Clarity of Mind on the Entrepreneurial Journey

On this one I was delighted to be joined by Francesca Hodgson, MBA, the successful entrepreneur and Founder of We are Ambition, a business consultancy offering fractional leadership, growth services, mentoring and coaching.

This was a fascinating conversation with Francesca where we explored the need for clarity of mind, as it relates to the entrepreneurial journey.

🌟 Some of the most interesting parts of our conversation were:
✅The power of authenticity, how it helps build confidence, and acts like a rocket ship for motivation;
✅The work that Francesca has been doing around the promoting of mental resilience as a positive tool to achieve your goals.
✅How everything is fighting for our attention and clarity of mind allows you to engage and articulate what it is that you're doing;
✅That it all starts with values and taking time to understand what matters to you and in what order, can really help inform why we do what we do;
✅Why coaching and mentoring combined can be such a powerful way to help people understand what is important to them and what to prioritise to execute their vision;

Business Book Bonus:

Shoe Dog: A Memoir by the Creator of NIKE:  https://amzn.eu/d/4l3ZZOM
Trillion Dollar Coach: https://amzn.eu/d/5WEHeVS

Transcript

Adam (00:03.842)
Okay, so today I'm here with Francesca Hodgson, the founder of We Are Ambition, a business consultancy that offers fractional leadership, growth services, mentoring and coaching. Francesca's a technology founder, having co-founded and then exited Goodbox, a tech for good company, and is a business leader, non-exec director, coach and mentor. Francesca, welcome to the Fractional CFO Show, how you doing?

Francesca Hodgson (00:30.072)
I'm good. Thanks Adam, thanks for having me.

Adam (00:33.134)
Thanks for being here. Thanks for being here. So today we're going to dive into the need for clarity of mind, particularly as it relates to the entrepreneurial journey. So to start with, I know you've been on your own entrepreneurial journey. would be, it would be great if you could give us a bit of an overview of how you went. I think I saw you were in the world of financial services for a while. So how did you go from that to, co-founding Goodbox and now, now starting up, we are Ambition.

Francesca Hodgson (01:03.032)
Thanks, Adam. So originally I trained as a graphic designer and that course taught conceptual thinking. I'm an aggressively creative person, which is a double-edged sword, which I'm sure many creative listeners will perhaps understand and recognize. And I went into financial services to curate events and be creative in that regard.

However, my brain is always ticking and I'm the sort of person that will come up with ideas in my sleep. And I had an opportunity through my first maternity leave where I met my first co-founder to go and explore the world of entrepreneurship and set up a company. So really from there, it's been a continual learning journey of getting stuff right, getting stuff wrong, building up a company.

and ultimately exiting that company. And today I sit here as a coach because clarity of mind is the mission that I'm on because now more than ever is it so so important for individuals to have both mental resilience as well as physical fitness if they're going to go and achieve anything at all in life and

Entrepreneurship is hard, right? It's a hard journey and it's not for the faint-hearted. And I think, well, I don't think I know that there is a lot of media out there that perhaps glamorises the world of entrepreneurship, but it is a very tough and lonely journey. And so what I love about coaching is it gives anybody the space and time to really think and reflect around their thoughts and get clear about the path ahead.

because without that clarity, can be exceptionally difficult and exceptionally tough to understand really what are the next steps in order to execute your vision.

Adam (03:06.21)
Okay, great. Great. Lots of good stuff there. And you mentioned clarity of mind. And it'd be interesting maybe to start with to understand your, your definition, I guess, of clarity of mind. How do you, how do you define it for yourself and for your clients?

Francesca Hodgson (03:22.798)
Yeah, thanks Adam. That's a great question. Really it's about finding the energy and the motivation and the understanding of what to do next. You there are only so many hours in the day. We all have the same amount of time, but we are in a highly digital age, which is full of distractions. Everything is fighting for our attention. And just to be able to get to the point where you can engage and articulate what it is that you're doing.

to yourself but then articulate it in a way in which others can understand and can get on board and can help. And that for me is clarity of mind when it comes to business and entrepreneurship. But of course, clarity of mind in a coaching sense can extend into the personal as well. So what is it that you need in your life in order for you to do what it is that you want to do? Or what is it that you want to do?

and just giving people the space and time to explore their thoughts, their values, what matters to them is a profoundly impactful process that we rarely have time to do in normal day-to-day conversation or in life.

Adam (04:33.998)
Okay, great. And obviously there's only so many hours in the day, as you say, and there's constant decision-making and stress, as you alluded to, when you're starting a small business or you're starting out on that entrepreneurial journey. What strategies do you recommend as kind of a starting point for the audience of this podcast, who typically are small business owners starting out on that journey? What sort of strategies could you recommend that they

that they follow to help cultivate that clarity of mind.

Francesca Hodgson (05:09.11)
Sure. For me, it always starts with values and an understanding of what matters to you. And this to some people can seem trivial and it can seem like, well, I, you know, a question that you might inherently think, I know the answers, I know what matters to me, but do you, what really matters to you and in what order? And taking the time to explore that can really help inform.

why it is that you do what you do, what your purpose is, and what mission are you on? And we're really talking to the kind of the top of Maslow's hierarchy of needs here around purpose and what is it that matters to you. And just taking the time to map those values out and to understand that will really help you prioritize the opportunities that come into your life and how it is that you spend your day.

Adam (05:58.608)
Yeah, I guess that makes a lot of sense and starting with values allows you to turn this to anything, right? So you're not limited to any one part, one area of your business. And obviously this, where I'm going with this is this podcast is, you I'm a CFO, this is a CFO podcast, but you know, if you start with your values, that clarity of mind approach can be turned to financial needs as much as it can be turned to any other needs, right?

Francesca Hodgson (06:25.518)
Absolutely, 100%.

Adam (06:27.536)
Yeah. Okay, great. And how do you see with that in mind, business owners turning and using that clarity to help identify and eliminate sort of wasteful ways of living, wasteful ways of working? Do you see particular techniques that allows them to determine what can be cut out of their lives as well as what can be focused on and added to?

Francesca Hodgson (06:56.792)
I mean on a practical level there are a number of...

tools that one can use on a day-to-day basis. Things like journaling are very effective. Planning, getting organized, understanding, know, time blocking, how much time do you have and what are you going to do first? All of these things are very practical tools. And then talking a bit deeper to, you know, clarity of mind and overcoming problems and understanding goals, this is where the coaching element comes in because this is where you may

need some support in order to understand what it is that matters most or what it is that you should do next and I think this is what's so powerful about coaching and potentially mentoring in a blended sense is that with coaching or as a coach I would never give anybody advice.

That process is about giving people the space and time to be truly heard and to ask questions that will help them explore those thoughts more deeply in order to find the answers for themselves. And if you combine that with mentoring where I might use my education or my experience in order to offer options around solutions.

Those two combined can be a very powerful way to help people with understanding what it is that's important to them and what it is that they should prioritize in order to execute their vision.

Adam (08:27.354)
And just one thing you said there, just my own clarification. When you say mentoring in a blended sense, what exactly do you mean?

Francesca Hodgson (08:35.672)
So coaching and mentoring can often be confused and often it's difficult to distinguish what coaching is about alongside therapy and how these three cross over or how they're different. And really coaching is a profound technique because it's about future focused, goal-orientated.

actions and deriving actionable insight in order to obtain future goals. Whereas mentoring may be that we're working through a business challenge or problem together, and I might be recommending solutions. But in a coaching scenario, you'll be finding your own solutions through the process of being allowed the space and time to talk and through the process of being asked questions to allow you as a person to explore your thoughts more deeply.

And I firmly believe that we all have the answers that we need within. We just sometimes need the help, support and guidance in finding them. And perhaps somebody to help us build confidence in order to execute against those thoughts and those answers that we may derive ourselves. And that.

again is different to therapy because that's often looking back at past trauma and learning from those experiences. But coaching and mentoring in terms of business are profoundly complementary because they're offering both an ear that understands and an opportunity to be heard.

Adam (10:11.76)
Okay, very interesting. And how did you decide on this path for yourself? What was it that from your own business experience, your own practices around clarity of mind made you decide that the route you're going on now with We Are Ambition was the right route for you?

Francesca Hodgson (10:31.539)
In a way, coaching found me. I was always the person, or I found myself quite often being the person that somebody would call when something was going wrong. And as a human, I'm quite empathetic by nature.

And I do like to help people. That's one of my core values. And that's really one of the reasons I set up my first tech for good company. It was about this deeper understanding and this deeper desire to add value and to help others. And

I don't, I mean, I've been told many times that I've helped many people really unlock their confidence and unlock their passion. And so I don't know specifically what that is, Adam, about my persona, but I really do truly love helping people. And it is coming from the depths of my soul and my heart that I really enjoy this process. And it is a privilege, right, to be able to help people unlock what it is.

they're passionate about and to see their purpose.

Adam (11:38.072)
Excellent, good answer, good answer. how, in terms of the sort of specific routines or habits that help you, is there anything that help you sort of, that you find incredibly valuable to help maintain focus in what I'm sure is a chaotic environment for yourself?

Francesca Hodgson (11:57.442)
Yes, absolutely. And some people are going to love this answer and some people are going to hate this answer because The 5 a.m. Club is a book that I could have written before. It's something I've been doing for my entire life is that I'm a morning person. And that's just about understanding what works for me. And some people are evening people and I completely admire that I will be in bed asleep at nine o'clock. So for me, I always start with myself and giving myself the space and time to exercise because that helps clear my mind.

and that helps me focus. That alongside other healthy habits and I always apply an 80-20 rule, right? I'm not perfect, but just doing and recognising what makes me feel good and what gives me the energy to go at my goals and to go at my day in the most effective way.

Adam (12:51.204)
Okay, great. And I can relate to both of that, in fact. So in terms of one thing that I've struggled with, and I know some of the audience who I know have struggled with as well is how business owners who work from home, and this is for people who are employees now, often working in a hybrid way, how can they create a work environment? We both mentioned our dogs at the beginning of this, at the beginning of recording, how can you minimize distractions and...

And how can you promote focus for yourself in a home environment, a homework environment? What have you seen work particularly well in that case?

Francesca Hodgson (13:28.428)
Yeah, great question. I mean, for me, I love my home environment. I've made it and optimised it in a way in which I feel calm and I feel focused.

But I do understand that there can be many distractions in a home environment. But again, I think if you go back to mapping your day and time blocking and using some of these basic tools and techniques to allow you to execute against what's important and layer on routines such as exercise and things that are going to get you in the right mind and in the right place to focus, then I think whether you're at home or whether you're in an office, it doesn't matter.

For me and in my experience, being in an office is even more challenging because you've got interruptions, you haven't necessarily got privacy, you have to endure a commute. so I think it's about weighing up your options and understanding your environment is absolutely key in order to optimise it in a way in which it's going to allow you to execute against what it is that you need to do.

Adam (14:36.604)
Yeah, no, exactly right. I know a lot of people like the commute as a sort of way of separating work from home, but as you say, there's an added distraction there for sure. And one thing that, you I know you talked about sort of time blocking before and there's different tools and technologies that can make these things easier. Some people swear by a pen and paper, other people more technologically advanced. Are there any sort of tools or technology that...

that has helped you, what role does technology play in this, which can be a sort of more mindfulness way of thinking, which lends itself to removing technology from one's life, but obviously there are tools that can help and facilitate. So what's your view and where do you stand on that?

Francesca Hodgson (15:21.774)
This is a great question because I'm married to a technologist who's deeply technical. So I put a LinkedIn poll out recently on my LinkedIn to ask this exact question of others, because I know that really when it comes to planning and prioritization, a pen and paper often works best for me. But my husband is of the other opinion that technology is the only way in which he can operate. And so the results of the poll

suggested that actually more people prefer to use pen and paper, which is interesting in a highly technological world. And all I can say from personal experience is that I find technology too distracting. No matter how much I have optimized notifications, et cetera, et cetera, there is always the tendency if I pick up my phone that I'm gonna see something that I wasn't there to see.

And so that's why for me pen and paper helps when it comes to being organised and optimising time because it's less likely to distract me.

Adam (16:32.412)
I was going to say your holiday planning as a family must be very interesting, I'm sure. One of you on the spreadsheet and the other with the pen and paper in hand. I think a lot of people have that kind of, you know, in their relationships, one in one extreme and one in the other, so that's interesting. One thing you said at the outset around your own career was around, you know, your values, and that was something that you then sort of...

Francesca Hodgson (16:42.958)
you

Adam (17:01.304)
said was important for anyone on an entrepreneurial or startup journey or anyone in life, I guess. you know, there's something that's been very common in sort of the recent years is about bringing your whole self to work and being authentic and having that authenticity in business and how being true to oneself, you know, can attract the right people and the right opportunities. Why do you believe if you do that authenticity is so powerful?

in business and you mentioned how it impacted your earlier career. Is that something that you see continuing throughout your career to date?

Francesca Hodgson (17:39.414)
Yeah, thanks Adam. I think the power of authenticity is because by virtue of what it is, it helps build confidence. And where confidence is present, everything else starts to flow. And so if I'm not bringing my whole self to the table, or...

if I'm putting on a persona that I feel that I need to in order to fulfill a certain role or criteria, that for me inherently will reduce my level of confidence, because it won't feel natural and I won't be in flow state. And so I think that those two are very intrinsically aligned, confidence and authenticity. And when you can be your true authentic self, it's honestly liberating.

When you can sit there and stand up for what you believe in and you feel supported and you feel like you've got a psychologically safe environment in which to do so. This is like a rocket ship for motivation. And then again, for motivation, you've got that energy, you've got that drive, you've got that passion.

to make things happen. And that's why think authenticity is so important. And in addition, it will help you connect. It will help you connect with others that align with what you're talking about and what you're speaking to. And so that power in like-mindedness and community will also be another rocket ship that will help support whatever it is that you're endeavouring to do.

Adam (19:19.408)
Yeah, no, great answer. And I'm interested because, you know, in the sort of the current social media landscape, the current world where people have, you know, being completely honest, been cancelled or had difficulties when they have brought their whole self to work or brought their whole self to their professional lives. How do you counsel about that? You know, there's one thing, you know, using your authenticity for confidence, as you say, to power you forward, but where your true self may conflict.

with the values of your client or your company or the values that others hold close to them, how do you sort of counsel balancing those?

Francesca Hodgson (20:00.918)
I mean, that's a great question. There's that age old saying that any publicity is good publicity, right? And particularly when you're looking at tools like social media, it's well known that controversy is a key engagement driver. So wherever you are in your journey and whatever you stand for, if you stand for something and you're outwardly promoting something,

that could be controversial, that could have differing opinions, you may put yourself in a position where you're going to get perhaps opposing views. However, that might not necessarily be a bad thing because it's sparking a conversation and it's sparking a debate.

But what it comes back to is you being you. And I think if you're confident and you're happy with who you are, then whatever challenges arise are just part of your journey.

Adam (21:09.628)
Yeah, that's a tricky one. That's good answer though, as you say, if you're, it's part of your journey and if you're authentic, you'll find your true path and you'll find your way of sort of finding like-minded souls who also believe in what you believe in, which I guess is the opportunity on the other side of that. And I guess one, are there with that in mind, authentic ways, sorry, practical ways, I should say, that you counsel business owners to check in with themselves?

because in the hurly burly of operations and you're so busy and so much going on, how do you stay authentic? How do you check in with yourself and stay authentic as your business grows and as your time is so stretched?

Francesca Hodgson (21:54.23)
Right, great question. And who you are today might not be who you are tomorrow, right? So you have to revisit these questions about who you are and what you stand for and what you need and what life really means to you, right? The question is always in any scenario, what did you learn? Right or wrong? It may in your head be branded the most catastrophic failure that you've ever endured, right? But what did you learn? And what are you gonna do?

do next time or what are you not going to do in the future? And when you're building a business, whether it's a small business, whether you're going down the route of more of an entrepreneurial venture, it's tough and you need to be able to pick yourself up again and keep smiling and keep going because if you don't, then there won't be a next time or there won't be another opportunity and you only really fail if you stop.

right? Because you never know what tomorrow is going to hold and what tomorrow is going to bring. So how are you going to learn from that scenario? How are you going to breathe? How are you going to give yourself the space and time to reflect and to find the energy to move on? And it's really about that willingness to learn and to embrace those perceived failures as motivation and as an opportunity.

to do better next time.

Adam (23:25.382)
Yeah, no, great answer. As you say, perceived failures. I think that's the operative word perceived because how you perceive them isn't necessarily how the world perceives them and they're all part of that journey. absolutely. Just changing tack slightly, because I know when we spoke earlier, you mentioned about, I think you said you have a household of men and there are some unique challenges that men and women face in their personal development.

Francesca Hodgson (23:30.478)
Okay.

Adam (23:55.376)
So I'd love to hear your view on what some of those unique challenges are that differ between men and women in personal development and then how you find coaching can help address some of those.

Francesca Hodgson (24:09.666)
Yeah, absolutely. mean, coaching is a transformational tool in both personal and professional growth. And as men and women, we often face distinct challenges in personal growth due to perhaps societal expectations or cultural conditioning. But at its core, the coaching process is the same regardless of gender. It is about giving somebody the space and time to be heard.

to understand that it's okay not to be okay and that just to have that confidential space in which to be truly listened to and to be asked questions in a way in which you can help find the clarity and the answers which may be residing deeper within is honestly profound. And it's a difficult, difficult time. The rise of technology has influenced

our understanding and has expanded knowledge around societal expectations, again, these cultural influences. But at its core, we're all human, right? And we are all battling similar challenges, depending on where it is that you're based in the world. And so just getting back to basics and understanding what really matters to you, right? And not everybody needs to be an entrepreneur here, Adam, right? Everyone's listening.

because that is a really tough road to go down and it's not for the faint-hearted and it's not to say that if you don't go down that road that you are not resilient, right, and you're not tough but perhaps in life things have different meaning and the idea of a stable paycheck so that you can go and pursue whatever else in life that matters to you is probably

for a number of people more enticing and the right decision, right? But until you've given yourself the space and time to explore what matters to you, I think regardless of gender, you may find it tough. And actually there's something that I think is quite profound about coaching is that if give yourself the hour or the investment of time to understand what matters to you and you will be on a faster ship because you'll know exactly what you need or what you wish to pursue.

Francesca Hodgson (26:34.53)
And that is, again, liberating.

Adam (26:37.956)
Yeah, no, absolutely. Absolutely. I think as you say, we're all one. We're all one, we? Ultimately, regardless of gender. But I know that when it comes to coaching, as you kind of alluded to there, can be more challenging for men, you know, in terms of, you know, opening up, accessing coaching, being willing to access coaching. What do you think can be done to address that in terms of making it more accessible for men or

Or do you think we're already there? you feel that men are already embracing this change and are accessing the opportunities that are available? Or do you still think there's work to do?

Francesca Hodgson (27:18.658)
I think that's an absolutely great point Adam and I particularly like working with men and helping male executives because there is a common challenge and it's just the byproduct of the way you know children are brought up and it's still true today sadly that you know we'll tell the boys get up get on with it and perhaps be more empathetic with the girls.

not saying that's right or wrong. It is changing slowly. But I do think as from my experience of working with men, they find it extremely tough to open up. But once you've got across those initial barriers, once they realize it's a safe space, it's okay. And the impact is profound, really profound. And I'm hoping that with the emphasis and awareness on mental resilience, mental fitness,

and almost the reclassification of mental health into more of prevention and a positive movement. So it's not about mental health, it's about mental fitness, it's not necessarily about therapy, it's about coaching. And of course there are differences and if people need to see therapists, that's absolutely the right thing and they should do that. And there's nothing wrong with that. But again, about using it as in thinking about it as a tool in order to achieve whatever it is that you want to achieve.

I'm hoping that men will find this more accessible.

Adam (28:52.292)
Excellent. Very good. Very good. I wanted to change tack again, go back to something that you said around entrepreneurship being a marathon and not a sprint. think, and I'd be interested to hear your views on what are some of the most common misconceptions about entrepreneurship, about starting up a business, particularly in the tech space where you come from, that you think new founders should be made aware of because it's not

It's often something that is glorified, as you say, and held up as the only way or held up as this is the path that you should be following. But as you say, it's a marathon, not a sprint. So what are some of those most common misconceptions that you'd like to put right?

Francesca Hodgson (29:39.726)
gosh, I mean, where do we start? And I think you've only got to open social media to see this realm of starting with side hustles, making...

20K a month, et cetera, et cetera. And there's a real difference between being a small business owner and being in an entrepreneurial venture. Typically when we're talking about entrepreneurship, you're looking to raise significant amounts of capital, you're bringing investors on board, you're tackling a really large global problem, and it's going to be more than just you. And both being a small business owner and being in entrepreneurship is an incredibly exciting

a liberating journey, right? But understand the difference. What do you want and what do you need? Because having 100 % of your company as a small business is very different to going into entrepreneurship, raising capital and ending up with sort of 20 % of a company that's then ultimately run by other people and you're just part of the pie. So.

understanding what it is, is the problem that you're solving and why do you do what you do because that will first dictate really what sort of company it is in venture that you're pursuing. But understand that at a fundamental level, either option is extremely tough. And if you are somebody that likes security, or relies on security of things like a paycheck,

you'll have to ask yourself, you know, how long can you endure such an adventure? Because there may be months where, you know, you don't have that security. So I think that, you know, for any typical tech venture that, you know, let's take a tech venture that somebody might be investing in, you've got a typical 10 year trajectory around any exit on that.

Francesca Hodgson (31:36.718)
10 years is a long time, right? Think about what were you doing 10 years ago and think about how far you've come and what energy would you need to do another 10 years? really then makes it clear, well it certainly makes it clear for me, why taking the time to invest in yourself and understanding what you need on both a physical and a mental level and an environmental capacity.

to pursue whatever it is that you plan to pursue for the next 10 years with consistency, with energy, and still feel like this is what you want to dedicate your life to. So I think be aware is all I'm saying about seeing the glamour of entrepreneurship because under that iceberg there's a lot that any entrepreneur will wrestle with.

Adam (32:33.228)
That's great advice. think having that 10 year horizon in mind is critical to what were you doing 10 years ago? What were you doing in 10 years? Yeah, very, very interesting and not easy to do as well. So having to take a step back and really sort of think about these things before you enter into some partnership or some.

Francesca Hodgson (32:45.422)
Thank

Adam (32:52.462)
organization that is going to limit your next 10 years. Yeah, very, very important. I guess the final topic I'd like to just get your view on is about your, your role as, a mentor for entrepreneurs and, and how, how you found that to be helpful. How have you found your experience mentoring has shaped your coaching? You I, you said about the empathy that you've got and both activities need, need an empathetic approach, but have you found any specifics?

that have really helped that you've taken from the mentoring into your coaching world.

Francesca Hodgson (33:28.524)
Yeah. Firstly, coaching and mentoring is a privilege. To work with individuals, to help them build their vision and to build their dream and to be trusted is a privilege. And I enter this with the hat on that says,

who or what would I have liked access to when I first started my entrepreneurial venture. And now I'm in the privileged position of being a visiting entrepreneur to King's College Cambridge and working with their entrepreneurship lab and with their students in a mentoring and coaching capacity. I feel that honestly, Adam...

I am just at the starting gates of understanding really how these two will overlap. But what I can say is that as an entrepreneur, or as a business owner, it is your vision, your values, your mission, your resilience, your leadership, right, that's going to execute or drive the business forward.

And so if we think about that, we think about the person behind it and how is that person bringing themselves to the table? How are they understanding themselves? And that's where coaching is so foundational for me before doing any form of mentoring or business advisory, because helping somebody understand.

What is life about? What really matters to them? What purpose are they on? What are they pursuing? What lights them up? How do they like to work? What culture are they building? All of this is ultimately inherently intertwined with the person that founds an organization, right? And so helping an individual create a stable ship in themselves,

Francesca Hodgson (35:30.178)
will help them unlock the path ahead and will help them then go on to derive the actionable next steps, the goals, the KPIs, what it is that they need to be doing on a day-to-day level. But unless that person can bring their whole self to the table.

it's going to be incredibly difficult to execute. And it is well known that the single biggest reason that companies and businesses and entrepreneurial ventures fail, it's due to leadership and management challenges.

And so protecting the person and investing in the human capital behind any organization, be it founder in the wider team, is so, so, so critically important and understated. And it really is something that can profoundly have a positive impact on the likelihood of success. And again, exit and long term.

execution of vision, right? And so that's why I believe the two are so, so complementary.

Adam (36:34.598)
Great.

Adam (36:38.78)
Absolutely and that really comes across your passion for your area comes across and I think that's exactly right. The investment in the people is often not realized at the very early stages in the companies that I deal with. So the fact that you have this mission and you're spreading the word as they say is excellent. Okay great and so changing tack onto our business book bonus section. This is where we ask

our guests to provide us with a recommendation for the audience of a business book or any business content that's helped you during your business career and that you would like to recommend to the audience. So what business book or other content would you like to recommend, Francesca?

Francesca Hodgson (37:21.89)
Gosh, there are so many here, honestly, Adam, but there's two that are my go-to. And the first is the story of Nike called Shoe Dog. And if you want a story of resilience, that is the story, right? That is a great, great example of the long game and resilience in entrepreneurship. So that's Shoe Dog.

The other book that I love because it's about coaching is a book called The Trillion Dollar Coach. And this book is branded the leadership playbook for Silicon Valley. And it talks about a guy called Bill Campbell who was an ex football coach. And he's held responsible for allowing a number of Silicon Valley leaders to create billions in value for their organizations. And that one's by Eric Schmidt and Jonathan Rosenberg and Alan Eagle. But another brilliant book of how profound

coaching can be and how fundamental it can be to organisational leaders.

Adam (38:23.676)
Excellent, two very good choices there and we'll put some links in the show notes with those recommendations. Thank you Francesca. Is there anything that we haven't covered that you'd like to say before we wrap up or where can people find you if not?

Francesca Hodgson (38:38.946)
Thanks, Adam. People can find me at weareambition.ventures on my website or on Instagram, we.r.ambition or mainly through my LinkedIn. We all find me under Francesca Hodgson on LinkedIn.

Adam (38:57.646)
Excellent, well thank you. And thank you very much for joining me today on the Fractional CFO Show. Francesca, really appreciate your insights, your perspective and your time. Thank you very much.

Francesca Hodgson (39:08.248)
Thanks Adam, it's been a pleasure.

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