Episode 70: Cravings, Hunger & Set Points: Real Answers to Your Weight Loss Questions

In this episode of the Pound of Cure Weight Loss Podcast, Dr. Matthew Weiner and registered dietitian Zoë answer listener questions covering some of the most common — and most misunderstood — challenges in the weight loss journey.

They break down how to set a realistic goal weight based on body composition, not BMI, and explore why nutrition quality matters more than calorie counting. You’ll also learn what causes sugar cravings, how to manage hunger after bariatric surgery, and why ultra-processed foods are designed to keep you overeating.

Whether you’re using GLP-1 medications, recovering from bariatric surgery, or trying to lose weight without extreme restriction, this episode gives you practical strategies grounded in real science — not diet culture myths.

Download the free Pound of Cure App!

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Transcript

Zoë (00:04)
Welcome back to the Pound of Cure Weight Loss podcast. Happy Monday. Hope you guys are doing great this morning or whenever it is that you're listening to the podcast. How are you today, Dr. Weiner?

Matthew Weiner (00:12)
Yeah.

I'm doing good. It's Friday afternoon. We always record the podcast on Friday afternoon. It's usually the last thing I do before we leave. So ⁓ yeah, ⁓ I'm good. I'm ready for the weekend. It's my last weekend with both of my children living at home. My youngest daughter is going to college on Friday, this week from today.

Zoë (00:26)
Yeah?

Wow.

Matthew Weiner (00:40)
So, and I'm an empty nester in one week, which is kind of blowing my mind. I felt like my kids were born like six months ago.

Zoë (00:44)
Well.

Do you guys have any fun special plans for this weekend all together?

Matthew Weiner (00:53)
You know, we do, but it's like it's crazy because it's all packing and preparing. There's just so much to get two kids ready for camp. That's what we used to do.

Zoë (01:06)
We

Matthew Weiner (01:07)
ready for camp. Now it's college.

Zoë (01:08)
know where your head's at.

Matthew Weiner (01:10)
Getting two kids ready for college is a lot of work. So a lot of more of that stuff is kind of going to occupy most of the weekend. But yeah, this ⁓ is it, man. Countdown.

Zoë (01:13)
⁓ yeah.

Yeah,

⁓ gosh, well, I'm sure it'll be an adjustment, but you've done a good job, so they're ready.

Matthew Weiner (01:29)
So

far, that's kind of the goals, My wife, when my youngest turned 18, my wife and I like high-fived each other like, hey, no teen pregnancies, no arrests, no drug addictions, both going to college, like we did something right. Yeah.

Zoë (01:38)
Yeah.

We did it. Yeah, we it. Very good.

Well, for our podcast today, we actually have all of our questions. It's a listener Q &A and all of our questions today actually are coming from our videos over on YouTube. So if you're listening to the podcast on Spotify or Apple Podcasts, know that if you want, can also watch the podcast on YouTube. So that's actually where we are getting the questions today.

Matthew Weiner (02:12)
Fantastic. We have good questions.

Zoë (02:14)
All right,

we've got a lot of good questions, lot of good conversation. So let's jump right in. Our first question is about how to set a goal weight. So it's a long question. I'm not gonna read all of it, but ultimately asking about, should there be a range? How important is body composition versus body weight? What about measurements like waist circumference? What about sex, height?

age, etc. And so she gave a little bit of background and because it can feel confusing, right? Like maybe I hear a lot of people compare like, well, this is what I weighed in high school,

Matthew Weiner (02:45)
Totally.

Zoë (02:50)
she gives some context around her body composition and measurements, but ultimately, what I like to think about with patients through this is, especially if they're stuck on BMI, right? Because here's the thing, a lot of things in the medical field, and if we're thinking about the weight loss space specifically, it's based on BMI, which in my opinion is garbage, and we've talked about this before, because if we think about...

BMI, your body mass index, it's just a ratio of height to weight. So body composition and muscle mass versus fat mass has nothing to do with it. And you can actually look at a lot of competitive bodybuilders, for example, or maybe sometimes in the obese range because of their weight to height ratio. So if you find yourself getting kind of trapped in that spiral of chasing a BMI, catch yourself a break.

and let's use some more valuable metrics. in terms of the specific weight, goal weight, I do get this question a lot. And Dr. Weiner, I know that you have a process with new patients that I definitely wanna ask about in a minute. ⁓ But I really actually try to have patients step away from a specific number. And it's fine to have a number in their head, but I always like to ask the question, if you were to be,

Let's say looking at yourself in the mirror and happy with your body composition, you feel maybe toned or you feel it fitting in your clothes better, you're feeling really powerful and strong in the gym or whatever those other non-scale victories might be for them and really kind of putting it back on that body composition. Would you care more about feeling confident in your body or seeing a specific number on the scale? And to date,

There has only been one person who said, well, I just want to see a number. And I'm like, OK, well. But everybody else can understand that it's more important your body composition, that fat mass versus muscle mass. And if we can see that go down, another really great example is I have people coming to me a lot, complaining of, or at least feeling frustrated that, ⁓ like I only, like I.

Matthew Weiner (04:41)
Hahaha!

Zoë (05:04)
only lost one pound this month or maybe they didn't lose any weight at all for the whole month. And then we get to talking, I start digging, asking some more questions and then come to find out they've like lost two inches off their waist and and they are fitting in their clothes better. And I really try to emphasize that with them of here we can see your body is changing, right? If your weight is the same, but your inches is going down, your body is taking up less space. But your

You know, your weight is the same, so potentially you're building muscle, losing body fat. To me, I get more excited about that than seeing a specific number on the scale.

Matthew Weiner (05:33)
it.

Yeah, no, I mean, I think that's great how you feel. hear a lot of times people will talk about clothing size. I really like that too. It's a little, there's a lot bigger range. ⁓ But you're right. I mean, there's so much more to it than that number on the scale. ⁓

And, you know, especially also what I see all the time is that, you know, the wonderland and everybody wants to get under 200 pounds. And I always try to remind people like, Hey, listen, we somehow came up with a base 10 numeric system, which meant a hundred is different. And, and that was a, you know, decision based on how many fingers we have most likely. And then at some point, somebody decided what a pound was. I think it had something to with silver. I'm not sure exactly, but.

Zoë (06:04)
Mm-hmm.

Mm

Matthew Weiner (06:28)
We decided on a pound and the rest of the world uses kilograms, but we use pounds. And so all of those things are really baked into this 200 pound mark. And that there's so much randomness that really has no impact on your life that we can't just look at that number because it's numerically neat.

Zoë (06:47)
hmm.

Matthew Weiner (06:48)
The process that I go through with every patient in the office, and we do this at the first visit typically,

is it's not about your goal weight, it's about your expected weight loss. And it really is about matching what therapies and treatments you're comfortable with and what the expected weight loss is from those treatments. And we've talked ⁓ ad nauseum about our plan, which is nutrition, medications, and surgery, and kind of not

which of the three are we going to choose, but how are we gonna use all three of these together the most strategic fashion to get you to the number that you like, get you to the body composition where you feel best. And that's a challenge. And so we always start with nutrition. If you lose 10 % of your body weight through nutrition, that is amazing. That is a really hard thing to do. Most people can't do that. If you've accomplished that,

That is unbelievable. if you say, listen, I'm not into meds, I'm not into surgery, and you weigh 300 pounds, I'd say if you lost 30 pounds, that would be amazing. That would be a huge change in your health. Lower your blood pressure, lower your blood glucose. There'd be a lot of benefit. Now, 270 is still a very high weight, and I would talk to that patient about medications and surgery, but that would be my goal weight if someone wanted to use nutrition only. If we want to use meds, depending on what med

and whether they have access to the higher doses or not. We're generally looking at around 15 to 20 percent total body weight loss. So again, you're 300 pounds. We're looking at 45 to 60 pounds. And so my goal weight for that person is probably 250 ish. That's what we would expect to see with the medications alone and good nutrition. Sometimes we see more, sometimes we see less. But that's my goal weight for that patient is 250. It's not about a judgment about what you should weigh. It's about setting

expectations properly and realistically

Zoë (08:51)
Realistic expectations.

Matthew Weiner (08:53)
and because because obesity is a metabolic disease and we're really using physiologic and metabolic treatments that we should just look at the science and this is how much weight we expect and and that's the right weight for you and if that's where you want to stop is with medications then this is how much weight we think you're going to lose and then if it was surgery it's we we I have a calculator our calculator is available on our website

if you want to use it and you can plug in your info and it'll send you what your expectation your expected weight loss is with sleeve and gastric bypass and so I plug both those numbers in and show them the numbers and we use that as part of the surgical decision-making process and and then on top of it I kind of well if you had a sleeve and had the medications then we might be here and we don't have a calculator for that at some point we will but ⁓ we don't have a calculator for that but it generally is kind

combining the two techniques.

Zoë (09:50)
I was just going to ask,

do you get to stack the percentages? So 10 % from nutrition plus 15 % from meds plus however many percentages or from your new starting weight, if they come now at 270 after that 10 % from nutrition, how would you help them stack?

Matthew Weiner (09:57)
Yeah.

So what's the math? That's where you're getting at, right? Because Zoe's going to make her spreadsheet so that she can plug all her numbers in, So first of all, nutrition doesn't count.

in the bariatric surgery calculation. So a lot of people will say, well, you have me losing 80 pounds with bariatric surgery. If I do really great with nutrition, will I lose more weight? And the answer is no, because those numbers come from expected weight loss that's studied over time. And so that really looks at all bariatric surgery patients who eat very well after surgery. you know, people think, well, I'm going to be the one who eats really well. No, you would be the one who doesn't eat really well because almost

everybody else is eating really well after surgery, at least in our practice. Now, a couple years out, things can drift back and that's a different story and that's part of the reason why we do these podcasts is to bring people back in after surgery. But nutrition doesn't get factored in, but the meds do. But you have to first subtract the weight loss. So let's say you're 300 and we think you're gonna lose 100 pounds from surgery. Now your new weight is 200. We take the 15 to 20 % off

the 200, not off the 300. So it's not off your starting weight,

it's off your post bariatric surgery weight. And I usually maybe round it up a little bit because you don't, it's not quite that clean, but meds tend to stack on top of surgery. There's not as much overlap as I thought there would be. And so that, what that allows us to do is kind of map out a treatment plan on average for every patient. And if we choose these treatments, we can expect this weight loss.

which is the way I think about it. A lot of people think about it more as like what should I weigh and it's not what should you weigh it's what's going to happen if I change my eating and if I have the surgery if I have the medications.

Zoë (11:55)
Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Yeah, very nuanced. And that's why

it's so important to have these conversations. And like you said, the calculator, if anybody here listening wants to calculate their own predicted weight loss, definitely go check out that calculator and see what your numbers come out as.

Matthew Weiner (12:22)
Yep, absolutely.

Zoë (12:23)
All right, ready for the next question? All right, next question is about sugar cravings. So again, there's kind of a lot here to get through, but ultimately, the question is about these horrible sugar cravings that this person has been having for the past month.

Matthew Weiner (12:25)
Let's go, next question.

Zoë (12:40)
And she's actually increased the amount of vegetables and fiber is currently around 20 to 25 grams. I love that. And protein over two or over a hundred grams daily. And I didn't expect this to happen. And when I read this, was like, yes. But increasing my vegetable and protein intake has completely taken my sugar cravings away. Can you explain if it's the protein or the fiber causing it?

Matthew Weiner (12:47)
That's a lot.

What do you think, Zoe?

Zoë (13:09)
Yeah, you know, I don't know if I could necessarily say it's one or the other. I think it's a combination of both. You know, I like to think about the fiber for the filling, the voluminous piece of it. It fills you up. You can eat till you feel full and the protein helps satisfies you. So it keeps you full maybe for longer than an hour.

So having those two especially together, and that's something I work with patients on, is building their meal formula around protein and fiber so that you get the filling up, you feel full from the fiber, and then you stay full from the protein. And that together is the food combination for reducing food noise, from my perspective.

Matthew Weiner (13:51)
Yeah.

So let me ask you a question, Zoe. Everybody's counting calories. Everybody's counting carbs, right? What? 50, 100 grams. I don't even know because we don't really do that in our practice what the right number is. Nobody counts fiber. Why is that? Shouldn't we be counting fiber?

Zoë (14:06)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah, absolutely. know, fiber fiber is interesting though, too, especially if we're thinking about a lot of the diet products and specifically like keto products. And then there was this whole craze of net carbs, which is total carbohydrates minus your fiber intake. And so that is and if anybody listening is maybe paying attention to or that rings a bell, it's a marketing scam. And from my perspective, it really is because it's all about

Matthew Weiner (14:37)
You're beautiful.

Zoë (14:40)
what can these new keto products put on their packages to save zero net carbs or whatever. So there's a more processed form of fiber and you might see some of those low carb tortillas or protein bars have 14, 15 grams of fiber. But guess what? 14 grams of fiber in a low carb tortilla does not do the same thing as 14 grams of fiber from vegetables.

Matthew Weiner (14:45)
Right.

Right, right, for sure. So it's more complicated than just counting up the fiber in on the nutrition label because there's a lot of different types of fiber and yeah. Yes.

Zoë (15:14)
and they make you feel differently. However,

something that you can count that is encompassed in that fiber goal, maybe it doesn't tell you the number of grams of fiber, but actually counting your ounces or pounds of vegetables on our app using Caloratio, using the Metabolic Reset Diet, if you've been listening for a while, you know that you're working towards a pound of vegetables a day and on the app.

there's actually that veggie counter. So if you can get yourself to over a pound of vegetables a day, you're gonna be good on fiber intake.

Matthew Weiner (15:50)
Yeah, I would have another thing that I would kind of add on top of why this happened. I would have personally expected this a little bit more if she told she said she was eating more fruit. ⁓

but we have this kind of inherent nutrient craving. And I think I've told this story on the podcast before about the little orphans that drank the cod liver oil because they were vitamin D deficient and they could somehow sense that cod liver oil was rich in vitamin D. And we have this kind of inborn drive for the nutrients that were missing. so, right.

Zoë (16:23)
Like pica and ⁓ iron,

right?

Matthew Weiner (16:26)
Exactly, exactly. so, you know, the human body is very good at that. Any animal, mammal body is good at that. And probably insects too, and reptiles have that ability as well. And so we're able to sense the nutrients we're deficient at. And that kind of, in my mind, is the origin of our food cravings, particularly when they're processed. And so it very well may be, but by eating these vet, this person was deficient in some of these phytonutrients and it was manifesting

themselves, maybe something in cherries would make them like some, you know, cherry lifesavers or... ⁓

And so the artificial flavors kind of would, they drove this craving and when they ate artificial flavored cherry, they don't get the nutrients. So you just keep eating

Zoë (17:03)
Moon.

Matthew Weiner (17:12)
and eating and eating. And so it's when you satisfy those phytonutrient deficiencies, then you don't have these strong cravings anymore. And so I think if you're really craving something, then you got to look at that vegetable intake. You got to look at the fruit intake and make sure you're getting those really valuable compounds.

that are necessary for our body to function well. So I think that might also be a part of why those cravings improved. So, but it's a great question. I love that this person had that experience. And I think if you're struggling with food cravings, you know, more vegetables, more fruit, nuts, seeds, beans, it helps, it works.

Zoë (17:40)
Mm hmm.

It's not about

focusing on restricting the sugar. It's about focusing on adding more of the good stuff. The more you focus on restricting the sugar, the more you want it. So just naturally crowd it out by filling your diet with those whole foods, fiber-rich, healthy proteins, et cetera.

Matthew Weiner (17:55)
Right. Right.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And again, that's really why we embrace this idea of Cal-O-Ratio. Cal-O-Ratio is the only food logging system that I know of where you can increase your score by eating more.

Everything else is about restriction and not eating, but if you add more broccoli to your diet, you will score higher on our calorie ratio system. And so that's something we really want people to embrace is the idea that eating healthy foods is good and you should do as much of it as you can. And it's a very different mindset from cutting carbs or calories.

Zoë (18:47)
Yeah, absolutely. Actually, in we just added a new support group to our schedule that is actually found within the app, but it's free for everybody, even if you don't have a membership. But this is our intro to the app. So was teaching people walking through how to use Cali Ratio and putting in the example of

Okay, here's our breakfast. It was really nutritious, got 100 % calorie ratio score. Then we went out for lunch and we had pizza and we saw that score drop down. And then we went through how can we bring that score back up with dinner? And that feeds into my philosophy that I work with patients on too, which is always follow your fun food with a fuel food. So making sure that you're adding in those nutrient-dense, healthy foods.

Matthew Weiner (19:27)
Yeah.

Zoë (19:32)
you do choose to maybe indulge in a treat so it doesn't turn into a snowball and Cali Ratio is a great ⁓ practical application example of how to do that.

Matthew Weiner (19:41)
Love it. Okay, what's our next question?

Zoë (19:44)
All right, next question says, my insurance doesn't cover GLP ones unless I have diabetes. My doctor says it will help me, but my insurance says no. What now? I have 35 pounds of regain to lose after a broken leg.

Matthew Weiner (19:59)
Yeah, so first of all, I love that the person acknowledges that this was an injury. We talk about that all the time. Injury is a cause of weight gain. It's on our intake questionnaire. I talk to patients all the time about it. ⁓ And so, weight regain after bariatric surgery, in my mind, theoretically, if our healthcare system functions somewhat normally, would be of historical note only, because weight regain is incredibly treatable with GLP-1s. ⁓

Zoë (20:27)
Mm.

Matthew Weiner (20:29)
and it really has made, know, first everyone's like, bariatric surgery, you know, that's going to be replaced by the meds. And we're seeing now that it's not going to replace anything. It's really going to augment it. And the weight regain and some of the issues we've had with bariatric surgery over the years is now really, it's a non-issue. The issue is now how do you get the meds? And that's what this person is asking. ⁓ And really, that's what our platinum program does. We have techniques.

Zoë (20:52)
Yeah.

Matthew Weiner (20:59)
rule is for $2.50 a month we can set you up and that's everything that's the meds and us you pay for it separately but the way it works out and the way we kind of handle it and we've really operationalized this whole thing.

to and we use real medications and we just know about all the deals

and different techniques, our creative dosing strategies as we call them. So, and I try to work with patients because you people when you regain 35 pounds you feel like the world is closing in on you and there's so much anxiety and stress and worry and my god am I going to gain all of it back and this is so terrible what am I going to do and I'm going to be another failure this is going you know and it just keeps you up at night and that spiral.

Zoë (21:20)
Mm.

Matthew Weiner (21:44)
in your brain and it just takes over your whole happiness. When I work with patients, what I try

to do, and it can potentially be a little bit less than that truthfully, but I try to say, okay, you don't have an unsolvable problem. You have a $250 a month problem. And I'm not saying $250 a month is nothing, but it's not, the world is not caving in on you over $250 a month for the overwhelming majority of people.

Zoë (21:51)
Mm-hmm.

Matthew Weiner (22:13)
And so now it's like, maybe I could do Uber Eats

and deliver food or Instacart and shop for groceries. And if I did that for two days a month, I would have $250. And so we really, we have people truly getting a side gig and it's kind of crazy and stupid.

but it beats that worry and stress. so that really is the problem that you have if you're struggling with

Zoë (22:42)
Mm-hmm.

Matthew Weiner (22:42)
a regain after bariatric surgery for the overwhelming majority. It's not 100%, but about 90 to 95 % of weight regain is very treatable with these meds. So that's how I would approach this. you don't have insurance coverage, we're not convincing them of anything. It's never gonna change.

Zoë (22:53)
Mm-hmm.

Matthew Weiner (23:03)
So it's now about figuring out the cheapest way to get it. also there's a whole big move for these peptides. Everybody's talking about peptides. It's sketchier than compounding. Be very wary of that. People are taking Retrutatide. I would really warn you against taking Retrutatide. It is not FDA approved. I have concerns about the safety of that medication. My thought is it may increase cardiovascular events. ⁓ And these are things we do

know the answers to because the studies have not been done and you should not be taking them. You're a guinea pig and it's not worth it. There's other solutions out there that are proven and safe.

Zoë (23:44)
Yeah, and we'll link in the description of the podcast to the page to learn more about the Platinum program. This is for anybody in the country.

Matthew Weiner (23:53)
Yeah, you can actually sign up to the app now. Yeah. Download the app and you can sign up for platinum through that. So.

Zoë (23:56)
Even better, download the app and then sign up for the platinum program. Yep,

another question here we have again from YouTube. What is your advice for people who feel hungry almost all the time with or without bariatric surgery? So for a little bit of context to this.

Hercent had the sleeve about three and a half years ago and her hunger never fully went away. And so it feels like, you know, maybe for the past six months that she's been absolutely ravenous and waking up in the middle of the night starving and ⁓ again, waking up in the morning starving.

Matthew Weiner (24:30)
Yeah, well, I mean, my answer is easy. I think let's focus most of our time on your answer because I think my answer is if you've had a sleeve, you need meds. And that's really, I'd say that's probably 90 % a true statement. I, you know.

The answer to durable, sustainable weight loss and weight maintenance and hunger and appetite control is a sleeve and meds. is rarely a sleeve alone. That's the truth, unfortunately. I don't think that that's being discussed as often as it should be. ⁓ We discuss it all the time. Sleeve and meds is a great combo. I love it. It works fantastic, but it's the two together that work. But what are we doing from a nutritional perspective?

Zoë (25:18)
Nutritional perspective, I always like to say if you're feeling hungry, I want you to eat more food. It's that simple. Of course, it's what we're eating more of. And if we think about this timeline, right, Sleeve about three and a half years ago, but she mentioned on camera if I read this part or not, but for the first three years could feel satisfied on relatively small amounts.

Matthew Weiner (25:24)
Yeah.

Zoë (25:37)
But guess what? That hunger suppression, that decreased food noise that many, most people experience after they have bariatric surgery, which is the whole point, it doesn't last forever. And of course, Dr. Wyner, that's where the meds come in. However, going into it with that expectation of if I'm relying on this surgery to completely wipe away my hunger for forever, you're setting yourself up.

for failure, ultimately. So as the honeymoon period gets farther away from you and as you feel more hungry and as you're able to eat more food, eat more food. But of course, like I said, it's about what we're eating more of. So like we talked about in another question, add more fiber, add more vegetables, add more fruit, maybe depending on where your protein's at, you three and a half years out, you know, I'm not exactly sure, but potentially if you're still relying on primarily protein shakes.

Matthew Weiner (26:03)
Yeah, absolutely.

Zoë (26:30)
Can we swap that out for more whole food protein sources? And really looking at the quality and the volume of your food, maybe getting out of that, was only eating this much before and I should, and there's that shoulding on yourself, I should only be eating this amount. And that's just not, that's again, just like some made up rule.

Matthew Weiner (26:52)
Right, yeah. And we talk a lot about the portion control trap too, which is that the surgery is gonna take care of portions for me and it really doesn't over the long run. And so that's where the quality of your diet and the type of food. But I love that statement. It's so beautiful in its simplicity, which is if you are hungry, eat more food.

And that really is the essence of the advice that I think you need when you're in this situation. ⁓ But it's just about what you eat.

Zoë (27:27)
Because

if you continue to just try to willpower your way through eating the same small amount you had before, that's when your metabolic thermostat and your set point starts to fight against you. Because then that's going back to that old broken system of eating less to lose weight. Doesn't work. Yeah.

Matthew Weiner (27:45)
Yeah, right. Doesn't work. All right, what's our last

question?

Zoë (27:52)
Alright, last question here. feel like ultra processed foods, this isn't gonna be interesting, okay I'll start over. I feel like ultra processed foods are much better at quieting the hunger than whole foods. There is no way I would feel satisfied from eating some celery with peanut butter for breakfast. What is your advice for people like me?

Matthew Weiner (28:14)
It's a tough one. What do you think about that?

Zoë (28:17)
You know, this, when I was putting together the questions for today's episode and I saw this question and actually just yesterday I had a one-on-one with somebody who had a similar experience. She's like, I've been wanting to move away from processed foods for many years. And this is the first time I've actually been able to do it, but I'm feeling more hungry and more cravings. And to be honest,

I was a little surprised by that. So now seeing that there's another person having this experience, it is interesting and it's definitely worth having the conversation. You know, what we worked on with this patient that I had the one-on-one with yesterday was she is on the GLP-1s and she was trying to have these three square meals a day and she was feeling like she was force feeding herself.

Matthew Weiner (28:49)
Thank you.

Zoë (29:08)
past the point of fullness, because she was trying to get that pound of vegetables in, like the great pound of cure student she is. And I was like, okay, yeah, I want you to eat until you feel full, but I do not want you to force feed yourself past the point of fullness to be uncomfortable. So we've actually shifted down to let's try eating on a schedule every couple hours, still getting that protein and fiber in.

Matthew Weiner (29:12)
Yeah.

Zoë (29:34)
and see how that changes, being more mindful actually and more present with that eating experience. I think a part of it too is she was so wrapped around the axle about this happening and she was really stressed out. And I think that can be a big piece of it too is like having this like anxiety around it. It's not working, can make it, it's what you're hyper fixating on, right?

Matthew Weiner (29:53)
Yeah. ⁓

I think to some degree also, let me throw, let me change this around a little bit different. think the answer will become apparent. ⁓ I find that smoking cigarettes is much more relaxing to me than meditating. And so I'm gonna continue to smoke.

⁓ And I think it's very easy to see that there's really an underlying addiction to nicotine that's driving that statement. And so I think that if that's really how you're feeling, then there's probably some degree of food addiction to these ultra processed foods, to the sugar and spike you have when you eat processed carbohydrates or sugary foods, ⁓ to the artificial sweeteners, to the dopamine from the fatty and sugary

Zoë (30:45)
The dopamine.

Matthew Weiner (30:50)
foods and so I think that the way I interpret this is this is a food addiction and so we really kind of almost need to look at it that way and part of it is just like well you know that person who can only relax when they smoke cigarettes they ultimately will be able to relax without cigarettes after a period of time passes and that addiction wanes and so I think that this really should be addressed for what it is ⁓

Zoë (30:56)
And.

Matthew Weiner (31:20)
I don't use Contrave and Topamax very much, ⁓ which are kind of these first generation medications. It might be worth a try in someone like this. GLP-1s can also kind of help you get through that a little bit. ⁓ And so I think we have to look at this as an addiction ⁓ rather than actual satiety.

Zoë (31:45)
And also just to be clear, peanut butter and celery would not be enough for me for breakfast either. So

maybe trying to augment what it is that you're eating and maybe having something like eggs with a like a veggie egg scramble and Maybe some celery with peanut butter or a apple with peanut butter. You're getting that volume You're getting all of your nutrients in and you're setting yourself up for success for that day because if you're just trying to eat celery with peanut I know that I maybe it's brought up because you had mentioned that sometimes you have that and that's great, but

Matthew Weiner (32:02)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Zoë (32:17)
Also, like, meeting yourself where you're at and knowing what helps you feel your best going into the day might just mean that we need to boost up that volume for breakfast a bit.

Matthew Weiner (32:25)
Yeah.

Yeah, some people are breakfast eaters and some people are not, you know, and sounds like this person's probably a breakfast eater, in which case, you know, big veggie scramble, something along those lines, maybe eat a large meal, put some more animal protein in it, which tends to be a little more filling. ⁓ And so, yeah.

Zoë (32:32)
Yeah.

I'll tell you what I had the other the other morning for breakfast. I love having shredded carrots in my eggs. I don't it's kind of weird. I know but I had like not even a cup of shredded carrots, a cup of spinach, cook that together, added egg whites, seasoned it, had that nice big plate and then I had a banana and peanut butter. I'll tell you I was I should have stopped but I was I had gone for a run early so I hungry and yada yada. I was so full off of this.

plate of veggies and eggs and my banana peanut butter. you know, maybe just gotta try a couple different things until you find something that works well and satisfies you in the morning.

Matthew Weiner (33:20)
Yeah.

Yeah, absolutely. All right, great, great questions. Really good

Zoë (33:31)
Well, keep them coming. We are here to answer your

if this feels relevant to anybody in your life, please share it with them. We are trying to get the word out, of course, and help as many people as we can get to the root of their long lasting healthy happy weight loss doing it in a way that is not keeping you starving.

Matthew Weiner (33:52)
That's right, absolutely. Alright,

we'll see you guys next time.