This podcast episode is sponsored by ChiefAIOfficer.com, offering training and certification through the International Association of Chief AI Officers. Interested in a new career or leveling up your value in the marketplace? ChiefaiOfficer.com can help. Welcome to Using AI at Work. I'm your host, Chris Daigle. Each week we'll be learning how today's business owners, entrepreneurs, and ambitious professionals are getting more done with smart use of tomorrow's tech. Let's get started. Okay, welcome to the Using AI at Work Podcast. My name is Chris Daigle. I'm the host, and we're flipping the table a little bit. I am going to be the guest on this, and I'd like to introduce uh the host of today's podcast episode is Segovia Smith. Segovia is the co-founder of ChiefAIOfficer.com and as smart about AI as anybody I know. I actually learned something from him today with that lip reading thing. That was pretty cool. Um, anyway, Segovia, if you want to take a second and introduce yourself and then um let's talk about AI.
SPEAKER_01All right. Well, it is fun. You know, after putting a year behind us in the rear view on this podcast, certainly exciting. Not only have I been a guest, but now you get to be the guest. So it'll be good to see, you know, what is the story behind Chief AI officer? And I guess that's kind of a beginner question. I mean, as a chief product officer, what I do is, you know, look at the lens of how do we create better product? How do we create, you know, uh training and education that's both forward-thinking, what can meet the demands of the market today, and what can we, you know, look forward to as this role evolves. So what I guess you you started this before I got on the scene. You know, you had a kind of a year of uh rumbling in creating product. What inspired you to the name chief AI officer versus anything else you could have picked off the AI landscape?
SPEAKER_02So ChatGPT comes out end of November 2022. It wasn't until January of 2023 where I was in a meeting, and some guy honestly told me I used AI to solve the mystery of the universe. I was like, what? He was a bit of a goofball. Um so but it opened, I was like, you were able to do what now? Obviously, he didn't. He became a self-titled astrophysicist, I think, at that point because of his output from ChatGPT. Um, so I said, okay, I'm gonna go try this out. This is pretty cool. You know, what can I do with it? And like most people, I set up an account, a free account, and I didn't really know how to communicate with an LLM. So it's my first exposure to using AI. I think I asked it something dumb like War of 1812, kind of like the same kind of like a Google search. And okay, whatever, this is cool, I guess. I didn't know how to think in AI. It's a term we use a lot in chief AI officer. It's when you've had that aha moment where you're like, oh, and like all of a sudden your brain goes tick, tick, tick, tick, tick, like, oh, can I do this? Can I do this? Can I do this? Can I do this? Right? You have that moment. And anybody listening who um is has been using the tools, you've had that moment. You know what I'm talking about. We actually have a book coming out called uh on the topic of thinking in AI, co-written with one of our chief AI officers. Um so didn't think much of it, but for whatever reason, I kept going back to it and I had that moment. I was like, oh, because I was doing a lot of business consulting at the time, helping companies scale and grow. And I realized, like, oh my goodness, I can use it like this. Very similar to the concept that Jeff shared, Jeff Woods shares in his book, AI Driven Leader, the thought partner. And instantly I was like, more all these, all these clients that I'm working with, everybody, every single person in their business would get lifted up in their uh ability to ideate, to perform, whatever. If they knew about it, so I instantly wanted to begin sharing it with my clients. Um and I talked to a friend of mine at the time who was very early into like within three months, he had already doing stuff that is just now being talked about um with agents, actually. He was way ahead of it. And uh he told me about like the the impact that this role would have in businesses. And I started putting the two together. Okay, I'm I'm coming into businesses, I'm helping them a lot. I want to bring in generative AI so that they can understand to use it. Uh and I I pretty quickly saw that without an understanding of a business, big deal if you know AI, it's helpful, but you don't know where to where the pieces fit, how to, oh, in this workflow, oh, they do it this way. AI, like, so he introduced me to this concept and it just formed. I was like, they need to have somebody in the company who's like the AI person. And if if and anybody listening, if you're the AI person, you think you're an expert, you know that you don't have to know it all. Somebody can come to you with a question, you can go, let's see. Well, the answer to that is like you you know how to get the information, and that's as important as knowing the information, right? Um, you become more of an architect rather than uh, you know, the the researcher or whatever. You just happen to know the questions to answer. And it was a natural, I saw this being wasted at a tactical level. So if somebody was exclusively using it in their job, not to say that anybody doing that is is wasting it, but for a company, if they had that that that center of gravity around the conversation of AI and the company, and that was some frontline person or just uh, you know, a around a programmer or maybe whatever, but it wasn't getting distributed, uh, that person would shine, but the company wouldn't get the benefit, the promise that we're seeing from generative AI and business operations, operationalizing it, as my friend Rachel Wood says. Um and it just made sense. Chief, it's a C-suite role, it's a strategic role uh that also has a tactical understanding. And it just made sense, chief AI officer. And then like within 24 hours, um, I heard two other people using it, one of them uh Peter Diamandis from the stage at Abundance 360, an event that he hosts. And this was you know early 2020 spring of 2023. So I realized, like, okay, I'm not the only one with this idea. And I said, I wonder if they're chief AI officer.com, right? I come from a digital marketing background. Um, it you you know, if you want to leverage this identity, you want a uh a platform on the internet where people can go, what is that? Who is it? How do you become that? That kind of thing, right? And I bought the domain, it was a premium domain at the time. Uh it's 10x in value since I bought it. Um and I ended up running into somebody at an event, and I know the date that I bought it. I looked it up, and he said, Oh, you know, I went and tried to get it, and it was um it was already taken. And I asked him, when did you do it? And I had gotten that domain 24, 28 hours uh before he had gone to try to get the same domain. So I I at that point I knew I like this is a thing, this is gonna stick around. This is a a source of counsel and subject matter expertise that companies need. So that was the inspiration.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and I mean, like when I jumped on and you know, kind of got on the scene here, it was before you guys were you're in pre-mark, uh, what we call you're still developing the content. Yeah, pre-revenue, still developing product. And I had kind of bumped into you through LinkedIn, just through some networking and outreach. Super random. I I was like saw the idea that you guys had. You had at least you know some stuff up on the website, and I was like, okay, this is cool. Let me go see like how popular this is, right? Because 10, 15 years ago, a product manager wasn't a role that anybody, it was a role people had, but not a title they had, right? They were doing things in Scrum teams, and then all of a sudden now it's like there's millions of product managers. Every company has an army of product managers, and it's like, where does the AI fit into this? I saw that like trajectory. And so I went to LinkedIn. I'm like, okay, how many people actually have chief AI officer or C AIO? And it was like 200, 250, 300, something like that. And I mean, now we're obviously graduating like way more than even that, as people are putting their shingle out there to say I'm an AI expert. So why is now like the perfect time for a business or an individual on a career path? You know, why is it the perfect time to really get into AI? Because like 2023 was one kind of you know kernel of the seed, but it's like popcorn, right? It starts in, it's getting hotter, and you know, it takes some time before like they just start popping. And 2024 was like, you know, starting to see some some early kernels, but 2025 is gonna blow the lid off this. So, what do you see in terms of the role of a chief AI officer as that transforms with the AI evolution?
SPEAKER_02Um, first I want to address something. Uh, a statistic that I bring up a lot in training that we do is from a recent Forbes article about the growth of the role of like AI being an VP, executive director, like all those levels in companies. And the C-suite role of chief AI officer had grown 428% in like 18 months or something, right? I wonder how much of an impact of that if they went to LinkedIn and it's because we've been graduating to anyway, just a random pocket. Yeah, right. Um, and there's no doubt that this is something. Uh you know, I when I whenever I do training, the question comes up: is AI gonna take my job? It's not as much now. I think people know that that's not the case, but they don't really, they did, they just know that they're safe from the robot walking in and replacing them one day. However, people haven't quite made the connection that, well, the robot's not gonna do it, or AI by itself isn't gonna do it. But what about somebody that knows my job from another company or whatever, and they know AI? They're like people are starting to wake up to like, oh, wait a minute, that's the threat. It's not, it's AI is not gonna take my job. Someone who knows AI will take my job. So I think it's important just whether you want to be a chief AI officer or you don't hell, you don't even want people to know that you know AI, you need to know AI, right? Like, like the category of employee, the category of business that is AI enabled, you know, doesn't even have to be like all the way through it, but they they've introduced Gen AI into some processes and marketing, maybe finance uses it a little bit, maybe the CEOs over there summarizing articles, whatever. That company is operating at a different level than a company that is putting the brakes. Oh, no, no one can use AI at work. And I get it. There's uh there's you know, been, I would say, in inaccurate information in the current environment about security risks. I mean, it's very easy. There's you know, simple ways to get around that. So that company that's not letting their people use it, one for one, there's people using it. The company just doesn't know about it. And that's the dangerous part, right? There's no guidelines in place. Yeah. There's no but no training or anything like that. Um so that company is operating at the status quo. The company that has any part of it AI enabled or or AI literacy is part of the culture, that company is at status quo plus. Plus what? I don't know, but they're not at status quo. Um so like that concept needs to land with people for sure. Because if you are curious or you've heard about it, but you don't really think it's gonna stick around, or it's just a fad, or whatever, whatever, I don't, I don't know what those stories are, but whatever that story is, I would tell you that um prepare for disruption in your your like your your reality at work because the guy next to you, the lady sitting across the the desk from you, whatever, if they're using AI, they're gonna be done with whatever the task was before you've you know cracked your knuckles to start typing. It really is that fast. So the chief AI officer role, I don't see it, um, I don't see it transforming, like it's first off, it's not a technical role, though at least our approach. There is a chief AI officer category of someone who is a data scientist or someone who has been PhD in machine learning or whatever. That's not the that's not the real impact for the companies that we address. Um, for a big multinational billion, multi-billion, sure, you need both, actually. You need that technical, because there's data to extract or insight to extract from your own, you know, housed data for sure. But um, there needs to be somebody that can translate usage into a customer service agent or a finance analyst or a human resource specialist. And that's not the same person. Our definition of a chief AI officer is it's a non-technical role. It's um somebody actually what they bring to the table is business experience, way more so than any kind of like, you know, they know how to fine-tune an LLM. And that individual, um, here's how I see that role changing. What and how that role is defined is the individual who understands business and under has had that aha moment about generative AI, and they've started putting them together. And they can walk into any department and they can say, okay, how do you do this? And that person's like, oh, you know what? They could be using this tool. Or, oh, they should here is exactly how I'm going to build the prompt to help them do that faster. Whatever that thing is, that person is the chief AI officer in our definition. It's non-technical business professional, understands gen AI, and can go into any environment and go, boom, use it here. Hey, try it this way and all that. The only thing I would say about the role would be that it might be getting easier for that chief AI officer simply because the technology continues to improve. Um any tool that we've used, I mean, we've been active power users of most of the, you know, category of AI generated or generative AI tool for uh going on two years now, they've changed. They've gotten better. The tool, uh a perfect example, if you're familiar, if you're listening to this and you're familiar with 11 Labs, it's a text to voice. I can type in a script, copy a script out of ChatGPT and paste it in there, and then I can select the voices. And one of those options is for me to have my own voice. And they had a what they call a pro version or a fine-tuned version. And I was early in, I set this thing up. I set it up about a year ago, probably. Um, no, maybe even longer than that. And it was good, but my my wife knew it wasn't me, right? She's like, that doesn't sound like you. I thought it did, and and somebody who didn't know me would think that it did. And then uh somebody that shares the co-working space with me said something about and I and I remembered, I was like, these things constantly improve. Let me go try it. I had just recorded a training. I took 20 minutes of that training, uploaded it into, and here's the difference a year ago or a year and a half ago, it was minimum two to three hours recommended dialog of me talking, and it was two to four weeks of synthesis before you got your. I think I got mine back in 18 days or something like that, right? 18 days. It's great, I was happy, but that's just the process. The other night, 20 minutes of audio and it said it can take up to two hours. I think I got it in 20 minutes, about the same time. And it that one, you cannot tell the difference. So um the tools are constantly changing, so it's not something uh and that's a big source of anxiety for a lot of people that you know come to our trainings or enroll in the program. Which tool do I use? Right? Because there's so many. Um, so may I share some advice on that? And that would be find one that works for you for the application, and don't worry about all the 50 million other tools that are out there that say they do the same thing or this one's better at this. Your the the tool that you select will be good enough for you. You're not a power user, or maybe you are a power user, but even so, it's good enough for you. And if whatever their competitor comes up with, the tool you're using will most likely have it in short order. That's just how fast these things are developing.
SPEAKER_01It's your parity. Everybody's gotta like rise, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. So that's how I define the role. If anything, it's gonna get easier just because the technology is getting better for that chief AI officer.
SPEAKER_01So let's take a down, you know, step from that. So we've got chief AI officers, obviously, that's the top of the org chart, you know, and we get a lot of people coming through our program that are CIO, you know, CMO, CFO, right? They're they're coming from a different leadership space and they're moving into that. Like, hey, I understand I've got a decade or two decades of experience in a vertical ed tech, med tech, you know, fintech, whatever it is. And they've got, you know, career advancement. They're at the top of the org chart already, but they're seeing around corners and they're looking for AI to like, you know, augment that career shift, or they want to go fractional, they want to change, you know, maybe leave corporate America and go be like a consultant of sorts. Um if we take it down from there, the way we're talking about data, right? You've got people who are maybe in a large you know enterprise organization, you might have a C AIO, and then you've got like the AI, you know, engineer kind of side of that. And there's a few people that report up to that person. But even further down, when you get to VP, director level, or even the IC individual contributors, what is you know, the what is the like AI literacy across the organizational chart and how is that changing and you know where that non-technical role kind of comes in?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I I don't I don't know that they would that it would be like more at the C level, less at the executive VP level, less at the VP. I don't think it's like that. I think you've got frontline users that could probably be, you know, sitting in my seat right now who because they got it. And I'm telling you, folks, if you haven't had that aha moment yet, once you do, you're like, oh, like what can I do now? Right. Um, and that that can happen with somebody tinkering, you know, on the weekend and they have that moment, they're like, oh, there's no way it can do this. Oh, I could use it for this. And then they just bam, bam, bam. And then they bring that with them to work. There are people at the highest tier of the business, the CEO level, that are scared to death of it, right? And there's also CEOs. I mean, Jeff Woods with his program covers exclusively CEO. So I but I don't know that that like a difference would be, let's say, business, business understanding, like MBA level stuff. At the highest level, high density of that knowledge. As you go down to middle management and below, it can it dilutes. There's not uh nearly as much or any at all. AI is so accessible, generative AI is so accessible that there is no four-year degree for me to be the MBA to understand business or two-year, you know, degree to get that. It's it's oh uh I've been I've been using it for you know a few days and I got it. Like, I mean you continue to get better, but like you can use it all day long effectively after, you know, I don't know, a couple of hours of of using it, maybe watching somebody do a training on that that thinking and like how to make that switch into thinking in AI.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and uh it's funny, like inside of our course as a you know product guy thinking about reverse engineering, like what's the most important pathway, right? Like we solve a problem, which is how do you develop a course that's all about AI, which I like to joke, the minute you press stop, it's almost obsolete. But how do you make this a course for non-technical business people who are leaders? And I think at every junction, whether you're you know, as individuals, depending on where they come from, they're walking through module one, module six, module eight. At some point they hit that C A I oh, and like the clouds part, you know, and it's like this moment. So I I feel like that's part of the journey that I want everybody to hit, and they'll all trip over that you know line at some point in the what's relevant to their existing experience of using AI and things of that nature. Um, across other industries, when we think about you know the different categories, is there a particular business industry that's better suited? You know, we get people that are from you know uh medical background fields or you know other areas, but is there industries that are more suited than than others when it comes to like early adoption of AI? Besides just the general laggards that you know like to kick and drag their way into technology.
SPEAKER_02You know, I would say that at the broadest level, knowledge work. So if you have a physical service business or a home service business, can you use it? Yeah, you can use it for creating communications with company and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But it's not something that you're hammering away at all day long as if as as it would be with a knowledge worker, right? So I'd start there. Um, I would say small teams or solopreneurs 100%, because um, yes, you still wear a lot of hats, a la the emyth from Michael Gerber talking about that. But um you're thinking that way. You're not necessarily having to do the thing. Like, for instance, with marketing, you want to come up with an email sequence. Well, and you also have to maybe take a look at uh the the finances and analyze those. Without generative AI and an understanding of how to use it and how to think in AI, you can do all those things, but they will take they'll take time. I have to sit, I have to think about what am I going to write. And I've written thousands of you know uh marketing emails and and it's a process. With this now that Same entrepreneur or small team can go to and say, Hey, I need um you know anything, any role. And it they're going to, it may not be like, here, bean, here's the answer wrapped in in a ribbon, but the person's not gonna have to spend as much time thinking about it if they do it all. We usually talk about uh an expectation for people of 1080-10 when they're using um Chat GPT or Claude or whatever. And that's the that's the first 10% is you as a human being able to type into the box the input what you want, the context, uh, if there's a role that you want it to evaluate it through, um extra instructions. When you're getting started, you don't know all that stuff. But after you've kind of watched enough trainings or or practiced enough or seen some articles about how to prompt, you understand that there's there's uh garbage in, garbage out. Uh uh accurate input results in accurate output. So that's the first 10%. That's you, that's a human, or you borrowing a prompt or something like that. We have 2,000 prompts available for for listeners. Reach out. Um and then you hit submit. The next 80% of the work, if your prompt was good on the front end, your instructions were good on the front end, 80% of the work gets done. The next 80%, leaving only the final 10%, 10, 80, 10. That final 10% is you reading the output. Is this good? Ah, you know what? I I should modify my prompt. That's not exactly what I was looking for, whatever. But it's not you sitting down with a blank sheet of paper and going, okay, I need to write an email. I need to write five emails, right? Or not sheet of paper or blank Google Doc or whatever. But it's um that would be a great place to start entrepreneurs, small teams. Um honestly, you know, CFO, the basics of analysis, but certainly ex asking the models, what am I not seeing? What are what are some trends that I should, you know, what are some threads I should pull on related to these numbers? It just again, it's cutting that time down. Marketing early users, Jarvis was, you know, early in. I think they might have been on like Chat GPT 3, uh, way before it wasn't even chat. I guess was it chat anyway, version three. Most of us didn't see it till 3.5 or 4. Um, so marketing for sure, uh, you know, honestly, doctors. Um, I was working with a group out of uh Harvard Medical School, and they were telling me all about how they don't call it artificial, they call it augmented intelligence in the medical field. But um, the suggestion was that at some point in the future, with the development of this technology, if a doctor doesn't consult an AI evaluation of their diagnosis of an individual, that they could be, as a second opinion, the doctor could be held liable for malpractice because AI is going to be, it's gonna catch the human error element. So um, I don't know that there is a role when you say, I'm customer service, easy. Um I am operations, easy. I am an HR easy. Like once you know how this is like a perfect example of a chief AI officer capabilities. Once you know business and you know what is possible with the tools, you can walk into any department and go, Hey, are you guys doing this? Well, let me save you an hour today, right? Are you guys doing this? Hey, you never have to do that again. Here's a custom GPT or an automation that was whatever. So I don't know that there is a role that's excluded. There might be some industries that were excluded, as I as I mentioned, like Yeah, yeah, I think like finance.
SPEAKER_01I mean, there's the the quantitative number crunching stuff that's you know, here it lends itself really well to the use of AI, but I think that there's a hesitancy to, you know, I know people in accounting, they tend to be like, well, we want to hang on to that, you know, three-year-old version, four-year-old version of QuickBooks for as long as we can. We're being dragged into the future. Yeah. Um, but I'm sure that there are people that are just gonna come in there on the finance side and you know, as long as they know they've got a walled garden that's safe from you know letting your data leak out, and that comes down to ethics, privacy, and then and the whole nine yards, which we cover in the course. What makes you know this program, the certificate, you know, to become a chief officer and the certificate program that we offer, what makes that different across the landscape of other AI training that you see?
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Easy answer. We've had many people come to our program who've done other, you know, AI certifications or whatever. And I hear some version of this. I learned a lot, but I didn't learn what to do. And our the way that we approach things is that I again, I can't just teach you the tools. That's great, but you it's that's not the that's not the whole, that's not both sides of the Oreo. The other half of that is something that we offer that people tell me they're not seeing in other programs, and that is like the okay, how do I actually do it? Okay, great. I'm gonna understand the tools, I'm gonna go into the business, then what? Well, you need to sit with the executive team and make sure that they're all, you know, that that they understand what's possible. So then they're not asking you to, you know, automate the entire business. It's not, it's not gonna happen. Um, then you, you know, then you forecast an ROI based on some information that you ask them. And then they they can kind of start to put some math together and go, okay, okay, is this work? Like we walk you through step by step, and then what do I do? I go find the uh find individuals within the company who are like, hey, I'm interested in in participating in any pilot projects or you know, helping to bring this into my department. You get those people assembled, you um get them all on the same page, you start training them. They become the like Jesus and the disciples. They're the ones that go or they're going back into their departments and saying, hey, try it this way. Hey, I just learned something at our AI council meeting or whatever. That like we walk them through all of those things. And it's stuff that you wouldn't it's it's not necessarily like uh innate to have thought about all that stuff, but that's what took us months of development and and was doing this and realizing, oh, if somebody's gonna do this job effectively, they need to plan to do this. And here's the slide that whatever.
SPEAKER_01And then in terms of like people they come to us, right, and they've taken MIT courses or you know, take any name brand off the shelf brand that everybody's knows for online training. How does how does this program sort of come across in that space where people, I've got some money, I want to figure out where am I gonna, you know, career level up. Do I put my you know, bet on this horse, or do I do it put my bet on that horse? And what's been our feedback, you know, from the customers that you talked to?
SPEAKER_02Well, I'll tell you, like, you know, everybody's heard of MIT. And if you show up with a certificate that says MIT, people are gonna go, oh, okay, right. They don't know anything about it, but they don't know if it's good or bad. They just know that MIT endorsed it or whatever. Um, but that program, I'm sure, and I'm sure it's fantastic. But that program is most programs think that you need to, we should at least cover what machine learning is and deep learning and neural networks and none of that stuff matters for uh uh a user, right? Like that's the architecture of what's going on behind the screen when I push enter. You don't need to, like, you're not gonna you knowing that isn't gonna impact the business one lick. They're not gonna say, hey, uh, does anybody what do we do about uh a neural network? You're not gonna go and roll up your sleeves and say, hold on, I've got the tools for that. That's not what this is about. Um, and I think that most executives that go through that, I I would want I would ask for my money back. Nothing against MIT, but that's not like so. I need to learn some intellectual, theoretical understanding of architecture of a uh generative, pre-trained transformer. No. I need to figure out okay, great. Here's a situation. We want to increase revenue by you know enriching our data. We want to uh make better hires by faster processing of resumes so that we're not, you know, people aren't getting placed before we get around. Like, you don't need to know anything about machine learning to know that. You just need to know how to go into the models. So the big difference is that ours is geared towards um somebody who is ready to get down to business. Like, let's use AI at work. And what we hear regularly, and this guys, this is the sign of a good training wherever you go, you know, start learning about AI, if it's a YouTube video, a TikTok, whatever, you're able to put it to work as soon as you learn it, right? Like, oh, this is easy. It's not, you're not gonna do anything with spending two hours going through a module on machine learning. It's not going to help you. Um, so you know, I think that that's probably one of the things that we hear the most is that I'm not through with the course, but I'm already using AI, right? Like, thank you. I'm already I'm getting the benefit. So that needs to be a hallmark of any any training that you're getting. Don't don't just sit there and watch a video just so that you can know more about how it's working. Maybe do that later if you have a deep interest. But to get results, like to start using AI at work, um, that is not going to help you. Make sure that that it's something that if I'm gonna sit here for 15 minutes, I can turn around and go use it tomorrow at work. If you're enjoying this episode and want to learn more about how to start using AI at work, we've made it easy for you. For just one dollar, you can have full access to the Chief AI Officer community, which will give you additional training, custom software, daily training calls on AI tools, using AI automations, getting more from your chat GPT sessions, and the business of being an AI consultant. Simply go to chiefaiofficer.com forward slash insiders to accelerate your AI journey. Now, back to the episode.
SPEAKER_01And we we hear that regularly from as the product guy who interviews customers who are going through the program, gonna get their caps down, graduating, you know, going out into the workforce. I get to hear them, and a lot of times I'll, you know, oh, I this isn't my first course in AI. Like I've been on this bandwagon for six months, or you know, I recently was laid off, you know, X company laid off 10,000 people. I was a part of that. I've gone in and I'm gone all in on AI. I went to this program and that program, the other program, and boy, do I feel smart at the end of that. Yeah. But I didn't really know what to do. Like once I got into your course, it was like, oh, now everything opened up. It's that C AI. Oh, shoot. Now I get how the rubber hits the road from the application of AI to the solving of an actual real business problem. I kind of think about it in regards to, and look, I got a background in programming from 20 years ago. Like I was, you know, behind the scenes on coding on some pretty cool projects in e-commerce when it was first getting started. But now it'd be like taking a leader and saying, oh, yeah, in order for you to hold your title in the executive suite, you must know, you know, PHP or Python or whatever like the language of coding is in the day. We're moving and one of the fastest growing areas because, well, who's the ones actually programming the machines? It's the programmers. Don't you think they're gonna scratch their own itch, right? Some of the best AI uses are actually tandem coding with AI. Like, hey, I don't have to write 20,000 lines of code today. Let's have AI help me do it, and I'm just gonna be checking it. It's gonna do all my bugs, et cetera. 1080 10. The new programming language of the future, especially where leadership is concerned, is that, you know, how do you get those good inputs? The 1080-10. You give it a good prompt, how do you look at that? And I like to think of the way we teach, like, you know, change the telescope from you're looking through the wrong end, like flip it around, right? Um, I think in the the case, I don't know if Jeff Woods uses this analogy, but it's like where if you think of AI as an assistant, a virtual assistant or whatever, even if you think of it as an executive assistant, that's gonna be the best you're ever gonna get from it. But if you think of it as like a coach for somebody who's at that executive level, dealing with boardrooms, dealing with you know multi-million or billion dollar decisions, you can get that kind of you know feedback and interaction with it. So great point. Um when we when we talk about like what's the ROI for a business that's gonna take the leap and either invest in training a CEIO, like a chief A officer of their own, send somebody to go get that title, you know, groom somebody from another role. Like we're gonna take our CIO and make him a C AIO, um, or for somebody who's investing in their own, like what does that ROI look like for a business to get on board with this new role?
SPEAKER_02So I don't know the size of the business of each of you that's listening to this, but I'm gonna give you some numbers that you can kind of use as a heuristic and ballpark the the your own ROI. What we normally tell clients when we're working with uh them on the service side of things is expect a positive impact of 10 to 40 percent on any KPI where we're able to introduce generative AI. So um you know, run the numbers on any any process in your own business and you can start to figure out what that ROI would be. There's a number of things to to factor into it. Um the first off, the cost is very low. For generative, like if I want to go use Watson or something from IBM and and use the analytical AI, that's not cheap. For me to go and sign up for Perplexity and Chat GPT is 50 bucks a month. And I'm like I'm covered. Um, so the ROI would be immense. If you had if you were able to get a 10% improvement on one process that saved uh, you know, an executive one hour a week and they make better decisions in the process from using the tool, but the ROI is already immense, right? So the impact is the impact should be measured. What if we did 10 to 40? What if we say we were able to do 10 to 40 percent improvement across every department in the company? And then like take a look at the payroll, take a look at how much more sales output would happen, would be happening, how many more, you know, all like all that stuff, better hires. It would just improve the business. Um it's not it's and it's not like uh oh, I thought this house was blue, now it's yellow. It's not some major change like that. It's all of a sudden uh uh drag is being removed, friction is being removed from the operation of the business, and things move faster, and you don't have to wait as long for that report. And hey, that's actually a pretty good idea. Where'd you come up with that? Oh, I use Chat GP. Like everywhere around the business drag is being removed from the the business vehicle. So it's not just about the money. I mean, there's certainly creating more money is is an an obvious output or result from this effort, but it's also creating more time. And one thing that gets often overlooked is creating more enjoyment. The way that we teach stuff, we do a uh a training uh the two-day challenge, and in there we help people identify like I don't know where to use it, right? That's why we did this podcast, not this particular episode, but that's why I launched the podcast. People like I'd love to, but how do I use it? Right, and using AI at work. Um we show them how to start to figure out where am I going to use AI now that I know this stuff, this is great. I just learned a whole bunch. Where am I going to use AI? And we have them start to list out um the things that are required for their role and that sort of thing. And then we we show them where to start. Okay, this one low-hanging fruit, let's make sure, blah, blah, blah. Here's the solution, right? So when when an individual does that, they're usually starting with things that either require a lot of time or they they don't like doing them, right? But it's I gotta do this. I right. So if I take that off an employee's plate or take it off a department's deliverable, all of a sudden people are like, hey, like that's cool. I don't have to do that anymore, or man, that just saved me a bunch of time and I didn't like doing it. So it does create more enjoyment as well. And you got happy people who are learning how to use AI in their role. They have that aha moment, they understand how valuable that skill is. Like, I'm gonna stick around. If these guys are supporting my, you know, they let me use AI with no issues. Heck, they teach me about it. This is a good job. And I got AI doing the crap work, like I'm happy. I'm gonna stick around. So that's my thoughts.
SPEAKER_01So let's take the position of a listener for a second. So I've been, I stumbled across this or somebody recommended the podcast to me. You know, I just typed in AI into iTunes and happened to think that the cover art was interesting enough to press play. Now I'm, you know, 10 episodes deep here, and I'm kind of thinking about, okay, I I like where you're going as an interviewer. I love the questions you ask. I love the fact that we're covering experts, you know, both on the tools SaaS side of the market as well as in the business use case, the consulting. For someone who's actually interested in, you know, venturing out and making a career lateral move or a career upward move, or even just breaking out as a consultant, what's the next step to becoming a certified sort of chief A officer? Like how do they begin this and what's the best way they can kind of get started?
SPEAKER_02So look, if you went and locked yourself in a cabin with YouTube and and the internet for 30 days, could you learn a lot about AI? Yes. You could maybe learn as much as I know or you know. Um yes. But when you showed up, companies are they're they're interested, but they're not gonna jump in with both feet. They want to make sure that they are not gonna screw things up or AI is gonna steal our data, whatever their concerns are, right? And it's just the way it's the way of the world. That's why people put letters after their name, MBA, PhD, MD, whatever, right? If you don't have some sort of a credential that said, hey, some certifying body evaluated my skills to the degree that I am I'm worthy to receive this uh, you know, uh credential. Companies are going to be doesn't mean they won't hire the TikTok YouTube uh person. Um but I would imagine that all things being equal, this one has the the degree, this one doesn't. Hmm. It's it's a safer bet to engage with the resource that has uh gone through some sort of a testing or evaluation environment as compared to somebody who just learned it on their own. Doesn't mean that person's not as good. Um, so my advice would be uh do both. Do the YouTube stuff on your own, like continue to study this stuff, listen to podcasts, blah, blah, blah. But also if you want to leverage this into a career boost, or uh maybe you start taking on some clients on the side, or you start doing some whatever. I mean, what they pay these AI experts and businesses is crazy. But um I would find a a way to get some sort of a a badge, uh, I mean, ideally, a legit certification, but but something is better than nothing, I would say.
SPEAKER_01So and and I know that one of the roadmaps that we have out there, because we we've been doing these challenges for the better part of all of last year, 2024. I think we did 11 months out of 12. Um, and we just finished last week doing our 13th one. You know, we're slated for coming up on on 14 in February. So uh the challenge, we started it as a three-day right uh challenge. And the idea, you know, we took the podcast name, using AI at work, and we kind of made it the you know, how using AI at work challenge. It's like, how do you actually use this stuff? Okay, it's nice to see that you know, that candy out there, and somebody can whiz bang, you know, oh wow, look at this new thing that just dropped, you know, uh 4-0 mini or whatever. Like you kind of get the the Sora of Halo effect. Oh, look at what AI can do. Oh, wait, it only does it for five seconds of a video clip. But how do you actually make practical use of this? So that was kind of the idea behind the podcast, as well as the idea behind what we do with the challenge. What are, you know, what when somebody goes to a challenge, like how how do you even go to a challenge? If somebody has never even stepped onto our website before, what's the the roadmap and what does that look like? Uh, what do they learn through the process?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I'll tell you the thing that I and sure, like it's my podcast. I want you to buy my product or whatever. That's that's not what this is about because the challenge is free. Um the thing that I like the most about it and that we get the feedback the most about is that there's a structure to it. It's not just a bunch of information, it's like a sequential from uh an understanding of generative AI into hey, let's move straight into a situation that you'd be at at work, and here's the tools to use for it, and here's where to go, like go sign up for the free accounts of and start practicing with it. Okay, then you know, great. Now that I know I I'm not scared of these tools anymore and I got uh my own little toolkit of AI tools, where else can I use them? Right. And then like showing them how to find those things, and then, you know, I'm well, I'm concerned that. I'm getting all this productivity game, but I don't really the our company doesn't have a policy in place, right? So how to talk to the boss and show that, like, demonstrate, watch this. This is why we need AI with with usage policies and training, of course, but like how to do all of that stuff so that by the end of this using AI at work challenge, you don't only know what tools to use, you know where to use it in your role, and you know how to, I guess we'll call it change management, how to facilitate the conversations with the team or the boss about like this, it's cool, it's cool that we use AI. This is why. Let me show you. Um, and you know, by the end of that, I'm I'm not I'm not pulling this out of the air. Um, it's the first time we've had this happen, but on the last one, we opened up the Q ⁇ A and we were talking to people, and we had two separate people say that listen, I've been doing a lot of trainings uh over the past two years. Um, and this is the best one that I've seen. Now that like we've we do a good job. We know our stuff, there's no question. Um, but I'm not I don't have time to go watch other people's trainings and see how like, and honestly, I don't care. I know that like we're focused on our way of doing things, but it was uh certainly an endorsement, not to hear it from one, but from two people on the same day that um that that was like this is high quality training. So regardless, and listen, we have people that are already chief AI officers, they've gone through our certification program, they're out there working with clients, and they come back to the challenges every month or every week, or however often you you find yourself in the situation to attend one of our challenges. Um, so it's not like, and we've done a good job, like beginners, because we ask at the beginning on a scale of one to ten, put in the comments, where are you at with AI? You a one, that means I'm I don't know much, I'm glad I'm here, or a 10. Hey, Chris, get out of the way. I'm gonna teach this thing. And we get we don't get tens very often, um, but we get somewhere between, I would say, seven and two. And all across that spectrum, people are having the same feedback, which was, oh my gosh, I learned so much. Um like we don't, we're not like, oh, and behind this wall, if you jump through this hoop, you get to see what's really happening. We don't, there's no teasers in here. It's all like look, if you can make it for 30 minutes, you walk away. That's the way AI is. You walk away, like that's something I can use. Sorry, guys, had the jet. Um it's an hour each day, so it's very bite-size, and there's homework. And the homework is people tell me it's fun because it's you just learned, you watch me demonstrate, hey, I'd use that tool for this, and then I'd take that to do that. And the homework is every tool that you just saw me use, they're all free. They don't have free versions. Go sign up for an account. That's the homework. And then what happens is people get in there and they say, Oh, I'm gonna try what Chris did on the on the challenge. And they're like, Oh my gosh, it worked. So people come back day two, super jazz, like, like, guys, I got it. Like, I I I can do I can do AI or whatever, right? Um, and it's like that both days. So I would tell people to um you're gonna have a lot of training options. Try us out. Look, 100% money back guarantee. It's free, right? But um, like based on that feedback, based on what you've heard on this, I think that you can kind of understand that hey, they know what they're talking about. Um, it seems accessible the way that they're talking about it. They're not talking about, you know, um, om OmniThink framework was just released by a Chinese agent, you know, like I mean, I'm looking at OmniThink articles, but we're not gonna talk about that stuff. Um and because it's free, we often encourage people like if there's other people on your team that either are interested or you know they're already into AI or they don't know anything about it, oops, um invite them. And that's the cool thing about it is that because it's free, like we don't care.
SPEAKER_01Like, bring your bring your spouse, bring your bring your team. We actually have chief officers that come in, they'll graduate, they'll be like, I went through the challenge, I you know, signed up for the program. I'm now graduated and I I've been like blown out of my mind. I now see things, I'm almost like looking in ones and zeros at business problems. And gosh, do I need to go bring like four of my team members? So that it may maybe I am never intending on being a chief officer because I'm like the owner of my 30-person company, right? But it's like I don't want to be the only guy who knows this stuff. I need my lieutenant, my right arm, you know, my left arm. They all have to know this stuff. Uh, we've seen people come through and bring their entire department just to go, hey, just all they need to do is go through that training and it's just gonna unlock new capabilities. I think that the differentiator, like if you go to AI summits or you know, AI events and you hear people talking, generally speaking, there's always gonna be at least one of more or multiple talks where they're gonna go into like the the shiny tools talk, like, okay, here's a cool tool, and it's like boom, tool, tool, tool, tool. And it it's it's amazing when you can hear you know about new tools, especially if you've not played with one. Like if I go to one of these tool talks and they drop, you know, 10 to 30 tools, I'll probably, you know, have tried 90% of them, but it's that one extra tool that I've never heard of that's like, yeah, oh cool, let me go play with that. But on the whole, I think the difference that we do and why people say, Oh, I've been to two years worth of this stuff, but now it's finally clicking. It's we're we're doing that extra legwork for you to think, and this is another thing we do with smart cuts, which we don't really have time to get into, but it's this idea of like marrying here's an actual business problem. Yeah, and here's how I use tool A and I linked it to tool B and did something else to tool C and the whole you know architecture of what could happen in a 10 or 15 minute experience using three or four different tools. Um, that's kind of a difference maker as opposed to, well, you know, there's voice, there's video, there's audio, there's text to speech, speech to text, you know, but how do I get all this stuff to work with the real space?
SPEAKER_02Well, that's a good point. Those those talks are fun because it's like it can do that, it can do that. But like, okay, well, how am I going to use it? Right. And that's that's the big difference. Yeah, like we walk through business use cases. Like, here's something everybody does. Here's the tools that I would use in that situation. Oh, I can do that too.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. So uh obviously, anybody that's listening, you can you know drop into the show notes, there'll be a link to how to get to the challenge. Yeah. If you are driving and you can just remember our brand, chiefaiofficer.com forward slash challenge. That'll take you to a page where you can enroll and register. Um, we do them pretty regularly. Outside of that, can you share, like maybe if anything comes to mind in the last year of graduates, like some success stories, you know, something that comes to mind that's like, what are people that are kind of coming off the conveyor belt, wearing their capstone graduation and going out into the workforce? Like, what are some of those success stories we're hearing that jump out for you?
SPEAKER_02So I'll start with uh something that's just basic. I routinely, because we're, you know, we are in communication with all the candidates and the graduates and all that stuff. And I'll check in with them. And I I've heard this a numerous times from again, not like you know, 24-year-old startup kid grinding it out under the desk, but seasoned business people with families and obligations. They're like, man, I've been at it for 13 hours today. I'm like, what? They said uh time has flown by. They're like uh it's like they they found a a toy that they had lost. They're just like enthused. And I I think that that's one one benefit that that's a success story that you get reinvigorated about your work, right? You're like all that stuff that's been loose ends in the back of my mind. Ah, let me prompt the solution for that. Oh, let me get the answer for that. Bing, bing, bing, bing, right? Um crush the back. Right? We all of us do. Um a success story um that I think is probably one that that is very inspirational because it's very universal. Um early in uh one of our first uh participants in the certification program had a background in more like the the design side of business. I'd worked in you know big companies, Fortune 500 stuff, but not in any type of strategic or anything like that. Just I'd done a uh, you know, they were a more creative type, let's say. So I get a call or text me, hey Chris, I've got an interview tomorrow.
SPEAKER_01Can I just after he's already graduated?
SPEAKER_02He's already graduated, yeah. Yeah, um, sure, yeah. Oh, so we got on the phone. He told me who the company was. It's a company that does $34 billion a year. They're big name. If I mentioned it, you'd know the company. Said, I've got an interview tomorrow as their AI strategist. I was like, dang, okay, good job. Um, so we talked through kind of, I was like, I'd focus on these things, uh, you know, blah, blah, blah. Said, man, call me back after that. That's exciting. Um, like the next day, he calls me back. I said, How'd it go? He said, Um, man, I got there, got checked in. Uh, they gave me directions to, I went to the office, I opened the door, and there's 14 people staring at me. 14 people sitting around, you know, a big boardroom table. They'd obviously been doing something else, but like they knew I was coming to talk about AI. I was like, oof, like that's a tough crowd. And he said, two of them were the AI experts that they had, you know, they were contracting or consulting the consultants from one of the big firms, Deloitte or Accenture or something. And I was like, okay, how'd it go? He said, the interview lasted about an hour, and they asked me a ton of questions. They said, by the end of that hour, there was no question in the room who the AI expert was, and it was not the consultant. So I was like, and this is a guy like what had never been a programmer, had never uh, I don't even know that he had really messed around with anything other than Chat GPT a little bit before he enrolled in the program. And now he sits as the, I don't know if it's the AI strategist, but but an a strategic AI leader within this huge company, and he didn't know anything about AI. Now, maybe, you know, he probably watched the YouTube videos on the weekends or whatever, but our course set him up and the certification gave him the credential to go and have that meeting. And like, I'm I don't I I wasn't there. I don't know if he put the consultants to shame or anything, but it was obvious that he knew more about AI and its application in their business than the high-priced consultants did. So I mean, that's a uh what what is he making? I don't know, but I would imagine if you're first off, people that know AI, like Forbes came out with an article, actually interviewed somebody that's on our board, um, interviewed a bunch of like, okay, I see these people out here that are uh putting out content on LinkedIn or whatever, like and um the lady from Forbes reached out to him and said, What does an AI consultant make? And I think that one person was charging 530 bucks an hour to do basically what we do in the challenge, honestly. Like, like it explain the basics to individuals or teams. Um, another person was charging $2,000 for a two-hour Zoom training that they would do. And you may be listening to this and you're like, damn, that's a lot of money for two hours. Yeah, $1,000 an hour is a lot of money. However, that's the going, like they don't trust it if, hey, I'll do it for a hundred bucks. Like businesses, they don't, they like that would make them nervous, even if you knew the stuff. Again, that credential, right? Uh, another one would do uh one-day hackathons. And a hackathon to us and to him is go into a company, kind of do a little training at the beginning of the day, um, kind of do what we do in the challenge, say, here's some applications of tools in different departments. And then, I mean, I guess it's kind of what we do with the challenge. Get them to identify some opportunities that they think, now that you understand it and you know what the tools can do, where do you think you could use it? Well, I think we could use it for this. And then the people actually start working on the tools and solving the problems in the room. That's what they call a hackathon. $8,000 for a day. Another uh Rachel, I mentioned her earlier. She and I and Kurt Malley co-host uh an AI founders meetup in Austin every month. Uh, Rachel does AI services for agencies uh at $10,000 per month per client and has, you know, because she's using AI, a lot of bandwidth. Um, so she's got you know numerous clients at $10,000 a month. And then uh Ashley Gross, who is friend of the family here at Chief AI officer, uh, actually gets paid $175,000 for each project that she does, and she can simultaneously manage two or three of these with, I think her team consists of her and one other person. Now she's working with you know huge companies. I'm not saying that that's gonna happen for everybody, but with those, with that information, like you should understand that I mean we there's so much more we could go into about the here's all the data showing the demand and the gap and you know, leadership. If you were to go behind closed doors or meet them at the 19th hole at the country club, and AI comes up, they're gonna go, don't even talk about it, right? Like they don't have an answer for that. Um and they're looking, like, and they're like, we don't know what to do. But you show up, you've got certification, you school the consultants that are in front of them, and all of a sudden you're you know, an unknown, like here's the AI guy, right? So um I I I would suggest that anybody listening to this would uh expect to see uh increase in income for sure. Is that $8,000 a day if you run one of those hackathons? Hell yeah, it is. Um but regardless, you're producing more, you're producing it faster, and you're producing at a better quality than you would without AI, and that gets noticed. That gets the attention of your boss, your boss's boss, your teammates. Hey, Chris, can you show me how to do this? Hey, Chris, and then that chatter starts going, hey, we got somebody that knows AI. Who who knows AI any, right? Like all of it, oh, it's him, it's him, it's him, right? They keep pointing at me, right? Like that is uh a good place to be in a business, a corporate environment, uh a team environment, anything like that. That's a good place to be. So um I can tell everybody to expect at least that.
SPEAKER_01So as we wrap down, you know, the the rest of this, let me just ask, we've been doing this for a year with the podcast. What's one of the most surprising insights you've gained about AI in business through you know 50 odd episodes?
SPEAKER_02Um, you probably think that you're behind right now. If you're listening to this, you probably think, oh man, like I'm not that good at it. You're better than most. The fact that you are investing the 45 minutes hour, whatever this is, into finding out more about AI. Other most people most people aren't doing this. The fact that you wherever you were and you found this, like AI was on your mind. Um, so is that my insight? Is that my like surprising to me? No, but to you, it might be. Who's listening to this? It might be.
SPEAKER_01You might think um like that that you're just yeah, like you are in it.
SPEAKER_02You are like you've already started. And what I would tell you is you can learn even more. So and once you have that aha moment and you start using it, you're kind of like, this is fun. Like, oh, I wonder if I could do that. Wow, and you kind of feel like a badass because you just like you're doing more, you're doing it better, and you're doing it faster. And it's kind of fun.
SPEAKER_01Here would be my pro tip for anybody. I know there's a time and a journey, like in your AI journey, like at the beginning of my explorative AI, and I it feels long, long back, like, but in the age of era of AI, it goes quickly. And I remember like, man, shh, this is like a superpower. Yeah, nobody can know that I know this, and man, I'll just be able to crank out and I'll be like working the half as much and I could do all these things. But I let me just tell you, as a person who wants to go and elevate your career, you need to quickly move past that and actually go and shout from the tops of mountains. Tell everybody, hey, I just took we like when you go through the two, uh, we do either a two or a three-day challenge. When you go through that, we tell people, like, here's your certificate, go put it on your LinkedIn, go announce this stuff. Tell people around the office, hey, I just did this workshop. You know, I'm, you know, show them that you are that person because if you're silently trying to like get an advantage here, it's gonna be, you know, in no time, everybody else is gonna be at parity with your knowledge. And you had that opportunity to get a lane ahead. It's like the old outrace or out chase the bear, like, hey, Dave, what are you doing? I'm tying my shoes. What are you doing that for? The bear's barreling down the hill. I just gotta outrun you. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02I'm not gonna outrun the bear just to outrun you. Um, I think that's a great point. Uh the I mean, you want to be, you want people to be like, oh, he knows AI. Like, like it's not something you want to hide. Like you want on every level with your teammates, you get elevated. Like, oh, that's the AI person, right? With the boss, you get noticed. With clients, like, oh, this is impressive. Oh, yeah, I use AI, right? With vendors, you know, like this negotiation is rather strong, Chris. Where that like, yeah, I used AI. Like you want people knowing you're using AI, and and you start to, you're no longer a sheep in the herd. You're the you're that one, you're the outlier, right? You're the one who knows it. I'm telling you, look around your office next time you go in or join a Zoom and say, how many people on this Zoom that I know that I work with are like into AI?
unknownRight?
SPEAKER_02Maybe they're using a tool like everybody's got co-pilot if you're in a Microsoft environment or whatever, but not the way, not not thinking in AI. They're using a tool, they're not thinking in AI. That's a big difference.
SPEAKER_01So fabulous. Well, this was fun. Let's do this again. I've got another army of questions that are in my AI army, 10 fingers, let's go podcast episode. You know, we'll do it before another 100 episodes.
SPEAKER_02Well, thanks for taking time out of the day to do this. I know we're all very busy. Um, so everybody listen, listen uh the challenge, uh, chiefaiofficer.com forward slash challenge. It's free. No, no gimmicks. And I mean, honestly, it's more than free because we end up giving you uh our prompt vault software on day one, and on day two, we have uh what, smart cuts and prompt packs. Unannounced goodies, unannounced goodies, like and the stuff that we're giving away, uh we just haven't had time to figure out how to sell it. Like it's it's good quality stuff, right? It's we routinely have people um you use it and get the results that we expect from it. So it's not just like, hey, I gave you a PDF of a bunch of ideas or something, it's it's actual things that you're able to use in your work um for free that we just give you for uh for showing up. People tell us too much, they tell us all the time, too generous. Hey, too generous.
SPEAKER_01Speaking of generous, if you if you don't know, head down to the show notes because in every episode, whether it's this one or episode 28 or 32 or you know, all the way through, there's actually something called a smart cut that's related to all the episodes that we cover. I don't know what the team's gonna cook up for this episode. We'll give them the challenge, wink wink. Uh but I would say if you wanted to go back into the the books and listen to some of our earlier episodes in the last year, you can certainly get some uh some good knowledge about how to like use some of the tools that are out there.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, please do that because I think that you'll see like, oh, they weren't kidding. This is valuable. Okay, great. Awesome. Everybody, if you're listening to this while you're driving, drive safe, walking, walk safe, um, whatever you're doing. We'll see you on the next episode, and hopefully we'll see you on the next challenge. Thank you so much, Segovia. Cheers. Thanks for tuning in to using AI at work. Don't forget to subscribe for more conversations about how to use AI at work. And a special thank you to our sponsor, Chief AI Officer, for empowering businesses with AI education and training. Visit their website for free AI readiness assessment and AI strategy guide to help you get started using AI at work. That's www.chiefaiofficer.com. Thanks to our producer, Evan Sonier, for making this episode possible. Follow us on Twitter at handleusingAI at work. And visit www.usingai at work.com for free resources to help you harness AI in your role.