Flipping the Latino Script: Colombian & Queer – Michelle (Pt 1)

“I do it for myself. Because I want to feel confident for me. I could care less about the male gaze. That’s a part of Latino culture that I have flipped.”

Michelle identifies as Latina first. She is a 32-year-old creative, and in this first half of our conversation, we trace the roots of her identity from the mountains of Pereira, Colombia to her life today in Atlanta.

From the "telenovela" of her first love and the end of a marriage to the intimate beauty rituals she shared with her mother, Michelle explores the complex "give and take" of inheriting a culture. We discuss how to honor your family's traditions while "flipping the script" to make room for your own modern, intersectional values.

In this episode, we explore:

• The Identity Order: Why Michelle leads with being Latina, and how that anchors her journey as a queer and polyamorous woman.
• The Ritual of Makeup: Transforming a tradition rooted in the male gaze into a tool for community care and trans-femme empowerment.
• Subversive Tradition: The intentional process of deciding what to keep, what to leave, and what to evolve within the Colombian diaspora.

Whether she's teaching her community how to find their confidence or reflecting on the chapters of her love life, Michelle offers a masterclass in living authentically.

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Support Our Season 3 Fundraiser

We are building a platform for cross-cultural storytelling that fosters empathy across generations and cultures. If you believe in a global neighborhood where no one is an outsider, please consider contributing today: https://ko-fi.com/cultureful

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Watch on YouTube

See the video version of this episode (Live at 11am EST on 4/14/26): https://youtu.be/-21BVGbeGEg

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Connect with Michelle

 Follow her journey on Instagram: @pebblespins

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Episode Credits

• Founding Supporter Shout-outs: Special thanks this week to Jackson Evans and Judy Thornhill.
• Community Connection: Special thanks to Quinn O’Briant for connecting us with Michelle.
• Host, Producer, & Sound Design: Jess Lin
• Advising & Production Support: Ruben Gnanaruban

Transcript

Michelle: 0:00

women in my family, They teach you, oh, if you want a boyfriend, you have to look this way. And if you wanna, if you want a partner, you have to do this. Right? And all of those things I genuinely enjoy. So I turned it around. I do it for myself.'cause I want to feel confident for me, right? I could care less about the male gaze. Um, so, so that's part of like Latino culture that, I have flipped. but. I'm very thankful for because so many queer people and my people who like, let's say are trans femme or whatever, I'm the first one to teach them the makeup of things. Like, they come to me, they're like, oh my God,

Jess: 0:35

You are listening to Cultureful where strangers become neighbors. I'm your host Jess Lin. Today I'm sharing the first half of a two-part conversation with Michelle, a 3-year-old client success manager in tech. Michelle is from Pereira, Colombia And is now living in Atlanta Michelle identifies as Latina, queer and polyamorous, together. We explore how those identities intersect and interact In part one, we look at Michelle's foundation, her Latina identity. and how it shapes her approach to life and relationships. We talk through her beautiful memories of learning femininity from her mother and how Michelle takes the rituals she was raised with reframes them to fit her own modern values. I originally set out to explore a story of romantic love, but as our conversation unfolded, it became clear that hers is a story of so much more. It is a story of loving yourself, loving your family, and loving your culture. Before we dive in, a quick note at our guest's request, we've replaced certain names to respect the privacy of those mentioned. If you see a blur in the video or hear a slight shift in the audio, Know that it's our way of keeping things confidential. as always the video version is on YouTube Here is part one of my conversation with Michelle. Welcome to the show, Michelle. It's great to have you.

Michelle: 2:11

Hey Jess, I am super excited to be here.

Jess: 2:15

Awesome. I'm really grateful you're here and you're willing to open up and share about your love life. one of the most personal topics there is, right? And so I really appreciate that you're coming on to talk about that. Um, you're queer, poly and Latina.

Michelle: 2:30

Mm-hmm.

Jess: 2:31

Um, and we're also gonna talk about the intersection and interaction of all those identities. So thank you so much for being here.

Michelle: 2:38

Thank you. Thank you. I'm so excited to be here. I'm very excited to talk about this, but, you know, you said you're, you're queer poly Latina. I would say that I am Latina first. Right.

Jess: 2:50

Okay,

Michelle: 2:50

I would say I am so Latina first. Like, like that, like I feel like I am Latina, queer, poly.

Jess: 2:59

within the LGBTQ plus community. Queer has come to be an expansive umbrella term for anyone who doesn't identify under rigid binaries, whether that's straight or gay, or male or female, It's a way to describe the full spectrum of sexual and gender minorities without needing a single restrictive box. Poly is short for polyamory or polyamorous, which simply means having multiple honest, consensual romantic relationships at the same time.

Michelle: 3:33

If I would really like for me being polyamorous, I feel, and hope is the least interesting thing about me. But, um, I'm so excited to, to have this conversation and like, I kind of wanted to like lay that out to, to give a sense of, you know, how these things kind of matter to me and how they lay out in my life.

Jess: 3:53

Awesome. Yeah, that's so interesting. I never, well, I guess I didn't really think of the order

Michelle: 3:59

Yeah. No, you're good.

Jess: 4:01

your identities, like it does make sense like that the order, you know, like. that's really good to know. And, um, and we will be kind of going through, starting with family, and starting with, you know, Latina aspect of

Michelle: 4:13

Exactly. Yeah. Yeah,

Jess: 4:14

Perfect segue. yeah, I wanna start with family. tell me about your family, what your family's like, and who was in your life when you were growing up.

Michelle: 4:22

Yeah. So I have both of the most amazing families a person can truly ask for. I have, you know, both parents who were present in my life, uh, for the most part. Right. Um, I have two siblings. I have an older sibling, and then I have a half sibling that came in later in my life. I was about 21 or 22 when they were born. And then on my dad's side, I have eight aunts and uncles, and we have about 20 cousins. And then on my mom's side, there's eight aunts and uncles and about 15 cousins. and then on my dad's side, there's 13 great-grandchildren. So like we have a big Latino Catholic family in, in kind of that sense that, that people imagine our family to be, or Latino families to be. And then both our families are very much matriarchs. So I grew up with strong women in my life, and I think that that truly reflects in my life as well. I'm, I'm very lucky and, and constantly say that, I have the most loving families ever.

Jess: 5:42

When you say matriarchal, tell me more about that.

Michelle: 5:45

Yeah. So, on my dad's side of the family, my grandfather passed away from a stroke when he was about 42. And my grandma was widowed with eight kids at about the age of like 33. Right. And she was, you know, she didn't go to, she didn't get an education. She, she knew how to, you know, I we're talking, my grandma was born in 32. So at that time, women, you know, as long as you knew how to read and write, and even then, like some people didn't even care about that. you have to take care of the farm, you have to take care of the kids. You know, your education doesn't, isn't really valued. So. she met my grandfather, they got married and she was, she was young. Um, she tells the story of her getting married at five in the morning because that's what people would do. People would just kind of like get married at five in the morning. Nobody would see it. Their dress would be black. She had a black dress.

Jess: 6:40

So the, the, the eloped, what do you mean? No

Michelle: 6:44

It's not an elope, it, it, it's not an elope. It's more of like, things would just happen and nobody would talk about it. Right. It's more of like, oh yeah, they're married now. And that's it. Like, it was, it wasn't like this big extravagant thing that we see now. It's kind of more like, okay, they got married, they're gonna go off and have children now and they're gonna go off and, you know, do their thing. relationships and dating and those kinds of things are just not talked about. It's more of like, they just kind of just happen and, we move forward with that. to be honest, like, once my grandfather passed away, she was poor and she only got what is 15,000 pesos. which now I don't know what that equals. But she bought a house. She was smart enough to know that she needed shelter for her eight children. And, uh, she survived. I mean, my, my father was poor, very, very poor growing up. He tells the story that he didn't have like his own pair of shoes until he was like about six. So, because she was in a position where she had to survive truly. my grandmother has always been a no BS kind of person, she's always been just kind of this very strong presence. And she did, she did raise her eight children and A couple of them went to school, or a couple of them went to college, some of them didn't. Just, just out of plain out survival. but now we are a huge family. You know, a lot of us live here in the States. We've, we've, you know, we've gone to college in our family. we're about to have like the first kind of PhD graduates. All of us kind of went to college, right? We, we went from my grandmother's generation who was incredibly poor and impoverished to now being able to have economic mobility and everybody has a house and education and, and a job and all those things. and it was all really out of the leadership of my grandma. And it's like, Hey, no bullshit. We have to do what we have to do. No excuses. Very cutthroat. And that reflects in me today. I, I'm that way with myself, um, because that's the example that I had growing up, uh, with the women around me. on my mom's side, they had a lot more traditional, my grandfather was present, he worked, my grandmother, you know, took care of the kids and all that stuff.

Jess: 9:18

After exploring her roots, we shifted our focus to the personal. Starting at the beginning with her first experience of falling in love.

Michelle: 9:28

I had a high school sweetheart. Um, and what's crazy is we ended up getting married

Jess: 9:36

tell me, About that relationship. Was that your first love

Michelle: 9:41

Was that my first love? Yes, that was my first love. It wasn't my first, um, obsession, like lust, if you will. but he was my first love, my first long-term relationship. The first guy that, like, I went to Catholic school, so I would, get outta school and he'd be waiting for me and walk me home. Very, the, the very like stereotypical telenovela. Kind of love where he would come and see me and we would sit at the door of my house and, and we would just talk and things like that. Um, he was in college, I was in high school. and I know people are like, whoa, what's the age difference there? Um, yeah, I know. It's, you know, it is what it is. I don't think there's as much of a, of a stereotype with that or, or an issue with that back home. I know that sounds terrible, but it's true. Um, you know, I was about, um, I think we really, we are two years apart, but when we're talking about, you know, college and high school, that's like, ah, you know, but still, you know, that's what it was. And, and we loved each other.

Jess: 10:55

Mm-hmm.

Michelle: 10:57

And we were together for about three years. And when it came to time where I was about to graduate high school we decided to get married. Uh, my dad was not happy about it, but my mom supported it. My dad did not go to my wedding. I had a small little courthouse wedding and, it was, it was crazy. now that I think about it, it was insane to get married at the age of 18

Jess: 11:26

Why? Just because of the age.

Michelle: 11:28

because I did not know what was coming. Like when you make huge transitions in life, you change as a person, like in and out of what you want, completely changes and everything of who you are changes. And when him and I like, we, like, I moved to and I was like, oh my God, I'm married and there's all these new things around me. And I was monogamous at the time

Jess: 11:59

And he did not come with you

Michelle: 12:01

Yeah. so it was like, oh my God, I am this whole new person because him and I got married in December. I moved in January. Yeah. So it was like quick turnaround and Yeah. And when I came here I was like, oh my God, I don't live with my parents anymore. I have nothing, nobody to tell me what to do, and I'm married. What? Like, it was insane.

Jess: 12:25

where were you living? Who were you living with? Um, were you living alone and like, what were you up to?

Michelle: 12:30

Yeah. So I moved in with my brother when I to Atlanta. and that didn't work out well. I'm 18, he is 25 or 20, 24. And he, you know, we just did not get along. Him and I are very, very different people. so I moved in with him. it didn't work out. And then I moved in with my aunt, who opened up her space for me because things were just too chaotic. Um, and then I, so I lived in Athens, Georgia, for a couple of years. but I was on my own and moved off to my own little apartment with roommates within like six months. of me moving

Jess: 13:12

And were you working? Were you in school?

Michelle: 13:16

I was a cashier, at this little spot called Call and Tito's I still go there, it's really good. And, I was not in school. it still took me about a year and a half to two years, but I, I mean, I, I knew I wanted to go to college. I knew I wanted to get a degree, and I did. you know, it took me a while to be able to like afford school and kind of get all that ready.

Jess: 13:40

Mm-hmm.

Michelle: 13:41

Yeah. With like 200 bucks. My parents were like, here's $200. Go figure it out. I mean, I was thrown to the sharks and, I mean, and think about it like. Comparing that to my grandma that we had, you know, it was widowed with eight kids. Like, if we think about like a, like those different big moments, you know, that different women, like, we just all, we just instinctually know what to do. It's like, all right, figure it out. Suck it up buttercup, let's go. You know?

Jess: 14:10

so at, at what point do you and your ex-husband decide to end it? Mm-hmm.

Michelle: 14:17

I was about, I wanna say I was, I don't even, I wanna say I was maybe like 24, so it still took a while.

Jess: 14:25

It's like six years. Yeah. That's a,

Michelle: 14:26

yeah, It is a while. It is a while, but, He, he moved to New York. We would visit each other. We still loved each other. I would say that I still love him to this day. but not in a romantic way, you know, in any, I mean, the person that he married versus the person that I am now, I am a queer polyamorous woman. He's a traditional Hispanic, monogamous guy. You know, like, it just, it was not it. but yeah, we officially ended it when I was around that age. but, you know, we would still visit each other throughout the years and see each other and spend time together and stuff like that. But we had to end it because, I mean, at some point you have to just move on,

Jess: 15:09

Mm-hmm.

Michelle: 15:11

you know?

Jess: 15:11

Yeah. after the break. Michelle's first queer relationship Cultureful is 100% independent, and we rely on listeners like you to keep these intersectional stories coming. If you're finding value in Michelle's story today, Please consider joining our season three supporters at the link in our show notes. And now back to my conversation with Michelle. Like at what point did you come into your queer identity?

Michelle: 15:47

Oh my God. I always knew I was queer. I remember as a kid, when, you know how like kids ex have expressed themselves, like through games and play and stuff like that, right? And games like, oh, we're gonna play house, we're gonna play kitchen, we're gonna play doctor, whatever. Like, I would always run to my girlfriends and be like, we're gonna be, we're gonna be spouses, you know, we're gonna be together. No, we're gonna be the head of the household. Like, I never ran to the boys like husband and Right to play kind of that role or any, like, none of that. Like, I was always very, very you into. Drawn to, girls and women but you know, like I would also, you know, have crushes on guys later on. but it was always very natural for me to, like, as a queer person. Like, I don't think that there was, you know, an awakening when I was a teenager. No. It was always there as a kid for sure.

Jess: 16:43

actually you were attracted to the girls and women before you were attracted to also the men. It sounds like

Michelle: 16:50

I mean, yeah. I thought boys were cute. I thought boys were cute, girls were cute. You know, we didn't, I did not grow up with like, I'm sure now, for example, let's say if there's a kid. In my position, you know, may maybe they are friends with somebody who's trans, right. And find themselves attracted to somebody who's more gender queer and fluid. Right. I did not have that example growing up. I, you know, um, so I came to realize that I was pansexual last year, you know? Um, yeah. So, or, or just like straight up, just queer last year. Before last year, I thought I was just bi and I was like, no, I am so queer in all the ways. And, always, always attracted to everyone regardless of, of gender. Um, as a kid and growing up and as a teenager and I remember I was like 14 and I was walking with my friend and we were just walking, and then this like, super cute girl just passes by and I'm just like looking at her. And then I turn around to my friend and I'm like, I'm attracted to women. Like I am attracted to women. And she looks at me, she's like, okay, cool. Like,

Jess: 18:05

She's like, and

Michelle: 18:06

she's like, love that. And then later on when I started dating women and like having like serious relationships with queer people, she was like, oh my God, I like when I see pictures of you in like queer relationships or like on Facebook or whatever. I remember that moment when we were walking down col, you know, the Street in the neighborhood, you know, just like, you know, kids playing soccer and, and you're just like, I am so attracted to women. Like, you know. So yeah, it was never, there was never a moment. There were definitely, and now as an adult looking back, I'm like, oh yeah, like. It was just always so natural for me.

Jess: 18:48

yeah. Tell me about your. First serious relationship with a woman,

Michelle: 18:53

Oh, my first serious relationship with a woman. so, he has transitioned ever since. So now his name, his, his name is Mark, and I want to respect that. Um, and I want to like, acknowledge it, right? I, I don't wanna misgender him or anything like that, but at the time we dated, and this was pre-transition and I fell in love so hard. It was the first introduction to a queer couple to my family. I brought them over to my family. I brought them. I was, it was the first time that like a lesbian couple was introduced to like everyone. and it's funny because we only dated for a very short amount of time. then we broke up.

Jess: 19:46

Tell the whole story how you meet, how I'll, like it's a very significant relationship. Like just give us the whole story.

Michelle: 19:52

So I met them at a bar through another former partner of mine, Susie. She introduced us and they went to high school together. they were part of the Gay Straight Alliance they met and. You know, she brought, uh, Mark to the bar, and I met Mark at the, you know, and I was like, who, who is that? Like, wow. It was just like so magnetic. It was just, and I, you know, we, I can't remember if we went on a date or anything like that. I know we just started like hanging out and I fell in love with them so hard. They were on my mind 24 7. I saw my whole life with them, and I finally like, it was so reassuring I finally felt so at home in a relationship, I felt understood. I felt very affirmed in that relationship because, you know, it was a queer relationship, you know? Um. And I remember for Valentine's Day, I got somebody to sneak into their apartment and put roses, from the door to the bed, and I bought them this beautiful, beautiful dress. Like I looked, at all the sizes and their closet and make sure that I had the perfect dress for them, and they wore it. And, and there was a note that said, I'll pick you up at seven. Like, I

Jess: 21:17

Casanova, oh, my gosh.

Michelle: 21:20

have game. Like I, I have so much game. Like, yes, when I, when I am in a queer relationship, when I date a femme. I love making them feel like my girl. Like I love doing all the things that like, like fem love, right? And being treated like a girl. And I open the door and like, I love doing that shit. Like, it's just, ugh. Oh yes. Total princess treatment. Total princess treatment. Like, I love doing it and it makes me feel so happy and I feel like, ugh. And I introduced, I came out to my family. I did everything. Like, I was like, this is it for me. Like I am finally, right? And, and I never felt that in my marriage. You know? I never felt that in any way. I, I came out to my family, I came out to my friends and just everybody who just didn't know I introduced them to everybody. So, and it's really crazy because, you know, we ended up breaking up. They went to, Vanderbilt for school and they started, you know, they went on with the rest of their life, I went on with mine. I think that, you know, in relationships, especially when we're young, when we date, it usually doesn't work out. We kind of hit this point. It's like, okay, cool. I'm gonna take this crossroad now I have to move on and grow you know, I'm not gonna settle down at the age of like 25 or 23 or whatever, you know,

Jess: 22:50

I mean, especially if you don't go together, like a lot of times, even when you do go together to like a major move, but my gosh, when you don't, it's like, people change and grow in different directions.

Michelle: 23:00

exactly. Exactly. And it's crazy because now we haven't seen each other in person in like over eight or 10 years. It's been a very long time. but we are both, we have, connected like online and now they're polyamorous as well, and queer of course. And although there are so many ways in which we developed later on that we have in common, um, you know, so, so, yeah. But they were the first like queer relationship that I just, it turned my world upside down and it was affirming and it, it, cleared a lot of things for me.

Jess: 23:35

you're talking a lot about like how you felt in the relationship, I'm trying to picture like the two of you together. Um, so. Before Mark transitioned, like, what were they like?

Michelle: 23:46

yeah., Mark was, uh, he was an, so again, we're, we're speaking pre-transition, right? So if we're going to talk about kind of like that femme piece, right? At the time where I met them, they were what we call in the lesbian world a Chapstick. So tomboy, so there's, so there's lipstick, chapstick, stud, right? So. a chapstick is a person of femme a lesbian who can wear a dress and heels and be super femme, but can also be very tomboyish and like, you know, the cap backwards and like very kind of masc. Right. It's that person where there's kind of like that gender fluidity thing, which I find extremely atta attractive

Jess: 24:33

Hence the, because CHAPSTICK doesn't have the color. Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. Uhhuh, and how do you identify? Do you identify

Michelle: 24:41

a total lipstick. I'm a total lipstick lesbian 100. I'm a huge femme. And, um, I even have a lipstick tattoo in the back of my, my neck. Um,

Jess: 24:52

The third, the third word was, so it was Chapstick lipstick, and was the third word

Michelle: 24:56

a stud So stud is like. lesbians who are like firmly masc.

Jess: 25:02

Chapstick is the one that kind of goes between both.

Michelle: 25:05

yeah. They're kind of fluid. They were very jockey. I haven't seen 'em in a long time. So they were super jockey. They were an MMA fighter for a little bit, uh, tatted up long black hair. they had liner. They would always have like this black liner. Um, beautiful, stunning. They were, I'm a tall person. I'm like five nine we were the same height. and they were just hot. They were just so hot and,

Jess: 25:39

was like 10 outta 10. It was like,

Michelle: 25:41

Yeah.

Jess: 25:42

and then what about like, personality?

Michelle: 25:44

Personality wise. So they at the time wanted to get, their PhD in neuroscience and now they are not down that route at all. But, they were super obsessed with like neuroscience and wanted to go to school for it, and they had their own apartment. They lived by themselves, so I would go over to their apartment all the time and, you know, we would cook dinner. I would, you know, the Latina would come out in me, so I would like clean their house for them. The la oh my god. I as, it's so funny because like, I, you know, I fight gender norms and I'm like this, like strong person and queer and polyamorous and all these things, but I love, I love cleaning my partner's house and space for them.

Jess: 26:26

is that one of your love languages?

Michelle: 26:28

Oh yeah. I love cooking for my partner and like looking Yes. Like, I love, it's, it's kind of like this thing that like. As a, as a Latina, we're raised to kind of show up and I, and I like, I'm like, ugh. I kind of roll my eyes as I say this, but I, it's so funny 'cause it's such a guilty pleasure. Like you as a, woman, as a cisgender woman, you have to clean for your partner and you have to cook for your partner, and you have to look good and you have to take care of yourself. And you have like all these like check boxes that you have to fill. And I hate admitting it, but like, I love doing all those things I love and, and, but, but I do it by choice. I don't do it because it's expected of me.

Jess: 27:08

you enjoy them.

Michelle: 27:10

I enjoy it. I enjoy taking care of myself and looking pretty for myself. my partner gets to enjoy that. You know, I love cooking dinner and having dinner for, ready for them, for when they come home. I love cleaning the house. Like, I like these stereotypical gender roles that, that people fill. I genuinely enjoy them for me, and I genuinely enjoy like those acts of service for my partner. and I, and I feel like I did that. I would do that for them, you know, every once in a while. And it felt very like, ooh. Like I just, I loved doing it. And, we would go out on dates and stuff like that. And,

Jess: 27:50

What kind of dates?

Michelle: 27:51

Oh my gosh, this happened so long ago. Um, we would, we'd go out to eat. We would cook. I mean, we were both like college students at the time, so it's not like we could afford much. But, you know, we'd go out to eat, we'd go to this little bar And, you know, we would hang out with friends. they got me into Drag Race, um, yeah. Which is, you know, RuPaul's Drag Race. we would watch Drag Race and Cuddle in bed and um, you know, just kind of do all the queer, gay things. Mm-hmm. But I fell in love with them so hard. And then. You know, we didn't work out the first time, and then we saw each other again a year later, and we dated again and and they were moving off to Vanderbilt. So it was a quick turnaround, and we didn't date for a long time. But I would say that that was my first queer love where I truly fell in love with somebody. where I truly like was I came out I, I wanted to like really do everything. but later on I realized, that they were just the first step into my queerness. I've had so many queer, so much have been fortunate enough to have so much queer love ever since then that has been as loving and fulfilling, and beyond. But Now I joke and I say, I don't, I don't date a guy if he can't kiss another guy, like I don't. you're like super, super straight, like it, it ain't for me. It ain't for me.

Jess: 29:28

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. it sounds like. The Mark chapter was like a pivotal chapter and big, deep love, that led to other things. But, you know, just to like wrap up the Mark When it ended the second time, I guess when it ended the first time to like, did you go through a big heartbreak.

Michelle: 29:48

Yeah, huge deep heartbreak, oh yeah, I was, I was heartbroken for months. I mean, for a very, very low, actually, for like a long time. And not only that, I kind of always wondered if I was ever gonna have queer love again. if I was just, I was like, oh, am I ever gonna fall in love with a queer person again? Like, I really hope so. You know, I think like at the age, like when you're like 20, do you think like any ending is like the ending and, and truly like,

Jess: 30:21

true, true.

Michelle: 30:22

right, like any ending is just the end of the world and um, Yeah. I was very, very heartbroken when we didn't work out and I decided to enter queer spaces. I started going to gay bars and I started surrounding myself around queer people. which for me has later become my home like it is. I, I, I feel at home. I feel safe in queer spaces. in queer, polyamorous, non-traditional spaces. I've tried to be in spaces where everybody is kind of more traditional and a bit more uptight, and I just, I just don't belong there and it doesn't work out. Um, so, you know, and, and then, and then later on, you know, I, I realized like, okay, cool, like, perhaps. Mark and I did not work out, but I mean, I did big things. I, I, I came out to my family, which is a big Latino family, and at the beginning I remember my cousin would be like, you know, you don't have to like kiss in front of everybody, right? Like, I like, or, and she sat me down. Yeah, she's, Yeah, And she sat me down. She's like, I know this is just a phase you're gonna end up with a man. Like it, you know, like those kinds of things. My mom, my mom was like, don't, whatever you do, just don't bring a woman to introduce to the family. And I told her, Hey, uh, it's okay. I just don't have to visit you. Like if, if for you, that is a problem. If I, if I fall in love with a queer person and I want to bring them. To my culture, because for me, like sharing my culture with the, with the person I love, oh my God. That for me is like everything. Like I love speaking in Spanish with the person. I love taking them to like the Colombian market or the Latino market and like showing them everything, especially if they're not like familiar with it. I just love it so much. I love sharing my culture and, and the music. And it is just like, like Latino culture, Hispanic culture is just great. Like, you know, it's just wonderful. Like our music, our food, our folklore, like our, everything, everything about Latino culture is just absolutely awesome. Yes,

Jess: 32:41

Mm-hmm.

Michelle: 32:42

Yes, Our energy, our games, our traditions, like,

Jess: 32:45

yeah. That's why I've been spending years working on my Spanish. Still work in progress, but you know. Yeah. There's just so many things that are so vibrant, rich, deep, all of it, right?

Michelle: 32:57

Truly, truly. and I'm not gonna sacrifice that because my mom feels uncomfortable and I know that she doesn't feel uncomfortable herself. She's actually very, she'll get somebody's pronouns in a heartbeat. She has, you know? Oh, yeah. And she's like in her sixties, and a lot of her students, she's a cosmetology, professor. She,

Jess: 33:17

Okay. This is also why your, makeup is like on point. Okay? Now I know. Your skin

Michelle: 33:24

My mom was very intentional. Yeah.

Jess: 33:26

Yeah. Side note, side note to the listener. When I was dropping off the, like when we were doing the tech check yesterday and I was, I was like, oh, I'm gonna get the same level of cute as I, as I am today because I'm not really good at makeup. You know? And then Michelle, you were like, oh, I can help you with that sometime, you know? And I was like, oh my gosh. Yes. Will, will you up on that. But anyway. Okay, so this explains some things for me. Mm-hmm.

Michelle: 33:51

yeah. I, well, I was always taught to, it's really sad, but I, but I really turned it around like, women in my family, they always said, Michelle, take care of yourself. look good, take care of your hair and your makeup and your skin and all that stuff. Now, later on, I realize it's for the male gaze. They teach you, oh, if you want a boyfriend, you have to look this way. And if you wanna, if you want a partner, you have to do this. Right? And all of those things I genuinely enjoy. So I turned it around. I do it for myself.'cause I want to feel confident for me, right? I could care less about the male gaze. Um, so, so that's part of like Latino culture that, I have flipped. but. I'm very thankful for because so many queer people and my people who like, let's say are trans femme or whatever, I'm the first one to teach them the makeup of things. Like, they come to me, they're like, oh my God, pebbles. Like, come and, sorry, my nickname is Pebbles. Um, I go by pebbles in most circles, but, oh yeah. I love teaching. Like the, my mom had was so intentional about teaching me these things. And when we had our girl time, this is how you do your hair. This is how you do your makeup, this is how you do it, this is how you dress. Like those kinds of things. And those moments taking out why they happened. They were so precious for me. They were these moments between my mom and I that we shared, and she showed me femininity and she, she shared it with me. The joys of being a woman. I love being a girl. Perhaps part of it. Yeah, sure. It's like, Hey, this is, uh, you can look good to, to set expectations of society, which is terrible. but also I have the joy of just being a confident person that takes care of myself. And I love, to have good style and I love to look good for me, and I don't do it for anybody else. you give and you take sometimes.

Jess: 35:40

I think that's a great place to take a break.

Michelle: 35:42

Okay. I'm here for that stretch. Break

Jess: 35:46

That was part one of my conversation with Michelle. I loved her reflection on those early lessons of femininity. And her wisdom that with culture and tradition, you give and you take. She shows us that tradition doesn't have to be wholesale discarded just because parts of it feel outdated Instead, we can keep the precious parts and update what we need to. I believe that culture is living and breathing and that it can and does grow with us. In part two, we dive into the complexities of Michelle's adult life from introducing a partner to her Catholic family to the golden rule she uses to navigate polyamory in her queer identity. Remember to subscribe so you don't miss that conclusion if you're enjoying season three, please consider becoming a supporter. This show exists to explore, highlight, and reflect on underrepresented perspectives and the messy, beautiful ways they intersect with our cultures. If you believe in this kind of social impact storytelling, join Cultureful season three supporters today. Your contribution keeps this show independent. and ensures that these voices have a home. this week. A special shout out to founding supporters, Jackson Evans and Judy Thornhill. Thank you for your support, and powering this kind of storytelling. You can find the link to donate the video version of this episode and how to connect with Michelle in the show notes. and a big thank you to Quinn O'Briant for connecting me and Michelle. Her story is a perfect fit for Cultureful This episode was produced and edited by me with advising and executive production support from Ruben. Gnanaruban Thank you for listening. I'm Jess Lin Take care of yourself and your neighbors, and I'll see you soon.