Dotty Posto (00:00):

Angie Colee (00:03):

Welcome to Permission to Kick Ass, the show that gives you a virtual seat at the bar for the real conversations that happen between entrepreneurs. I'm interviewing all kinds of business owners from those just a few years into freelancing to CEOs, helming nine figure companies. If you've ever worried that everyone else just seems to get it and you're missing something or messing things up, this show is for you. I'm your host, Angie Colee, and let's get to it. And welcome back to Permission to Kick Ass with me today is Dottie Posto. Say Hi, Dottie.

Dotty Posto (00:37):

Hi, Dotty

Angie Colee (00:39):

. It's, it's always half and half whether people are gonna say their own names or not, but it tickles me every time. So tell us a little bit about your business and what you do.

Dotty Posto (00:47):

So, I am a leadership and life coach, and I do leadership and team development consulting. So I have been in the organizational change management organizational development space. I can never, like, I can't do math in my head, and I never remember the number of years, so I'm just gonna say like the midnight, you know, like 1997 ish is when I first got into that space. And, uh, been in my own business since 2009. And that always closed my mind that it's been that long. Um, so I worked at Harley-Davidson as an organizational development manager. Towards the end of my time there, I was there nine years, and I absolutely love that work. But when I got laid off in the middle of the economic downturn of oh 8, 0 9, then, uh, I thought, you know what this is. As, as my manager was reading the, you know, my, my layoff letter, I thought, this is an opportunity.

Dotty Posto (01:41):

This is an opportunity. And everybody I talked to said, Dottie, no one is hiring organizational development consultants right now. No one. Mm-hmm. . So try to get a job, try to get a job, just get a job. You know, it, the, the economy was just really awful. And so I did try to get a job, could not find a job. Interviewed, you know, in several places. Did not get any jobs there. And, uh, then all of a sudden somebody found me on LinkedIn and I started more on the organizational change management side because, um, that's what my profile had was focused on. And that's what a lot of the history was in terms of some of the positions I had. And so I did that work and then interspersed, I had some organizational development work, which is where I was working with like the c e O of Waukesha Gas engines and his leadership team, and helping them to be more effective and more impactful, or working with Harley Davidson and working with one of the teams there to build more trust and build more, um, commitment and actually build more constructive conflict, um, is something I really like working with teams on.

Angie Colee (02:48):

I love that I was writing so many furious notes during that, and I wanna circle back to a few of them. One was this mindset that you took while in the midst of something that arguably is really devastating. I've even talked before about how I think people need to allow space for grief after layoffs, especially since so many of us have our identities deeply tied to what we do. And now it's like, what do I even do? Who am I even now that I'm not doing this anymore? So like, congrats on, you know, I don't even know if it was a conscious thing, but it was a choice to have that mindset for sure. To see it as an opportunity versus a devastating blow. You know what, I don't know. What do you think about that?

Dotty Posto (03:27):

I, I, I think it was, I mean, at that point I had been in the organizational development space at Harley, which I think Harley-Davidson, I don't, you know, they had many fewer organizational development folks now I think they have two. Mm-hmm. Where they used to have one od, I'll just refer to it as OD organizational development, one OD manager for every single department. And so I was paired up with an HR manager for one department. And I think a lot of the training I went through, and in fact, one of the trainings in particular, I went through with, um, what was called at the time Inner Strength Associates and now is called Linda Barons Institute, where I learned how to do self-discovery on the my with the Myers-Briggs, kind of coming up with, with Myers, with the Myers-Briggs in the end. But she doesn't use the assessment. You know, she does a self-discovery process. And if anybody knows anything about, um, Myers-Briggs, I had always tested when I was a project manager and a business analyst, I tested E S T J. Then when I went through the self-discovery process, I am an I N F P , the exact, oh.

Dotty Posto (04:33):

But part of that was, and this is, this is one of the things I really coached people on because it was such a huge, huge, um, unveiling for me, like a huge, you know, weight off my shoulders, understanding of myself. Because what I realized was that even though I got very good at project management, maybe not, but I was, I got good at it and they sent me to more training and I developed those skills. They weren't aligned with who I was. Mm-hmm. . And so I think having had that and having started coaching other leaders on that at Harley really got me into the mindset. And I think I, I'd always, you know, I think I had the thought in the back of my head that I wanted my own business at some point. Um, and so I think that's what led to that mindset. Back to your question, I wasn't sure I'd make it back.

Angie Colee (05:18):

Yeah, no, I mean, A D H D rambles and shiny paths are always welcome on this show. This is how my brain processes too. I think that's perfect because I, I, how many people have that in the back of their head, but they also have some sort of condition attached to it. You know, when I have enough, when I've earned this, right. When I feel comfortable to make a move, and then that never really happens. And, you know, I had something similar happen. I tell, it's such a goofy story, but it makes me laugh. It's actually the anniversary of it was just a couple days ago, but I once got fired from a job I didn't even have. Uh, and that, it just makes me laugh because I had left my corporate job as a copywriter to start my business. And suffice it to say I hadn't really developed a lot of great business skills yet.

Angie Colee (06:05):

I was still in that like prospect a whole lot, overload myself, work around the clock to fulfill on these things. Burnout, put prospecting on pause to recover and then like, that's just a vicious cycle with lopsided wheels that doesn't really get you anywhere. So a few months later, I had the opportunity to go back and do a freelance project in-house at my old job. Well, day five of that contract, the whole team got laid off. And I remember being just as devastated as if I was working there. 'cause I didn't realize until that very moment that I always had it in the back of my head. You can go back if you need to, which was such a, like unconscious, but self-sabotage thing to think that I was already going into the business going, if I fail, I can go back versus how can I set this up to minimize my chances of failure and like trust myself to figure it out if I do, you know?

Dotty Posto (06:56):

Yeah. And two things around that. One was once I started in my own business, I actually had one of the guy, one of the gentlemen who was on the team that I was an OD manager for, he was one of the directors asked me to come back as the manager for his, he was now c i o. And I, I knew, I mean, I knew in the depths of my heart, and one of my coaches said, Dottie, maybe you need to just go back into corporate. And I knew from the depths of my heart, no.

Angie Colee (07:24):

Mm-hmm. , no.

Dotty Posto (07:25):

Then the second thing is just this last December, I finished up a project with Molson Coors, and I had been working with them since 2015. And then I had also worked with them three years prior, um, with a project in between. And I was doing organizational change management, which is different from org org development. And I was doing it on IT projects. And it's like, that took me back to 19 97, 19 98, 2000. And I was like, you know, that's all well and good and that can pay the bills. It's not really, it's not what's totally aligned to who I am and what I really want, what, what I know I'm meant to bring to the world mm-hmm. . And so it's been these last few months of really focusing on, like you said, prospecting, networking, putting my thought leadership out there. And my husband's like, well, you might just have to take a project mm-hmm.

Dotty Posto (08:16):

. And I'm like, I don't have to, you know, and I can take on different projects. It's just really trying to make sure that I'm not going back. You know, I don't want to go into another full-time gig because I know that, that it'll just slide me back. And this, this kind of pivot that I've done in since December of really focusing on, you know, leadership and team development and leadership and life coaching, those two things. That's, that's really what I'm meant to do. And so, just really, you know, I'm not going back. I got, you know, moving forward,

Angie Colee (08:50):

I love that decision because like, just like I said, when you have that in the back of your head of like, I can can always go back, I've got a safety net. It winds up, I think, kind of suppressing you, giving your all to the thing that you are working on, which has this, you know, self-fulfilling prophecy effect. Yeah. I realized that about myself time and again with ventures that I've had in the past that failed, that I took the approach of like, well, I'll kind of, sort of try, I'll dedicate what I can to this and see what happens, what the outcome is, and then if it looks good, I will put my all into it. And I couldn't see, at the time, I just didn't have, you know, that worldview and that context yet to understand that I wasn't putting my all into it. So it wasn't going to succeed because I wasn't actually trying at anything very seriously. And that's just not a way to set yourself up for success.

Dotty Posto (09:41):

Yeah. And I love how you put that. You didn't say it outright, but one of the things that I really coach people on, you know, I, I met someone today and she's like, oh yeah, you know, the coach, they, they're the big motivator and they, they kind of tell you what to do. And I'm like, Hmm, that's not mm-hmm. That's not who I am and what I am as a coach. I am here to help you see your brain, you know? Yes. I'm here to help you. Really. And what you were saying is really getting to know your thoughts, like mm-hmm. how, thinking about this, because how I think is how I is generates how I feel, how I feel then creates my actions, which then create the results. Yes. And there are a lot of coaches that just focus on, okay, what do we need to do? Mm-hmm. , let's just focus on what we need to do, where I'm focused on what you need to think first. Like what are the, what are you currently thinking and how is that creating the feelings and actions and results. Yes. And then what does it need to be to create the results you really want?

Angie Colee (10:36):

And sometimes are the feelings even real, because that's been a whole big rabbit hole that I've gone down lately because the, the thoughts and the feelings that we have, they're just, so, I read this book, I don't know if you're familiar with Dan Harris. He was a news anchor that had like a very public panic attack and like freak out and then delved into the world of mindfulness. And I got introduced to him with this book that's a perfectly named book for someone like me, it's called Meditation for the Fidgety Skeptic. And I was like, okay, I could be talked into learning more about meditation through this filter. Um, but he basically talked about how much he learned that we're all kind of going through life on autopilot, right? And we, when the thoughts pop up, we think this is what we're genuinely thinking versus just an observation that happened to pop into our brain.

Angie Colee (11:25):

Is it true? Is it not? Isn't an assumption? Is this just like emotion taking over and clouding judgment? Like there's never as much truth to the first thought that pops into your head as it might seem. And so, like for instance, a, you know, if, if you got offered a new opportunity outside of your comfort zone, this is like a hypo hypothetical to the universe. You got this big dream gig offer and your immediate thought is, I don't think I can do this. Is that true? No, you can't. You can figure out a way to do it if you trust yourself to do that. And you are a resourceful person, and I'm gonna blanket state that if you're listening to this show, you are smart, you are resourceful, you have got someone in your corner that believes in you. I'm gonna speak for Dottie. I'm gonna presume on this point, I think she believes in you too. But I'm never gonna be the reason that somebody gives up on themselves. So if you trust yourself, then that first thought is not true. I don't think I can do this. Yes, you can. You can figure it out.

Dotty Posto (12:22):

Yeah. Yeah. And something to, to add to that is that we have 60 to 80,000 thoughts a day. Yeah.

Angie Colee (12:31):

,

Dotty Posto (12:31):

60 to 80,000, most of them we're not even aware of. Mm-hmm. , I mean, they're just like cycling through. And they're not true or false, they just are.

Angie Colee (12:41):

Yes.

Dotty Posto (12:42):

The, you know, what's outside of us, the fact that it's raining, the fact that it's thundering and lightning, that's a fact. Because it could be proven in a court of law. Those are, that's what's true or not true. Mm-hmm. , if it's a thought, it's there. You know, and that thought is gonna create a feeling and that feeling is gonna drive what you do. And so sometimes we can, it's good to just observe, oh, why is that coming up? What, you know, what am I feeling? Mm-hmm. and what do I do? I feel that way. So that at least you have that level of observation. Because if all we do is say, oh, nope, I'm gonna put up the the, I'm not gonna think that, I'm not gonna feel that mm-hmm. , then that resistance creates that thought or that feeling coming back like a two year old with a red crayon in a white room.

Angie Colee (13:25):

Oh yes. I, I have joked about that. Like, I think it, I think that toxic positivity is basically, you know, trying to force the feelings to not exist because I don't like them and I don't wanna deal with them. And to me, that just conjures an image of somebody standing on the shore of, of a beach trying to hold back a wave with their arms. Honey, at some point, one of those waves is gonna knock you flat on your and there's not gonna be anything you can do about it. It's gonna drag you out to sea and you best stop fighting it and just let it push you back to shore. Like, yeah.

Dotty Posto (13:56):

And I always tell people it's like a little two year old, you know, that, that feeling, if you push it away and you ignore it long enough, it's gonna be just like a two year going, mom, mom, mom. Mm-hmm. , mom, mom, mom, nonstop. Yes. Until you allow it. Mm-hmm. . And there's, I dunno if you've ever heard of the organization called Six seconds, s I x, six seconds. Six seconds. They are, they do all sorts of work around in the realm of emotional intelligence and emotional, um mm-hmm. , uh, fluency. And if you allow an emotion, if you just, it an emotion, a feeling is a sensation in our body. Mm-hmm. It is a vibration in our body different than a sensation, which might be hunger. If I have haven't eaten since yesterday evening, you know, I might feel actual hunger. Many of us eat when we don't feel hunger mm-hmm. , um, you know, or the feeling of pain. I had, you know, some dental work done. I am in physical pain from the dental work mm-hmm. . Um, but the feeling is just a vibration. Yeah. And if we notice it and allow it, and kind of just acknowledge it, what this organization says is it will flow through your body in six seconds. Mm-hmm. ,

Angie Colee (15:09):

Sometimes

Dotty Posto (15:09):

It'll come back like grief, you know, when my mother passed way too early and way unexpectedly that that came, you know, back time after time. And it still does sometimes, you know. Yeah. And I, you know, there's, we want to allow all of it because if you stuff down grief, if you stuff down loneliness, if you avoid despair, it, then you, then you stuff down and avoid you. You limit your Brene Brown talks about this. You limit your capability to feel happiness and joy and optimism and hope and freedom and love. Mm-hmm. You can't selectively numb your emotions.

Angie Colee (15:47):

Yes. I totally agree. And when you allow it too, and you don't fight it, and you resist judging it. Right? Yeah. Being angry doesn't make you a bad person. Being sad doesn't make you a pathetic person. Being overjoyed. Like, I made a, a joke earlier because my partner and I are in the process of planning a Disney trip. I finally found a way to write Disney trips off. Yes. Government take that. Um, but I told her, okay, well if we take these people to the Lion King show at Animal Kingdom, they better be prepared for tears. 'cause every time that final circle of life happens, just like circle of life, yes, I like, I'm going to be happy tears, but I ha I know myself. And if I stifled other feelings, other less pleasant feelings, then I wouldn't have that over the top joy at things that I love. And I want that, I want that enough to make the trade off that I'm willing to feel the negative in order to feel that high of a positive. I dunno if that makes sense only to me, but that's my life.

Dotty Posto (16:48):

No, it's totally true. I mean, it's, you know, and, and we don't have to, we can experience it. We can feel it without acting it. Yes. Without reacting to it. So I was sharing this this morning is, you know, if I was angry at my husband for something, let's say he, you know, he didn't help me with dinner, he didn't help me with dishes. He put all his stuff on, all his dishes on the counter, walked away, went and, you know, went out in the garage and did his thing. And I could be very upset and go out there and scream at him, you know? Mm-hmm. , what the hell? Why don't you know, blah, blah, blah, whatever. You know? And that is taking it out versus sharing it, is that I was really frustrated when, you know, it, I was, it, I was very frustrated when you didn't choose to help me. And I, I would appreciate that. And it's just the two of us. I would appreciate help, especially if I'm making dinner, I'd appreciate help cleaning up, you know, and it, I can share the frustration, I can share the anger. And there are times, I mean, there are times I wanna get angry, you know? Yes. I, and, and that's okay. You know, it depends on who it is. 'cause like my husband doesn't handle anger coming out very well.

Angie Colee (17:58):

Oh yeah. I mean, I used to be involved in a partner who was definitely the typical road rager person. And actually, I, I told this story once in a group run by our mutual friend, Dr. Julie Helmrick, where I was like, I used to get so frustrated. That was our, our biggest fight was the fact that he was a road rager. And he wanted me to also road rage and like teach people a lesson. And I just told him like, well, first of all, we live in, we live in Houston, and people get shot for that kind of stuff. And I'm not willing to risk my life in order to be right. Um, and second of all, like the thought that I had, and I don't even know why this popped into my head, but one day it just occurred to me, am I going to even remember this incident in five years?

Angie Colee (18:37):

Is it, is it going to significantly impact me? The fact that this person cut me off today? Okay, cool. I don't care. I'm allowed to be frustrated that, you know, they did something that scared me or made me upset or anything like that. But I choose to let go of that and just may, I'm gonna give them the benefit of the doubt and assume that they were rushing to the hospital to save their dying. I don't know. But I'm gonna give them a human moment there and, and not take it personally. And that, that has changed my life behind the wheel. I'm just so much more, it, it helps since I'm a digital nomad and I drive from place to place that I'm not spending 10 hours in near heart attack mode. I wanna go back to something that you said earlier, because I know that some of the stuff that we're talking about is probably a little bit advanced because you're in the team building and like change managements, change management side of it. So I wanted, and I, this was not my, uh, strongest forte when I was getting my master's degree, but can you tell us a little bit about the difference between change management and organizational development? So

Dotty Posto (19:38):

The way I see it is that change management is one bucket of organizational development. It's one piece. And change management is helping an organization. And I did a lot of IT projects where they're implementing a whole new system. Yeah. And you're helping on what they always call the people side of change. You're helping with communication, with training, with reinforcement plans, with what is it today, what is it gonna be in the future? And helping humans through the discomfort of change. Yes. And through the, the, well, I mean all of it, the trauma, whatever it is, the trauma, the, the discomfort of change and how, and helping them to get through that cycle of change as, as quickly and easily as possible. And to know that what they're going through is normal mm-hmm. , it's okay. Mm-hmm. , they can share their frustration, they can share their fear, they can share it all.

Dotty Posto (20:37):

And we still want them to be to, to continue to move forward with it. Organizational development is bigger than that. It goes, you know, change management is a piece of it, but it might be team development. Let's say you have a team where you've got a couple of people who are really in conflict all the time, or you've got people who are, you know, really Nancy, nice person, or, uh, nice Ned who everything's fine in the room. Oh yeah, yeah. We'll do that. And then behind the scenes they're like, F no, we ain't doing that. I'm not, I'm not helping with that. There's no way. You know, so whatever conflict is going, whatever they're, that's going on that is impeding the team from actually performing at their highest or for, for producing the raw results that are expected, is helping that team to, you know, get connected more, build more trust, build more constructive conflict.

Dotty Posto (21:28):

I love working with, with teams on how to have constructive conflict. Um, I love the work of Patrick Lencioni, um, with the five dysfunctions of the team. 'cause if you don't have trust, then you can't have constructive conflict. If you don't have constructive conflict, you cannot have commitment. Yes. You're not gonna get people to commit because otherwise No. Not everybody's. If you can't have a good debate and a good conversation, and sometimes that means some voices might get raised, which some people are really against. They think that's like the worst thing you could ever do. If you don't have commitment, you can't have accountability. Yes. And if you don't have accountability, you don't get results. And so many people wanna focus on just, here's the results, here are the metrics. Go figure it out. Mm-hmm. , and you gotta have that whole foundation, or it doesn't work.

Dotty Posto (22:16):

Yes. And so that's a piece of organizational development is developing the teams and also developing the leaders. Mm-hmm. , you know, where I, when I was at Harley and we were doing leadership development, there were so many people who were promoted into leadership. They did a lot of promotion from within. And so they were technicians first. They were experts first. And then they got into leadership. And that transition is often very hard for folks of how do I, how do I first recognize what are my strengths, what are my weaknesses? And then secondly, build that the capabilities around me. And, and be okay with people being smarter than you and actually wanting people who are smarter than you. Yes. You know, there's so much fear and so much, you know, like, uh, territorialness and just fear of not, of somebody taking over or somebody showing me up. And it's like, you want people to, to, to be better than you. You want experts in their area and to fill in your gaps. Mm-hmm. , you know, or building your, your job is to build leaders and to build whoever's gonna take your place so that you, if you wanna move up. And if you don't, that's great.

Angie Colee (23:27):

Yes. I think, I think that view is perfect. And I'm so glad that I was like, I wanna, I wanna know more about that, share more about that. Because I think I have had people talk about how I lead teams, which is one of the things I'm very passionate about. And I discovered that just kind of by accident a long time ago, because my natural leadership style was to mimic what I didn't quite understand, which is I tell you what to do and you do it. And I didn't really understand the resistance that people had to it, the frustration that they had with my approach. So, so I studied a lot of this stuff and started experimenting on my own with how to be a better leader. And the interesting thing to me was when I discovered that I could let people shine, and that made me look brilliant. Yeah. And I was like, oh, my job just got a lot easier. 'cause I'm not having to do the work of five people so that I can be the smartest person in the room. I get to be the smartest person in the room by guiding the smart people around me and helping them make better choices that both allow them to shine and make my team look excellent. I like this

Dotty Posto (24:27):

. And for some people, that's an easy transition. Yeah. Sometimes it's hard because their identity is so, you know, wrapped up in and, you know, just engulfed in their job. And if they were a technician for five years and that's what they knew, that's what, you know, they have a hard time letting go of some of it. And, you know, giving it, you know, allowing other people to, and allowing other people to fail. Yes. I mean, that's something that, that, you know, not a lot of leaders are comfortable with is, how do I let my team fail, you know? Mm-hmm. and encourage failure. I mean, that's something I think that you, you have to encourage failure. Yeah. You know, my mentor Brooke Castillo, who in my, in this new coaching, uh, certification I'm getting, she talks about you should have, you know, multiple fails a week. Mm-hmm. , you know what, like plan, what can I try that I am most likely gonna fail at? Yeah. Because the more you fail, the more you learn, you know? Yeah. And if you swoop in every time somebody's about to fail and you fix it, or you take it over, then they're not learning.

Angie Colee (25:31):

Mm-hmm. they're not learning anything. And it also, it, like, it magnifies the pressure. Like, it, it's such a, I don't wanna say hidden or, or covert or anything, but it's such an unconscious way to like magnify the pressure of any fail. And I know in all of this stuff that I've studied about leadership and management and things like that, we talk about creating psychological safety and permission to fail means that sometimes these risks aren't going to pay off. But we're encouraging to take the, the kinds of risks that actually will innovate and make us into industry leaders, where if we fall into that trap that is oh, so human, right. Like, I found a way that works. I am comfortable here. I am resisting change with every fiber of my being. No. Well, that, I mean, look at Blockbuster for an example of what happens when you refuse to change.

Dotty Posto (26:19):

Yeah, exactly. You know, and it, the, the hard thing about it is it's not, it's not anyone's fault. Yeah. Our brains hardwired to stay in comfort, to avoid pain, to avoid, you know, any kind of exertion and to seek treasure, you know? So staying in our comfort zone is where our reptilian brain mm-hmm. , you know, it never got beyond that, you know, and also to keep us safe, so it's, you know, this, um, protection mode that it's in. Yeah. And we have to be able to use our, you know, our prefrontal cortex to get to, to kind of manage our brain. And that's really what, you know, I work with leaders as in my leaders in, in my coaching, is helping them to actually, how do we plan ahead? How do we, how do we use the brain, but how do we look at it all mm-hmm. , how do we realize what's going on in there? And that's why I meet with my clients every single week Yeah. Is because there's so much, I mean, 60 to 80,000 thoughts a day. Yeah. And percent of 'em are negative, you know, and I don't even like using the word negative. I usually word like emotions are usually either constrictive, you know, they're, they're going to separate us from ourselves and others, or they're expansive. Yes. You know?

Angie Colee (27:31):

Oh, I like that thought.

Dotty Posto (27:33):

And, you know, so meeting weekly, it's, let's look at your brain. What's going on? Where are you, where are you contracting? Where are you trying to stay safe? Where are you staying in your comfort zone? Mm-hmm. . So, um, yeah.

Angie Colee (27:44):

This is why I'm such a big fan of coaching and not, I mean, not all coaching. I rebel very, very much. And I will get on my soapbox all day long about prescriptive coaching. The people that presume that they know you, your motivations, your goals and your desires, and that they can come up with a one size fits all solution that everybody fits into this box. No, absolutely not. I'm probably the most frustrating kind of coach out there. And this is why I'm such a big fan of coaching. I, I probably attract the same kind of coaches to me that I am to my clients. But, uh, I I used to articulate things that I would say out loud to my coach, Brian. Um, and as soon as I heard myself say it, I realized how ridiculous it was. It made perfect sense bouncing around in the echo chamber between my ears. Oh,

Dotty Posto (28:30):

Absolutely.

Angie Colee (28:30):

Until I had to explain it to another person. And upon which I instantly realized that I was being ridiculous. And nine times outta 10, the stuff that he helped me solve were things that I already had the skills to solve. He didn't need to give me a tool. He didn't need to prescribe a fix. He needed to remind me that I already had the tools in the steps. And I wanna say that a lot of the things that caused me anxiety and caused me to like, just like overwhelmed spiral of am I even meant to do this, was that I hadn't taken the time to picture what the end looks like. So I didn't know how to find my way from here to there, and I got lost. And I would like spiral on that for a while. So he would tell me, you know, okay, so what does done look like?

Angie Colee (29:10):

Oh, you don't know what done looks like. What would help, you know, what done looks like? What are the results that you're hoping for? And by practicing that line of thought process, it starts to become a much more natural way to disrupt my own anxiety. Where, you know, just like you were talking about earlier, it becomes a sensation in your body of vibration in your body. I know when I start to feel my shoulders come up around my ears and that knot that pops up right between, you know, like right on the right side underneath my right shoulder blade. That that is the anxiety that I usually feel around, I don't know where I'm going with this. Yeah. Okay. Let me sit down and think about what does this look like? What does success look like? What does done look like? Is that realistic? What do I need to allocate to make that happen now? What are the steps? And then I feel better. 'cause I'm like, oh, I've got steps.

Dotty Posto (29:59):

And it's also helpful what I, and this is, you know, I learned this in the cha and did change management for so long, current state, future state. Ooh. So, so understanding where you are now and what the thoughts are. So what thought is, what's, what's the thought running through your head that's causing you to feel that anxiety mm-hmm. and you feel the anxiety. What do you do? I, you know, go to the pantry and I eat food. I, you know, scroll social media. I check my emails instead of doing the work I need to do. And the result is my business doesn't grow. Mm-hmm. . So understanding current state and then having that vision of future state, the, you know, what's that intentional place I'm trying to go to? Helps you see what are the steps. Because otherwise, if all we do is focus here, we might try to start here.

Dotty Posto (30:48):

And our brain isn't ready for that. It's too much, it's too much, it's too big to believe that I can do this. I'm, I need to know exactly where I'm starting from so that I can actually take the steps. Because some people can make a big leap and go, okay, I can jump, you know, three steps ahead and, and I can get in that mindset, I can get in the feeling I can do those actions. Whereas other people need, okay, I'm gonna take this step and then this step, and then this step. And knowing that current state is so important to do, to do that.

Angie Colee (31:17):

Oh, yes. And a willingness to be honest with yourself. Because I, I love everything about this conversation. And you know, not judging or attaching any kind of condemnation or anything to the thoughts that pop up being honest about where you're at and what you're struggling with is the key to finding something that actually works for you. My partner and I were debating about this earlier, well, not even really debating having an interesting discussion about it, because we were wondering out loud why some folks take to business coaching incredibly well, they take the plan, they run with it, they own it, they make it their own. They ask lots of questions, they report back results. And like, woo-hoo, that's what every coach hopes for Yes. Success. And then what's happening with the ones that are resisting, that are doubting, that are stalling, you know, it's not just fear, it goes a level deeper. And so we started kind of bouncing around the ideas like what are the reasons that coaching works so well for others and it fail for some and, and fails for others. And that was one of the things that we came up with. Like, if you're in a state where you are not being honest with yourself about your business reality

Dotty Posto (32:24):

And also not even your business reality, and not being realistic and not being honest with what's going on in my brain. Yeah. Or you're ignoring, I am just, I'm not even gonna, because being the observer of your own brain is not something we're taught to do. Do

Angie Colee (32:39):

No thinking about how we're thinking is deeply uncomfortable .

Dotty Posto (32:43):

Yeah. And when it is uncomfortable, we push it away. Yep. You know, things

Angie Colee (32:48):

Are never as bad or as good as we think they are. It's, it's just, it's all on a spectrum, on a sliding scale. And that's why I'm a big fan of, I talk about pendulum swings, like this idea that we have of balance. Like, we're gonna climb up on a pedestal and stand there for all time and never deal with tired knees or the need to pee, or somebody trying to climb up the pedestal and knock us off it. Like, that's not realistic. And to be that top person on the pedestal takes a hell of a lot of work. And I know I, for one, I'm too lazy to be the number one at everything. I'm gonna, I'm fine settling with good enough and maybe, maybe top 10%. Woo hoo. I have no desire to be the best because I don't wanna work that hard.

Angie Colee (33:27):

That's something I know about myself. That's me being honest with myself. So now I can stop beating myself up, stop treating myself as a punching bag for not putting in the effort to be number one. 'cause I don't want it. And that's just honest. Right. And so, well that ties back into the pendulum swing because I was, you know, um, we're wired for, for negativity. That's, that's what helped us survive saber tooth tigers in the past. Right. And so that pendulum always tends to swing toward, here are the reasons why everything sucks and I'm in danger and I'm a horrible person. Right. And I'm a big fan of, I started this practice probably five or more years ago. I have what I call a Kick Ass confidence file, where anytime somebody sends me something unsolicited, nice, a compliment tells me a result from a campaign I worked on, anything like that, I take a screenshot, I put it in the file. And in that way, when I can't tap into my support network to remind me that I'm an awesome person, and these are just feelings that will pass, I will go dig in that file and be like, that's right. I do help people. It's okay. It's gonna be fine. Let's just cry it out for a little while.

Dotty Posto (34:29):

And you know, that's where some self coaching, and maybe you and I can have a little, I'll do a couple sessions for you, is, is really tapping into it from what is, what do you think when you read those

Angie Colee (34:44):

Mm-hmm. ,

Dotty Posto (34:44):

You know, what is your thought when you read those, those testimonials or those thank yous or those gratitude emails?

Angie Colee (34:51):

Sometimes, well, when I'm reading them in the context of going through the folder, it's surprise because I'm surprised that I have forgotten about that. That I have like, buried it and it is not in my consciousness. And that's why I love that I've developed this habit of, of gathering those screenshots. Because, you know, my, my brain and I think all humans' brains, we love to focus on all the struggles and the challenges and the, you know, the places that we aren't yet that we want to be, that we lose sight of how far we've come. And I always talk about that. Like, if you're looking ahead and, and realizing how far you have to go, also remember to look behind at how far you've come.

Dotty Posto (35:27):

And for the business person who doesn't have all of that, 'cause it isn't the file that makes you feel good. Mm-hmm.

Angie Colee (35:35):

,

Dotty Posto (35:38):

I forgot I, you know, I forgot I had this, you know, I forgot, I forgot that I'm really this good. Yes. You know, whatever that thought is, and we could go through that whole thing. But, you know, it's your thought that's creating the feeling of I can do this. Mm-hmm. , you know, the feeling of confidence or the, whatever the feeling is that you, that that generates. Um, and then that will then drive you into new actions. Because being able to do it without that file, like let's say you lost the file, somebody accidentally deleted it. There's ways to, how do I wanna think about this differently? You know, first of all, acknowledging what you are thinking in the moment. I suck. Yes. I'm horrible. This is never gonna work. You know, they're

Angie Colee (36:18):

All gonna find out I'm in imposter at any given moment.

Dotty Posto (36:20):

Yeah. , that's a whole nother, that's a whole nother conversation. Oh yeah. But, uh, you know, it's, can I, can I acknowledge what I'm feeling and go, okay, I'm feeling this and if I let, if I, if I attach to that feeling and if I spiral with it and you know, be the victim and p you know, have a pity party, you know, I can do that for a little while and acknowledge this is the result it's gonna create. I am not gonna get done the things I need to get done. Mm-hmm. or I'm gonna create more spin and then, you know, be able to shift if we need, when, when you have the capacity is to be able to shift and say, okay, what, what thought would create, you know, what thought, what do I want to feel in this situation? I wanna feel confident. Well, what thought is gonna help you feel confident?

Angie Colee (37:10):

Oh man, that's fantastic. I could talk about this all day, , but I know we're approaching time. So what I'm gonna say is, hey, share your website. Tell us where we can learn more about you working with you. I have a feeling people are going to need you and want to work with you after hearing all of this loveliness.

Dotty Posto (37:26):

This is awesome. So my website is in plain p l a i n in plain site, SS I G H T Inc in plain site inc.com. And I've got a couple things that'll be in your show notes. I've got a, a retreat that I'm doing in Maine. There is, I'll have a link for that, a women's retreat in Maine in October, which is gonna be gorgeous. Love it. And then I also have, and I'll put in both how to do a pre-consult with me and how to, um, I have a free energy assessment that people can take where they can I call myself the energy coach, which we didn't even really talk about much, but, oh yeah. Um, I, it's an energy assessment to kind of take a look at all of the things you do, all of the, every single thing that you do every day, every week, every month, every year, putting it on paper and doing, I have a whole process that takes 'em through an analysis that then helps you realize where am I in alignment with my core being and where am I out of alignment. And then I do coaching with folks on top of that if they need it. If they like

Angie Colee (38:30):

Love that. That's fantastic. I'm definitely gonna make sure they have clickable links in the show notes. Man, this is fascinating. I think we have to sign up for a part two later, later this year. We're gonna have to dig some more into this stuff. 'cause I find the internal workings and the brain stuff fascinating. So thank you so much for being on the show and I'll talk to you soon. Thanks

Speaker 3 (38:49):

Angie.

Angie Colee (38:52):

That's all for now. If you wanna keep that Kick Ass energy high, please take a minute to share this episode with someone that might need a high octane dose. If you can do it, don't forget to rate, review, and subscribe to the permission to Kick Ass podcast on Apple Podcast Spotify and wherever you stream your podcast. I'm your host, Angie Colee, and I'm here rooting for you. Thanks for listening and let's go Kick Ass some.