Welcome to the Cultivating Growth Podcast, where each week we discuss different ways in which we can grow as followers of Christ. This week, we're going, John and I, to discuss how we can grow in our joy. Not does God want us to be happy, but the joy that can be found in being a follower of His.

Both the Old Testament, both the New Testament, God wants us and has provided us opportunities for joy. That's what we're going to talk about. I'm excited to share this conversation with you today, and so with that, let's get right to it. 

Well, Jeremy, I think one of the things that is often mistaken when we talk about the idea of joy is something that you mentioned in our intro. thEre can be a confusion sometimes between the idea of being joyful and being happy. And I do think that's an important distinction to make. And certainly you could potentially look at that and say, well, you're kind of splitting hairs here a little bit.

And I understand that. And perhaps there is some semantics to this. However, I do think it's important to recognize when we talk about joy, we aren't talking about circumstances that make us happy. We can be joyful in all circumstances. That's what God calls us to do as Christians. He calls us to be joyful people regardless of our circumstances.

I can be sad and still be joyful. And so there's an important distinction to make as a Christian, that we understand when we talk about being joyful, it's not walking around with a smile on your face all the time or never being sad about anything. That's not it at all. This is, this is a mindset. This is a part of who we are.

We are to be joyful people. And so I think today we'll talk about ways in which we can become more joyful in our walk with Christ.  And really how we develop  that characteristic within us that eludes joy,  even in situations that may bring us sadness or fear or whatever it may be, we can still be joyful people.

Yeah, I akin it to how we look, certainly biblically, and how we perceive when God calls us to love. Culturally, when we think about love, we think about it as strict emotion. You're falling in and out of love. Somebody does something poor to you. You feel bad about that. You don't have to love them. Somebody does something good for you.

You feel great about that and you love them. That we think about love as that strict emotion. But yet, biblically, it isn't that. There's emotion involved.  But love is a choice. It's so much deeper than that. It's a choice that you make because we're called to love those who persecute us, those who treat us poorly, our enemies.

We're told to love all of those. And so it's so much deeper than just that surface level feeling. To me, that's where joy and happiness is. If you will, comes in culturally when we think about happiness or joy, we think about it strictly as on that only emotional level that if things are going great in my life, I'm super happy about that.

If things aren't going great, I'm super not happy about that. But yet to your point, the way that we're able to even in difficult circumstances, still live with joy is an understanding that joy from God is sits deep. Not on that level only emotional, it is a deeper thing, and so now,  regardless of circumstances, I can have joy.

Just like regardless of circumstances, I can love. I can only do that with an understanding of God and who He is. Regardless of circumstances, I can have joy. The only way that that's possible is an understanding of God and who He is. You know, Paul is such a great example of this. I mean, you can't have a conversation about joy without looking to him and his example that he sets.

You look at a book like, a letter like Philippians, for instance, you know, we oftentimes talk about the theme of that book being joy, largely, and yet Paul's in prison and he's struggling in a lot of ways. And we see both at the end of, of that letter and the end of the first letter he wrote to the Thessalonians that he called on them to be joyful always.

And in 1 Thessalonians 5, verse 16, it says, rejoice always, pray without ceasing. And then verse 18, I think gives us the key to all of this. In everything, give thanks for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus for you. There is a direct. a link that is to be made between joy and thankfulness. If I am continually being thankful, that is going to bring about joy in everything that I'm doing.

And that really should tell me, even in times where I'm sad, I can still be thankful. Even if you take a tragic situation, the loss of a loved one for instance, I can still be thankful for the time I had with that individual. I can be thankful for the example they set. I can, I can be thankful for the presence that they had in my life.

And through that thankfulness, I can find joy because of what God has given to me and the opportunities that he gave me. So even in a moment of tragedy and sadness, I'm still able to find joy through that level of thankfulness that I'm expressing in that moment. And so I think Paul sets a good example for us here at the end of 1 Thessalonians, that joy and thankfulness go hand in hand.

And if we are focused on being thankful, thankful, then joy becomes a byproduct of that. I mean, we see that playing out biblically  in a biblical example in Daniel chapter six. You have Daniel  as an old man here in Daniel chapter six, and the decree made up in a far city kind of way by his enemies. That, listen, if you're approaching, you know, any other God besides, you know, the king, then you're going to be thrown into a den of lions.

And they did that knowing that Daniel, as was his custom, he approached Jehovah multiple times a day. And so you had that incredible passage that Daniel, knowing that this decree had been signed, he's, he's, he's there in front of an open window and he kneels down as was his custom. And the text tells us there in Daniel chapter six that he That and gave thanks.

Mm-Hmm. . Well, you start to think about, you know, where his mind, his understanding is.  He knows he's got enemies out to get him. He knows that this decree was set up probably to get him specifically. He knows that the king is going to have to follow through because this is the decree that's been signed and he is shortly going to be thrown into a den of lions.

But yet, in the midst of that incredibly difficult circumstance, what does he do? Gives thanks. And I think that goes directly to the point you just made. Yeah, one of the passages that probably stands out to a lot of people when we talk about this is in Galatians chapter 5. Where, you know, Paul there talks about the fruit of the spirit, and we've, we've talked oftentimes about how this list that Paul gives, it's not a list of things we are to do in order to be a child of God.

These are characteristics that come from being a child of God and being led by the spirit to use Paul's own words there in Galatians chapter five. But there in verse 22, he says, but the fruit of the spirit is love, joy. Peace, patience, so on and so forth. And so what we're told is that being a part of God and his family brings about joy.

And one of the reasons it brings about joy is because of the great love that has been shown to us by Christ, the hope that we have in him. We talked about that a few weeks ago. We have all of these wonderful blessings in Christ that we should be constantly thankful for because of all of these. things, joy should be a part of who we are as a result of being in Christ, being led by the spirit.

Joy comes as a byproduct of that. And so again, that tells me that joy isn't then dependent upon circumstances. Joy is dependent upon me being close to God and being led by the spirit. That's what my joy is dependent upon. And so if I'm struggling with joy, I shouldn't be looking at my circumstances. I should be looking at my relationship with God and I should be looking at my relationship with his word and asking myself, well, where are the deficits, the deficits there that I need to work on so that I can experience the joy that is to be found in Christ, that's really where our focus should be.

If we're constantly worried about. Well, you know, if things just get a little bit better for me, then joy will be a whole lot easier. We're always going to be disappointed, and we're always going to be falling short, because that's not where true joy is to be found. No, it is in that relationship with God, and you've used a couple of words.

I mean, you know, certainly Paul uses it there in Galatians 5 in, you know, the fruit of the Spirit, love. Joy, peace, he follows that up with, and that's a word that you've just used as well, you know, and understanding that, you know, peace and no worry, no anxiety, all of those things are joy producing things, and those things are only to be found, you know, in a relationship with God.

And so you have Jesus himself, like in Matthew chapter 6, to make the point over and over and over that there's no need to worry. You don't need to spend, you know, any time worrying about your necessities or if you're going to be taken care of. care of because God takes care of his own. He takes care of his people.

And then, of course, you have, you know, the Apostle Paul in Philippians chapter 4. We've already made reference, you know, to that, you know, to that idea of rejoice always. Again, I say rejoice. And then he makes reference of, you know, giving, you know, be anxious for nothing. There's no reason to be anxious or worrisome.

You give all of your concerns. You take everything to God.  And if you do that, the peace that surpasses all understanding will be yours. And, you know, those are joy producing things, but that only comes with that understanding of your need and dependence on that relationship that you have with God. And this is where the joy that a Christian has is not going to be understood by the world.

No. Because in the world's idea of joy, it is very similar, if not the exact same thing as happiness. And it is 100 percent circumstance driven. And so the world is not going to understand the joy that we have because like peace, it surpasses the understanding of the world because it is something that is only found in God.

And that is, is both a comforting thing to keep in mind. It also presents a challenge then as other people see, hopefully see the joy that you have in your life. The only way to truly describe that and to truly help someone else see that is to introduce them to Christ. Because that's where it comes from.

It has nothing to do with my circumstances in life. It has everything to do with my relationship with Christ. And so if we want to help others grow in joy and help others experience the joy that we experience, then the responsibility we have is to lead them to Christ. Because that's the only way it's going to be found.

And that's the only way they're going to be able to experience this joy that we experience. And so it really places on us. It's a responsibility to be evangelistic and to be helpful as others try to find their way to Christ through this messy world around us, because we want others to experience the same joy that we're experiencing.

Yeah, I mean, it's a perspective, you know, in every way. It's certainly a perspective when it comes to Are you focused on this world and its things, or are you focused on God and His things? If you're focused on God and His things, there's incredible joy that comes, certainly in the relationship that we have for Him and the hope that, you know, is set out before us.

But I think biblically there's taught that there's even joy to be found. in this world, if our perspective, you know, with God is right. I mean, we certainly don't have the time to read the entirety of the book of Ecclesiastes, but you take a look at that book and it's pretty clear that if your perspective is not where it needs to be, if your perspective is on the world and your focus is on the world, then worldly Goods and things are absolutely meaningless, but yet that's not what the whole book is about.

I mean, there are passages that make the point that if your focus is on God, that the things in this world can be can be roots of incredible joy and there can be blessing and enjoyment that comes from those things. But the difference isn't in those things. The difference is in our focus. And that's what makes, you know, studying and reading a book like Ecclesiastes really helpful, you know, in an area like this, because sometimes, you know, the Christian is like, well, I've just got to endure this miserable life because I know I've got a great life, you know, ahead of me.

And there's some, certainly at the back end of that statement, there's reality in that.  That's not the idea that God has for us, that there is joy to be had, even in this life, but it isn't going to be if our focus is only here on this life. If our relationship with God is where it needs to be and our focus is where it needs to be, there's joy to be found here for sure.

I think Jesus gives us a very similar message in his words in John 15, and we'll kind of wrap things up there today. And we'll let Jesus kind of tell us about the joy that we can have in him. And I think this really illustrates to us both his perspective on joy and also the opportunity that we have to truly have joy in our lives.

In John 15, beginning in verse number 10, Jesus says, If you keep my Father's commandments, you will abide in my love, just as I have kept my Father's commandments and abide in His love. These things I have spoken to you, that my joy may remain in you, and that your joy may be full.