To use your degree or not

Brett, is an outdoor and hockey enthusiast with a degree in biochem, who is trying to decide between going Combat Rescue Officer or Pararescue (enlisted). There is certainly pressure from everyone around him and from himself to join as an officer due to his degree. He is looking for a little more clarification on what each job entails before he makes his decision. This is an individual who is extremely driven as evidenced by his previous accomplishments.  

The choices between the more hands on job of a Pararescueman and the strategic command of a Combat Rescue Officer is one that I have discussed many times with people throughout the many consultations I have done. The biggest factors we talk about are family, what you want to be doing in 10 years, and if there are any specific financial obligations that need to be covered.  As we dissect the complexities of rank progression and pay scales, we reveal the surprising prevalence of college graduates in special operations, debunking myths and uncovering the synergy between academic discipline and elite military achievement.

As you listen to the episode I want you to remember it is your responsibility to make the best decision possible for yourself and your current or future family. You are the only one who has to walk down the path. No one will ever care about your dreams as much as you do, figure out what you want and make the decision, it doesn't get easier when you get older.

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The views, thoughts, and opinions expressed on this show belong solely to Brian Silva and his guests and do not represent the views, thoughts, or opinions of the DoD. The content here is for informational and entertainment purposes only and does not substitute for professional medical advice. The use of information or materials linked from this show or website is at the user’s own risk. It is not intended as a substitute for the advice of a physician, professional coach, psychologist, or other qualified professional, diagnosis, or treatment. 

Transcript

Brett Discusses Joining the Air Force

Brian 0:00

I also did not get that vaccine , and it was paperwork after paperwork of me not doing it . At the end of the day , that's also the kind of person that it takes . You have balls and stand up when something doesn't seem right . What's up , everybody ? Welcome back to another Prepare for the Drop podcast . Today I have Brett . He just graduated from college and he's looking for some direction on what he should do when he gets into the Air Force , when he gets in the Air Force , and we'll see how everything goes . He has a couple of questions though , brett , if you don't mind just introducing yourself a little bit and what you're going for in the Air Force and what you're kind of thinking .

Brett 0:40

Yeah , for sure . So I'm Brett . I'm 22 years old , I just graduated from Washington State University with a biochem degree biochemistry and I also played collegiate hockey over there . That was a lot of fun . I've been playing hockey my entire life and I live in Alaska . I work as a microbiologist on the state of Alaska right now . So just training for that .

Brett 1:04

These past couple weeks and , yeah , I've been training near the end of my college , college education I've been using the BAPJ program . It's a great program . Recommend it for sure . I'm on the selection portion , so get selected . It's a four and a half month program through BPJ as well . I am on the water portion right now .

Brett 1:27

So I've been ramping up the training quite a bit . I have guard Alaska unit tryouts May 16th and 17th , so those are coming up pretty soon . So I've been hitting the training pretty intensely and those tryouts are for the PJ unit and because I have a bachelor's degree , I've been really contemplating , going back and forth , hearing things on both sides pros and cons of whether or not I should look at combat rescue officer instead , which , if anybody doesn't know , it's just the officer version of PJ . So that's kind of what I'm going back and forth on . I don't want to go to tryouts for to be a PJ and you know , just have that officer thing in the back of my mind . I don't want to be going in on my heels . So I really just want to ask a bunch of questions and figure it out .

Brian 2:14

Okay . So first thing , hockey in Alaska real original , just kidding . Uh , have you done anything else in Alaska ? Obviously you liked the outdoors . To some extent you've been like ice climbing or what kind of draws you in general to PJ crow , that kind of stuff .

Brett 2:31

Yeah , so I mean I like building igloos and riding on my polar bear to school too . So no , I definitely like the outdoors . I've been hiking all my life wakeboarding , you know , in the summer go wakeboarding with my buddies on the lake . I enjoy swimming . I went to , you know I was . I was in swim lessons when I was younger , so I just grew up swimming . I love it . I love it on the lake .

Brian 2:55

I love why did you smile like that at the uh thinking about swimming when you were younger ?

Brett 3:01

Is there some kind of story behind that , I don't know , maybe a cute swim instructor or something in the past . So , oh , okay , maybe I'll say good old , uh sandlot thing .

Brian 3:13

You might not have watched that .

Brett 3:16

I also grew up , uh , running track , so I ran track . I tried football for a month and I hated it . It was very boring to me compared to hockey . So one day I just walked off the field and I never went back . Um , so I also I love hiking and the outdoors . I've hiked the tallest mountain in the Valley here , um , in Alaska , in Palmer , alaska , which is a pioneer peak for everybody , for anybody that knows that that , um , I love snow machining too . I just love the outdoors in general .

Brian 3:47

so also the draw of , yeah , my degree in , uh , pre-med biochemistry and combining the outdoor love and the physical action of the pjs and dealing with medicine just really drew my interest yeah , and I think that was one of the best parts of the job is that you get to do all the things that you just mentioned , get paid for it and also do a bunch of other stuff on top of that . So every day is different and you're always going out and figuring out what kind of adventures you can get yourself into . And I think that was one of the most fun things about pararescue in general , and I think something that people kind of overlook is the adventurous aspect that special operations and PJs have in general .

Career Paths

Brian 4:33

Whenever I would go TDY somewhere , the first thing I would do is put on my running shoes and go with one of my buddies , or sometimes by myself , just run around the city and figure out what the people are doing around there , what kind of restaurants are there , and just get the lay of the land , and it was always really cool to just be in some random place and throw on my shoes and just go for a run .

Brian 4:53

Obviously , you got to be careful , I guess , or whatever nowadays , but you know they see some kind of weird looking American running around , most of the time a little bit bigger than , uh , most of the other people there as far as strength , but they're usually . Don't mess with you , you just got to have that . Uh , don't mess with me . Look on your face whenever you're running through but anyway , yeah , that little like smile , like , come on , bring it then .

Brian 5:20

Um , so , getting back to the whole crow PJ thing , the biggest thing that I tell people to consider is how old are you ? 22. , 22 . So typically people who are younger in age . It's definitely more of a toss up because as a PJ you'll get a little bit more training as far as being able to extricate patients . You're expected to be the hands-on guy . As a crow they teach you as a nice to know thing , like if we don't have enough hands you can help and get in there . But that's not your primary job . Your primary job is the up and out stuff and being able to communicate with assets and whoever . You need to be talking to the team leader and coordinating the overall picture of what's going on on the ground , because at the end of the day , the officer is a person that is in charge of what's going on on the ground if they're there , so they take that responsibility .

Brian 6:15

But for a person who is older , I usually recommend you know you got kids to take care of or you're making a certain income . It's going to be a big drop in pay to go from making whatever income you're making . Hopefully it's a decent income if you're a 30 or whatever . But to go from doing that to being a senior airman is a big drop in pay . So , especially when you're going through the pipeline , you get benefit or extra bonuses Once you graduate for jump , dive and you know a couple of other things , but it's going to be a big pay . So besides that , it's what do you see yourself doing ?

Brian 6:54

The other , the other aspect is if you get in and you're young and you go straight in for officer and you're planning on doing a career out of this thing , you can potentially make it to Lieutenant , colonel , colonel or more .

Brian 7:07

So it just depends on what your aspirations , your goals are .

Brian 7:10

And you can obviously go into PJ and then four or six years later , but at that time you would have been almost a major if you had come in initially for officer and stuck with it .

Brian 7:25

So do you like the straight up leadership as far as almost being like eventually the CEO of a company , like that's basically what a squadron commander and group commander , wing commander , is just the bigger companies , and then that obviously transfers to different opportunities than you would get if you were a PJ . Or do you want to just stay with the bros and go and have fun out on the mountain , which obviously is more enticing to you based on the way that you gave me that look , he's smiling because his video is not there , but and that's kind of expected when you're 20 , in your , you know , young twenties , um , whereas older guys have been in charge before and they're just like , yeah , I guess I gotta keep with this . But those are some of the strong factors that I would recommend you consider on what you want to do . I mean , it sounds like just from your action you would regret it if you didn't do PJ first .

Brett 8:29

Yeah , I was going to ask you if you've had anybody that's went straight into crow , especially when they're young , like , let's say , my age , and look at all you guys , maybe having more fun and regretting his decision or being like I wish I could do that , or is it really just like as an officer he could be like oh , that sounds cool , let me go do that with you guys .

Brian 8:49

Yeah , some of both . It just depends on what the task load is for the squadron at the time , because when you become an officer you're going to be in charge of a section . So you graduate from the apprentice course for Crow School and then you end up going to the unit and you can be in charge of whatever place .

Brian 9:09

Some people were in charge of supply when they first were , like a butter bar or like a first lieutenant , whenever they got out of there on if they had some other experience or there was just not a spot to fill on a team because there was another person there already , and try to keep teams together . So you're going to be in charge of some kind of section running those things and that's your primary duty for that time , until you get to be around the team . Then you'll go and train with them , of course , because you have your own line items and checklists of things you got to do as far as upgrade is concerned and then beyond that , if you have the time and you're still knocking everything out , you can go on everything with the teams as long as there's not something else to do . But as a PJ , you're on the team immediately . There's no reason for you to be going to supply unless you really messed up and kind of handcuffed yourself .

Brian 10:07

I mean , like getting DUIs and that kind of thing is what I'm talking about . So when you're a PJ , you're brand new , like your job , like I said , is literally the hands-on everything . You should be all up on the patient , extricating all the ropes , everything you should have your hands on and be actively engaged in the work . So that's what's expected is you're going to go on every TDY , no matter what , or extra TDYs , because you're new and you need to go and get all the experience that you can . So you definitely get a lot more hands-on as far as that's concerned .

Brian 10:41

Officers also have to do more reports , which none of this sounds sexy , but at the end of the day , if you are doing those being prepped for CEO-like tasks as the civilian equivalent , then you need to know the ins and outs of what you're in charge of , what you're responsible for , putting your signature on everything You're doing EPRs for people and helping out with that as one of the approving authorities on that . So writing and going to leadership type conferences so I mean you learn , obviously , a lot of things . You have a lot of responsibility as a crow , so I'm not trying to diminish any of that , but you definitely have less of the hands-on and you'll still deploy also , uh , for at least a couple of rotations , so you can have that experience , um , and go with the team , but it's going to come to an end after you've pretty much put on captain .

Brett 11:38

You'll still deploy , but you won't be on the missions because there's other lieutenants that'll be there and you'll be the person that's in charge of staying back at the operation center and so , from my understanding , you stuck with pj the entire way and you you never went to pj , to crow , and I was going to ask why , why you didn't go to crow ?

Brian 11:59

well , I did 12 years as a pj and then I became PA . So I'm a PA right now , but I'm not in the military .

Brian 12:05

Obviously my hair but , um , I never really wanted to be a crow , honestly . Um , I guess maybe when I first started I thought about it because a lot of the crows were just studs whenever we got on team and they were super chill , laid back , um , but eventually they have to put their higher ranking officer hat on and then not necessarily hang out as much with the boys or be a little bit more tailored in the way that they hang out with the guys , just because the officer enlisted relationship , you know , fraternization and everything . So they can't have favorites or anything like that . But I , you know , I really just enjoyed being one of the dudes and then eventually being the team leader .

Brian 12:52

And I mean you still , as a team leader , are doing a lot of the things that are about the same as what a officer would do , kind of . Obviously you're not getting as much pay , but you're planning out a lot of the training and you're making sure all the guys get their upgrades . But you're also there just hands on , teaching them exactly what they need to be learning for their upgrade training , whereas a crow that's again not their expertise and they eventually will get their instructor . But when you're a team leader , you have to be an instructor and you have to be able to teach the guys and run the team . So it was pretty cool to just be in that position and that's all I really wanted to do was be a team leader and deploy a couple of times with the guys and be able to feel like I was able to adequately train everyone that came onto the team and make them you know the team environment . You build the team how you want it to be .

Pay and Rank Progression in Military

Brett 13:47

So , regarding the pay , um , you were talking about the bonuses and stuff , like you said , after the pipeline . So once you get those certifications , so is that like bump in pay ? Um , not that you want to do the job just because of the money or whatever , but um , is that depend on , like , when you're deployed , so like you're getting this money only if you're deployed , or you're getting this money only if you're doing this certain mission , or you know what I'm talking about ?

Brian 14:16

yeah . So , to be honest , it's changed a little bit , because it used to be you get get separate pays for each qualification that you have . So you got a separate jump pay , which at the time it was $225,000 . And then you got a dive pay , which was $150,000 a month . And then they changed those individual pays to one special duty type pay and I think whenever I left it was somewhere around $800 to $1,000 . I hope that it's gone up now .

Brian 14:49

I don't know what it is right now off the top of my head . Honestly , that's something that I'd have to look up , so don't quote me on what that is exactly going to be , but it's somewhere around that number $700 to $1,000 . Um , and you'll get that every month . There were some times when you had to jump to keep up currency or fly to keep up currency four hours a month in order to continue to get paid as that flyer status .

Brian 15:20

So again , I'm not sure exactly what that is right now , but you will get pay , which is obviously more than what a normal E4 , 5 , or 6 would get . And then you also get bonuses on top of that , and I don't know where the bonuses are right now either , but my first bonus that I got when I re-enlisted as an E I think I was E5 at that time . It multiplies the number of years you're going in or re-enlisting for times your base pay . So I ended up getting like ninety thousand dollars for my first re-enlistment . It's probably worn out at least I hope it is , but I don't know off the top of my head that's pretty good .

Brett 16:06

And uh , just the first thing that sprang to my mind . This may be a little goofy , but so when you were saying that the officers initially up until they reach captain or you know they're kind of one with the boys , they're always training , you know they're kind of in that role more , but then once they put on captain they kind of have to put on their officer more officer-like duties , is there anybody that has tried to just kind of stay under the captain role ? Is that frowned upon ? Has anybody tried to do that so that they could stay at that level or somewhere hands-on ?

Brian 16:38

you pretty much can't do that . So unless you mess up terribly , which obviously you don't want to do , that , yeah , you don't want to do that .

Brett 16:47

Yeah , you don't want to do that purposefully .

Brian 16:49

Yeah , captain is basically a guaranteed thing . So all you have to do is not mess up and then be in for long enough . It's kind of like senior airman . So it's difficult to stay in that position . And then you know , it also looks bad if you're a captain for a long time . It also looks bad if you're a captain for a long time . And again , major is also one of those things that's kind of hard to not get . If you're performing well and you do your job well , then you're probably going to put on a major unless you mess up . So a lot of that . And then lieutenant colonel . It gets a lot more competitive at that point .

Brett 17:26

But at that point in time , once you're putting on lieutenant colonel , you're going for squadron group type of leadership position , depending on , uh , who you are and how fast you got there how common is it for guys like me that graduated college or have a degree under their belt a bachelor's degree under their belt or more you know , maybe even a master's um to go into enlist and become a pj ? So just like , how common is that ?

Brian 17:56

I would say 22 years old is a pretty solid time to go in . 22 , 23 , like you're probably ahead of the curve as far as maturity . When I first came in because I was 19 and I didn't know my head from my ass I was just there and I was just like , okay , Sergeant , I'll do whatever you tell me to do which maybe it was the Forrest Gump thing and I was just like whatever you tell me to do , Sergeant , I'll do it . But I think that actually one of the recruiters told me there was a study that they did that people that had their degrees were more likely to graduate than people that didn't have their degrees . They didn't specifically delineate what the correlation was , but I can speculate that it's probably because people that have finished a degree have some amount of discipline and they're striving for making themselves better in general .

Brett 18:48

Yeah , that makes sense amount of discipline and they're striving for , you know , making themselves better in general .

Brian 18:50

So that makes sense . I , you know , don't know if that is exactly it , but that's , like you said , what makes the most sense to me . So you have a better chance statistically speaking . I always get tripped up on statistically , but yeah , so I think overall you would have a good shot if you went and with your background , all the things that you did playing hockey your whole life and liking the outdoors and being an athletic person and especially going through the program , the BPJ program . Obviously it's not an easy program , but that's why I programmed it that way is because I want people to just get that experience . Like this is kind of a glimpse , especially the uh , the longer days crucibles , where you just go through a whole bunch of shit and it sucks at the end but you're like , yeah , that was cool and I was able to do that , even though it took forever .

Brett 19:41

And yeah , definitely builds confidence day by day . It's . It's definitely really good I it . I mean , it's really fun in the moment . You know , sometimes , especially when I'm just doing everything by myself pretty much , I don't have many people . I have maybe one person I'm training with now that I just met in the pool , but uh , yeah , it gets pretty you get into that robot state where I'm just listening to music for so long and then I get sick of all my music . Like , I have probably like eight different playlists that I go through , cause I'm just like , oh man , and then eventually I just take off my headphones . But in the end I feel amazing . I get that euphoric feeling , you know , when you just beat your body down . Yeah , love it .

Brian 20:19

That's awesome , um , but yeah , so you're doing a lot of stuff . I think that you would have a good shot , um , especially , I mean , you'll get a real taste of it when you go to the tryouts here in a couple months and figure out what that's all about . I can imagine in Alaska that's definitely one of the more sought after units because the terrain that's up there and the civilian missions that they get to get who are leading the squadron They've been there for I don't know a lot of them have been there for a very long time at the Alaska unit , so lots of experience there and lots of good dudes to help mentor younger guys .

Brett 20:58

I'm guessing you know quite a bit of them .

Brian 21:03

I've never been up to the Alaska unit but I know a couple of the guys that we've crossed paths when we were on deployments or wherever we were at different trainings , paramedic refreshers , so you see each other and some of them , you know , I went through and dock with . So it's cool to have that community and you guys just always kind of pass by each other . Maybe it's a year or maybe it's five years that have lapsed between the last time that you saw them and you know it's . It's just cool , that community in that way , because you know you never just forget any of the guys that you met , because it's always in some kind of shitty place that you meet , um , and you always have good memories .

Brett 21:46

Oh , oh yeah , I was going to ask if you could kind of talk about maybe guard versus reserves , pj and crow .

Brian 21:56

So there's , a big difference .

Brian 21:58

Guard versus reserve . I am not a subject matter matter expert on that , but the biggest difference that I've heard is the funding and where that comes from . So obviously the guard guys are going to get it's a national guard , so you get the money from that state , so it's funded by that , and so it depends on how they want to send your guys out , like Texas we don't have a unit in Texasxas or anything , but just , for example , they're sending their guard , I guess , down to the border , um , so the governor kind of has more authority to be able to mobilize those kind of units , depending on where you're at . And then the reserve guys you know take from a different pool of funds . But honestly , beyond that , um , I don't know a lot else what about um ?

Brett 22:51

obviously you deploy when you're guard like you still deploy um . Can you talk about that a little bit like guard deployments versus active duty deployments ?

Brian 22:59

yeah , so the guys that I know on the guard units , they we have a primary job and both with guard and reserves you're expected to have a primary job , and both with guard and reserves you're expected to have a primary job . You're not getting paid the normal amount unless you go active guard or reserve

National Guard and Reserve Duties

Brian 23:13

. Active guard or reserve means that you're holding down the fort and keeping continuity at the unit while all the other guys are coming and going and doing their thing . So you're just tracking what needs to be done and making sure that everything's taken care of . But if you're just a regular guard , part-time kind of guy , then there'll be most of the time when guys that I know who have been in reserve guard they say hey , there's a training that's coming up , let me know if you're able to make it . And obviously it know , obviously it looks bad if you're just every single time , nope , nope , nope , not able to make it like , okay , what are you doing here ? You got to do your minimum at least , and so there's a degree to which you're you are able to put into that unit . So , and it's the same thing for deployments as well .

Brian 24:09

Obviously they needed to fill spots for leadership positions , so there has to be a crow , team leader , element leader , and then a lot of times there's also one-offs .

Brian 24:16

So if let's say the Vegas team or I guess the Vegas team is moving out now so the Davis-Monthanzona team is trying to deploy and they're , you know , missing a person , so you can augment them and deploy with that unit as whatever role you are in , like a pj element leader or just a team member , so you have chances to augment um as well . As there are also guys that have deployed with some of the rangers um for a couple different like recovery specialist positions . And you know all those opportunities just depends on who the commander is , what kind of relationships they keep up . A lot of people have just rotating contracts with other special operations branches to augment , so and the a lot of times the units kind of share those things because obviously each one wants their guys to have experience as well and that's just part of the deal . So a lot of different options there . But in general , you know you have some more ability to say no , I , I have something really important going on , but it's not always guaranteed .

Brett 25:33

So you know , just with a grain of salt kind of thing , because if you're the only guy , then you're the only guy , and that's what needs to be taken care of and then so I also want to talk about the difference between PJ versus Crow and being attached to certain units , because obviously , like the PJ would be have more opportunity to attach to certain units such as Rangers and Seals and maybe , like Green Berets , oda teams . So maybe that versus combat rescue officer side , like , do they get to integrate as much .

Brian 26:08

No , they don't . So the only the only other things that crows really do that are like , I guess , extracurricular . That PJs don't do is sometimes you'll need to do like a site survey in some kind of I don't know austere environment where you're thinking about sending your team and you need to just make sure that there's the assets and facilities available for , you know , just deployment in general . So they'll go down with a really small team and just check it out and figure out what the logistics of doing all that would be , because you know the main person that's going to be planning it . So that's primarily what the big extracurricular things , like I said , crows have done . But Honestly I can't think of any crows that have deployed by themselves as an augmentee to seals or green berets or anything . Every time we went it was me and a CCT guy or just me that would be augmenting . So yeah , I can't think of any .

Brett 27:23

That fact alone is very enticing to me .

Brian 27:24

That sounds very cool yeah , just being able to integrate with different units yeah , yeah , yeah , you're kind of .

Brett 27:31

I mean just every . Uh , the whole pj route is definitely more enticing to me as we're having more and more looking more and more like that's going to be .

Brian 27:41

I mean , I like I said I already knew it by the smile you put on your face when I was explaining pj versus crow at first . So it's you know .

Brian 27:50

It sounds like that's what you got to do , but yeah other people are going to tell you well , it's more financially responsible to go and be a crow , because then you'll be an officer and then you can do whatever . But at at the end of the day , you know , life is about the experience . You can always make money doing whatever other job that you want to do after you're done . Go be a freaking pro hockey player or something , or start start a business training people how to play hockey . Whatever you want to do , you know the world is your oyster Once you've just , you know , instilled the confidence in yourself and you know that you can do pretty much anything . Um , which is what you feel like after you're done with a doc . Obviously don't mean to be um egotistical , but that's I mean . It's , it's a good feeling , just like . Whatever it is , I'll take care of it and I'll knock it out , cause that's what I want to do .

Brett 28:35

Yeah , that's awesome . Um , so , speaking of like different jobs and going on to different jobs , um , do you know much about being a guard pj and potentially have another , potentially having or working towards your civilian career ? Um , and then what if that civilian career is overseas but you still want to be a guard pj ?

Brian 28:58

let's say me being in alaska and having a career opportunity overseas that would be something that you would have to work out with your commander .

Brian 29:08

So the commander is of the squadron , is the person who accepts a certain amount of risk that's involved with you not being immediately deployable , and a lot of times they'll say well , you just need to be able to be back here within like six hours or something like that .

Brian 29:23

So in case there is a recall and the whole unit has to mobilize for whatever reason you know world war three or something then you need to be able to be there , obviously because you're part of that unit and you've made that obligation clear . So that's really the biggest stipulation .

Military Career Path Comparison

Brian 29:42

I it's kind of loose on what that means of six hours , like you can hop on a flight versus driving distance . So again , it's up to the commander on what they expect out of you and if you've been there for a long time , maybe they will make some more um exceptions for whatever job that you may have eventually , and obviously as long as it's not in China or some on the other side of the world kind of place , which I don't know if that is , but I won't get into that Microbiologist as long as you're not working for the Wuhan lab .

Brett 30:21

What if I already am under john lab here in alaska ?

Brian 30:24

all right , forget it . You're not gonna do either one pj or crow you already make enough , enough money , um . So yeah , that's just basically what it depends on is what the commander is willing to accept as far as risk , so so , okay , that makes sense .

Brett 30:42

And what about PJ versus Crow family life ? Is there a big difference there ? Both of them are very demanding .

Brian 30:55

I can't really think of a big difference between those two , because you are still gone almost the same amount of time , maybe home a little bit more as a Crow , because you don't have as much offsite training to do and a lot of it has to do with like leadership responsibilities and planning . So it just depends on the unit , though , and how much they need you or need to use you for certain things . But maybe a more home for uh crow .

Brian 31:19

So what about pj and crow like desk work , so I assume that there's more pj desk work than I think well , you're in the air force , so anybody in the air force has to do some amount of computer-based training , which you you basically have OPSEC requirements and just different trainings that everyone in the Air Force has to go through . But for the most part , the big things that you're going to be doing as far as desk work is going to be developing a PowerPoint to teach and let people know . You're going to be teaching land nav and all the different aspects of land nav and telling us about how you use this compass and how you use um , a map , to plot different points , and then you know what the different terms are for those things , each different um , each different type of geographic feature that you see on a map . So you're just going over little things like that because it's part of your upgrade training , so you're just need to make PowerPoints for that . And , at the end of the day , though , that is just prepping you to give speeches in front of whatever platforms you're going to be working with . As far as , like aircraft , you need to give briefs to the commanders on what our side is , what our duties are , what you plan on having your team do Once you become , like element leader , a team leader , you're going to be giving all those produce and doing all the planning for that .

Brian 32:45

So a lot of that is good practice , to just be able to be in front of people and , you know , give out a brief . So , but for the most part you're not necessarily doing a lot of typing up of stuff , depending on what your ancillary duty is . A lot of times you have , like , as a team member , one guy's in charge of the med equipment , one guy's in charge of the extrication equipment , one guy's in charge of whatever . So each person has their own little thing that they just need to keep track of . As far as team gear , just so we know that it's organized and it's good to go . So not a ton though of computer work . You would usually just set aside like a friday or maybe a wednesday , if it's a down day between training , to get all those little computer things knocked out . So it's not terrible , although it sucks when you're doing it , because obviously that's not why you joined to be a .

Brett 33:41

PJ yeah , exactly yeah . That's what I'm feeling like right now with my training as a microbiologist . It's very boring right now , but hopefully it's temporary . Yeah , I don't know why I mean PJ to microbiologist .

Brian 33:57

That seems like a pretty stark contrast of the things that you would be doing and it's interesting that you even went for microbiology . Maybe that's making you or forcing you to like go pj and go the opposite direction , because microbiologist is probably a sedentary job yeah , so initially when I went to this is kind of a side tangent , whatever .

Brett 34:18

But when I joined college I wanted to become a doctor . So I went through biochemistry pre-med so I mean I could go to med school if I got all my prereqs in and MCAT whatever . So originally I was doing that , I was really into medical aspects and I actually went through ROTC in college for three years and , um , I was just really honed in on the doctor route and then as time went on that's when I got introduced to PJ or Crow , so for ROTC , um , so then that kind of just really consumed me , especially just loving like the team aspect with hockey on my life . I just love that , that atmosphere , the banter , everything like that other challenging each other , bettering each other , and so that , just like I said , it just consumed me and I just was like thinking about it right when I woke up , thinking about it right before I went to bed , training and going to school . So that's how I got introduced to that , basically this whole career path .

Brett 35:25

And then I left , um , because of the mandates , so I left because of that , um , I stepped away and I had my cadre tell me you know , we'll give you , we'll put a good word in if you want to go to officer candidate school later down the line , if things settle down or whatever . So that's why I'm really you know this whole thing . Just I just had that another spark for it . Uh , especially with everything calming down , and I don't want to let anything get in my way of having amazing experiences . And you know , the dream job that I was just so obsessed with for three years and I'm becoming more obsessed with it now , um , so that's just a little tangent , but that's how I basically landed into this interest of wanting to go pj and that's another thing that lines up with being a good candidate is that was what I was like when I was thinking about joining , and then I was like okay , I'm .

Brian 36:28

This is all I can think about is just same thing every time you wake up before you go to bed , and every other second you have in between where there's dull moment , you're thinking about it and she's like oh look let me look at another video , or .

Brian 36:40

And you're just checking out different things on the internet and you're like , okay , well , I mean , I got to do this . Like this is everything that I'm thinking about right now . And then the other part is the whole mandate thing that you talked about , and I also did not get that vaccine , and it was paperwork after paperwork of me not doing it . At the end of the day , that's also the kind of person that , um , it takes like you have balls and stand up when the something doesn't seem right . So it's something that obviously is a sensitive subject at some point , um , but at the end of the day , you can try and file a religious exemption or whatever where you just don't have to get it . Nobody can force you to do anything that you don't want to do . So anyway , we can , uh , probably do a whole .

Brett 37:33

I could do a whole podcast on that , so you know yeah , I figured I was trying not to get into that whole rabbit hole . But yeah , that's the yeah .

Brian 37:41

Yeah . So anyway , for you guys that are out there listening that you know , stick to whatever you believe in . That's all that it comes down to , and nobody can force you to do anything that you don't want to do . Maybe they'll give you some paperwork or whatever . At the end of the day , do what you think is right and stand with your head held high . That's all there is to it . Well , I think , overall , hopefully , this added a little bit of clarity to what you want to do and what you want your path to look like .

Brian 38:10

We mostly talked about PJ versus Crow , guard versus being active duty , and it sounds like you're more set on being a PJ , which you know . If you want to be hands-on and you want to be with the boys , so to speak , for a longer period of time , then PJ is the route that you want to go . Crow obviously has its benefits as well . If you are trying to join and you're younger , just know that you're going to have to be more mature , be able to speak in front of people and then do planning and all the other things that are involved with being an officer .

Navigating Military Relations and Rules

Brian 38:43

But at the end of the day , you're an officer , enlisted or unlisted , and you can't just necessarily be bros out in public . There are rules and some people can bend them , depending on the team you're at . Uh , at the end of the day , all it takes is one person it's typically a support person to say , hey , I think that guy was hanging out with the other guy he's an officer and you know they turned into super nerds .

Brian 39:14

So , anyway , jealousy , yeah . So , um , hopefully , like I said , that answered a couple of your questions and if you have any questions after , just feel free to hit me up . And if you guys listening have any questions or want to be on the podcast , hit me up . Brian , it had to be a PJ check out the programs that we were talking about . If you have any questions about any of that , again hit me up . Otherwise , I appreciate um y'all listening and I'll see you next time Later .