The IBSA Podcasts
IBSA podcasts contain information from a global community of entrepreneurs and professional advisors dealing with international business structuring and regulatory compliance.
Hosted by Roy Saunders, who has over 50 years’ experience within the financial sector, these podcasts delve into enlightening conversations with a wide range of leading professionals aiming to demystify the complex world of business and provide invaluable insights to help listeners deal with various complex technical matters to best support their business and clients.
Disclaimer: We believe the information in this podcast to be correct at the time of recording. The information given is relevant at the time in line with governmental legislations. Competent counsel in the jurisdiction(s) whose laws are involved should be consulted. The podcast is made available by the IBSA for educational purposes only and to provide general information. The information should not be used or relied upon as a substitute for competent legal advice from a licensed professional in your jurisdiction.
The IBSA Podcasts
Liliya Scott Demystifies Post-Brexit UK Immigration for EU Nationals and Investors
Embark on an enlightening journey through the transformed terrain of UK immigration with the astute guidance of immigration expert Liliya Scott. Our conversation peels back the layers of complexity for EU nationals seeking to navigate the post-Brexit landscape, offering a beacon of understanding in the otherwise murky waters of work permissions and visa categories. Entrepreneurs and their families, in particular, will find the insights on the Global Talent visa and its potential for paving a new life in the UK invaluable. Liliya also sheds light on the delicate intricacies involved in relocating a family, ensuring that every listener leaves equipped with knowledge to make informed decisions about their transatlantic leap.
Liliya's expertise doesn't stop at entrepreneurial aspirations; we also dissect the landscape for high-net-worth individuals, delving into the Innovator visa and what the end of certain visa categories means for future UK investments. With an eye to current global events, we offer special insights for Ukrainian nationals seeking refuge and the path to indefinite leave to remain in the UK. Whether you're a skilled worker aiming to bring your talents to British shores, or an individual planning your long-term residency, this episode is a treasure-trove of expertise, made even richer by the anticipation of more riveting discussions at the upcoming May conference. Join us for a session that promises not only to inform but to transform your understanding of the UK immigration process.
This podcast explores a fictitious case study centred around an entrepreneur’s ambition to develop a task management software company. Click here to read the case study in full.
These issues will be examined in greater detail at our upcoming conference in May. Click here for full details of the conference and to book your ticket.
Hello and welcome to this IBSA podcast on the topic of immigration into the UK. My name is Roy Saunders, founder and chairman of the IBSA, the International Business Structuring Association, a multidisciplinary global association of entrepreneurs and their professional advisors, dedicated to sharing their expertise with each other within a great networking platform. Today, I'm joined by Lillilia Scott of LS Legal Solicitors, and I'm changing my identity from Roy to become Nicholas, the entrepreneur behind my fictitious case study, which formed the framework of our autumn workshops, which Lillilia was kind enough to participate in and which will feature in the forthcoming annual IBSA conference. I direct our listeners to read the case study on the IBSA website under the conference page at the IBSAorg, to fully understand what we'll be discussing today.
Speaker 1:So, lillilia, you know the case study and, as Nicholas, I would like to ask some questions which may help me decide on migrating from the US to the UK, how my wife and children can accompany me, or indeed, if they can come to the UK in advance of my expatriation from the US. So now I'm going back a couple of years and just to let you know, in case you don't remember, as Nicholas, I am an entrepreneur with Austrian nationality and I own various companies in Austria and the US, and I plan to create a UK company. So what advice would you give me looking in order to establish a UK presence post Brexit? As I am an Austrian national, how can I navigate the immigration complexities to ensure a cohesive working environment for my international team?
Speaker 2:Thank you, roy. Thank you for having me. As you mentioned, my name is Lillia Scott. I'm a managing partner of LS Legal Solicitors and I would be happy to help you. As Nicholas, I think the first thing what we would need to consider is where the clients are based. So if you are coming to the United Kingdom from Austria, from European country, then my advice would go one way. However, if you moved to the US and coming from the US to the UK, that would go the other way.
Speaker 2:I think for immigration practitioners nowadays, it's very important to understand whether EU nationals established themselves in the UK before the end of 2020. The date is crucial for EU nationals, so if you've only visited the United Kingdom, that will not help us as much. However, if you've planned already or attempted to establish the business prior to 31st of December 2020, we can look at the more options. Overall, for entrepreneurs coming to the UK, my first advice would be to speak to the tax advisor before you start moving your family and the business into the new jurisdiction.
Speaker 2:Once that is set, the immigration plan is relatively easy. However, it requires lots of firm consideration for the company and the family. So I think at this stage, should the EU national wish to move to the UK, they would need to have permission to work in the United Kingdom and spend more than six months in a year, which means you will need to apply for visas to remain in the United Kingdom. So if we're talking about moving the company, there are a few more categories that would be available to EU nationals. If it's just a family that's moving in, the categories of immigration to the UK would be quite limited.
Speaker 1:Well, just to remind you, I did actually move to the US in 2014 and I planned to come over to the UK in 2021. So I was setting up my business in the UK from about 2019 onwards. I wondered whether I could move my wife and children to the UK who are also Austrian nationals, of course, but they did come with me, obviously, to the United States. So could I move into the UK before I personally come, because I've still got some things that I need to finish off in the US?
Speaker 2:Unfortunately, it's not as easy in 2021 anymore, and the reason and the reason being is obviously United Kingdom living at the European Union. If you were to decide to move your family to the UK from January 2021, they would require a visa to stay in the United Kingdom, regardless whether they're coming from the US as EU nationals or from the European Union. If we're talking about children, again, depending on their age, up to the age of four, children can apply for student visas. However, the studies need to be at the private educational establishment was the permission to work. Up to the age of 12, the children can stay on the student visa and only one of the parents can join them on the parent of a student visa, allowing them just to stay in the United Kingdom with children.
Speaker 2:Now, what happens when your children turn 12,? Then the parent needs to leave the UK if they have not secured another type of visa allowing them to stay there, Because the idea is that the parent can support the children up to the age of 12, and after children turn age of 12, students that is, foreign students they would need to go into full boarding For the parents. Then we would need to consider different options In the scenario that we have now. And to your question whether the family can move without the entrepreneur they can, but it's a very limited option which doesn't allow our spouse to work for one of the parents I'm planning to come over anyway.
Speaker 1:so let's assume that in 2021, I do make an application to come over with my wife and my children. What's the method that I go about? I have substantial funds. Are those funds required? What levels of wealth do I need to have in order to be able to get the general visa here?
Speaker 2:There are a few options for you nationals to come to the UK. One of the options is a global talent visa. If you are succeeding in the area of your expertise, we can consider this option, because global talent visa would allow you to stay in the United Kingdom between three to five years, depending on the type of the global talent visa that you will secure. Your family would be able to come with you as your dependents and they will have the same rights as you would. I would be able to stay here travel. The category of the global talent visa leads indefinitely to remain, which would allow you to stay in the United Kingdom for as long as you want without any restrictions. The other category we can consider for an entrepreneur is innovative visa. Innovative visa brings migrants that got innovative idea of the business that they wish to set up in the United Kingdom and run.
Speaker 2:Obviously, there are other requirements that you need to satisfy, but it's not about the wealth that you've got behind you, even though I must say that the home office fees at present are quite high. The home office fees consist of two types of payments. The first one is for the processing of your visa application, which is goes to the home office. And the second is immigration health surcharge fees. It's a one-off payment that would go into NHS fund, allowing you to use the NHS for free once you are in the United Kingdom. Keep Hate, Faith plaid, Listen, play. The payment that you make towards the NHS almost doubled for every year of the visa you're receiving.
Speaker 1:What is it roughly?
Speaker 2:It used to be just over 600 pounds. Now it's just over 1,100 pounds For every year of visa you are getting. So if you are getting a three-year visa, it's just a one-off payment of at least 3,000 pounds to an NHS. The visa fee varies depending on the application, but it's in the region of from 750 pounds to 2,000 pounds for each individual applicant. So I think sometimes for the family, when they look into move to the United Kingdom, they need to put aside at least 10,000, 15,000 pounds for the whole family just for the visa fees.
Speaker 2:Obviously, if you have the legal representatives, that could go up as well, but UK legal fees are not as scary as in the US, for example. So I think at this stage we can consider the global talent visa, we can consider the innovative visa, we can look at the skilled worker visa, which would entail you working for somebody or setting up your own business, and if your business requires you as an employee bringing you in. It's a bit more complicated to consider this category and we can talk about it in detail, but it's all down to what structure of the business you plan to have, how many employees you plan to have and what's the intention. I think I would certainly consider the global talent visa, which would give you more flexibility, as it doesn't connect you to obligation of setting up your own business or working for somebody or working for yourself. It gives you a bit of a freedom in the United Kingdom and again allows the shorter route to indefinitely remain, which is in three years time, where all those restrictions would be lifted and you can continue your residence freely.
Speaker 1:Are these three different types of visas the global talent visa, the innovative visa and the skilled workers visa? Are they specific for EU, because you mentioned, since he's coming from the EU, what about US people or Australian people? Do they have the same visa application possibilities?
Speaker 2:Yes, it's a very good question. Yes, they would. The short answer Australian nationals. They might have one more category that would be available for them. It's a use mobility scheme allowing common-lawsh citizens to come and join the United Kingdom, but it doesn't lead to indefinitely to remain. Since the United Kingdom left the European Union, eu nationals, new EU nationals that haven't had any kind of contact with the United Kingdom or the immigration to the United Kingdom before by 31st of December 2020, they are all the same in the eyes of the United Kingdom foreign nationals that come into the United Kingdom to work or stay or reside for a long period of time. So, whether it's EU national or third-party third-country nationals any other nationalities that require visa to the UK they would go through the same process.
Speaker 1:Now a lot of countries, as you know I know Cyprus, malta, other countries. They have the investor visa where you pay a certain amount of money and that gives you the visa, the right to go to there. We don't have an investor visa such in the UK.
Speaker 2:Not anymore. We used to have two very amazing categories available for high-near-worth individuals. We used to have an investor visa that would require £2 million investment into the UK company, or an entrepreneur visa that would require £200,000 investment into your own business or somebody else's business. Both of these categories were closed down. Any migrants that started the route they were allowed to finish it, to get to indefinitely to a main point or change into a different category, but at the moment we do not have any investment opportunities in the United Kingdom. Instead, we've created an innovators' visa that requires establishment of innovative business that would definitely grow, that would either create ten full-time positions for local residents for at least a year, or the company would be able to advance the technology that they're developing and obtain intellectual rights on the product that they're issuing. The overall statement of the United Kingdom. We would like to attract the brightest and the best into the United.
Speaker 1:Kingdom.
Speaker 2:That's why we have a global talent and innovative visa and the government is really pushing for these categories.
Speaker 1:So in that respect, constantine, who's my CTO in America and who I brought in from Ukraine actually I would like to bring him over to the UK once I'm here. Is that going to be under the skilled workers' visa? Do you think I'm going to have my company and I need to employ somebody like Constantine?
Speaker 2:Most definitely. I think that would be the most cost-effective way for you to bring Constantine over through the skilled working.
Speaker 1:Yeah, do I have to advertise for UK people to do that job rather than Constantine?
Speaker 2:Not anymore. It used to be the requirement of resident labour market tests previously. However, the government decided that they've cut down on immigration so much. Maybe they would let the employers breathe a little bit and lifted the requirement. So at present, once you moved to the United Kingdom and established your business, you will need to apply for sponsorship license for your company, allowing the company to employ foreign nationals, foreign employees. Once you obtain the license, it will be valid for four years and it doesn't have a limit of how many employees you wish to bring.
Speaker 2:You can find some employees within the United Kingdom that also require the work. For example, there are foreign students. By foreign, I mean EU nationals or other nationalities, students that finish their education. Their student visas are coming to an end. You can employ them and they will be required to go through the skilled worker visa, and they can apply from within the country. The requirements are a little bit different, but the route is the same. The license is the same. Anyone coming from the US, they would need to apply for a skilled worker visa at the British Embassy. The application will be made online.
Speaker 2:You will need to prove that the person that you are bringing can satisfy certain requirements. One of the requirements is they actually need it by your company. So it's not the role that you created just to bring the friend over. It's something that the company genuinely require. And once the position been identified, you will need to show person CV and their work experience and education that would confirm that they can do the position that you are taking them on. On top of that, their immigration history need to be clean. Any kind of previous adverse immigration history with the United Kingdom will be taken into account. You need to pay the person this minimum salary as set by the government, by the Home Office, for the position that you are taking them on. So, overall, it's not about minimum salary, it's about minimum salary for the position that Home Office thinks is fair.
Speaker 1:The fact that he's Ukrainian? Would that have any benefit in today's world, where we're trying to support Ukrainian immigration?
Speaker 2:I do it myself as well quite a lot and with Ukrainian nationals that coming from Ukraine or resided in Ukraine on January 2022, they can benefit from the Ukrainian schemes. There are four of them. However, if it's someone who has been residing outside the Ukraine for quite some time, they won't be able to benefit from the scheme unless they had a visit visa to the UK that was issued by the 16th of November 2023, I believe. Then they can switch that visa into the Ukrainian scheme and, unfortunately, ukrainian scheme doesn't Lead to indefinitely to remain it's very uncertain way or staying in the UK, but it's still amazing route that the UK government created for Ukrainian, supporting them and the family, okay and one of the things that concerns me a little bit is that I'm going for indefinitely to remain in the UK Assuming that that's the case.
Speaker 1:But I have businesses outside of the UK so I travel an enormous amount and I understand I have to be in the UK during that five-year period For a certain amount of time. Is that correct?
Speaker 2:Well, the short answer would be yes, that is correct. There is a requirement to stay in the United Kingdom certain amount of time. The only thing that, I would add, you can obtain indefinitely to remain either in three years or five years, depending on which category you've chosen. So, global talent, innovative visa, there is a possibility of obtaining indefinitely to remain in three years time the short, the shortest period of time. If you're talking about the skilled worker visa, it's five years. Partner visa and some other categories, you would need to reside in the United Kingdom for a continuous period of five years.
Speaker 2:Now, continuous period Residency in the United Kingdom considered to be not broken and If you are staying in the UK at least six months in any consecutive 12 months period. So if you're looking at the three years Root towards indefinitely to remain as a global talent migrant, you need to count your days of absences. Say, if you fly often, we need to know how often you can fly often, as long as it's not more than six months in a year. If it's more than six months in a year, you would either extend your visa until you get the three consecutive years of continuous residence or Maybe you've had some exceptional circumstances that you can present to the home office and home office has the power of Discretion and exception to the rule and they may admit to your explanations.
Speaker 2:We've had many clients now that've been absent from the UK for more than they anticipated due to COVID restrictions, some due to poor personal reasons. Now, at present, the home office does not see an An exception of you traveling for business. Unfortunately, now it's all Down to you as well, because if your business is very successful and it brings many Benefits to the United Kingdom and it is absolutely necessary for you to travel to maintain that business and that benefit, it could be argued that the exception should be made in your case.
Speaker 1:Okay, so it needs to be considered further. Fine, well, I'm just about to write, switching from Nicholas back to Roy, I'm just about to write Something. Well, actually I wrote it back in two thirty in 1998. I think it was called the offshore nightmare and it was what goes long sometimes when you plan and complicated tax issues and so on, and it goes very, very wrong. I just wondered whether you had anything to finish off this podcast that you've experienced, which is similar to the offshore nightmare, where, where people have done certain things and, without realizing it, they've got into a lot of trouble.
Speaker 2:Yes, we've had Quite an issue was one of our clients In relation to the residents in the United Kingdom whether they had to spend certain amount of days in another jurisdiction to for the tax purposes, which clashed with our days that they have to spend in the United Kingdom.
Speaker 2:Yeah so one of my clients. We would have a meeting every six months when we would review her days and nights in the United Kingdom. Then we will contact her Advisors from other jurisdictions and together they will count their days and nights so we can then work out our plan for the next six months when she would need to travel, leave and where she can give instructions Instructions towards her business, because, as you know, from the tax point of view the decision making also matters In which jurisdictions you are taking. I must say it was very successful case. We have lived through five years Peacefully with the client and at the end we managed to satisfy immigration requirement of continuous residents and obtained her indefinitely to remain and she kept her tax residency in another jurisdiction. She still was a UK tax resident for the UK purposes because obviously she spent here six months in a year, but she kept exactly what she wanted to do jurisdictions and the taxes were very interesting because the double tax treaties.
Speaker 1:Obviously there was a double tax treaty involved, but normally if somebody is here for more than six months that would be difficult to say that they should be resident somewhere else. I'd be very interested in another time we can talk about that, but that sounds fascinating. And yes, the statutory residence test, which determines residents, could well be at odds with the immigration requirement. So I do understand that. It's been fascinating. I think it's a really interesting understanding of what my options are, what the family's options are and so on, what the employees options are as well. So thank you for Lillian for joining me today. I'm sure me, as Nicholas, would be extremely grateful for these insights and I might have some more questions for you at the May conference, which I hope you're going to attend. Details are on our website at theIBSAorg. So I'm now changing back to Roy Saunders. I conclude this podcast by thanking you very much, lillian, for a fascinating understanding of immigration, and thank you to our listeners for listening.