Turning Tides: Richard Broo's Insights on Leadership and Project Recovery

In this insightful episode of Living the Dream with Curveball, we are joined by Richard Brew, a seasoned project turnaround specialist with nearly five decades of experience in transforming struggling organizations. Richard shares his journey from the plastics industry to leading Fortune 500 companies like GE and Black & Decker, and now running his own consultancy, True North PMP Consulting. He delves into the critical early warning signs that leaders often overlook before a project spirals out of control, emphasizing the importance of understanding market shifts and the compounding effects of seemingly minor decisions. Richard also discusses the delicate balance between engaging with teams and maintaining trust, while highlighting the necessity of a holistic approach to leadership. Learn how he guides companies through crises, turning around failing projects into success stories with actionable strategies. Tune in for invaluable lessons on resilience, integrity, and the pivotal role mindset plays in overcoming challenges in high-stakes environments. This episode is a must-listen for any leader looking to regain momentum and steer their organization back on course.
For more information on Richard Brew and his work, visit www.truenorthpmpconsulting.com
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Transcript

>> Curtis Jackson (also known as DJ Curveball): 0:00

Welcome to the Living the Dream podcast with Curveball. If you believe you can achieve, Welcome to the Living the Dream podcast with Curveball. If you believe you can achieve, welcome to the Living the Dream with Curveball podcast, a show where I interview guests that teach, motivate and inspire. Today I am joined by project turnaround specialist, Richard Brew. Richard has spent decades helping companies and stepping in in quiet moments of crisis when things are going sour, projects are failing and clarity of, leadership is slipping. He has done things like help a company avoid bankruptcy and make a sale, and helping companies succeed in high stakes moments when they might be failing. So we're going to be talking to Richard about the great work that he's doing and everything that he's going to be up to and that he's up to. So, Richard, thank you for joining me.

>> Richard Brew: 1:19

Thank you very much. Happy to be here.

>> Curtis Jackson (also known as DJ Curveball): 1:22

Why don't you start off by telling everybody a little bit about yourself?

>> Richard Brew: 1:25

Sure. My, name is Richard Brew. I am a project management expert. I started my career roughly 49 years ago as a young buck, in the plastics industry. And I've worked for Fortune 500 companies such as Owens Corning, Black and Decker and GE Plastics. I've also, had two startups that were put underneath my command and I now have my own company called True North PMP Consulting. And our mission is to help small to medium sized businesses improve their project delivery systems so that they can get to market quicker with less money, with less risk and with better profitability and competitive differentiation.

>> Curtis Jackson (also known as DJ Curveball): 2:17

Well, you know, you often step into organizations and in quiet moment of crisis. So talk about some of the early warning signs that leaders miss before things actually start to unravel.

>> Richard Brew: 2:29

Okay. there were a couple of them. when I was at ge, I was asked to go in and help turn around GE Silicones, which had been slowly declining. And some of the early warning sign systems that they had missed was, I mean, everybody knows GE silicones and they see it in Lowe's and Home Depot. But there's more to GE silicones than what we, what the normal person sees to the eye. But specifically in the automotive market, they saw erosion every year, and a significant erosion on the order of about $10 million per year going down. It was once an Automotive, about $120 million business. And the early signs that they missed was the market was shifting away from traditional silicones for automotive to things that you and I would not even think of. When we walk into a car showroom or we drive our car, it's a little thing called buzz, squeak and rattle. that means your door squeaking or something rattling in the car. And that was where the market was transitioning to those types of products as well as products that were being used to, assemble, engine blocks. And the competitors were already out there three or four years before ge and the management that was in there thought that was just an anomaly. But in fact it was the downfall of GE silicones. And so I went, in there and we had to do a complete product remix. we had to enter new markets and market segments which never was before, and we were able to turn it all around. when I took it over, it was around Detroit was around $54 million and we got it back up to 80 million before I was asked to move on and do another job at ge.

>> Curtis Jackson (also known as DJ Curveball): 4:16

Well, congratulations on that. You often speak about how small decisions tend to compound. So can you give an example how a seemingly minor choice, had massive consequences?

>> Richard Brew: 4:29

Absolutely. I, I did a turnaround about three years ago for a company in the medical packaging business. And they were under the, I guess the mindset that in order to keep the competition out, that they could, they would work on lower margins, than what they normally would. So these are medical packaging that was used for oncology and hematology. Very critical stuff. And so when I was asked to go in on the turnaround, the first thing I looked at was, well, why, why was this company failing financially? And what came down to was they had this mindset that low margin, more business. Well, it really didn't translate to that. It was low margin, low, profit. You, can't even cover some of your basic expenses. So I had to revamp their whole commercial structure and take it from an 8% contribution margin up to a 25. But it was that mindset that is. No, we, we have competition from Japan and Germany. We want to hold them out with being a low price producer. And that's okay in some instances. But when you're dealing with a high ticket item, that's really not the mindset you want to be thinking about.

>> Curtis Jackson (also known as DJ Curveball): 5:49

Well, when you first walk into a failing project, what is the first thing that you actually focus on? People process or truth telling?

>> Richard Brew: 5:57

Absolutely. Curtis. First thing you look at is, it's like a doctor, you take a, status of what the project is, what, what's working well, what's not working well, you got to figure out and what's not working well. Well, what are some root cause. Correct, root causes because you've got to get to root cause corrective action. And then you have to whittle each root cause, corrective action down to the one or two that will really turn the ship around. So I look at, I do that type of analysis first, then I look at the processes that they're using. And in the case of the company I turned around, they had no project management process. It was like whatever, whatever someone wanted to do in the production floor that day or in the engineering department, they did it. No documentation, nothing. So it was a matter of putting in some process discipline and making sure that people followed that discipline. And then it was the people. did the company have the right people in the right jobs? They did not. They were good people, but they were just miscast, if you will. So it was trying to get these people in the right roles with the right responsibilities and authorities that they can really shine on what they do and how they did it. And the end of the whole story was, is, you know, we turned the company around and we sold it for about 22 million, which was about 5 more million worth in its assets. but those are the things you look at first coming through the door.

>> Curtis Jackson (also known as DJ Curveball): 7:29

Well, avoidance is a recurring theme in your work. talk about why leaders tend to avoid things that they know that are critical and how do you help them break that habit.

>> Richard Brew: 7:42

The biggest issue I see in my work is that the leadership team on small to medium sized companies, they have a vision, they have a direction and they basically entrust that to the people that work for them and they disengage because they figure, well, Curtis has this, so we'll put this in Curtis's hands and we will talk to Curtis when Curtis comes up to our, up to the level to talk to us. So we need to talk to Curtis. why do they do that? Well, a little bit is trust. I mean, if you and I have been working together for 20 years, we know one another, we know how we work. And in most cases that it should work, that whatever you or I would do for you should work. But, what really happens is at the levels below them, the people get into, an issue, they try to fix that issue, but they mucky it up or they can't do it. And then it's going to come up to your office, Curtis as a CEO, and I'm going to say, Curtis, I got a real tiger by the tail here and it's biting me and I can't fix it. The solution to that and what I tell leadership is you have a, you have a responsibility to stay connected throughout the whole project. You just can't ask or, or direct and then walk away and expect it to show up at a certain date. you have a responsibility to stay connected to your project teams, your project sponsors. You have a responsibility to make sure that you are actively engaged in making sure that what you are requesting as the leader of a company is in fact being accomplished. You have a responsibility to respond when asked for help. And a lot of, a lot of leaders will get that response and they'll sit on it because they don't think it's a, priority. It is a priority. Why? Because you put people into a situation or accomplish something, you put money into the game. So if you disengage from those two things, you're basically out there in left field waiting for the ball game to be over.

>> Curtis Jackson (also known as DJ Curveball): 9:51

Well, I know you helped guide a company through bankruptcy to a successful sale. So talk about what that experience taught you about leadership under extreme pressure.

>> Richard Brew: 10:04

first, ah, as I told their board of directors, you need to step back as leaders, and I answer to a board. You need to step back and first figure out why did you get into this conundrum. Don't react right away because you probably just exacerbate the problem. So first, as a leader, don't criticize, don't get angry. Figure out why you are in the position you are in, what are all the triggers that got you there, and then the next lesson learned is start to find root cause. It's not, sometimes it's not more people, sometimes it's not more money, sometimes it's, you're just approaching something in a way that will not allow you to achieve what you want to achieve. So in the case of the bankruptcy that I turned around, they kept on throwing more people and more money, and they were money scarce to begin with, when, in essence, it all came down to process, positioning of people and listening to the voice of the customer.

>> Curtis Jackson (also known as DJ Curveball): 11:19

Well, talk about the methods that you use to help leaders move from emotional reactions to clarity when things are urgent or feel urgent.

>> Richard Brew: 11:30

Right. Well, when I get called into that type of situation, I do a bit of an audit on the leaders first, which again, as I've said, is why do you think you're in this situation? What do you think the root cause is? Is it people? Is it process? is it money? Is it customer, centric related? Let's figure out first why the ship is in the condition that it's in. Then we sit down and talk about, okay, now that you realize this. Where do you want the ship to be within the next 90 days? What has to happen in order to make things turn? And let's, let's actually make a plan around that. Let's put some metrics around that so that we can track, is the ship turning. And then let's make sure we have the right people on the ship that can turn the ship in the direction it needs to be. But I don't stop there. I tell the leaders, I'm going to go down into the ranks and I'm going to ask the exact same questions. Because as I said to you earlier, leaders can disengage what you and I think reality is. And the floor of our company may not be the real reality that the people who work the floor, who actually do the work, and they may see it from a different perspective. So I want to get the perspective of the people that are doing the work and being affected by the work. And then I pair that up against what the leadership has told me and then I sit back down with them and say, here is where I see similarities between where you think we are, where you want to go, and here are some disconnects. And these disconnects point to either people process or some other thing about how things are being executed within an organization that have to be addressed. Because you may be the CEO, Curtis, and you're telling me what you think, but it's very important to understand what the people working for you think because they're the ones who are going to do the turnaround.

>> Curtis Jackson (also known as DJ Curveball): 13:50

I think you're absolutely right on that. And speaking of that, that, that goes into my next question. When you walk into a turnaround situation, which one is the hardest? Fixing the technical problems or shifting mindsets?

>> Richard Brew: 14:05

It's mindset and it starts with leadership. you know, I got 49 years underneath my belt and I was highly trained by GE in what I do. and I honestly believe the people that are involved with the issue, the workers, the people who have to do the heavy lifting, they want to be successful, they want to be, they want to be empowered in order to do the things that they're saying need to be done, to be fixed. That's where, when that information shared with leadership, I have encountered situations where management will say, I don't believe that. Of course you're going to ask, why don't you believe that these are your people, these are the people you've entrusted to get something done for the company, for the customer, for themselves. Because, I was involved with some ESOPs employee organizations. It's that mindset from leadership. Well, I don't believe what they say. Well, because I've heard this before. Well, we've heard a lot of things before. But have you really gone down now and dive deep into the water to see what you're hearing now is true? And if you don't believe it, why haven't you gone down to the people you've entrusted for their advice? Because they know how to fix the problem.

>> Curtis Jackson (also known as DJ Curveball): 15:30

We'll talk about how timing and responsibility intersect. When leaders know that changes, changes are needed but they don't do it because they fear the consequences.

>> Richard Brew: 15:41

That there are some situations where, well, I have to answer to my shareholders, you know, on X. Well, okay, but you're not going to get to X. You've got to. You leader, are ultimately responsible for the success of your company. You leader, need to have an empowered, holistic approach to how you do that. And it's not like being in the military where you're the general and you cut the order to the colonel, the colonel cuts it down to the major. It doesn't work that way in business. It's a holistic approach that you need to be thinking about. And that means you've got to look at your mindset and say am I really thinking straight on this one? Or I might not believe it but you know what, I'm going to go with it because this came from the bottom up and these people are telling me they can do it and this is how they can do it.

>> Curtis Jackson (also known as DJ Curveball): 16:38

We'll talk about the personal lessons that these high stakes environment have taught you about resiliency and integrity.

>> Richard Brew: 16:48

Well, the first thing I learned at a very young age at GE is you need to be persistent and perseverant personally. When you get involved in very tense and troublesome situations and you're trying to find your way through that, there's no room for chastising, finger pointing, yelling. you have to be persistent and perseverant with the message and the approach. The other thing you need to be is a little bit humble because when you're sitting in an organization that could be experiencing issues or wants to go in a certain direction, you don't know it all. You may think you do, but you don't. The real life of a company happens where the action is and that's down on the floor in your engineering department, manufacturing department, quality department. So the humbling lesson that I learned early on because I've obviously been involved in many situations that GE owns Corning and Black and Decker, but especially for small to medium sized companies is be humble. Listen, my dad used to have a saying. He told my brothers and I when we, when we graduated college and went out to our respective careers. And, and his saying was this. Grow big eyes, grow big ears, keep your mouth shut and you will learn something. And that's the way to approach these things.

>> Curtis Jackson (also known as DJ Curveball): 18:20

Well, for leaders who might be listening, who feels like something may be off but can't put their finger on it, what is the first step that you recommend them take to regain momentum?

>> Richard Brew: 18:33

again, if I came into your company and you said I'm having X issue, the first thing I want to know is what is the issue? What have you done about the issue? What do you think is the root cause of that issue? What have you tried to fix the issue? And what has and hasn't worked? What have you learned so far? Because that learning is going to, is going to be used to resolve whatever the issue is you want resolved. And as a leader, when you get involved with these things, you know, you, you really have to spend step, as I said, step back and find the time to do this. So I would tell any leader, if you think you've got a problem and even if you don't know the whole context of the problem or the depth of the problem, put it down on a piece of paper, write it down in your journal. What is the problem? Why do I think I have this problem? What has been done to try to fix it? What's worked, what's not worked? Step back. Think, don't react. Think.

>> Curtis Jackson (also known as DJ Curveball): 19:41

Well, tell us about any other upcoming projects that you're working on that listeners need to be aware of.

>> Richard Brew: 19:47

I am, working on a couple projects. Again, I focus on small to medium sized businesses, businesses that are anywhere from 50 million to 250 million. anywhere from maybe 50 employees to 200. 250 employees. And of late, most of my projects seem to be the same in nature. We, we are having issue, getting product out the door on time. And project management has three elements to it. One is common sense. You know what you want to do. you should know what you want to do, you should know why you want to do it and you should understand when it's done, what does it yield for you, your company, your customer, your employees. That's the first thing. The other is logic. Okay, I'm at point A, got to get to point B. How do I do that? That's what I call project planning and execution. And the last third is project discipline. That's you choosing to follow a plan that will take your logic, execute it to the goal or objective you want to get to. And so most of the projects that I have of late, there was the common sense there, there was a logic there. it lacked project discipline in, in several areas. One, they may have had a project plan, but they deviated. Why did they deviate? Because someone in the company said, you know, this is a good plan, but, if we did this, it'll create that, and that's better for the customer. So let's just add this in here. Well, if the customer didn't ask for it, it shouldn't have been in there. And scope creep is, is a lot of what I work on with, with clients. Only do what the client has asked you to do. Don't do anything more than that. It will cost you more time and money. If you figure out along the way that there could be another generation of what the customer is asking you to do, don't just go do it. When you deliver what they've asked for, inform them, hey, this can be further refined with these types of benefits or features.

>> Curtis Jackson (also known as DJ Curveball): 22:07

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