Are You Blocking Your Own Mediumship Without Realising It? — With Lawrence Savill

What if the very thing you’re doing to develop your mediumship… is actually what’s blocking it?

In this workshop-style episode, I sit down with Lawrence Savill to explore one of the most overlooked aspects of mediumship development — getting out of your own way.

This conversation strips everything back.

No performance.
 No pressure to “get it right.”
 Just an honest look at what really helps mediumship unfold… and what quietly holds it back.

We talk about the tension between structure and surrender, why intention matters more than technique, and how overthinking can disconnect you from the very thing you’re trying to access.

If you’ve ever felt stuck, frustrated, or like you’re trying too hard… this episode will land.

What you’ll hear

•  Why mediumship may be something you remember, not learn
•  The hidden ways overthinking blocks your connection
•  Why your intention shapes your development more than any method 
•  The balance between structure vs surrender
•  How to stop forcing it… and start allowing it 
•  Choosing the right path: in-person vs online development
•  Why mediumship is as much inner work as it is spiritual work 

Who this episode is for

•  Anyone developing their mediumship (at any stage) 
•  Sensitives who feel blocked or unsure of themselves 
•  People who feel like they’re “trying too hard” spiritually 
•  Those curious about mediumship beyond the traditional approach 

Mentions & ideas

•  Trust vs control in mediumship 
•  Personal development through spiritual practice 
•  Letting go of rigid expectations 
•  Creating space for natural connection 

Gentle note

This episode explores spiritual development and personal reflection. Take what resonates, and trust your own pace and experience.

✨ Get in touch
If you have a story, experience, or idea you'd love to share on Soul Sync, I’d love to hear from you.
📩 Email: hello@jasonpaulmedium.com

🌐 Website: jasonpaulmedium.com

If you enjoy the podcast, please take a moment to leave a review — your feedback truly means the world to me and helps others discover the show. 💫

Transcript

Episode Intro

SPEAKER_02 0:01

Hello, it's also thinking, it's me, Jason Paul, and the sun is shining. It's out and I'm feeling good. Hottest day of the year in Britain so far, 25 degrees. Can you believe it? Mid April. Global warming, not good, but also uh beautiful at the same time. I've had a nice walk today, uh, ran a reservoir, a couple of laps, getting into the fitness, trying to lose those uh summer pounds. Uh I've put a bit away recently, and I'm trying to work it off. Now, I've managed to persuade the lovely, lovely Lawrence Savile, who's a medium, who's been on the podcast recently, and he is a knowledgeable chap. Let me tell you that. He runs a circle in Paul Spiritualist Church, and he has to start away. Firstly, he's been teaching forever his service to the spirit world and to the church that he served in Paul is nothing short of fantastic, let me tell you that. Now, he's been teaching for a long time, and Lawrence has a way of explaining things that uh makes a lot of sense really, and you can tell it's come from um, you know, a lot of experience and a path that's been well trodden, let me tell you that. That's from one person who's uh lived an interesting life to another. So Lawrence has come on to do a workshop episode today, but we're gonna delve deep. Now, the episode is titled Are You Blocking Your Mediumship Without Realising It? Now, it is a problem. We do block our own mediumship for a number of reasons. Um some of that is to do with the mind, it's to do with conditioning, it's to do with what we believe is possible, it's limiting beliefs because connecting to the spirit world is like tuning in to what's around you. You're not connecting up to it, it is around us all the time. It is like a frequency that we are dialing into. So I have a very deep dive on this conversation, and you're gonna find it interesting. There's so many poles of gold that I can't even get them all in in the length of the intro track. But trust me, there's lots in there, so you're gonna enjoy it. This is my workshop episode with the lovely Lawrence Davill. Oh Lawrence, I'm so excited to welcome you back so soon. It's lovely, it's beautiful. Welcome back to the Soul Sync. Thank you, Jesus, and big pleasure to be back with you all. It's lovely. Well, as I was saying before we hit the record button, I always love these kind of deeper dive workshop style episodes. And when you agreed to come on and do one, I was thrilled because you talked a fair bit on the previous episode about you know how you teach people, help them unfold their mediumship, and you've got a very beautiful way of explaining things. So it's a lovely opportunity to do a deeper dive. So welcome.

SPEAKER_00 2:45

All right, well, no pressure then. That's wonderful. Thank you.

Can Mediumship Really Be “Learned”?

SPEAKER_02 2:50

So the topic we're gonna talk today is about kind of learning mediumship, which even in itself, you know, saying learning it is an interesting way to even begin, isn't it? Because it's is it learned, is it remembered? You know, does it begin, you know, with ability or is it intention? You know, just pose many questions to you there.

SPEAKER_00 3:15

Which one first? No, you are quite right. There are many, many facets to it. I've looked at it from the lens of somebody starting their mediumship journey. And please, when I say mediumship, I don't just mean evidential. Uh it can be philosophical, it can be healing for your own development, for your own use. It doesn't matter. Mediumship is a generic term across the board. But I've just looked at it and asking a few questions. Often we don't ask, we don't stop to consider because we see the bright flashing lights. You know, does it work? Oh, we do both. Yeah, do this workshop and you'll be up on the platform tomorrow. Well, you know, there's an awful lot behind the scenes that we maybe want to consider. Hmm.

Why Do You Want to Develop Mediumship?

SPEAKER_02 4:09

There is indeed. When you go into I think it's, you know, a lot of people listen to this podcast because they're interested in mediumship, but I remember the first time I went and uh saw a medium, and it didn't, you know, it I sort of wanted to believe it, but I wasn't getting a message myself. But I've seen a lot of mediumship in my time, and I often question, you know, if I'd have got a message sooner, you know, because it took me sort of probably 10 years from the first time I went to a spiritualist church to start to even consider unfolding it. But there is a lot to it. So where do we even begin with that? Someone wants to develop it, what what do they even do?

SPEAKER_00 4:55

Well excuse me. I would I would always pose this question when I have people approaching me about learning to develop their mediumship, and I find this a very useful question is why do you want to pursue this? Now, that isn't a question that we stop and think about. What is it? And it's a multi-layered question because the more you learn, the more you develop, the more these questions start to take on the hidden depths. What is it about mediumship? We do have people coming in, you know, they see somebody on the platform and think, I can do that, and then they're all eager, and that's great. We love eagerness. But like all any work, any job, you know, you don't just walk into a brand new job without any of the underpinning knowledge of the job. So you go and work at Sainsbury's on the till. You've got to learn how the till works. You've got to learn disciplines of being there on time. You've got to learn different aspects of dealing with customers and the public. Maybe you learn a numerical quality of counting money and giving change. So just sat there on the till. That's what everybody sees. But where's that underpinning that allows you to sit there, actually allows you to do the job? Exactly the same with any form of mediumship. There's an awful lot of underpinning work that needs to be thought in, developed, and evolved. And I really emphasize that word evolve because we never stop learning.

Natural Ability vs. Desire to Learn

SPEAKER_02 6:49

I even think back to myself. What made me develop my mediumship? And it was for me, it was curiosity. It was the fact that I wanted proof of the spirit world. And every time I saw a medium do it, that for me still wasn't proof enough because I either wasn't getting the message myself or the message I was getting, I could take a lot of it, but not other bits. But then it was the more I learnt about it, it was made me even more curious because I thought, well, now you know I know about this. What where what do I do with this? And I thought, well, I need to know more. And it was actually pursuing my loved ones in the spirit world that probably kept bringing me back to it because it was only when I was developing my mediumship was the ever only time I would get a message. I'm not sure if my granddad and loved ones in spirit keep choosing that to be the way they communicate. No, we're not going to do it for we will only communicate to him when he's in a circle, when he's ready to unfold it himself. I I don't know if you will have of course they have that level of knowledge up there, but we all come to it for different reasons, don't we? And you know, if I I was probably in the club of wanting to run before I could walk, and then I realized that actually it doesn't work like that, does it, Lawrence?

SPEAKER_00 8:05

We all do these things. A lot of people when they get the first car, you know, strength behind the wheel, that's it. On the motorway, I'm gonna do 70, uh everything because it's that was me again.

SPEAKER_02 8:19

That was me again. You're just summarizing my personality. Not so much these days. I've learned to be more considered and slower.

SPEAKER_00 8:29

That's really interesting because that leads into the next part of this. We do, when we have something new, the enthusiasm is there, you know, and the excitement about it all. I remember when I was learning and developing, I used to have a partner and we would go out quite often and do clubbing. And halfway through the night, and certainly a little bit worse for wear, mediumistic faculties would open up. Now, I do not condone that pen waggling, sorry, my fiddler.

SPEAKER_02 9:04

Oh, you fiddle the pen if you like.

SPEAKER_00 9:06

I have nothing against what that but it was because of the new, because of the excitement, because I could do it, and it just came in, and I was so fortunate my partner at the time dragged me out by the straff of the neck and said, You are not do that with alcohol. And now I was yeah, you're right. You're right. I shouldn't have done that, that's fine. But when we're first there, it is exciting, it is it's wonderful. You're opening up the doorway to a whole new world and a whole new look at our existence.

SPEAKER_02 9:42

Well, it literally is a whole new world, isn't it? Exactly. It's and yeah.

Exploring Your Local Opportunities

SPEAKER_00 9:49

You know, we have this formula, you're born, you live, you die. And then suddenly you start to discover, yeah, you're born, you live, you change. And then you're born again, and then you live again, and then you change again. So you start to really challenge all our taught and indoctrinated ways of views of life. So that's where the excitement comes from. That's where the people, oh my gosh, this is great, this is wonderful. But don't forget, we have a lot of people who have the ability but who don't actually want it. When I've been called out on house clearances in my time, an awful lot of the time is it's the mediumistic faculties of the people involved. It's not, you know, because we've got a bit of a Hollywood version of spiritualism at times. Oh, they've come. Well, they don't come because they're here. They're here all the time. We just shift our vibration and move those dimensions and we are there with them. Where people have got latent mediumistic abilities, they don't want it. And I don't blame them because they've got no desire, they've got no involvement in spiritualism. Religion can be very, very strong with them, or just non-existence as well. But the actual thought of seeing dead people is really abhorrent to them, and they don't want it.

SPEAKER_02 11:27

I hadn't even considered that when people were getting, you know, sort of ghostly encounters, so to speak, or spirit encounters. I suppose a lot of the time it is, you know, their sensitivity opening up. And I can understand why that's scary, but I suppose it's, you know, what should they be doing in that moment? I suppose they don't want to go and sit in a circle and find out more about it, they want you to make it go away, they want you to do the opposite, they want you to close it down. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 11:58

My advice in that scenario is what I thought. This is something I teach, and it's cutting the link. So if, for example, a figure started building up here and I'm going, I don't like this, I don't like this, I would talk in my mind very plainly and very openly, no incantations or no magic spells, but just like, go away, you're freaking me out. And then take your attention away from it. And that's the important thing. Because if I say, Oh, go away, go away, and I sit here waiting, watching, have they gone yet? Are they that link is still there?

SPEAKER_02 12:38

Well, it is, yes, you're you're you're not breaking the link. I see what you mean. You're sort of sitting there on on edge, giving it your energy, aren't you? I suppose.

SPEAKER_00 12:46

Exactly, exactly. But as I say, that is in some cases, but in our cases of looking at progressing it, this eternal question of why, and this this is a really good question. If you're sat with a reputable medium mentor, is there a question, in my opinion, should be revisited once every six months? Because the initial answer will change the understanding and the acknowledgement of working with the divine. The understanding and the acknowledgement of what does eternal life actually mean? That's quite a big question. That is quite a big question.

SPEAKER_02 13:35

Well, it's a very big question, and it can lead you down eight billion and one rabbit holes, can't it?

In-Person vs. Online Learning

SPEAKER_00 13:42

That's the beauty of it, because each and everybody is individual in their experience. And although we can listen to other people, listen to their experiences, it's the tools, the nuts and bolts, to be able to ask those questions ourselves and come to the answer. You mentioned earlier about seeing mediums getting the evidence, or maybe not, or you know, not completely fulfilled. That is always going to be an eternal thing because we as mediums have the evidence or the presentation coming in from spirit, but then we as a logical mind want to make that into a story that we understand. Often, this is where the complications set in. I did a wonderful little uh trial test with my circle just recently, and I gave them three words. I said, This is your communication from spirit, and I just gave them three words. I said, now present that. And we had seven totally different presentations based on those three words. And I said, the whole the whole reason for that is to highlight how our mind, our perspective, our understanding formulates the evidence to present, but that's never going to be in the same way as the sitter will understand it, or even indeed the spirit will understand it.

SPEAKER_02 15:20

It's interesting, isn't it? Because even when you say that every single one of us is having our own experiences, there is no one, no one person in the world who will ever, you know, be entirely like you because we're all bought up in a totally unique kind of situation. And for that reason, you know, we can bog that ourselves down a lot in life of trying to find you know our people or whatever. What you know, no one's ever going to be exactly the same as you. You are unique, which you know makes total sense when it comes to mediumship. And the question of why is a question I ask myself a lot these days about many, many areas of my life. It's actually one of the biggest questions I teach my newbie people into sales. Why, why, why, why? Ask it of every client, customer. It's the best question in the dictionary. But yes, it's you know very powerful, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 16:19

It is, it is. So we you know, when we start to develop that desire to start to develop whatever latent mediumistic potentials that we have, that question should be in that mix. Why do I want to do this? You know, why do I want to come home from work on a Monday night at six o'clock after having, you know, the Monday from hell and rush dinner and then jump in the car and go and sit somewhere at seven o'clock? Because it is very demanding in its rigour. Often I used to work nights and I was in a circle that was two o'clock in the afternoon. And I used to, every time, if I was on a night Well, that's a right old bugger of a time, 2 p.m.

SPEAKER_02 17:07

when you do nights. That's commitment that. I know that because I did nights.

SPEAKER_00 17:12

Well, I'll get in at six in the morning, go there. No, and I'm not going to circle today. Well, at 2 pm, guess for a B. Fast asleep in circle. No, not fast asleep. In between worlds. Yes, yes. So that initial question, why? Why do we want to do this? And keep revisiting that question as well. Because as your development grows, your understanding grows, you'll find different depths, you'll find different meanings, different understandings of that question. I've had people say, Oh, yeah, I wouldn't be a medium. Why is that? Because I want, you know, want all the money. And I'm like, well, good luck with that, mate.

Planning Your Development Path

SPEAKER_02 17:56

Uh I'm honestly, do you know what? In terms of my mediumship, I must be, if it was a business and I had a PL sheet, I dread to even think how much in the red I would be by this point that I've spent on it. Not that I look at it like that, but yeah, this and and I've I do you know what? I have a massive problem um sometimes even bloody charging for readings because I just end up doing them because I I don't look at mediumship as my work, I sort of look at it as a passion, but you know, there's there's you do end up spending a lot on it. So when people come to you then, what sort of camps do you think they fit in? And this question of why, how have you seen people's why evolve?

SPEAKER_00 18:37

It's very interesting. We keep going through different phases in spiritualism. It's been much more pronounced, in my opinion, of late. We just seem to be coming out now of the trance vaccination. For quite some time, trance was it, everybody. Oh, yes, trance, trance mediumship, trance, trance, I've got to do trance. I'm of the generation, trance has a totally different meaning, and it was fabulous. But it was based upon the really the lack of knowledge of people that had this envisionment of trance, a spirit stepping in, a bit like in ghosts. Do you remember that scene in ghosts where she sat there and they're all jumping in and jumping out? That actually was a lot of people's idea, but again, we tend not to think too hard about these things. We just take it for granted, it's this, and trance mediumship is beautiful, but the mind of the medium is always going to be active. It cannot not be active within that, and it's a very deep and purposeful cooperation. It is not spirit gonna step in, you go out, and then come back ten minutes later and go, Oh, what do they say? It was interesting, you know. So the trance fascination does seem to be waning, but the new fascination, which is wonderful, is the healing side of mediumship, and that is a continual pull. And even people who have come to here in Paul have sat to develop evidential mediumship. In the courses for evidential, I always do one evening of healing mediumship, and the number of people at the end of the course drove, you know what? I really love the healing. Yeah, and and again, you can ask that question why mediumship isn't a mask. I know I say this quite a lot, but people do tend to either consciously or most likely unconsciously. Oh, if I'm a medium still up there, it means yeah, I'm a good person. Well, you can be a good person without standing out there. If I'm a healer, I'm bringing relief to everybody.

SPEAKER_02 21:04

So when he's probably much easier ways to be a good person, to be a kind person than to stand on the platform is a hard way to do it.

SPEAKER_00 21:11

I know, I know, but then we start dealing in the ids and the egos, and that's where it gets a bit messy. But like with the healing medium and shit, you know, everybody wants to make everybody else feel better. And I've heard I've heard a medium said this to me once, and I was baffled. And I said, I'm only ever happy when I'm stood on a platform giving messages and I'm going, wow, there's a lot there you need to unpack. Seriously. Seriously, seriously. So with this, why do you want to pursue this? It's finding where your heart goes, it's finding where your soul resides. You know, it's it's all right chasing something, but if your heart and your passion isn't there, do you not think you may want to listen to? Your soul? Do you not think you may want to listen to your own guidance from your higher self and go, Yeah, it's a nice idea to be up there. And again, people don't understand, you know, giving up 40 out of 52 Sundays of the year. That's not very appealing, is it? No, it's not.

SPEAKER_02 22:21

The day of rest for most.

SPEAKER_00 22:23

Exactly. If you work Monday to Friday, Saturdays and Sundays are very valuable. But it's it's finding it's finding that flow with your soul, with your own magic, with your own understanding. And you will know, you will know that's where we want to go.

The Biggest Blocks in Mediumship

SPEAKER_02 22:45

It's like a pull, it you know, it very much pulled me back every time. And even this, you know, coming year, I think to myself, oh, I'm gonna scale back some of the mediumship time I've allocated. And I just can't because I get pulled back to it, and it is kind of like a like a pull of the soul, you know, and I think, you know, like like we said, so many people come into it for different reasons, and it's a very interesting topic of discussion, even the fact of how do you go about unfolding it because we're in the world now of more information than ever before, you know, and I guess even your journey, you know, you've probably seen it firsthand from your time of when you developed to where we are now is just crazy. And the how the expectations of people, I imagine, have changed in line with fit information at the fingertips, one might say, Lawrence.

SPEAKER_00 23:42

Yeah, very true. Uh, the information overload. I've seen people chase after everything. Uh, I've seen people one week they're a psychic artist, next week they're a trance medium, the next week that they do tassiography, and I'm just like, well, when when are you gonna make your mind up? Where do you when are you gonna go? I can be quite reactionary at times, and I did find navigate my own path through where people are coming in with their own different thoughts and philosophies. Initially, I I could have been a bit dismissive, I own up to that. That is in my nature, but now it's like, well, if that floats about, that's absolutely wonderful. But for me, here, now, and this is me, my path is spiritualism, and I will be sticking to that. So you may have these thoughts about whatever philosophy, whatever gamut of different sources of information for you. That's great. But just understand it's not for me. Because I want to go in depth, I want to really absorb and really understand and explore what I am doing in spiritualism, and I don't want to start watering that down by being pulled in all these different directions because a lot of these new philosophies coming in are actually just rehashes of different things we've seen over many years. Yes, I do agree with that. So, yeah, it's absolutely fine. You know, if you find peace in that, if you find joy in that, that's great. But please, I'm on this path. I'm not being rude to your path, I'm just on this path. And this is where I'm going with it. So, yeah, the information side can be counter-productive.

SPEAKER_02 25:46

I can a hundred percent relate to that, and you you it made me sort of smile when you're talking saying that, because again, that's another one of my rabbit holes that I've gone down is thinking knowing more is in some way advantageous. It's not because I spent you know a lot of time getting confused. And you're right, uh, even now, uh, so much of modern day kind of literature on mediumship is a rehash of something else that's older. And I've even found myself now going back to all the books of the mediums of from you know the early 1900s and late 1800s, because you know, I used to be a little bit put off by those books by the word, but the sort of um language they would use. But actually, to be honest with you, they're smaller, those books as well, they tend to be much thinner. So I yeah, I actually stand a chance of finishing one, which you know is a whole nother conversation, but you know, so there's a lot of places that you can go, but I think you are right there, and I do think starting, you know, with just a circle, you know, is is a good place to start, isn't it? Not everyone's fortunate enough to have one, but if you're not, then perhaps you could start one.

SPEAKER_00 27:03

Yeah, very true. I mean, we are now in the virtual world as well. We are, and there are some very good works being carried out in the virtual arena. Similarly, there are also some paths there that you need to be very wary of. You know, if it doesn't sit with you, if the person, the tutor, the mentor, whoever's running these courses, if they don't sit with you, and I don't mean as in, oh, they they're just gonna be wonderful, I say to my circles, if you're looking for a circle where I'm gonna pat you on the head and tell you how wonderful you are, you may as well leave now because that's not gonna happen. I will be honest, open, direct, but I'm coming from a place of learning. I I don't bring personality into it, I don't bring mutual dislike or anything into these things. And it should be the same with any mentor, they should be there because we asked that question ourselves why do we want to pursue that? Similarly, you can turn that around and say to a prospective mentor, circle leader, whatever, and say, Why do you want to teach us? That's an interesting question, isn't it? Yeah, anyone anybody worth their salt will take that on the nose and go, because XYZ.

SPEAKER_02 28:32

And if they're not willing to answer that question, straight away there's a red flag there.

How to Build Trust with Spirit

SPEAKER_00 28:37

Yeah, yeah, because not answering that question can be arrogance. It can be actually they haven't got any idea themselves, and sadly I am seeing some issues with that background. They don't want to say because it's gonna be six hundred dollars a month in my pocket from you, thank you very much. So, yeah, it is, you know, and it's all about mutual respect and understanding, as I say. It's never happened. But if anybody were to ask me why do you want to teach me this, I I would like that question. I would welcome that question.

SPEAKER_02 29:15

Isn't it interesting that you've never even been asked the question?

SPEAKER_00 29:19

I think because I'm a bit of an open book, people just see the passion. Oh, okay. And I I I always say, you know, you have the passion, whatever you do, find that passion. Once you start in that passion energy, it's evident to everybody. It's just there. I love it. And yeah, teaching people brings about its own challenges with some people, that's fine. That's why the world's different, that's why we're all different. If you like it, great. If you don't like it, well, great.

SPEAKER_02 29:56

I agree, I agree, and I think it's when you have passion in something, that's that's the energy of manifestation, isn't it? If you're doing things where you sort of drag in your heels because you feel you have to, and I look back actually at my own development, and I used to sort of say to myself, okay, if I'm going to develop my mediumship, I need to sit every day for spirit. And then it was when I was speaking to a friend of mine a few weeks later and he he sort of almost shot a mirror in my face at what I was doing. And I used to sort of go, Oh, it's the time now, you know, sort of dragging my heels up the stairs. And then he says, Well, it's hardly surprising why you're not feeling the energy of the spirit, is it? Because you're not, you know, you're going in there already, like I have to do this, you know, it should be I want to do this. So if you're trying to do, I'm bad at setting unrealistic expectations from the start, you know. I'm the sort of person who'll go from saying, Okay, I'm not going to the gym to my okay, my goal is five times a week from January the first, you know, totally unrealistic from the start.

SPEAKER_00 30:58

Yeah. And we do do that. We do set unrealistic and this mirrors right the way through if you just wonderfully put about the gym, and I can totally relate to that. I think I've managed it five times this year, but never mind, moving on. We do, and we all through the development of mediumship, I always say to people, you never fail when you're practicing your mediumship. Your sense of failure comes from you haven't exceeded the expectations you had of yourself.

SPEAKER_02 31:39

That's an interesting one, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 31:42

Every time we work with failure. You see, because there is another very valuable lesson about failure. There is no failure. It may come about that we don't get what we want, what we expected, what we desired. And the other thing linking in very strongly with that is about lessons. You know, I always say not every lesson comes wrapped in bows and with puppies. Some lessons come at you screaming, shouting, and raging. It's still a lesson, it's how we respond.

SPEAKER_02 32:16

Yes, especially the hardest lessons. Some of those are definitely not with bows, puppies, and all things sweet and nice, are they?

SPEAKER_00 32:25

Sadly not.

SPEAKER_02 32:27

No, I and I'm I'm one for sometimes having to learn the hard way, I will say that. But you know, expectations that we put on ourselves is a massive one. I'm terrible for, you know, at times giving myself a very hard time, and I think a lot of us are. And but you know, I even look back at some of how I've grown my business over the years, and you know, it wasn't from a place of self-encouragement at times, it was from self, you know, almost like being an army officer to myself. No, you will do more, you're not good enough, you must do more of this. And you think about that internal narrative that you've got going on, you know, that so many of us have. And even with mediumship, you know, the amount of times you see people developing where they say, Oh, I'm not good enough, you know, it's not something that I can do or whatever. And you know, that's why it takes so much self-work, doesn't it? It's not necessarily just as you say, standing on the platform giving a message from spirit, it's all that self-work that has to go into, you know, the the amount of self-limiting beliefs we have in life is just crazy, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 33:27

It is, you know, we should always think that energy follows thought. Yes. So if you sit there saying I'm not good enough, guess what? People in my circles know when they say I can't, my response is it's like a parrot. No, you can't now because you just said that. So take a pause, take a breath, rework the energy and try again later. If you keep saying I can't do this, I can't do that. I'm not saying that we're gonna become Superman or Suoman, but we can start to learn areas that we're not gonna make those promises to ourselves because we realise for whatever reason they are beyond our capabilities, you know, something like we've got a 5k charity run on this Saturday. Well, me entering a 5k charity run is not gonna be pretty. There'll be a 1k charity crawl and uh a ride to pool hospital in an ambulance.

SPEAKER_02 34:32

I I think you're under selling yourself. I imagine you could do a 5k.

What Actually Makes a Good Medium?

SPEAKER_00 34:37

Yeah, I could do it in a car, but but it again, it's it's what the goals are we set ourselves, and this is where we consistently set ourselves up to fail. And that's quite a big thing. We s we do it, we self-sabotage.

SPEAKER_02 35:01

We do, and I think even when I look at my own life in just so many ways, I can just with the benefit of age now. I look back and I think it's hardly surprising why this series of events happened. And it's because you know, I would switch for for instance energetically. When I was in manifesting mode in my life, for instance, when I'm I was growing my business, I was very much, you know, positive vibes, really thinking about where it was I was going. And then when the wheels fell off, it's when I replaced that for worry. And so much of you know what you attract in your life is is literally just the thought and the energy you put out. And like you say, it's the same in mediumship. If you are going to, you know, go in with you know a lot of self-criticism, then you know, you really need to look at the way that you speak to yourself and your thoughts. And I always remember the exercise that Eileen Davis, the medium, got me to do recently, which was about having a band on one wrist, and every time you noticed yourself or catch yourself having a fear-based thought, move the band onto the other wrist. And that was bloody eye-opening, I tell you. That was eye-opening.

SPEAKER_00 36:13

That was actually based on a therapy where you oh, it was, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 36:18

She would snap hers, but I wouldn't do it because I'd it would hurt, it would catch the hairs of my heart every time. Uh yeah, but I'll tell you what, it certainly reminds you, and it got me really thinking in a better place. So people are going along then in their journey of you know trying to unfold their mediumship. What would you say are some of the pitfalls you know you see people you know make? And it'd be interesting. Let's see how many of them I've fallen down.

SPEAKER_00 36:51

I'm just gonna I'm gonna get a bit pedantic here. Yes, and just correct that when you say about trying to unfold a mediumship, they're looking to explore.

SPEAKER_02 37:00

Yes, I must stop using that word trying. Yeah, learning to unfold one's mediumship. The word try implies failure.

SPEAKER_00 37:09

Yeah, it does. It does. You know, I'm gonna try that, but it probably won't work. I'm gonna try that, but yeah, I don't feel confident. Try implies failure. So again, it's just a little twist of a word. It's moving the elastic band to the other wrist. But some of the pitfalls, not getting what you expected straight away can be a very big pitfall. And again, that's based on self and expectations. The other pitfalls can be not finding either a healthy group or mistrust from your mentor or coach or whatever. That can be incredibly harmful. Because if you put your faith and trust in somebody, and whatever reason that is misplaced, that can really have a significant impact on us. And accepting defeat readily. That's that to me is a very big pitfall. You know, if I try something and it doesn't work, I go, okay, why didn't it work? I want to go back through this. I want to try and track where it stopped working, I want to understand why that didn't work. And invariably comes back to self, expectations, management, abilities, whatever. But at least you understand it and then you can progress on. But in the beginning, in that very early stage of any form of development, any form of knockback can have a disastrous effect on us. Both physically, mentally, and emotionally. Often it will be displaced by us because that person was horrible to me. And when you start to say, Well, how were they horrible? Well, they kept telling me I was doing it wrong. Well, what were you trying to do? I was trying to do this, but I thought I'd go down that route and I go, ah, hang on, right, we're we're changing the narrative here. Initially, that person was horrible, but now we're getting to the stage of I wasn't doing what I was asked to do. Slight difference there. You know, we can resolve so many of our conflicts, our perceived failures through really digging back through what's been done, what's been said, what's been missed. This is one reason I never entertain discourse. If somebody comes in to tell me about what somebody else has done, I just say, unless they're both here, I don't want to hear. Because you will only ever hear your say, oh, they were terrible. Oh, he shouted at me. Why? No, he's just a horrible person. Why? Well, no, I I was talking during when he was trying to tell us to do an exercise. Oh, right, okay, now we're getting interesting. Now the mist is clearing. So we can do this as an exercise with all facets of our life, be it in our spiritual development, in our careers, in our families, in our love lives. Whatever we can look, and if we aren't really honest and really methodical, often we will get down to the reason where it started to go wrong can be totally unrelated to what the perceived issue is I'm doing up here. Actually stems from an issue down there, and a lot of the time from childhood or development years. I remember this is a personal experience of mine, so I don't mind sharing this. Somebody really pushed me on the questioning about something that had gone astray. And they kept saying, Why? Why, why, why? And I suddenly blurted out and said, Because I don't deserve it. Oh my god, there was this thunderous silence rolled in because that was the first time I had said that to myself about myself, and it really was one of those. Oh my god, I need to deal with this, don't I? I really need to heal this because this is causing issues. It's a fascinating journey. So the pitfalls they are there, they are many. The regular attendant, you will get times you'll come in from work and go, No, not getting out, especially in the winter months. You know, when it's dark at four o'clock, you get home in the dark, it's raining, and you think, Am I going to circle or am I not? Well, you know, you should make a commitment.

SPEAKER_02 42:16

That's it. Sorry, James. It's a bit, it's that's uh a big one. I think you made many good points. I think that first of all, in life, you know, don't be afraid to have a go, throw your hat in the ring, experiment. You know, that's how you learn at the end of the day. And if anything, I think throughout my life, I've probably taken too many rolls of the dice and throw my hat in the ring. But that's you know, why I've developed a lot of different things. But you know, I think that's interesting, and I think that don't fear that fear knows, you know, all these things that happen, you know, look at them and and learn from them. So I just thought that was very interesting there when you look back at that. It's the knockbacks that make you grow, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 42:59

It is indeed. It is indeed. A no is a great thing from a congregation. Uh it teach you. We say you've got to be out of your thinking, but there has to be a certain amount of critical thinking available to you. I often say with my students, if you get a no, go back and repackage it. Now I don't mean change it. So you know, I'm showing you a pen. Oh, okay. No, actually, it's a mouse. I don't that's a no-no. Like if I say I'm showing you a pen, they're going no, and I said, would you understand then like a pencil? No. All right, where are we going? Where are we going? This is writing, this is chalk writing on a blackboard or a teacher. Yes. Wonderful. You know, you've you've got through that no, you've explored and worked the evidence and not just dropped it, because we see a lot of people do that. Oh, well, I'll leave that with. You, you know, you end up sending people out with bagging bags of stuff that they don't understand.

SPEAKER_02 44:06

They leave with more than they came in.

SPEAKER_00 44:08

I know. Come in with baggage and they go out with tens of more. But again, it's the it's just the learning that you know we're not gonna hit everything right on the head. I love working with engineers because I was in engineering. And when I get an engineering, I go, Oh, this is gonna be fun. I like this. This is this is great, because I understand very much a way of thinking. Engineers are terrible, terrible people.

SPEAKER_02 44:38

I imagine lots of you know, very analytical and I imagine very detailed in their readings.

SPEAKER_00 44:45

They are, and they're never wrong. An engineer is never wrong, it's always somebody else. That's something I learned in my many years working with them. But I love working with the engineers because I've got there's that commonality there, the understanding. And we we get 101 different types of contract contacts through, and it's just learning, you know, if nice little exercise in circle, just pick this is early days circle, pick two people. What do you do for a job? I think one was a nurse. The other chat, what do you do for a job? I'm a plumber. Okay, to the nurse, describe the plumber's job, and to the plumber, describe the nurse's job. And it's it's a really nice exercise because you can hear, see, and feel the difficulty in explaining what your perception is of that job. And again, it's a to me, it's a very valuable learning curve of when you're working evidentially, is just whatever you get, work with that one part and work to unfold it to its best. Don't be afraid of the no.

SPEAKER_02 46:05

I like it when you tell me about your little experiments, by the way, they're always very interesting.

SPEAKER_00 46:10

We should be doing this, we should be doing it no matter what level we're at. Experimenting with the spirit world was what got spiritualism noticed. And it seems sort of eye to death. But we should be, even with the most advanced circles, things like memory card out of a phone, ensuring it is blank, and putting that into the circle and asking for an image to be put on there, and I have seen that be successful. And what happened there? How does that work? There wasn't there used to be a practice where the medium would sit with a camera. So before we had mobile phones, electronic devices, and they would sit with a camera, and pictures would come out on the film when it was developed. Going back in the further part, the Bang Sisters, very well-known spirit artists of the time, and they did what was called precipitous art. So they would present a painting, but over time different elements would start to appear in this painting. Colours would start to come in. You know, the only thing that limits the spirit world is that.

SPEAKER_02 47:33

It's interesting as well, because that's the beauty of your circle, is the fact there's so much variety. But you're right, that is what got spiritualism noticed, and it's what we need to be doing more because that's it really brings out because I think mediumship is you know truly a creative process when you blend with the spirit world. And I think by us having these particular conscripts and ways on which you know, I even think to myself, I've seen a lot of circle, different circles over time, and a lot of them is you know, it's kind of the same thing, or not really, you know, allowing the mediums to sort of develop in a way that's kind of working on all facets of their mediumship because it's very two-dimensional. But even the beauty of that experiment with the uh the nurse and the engineer, I can imagine that's you know, that that that is just such a fascinating thing to do because it's it's true to develop your mediumship if you're engineer-minded and you're only bringing through you know, you you're not practicing that. Well, how are you going to communicate uh you know a different spirit through you that's of a different profession? That's why you need to get as much, you know, experience of every sense or facet or whatever it might be.

SPEAKER_00 48:47

Very much so. I mean, the medium's best item that they can develop is what we call the toolbox. And the toolbox, you take it, spirit work with us psychically to a degree. It's what's in our mind is utilized. I always say if I had a mathematician come through and give me the mathematical formula to turn lead into gold, I wouldn't understand it because my mind definitely isn't programmed that way. But whereas somebody else may well be, oh, yeah, that's so and so and so and so. That's easy. So it's what's in the mind, what's in the energy of the medium. And we can keep working at developing our toolbox, very simple little techniques. If you're sat somewhere having coffee or you sat on a bus or whatever, really look at people and make that conscious because we see so many things that just pass through our unconsciousness. But for instance, I'm looking across the road now and there's a beautiful hedge. Can't quite remember the name of it, but I know it's just starting to come into flower these white flowers, and although they are beautiful, it's a rich honey scent, it can be really catching when they are in full bloom and it's hot and still. See, I'm consciously taking in the image that I'm seeing. Same with people, you can look at somebody and go, have they got a round face, an oval face, a long face? Is it proportionate? Is there anything that sticks out particularly? Obviously, you've got to be very careful how you do that. You don't sit there in the cafe like that looking at her.

SPEAKER_02 50:34

Yeah, I can imagine. Lawrence, you're staring again. You're staring. Oh, I just developing my Claire, one of my Claire's today.

SPEAKER_00 50:42

All right, yeah, actually, that's a good example. My user when I'm called. But there are so many things we can do. One thing I've I've well, two things I've really enjoyed working with. When I tell you, you might think it was a bit weird. For me, this the word cancer wasn't enough. Because we would say, oh, cancer condition, cancer condition. As a cancer sufferer myself, I know that there are different types. So I just sat there and Googled types of cancer and really sort of took in these different types of cancer. Lo and behold, Deming and said, This is a carcinoma cancer they had. And they went, Yeah, and I went, That's great, because I've made that effort. Similarly with the way we're working now more and more with the European friends, trying to take in little facets of different languages, even just the greetings. How do you say hello in Swiss, Dutch, Danish, Portuguese? Just try and remember those because it opens up this whole new realm of communication possibilities.

SPEAKER_02 52:01

It's interesting, isn't it? The journey you go on when you develop your mediumship is a yeah, and it's a lifelong journey, and it's that's why you know it's something when you pick it, it you know, you it needs to be unfolded for the right reasons because it it but that's why I can't stop going back to it myself, because you know it helps my life in you know many different areas. It is a cross-pollinator, we could say.

SPEAKER_00 52:28

Yes, very much so. Very much so. I mean, we we may have that focus on developing our evidential mediumship, or we may have that focus on developing our healing mediumship or our philosophical mediumship. At the end of the day, we are developing that link with spirit. We will have moments of inspiration, we will have moments of I don't want to get involved in this. Something's not right. I've been having people coming in doing quotes for a new roof, and honestly, some of them just gave themselves away. There I had one person, he was totally fascinated by squirrels. He gets have you got squirrels? No, what? But other people were turning up and I'm going, no, no. Other people turned up and I went, Yeah, I really like you. And the ones he went, Oh, yeah, do you know what? You I like you, you're good. They are the ones whose quotes have been really well produced. I can't say affordable, nothing's affordable these days, but that's neither here nor there. But you you just develop this sort of knowing, you develop you're working on enhancing all your senses. So your own spirit will go, are you sure you want to go there? Are you sure about this person? Or oh, well, you know, look at that, look at that, look at that.

SPEAKER_02 54:14

Do you know? It's it it's I'm just just thinking, if if there's ever a church that needs to have its roof strapped on, it's yours, based in Paul. But it's it's true. I use my I I use my sensitivities in every area of my life. When I make a hiring decision now in my own company, I will really sit with it and and feel it. And you know, uh, and you can get so much from that if you you know give yourself a moment. He says, having made two wrong hires recently, but you don't always get it right, you know.

SPEAKER_00 54:52

You can hire because you see the potential, yeah, but it's also a two-way street because they have then got to see the potential in remaining where they are. And again, like our mediumship, the first six months that's the time people will be quick to dismiss because there's no real investment of time or of energy. There's still a newness there, and it can be dropped just as easily. After about six months, you start to feel do you know what? I'm getting on now. All right, I do find trouble with some bits, but other bits I quite like, and we start to develop that routine and then relationship. And that is exactly the same within our working life, with our social life, with our development life. Getting over those initial few months of starting to bed in and start to feel it, and then things will grow.

SPEAKER_02 55:52

It's Mother's Day today when we record this. Are you just about to go straight into service then?

SPEAKER_00 55:57

No, we had ours this morning. Oh, you've done a morning service. Oh. Which is wonderful. It used to be three o'clock in the afternoon, and without being rude, it was a real pain in the derriere because you spent all morning getting ready to go to church, and then in the evening afterwards, only in the height of summer when it was daylight till ten o'clock, could you actually get out and do other things? Otherwise, the whole day just revolved around the service.

SPEAKER_02 56:28

I always think that room you sit in has such a good energy about it, it's just got such a radiance. I love it.

SPEAKER_00 56:35

It has, and I work very hard with the energy of the church. I feel it. I will actively deal with any discourse. Because we see there's quite a lot in churches and centres, you know, you've got one party, you don't like the other party. We work with energy, you know. How how dare you think that you can sit here? I can't do it. You can sit here and give the evils out to somebody sat there without an effect.

SPEAKER_02 57:13

Yes, exactly. Especially, especially in a place as sacred as that. Yeah. It's been a delight to have you on. Would you like to close your workshop episode today with a final thought? It's beautiful. I can't believe every time I talk to you, it flies out.

SPEAKER_00 57:29

I'm thinking about it again. With a final thought. Don't limit your mediumship to what you want. Explore your mediumship as a form of connection to see where it goes. As I said, I've got two beautiful people from the evidential development group who are now working as healers in the church, and they're a great asset, they love it, we love them. The people coming into healing love them because they had that openness. They tried the evidential, and it was like, eh, I'm not sure. Don't feel it. Oh healing. Oh, I like this. So don't limit yourself, don't put that cap on it and go, I'm gonna be a platform medium. Rather approach it and say, I'm gonna explore connection. Just nice, simple introduction. I'm gonna explore connection. Where do I go from there?

SPEAKER_02 58:37

But that's beautiful, and what was ringing through my mind there as you were saying that is you know, we all have this preconceived idea on where we should be or where you should go, but all you're doing is limit limiting yourself. You don't know what the universe might have in store for you. So keep an open mind. Definitely. Lawrence Savile, it's been an absolute delight. Thank you so much for coming onto the Salting Podcast.

SPEAKER_00 59:02

Pleasure. Thank you very much, me, James, and I've thoroughly enjoyed it.

SPEAKER_02 59:06

Keep an open mind indeed. Don't limit yourself by thinking small. Don't be sitting for the spirit welfare with a set criteria of what you think should happen. Lawrence is right, just sit there and be. Just quiet the mind. Because so often, when I even used to sit at the very beginning, I used to sit saying, oh, this is what I want today. This is what Jason wants. Um, you know, and I'm limiting myself. It means I'm not open to what the spirit world, the intelligence of the spirit world, might have for us. That was a fascinating conversation. I absolutely love Lawrence. I could talk to him for quite some time, let me tell you that. And um, I think we talked about so many interesting topics, and it really made me think a lot about my own mediumship. But until next time, goodbye.