Moving The World Forward For 125 Years

Welcome to Standards Impact, the official podcast of ASTM International. On this exciting first episode, host and Editor in Chief of ASTM’s flagship publication, Standardization News, Dave Walsh, is joined by none other than ASTM International’s President, Kathie Morgan. Kathie has been a leader in the standards development community for nearly 40 years and she joins Dave to talk all about the amazing and impactful world of standards, the history of ASTM, the impact the organization has had, and what the future holds, as well as the very special anniversary we’re currently celebrating in 2023. Then later, Content Editor for Standardization News, JP Ervin, joins the show for a special Standards Spotlight segment to highlight The Standard Specification for Carbon Steel Tee Rails, a standard that is close to the heart of ASTM International.  So press play and get ready for a fascinating inside view into some of the most exciting industries and the standards that are moving them forward, this is 
Standards Impact presented by ASTM International.

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Transcript

Voiceover (00:06):

Standards are everywhere from the floor beneath your feet, to the aircraft above your head. This is standards impact presented by ASTM International.

Dave Walsh (00:17):

Welcome to Standards Impact, the official podcast of ASTM International. I'm your host, Dave Walsh, editor in chief of ASTMs flagship publication Standardization News. Today we're joined by ASTMs president Kathy Morgan. Kathy has been a leader in the standards development community for nearly 40 years. She's with us now to discuss not only the world of standards in general, but also to talk about a very special anniversary ASTM is currently celebrating here in 2023. So let's start at the beginning. What is a standard and why are they so important?

Kathie Morgan (00:50):

Well, Dave, that's a good question. I like this one. So a standard is an agreed upon approach, an agreed upon set of requirements, an agreed upon process or way of doing a certain task. And by agreed upon, I mean, you bring together all of the interest groups that have expertise in that particular material, that particular process, that particular practice. You bring them together, you work through a process that encourages technical discussion, that resolves technical debate, and you reach an agreed upon content that is a standard, whether it's a standard specification, which is a requirements document, a standard test method, which is a way to measure some particular property standard practice, which is a procedure for doing something, A standard guide, which is a document that has more flexibility and presents a series of options. So there's a variety of types of standards, but the key to a standard is that there's a process.

(02:10):

There's a group of stakeholders that have expertise on the content of the document, and that process is then worked with those stakeholders until you meet all of the requirements in the document can be published as a standard. Why they're important is because standards are conduits to a lot of different things. They're documents between buyers and sellers. They provide entrance to marketplaces so that trade can happen between countries. They ensure the safety, the reliability that products and technologies perform as they're intended to perform. So it really does level the field standards, ensure expectations are met, standards can promote consumer confidence and standards are just all around impacting the products that we use, the homes that we live in, the buildings that we work in. They're there supporting all of the elements of the materials and the environment. So they're just critical to making sure that our infrastructure and the ecosystem that we live in and work in is functioning properly.

Dave Walsh (03:33):

And having worked in the standards development community for some time, I know that standards often emerge from a crisis or even a tragedy. And that's true for A STM as well, I believe the first standard A STM produced and sort of ASTMs reason for being came from unsafe conditions in the railway industries.

Kathie Morgan (03:53):

Yes, that's absolutely correct. A STM was founded as the American Society for Testing and Materials. It was back in 1898, so we're proudly celebrating 125 years this year. And the organization was founded by a man, his name was Charles Dudley. He was a chemist with the Pennsylvania Railroad. And just as you indicated, there were quality control issues in the steel industry, in the railroad industry in particular. And the very first standard that was published by the American Society for Testing and Materials at the time was standard A one, which was a material specification for steel T rails. And interestingly enough, that standard is still relevant to the marketplace today. So it was our first standard, and it's withstood the test of time, and it's still published as an active standard and used to support quality for the railroads.

Dave Walsh (05:00):

That kind of leads into another part of this discussion, which is that A STM International is celebrating its 125th anniversary this year, as you mentioned. And maybe you could tell us a little bit about how A STM began as an organization and how it did evolve into what it is today.

Kathie Morgan (05:15):

ASTMs roots began in the steel industry and in the metal industry. It's expanded from Ferris metals to non Ferris metals and then into cement and concrete type of materials. And probably the first several decades of ASTMs existence, we were known as a material society. We were founded as the American Society for Testing and Materials, and that's what A STM was known for. Its material specifications and the test methods that it had to evaluate the properties of those materials. Then as time went on and decades progressed, there was a population explosion. We saw tremendous growth in the cities and in the rural areas, and A STM responded with launching new committees in the construction sector. We launched a committee on the performance of buildings and assisted with our growing cities and urbanization. And then as time evolves, other issues come to the forefront. We had a consumer movement in the 1970s, the Consumer Product Safety Commission was formed, and at their request, A STM launched another new committee on the safety of consumer products.

(06:39):

The environment was highly visible. Not long after that, there was tremendous concern about how we can better protect our environment. And you saw A STM committees birthed on soil and rock, on air and water quality on environmental assessment. So I think what A STM found as these decades continued on and A STM evolved as an organization, we found that A STM had something very special and something very elastic. It was a process, it was an infrastructure. We had a staff and resources to help industries find standard solutions. And that process, those resources, they were extendable to any situation that could benefit from a standard solution, any industry that could benefit from a standard solution. So A STM continued to evolve. It continued to attract new industries, even the traditional industries that were advancing their materials and advancing their technology, had new work to do in A STM and the organization just continued to grow.

(07:58):

And that's where we find ourselves today, still welcoming new industries to the organization and trying to help the more traditional areas of steel and cement and concrete and plastics as they advance and accelerate changes in their industry. So I suspect that Charles Dudley may have never envisioned that his concept for bringing stakeholders together to address the quality of steel rails, he may not have thought that we would bring similar stakeholders together and develop standards that would send individuals into space. But in fact, that's what A STM is doing 125 years later. So it's been an evolution to respond to market needs using the exact same process and infrastructure that Dr. Dudley envisioned to solve his quality problem in the steel industry 125 years ago.

Dave Walsh (09:07):

Well, and I think it's interesting you just kind of sketched out a rough timeline. You started with the steel industry and you moved into the thirties, and then you mentioned consumer issues in the seventies, and you kind of touched on a modern issue, but I wonder what areas do you think have the greatest need for standards right now? Where do you think is the next big area where standards will help things work better and be safer?

Kathie Morgan (09:27):

Well, we have almost 150 technical committees working in 90 different industry sectors, and they're all pursuing standardization objectives that are pertinent to their industries and important to their industry. I think the one thing that's unique about A STM is that our technical experts are all volunteers. So for a standard to be developed, it has market relevance because the broad industry of stakeholders needs to come together in A STM to work on that standard. So the one thing that I find really fascinating about A STM is that all of our work has relevance because it simply isn't going to get done if it isn't relevant to some segment of the marketplace. With that said, some of the larger areas that we have been working on recently are some of the emerging technology areas that are coming about. We began our work in additive manufacturing back in 2009, and it has just grown in leaps and bounds ever since then.

(10:43):

What started as 3D printing has now expanded to a broad range of advanced manufacturing technologies, including exoskeletons and different unmanned space systems. And what else? We have cybersecurity, we have automation, we have robotics. We have a lot of these new technologies under the umbrella of advanced manufacturing that are almost horizontal in nature. They're impacting almost all of our technical committees in a very horizontal way. So they have broad applicability, and there's just a lot of great work going on in A STM in those areas. So I would say those are the newest to be a part of the A STM portfolio, but it's exciting to see all the new areas that are happening in some of our more traditional committees as well.

Dave Walsh (11:43):

Well, I think you also touched on something that's important to A STM and maybe even unique, which is ATM specific standards development process. And I know it's on consensus, and maybe you could talk a little bit about what that means, because I think a lot of people think the standards of development process is sort of like a star chamber. They picture people in a secret room somewhere coming up with these lengthy documents, but that's really not the case.

Kathie Morgan (12:08):

No, it's really not. The A STM process is proven, and I say that because through 125 years, the basic pillars of that process have not changed. Our process is open. By open, we mean anybody can participate in the development of an A STM standard if they have an interest. And we believe that every person brings a unique lens to the standards development process. So every person's unique, every view is important and every view needs to be considered. So it truly is open. There truly is direct engagement by individuals, whether it's a mom who's interested in toy safety for her children or a representative of Boeing, a large Fortune 500 company, they both have access to the A STM process and they have the right to participate and have their comments heard within the standards development process. So that really is empowering to everyone that participates in A STM.

(13:24):

So our committees are organized, as I said, mainly by industry sector, and our main committees are divided into smaller groups called subcommittees that have more narrow areas of technical focus. And the standards development process is all electronic now, which makes it wonderful and very inclusive. And standards are developed. They're sent out for ballot, they're open for a month at a time. So people have the ability to spend some time with the standards that are being developed, submit their feedback, have it considered by the technical committee. And I think the most interesting part of the process is when negative votes come in on the standards and those are considered many, many, many times, the input is accepted, the document is strengthened, and as I said before, all these lenses that come and participate really contribute to a sound technically credible standard at the end of our process. Alright,

Dave Walsh (14:30):

Well, we should shift gears a little bit because this podcast is as much about you as A STM. You've been with A STM since the 1980s, 1984, I believe. How did you personally get involved with standards in general and with A STM specifically?

Kathie Morgan (14:45):

Well, it's a bit of an interesting story, Dave, and I will say the satisfaction of me finding A STM was like I would compare it to when you're doing a jigsaw puzzle. And that last piece, you finally put that last piece into the puzzle, this satisfaction that you feel that, yeah, that's a beautiful thing that's been created. Finding ATM was like that for me because when I was contemplating college, we have to go back a few years. When I was contemplating college, I had a broad array of interests. I really couldn't decide in going to college whether I wanted to study psychology, perhaps all the crime shows I watched, I had an interest in forensics, I thought I could teach, and medicine was another thing that just drew me in and all of these things I couldn't decide. And in fact, I thought it was quite unfair that you had to choose.

(15:45):

One particular major went into college. So my guidance counselor at the time, as I'm sure most of them do, took a look at my academic record and said, Kathy, you have a great affinity for math and science. If you were a female engineer in 1984, if that's what you were to graduate college from, the world would be open to you because there just aren't that many female engineers right now. And so I thought, okay, maybe engineering's it. And I found a small school in Easton, Pennsylvania called Lafayette College. They were known for their engineering curriculum. I went to Lafayette for four years, had a wonderful experience there. But apparently there were a lot of guidance counselors providing the same advice to young women like me back in 1980, because when I graduated in 1984, chemical engineers were a dime a dozen and there was quite a few females.

(16:46):

And I began to wonder again, if I had done the right thing going through an engineering path, it took me all summer to find a job. And when I finally found that puzzle piece on the floor and put it in the puzzle and came to A STM in September of 1984, it was just like the perfect fit for me. I had answered a one ad because that's how you found a job back in 1984. I answered a one ad that was looking for a person with a technical background to manage technical committees for a leading standards organization located in downtown Philadelphia where A STM was at the time on Race Street. And I knew nothing about standards. I hadn't learned anything about standards in my chemical engineering curriculum. So when I interviewed, I actually had the chance to interview with my predecessor, Jim Thomas, who was president of ATM for 25 years.

(17:46):

And he couldn't understand, he must have asked me 10 times, why don't you want to be an engineer? You won't be an engineer here. You're going to work with technical people, but you're not going to be an engineer. And I said, I think that's fine. I have a really broad interest in a lot of things. I didn't necessarily want to be pigeonholed into engineering. And I got home slightly distressed because I really didn't think I had convinced him of my desire to do something different from engineering per se. But I was so pleased to get that phone call. And now I've spent 38 wonderful years doing what I think I yearned for back in high school. And that's being with a lot of different industries. The common thread is standards, but I can dabble in any of 90 industry sectors on any given day, and it's really just supported my lifelong love of learning and seeing what's happening in different industry sectors and what's new and how standards can help all of these different sectors improve and help our world. So it's been a great journey.

Dave Walsh (19:01):

Alright. Well, we've been talking about the beginning of your career, Kathy, and how you found your way to a CM. And you mentioned starting off in 1984, and just out of curiosity, it must have been such a different time in not just the business world, but the standards development world. How have things changed since then? I mean, I hear stories about how collegial A STM has always been, and what were your impressions over the years?

Kathie Morgan (19:27):

Oh, A STM has always been an amazing community of people. It's staff, it's members, and it's board. All of our policy committees, our customers. I think absolutely the best part about A STM are the people that I've met and journeyed with over the 38 years here. Some of them are still here with me and I've met a lot of new ones along the way. But it's very rewarding to work for an organization where the whole community believes in the value of what they're creating in the standards that the technical committees produce. It's a high calling to develop standards that solve so many challenges that society's facing and do so much for all of us as consumers. And that's just, I think, a sentiment that permeates all of those that participate in A STM. It's a sentiment that motivates us, that inspires us, that really drives us to do the very best that we can.

(20:46):

Whether you're working as a member, whether you're working as a staff person, I just love the drive that everyone has and the passion that they have for the mission of this organization. But you're right, I mean, we have changed a lot. In 1984 when I came, it was a paper society at that point. Everything was done by paper. We thought communication was fast, but compared to today, it was terribly slow and inefficient and very difficult for A STM to actually be as inclusive as it would like to be to accelerate standards development. Thankfully today, we don't need to worry about all of the technology advances that have come over the past, well, since 1995 or so, I'd say. So the past 25 years or so have been paramount to helping A STM achieve its mission in a much more efficient manner. Our international participation has escalated our ability to be inclusive in the standards development process so much better now.

(22:00):

We've opened offices in other parts of the world in Beijing, in Lima, in Singapore most recently. We also have an office in Brussels. So we have boots on the ground in all different regions of the world, which we weren't able to do back in 1984 when I came. So that's changed an awful lot. A STM has also always stuck to its core competency of developing standards, but I think we've learned, or we've heard maybe from our customers that you can develop a good standard, but it becomes a great standard when it's implemented. So we've looked at these innovative services and wraparound products and productivity tools to help in the implementation and use of A STM standards. Programs like training, helping to build workforce capacity proficiency testing programs, even the online tools that are in our Compass platform where you can access standards red lines, so you can see how standards have changed, annotation tools, historical versions, all of these change management tools that really help organizations to effectively implement the standards that are important to them. So those kinds of wraparound services and value adds is something ASTMs focused on in the past 20 years or so. And these are new for us. We've become more of a solution offering. It's not about just access to standards anymore. We do still develop standards. They're the heart of our organization and they're some of the best, most technically respected standards in the world. And now in addition, we have them on a platform that has these additional functionalities that help organizations to implement them effectively.

Dave Walsh (24:08):

You just touched on one of the biggest changes that has occurred. A STM became an international organization. What has it meant to A STM as an organization to become A STM International and what has it meant in terms of growth and what has been the significance of that change?

Kathie Morgan (24:24):

Becoming A STM International was an extremely significant change for the organization. We were always international in our thought process, but it was in 2001 that we went from A STM to A STM International. When our board implemented that very significant name change for our organization, it wasn't done just as a name change. There was a real mapping of strategy behind that to put a stake in the ground and say, yes, we may have been founded as the American Society for Testing and Materials, and that may still be our legal name, but we are A STM International and we are international in so many ways. We're international in our approach, in our vision, in our strategies. And then tactically, we're international in a lot of different metrics. Our membership is international. The relevance of our standards work is all around the globe. So we have significant international sales and utilization of A STM content.

(25:51):

We have offices in China, in Peru, in Europe, in Brussels, in Canada, in addition to our Philadelphia suburbs office and our Washington DC office. And all of the technology changes as we discussed before, those allowed us to further globalize and be more inclusive of members from around the world. So that was a very, very significant change. The other programmatic change that we did in 2001 with the name change was we initiated our memorandum of understanding program in our global cooperation department. And what that program does is offer a memorandum of understanding and agreement with developing around the world, and it allows them the ability to adopt and utilize A STM standards and to participate in the A STM standards development process. So we started with our very first MOU country with their standards body econ tech in Columbia in 2001. And now today we have MOUs with national standards, bodies of developing countries around the world or regional organizations, and they are utilizing A STM content and reporting back to us on that usage.

(27:26):

They are encouraging their industry stakeholders in their countries to participate in A STM standards, and they are taking advantage of capacity building resources that A STM has to help the workforce in their country and to improve quality of life through the A STM standards that are now readily available to them. So it has been a remarkable program and we are really living out every day the international part of our names. We're really thrilled to have the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development located in Paris. France recently publish a case study of A STM International as an international standardization organization, an organization that follows the principles of an international standards developer as defined by the World Trade Organization. So the publication of that document was very exciting for me and for all of those that rely on A STM standards to do business globally because it sends a message of trust and it sends a message of confidence that the standards A STM is producing are done through a process that meets all of the required criteria.

Dave Walsh (28:58):

I thought I'd kind of be remiss if I didn't mention that you are the first female president of a 120 5-year-old organization. What do you think about that? How does that strike you? Is it something you think about a lot?

Kathie Morgan (29:09):

Well, if I'm honest, I didn't think much about it when I was appointed because throughout my entire career, I have always felt respected. My opinion has always mattered, my contributions have always been acknowledged. I think the culture of this organization is so empowering. I never felt disadvantaged or not taken seriously or so when I became president, I really didn't think about that. But as the word got out that I had been appointed president, I started hearing from colleagues and that was kind of the tenor of the comments I was receiving. You're the first female president of A STM, you're, thank you. It's so nice to see a female progress through an organization and rise all the way up to the level of president. And I guess that caused me to reflect on it a little bit more. And it is an absolute honor and a joy to be able to have reached this position and reached this level within an organization that I have the utmost of respect for all of the staff here and the members that we work with and the board, granted, they come and go, and I'm always working with different people, but I am just always amazed by the care that everyone chose for this organization.

(30:39):

So yes, this has been an amazing journey for me. I'm proud that I could be here, and I just really appreciate the opportunity that I've been given. Before

Dave Walsh (30:50):

We wrap up, do you have a favorite standard or one that sticks out to you over the years? I only found out recently A STM has a standard for cave exploration. That one came out of nowhere. I thought that was great. Do you have one that sticks out to you like that? What is your favorite standard?

Kathie Morgan (31:04):

Well, that's like asking parents about their favorite child. Not that I'm comparing standards to children, but I have a couple, so maybe if a couple are allowed. One of the first standards I was introduced to back in 1984, the first committee I was given was ship building. And the very first standard I put on a ballot for revision was a standard specification for rat guards for ships. And this is back when I was still learning the world of standards, I guess I never really thought about needing standards to keep rats from going up the mooring lines on ships and being able to get on a ship that an organization had a standard for these rat guards was just a pretty eyeopening to me.

Dave Walsh (31:54):

And gross.

Kathie Morgan (31:55):

Yeah, exactly. And then years later, I had the opportunity to work with committee E 18 on sensory evaluation. And that was a fascinating committee because to think about the sensory evaluation of different consumer products, and they had a lot of really what I thought were cool standards at the time on the sensory evaluation of shampoo and of skincare products. And I even remember reading one about toothpaste and toothbrushes and all of the, it's amazing the detail that goes into creating toothpaste and toothbrushes that are desirable, I suppose, by consumers in a sensory sort of way. So those are always interesting to me too. But I will say right now my favorite standard, and I will do it in honor of the Dairy Queen that has just opened up, that has the soft serve ice cream, which is a springtime favorite and summer favorite for me. We have a standard of 27 95. I just have the standard test method of performance of self-contained soft serve and shake freezers. And the idea behind this standard, it's a test method that determines the time and the energy that the freezer needs so that it can dispense soft serve ice cream once it's been loaded to a certain degree with the mix. So for somebody that wants to go to Dairy Queen and be able to see that soft serve dispense when I want it, I'm going to say that's my favorite one for this time of year.

Dave Walsh (33:45):

That's great. And I know my kids would agree because whenever they go to Little League, that's really what they want, so

Kathie Morgan (33:51):

Yeah, exactly.

Dave Walsh (33:55):

Well, it was great having Kathy here today, but now it's time for our standard spotlight segment with SNS content editor, JP Urban.

JP Ervin (34:03):

For our first installment of Standard Spotlight. I'm going to talk about A-S-T-M-A one, the standard specification for carbon T rails. This standard is close to the heart of A STM International in many ways. ASTMs work has sprawled across more than 90 industry sectors, and it has confronted cutting edge issues related to fields such as exoskeletons, additive manufacturing, robotic vehicles, and space flight. But A STM has deep roots in the rail industry, which was and remains an important component of the economy and the world more generally. At the end of the 18 hundreds, the United States witnessed a staggering growth of industry and engineering brought about by scientific discovery, new forms of communication, and a revolution in transportation. The expansion of rail networks in particular allowed people and materials to move around the world faster than ever catapulting an age of expansion. That era also brought with it new safety concerns as well as an increasing reliance on rail systems.

(34:57):

While trains of the early 18 hundreds traveled slowly, modern trains moved at a rapid pace and crowded rail lines. They also carried human passengers as well as valuable cargo that was necessary for applications of the day. The stakes became higher and higher, and so it was crucial to address potential hazards. Dr. Charles Benjamin Dudley was a chemist for the Pennsylvania Railroad Company where he led a PATHBREAKING chemicals laboratory focused on rail safety and improvements, recognizing the importance of standard specifications for the rail industry. He and other scientists and engineers came together to form the organization that would become A-S-T-M-A one was a key priority of the new organization, and it raised expectations about the quality of rails and led to efforts to help Rails perform better. This standard remains important to this day. In his current form. A one addresses the composition of rails, the process by which they're made, and tests that can ensure rails are of an appropriate level of quality. The standard also outlines conditions around the acceptance and transport of rails meant to help producers and purchasers feel confident in the quality of their materials. In many senses, it forms a bridge between that age of rapid discovery and our current world showcasing ADMs early roots, as well as its enduring goal of helping our world work better.

Dave Walsh (36:16):

If you want to learn more about any of the standards discussed in this episode, visit astm.org for all the latest. And if you enjoyed the show today, remember to like and subscribe so you never miss an episode. I'm Dave Walsh for Standards Impact presented by A STM International.