Critical Care Crossroads
Critical Care Crossroads brings together a flight paramedic, a flight nurse and an ER nurse (and guests,) who probably spend too much time around sirens and sarcasm. We're here to talk about the real world of prehospital and critical care-the wins, the lessons, the close calls, and the stuff they definitely didn't cover in training.
Whether you are on the ground, in the air or somewhere in between, join us for honest conversation, clinical nuggets, and just enough dark humor to get you through your next shift. Listener discretion is advised.
Critical Care Crossroads
Ep. 6: Imposter Syndrome, Gatekeepers and the Courage to Jump
Carson and Nicole have a reflective conversation about imposter syndrome and the courage it takes to continue progressing in a career when you're unsure if you have what it takes.
Follow @critcarecrossroads on Instagram for updates about the show and more content from the crew!
Welcome to Critical Care Crossroads where we talk all things EMS, critical care and the wild world of free hospital medicine. I'm Carson, I'm Jaden.
Speaker 2:And I'm Nicole Quick reminder the views and the opinions you hear on this podcast are ours and our guests' alone. They do not represent our employers, the agencies we work for or any organizations with which we're affiliated. This show is for educational, commentary and entertainment purposes only and is not a replacement for your organization's protocols or guidance.
Speaker 1:Stories involving real patient encounters may have been de-identified or altered to protect patient privacy. Due to the nature of this podcast, listener discretion is advised.
Speaker 2:So buckle up, join the ride and let's navigate the crossroad between street medicine and critical care together.
Speaker 1:Hey, welcome back to another episode. This one's going to be just me and Nicole Given. We have a little bit of experience to us. We wanted to talk about just kind of the paths and the imposter syndrome that comes with having experience and our own little backstories that come with that as well. Talk about, like I said, things like imposter syndrome and making the jump, and what I mean by that is knowing that you might not be ready for the next step in your career, but making that step anyway and empowering that, nicole, how you been doing.
Speaker 3:I've been doing great, yeah. Yeah, things have been busy, but that's okay.
Speaker 1:It never slows down, does it?
Speaker 3:No, it does not. It feels like it is always something.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so in preparation for this episode, you brought up the definition of imposter syndrome. Do you still have that, by any chance?
Speaker 3:I do so. The definition of imposter syndrome is the persistent inability to believe that one's success is deserved or has been legitimately achieved as a result of one's own efforts or skills.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and in kind of my own terms, to me that means like the idea that I don't deserve the role that I'm in and eventually I'm gonna get caught on that, and in the meantime, I've either just gotten lucky along the way, um, and like every success is one that I haven't necessarily owned. It just kind of happened to fall into place, um, and it makes you kind of question your successes. You want to avoid you to avoid taking on leadership roles or teaching roles. How is that? Is that kind of in line with your thought as well, or what do you think?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean, I think that my like for anyone who knows me personally I have this huge, huge struggle of feeling like I don't deserve something, or I'm not good enough for something. Don't deserve something, or I'm not good enough for something I like. If I go for a position, whether that's in a leadership role or a new job or something, I'm always like there's somebody better, there's somebody better, they're going to get it over me, like I am never, ever saying I've got this, I'm going to get it, I'm going to do it or I'm going to do great. Because I always feel like I'm not good enough for something. And I think that that comes from just kind of like the culture in EMS in general and like what has been like dished out, I guess.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and sometimes I think early on, especially in any role, like early on in my first nursing job, versus when I moved from the ER to the ICU and then again in the flight role wondering in those stages, am I underqualified or am I just early in the learning curve and is this normal for the people around me? Sometimes I think it's so easy to focus on the people around us, especially the people in the same like age group, class, whatever it may be the same experience level, and only focus on their successes and our own failures. That makes you wonder like am I not qualified for this? Am I early in my learning curve? Am I actually on par with their education and their standards? Where am I at?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think that it's easy to feel like you're underqualified for many different reasons. I mean, sometimes there's a toxic environment that's built and we kind of just like hang on to that and it's so easy to tell yourself like I don't deserve this or I'm not going to get it, versus like building yourself up and thinking that like you're overqualified for something. I have referenced the imposter syndrome multiple times throughout my career and I'm sure that I will probably reference it for years to come career and I'm sure that I will probably reference it for years to come. It's just, it's really easy to feel like you got lucky over something or oh God, I probably didn't. You know the other, the other candidates weren't great. Or, you know, like you're never like thinking that maybe I'm the one who's great, I am awesome and that's why I got this position, instead of thinking that like something horrible happened and everyone else dropped out and you're just the last standing person and that's why they chose you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, this will be something that we kind of referenced throughout the rest of the show here, just kind of, with it being my own personal experience too. But I think, doing the math in my head, you probably were doing the same things around the same timeline, just on the EMS side that I was doing on the nursing side. I think we graduated on respective programs about the same time and everything else. But that eat it. You're young.
Speaker 1:Mentality was very, very big, especially at the time that we started, and we also started during COVID. And so when you put those two orientations together, those two orientation processes where we don't get the full ride time, for example in EMS, or you don't get the full preceptorship I only had a couple of weeks in the ER before I had to be turned on my own because we were just getting slammed like that and so it gets to the point where you don't have time to really build a rapport with one preceptor and them understand your strengths and weaknesses, and I think it's very easy for them to assume that you're just immediately not capable or only provide negative feedback and not positive feedback, and that really feeds into that imposter syndrome.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think that I mean I got my medical license right before COVID started and obviously once COVID hit, things changed tremendously and you know you couldn't have the full experience of preceptorship. You were just kind of like thrown out to figure it out on your own, even if people were trying really, really hard to like make it somewhat decent for you. But they would focus on the bad things or, you know, try to maybe humiliate you or every from that point forward saying like well, you didn't get this experience in this role, or you didn't get to, you know, do extra ride time, so that's why you don't know what you're doing. Because it's easy to say something like that versus like saying, hey, maybe I'm the shitty one who gave them a really shitty preceptorship, like that, maybe it's my fault and not theirs, and so it kind of like builds this, it plants this seed in your head, of like, oh, maybe I am not that good of a paramedic and maybe I am just awful at my job and I don't know what I'm doing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think one thing that was really tough on the nursing side you know, travel nursing just absolutely exploded. People were leaving roles left and right, people were getting sick, the schedules were just insane and a result of that was I never actually had my own preceptor, either in the ER or the ICU, so I never got the time to build up a rapport with one, and it was always this kind of a shadow period for just a few weeks and then boom, I'm on my own, a shadow period for just a few weeks and then boom, I'm on my own. So I don't know how that was with you, cause I I don't know if most EMS programs like to do ride time with one specific person to build a rapport, or they just bounce them around a bunch and where, like, the sweet spot is for that.
Speaker 3:Um, honestly, it kind of depends on the agency that you work for. Some like for you to be with one person and then other departments want you to bounce around to see how other people do things. For me, personally, I am a huge fan of just sticking with one person, like you know, for you know your six month orientation or whatever it is just because you get familiar with that person and it's so easy to kind of lean on them, versus bouncing around to all these different people and maybe not meeting their standards and so then you get a really, really bad report back, just because either they don't like you or they don't think that you're good enough, or you're young, and so they think you're young and stupid. I think that having one preceptor is like it's great, versus having multiple Cause that just leads to being like people being able to talk poorly about you.
Speaker 1:I did like the opportunity, like from time to time, not as a standard thing, but to shadow somebody that wasn't. It wouldn't be like a main preceptor, like maybe 20% of the time, 25% of the time, just to get a couple of different perspectives, maybe towards the back end, after you already had your feet underneath you. And I know one thing we do in the bedside um role is we'll do say, say they get a 12-week orientation is what we're supposed to get. They'll do like the first six to nine weeks on day shift and then they'll be on night shift the last few. So you're there with a new preceptor there too. I think it also gives them the chance to be evaluated by a couple of people, just to make sure that one person doing a precept thing isn't just, you know, blowing smoke or you know giving a bad reputation to someone that doesn't deserve that either.
Speaker 3:I think that I mean, I agree. I think that the main chunk of an orientation needs to be with one person, because you get familiar with that person and like it's your partner and like once you, once you build a partnership with somebody, you feel very confident in what you're doing because you have that person and you know that person's strengths and weaknesses and you kind of like build off of each other and I mean it is great you know, past a certain point in their internship, to be like, hey, you're going to go ride with this person for a shift or two to see how they do things, because you should be aware of that as well. I just don't think that switching them from one person to the next, to the next to the next does anything productive for them. I think that, if anything, that just stresses you out that much more.
Speaker 1:Oh, absolutely. Yeah, no, I get that for sure. I also think one thing that played into the whole COVID thing and being released off orientation early, like in an emergency status, was that I got a lot of this situation and I don't really know if there's a word for it or a way to describe it, but obviously we're all going to make mistakes when we're new and it's amplified whenever you're on your own, and I wouldn't give like the best handoff in the world, like the patient wouldn't be at a detriment or anything, but like maybe there were tasks that I didn't realize need to be done and I always got the and that's okay, that's okay. It meant to be supportive, but they never actually taught me what right was, and there was a long time there, like months, if not the first year. I was just trying to figure out what right was. I don't know if you got anything like that.
Speaker 3:I mean, I think that everyone can say they've probably gotten bits and pieces of that. It's easy to be like oh, I'm new, I don't know what I'm doing. Or other people saying, oh, it's okay, you're just new, but they never actually take the time to teach you how to do something, they just do it themselves. Or God, you're new, so just move out of my way, let me do this for you, or I'll teach you this later. I need, I just need to do this. Um. Being the new person sucks in many different ways, um, but you know, I think that maybe not treating your new person like, like and crap also helps.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and the other thing too, that I think COVID really accelerated. Now they had this. So I was a tech for a few years before I went to nursing school or before I got my nursing license, and this was kind of a thing before then, but it really got amplified during COVID as well, where the burnout was going through the roof. Travel nurses were taking over left, and right, right and your experienced nurses were leaving, and what that turned into is we had to have a lot of young people in leadership.
Speaker 1:Hospitals typically don't like making charge nurses out of travel nurses. It's kind of an exception to the rule if they do. And that means that, like there was a time on my night shift where I didn't even have a full year of experience and I was probably the most experienced that we had in a full-time status, so they just jumped me to charge nurse real fast. Was I ready for it? Probably not. But that comes with the whole dynamic of you know these day shifters, because our day shift typically was had some more experience in the night shift and you know these people having four or five plus years of nursing experience interacting with a charge nurse that hadn him have his first year.
Speaker 3:That's a huge dynamic that can play into that imposter syndrome for sure. Yeah, I mean I've been in a couple of roles being brand new. Like you know, I first got my medic license. It felt like I jumped from being a baby medic to precepting somebody or having students and it's like I don't even know how to be a medic on my. I don't know how to stand on my own two feet and I'm training these other people.
Speaker 3:I mean there's good and bad, because I kind of had to like grow up quick in my role as a paramedic but also, like it just created a lot of doubt in my head of like do I actually know what I'm doing? I mean, still to this day I ask myself do I know what I'm doing? Or like, am I good enough for this? I mean it's so easy to fall into that trap and like having a good support system kind of helps with that and kind of like tries to beat that feeling. But I feel like if you ask anyone in EMS or nursing that if they have imposter syndrome or felt like that, they would all say yes, without a doubt.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the other thing that I got was a lot of not not a lot of, but a good amount of just pushback from peers like the whole you haven't earned this yet comment, or the oh man, it sucks that they have the young charge nurse comment.
Speaker 1:Don't really know if I'm going to help him out though At my facility when, if you're in charge of a cardiac ICU or the regular ICU, you're also the code in the rapid team.
Speaker 1:So a lot of times these nurses with good experience on these med surge floors or these step down floors would be making a call out asking for the resource of the rapid nurse or the code nurse and they would expect somebody that you know is probably rocking their stuff and those are things. And then when they see this like 23 year old kid coming out like a little silly goose on the loose, I don't think they. I don't know if that's immediately a look of trust, right, or I don't know if that gives the optics of someone that really knows what they're doing outwardly. And while I did my best and we all do our best to outwardly have this presence of a good leader and, you know, pay attention to the optics of all of that, I don't know if it's really earned just by the look of your face, the fact that I was shaving once a week and still look clean shaven, for example and I'm the kid responding to this stuff. There's no way to trust in that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean, when I first got into the fire service and I mean it's definitely been a difference from 10 years ago to now but my very first job I was told that I had to earn my position there and I needed to earn my respect, like earn that person's respect for me, and that was kind of like a hard pill to swallow because I'm like what in the world?
Speaker 3:And it took a lot of like being able to actually prove myself that I was worthy of having their respect and that I was earning my place at that department. I feel like a lot of people treat new employees kind of the same way Like you have to earn your position here and you need to show me that you deserve to be here, and if you don't, then you're going to get out. And I feel like it's so easy to kind of attack a new person if they don't automatically jump to the standards that you've built for, like you have yourself. It's not even like a company or a department standard, it's something that you have set forth and like. If that new person doesn't meet that, then you just kind of attack them and make them feel less than and like then it's really really hard to feel like you're doing a good job and that you are, you know, saving lives and living the dream, when you know you probably hate coming to work because of not meeting that person's quote. Unquote standards.
Speaker 1:Right, and there's such a balance, too, with that, because you want to, as a leader, earn your team's respect Granted, like there's something to be said for just immediate respect to the title and everything else too but you want to genuinely earn it with the right optics. But you also don't want to overcompensate and go too hard, to the point where you're adopting bad practices or adopting mindsets that you don't want to have. One thing that's cool about putting young people in leadership positions is they're very fresh to everything. They're looking at it from the outside in and they can really come up with these cool adaptive solutions that everyone else hasn't thought of, because this is just the way that we've done things.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think it's so easy to. Or they're like you're not doing this and I, this is what you have to do, or this is a policy, and it's like well, it's not, it's not a policy. I don't, I don't know where you came up with that, but okay.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I actually remember, um, this reminded me of a time when I was still a relatively new charge nurse on my ICU that I was in charge of overnight and the night charge nurse usually makes the assignments, like the shift assignments, and which nurse is going to take which patient and make that assignment for the coming shift. And it was going to be a crappy day. We had some call-ins, we had some really sick patients, and so I did the best I could. But I knew everyone was going to come in and just not like their assignment off the get right and there's not a whole lot that I can do about that other than just like try to have a good attitude and so I'm doing my best and all these nurses come in and every single one of them has a whole lot more experience than I do, just because they're having to be that crowd, like that day shift crowd that's all been there for some good time and they all look at my assignments and immediately just start talking their talk right and saying that these are the worst assignments I've ever seen and we're going to change them. Like you know what, you guys go ahead. If you think you can make better assignments, you probably can, like, go ahead and go for it.
Speaker 1:And I remember sitting on the corner watching them erase and debate and erase and debate and write names down. And then they settled they don't realize this. They settled on the exact same assignments I made, yeah which I think is hilarious and they, like you, got to let them have that win. You know you can't just do the whole, I showed you or whatever. They don't realize that they did that, but like to this day that kind of sticks with me as a you know a way that to kind of prove to myself that maybe, hey, I did do something right, but I don't have to boast about it either. I can let them have that win and walk away.
Speaker 3:This part of being a leader is kind of taking the slack and taking the quote, unquote shit talk and letting them have that moment, I guess. Yeah, I mean, I was promoted into a position and I was very new to where I was working and nobody nobody, except for like one person agreed that I was the best fit for that position, because they felt that they deserved it. And it was really, really rough for me because I was constantly feeling like I just wanted to like be a turtle and go in my shell and just not be around anyone. I didn't want to be seen, I didn't want to make changes, I didn't want to like have trainings, I didn't want to do anything because of the like it was terrible pushback and nobody wanted to listen, nobody felt that what I had to say was right and it it messed with me for, I mean, a really long time and like mentally, I'm like I'm not good enough for this. I I don't know what I'm doing. I shouldn't have even put in for this job. I'm just going to tell my boss that I'm going to give it back and he can give it to one of them, because they clearly deserve it more than me and you know there was such a huge fight over it and then at the end of the day, someone like super close to me was like why does it matter? Why does it matter what they're saying or what they're pushing back?
Speaker 3:You were chose for, you were, you were picked for the position and they were not. And that's something that they have to sit with and they have to get over. And I'm like you know you're right. But it's also super difficult for me to, like you know, go in and feel like I know what I'm doing and I'm feeling very confident in that. And you know, he told me, like you have all of this experience, you've been an FCO, like you have taught classes. You know, know you, you know what you're doing, you're not dumb. So go in there and sit in that position Like you earned it because you did and you know what you're doing. And they can either get on board or they can get out. And I mean I agree 1000%. I think that everyone can disagree with somebody's decision in a workplace, but you can either agree or you can leave, you can get out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think the other thing that's really hard is when you're this younger person that is put into these leadership roles, like, for example, on the hospital side.
Speaker 1:That also meant since, with COVID, we cut our educator, but even still we have to help out with this.
Speaker 1:When it comes time to do competencies you do annual and like biannual skill competencies and checks. They go to you for this competency on the day and you're the one that's like proctoring or leading it and, like you, still have to maintain the standard and hold the standard, as this guy that has six months to a year experience in these nurses, with five, 10 plus years that they might expect as a free pass and there might be like points that they don't know. And so how do you convey to them like, hey, actually let's run this back again. And then it's the same thing with your friends too, because you're young and you're cool and I don't know if I'm cool or anything like that, but you, you know, you, you bond to the people when you're 22, you want the other 21 fun with you and, like you know, it sucks being the only one in that age bracket that is up at that level, to the point where it's like, hey, I'm sorry, but we got to maintain the standard a little bit.
Speaker 3:I think that you know I, I experienced the same thing and it was a I need you to show me how to do this skill. Well, I already know how to do it. Well, fantastic, show me, show me you know how to do it. And they would would get mad and it's like well, this is the standard.
Speaker 3:And if the roles were reversed, you would be doing the same exact thing to me, because you can't just pencil whip things and check people off just because you don't want to have that interaction with them or worry about repercussions or whatever it is.
Speaker 3:You still have to be able to do your job, because in the end, they would do the same thing, and if you're pencil whipping, that just leaves room for them to not actually know how to do something and attempt to do it on a patient, and they have no idea in the world what they're doing. And you know you also have to hold yourself to the same standard, like I am going to tell them to do this because I know how to do it and I can teach them if they are maybe not as competent in the skill as they need to be, and I'll educate them and I'll help them grow. I'm not going to treat them like crap over it. You kind of have to be the bigger person in it and I mean I learned that. Was it comfortable? No, it was uncomfortable because you don't want the pushback. But at the end of the day, this is for our patients and we have to keep that in mind.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I do remember also being pretty isolating, kind of being the first one in my age group to get that leadership role too, because there's a time and a place for everything. But once you kind of get put into that charge nurse role or even that preceptor role, you got to be careful about what conversations you engage in now and who you sit next to, and you can't sit next to any one person for too long of a time and so like if your best friend's working but they're not a charge or whatever, people are going to really quickly point to favoritism even if it's not favoritism. So you really lose a lot of friends once you get into that role and it's just a matter of like is that something that you want to do when you take on the role and understand that's a sacrifice you have to make when you move on into leadership?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean I learned from a person who is close to me that once you go into a leadership position, like nobody's your friend and the unfortunate thing is that most times that's the truth. Um, it's kind of the hard truth that they're not your friends, but they'll try to like buddy up to you and be like oh hey, um, you remember that one time and it's like oh, you remember that one time you treated me like shit. But, um, like I mean, once you get into a leadership position, you kind of have to like watch your P's and Q's and you know like make sure your stuff's in line. So I mean, it's all about the culture that you build as well, like having an opening, like an open space to be able to go in and like mess up or not be perfect in that role, but also not feel like you're going to get your head bitten off or something Like. I think that just kind of like supporting people in that role is super important.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and so the thing I want to talk about next and I want to see if I can convey this properly. But one thing I don't think that anyone should do is be comfortable in a spot for too long. You should always be challenging yourself. And so I right, when I was starting to really get a groove and get comfortable as an ICU nurse and be a guy that I trusted to be called to these rapid responses and to be able to help out the doctors and, you know, was starting to get well known among my peers as someone that could lean on, I like to think, and I and I decided to move on to flight and the way that I described the flight orientation of the first day.
Speaker 1:If for any of you that play sports, you might know this but or you might like understand this. But imagine that high school standout athlete like the guy that breaks all the records and does all the cool stuff, and then it gets that D one offer and then you know you got high hopes for them, you're going to see them on TV and they go to that first D1 practice and just get their shit rocked. That's like what day one felt, like I thought I had this cool resume coming from this big level, one regional, you know trauma center, and you know I had charged on the resume, I had preceptor and all these things, and then like everybody around me, that's like the bare minimum, you know.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean I cried after my first shift on the way home. I was like I, I'm not meant for this, I'm not going to do well, I'm not good enough. And um, I mean, I really struggled with that and, honestly, like throughout my entire orientation, I felt like I had no idea what I was doing. I felt like you know, you see a duck pat like going across the water, but their feet are just paddling away under, like I felt like I was just constantly. I try to be calm on the outside, but inside I'm like shit, shit, shit, shit, shit. I don't know what I'm doing. I don't know what I'm doing. Oh my gosh, this is crazy. And um, I mean, like for most of my orientation, I was like I'm not good enough, I'm not good enough for this and I don't know what I'm doing. And then one day it kind of like clicked that hey, um, so I can get in the helicopter without, you know, being over the skids, or I can get my seatbelts on like a big girl on this helicopter.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and it's. It's wild too, cause like while that environment changes, really patient care is not a whole lot different. It's just the logistics that are really different.
Speaker 1:But you just feel the microscope that you're under. You just feel the whole microscope and the other thing that's so hard. Usually I don't know how it is on the paramedic side, but at least on the nurse side you orient in waves so you have, like your buddies you're orienting with, and that other slot in the organization at the time to get hired because it's such a small pool. So you only see yourself failing and nobody else. You just don't know if you're on track or not.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean when I got hired on thankfully there was another person that was also hired on but I felt like my orientation was significantly different and that's okay, it is what it is. But I was constantly feeling the pressure of yeah, I'm not good enough, I don't know what I was thinking, I made the wrong decision coming into flight. I'm not smart enough, I don't know what I thought I did. Then one day it clicked that I know what I'm doing and it's the same thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, with that. Whenever you take on these new roles not rules, I apologize when you take on these new roles, I want to talk about how you can make an impact anyway, we kind of touched on this in our leadership episode but just how can you affect the culture when you're new and how can you be somebody that you know is resilient through that?
Speaker 3:Because you don't want to be the oddball, you don't want to be the one calling things out or saying like hey, I have an easier way of doing this. Or like, hey, that person's being really, really shitty and we should do something. We shouldn't just allow this to keep happening. So I think, as a new person coming in and just having the ability to have the confidence of, like, I love my job, I want to do it really well and I want to have all the resources available and I want to have a team that stands behind me in case I need something. So, you know, coming in and like asking to train, or um, you know, like going into the living room and watching a movie with your crew or eating dinner together.
Speaker 3:Um, I mean Carson and I, whenever we worked together, we always had we called it family dinner time with us and our pilot, and I mean it was it's nice to be able to sit down and like at the firehouse, I mean I would sit down, we'd make dinner and I would sit down with my crew of you know seven guys, cause I was the only girl, but um, I still call those guys like they're, they're my brothers and um, like the best times I can think of is sitting out in the bay just shooting the shit with them, or sitting at the dinner table and at the base I mean us eating dinner or watching movies, or like me burning my tongue with hot chocolate on like Christmas Eve because we were watching movies.
Speaker 1:It's like little things like that, like just welcoming that environment and like not hiding in your shell and being afraid to like be different yeah, we had a similar experience on the nursing side, where it wasn't necessarily we were like living together and doing that on our downtime but, um, very much like the oh it's, we all worked this three in a row.
Speaker 1:At the very end of it, let's all go to happy hour.
Speaker 1:You know, or you know, when you're off at that night, a lot of the areas around hospitals will um, serve brunch super early, as I know that the nurses and the respiratory therapists and healthcare workers excuse me, in general are getting off work. So make an effort to show up to those things and if you don't see it happening like as either the new person or the person with some experience, do your best to like start that conversation and that invite to have people out and really, really try your best to include the people that usually don't get that invite or the people that are brand new as well, so they can start to feel like they're a part of the team. Because I don't think so much of it is a battle of knowing your stuff, because that's always going to come with time, as long as you stay curious and have a good work ethic, but you really just need to feel like you have your place on the team and a lot of that imposter syndrome really starts to go away.
Speaker 3:I feel like inviting the new person is super important, because nothing hurts worse than like seeing a picture on Facebook or Instagram or whatever, of you know most of the people that you work with hanging out or doing something and you didn't get an invite. So always inviting the new person, I mean they're fun. They're going to be awkward and weird because they're the new person, but we love them. We love weird and awkward and that's what I was going to say.
Speaker 1:It's going to feel, especially the first time you do that kind of thing. It's going to feel weird and awkward. But make the effort to show up, at least just for a little bit.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean, even if you come in for, you know, 10 minutes, just showing the effort, and I mean being the new person.
Speaker 1:Of course you don't want to show up into a room full of people you don't know, but you kind of have to just like dive in and, you know, get over the weirdness. Yeah, and one of the last topics I have on the outline here that I wanted to talk about was about physically making that jump to that next role. Right, whether that be your first FTO or preceptor role, your first charge role or you know, say you want to move on to the flight world, I don't think you're ever going to be completely ready. Obviously you have to meet the requirements and there is a level of competence that's come with all of that, along with the thick skin and all the things that come with it. But you're never going to be completely ready.
Speaker 1:So give yourself grace to understand that you will be trained into that role one way or another and that you will learn and get better as time goes on. And don't be stuck in that, that headspace. That well, I'm not good enough for it yet, but maybe next year and then maybe next year, and then maybe I'll apply to that school program, that degree program next year. If you're meeting those requirements and you're able to be heard out for an interview. You're already earning your place. You just have to make that jump.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think that you know, whenever I put in for my flight position, I was like I am not going to get this, I'm just throwing a freaking ball and like hoping, you know, it goes in the hoop, kind of thing. And um, when I got my interview I was like huh, okay, well, maybe I have a chance. And then, like four days later, they called me to offer me the position and I'm like, oh God, now I have to like face my fear and like hope that I'm, I'm good enough for this and, um, like jump in even when you think that you're not fully ready, because you will, you'll get ready. And there's training. For a reason, you know, you can't just jump into a position and not have any sort of training or orientation for that specific role, and doing the training makes you significantly more comfortable in that role.
Speaker 1:And I think that the best way to really inspire these people to make the jump and you know anyone that's on the fence not quite knowing if they're ready, really having that self-awareness is to humanize ourselves that are in these positions and we kind of touched on this in a previous episode, I think.
Speaker 1:But like we are not experts in this field by any means and that's not what our podcast is about, we just happen to have a subscription to Buzzsprout and I have a subscription to Spotify not Spotify Riverside, right and we're able to use our voices, and so what I wanted to do with this, what we wanted to do, was take us being some kids in our twenties that have varying levels of experience but aren't like formal educators or anything, and just kind of give our take and you don't need to be this special, awesome, super experienced kind of every letter after your name person in order to start making waves around you and start making waves in the community.
Speaker 1:And, like, looking we at the time of this episode, we have five others that are published right now and we've been listening to in three countries, four countries already, all over the United States. Like people are listening to us, which is insane to think about because, like we're not like this, I'm not the job names of, like flight bridge ad, we're not impact EMS, nothing like that. You know, we're just Carson, nicole and Jaden.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we are, uh, just three regular people just like doing this for fun. I mean, we've wanted to do this for a while and it's always been like, well, nobody's going to want to listen to me, so why am I going to do this? I'm just going to be talking to myself.
Speaker 1:But there's so much imposter syndrome with it too. We're at the point now where every now and then we get this comment or this DM, or one of our friends texts us like hey, it's actually like a cool product, like no, it's just us doing us. You know, that is the most imposter syndrome growing moment in the world and I don't think we're ever going to get over it. But just know that it doesn't go away even at this level.
Speaker 3:I think that it is super rewarding to get a text or a phone call or a picture or something People that I haven't talked to in a couple years or something and they're like, hey, listen to your podcast, it's freaking awesome, you're doing great, and they'll shoot some ideas or something out there. And my very first EMS boss he texted me yesterday and I'm like, oh my gosh, I reached you. Look at that, and I think, the world of him, because he kind of grew me into the provider that I am and went through a lot of crappy times with him and he got to see me as a baby medic. So that was probably really horrifying for him to see. But, um, it is like super rewarding to see like what we're doing and the outcome it has and the support is fantastic.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So, as we move towards wrapping this up, I wanted to ask you this question you now, in your current shoes, what would you tell baby EMT, student, or baby medic or whatever? It would be like baby Nicole.
Speaker 3:Like what's like the advice you would give her about this. I would tell myself to not give up and to not listen to others. You know, when I first got into this, women being in the fire service was like now it's way more supported. But even 10 years ago it was like, oh my gosh, what are you doing? You don't need to be doing this. So then there was a lot of pushback to get into this and it was like, well, you can't do this until you get this and this and this. And it just felt like it was never ending of the list of things that I had to do and I wanted to give up. I wanted to like switch to something else. I didn't want to do EMS anymore, and so I would tell myself to like keep pushing it. And you know it's going to work out, it's going to be awesome and it's going to be even better than what I expected, and I'm going to be living my dream as a flight medic way earlier than expected. So it's going to be great.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and it's. It'd be the kind of the same thing, really. Um, just stick with it and stay in the game. Um, I'm full disclosure. I've failed tests, I've retaken classes and you know all all those things. Um, if it wasn't for being persistent, I wouldn't be here and uh, with that, like, despite all these failures, that's what's turned into successes and learning moments. And then, despite all that stuff, I still became a flight nurse at the age of 26. You know what I mean? Like that's it's not a testament to me by any means. It's a testament to if you stay persistent, you'll get there so much faster than you probably think you will. And even if it's not on your timeline, it's fine.
Speaker 3:For sure. I mean just like staying in touch with yourself and you know, being humble and constantly training and never letting yourself get kind of lazy, and that is super important and staying persistent is key.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and so, as we go to close, I want to leave you all with one reminder, and that reminder is someone is always going to think you're not ready, but don't let that someone be you.
Speaker 3:Yeah, don't let someone be you.
Speaker 1:Well, that's all I got. Nicole, you got anything?
Speaker 3:before I hit the stop button no, just thank you guys for listening and stay safe out there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, y'all be safe.