Small Business Big World
New episodes every Tuesday discussing the challenges, adventures and fun of being a small business owner. Each week we'll delve into various small business topics, from real-world DEI considerations to selling your business, using video to market your business, unique benefit offerings for your employees and so much more. Curated by the crew at Paper Trails.
Small Business Big World
I've Retired, Now What?
As you prepare for the next chapter of life, what hurdles await you? Join us and special guest Josh Chase from BGA Financial as we unravel the often-overlooked transition into retirement, a significant shift especially challenging for small business owners whose identities are tightly interwoven with their careers. Josh shares his insights into balancing financial plans with emotional readiness. We explore personal stories like that of a newspaper editor grappling with his sense of self-worth after retiring and a receptionist's unexpected approach to her final workday.
This episode promises a holistic approach to retirement planning, blending financial readiness with emotional well-being. We emphasize the power of conversations with loved ones and advisors to navigate the fear and uncertainty of retiring. Whether you're considering retiring soon or planning for the distant future, this discussion offers insights to prepare for a satisfying and meaningful life beyond the workforce.
This is Small Business Big World, our weekly podcast prepared by the team at Paper Trails. Owning and running a small business is hard. Each week, we'll dive into the challenges, headaches, trends, fun and excitement of running a small business. After all, small businesses are the heartbeat of America and our team is here to keep them beating.
Speaker 2:The following is not considered legal advice or counsel. Please seek legal advice prior to making any decisions. Securities and investment advisory services offered through Osaic Wealth Inc. Member FINRA, sipc. Osaic Wealth is separately owned and other entities and or marketing names, products or services referenced here are independent of Osaic Wealth Insurance offered through BGA Retirement Advisors.
Speaker 1:Welcome to Small Business Big World, our weekly podcast where we talk about all things small business. So today my guest is Josh Chase from BGA Financial. Welcome, thank you.
Speaker 3:Good morning Chris.
Speaker 1:How are you so? You know we talk a lot about getting ready for retirement, but today we're going to talk about the emotional side of getting ready for retirement. Right, that's a big piece.
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely. I think the financial piece of retirement is covered by a lot of people and people know how important it is to make sure you have enough money for retirement. But I think that emotional side of retirement is not talked about enough.
Speaker 1:Right. So that's what we're going to talk about today. But before we get into that, don't forget like, follow, share, rate, review, subscribe. We are everywhere you get your podcast. We certainly appreciate any ratings you can give us. That helps us grow as well. If you ever have a question for us or any of our guests, you can email us at podcast, at paper trailscom. So let's talk. Let's start from the beginning. The financial piece of that, right we all you know since we first got our jobs. You know, even sometimes before that we're taught, you know, start saving early for retirement. Right, you know what is what you're a financial advisor. What are you working with clients on? That financial piece in that realm?
Speaker 3:Yeah. So you're right. People you know, people talk about saving money from the first nickel you earn. When you're, however old you are, people are regularly talking to you about the importance of saving money saving money for the future. And people when they're closer to retirement. It's easy to think about retirement because you can almost see it there. It's difficult to talk to someone in their teens, 20s, 30s, even 40s about retirement, but it's important and saving for retirement is important and that's something I regularly do with folks help them understand the importance of saving for that point of retirement.
Speaker 3:And it's funny I often get questions from people. They say hey, josh, when can I retire? And I always say, half kidding but half serious, I'm like you can retire anytime you want. I mean you literally can walk out the door right now and tell the boss you're not coming back. Anybody can do that at any time, at any age. The real question is where's the money going to come from for you to do the things that you need to do and want to do? So that's sort of the financial side of it. But the things you know. Obviously you need money to do those things that you need to do. You got to pay your bills, put food on the table. But what about the things you want to do? You know that's obviously sometimes money's important for that, but that's when you start talking into the emotional side of things. What is it that you do want to do in retirement Right?
Speaker 1:You know we work with a lot of small businesses, as you do, and you know one of our clients last year came to us, you know, approaching the retirement age, you know blue collar. He's, you know auto mechanic runs great business and he's like gosh, I really didn't start thinking about you know, I just thought I was going to work forever right in my late 50s. And you know, now I need some help, I need to talk to somebody about, you know, the financial piece of it, because you know a lot of small business owners also think, gosh, my business is my retirement.
Speaker 1:In one way, whether I'm going to work forever, or you know I'm going to sell it, or whatever. You know, do you see a lot of clients like that too, that are behind the eight ball, or you know, getting ready for it, or don't think about it until it's too late, right?
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely. And you hit the nail on the head with small businesses and any small business owner knows this they often put their life into that small business and sometimes, either appropriately or inappropriately, they might think this is my retirement, you know, I'm going to cash out or cash in, however you want to say it someday and that's going to be what it is, how I'm going to fund my retirement, or I'm going to do this forever. Right, that's often what people think. But I think those and also when you talk about, like the identity what's somebody's identity? I see a lot of people struggle when they retire, when they stop working. They're trying to find what it is that their purpose is, moving forward, and a lot of people have work or their careers as their identity. That's who you are. I mean, think about any time you go to, like a cocktail party or a networking event. What's the first thing you ask someone, what do you do? It's not who are you, it's what do you do. It's like, oh, I'm an engineer I'm an architect, I'm a doctor.
Speaker 1:It'd be great if you had something exciting other than you know. Hey, I do payroll right. Right, finding that purpose. Yeah, that's the whole idea yeah, but but so.
Speaker 3:So you know, right or wrong, that's often people's identity and small business owners who probably I don't want to say necessarily more than others, but that's really you know that's been a passion for them for their entire lives. So to be able to just sort of walk away from that, I think is really difficult emotionally for folks. You know what I mean.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, and you know we talked earlier just kind of about the different stages of life and that's really interesting to me because I never thought about it that way. But what are you seeing as you're working with clients and through their stages of the emotional point of life, right, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:So you know, if you think about life in different phases, most of it's scripted. You know, when somebody's born, up until I don't know age 18, 20, it's a very scripted life, it's okay. And up until I don't know age 18, 20. It's a very scripted life, it's okay. You're a child. You learn how to walk and talk and eat. You go to school because you're supposed to. When you go to high school and maybe prepare for college, it's pretty scripted.
Speaker 3:Everybody knows sort of intuitively what it is that you're supposed to do. People sort of know how to raise kids. And then, when you get in your 20s and 30s, it's like, okay, now I'm learning how to be an adult. Maybe you go to college, maybe you buy a house, get your first job it's okay, now I know what I'm supposed to do. And then it's very scripted. And then maybe you get married and you have kids and you build your career and it's okay, that's very scripted. But the final phase, whatever you want to call it, however you want to look at it which is sort of post-career, post-kids, empty nester, Now it's like, okay, what do I do? I'm retired. There's no handbook on how to live during your retirement years, what it is you're supposed to do, what it is that your purpose is, what brings you joy, and I see a lot of people struggle with that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and so what do you? I know you spend a lot of time thinking about that. What are you doing to help your clients as you're working with them over the years, right through the different phases of life? How are you helping them through that, coaching them and so forth?
Speaker 3:Yeah, so obviously the financial side of things is important, making sure you reduce your debt and save appropriately in the different buckets, however that might work for each individual. But it's also just when folks look forward to retirement, when you see that, whether it's five, 15, 20 years ahead, start thinking about other things. You know what things beyond your career or your family bring you joy that you like to do, whether you spend time with, and especially with, couples, chris, I see I often have people come sit down with me and I'll ask a basic question like you know hey, what do you, you know, what do the two of you want to do in retirement? I'll hear completely different answers. People have been married 20, 30, 40 years and they sort of look at each other like really I didn't know you wanted to do that and you know not that I'm a counselor or anything.
Speaker 3:I'm like, hey, maybe the two of you might want to sort of talk about what it is that you want to do in retirement and have like an idea well in advance of getting to that point. So from the financial side of things, sometimes I've had people sit down with me and they say okay, josh, I'm 64 and a half years old and I'm going to retire in six months, at 66. Here's my stuff, what can we do? And sometimes I'll do calculations and I'll look and my inside voice says well, you need to get in a time machine and go back 10 or 15 years and we'll start this conversation over again, because what it is that you want to do and the amount of money you have is not aligned.
Speaker 3:So from a financial standpoint, I tell people you really need to stop thinking about this stuff in advance of that point of retirement. From a non-financial standpoint, it's the same thing. It's like OK, what do you think that you want to do? If you're single, fine. If you're a couple, fine. But figure out those things that you want to do and how you might approach that in retirement to bring you that sort of purpose beyond what it was during your working years.
Speaker 1:Are you seeing people slow down or semi-retire and or take a minute to say, gosh, I really enjoy X right, this is my true passion. Before they retire, you seeing people? I mean, I have a long ways for retirement, so I haven't started thinking about that, but so I'm trying to get myself ready. Right Gosh, I've got a few more years, but how are people getting themselves emotionally prepared? I know you're really big on supporting those clients. How are people doing that?
Speaker 3:You know I don't see it enough and that's why I enjoy actually talking about this and talking with folks. You know, I think people focus a lot on the financial side of retirement, which is an important thing to do, but I think I just I'm not seeing people do enough. Talking enough about that, chris, unfortunately. So you know, again, going back to what I was saying, I just think people need to think about the emotional side of it, need to think about what brings them happiness and just have those conversations, whether it's with an advisor, friend, neighbors, their spouse, whoever, just to sort of identify how emotionally you can approach retirement successfully.
Speaker 1:So another piece of the emotions and I mean I have this emotion at 35 years old is I'm not going to have enough to retire, right, that's something that I know my father, who's much closer to retirement than I am I don't have enough to retire, right, he does and I will and we'll all be fine and we'll figure it all out. But how are people managing that emotion and kind of going through that phase of it? Are you saying, well, gosh, here's the plan, this is what we can project out. We can't break the future, but you know we think you're going to be fine or you need to change a strategy, right? Are those conversations that you're having with people as well, I mean?
Speaker 3:Yeah, you know, going back to when you know you earned your first nickel. However old you were, you spent your entire life earning and saving money and again, that's scripted. Everyone sort of knows how to do that. People are preaching to one another constantly about how to save money and the different sources of savings accounts, etc. But not enough. People also talk about the.
Speaker 3:When you stop earning money, you know, if you picture yourself as a like a money making machine, truly you are a machine that makes money. That's your ability to earn income. And when you stop doing that at age 65, sometimes age 70, when people have been working often for 45 or 50 years, every Monday, tuesday, wednesday, thursday, friday, they wake up, they go to work and they get a paycheck at the end of the week and then all of a sudden to say, okay, don't do that anymore. People just don't know how to do that. They don't understand and that emotional toll is like I have no idea how to stop doing this and the idea of no longer putting money into a bucket really scares me. And now you're telling me I have to start taking money out of this bucket and there might be a bottom of that bucket. That's kind of scary for a lot of people Right.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. That's what I, you know. That's what I think about, right, what you know, you said when we talked a couple weeks ago that you know, when your clients retire, that you know. Following Monday, you call them and say hey, what's going on? How are you feeling?
Speaker 3:I love, I love, I love that I didn't sort of what I was just talking about, the idea of like working for 40 or 50 years and then one day you go to work and then the next day all of a sudden you wake up literally with nothing to do. And it's fascinating. But I think that's also what scares a lot of people. I've seen so many people they rush towards that, they're like I can't wait for that day, and other people. I think it really truly scares them. But I've had several conversations with people that tell me they're going to retire and I kind of it's weird. I kind of get excited. I'm like, oh my gosh, can I call you? They're like, yeah, sure, absolutely. And there's one gentleman that I work with and every time I call him I'm like so what's on the agenda today? What are you doing? And he's great and he's very content, and I love the word contentment. He's very content and he's like, yeah, you know what he goes. I just think I'm gonna go trim a couple of trees, I'm gonna drive my tractor out back a little bit. I absolutely love that.
Speaker 3:And I read I read years ago this was a really interesting story there was, uh, some uh editor or something in a big newspaper out west in California or something like that.
Speaker 3:And uh, so his, he, his identity, was working for this newspaper for 30 or 40 years. That's what he did his entire life. And he said the sort of the greatest and the worst day of his life was when he woke up the day after retirement and went to his doorstep and the newspaper was there. And what he said was you know? He realized he's like, wait a second, they're going to do just fine without me. And he thought you know, I'm this big shot and I, you know, I helped build this newspaper and they can't operate without me. And and then the next day a newspaper showed up and he's like, wow, he goes, I'm just another number, I'm just another person, they don't necessarily need me. He was really excited to reach retirement but realize at that same time that, oh my gosh, I, that's, that's not I'm. That my identity was sort of all wrong. Who I saw myself is not necessarily the way other people saw me.
Speaker 1:That's interesting, I think you know we all, again, we have our identity right, which for me, is I'm guilty of it right, my business. I work too much. I enjoy it, of course, but you know I don't take the time to enjoy other things sometimes and I think that's, you know, things we all need to stop and think about and say gosh. We need to stop and smell the roses and realize that you know we do have a finite time. The bucket's going to come to. You know it's going to get empty at some point. You might as well enjoy it while it's full right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that's something that we all probably should take a step back and think about?
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely, Absolutely. And I, you know, with respect to people reaching retirement, I also I love the way people approach retirement and think about that actual day we were talking a moment ago about, like, when I get excited to hear people like you know, like what?
Speaker 2:are you doing?
Speaker 3:on that last day, you having a party, like it's just that, it's that sort of finality, that it's that final moment of like I've been doing this all my life of finality, that it's that final moment of like I've been doing this all my life and like how does it end?
Speaker 3:And there's no other, there's really no other thing in life where I can see, where it's just you're preparing for something, this sort of final moment where you're telling someone, a group or career or something where I'm done with that and you've been doing it for you know 30, 40, 50 years, and to see what that moment is going to be like.
Speaker 3:A few years back I was working with this, with this woman. She, she was fantastic and she was a receptionist at this organization and she announced her retirement and she was working there for 30 years, something like that, and she's and she said, all right, the time is right for me to retire. And she didn't know the actual day. But she prearranged with the boss and said, hey, within the next couple of months I'm going to retire. I don't know the exact date, but she said I know that I'm going to be driving home one day and I'm going to know that's my last day and I'm just not going to show up the next day. And she said to the boss the employer in me is cringing right now.
Speaker 3:Well, she said she said to the boss out of respect for you, I don't want you know, I don't want you guys to worry about me and I don't want to, just, you know, stiff you guys and not have somebody in the boss. That I 100% understand. You do what you need to do, we'll be prepared for whenever that day is. And then, sure enough, she was just driving home one day and I talked to her after this and she looked at me and she goes yeah, I was just driving home one day and she looked around. She goes yep, today's the day, and she just didn't show up the next day. I was just like wow, and I was just like so fascinated by that.
Speaker 1:I'm like how do you do that? That's just so cool. It's cool and again, frightening as an employer, right, you know, that succession plane, that's a whole different episode, but you know, that's certainly something that small business owners need to think about.
Speaker 3:But I think I think for her too. I think part of it was the fear of of facing those emotions and having people hug her and give, giving her a cake and throw in a party and giving her cards. I think part of it was she didn't want to face that.
Speaker 1:So you didn't want the finality.
Speaker 3:She didn't. That's right, that's exactly right Interesting.
Speaker 3:Interesting, interesting. What have you seen in your clients? You know that has fulfilled them. What have you seen them doing. You know what are thing and, as you know, when you're passionate, very passionate about what you do, it's hard to let that go sometimes. But when they have somebody to mentor, somebody to pass on that wisdom, pass on that business, pass on that knowledge, all of that information, I've seen that gives people a lot of satisfaction.
Speaker 3:So that and you know whether it's like handing off a baton and allowing someone to continue your legacy, what it is that you've done so small business owners that's definitely something that's brought them happiness and passion and makes it easier for them to sort of reach that retirement phase, sort of phasing out of retirement, rather than that final moment. You know, you see that like okay, I'm here on a Friday and I'm not going to show up on a Monday is one thing, but I think we're seeing a lot more of that sort of phasing into retirement or phasing out of your career. I was working five days a week, now it's four, now it's three, especially, I think, with the way unemployment rates are, and I think businesses are very much willing to work with people that are good quality employees to say hey, we know you're at that point of retirement.
Speaker 3:We'll work with you, we'll be flexible and allow you to sort of phase into retirement which will help you emotionally deal with. Okay, I'm working five days a week. Now I'm working four days a week and it has that extra day to allow you to find that fulfillment and that purpose outside of your career. Then maybe down to three days, rather than working on a Friday, waking up on a Monday with nothing to do.
Speaker 1:Right, and that's a perfect example. We're doing that here internally. You know, I have an employee, long-time employee, wonderful, wonderful. You know, about two years ago we kind of transitioned her into her retirement role, something that's a little less stressful, you know, senior level kind of position, not the monotony, the craziness of the day to day. And now we're starting to have that conversation of like, okay, how much longer do you really want to work and do you want to go to a couple of days a week before you? You know, so you can start to phase in which I think is works great for me as an employer and I think certainly for certain folks it might work, you know, as an employee as well.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you know it's hard enough for businesses to find quality employees right now, so when you have one, you don't want to lose them Absolutely. But I also see a lot of business owners take a certain amount of pride in having somebody retire from their organization. I see that a lot with small businesses incredibly proud, especially some newer businesses where they have, like the first person to retire from their company. Business owners take a lot of pride in that.
Speaker 3:They're like you know what? I was able to give somebody a career. I was able to give them the ability to phase into retirement with some dignity, and it's really it's pretty neat to say.
Speaker 1:That's really cool. So I think retirement's a long way for a lot of us. You know we're getting ready to. You know we're getting ready early to retire, and then you know it comes, and now we are, we're there and you know, I think I have to find my purpose when we get there. I don't know if you've started thinking about yours. You know, I think that's kind of the summary of you know, today is really just getting yourself emotionally ready, right, that's the big piece of it, and certainly we don't want to see the people that just go home and sit in the chair for 20 years and then go to the box right, that's terrible, well, good.
Speaker 1:Well, just a reminder. Our disclaimer Josh is a financial advisor. Everything that we've talked about today is not advice or counsel. Please continue to seek your own advice and counsel from your trusted advisors as well. So that is wonderful.
Speaker 3:Thank you so much, josh, we really appreciate it Before we head off.
Speaker 1:Don't forget please like follow share rate review. We really appreciate all those reviews. That helps us grow and again, if you have any questions for us, you can reach out to us at podcast at papertrailscom. Josh, how do folks get in touch with you if they want more advice to where they want to sit in your chaise lounge?
Speaker 3:Yeah, thank you In the office. Yeah, absolutely. Email address is jchase at bgaretirementcom. Telephone 207-233-8237 or visit our website wwwbgafinancialcom.
Speaker 1:Awesome. Well, thank you so much. Thanks very much, josh, and thanks everyone for listening today and we'll see you very soon. Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Small Business, big World. This podcast is a production of Paper Trails. We are a payroll and HR company based in Kennebunk, maine, and we serve small and mid-sized businesses across New England and the country. If you found this podcast helpful, don't forget to follow us at at Paper Trails Payroll across all social media platforms and check us out at papertrailscom for more information. As a reminder, the views, opinions and thoughts expressed by the hosts and guests alone. The material presented in this podcast is for general information purposes only and should not be considered legal or financial advice. By inviting this guest to our podcast, paper Trails does not imply endorsement of or opposition to any specific individual, organization, product or service.
