{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"startTime":0.0,"endTime":4.2,"body":"Coming up on the Leadership Growth Podcast."},{"startTime":4.2,"endTime":6.96,"body":"Where is your locus of control?"},{"startTime":6.96,"endTime":10.86,"body":"Where is your power that you believe you have?"},{"startTime":10.86,"endTime":14.04,"body":"And how much responsibility can you take for it?"},{"startTime":14.04,"endTime":18.12,"body":"Oftentimes we can kind of go into two different mindsets."},{"startTime":18.12,"endTime":20.52,"body":"One is more of the passive."},{"startTime":20.52,"endTime":22.68,"body":"Sometimes it's termed the victim."},{"startTime":22.68,"endTime":26.36,"body":"Or it's essentially assuming that the ability"},{"startTime":26.36,"endTime":30.12,"body":"to control things is outside of you."},{"startTime":30.12,"endTime":31.84,"body":"And it's they."},{"startTime":31.84,"endTime":33.56,"body":"They did this to me."},{"startTime":33.56,"endTime":35.44,"body":"It's their problem."},{"startTime":35.44,"endTime":37.44,"body":"And it's outside of you."},{"startTime":37.44,"endTime":41.2,"body":"Versus the other way of thinking about something is,"},{"startTime":41.2,"endTime":42.24,"body":"no, no, no."},{"startTime":42.24,"endTime":46.3,"body":"I have a level of power and control and influence."},{"startTime":46.3,"endTime":48.52,"body":"I wanna recognize it."},{"startTime":48.52,"endTime":49.92,"body":"I wanna understand it."},{"startTime":49.92,"endTime":51.08,"body":"And I wanna utilize it."},{"startTime":51.08,"endTime":54.2,"body":"And that does not mean that I'm gonna always make"},{"startTime":54.2,"endTime":56.6,"body":"the best or perfect choice."},{"startTime":56.6,"endTime":58.92,"body":"But I wanna play."},{"startTime":58.92,"endTime":63.78,"body":"I wanna be in the arena, as it's often described."},{"startTime":63.78,"endTime":66.14,"body":"I want to be able to be active."},{"startTime":66.14,"endTime":67.54,"body":"I wanna make a difference."},{"startTime":67.54,"endTime":69.82,"body":"I wanna keep trying."},{"startTime":69.82,"endTime":73.54,"body":"And it's often in that effort to keep trying,"},{"startTime":73.54,"endTime":78.0,"body":"that is where the greater level of not only respect"},{"startTime":78.0,"endTime":81.62,"body":"and appreciation and admiration comes,"},{"startTime":81.62,"endTime":84.8,"body":"it's where progress can be made."},{"startTime":84.0,"endTime":92.0,"body":"(upbeat music)"},{"startTime":92.0,"endTime":95.0,"body":"Hey everyone, welcome to another episode"},{"startTime":95.38,"endTime":97.46,"body":"of the Leadership Growth Podcast,"},{"startTime":97.46,"endTime":101.34,"body":"where we talk about great tools, ideas, and tips"},{"startTime":101.34,"endTime":105.68,"body":"to help you continue to elevate your leadership ability."},{"startTime":105.68,"endTime":108.08,"body":"I'm Daniel Stewart, joined with my brother Peter Stewart."},{"startTime":108.08,"endTime":109.64,"body":"We're your hosts."},{"startTime":109.64,"endTime":113.18,"body":"And we're excited to dive into the episode here today."},{"startTime":113.18,"endTime":117.38,"body":"So as we often do, we wanna start with an Insight"},{"startTime":117.38,"endTime":120.9,"body":"of the Week, something interesting, profound."},{"startTime":120.9,"endTime":122.92,"body":"Well, profound might be overstating,"},{"startTime":122.92,"endTime":125.72,"body":"but it's something interesting here, Peter."},{"startTime":125.0,"endTime":129.0,"body":"(upbeat music)"},{"startTime":129.0,"endTime":132.0,"body":"As we were chatting before the podcast,"},{"startTime":132.1,"endTime":134.34,"body":"you came across with a client of yours,"},{"startTime":134.34,"endTime":137.12,"body":"something that was particularly impressive"},{"startTime":137.12,"endTime":140.18,"body":"in terms of a productivity hack."},{"startTime":140.0,"endTime":142.0,"body":"Tell us about that."},{"startTime":143.0,"endTime":146.0,"body":"Sure, yeah, I think it is, it's a productivity hack."},{"startTime":146.22,"endTime":150.0,"body":"It was a great idea as I was having a coaching session"},{"startTime":150.0,"endTime":152.26,"body":"with a group as they've been assigned"},{"startTime":152.26,"endTime":154.3,"body":"to with accountability partners"},{"startTime":154.3,"endTime":157.9,"body":"to help support each other in their action plan."},{"startTime":157.9,"endTime":161.46,"body":"And the idea that this partnership came up with"},{"startTime":161.46,"endTime":164.62,"body":"is that they set a meeting each week with each other."},{"startTime":164.62,"endTime":166.5,"body":"So it's for an hour long."},{"startTime":166.5,"endTime":170.5,"body":"And the meeting is for them to get things done."},{"startTime":170.5,"endTime":172.46,"body":"So at the start of the meeting,"},{"startTime":172.46,"endTime":174.96,"body":"they both report to each other"},{"startTime":174.96,"endTime":177.7,"body":"what they're gonna do for this next hour."},{"startTime":177.7,"endTime":180.1,"body":"And so this is a team's meeting."},{"startTime":180.1,"endTime":182.54,"body":"And then after they've shared what they're gonna do,"},{"startTime":182.54,"endTime":185.66,"body":"they go on mute, they turn their camera off,"},{"startTime":185.66,"endTime":187.34,"body":"but they keep the meeting going"},{"startTime":187.34,"endTime":189.54,"body":"so that nobody can interrupt them."},{"startTime":189.54,"endTime":191.78,"body":"And they just plug away."},{"startTime":191.78,"endTime":193.76,"body":"They just dive into what they're trying to get done"},{"startTime":193.76,"endTime":195.9,"body":"for the next 55 minutes."},{"startTime":195.9,"endTime":199.44,"body":"And then before the end of the hour,"},{"startTime":199.44,"endTime":203.34,"body":"they get back on the call and report their progress,"},{"startTime":203.34,"endTime":205.06,"body":"report what they were able to do."},{"startTime":205.06,"endTime":210.7,"body":"And so they found it just to be tremendously helpful"},{"startTime":210.7,"endTime":212.02,"body":"to get a lot done."},{"startTime":212.02,"endTime":213.62,"body":"It's so helpful that they're now considering"},{"startTime":213.62,"endTime":215.3,"body":"doing it twice a week."},{"startTime":215.3,"endTime":216.72,"body":"And I thought, what a great idea,"},{"startTime":216.72,"endTime":219.38,"body":"what a great way to leverage, all right,"},{"startTime":219.38,"endTime":222.28,"body":"the systems that we're utilizing,"},{"startTime":222.28,"endTime":225.2,"body":"the environment of constant instant message,"},{"startTime":225.2,"endTime":228.44,"body":"chat, email, ping, whatever."},{"startTime":228.44,"endTime":230.18,"body":"But oh, nope, they're in a meeting,"},{"startTime":230.18,"endTime":231.86,"body":"so people don't disturb them."},{"startTime":231.86,"endTime":235.6,"body":"And they're just heads down getting stuff done."},{"startTime":235.6,"endTime":236.42,"body":"I loved it."},{"startTime":236.0,"endTime":238.0,"body":"I thought it was a great hack."},{"startTime":238.0,"endTime":240.0,"body":"- It's such a clever idea."},{"startTime":240.38,"endTime":243.86,"body":"So say, Peter, you and I are accountability partners."},{"startTime":243.86,"endTime":247.4,"body":"We're trying to help both of us stay focused."},{"startTime":247.4,"endTime":250.02,"body":"So we could book an hour."},{"startTime":250.02,"endTime":253.0,"body":"It looks busy to everybody else."},{"startTime":253.0,"endTime":256.06,"body":"We simply say hi, and then get off"},{"startTime":256.06,"endTime":257.98,"body":"so that we can just do individual work"},{"startTime":257.98,"endTime":261.08,"body":"and then check in at the end of the hour with each of us"},{"startTime":261.08,"endTime":263.46,"body":"to be able to say, hey, did you do the work"},{"startTime":263.46,"endTime":265.42,"body":"that you needed to get done?"},{"startTime":265.42,"endTime":270.42,"body":"So there's some reinforcement and play time,"},{"startTime":270.0,"endTime":274.0,"body":"work time to be able to then dive in and do it."},{"startTime":274.0,"endTime":276.0,"body":"- Correct. Yeah, the majority of that scheduled time"},{"startTime":276.82,"endTime":279.22,"body":"is just to get stuff done."},{"startTime":280.1,"endTime":281.26,"body":"You're working on a task,"},{"startTime":281.26,"endTime":284.5,"body":"maybe it's a report you're trying to generate,"},{"startTime":284.5,"endTime":286.42,"body":"something you're trying to plan."},{"startTime":286.42,"endTime":289.98,"body":"It's that focused, uninterrupted time,"},{"startTime":289.98,"endTime":294.1,"body":"which becomes one of the most precious commodities we have"},{"startTime":294.1,"endTime":295.24,"body":"'cause it's so rare."},{"startTime":295.24,"endTime":300.58,"body":"- Yeah, what I also like is it combines,"},{"startTime":300.58,"endTime":302.5,"body":"or we could combine this idea"},{"startTime":302.5,"endTime":305.54,"body":"as one of the best productivity hacks that I know of"},{"startTime":305.54,"endTime":309.3,"body":"is every day, start with the most important thing,"},{"startTime":309.3,"endTime":312.06,"body":"whatever that is, and that might be challenging"},{"startTime":312.06,"endTime":316.38,"body":"to even figure out, so pick a one, most important thing,"},{"startTime":316.38,"endTime":319.38,"body":"something that is high value add,"},{"startTime":319.38,"endTime":322.5,"body":"and if you combine that with what you were just suggesting,"},{"startTime":322.5,"endTime":326.1,"body":"say like eight o'clock or 7.30, 8.30,"},{"startTime":326.1,"endTime":330.18,"body":"whenever you start the day, quick call, one minute,"},{"startTime":330.18,"endTime":333.08,"body":"and then you do the most important thing"},{"startTime":333.08,"endTime":334.98,"body":"that you need to focus on for that day,"},{"startTime":334.98,"endTime":337.38,"body":"and then you check in at the end of the hour."},{"startTime":337.38,"endTime":339.9,"body":"Anyway, it's just such a great idea"},{"startTime":339.9,"endTime":341.86,"body":"to make sure you're getting stuff done"},{"startTime":341.86,"endTime":344.02,"body":"that adds the greatest value."},{"startTime":344.02,"endTime":346.74,"body":"- Yeah, and the power of support"},{"startTime":346.74,"endTime":349.46,"body":"because you know how easy it is to get distracted."},{"startTime":349.46,"endTime":352.26,"body":"Something might pop up on your phone or something else,"},{"startTime":352.26,"endTime":354.04,"body":"but you know at the end of this hour,"},{"startTime":354.04,"endTime":357.34,"body":"you're gonna have to report on what you got done,"},{"startTime":357.34,"endTime":361.78,"body":"and that accountability is such a strong driver."},{"startTime":361.78,"endTime":363.54,"body":"So it's leveraging our natural tendency."},{"startTime":363.54,"endTime":365.34,"body":"We don't wanna disappoint somebody."},{"startTime":365.34,"endTime":367.38,"body":"We wanna be able to get a good report."},{"startTime":367.38,"endTime":368.78,"body":"Hey, I was able to crank this out."},{"startTime":368.78,"endTime":370.58,"body":"I got all this done."},{"startTime":370.58,"endTime":372.12,"body":"So use it to your advantage."},{"startTime":373.0,"endTime":375.0,"body":"- I like it, I like it."},{"startTime":375.0,"endTime":379.0,"body":"So listeners, everyone who's listening in today, try it."},{"startTime":379.38,"endTime":380.7,"body":"Test it out."},{"startTime":380.7,"endTime":384.64,"body":"Pick a trusted colleague, somebody who can help support you."},{"startTime":384.64,"endTime":386.62,"body":"Try it for a week or two."},{"startTime":386.62,"endTime":388.22,"body":"Let us know how it goes."},{"startTime":388.22,"endTime":392.86,"body":"Write it in the notes here below."},{"startTime":392.86,"endTime":394.02,"body":"That'd be great."},{"startTime":394.02,"endTime":397.5,"body":"Okay, Peter, Memory Lane time."},{"startTime":397.0,"endTime":401.0,"body":"(upbeat music)"},{"startTime":401.0,"endTime":404.0,"body":"And as we were talking through this,"},{"startTime":404.14,"endTime":409.06,"body":"you brought up a great point of as we were kids"},{"startTime":409.06,"endTime":411.38,"body":"and we'd go into dad's office,"},{"startTime":411.38,"endTime":416.86,"body":"you could see evidence all over his office"},{"startTime":416.86,"endTime":419.62,"body":"of the kinds of clients he worked with,"},{"startTime":419.62,"endTime":421.86,"body":"the kinds of work he did,"},{"startTime":421.86,"endTime":424.66,"body":"and we were always trying to figure out what exactly it was,"},{"startTime":424.66,"endTime":426.3,"body":"but he was very open about it."},{"startTime":426.3,"endTime":428.82,"body":"And I distinctly remember going in"},{"startTime":428.82,"endTime":431.8,"body":"and seeing a space shuttle, for example,"},{"startTime":431.8,"endTime":436.8,"body":"or an SR-71 because he worked with NASA for so many years"},{"startTime":436.8,"endTime":440.74,"body":"and with Lockheed and so many defense contractors."},{"startTime":440.74,"endTime":442.74,"body":"And so we got a sense of that"},{"startTime":442.74,"endTime":445.82,"body":"and he was very, very open about sharing"},{"startTime":445.82,"endTime":447.96,"body":"some of the fun clients."},{"startTime":447.96,"endTime":450.2,"body":"We didn't always necessarily know when we were younger"},{"startTime":450.2,"endTime":453.92,"body":"what he did, but we learned a little bit more."},{"startTime":453.92,"endTime":457.76,"body":"But those are some memories that I had and always enjoyed."},{"startTime":457.0,"endTime":462.0,"body":"And he has a lot of those models still today."},{"startTime":462.0,"endTime":463.0,"body":"- Oh, very much so."},{"startTime":463.82,"endTime":466.66,"body":"There are airplanes all over sitting on his bookcase"},{"startTime":466.66,"endTime":471.2,"body":"or coins he might've gotten from people he's working with"},{"startTime":471.2,"endTime":476.2,"body":"in the military or other little knickknacks and swag,"},{"startTime":476.2,"endTime":479.46,"body":"you could say for various places he'd go."},{"startTime":479.46,"endTime":483.38,"body":"And it was just him wanting to bring his life,"},{"startTime":483.38,"endTime":486.24,"body":"kind of open it up a little bit for us to be aware."},{"startTime":486.24,"endTime":489.3,"body":"And as we look over time, there are a few offices he had"},{"startTime":489.3,"endTime":491.52,"body":"which were out of the house,"},{"startTime":491.52,"endTime":493.28,"body":"and then there are times in which he was working"},{"startTime":493.28,"endTime":494.52,"body":"out of the home."},{"startTime":494.52,"endTime":498.48,"body":"And in either situation, it was come in and just explore"},{"startTime":498.48,"endTime":502.56,"body":"and see a little bit more of what dad's life is."},{"startTime":502.56,"endTime":505.32,"body":"Because there's also a part when he went to the office"},{"startTime":505.32,"endTime":508.32,"body":"and went to work, we also thought he was going"},{"startTime":508.32,"endTime":512.08,"body":"to the airport because that's where he was getting ready"},{"startTime":512.08,"endTime":515.88,"body":"to go fly away somewhere else as he'd check in."},{"startTime":515.88,"endTime":519.68,"body":"And he was really good at calling at night so he could chat."},{"startTime":519.68,"endTime":524.68,"body":"But it made me stop to think, okay, am I allowing my kids,"},{"startTime":524.68,"endTime":529.44,"body":"my family to know about what does the work life"},{"startTime":529.44,"endTime":530.52,"body":"look like for me?"},{"startTime":530.52,"endTime":533.44,"body":"Am I open in sharing that?"},{"startTime":533.44,"endTime":535.98,"body":"'Cause people care, they want to know."},{"startTime":538.14,"endTime":541.38,"body":"- Yeah, it's a great point."},{"startTime":541.38,"endTime":544.82,"body":"That was definitely something dad did a great job of,"},{"startTime":544.82,"endTime":549.5,"body":"which was sharing his experiences, who he worked with,"},{"startTime":549.5,"endTime":552.66,"body":"and very open as we ask questions."},{"startTime":552.66,"endTime":556.1,"body":"And the point you mentioned around the airport,"},{"startTime":556.1,"endTime":560.04,"body":"it was the normal thing that when dad was working,"},{"startTime":560.04,"endTime":561.38,"body":"that meant he was gone."},{"startTime":561.38,"endTime":565.5,"body":"And so, some people go to work in the office in the morning"},{"startTime":565.5,"endTime":566.9,"body":"and come home at night."},{"startTime":566.9,"endTime":569.58,"body":"He was like, no, we got to take him to the airport"},{"startTime":569.58,"endTime":572.02,"body":"and he'll be back in three or four or five days."},{"startTime":572.02,"endTime":577.02,"body":"And that was his office in some ways, as he was,"},{"startTime":577.02,"endTime":580.94,"body":"I just did air quotes for people who are listening,"},{"startTime":580.94,"endTime":585.94,"body":"his office in some ways, because that's the life"},{"startTime":585.94,"endTime":587.36,"body":"of a consultant."},{"startTime":587.36,"endTime":591.3,"body":"Anyway, that was the normal life, working life,"},{"startTime":591.3,"endTime":594.46,"body":"as we explored it and grew up with for sure."},{"startTime":596.86,"endTime":600.78,"body":"- And him wanting to share the stories as he came back"},{"startTime":600.78,"endTime":602.88,"body":"and say, this is what I was doing this week,"},{"startTime":602.88,"endTime":604.86,"body":"or these are the people I was interacting with,"},{"startTime":604.86,"endTime":607.9,"body":"and friendships you make, or the funny stories,"},{"startTime":607.9,"endTime":609.14,"body":"just things that happen."},{"startTime":609.14,"endTime":612.56,"body":"So, that's just brings some fun memories."},{"startTime":612.56,"endTime":614.86,"body":"- I love it."},{"startTime":614.86,"endTime":618.62,"body":"All right, onto the topic at hand for today."},{"startTime":618.62,"endTime":620.5,"body":"And this is a fun topic."},{"startTime":620.5,"endTime":625.5,"body":"The topic is based on a story called The Three Envelopes."},{"startTime":625.5,"endTime":628.18,"body":"And we have found this Three Envelopes story"},{"startTime":628.18,"endTime":630.78,"body":"to be one of the most popular videos"},{"startTime":630.78,"endTime":632.74,"body":"that we have on our website."},{"startTime":632.74,"endTime":635.06,"body":"And so we want to talk about this"},{"startTime":635.06,"endTime":636.78,"body":"and offer some additional commentary"},{"startTime":636.78,"endTime":641.78,"body":"because it clearly strikes a nerve with many folks."},{"startTime":641.78,"endTime":647.46,"body":"And it's in some ways kind of a controversial story itself."},{"startTime":647.46,"endTime":650.54,"body":"It makes you both chuckle and shake your head"},{"startTime":650.54,"endTime":651.8,"body":"at the same time."},{"startTime":651.8,"endTime":655.7,"body":"And so let me share this story."},{"startTime":655.7,"endTime":658.98,"body":"I'll share the story, then we can kind of talk through it."},{"startTime":658.98,"endTime":663.5,"body":"So, the story goes that there is a new CEO"},{"startTime":663.5,"endTime":667.96,"body":"who was just named, starting off with an organization."},{"startTime":667.96,"endTime":672.22,"body":"And on the first day that he joined the organization,"},{"startTime":672.22,"endTime":677.1,"body":"he went up to the top floor, as is often the case,"},{"startTime":677.1,"endTime":679.66,"body":"in some of these more traditional organizations,"},{"startTime":679.66,"endTime":682.14,"body":"and walks into his office."},{"startTime":682.14,"endTime":686.58,"body":"And on the way out is the old CEO."},{"startTime":686.58,"endTime":689.34,"body":"And the old CEO is just kind of leaving,"},{"startTime":689.34,"endTime":691.78,"body":"or he had to get something else."},{"startTime":691.78,"endTime":695.02,"body":"And as they briefly, it was kind of an awkward moment,"},{"startTime":695.02,"endTime":698.06,"body":"but as they briefly walked past each other,"},{"startTime":698.06,"endTime":703.06,"body":"the old CEO hands the new CEO three envelopes,"},{"startTime":703.06,"endTime":706.44,"body":"and says, \"Here you go."},{"startTime":707.32,"endTime":708.78,"body":"Look at these later.\""},{"startTime":708.78,"endTime":711.64,"body":"And the CEO's like, \"Okay, fine,\""},{"startTime":711.64,"endTime":712.96,"body":"but you know it's the old CEO,"},{"startTime":712.96,"endTime":715.64,"body":"he's not gonna talk to him for very long,"},{"startTime":715.64,"endTime":718.62,"body":"and kept on talking to other people, and the old CEO left."},{"startTime":718.62,"endTime":722.02,"body":"The new CEO put the envelopes in his pocket,"},{"startTime":722.02,"endTime":725.44,"body":"forgot about them, and at the end of the day,"},{"startTime":725.44,"endTime":727.32,"body":"was about to go home and thought,"},{"startTime":727.32,"endTime":729.22,"body":"\"Oh, what are these envelopes?"},{"startTime":729.22,"endTime":730.74,"body":"Oh, that's right.\""},{"startTime":730.74,"endTime":732.96,"body":"Well, he didn't really have time to open them."},{"startTime":732.96,"endTime":736.2,"body":"And he just put them in the bottom drawer of his desk."},{"startTime":736.2,"endTime":738.52,"body":"And really forgot about them."},{"startTime":738.52,"endTime":742.64,"body":"Went on about his business, trying to build a new team,"},{"startTime":742.64,"endTime":745.4,"body":"get his organization all ready to go."},{"startTime":745.4,"endTime":747.88,"body":"Well, about five, six months later,"},{"startTime":747.88,"endTime":750.12,"body":"things were not going very well."},{"startTime":750.12,"endTime":754.22,"body":"Their stock wasn't performing very well,"},{"startTime":754.22,"endTime":756.72,"body":"they were having some challenges on the team,"},{"startTime":756.72,"endTime":759.28,"body":"they were having some internal process aspects,"},{"startTime":759.28,"endTime":763.44,"body":"supply chain challenge, I mean, lots of challenges."},{"startTime":763.44,"endTime":765.24,"body":"And it was late at night one night,"},{"startTime":765.24,"endTime":766.92,"body":"and he was like, \"I don't know what to do.\""},{"startTime":766.92,"endTime":768.12,"body":"And then he remembered."},{"startTime":768.12,"endTime":772.44,"body":"\"Wait a minute, I had those three envelopes,"},{"startTime":772.44,"endTime":775.5,"body":"that previous CEO, I wonder what those were?\""},{"startTime":775.5,"endTime":778.84,"body":"And he remembered, he's like, bottom drawer,"},{"startTime":778.84,"endTime":781.9,"body":"and he opens up, and he sees they're numbered."},{"startTime":781.9,"endTime":786.68,"body":"And he says, \"Open me first,\" on the first one."},{"startTime":786.68,"endTime":788.36,"body":"He's like, \"Okay.\""},{"startTime":788.36,"endTime":793.36,"body":"He opens this up, and all it says inside this envelope"},{"startTime":794.02,"endTime":797.8,"body":"was \"blame the previous CEO.\""},{"startTime":797.8,"endTime":804.6,"body":"And he's like, \"Well, that's actually a great idea."},{"startTime":804.6,"endTime":806.58,"body":"That'll buy me a lot of time."},{"startTime":806.58,"endTime":808.24,"body":"That's what I should start to do."},{"startTime":808.24,"endTime":812.1,"body":"I should blame the previous CEO for all of these problems,"},{"startTime":812.1,"endTime":814.3,"body":"'cause I didn't cause them.\""},{"startTime":814.3,"endTime":817.66,"body":"No, and so, sure enough, he went out the next day"},{"startTime":817.66,"endTime":819.32,"body":"and started saying, \"You know what?"},{"startTime":819.32,"endTime":821.16,"body":"This is all because of what happened"},{"startTime":821.16,"endTime":823.68,"body":"under the previous person's watch.\""},{"startTime":823.68,"endTime":825.12,"body":"And that's what happened."},{"startTime":825.12,"endTime":828.56,"body":"And that just kept going for months."},{"startTime":828.56,"endTime":831.92,"body":"And then about five or six months later,"},{"startTime":831.92,"endTime":833.82,"body":"it just wasn't working anymore,"},{"startTime":833.82,"endTime":836.62,"body":"because it was kind of too far past the point"},{"startTime":836.62,"endTime":839.24,"body":"that you could really blame the previous CEO."},{"startTime":839.24,"endTime":842.0,"body":"So late one night, he was struggling,"},{"startTime":842.0,"endTime":845.78,"body":"and he thought, \"Wait a minute, there's a second envelope."},{"startTime":845.78,"endTime":847.76,"body":"What's in the second envelope?\""},{"startTime":847.76,"endTime":849.7,"body":"And he opens up the second envelope,"},{"startTime":850.72,"endTime":854.18,"body":"and it says one word, \"reorg.\""},{"startTime":854.18,"endTime":858.08,"body":"In other words, reorganize things."},{"startTime":858.08,"endTime":859.76,"body":"And he's like, \"That's it."},{"startTime":859.76,"endTime":860.84,"body":"That's brilliant."},{"startTime":860.84,"endTime":861.84,"body":"I need to reorganize,"},{"startTime":861.84,"endTime":866.24,"body":"because that will solve all of my problems.\""},{"startTime":866.24,"endTime":868.16,"body":"So he went out the next day,"},{"startTime":868.16,"endTime":870.36,"body":"started reorganizing his team,"},{"startTime":870.36,"endTime":872.8,"body":"and started reorganizing the different functions."},{"startTime":872.8,"endTime":875.6,"body":"And he started going a six to 12-month effort"},{"startTime":875.6,"endTime":879.42,"body":"to reorganize the entire company and restructure it."},{"startTime":880.42,"endTime":885.14,"body":"And then about a year later, things weren't going too well."},{"startTime":885.14,"endTime":888.9,"body":"The restructure really hadn't landed in the right place."},{"startTime":888.9,"endTime":892.54,"body":"And he was sitting by himself late at night,"},{"startTime":892.54,"endTime":894.7,"body":"and he realized there was a third envelope."},{"startTime":894.7,"endTime":899.54,"body":"He opened it up, and all it said was,"},{"startTime":899.54,"endTime":902.38,"body":"\"Write another three envelopes.\""},{"startTime":902.38,"endTime":906.64,"body":"And he sat back, and he knew he was done."},{"startTime":908.62,"endTime":911.78,"body":"And he knew the pattern that had just been repeated."},{"startTime":911.78,"endTime":915.38,"body":"So that's the story."},{"startTime":915.38,"endTime":917.46,"body":"And it's fascinating, 'cause I've heard this"},{"startTime":917.46,"endTime":920.12,"body":"in a few different ways over the years."},{"startTime":920.12,"endTime":924.34,"body":"And as I share this with groups, as I mentioned,"},{"startTime":924.34,"endTime":929.1,"body":"it's both, it kind of engenders some chuckling or smiles,"},{"startTime":929.1,"endTime":932.74,"body":"and yet at the same time, it's deeply depressing"},{"startTime":932.74,"endTime":937.74,"body":"and cynical and makes you just wanna shake your head."},{"startTime":937.92,"endTime":942.54,"body":"And so as we saw how often this is downloaded as a video"},{"startTime":942.54,"endTime":946.02,"body":"and how popular this is from our website,"},{"startTime":946.02,"endTime":949.38,"body":"we wanted to talk about this,"},{"startTime":949.38,"endTime":952.98,"body":"because there are realities that are associated"},{"startTime":952.98,"endTime":958.18,"body":"with this story, and yet there are also ways"},{"startTime":958.18,"endTime":961.8,"body":"that we can avoid these mistakes"},{"startTime":961.8,"endTime":965.1,"body":"and avoid the mindset and frame of reference"},{"startTime":965.1,"endTime":969.96,"body":"that leads to thinking that these envelope messages"},{"startTime":969.96,"endTime":974.28,"body":"are actually right, because they aren't."},{"startTime":974.28,"endTime":976.08,"body":"And that's what I wanna emphasize."},{"startTime":976.08,"endTime":978.2,"body":"We want to avoid those messages"},{"startTime":978.2,"endTime":980.34,"body":"because they are not helpful."},{"startTime":980.34,"endTime":982.14,"body":"They are the opposite."},{"startTime":982.14,"endTime":986.44,"body":"So, Peter, now that I've kind of shared this,"},{"startTime":986.44,"endTime":988.92,"body":"start us off with some of your commentary."},{"startTime":988.92,"endTime":991.64,"body":"What are your thoughts and reactions to this story?"},{"startTime":994.6,"endTime":998.28,"body":"Yeah, I think one of the first is that realizing"},{"startTime":998.28,"endTime":1002.12,"body":"why this resonates with so many, it's 'cause we've seen it."},{"startTime":1002.12,"endTime":1003.36,"body":"We've observed it."},{"startTime":1003.36,"endTime":1005.76,"body":"Whether we've been a leader that's been a part"},{"startTime":1005.76,"endTime":1007.24,"body":"of a team that's gone through it,"},{"startTime":1007.24,"endTime":1010.36,"body":"we've been a part of an organization that we've watched this."},{"startTime":1010.36,"endTime":1014.74,"body":"And this happens not just in business organizations."},{"startTime":1014.74,"endTime":1018.08,"body":"You can watch this in so many different aspects of life,"},{"startTime":1018.08,"endTime":1019.24,"body":"politics and other things."},{"startTime":1019.24,"endTime":1021.08,"body":"It's this pattern."},{"startTime":1021.08,"endTime":1024.16,"body":"And so I think it really does get at the core"},{"startTime":1024.16,"endTime":1028.12,"body":"of, wow, this happens, but it doesn't help."},{"startTime":1028.12,"endTime":1030.6,"body":"So yeah, we laugh at human nature."},{"startTime":1030.6,"endTime":1032.4,"body":"We laugh at the cycle being repeated,"},{"startTime":1032.4,"endTime":1035.4,"body":"but it's like, what can we do to break that cycle?"},{"startTime":1035.4,"endTime":1039.7,"body":"So I think that's what's profound about the story."},{"startTime":1039.7,"endTime":1044.12,"body":"So as we look at that first one and this concept of blame,"},{"startTime":1044.12,"endTime":1047.2,"body":"and what is the appeal of blame?"},{"startTime":1047.2,"endTime":1051.48,"body":"The appeal to blame somebody else for what's going on."},{"startTime":1051.48,"endTime":1053.52,"body":"And I think as we look just internally,"},{"startTime":1053.52,"endTime":1055.48,"body":"what does that blame do?"},{"startTime":1055.48,"endTime":1058.84,"body":"If we're the individual trying to blame the circumstances"},{"startTime":1058.84,"endTime":1062.4,"body":"on somebody else, it can give that perception that,"},{"startTime":1062.4,"endTime":1065.28,"body":"oh, we are now free from responsibility."},{"startTime":1065.28,"endTime":1066.68,"body":"It's not our fault."},{"startTime":1066.68,"endTime":1070.88,"body":"How many people love to say, it's my fault?"},{"startTime":1070.88,"endTime":1076.4,"body":"I am the reason why this bad thing happened."},{"startTime":1076.4,"endTime":1080.48,"body":"I mean, it's a hard thing for most any honest person"},{"startTime":1080.48,"endTime":1084.0,"body":"to state, 'cause there's an ownership and responsibility,"},{"startTime":1084.0,"endTime":1088.52,"body":"but oh, it's powerful when a leader or a team member"},{"startTime":1088.52,"endTime":1091.64,"body":"or somebody actually is able to make that statement"},{"startTime":1091.64,"endTime":1094.96,"body":"saying, I own it, it's on me,"},{"startTime":1094.96,"endTime":1097.5,"body":"as opposed to looking for somebody to blame."},{"startTime":1097.5,"endTime":1104.66,"body":"- It also builds on this whole notion of understanding"},{"startTime":1104.66,"endTime":1107.4,"body":"where is your locus of control?"},{"startTime":1107.4,"endTime":1111.32,"body":"Where is your power that you believe you have?"},{"startTime":1111.32,"endTime":1114.52,"body":"And how much responsibility can you take for it?"},{"startTime":1114.52,"endTime":1118.58,"body":"Oftentimes we can kind of go into two different mindsets."},{"startTime":1118.58,"endTime":1120.96,"body":"One is more of the passive."},{"startTime":1120.96,"endTime":1123.14,"body":"Sometimes it's termed the victim,"},{"startTime":1123.14,"endTime":1126.84,"body":"or it's essentially assuming that the ability"},{"startTime":1126.84,"endTime":1130.56,"body":"to control things is outside of you."},{"startTime":1130.56,"endTime":1134.04,"body":"And it's they, they did this to me."},{"startTime":1134.04,"endTime":1135.92,"body":"It's their problem."},{"startTime":1135.92,"endTime":1137.92,"body":"And it's outside of you,"},{"startTime":1137.92,"endTime":1141.68,"body":"versus the other way of thinking about something is,"},{"startTime":1141.68,"endTime":1145.34,"body":"no, no, no, I have a level of power and control"},{"startTime":1145.34,"endTime":1146.8,"body":"and influence."},{"startTime":1146.8,"endTime":1149.04,"body":"I wanna recognize it."},{"startTime":1149.04,"endTime":1150.4,"body":"I wanna understand it."},{"startTime":1150.4,"endTime":1151.58,"body":"And I wanna utilize it."},{"startTime":1151.58,"endTime":1154.68,"body":"And that does not mean that I'm gonna always make"},{"startTime":1154.68,"endTime":1159.42,"body":"the best or perfect choice, but I wanna play."},{"startTime":1159.42,"endTime":1164.28,"body":"I wanna be in the arena, as it's often described."},{"startTime":1164.28,"endTime":1166.64,"body":"I want to be able to be active."},{"startTime":1166.64,"endTime":1168.04,"body":"I wanna make a difference."},{"startTime":1168.04,"endTime":1170.32,"body":"I wanna keep trying."},{"startTime":1170.32,"endTime":1174.04,"body":"And it's often in that effort to keep trying,"},{"startTime":1174.04,"endTime":1178.48,"body":"that is where the greater level of not only respect"},{"startTime":1178.48,"endTime":1182.12,"body":"and appreciation and admiration comes,"},{"startTime":1182.12,"endTime":1185.24,"body":"it's where progress can be made."},{"startTime":1185.24,"endTime":1190.44,"body":"And it's challenging to actually, I'll say fight,"},{"startTime":1190.44,"endTime":1192.1,"body":"but we're not physically fighting."},{"startTime":1192.1,"endTime":1193.18,"body":"We're not even meant,"},{"startTime":1193.18,"endTime":1195.64,"body":"but it is a struggle."},{"startTime":1195.64,"endTime":1198.84,"body":"It is meant to be able to then move."},{"startTime":1198.84,"endTime":1202.4,"body":"And it's in some ways easy to say they."},{"startTime":1202.4,"endTime":1205.76,"body":"He or she, they did it."},{"startTime":1205.76,"endTime":1210.34,"body":"They did it, instead of no, no, no."},{"startTime":1210.34,"endTime":1212.7,"body":"We're all part of this."},{"startTime":1212.7,"endTime":1214.98,"body":"Let's recognize our part."},{"startTime":1214.98,"endTime":1219.98,"body":"And more importantly, let's keep moving forward together."},{"startTime":1219.98,"endTime":1221.88,"body":"And that's something else blame does,"},{"startTime":1221.88,"endTime":1226.88,"body":"is it begins to separate people instead of uniting."},{"startTime":1226.88,"endTime":1230.64,"body":"And so instead of the somewhat easy way"},{"startTime":1230.64,"endTime":1232.72,"body":"of that new CEO saying, yeah,"},{"startTime":1232.72,"endTime":1234.56,"body":"I'm gonna blame the previous one."},{"startTime":1234.56,"endTime":1237.06,"body":"And we see this play out all the time."},{"startTime":1237.06,"endTime":1242.06,"body":"Politicians, new athletic coaches, corporate leaders."},{"startTime":1242.06,"endTime":1244.52,"body":"Yes, it's an easy thing to do."},{"startTime":1244.52,"endTime":1249.48,"body":"However, it does not necessarily position you"},{"startTime":1249.48,"endTime":1254.18,"body":"with the level of power that you have to work with others"},{"startTime":1254.18,"endTime":1255.88,"body":"to accomplish good things."},{"startTime":1255.88,"endTime":1258.24,"body":"- Yeah."},{"startTime":1258.24,"endTime":1261.52,"body":"And how easy it is for us to blame"},{"startTime":1261.52,"endTime":1263.16,"body":"when it's the negative situation."},{"startTime":1263.16,"endTime":1266.44,"body":"To put, as you're talking about that locus of control,"},{"startTime":1266.44,"endTime":1268.48,"body":"to position it on the external factors"},{"startTime":1268.48,"endTime":1270.4,"body":"when things are going bad."},{"startTime":1270.4,"endTime":1273.48,"body":"But then how eager we are when things are going good"},{"startTime":1273.48,"endTime":1276.76,"body":"to put it on, oh, I caused that."},{"startTime":1276.76,"endTime":1278.68,"body":"You know, that was because of me."},{"startTime":1278.68,"endTime":1280.64,"body":"That was stuff I did."},{"startTime":1280.64,"endTime":1285.28,"body":"And so there's that differentiation,"},{"startTime":1285.28,"endTime":1289.6,"body":"that bias toward the externalizing the negative,"},{"startTime":1289.6,"endTime":1291.34,"body":"internalizing the positive."},{"startTime":1291.34,"endTime":1296.2,"body":"And that's not really truly being authentic"},{"startTime":1296.2,"endTime":1298.5,"body":"to life, to ourselves."},{"startTime":1298.5,"endTime":1301.32,"body":"And if we flipped that script,"},{"startTime":1301.32,"endTime":1304.72,"body":"oh, that's when you start to gain willing followers,"},{"startTime":1304.72,"endTime":1308.02,"body":"which is one definition of leadership."},{"startTime":1308.02,"endTime":1311.2,"body":"I think it was Warren Blank, one of my favorite quotes,"},{"startTime":1311.2,"endTime":1312.8,"body":"you know, \"Leadership is the art"},{"startTime":1312.8,"endTime":1314.76,"body":"of gaining willing followers.\""},{"startTime":1314.76,"endTime":1317.16,"body":"And when you flip that script"},{"startTime":1317.16,"endTime":1321.5,"body":"of actually internalizing the negative, it's on me,"},{"startTime":1321.5,"endTime":1326.4,"body":"externalizing the positive, it's on all of you."},{"startTime":1326.4,"endTime":1327.96,"body":"It's all because of you."},{"startTime":1327.96,"endTime":1331.46,"body":"Oh, there's power in that formulation, in that flip."},{"startTime":1331.46,"endTime":1336.92,"body":"- Yeah, I love it 'cause it just continues"},{"startTime":1336.92,"endTime":1341.92,"body":"to reinforce the shifting to the we versus the they,"},{"startTime":1341.92,"endTime":1344.44,"body":"and it builds the camaraderie."},{"startTime":1344.44,"endTime":1348.94,"body":"So let's talk for a second about this second envelope,"},{"startTime":1348.94,"endTime":1352.62,"body":"because the second envelope, reorg, you know,"},{"startTime":1352.62,"endTime":1355.86,"body":"yes, blame, and there's a temptation to do that."},{"startTime":1355.86,"endTime":1360.22,"body":"There's a temptation to assume that all the great stuff"},{"startTime":1360.22,"endTime":1363.86,"body":"is from us and all the bad stuff is from somebody else."},{"startTime":1363.86,"endTime":1367.54,"body":"But then we get into this second temptation,"},{"startTime":1367.54,"endTime":1371.16,"body":"which is to use a leader's power"},{"startTime":1371.16,"endTime":1375.14,"body":"to what we often call boxology,"},{"startTime":1375.14,"endTime":1380.14,"body":"moving the boxes and the sticks on an org chart around."},{"startTime":1380.14,"endTime":1386.3,"body":"And it's one of those representations of power"},{"startTime":1386.3,"endTime":1390.4,"body":"that leaders have, which is to restructure."},{"startTime":1390.4,"endTime":1395.4,"body":"However, moving boxes and sticks on an org chart"},{"startTime":1395.4,"endTime":1399.08,"body":"is not sufficient."},{"startTime":1399.08,"endTime":1401.04,"body":"It is not sufficient."},{"startTime":1401.04,"endTime":1404.84,"body":"And there's a whole suite of additional work, hard work,"},{"startTime":1404.84,"endTime":1407.88,"body":"that needs to be paid attention to around people"},{"startTime":1407.88,"endTime":1411.48,"body":"and empowerment and change management and communication"},{"startTime":1411.48,"endTime":1414.52,"body":"and process redesign and decision-making rights"},{"startTime":1414.52,"endTime":1417.56,"body":"that need to be clarified on and on,"},{"startTime":1417.56,"endTime":1421.88,"body":"instead of simply moving around people"},{"startTime":1421.88,"endTime":1425.22,"body":"and just saying, all right, go to it."},{"startTime":1425.22,"endTime":1429.04,"body":"- You should run through that list again,"},{"startTime":1429.04,"endTime":1431.92,"body":"'cause you just rattled off so many other things"},{"startTime":1431.92,"endTime":1435.1,"body":"that have to be considered to be taken into account"},{"startTime":1435.1,"endTime":1440.1,"body":"as these reorganizations, restructures are being driven."},{"startTime":1440.1,"endTime":1443.48,"body":"And fundamentally, it's helping to understand"},{"startTime":1443.48,"endTime":1448.32,"body":"what is the why behind a potential restructure?"},{"startTime":1448.32,"endTime":1450.68,"body":"What is the strategic rationale?"},{"startTime":1450.68,"endTime":1451.68,"body":"What is the reason?"},{"startTime":1451.68,"endTime":1454.76,"body":"What is the objective we're trying to accomplish"},{"startTime":1454.76,"endTime":1457.28,"body":"by this restructuring?"},{"startTime":1457.28,"endTime":1460.24,"body":"And even before we start getting to shifting around boxes,"},{"startTime":1460.24,"endTime":1462.52,"body":"looking at what are the processes?"},{"startTime":1462.52,"endTime":1463.48,"body":"What are the systems?"},{"startTime":1463.48,"endTime":1464.88,"body":"What are the things we need to have?"},{"startTime":1464.88,"endTime":1467.68,"body":"What are the people we need to have"},{"startTime":1467.68,"endTime":1469.7,"body":"before we just start moving things around?"},{"startTime":1469.7,"endTime":1472.02,"body":"So all these factors to look at,"},{"startTime":1472.92,"endTime":1476.8,"body":"but it's jumping back to that core element"},{"startTime":1476.8,"endTime":1480.54,"body":"of how are we using the power that we have?"},{"startTime":1480.54,"endTime":1484.6,"body":"And are we using it to help us feel better,"},{"startTime":1484.6,"endTime":1488.24,"body":"to help us feel more confident,"},{"startTime":1488.24,"endTime":1492.24,"body":"and to help convince others that we have the power?"},{"startTime":1492.24,"endTime":1495.36,"body":"Or are we using the power to then be able"},{"startTime":1495.36,"endTime":1498.4,"body":"to bring together the resources,"},{"startTime":1498.4,"endTime":1501.6,"body":"to harness, to gather, to bring the folks together,"},{"startTime":1501.6,"endTime":1503.84,"body":"to be able to come up with a better solution?"},{"startTime":1503.84,"endTime":1506.54,"body":"And ultimately, that's what we're describing."},{"startTime":1506.54,"endTime":1508.12,"body":"It's not boxology."},{"startTime":1508.12,"endTime":1510.3,"body":"Hmm, I'm gonna sit at night in my cabin"},{"startTime":1510.3,"endTime":1512.2,"body":"with my feet up on my chair,"},{"startTime":1512.2,"endTime":1515.0,"body":"and I'm going to say, \"You go here, and you go there,"},{"startTime":1515.0,"endTime":1517.14,"body":"\"and this is what happens.\""},{"startTime":1517.14,"endTime":1521.96,"body":"No, it's a very complicated process"},{"startTime":1521.96,"endTime":1525.08,"body":"because of all the ripple effects and the people involved."},{"startTime":1525.08,"endTime":1528.08,"body":"And whoa, lo and behold, you as leader"},{"startTime":1528.08,"endTime":1530.04,"body":"might not actually know absolutely everything"},{"startTime":1530.0,"endTime":1531.0,"body":"that's going on."},{"startTime":1531.72,"endTime":1533.72,"body":"And that's okay."},{"startTime":1533.72,"endTime":1536.44,"body":"You're not expected to know everything that's going on."},{"startTime":1536.44,"endTime":1538.84,"body":"But until you actually tap into the benefits,"},{"startTime":1538.84,"endTime":1542.36,"body":"or the skills and talents and perspectives of others,"},{"startTime":1542.36,"endTime":1546.08,"body":"you're gonna be living in your own power-isolated bubble."},{"startTime":1546.08,"endTime":1551.22,"body":"Right, and let's be clear"},{"startTime":1551.22,"endTime":1555.64,"body":"that restructuring can often be needed."},{"startTime":1555.64,"endTime":1556.88,"body":"Oh, great. But the point is"},{"startTime":1556.88,"endTime":1560.02,"body":"to make sure it's done in a thoughtful way,"},{"startTime":1560.02,"endTime":1562.36,"body":"and with the follow-up that's needed"},{"startTime":1562.36,"endTime":1565.2,"body":"to be able to make sure that the new people"},{"startTime":1565.2,"endTime":1569.48,"body":"in the new roles are set up for long-term success."},{"startTime":1569.48,"endTime":1574.48,"body":"And it's not just a play for short-term gain,"},{"startTime":1574.48,"endTime":1578.8,"body":"or a play to kind of confuse"},{"startTime":1578.8,"endTime":1581.48,"body":"and obscure what really is going on,"},{"startTime":1581.48,"endTime":1583.82,"body":"which is often a misalignment"},{"startTime":1583.82,"endTime":1587.98,"body":"around talent and strategy and process."},{"startTime":1587.98,"endTime":1591.24,"body":"To be able to then meet the client needs."},{"startTime":1591.24,"endTime":1595.2,"body":"These are the deeper challenging conversations"},{"startTime":1595.2,"endTime":1598.1,"body":"to be able to make strategic choices."},{"startTime":1598.1,"endTime":1600.24,"body":"And to make hard choices,"},{"startTime":1600.24,"endTime":1602.68,"body":"that is where it often comes down to."},{"startTime":1602.68,"endTime":1606.32,"body":"So as we do organization design work,"},{"startTime":1606.32,"endTime":1608.32,"body":"anytime a CEO comes to us and says,"},{"startTime":1608.32,"endTime":1610.52,"body":"\"Hey, I wanna reorganize."},{"startTime":1610.52,"endTime":1613.56,"body":"I'm not sure that either the people are right,"},{"startTime":1613.56,"endTime":1615.12,"body":"or we're heading in the right direction,"},{"startTime":1615.12,"endTime":1617.42,"body":"or I don't have as much confidence.\""},{"startTime":1617.42,"endTime":1620.76,"body":"These are all legitimate reasons to consider."},{"startTime":1620.76,"endTime":1623.36,"body":"The point is then to identify,"},{"startTime":1623.36,"endTime":1625.5,"body":"are you gonna just do this by yourself?"},{"startTime":1625.5,"endTime":1628.86,"body":"How are you gonna involve others?"},{"startTime":1628.86,"endTime":1630.72,"body":"What's the degree of commitment"},{"startTime":1630.72,"endTime":1633.34,"body":"that you want to achieve with others,"},{"startTime":1633.34,"endTime":1635.96,"body":"so that they can have a level of buy-in?"},{"startTime":1635.96,"endTime":1637.28,"body":"I often will think,"},{"startTime":1637.28,"endTime":1640.68,"body":"and maybe this deserves another conversation,"},{"startTime":1640.68,"endTime":1643.44,"body":"I will use this kind of change equation"},{"startTime":1643.44,"endTime":1645.94,"body":"to be able to help manage a lot of this,"},{"startTime":1645.94,"endTime":1648.76,"body":"because you can come up with all sorts of great ideas,"},{"startTime":1648.76,"endTime":1650.72,"body":"a technically good solution,"},{"startTime":1650.72,"endTime":1654.2,"body":"or an organizational structure that looks,"},{"startTime":1654.2,"endTime":1656.68,"body":"just that's fantastic."},{"startTime":1656.68,"endTime":1660.2,"body":"But the other part of that equation is the buy-in."},{"startTime":1660.2,"endTime":1662.12,"body":"And if people hate it,"},{"startTime":1662.12,"endTime":1663.48,"body":"they don't agree with it,"},{"startTime":1663.48,"endTime":1665.18,"body":"or they don't understand it,"},{"startTime":1665.18,"endTime":1667.28,"body":"they don't know how to work within it,"},{"startTime":1667.28,"endTime":1671.52,"body":"I don't care how amazing the reorganization is,"},{"startTime":1671.52,"endTime":1674.26,"body":"it is likely not going to work,"},{"startTime":1674.26,"endTime":1676.6,"body":"or at least it's gonna take a long time"},{"startTime":1676.6,"endTime":1679.56,"body":"before it starts to show benefit."},{"startTime":1679.56,"endTime":1681.64,"body":"So you need both of these"},{"startTime":1681.64,"endTime":1685.0,"body":"to be able to then equate an accurate change,"},{"startTime":1685.0,"endTime":1688.0,"body":"sustainable progress moving forward,"},{"startTime":1688.0,"endTime":1689.94,"body":"especially as you restructure."},{"startTime":1689.94,"endTime":1692.52,"body":"So we often will start with"},{"startTime":1692.52,"endTime":1695.36,"body":"identifying what's the design criteria."},{"startTime":1695.36,"endTime":1698.92,"body":"What's the criteria by which you need to reorganize?"},{"startTime":1698.92,"endTime":1701.52,"body":"And there's probably some very good clear criteria,"},{"startTime":1701.52,"endTime":1703.64,"body":"and it's making sure not just identifying it,"},{"startTime":1703.64,"endTime":1705.16,"body":"but making sure that others"},{"startTime":1705.16,"endTime":1707.44,"body":"who are in key leadership roles,"},{"startTime":1707.44,"endTime":1708.98,"body":"they buy into it,"},{"startTime":1708.98,"endTime":1710.36,"body":"they can agree with it,"},{"startTime":1710.36,"endTime":1711.98,"body":"they can support it."},{"startTime":1711.98,"endTime":1714.68,"body":"And then it's having deep conversations"},{"startTime":1714.68,"endTime":1717.44,"body":"around the intended and unintended,"},{"startTime":1717.44,"endTime":1720.4,"body":"possible unintended consequences"},{"startTime":1720.4,"endTime":1722.68,"body":"that may come from restructuring."},{"startTime":1722.68,"endTime":1724.28,"body":"Because there's all sorts of things"},{"startTime":1724.28,"endTime":1726.52,"body":"that can then come about."},{"startTime":1726.52,"endTime":1728.08,"body":"And how do we keep learning?"},{"startTime":1728.08,"endTime":1729.6,"body":"And how do we keep growing?"},{"startTime":1729.6,"endTime":1732.16,"body":"Which goes back to that first envelope,"},{"startTime":1732.16,"endTime":1735.2,"body":"or rather the opposite of the first envelope,"},{"startTime":1735.2,"endTime":1737.44,"body":"is recognizing that we're not gonna be"},{"startTime":1737.44,"endTime":1739.32,"body":"focusing on blaming."},{"startTime":1739.32,"endTime":1741.56,"body":"We're gonna be focusing on learning,"},{"startTime":1741.56,"endTime":1743.56,"body":"and taking responsibility,"},{"startTime":1743.56,"endTime":1746.0,"body":"and continuing to move things forward."},{"startTime":1746.0,"endTime":1750.36,"body":"That, that's gonna get people far farther"},{"startTime":1750.36,"endTime":1753.8,"body":"than the blaming or reorganizing"},{"startTime":1753.8,"endTime":1756.24,"body":"by some individual leader"},{"startTime":1756.24,"endTime":1758.46,"body":"that is just kind of broadcast"},{"startTime":1758.46,"endTime":1761.0,"body":"and obscures some of the real challenges"},{"startTime":1761.0,"endTime":1762.14,"body":"in the organization."},{"startTime":1762.14,"endTime":1767.72,"body":"- Yeah, it's really, it's true."},{"startTime":1767.72,"endTime":1770.48,"body":"And let me share an observation I've had"},{"startTime":1770.48,"endTime":1772.56,"body":"as well as I've talked with leaders,"},{"startTime":1772.56,"endTime":1776.94,"body":"as they will bring up this concept of a restructure."},{"startTime":1776.94,"endTime":1780.24,"body":"And we'll start to look at what the present structure is."},{"startTime":1780.24,"endTime":1782.48,"body":"'Cause it's always a good place to start from."},{"startTime":1782.48,"endTime":1785.36,"body":"All right, what is the current situation?"},{"startTime":1785.36,"endTime":1788.32,"body":"And why has it been that way?"},{"startTime":1789.34,"endTime":1792.16,"body":"And as you start to, inevitably,"},{"startTime":1792.16,"endTime":1795.44,"body":"there are these kind of offshoots"},{"startTime":1795.44,"endTime":1797.92,"body":"to an organizational structure,"},{"startTime":1797.92,"endTime":1802.08,"body":"which were a result of somebody's avoidance"},{"startTime":1802.08,"endTime":1803.86,"body":"of a crucial conversation."},{"startTime":1803.86,"endTime":1809.36,"body":"They were unwilling to have that hard conversation"},{"startTime":1809.36,"endTime":1810.72,"body":"to be able to say,"},{"startTime":1810.72,"endTime":1813.62,"body":"\"Actually, this person shouldn't be here.\""},{"startTime":1813.62,"endTime":1817.4,"body":"Or, \"These two people just couldn't get along,"},{"startTime":1817.4,"endTime":1820.26,"body":"\"so then we had to move something over.\""},{"startTime":1820.26,"endTime":1824.06,"body":"So there was a, it's the tail wagging the dog"},{"startTime":1824.06,"endTime":1826.02,"body":"for those sorts of changes."},{"startTime":1826.02,"endTime":1829.42,"body":"And then what happens is that structure sticks in place"},{"startTime":1829.42,"endTime":1832.64,"body":"even after people have left and gone."},{"startTime":1832.64,"endTime":1835.38,"body":"It's like, why is this division over here by itself"},{"startTime":1835.38,"endTime":1838.26,"body":"when it actually should be over under here?"},{"startTime":1838.26,"endTime":1840.06,"body":"And you see some of the rationale"},{"startTime":1840.06,"endTime":1841.66,"body":"for why those changes happen."},{"startTime":1841.66,"endTime":1844.58,"body":"And it's looking at ourselves as a leader,"},{"startTime":1844.58,"endTime":1847.62,"body":"why are we making this move?"},{"startTime":1847.62,"endTime":1851.1,"body":"And is a movement of structure really the answer,"},{"startTime":1851.1,"endTime":1853.26,"body":"or is it really getting in"},{"startTime":1853.26,"endTime":1856.98,"body":"and having a person-based conversation?"},{"startTime":1856.98,"endTime":1864.08,"body":"- Thank you for bringing this up, 'cause you're spot on."},{"startTime":1864.08,"endTime":1866.5,"body":"And too often the restructuring is meant"},{"startTime":1866.5,"endTime":1871.5,"body":"to kind of obscure or avoid the real performance challenges"},{"startTime":1872.44,"endTime":1874.32,"body":"and the direct performance conversations"},{"startTime":1874.32,"endTime":1875.96,"body":"that need to happen."},{"startTime":1875.96,"endTime":1878.12,"body":"And so that's one of the first questions"},{"startTime":1878.12,"endTime":1880.48,"body":"any organization approaches us saying,"},{"startTime":1880.48,"endTime":1883.7,"body":"\"Hey, please help with reorganization.\""},{"startTime":1883.7,"endTime":1885.5,"body":"And we will often ask,"},{"startTime":1885.5,"endTime":1889.42,"body":"\"How much of it is due to performance challenges?"},{"startTime":1889.42,"endTime":1893.3,"body":"And what have you said to the specific people?"},{"startTime":1893.3,"endTime":1895.94,"body":"And how have you set clear expectations?"},{"startTime":1895.94,"endTime":1898.06,"body":"How have you supported them in their development?"},{"startTime":1898.06,"endTime":1900.48,"body":"How have you provided the resources and skills"},{"startTime":1900.48,"endTime":1902.32,"body":"and development and training?"},{"startTime":1902.32,"endTime":1903.16,"body":"What does this mean?"},{"startTime":1903.16,"endTime":1905.32,"body":"What does this look like?\""},{"startTime":1905.32,"endTime":1908.3,"body":"Just to make sure that it's not just"},{"startTime":1908.3,"endTime":1911.14,"body":"to cover up performance,"},{"startTime":1911.14,"endTime":1914.48,"body":"it is a much bigger issue as well."},{"startTime":1914.48,"endTime":1917.56,"body":"So to be able to have direct conversations,"},{"startTime":1917.56,"endTime":1920.02,"body":"unpleasant as they might be,"},{"startTime":1920.02,"endTime":1923.36,"body":"but that is the job of a great leader,"},{"startTime":1923.36,"endTime":1927.78,"body":"to have a direct conversation, future-focused,"},{"startTime":1927.78,"endTime":1931.38,"body":"learning from the past, but future-focused,"},{"startTime":1931.38,"endTime":1935.86,"body":"to be able to then help align, clarify expectations,"},{"startTime":1935.86,"endTime":1937.02,"body":"to move things forward,"},{"startTime":1937.02,"endTime":1939.42,"body":"and then to make changes as needed."},{"startTime":1939.42,"endTime":1940.62,"body":"Absolutely."},{"startTime":1940.62,"endTime":1942.44,"body":"And sometimes those changes,"},{"startTime":1942.44,"endTime":1945.34,"body":"they do not need a full reorganization"},{"startTime":1945.34,"endTime":1946.88,"body":"or even a partial one."},{"startTime":1946.88,"endTime":1951.34,"body":"They may just need to adapt and adjust the person"},{"startTime":1951.34,"endTime":1953.48,"body":"to fit in a better role."},{"startTime":1953.48,"endTime":1957.9,"body":"- Yeah, it's focused on the people,"},{"startTime":1957.9,"endTime":1960.26,"body":"making sure our motivation's behind it."},{"startTime":1960.26,"endTime":1962.1,"body":"- Makes sense, yeah."},{"startTime":1962.1,"endTime":1964.32,"body":"So we've talked about the two envelopes."},{"startTime":1964.32,"endTime":1967.96,"body":"The first two, talked about the need to blame,"},{"startTime":1967.96,"endTime":1970.04,"body":"how that is a myth of leadership,"},{"startTime":1970.04,"endTime":1972.12,"body":"try and avoid the blame."},{"startTime":1972.12,"endTime":1975.66,"body":"Restructure, it is a tool to be leveraged,"},{"startTime":1975.66,"endTime":1978.78,"body":"but it needs to be utilized appropriately"},{"startTime":1978.78,"endTime":1981.1,"body":"with the right process, the right people involved,"},{"startTime":1981.1,"endTime":1985.04,"body":"and with the right motivation and strategy identified."},{"startTime":1985.04,"endTime":1988.78,"body":"The third letter, write new letters."},{"startTime":1988.78,"endTime":1991.28,"body":"More of a joke on the exit,"},{"startTime":1991.28,"endTime":1996.1,"body":"but any commentary thought on the third letter?"},{"startTime":1996.1,"endTime":1999.38,"body":"Is it, well, we've given up, it's inevitable,"},{"startTime":1999.38,"endTime":2002.18,"body":"somebody else is going to now take the reins?"},{"startTime":2002.18,"endTime":2006.8,"body":"- And what I would say is,"},{"startTime":2006.8,"endTime":2011.8,"body":"if we're able to do the opposite of those first two letters,"},{"startTime":2011.8,"endTime":2015.5,"body":"then there should not be a third letter."},{"startTime":2015.5,"endTime":2018.5,"body":"- The goal is to avoid a third letter."},{"startTime":2018.5,"endTime":2022.08,"body":"I wanna, we wanna avoid the third letter."},{"startTime":2022.08,"endTime":2023.86,"body":"We wanna avoid it."},{"startTime":2023.86,"endTime":2026.34,"body":"Sometimes it gets to the point where,"},{"startTime":2026.34,"endTime":2028.78,"body":"you know, I'm not the right person,"},{"startTime":2028.78,"endTime":2032.18,"body":"and maybe you got it, but no,"},{"startTime":2032.18,"endTime":2034.76,"body":"you wanna have direct conversations."},{"startTime":2034.76,"endTime":2039.04,"body":"You wanna stand up and show responsibility and courage"},{"startTime":2039.04,"endTime":2042.44,"body":"and stay in the struggle."},{"startTime":2042.44,"endTime":2044.74,"body":"That is what's key."},{"startTime":2044.74,"endTime":2049.74,"body":"And so we, I guess this is the main point of all of this."},{"startTime":2049.74,"endTime":2053.94,"body":"We wanna make sure the third letter is never written,"},{"startTime":2053.94,"endTime":2056.38,"body":"because we wanna break the pattern."},{"startTime":2056.38,"endTime":2057.82,"body":"We wanna break the pattern"},{"startTime":2057.82,"endTime":2061.14,"body":"that can sometimes be an easy temptation,"},{"startTime":2061.14,"endTime":2065.42,"body":"which is to blame and to utilize your power as a leader"},{"startTime":2065.42,"endTime":2068.92,"body":"to restructure and to shift things around,"},{"startTime":2068.92,"endTime":2072.02,"body":"as opposed to having the hard conversations"},{"startTime":2072.02,"endTime":2076.42,"body":"with yourself and with others to move things forward."},{"startTime":2076.42,"endTime":2080.98,"body":"That, that is what we, that's the idea"},{"startTime":2080.98,"endTime":2083.16,"body":"we wanna continue to emphasize."},{"startTime":2083.16,"endTime":2085.82,"body":"Peter, what would you add onto that?"},{"startTime":2085.82,"endTime":2087.68,"body":"- That's the moral of the story."},{"startTime":2087.68,"endTime":2089.06,"body":"That's the core issue."},{"startTime":2089.06,"endTime":2092.42,"body":"I also wanna make it very clear that the tale,"},{"startTime":2092.42,"endTime":2095.48,"body":"as we told it, is about the story of a CEO."},{"startTime":2095.48,"endTime":2101.6,"body":"But this tale can be applied to all leaders at any level."},{"startTime":2101.6,"endTime":2104.16,"body":"You become a first-line manager,"},{"startTime":2104.16,"endTime":2107.4,"body":"you become a general manager, you become vice president."},{"startTime":2107.4,"endTime":2109.7,"body":"Whatever level you're at,"},{"startTime":2109.7,"endTime":2113.36,"body":"where you have people managing responsibilities,"},{"startTime":2113.36,"endTime":2115.22,"body":"you can blame your predecessor"},{"startTime":2115.22,"endTime":2117.98,"body":"and you can look to reorganize your team."},{"startTime":2117.98,"endTime":2121.98,"body":"They are very appealing options."},{"startTime":2121.98,"endTime":2125.9,"body":"So this isn't just talking about those in the C-suite."},{"startTime":2125.9,"endTime":2127.3,"body":"I think we can learn that principle"},{"startTime":2127.3,"endTime":2129.22,"body":"and it applies to all leaders."},{"startTime":2129.22,"endTime":2131.64,"body":"So just to make that application quite clear."},{"startTime":2131.64,"endTime":2135.14,"body":"- Yeah, love it."},{"startTime":2135.14,"endTime":2137.86,"body":"Okay, Lightning Round as we're wrapping up here."},{"startTime":2137.0,"endTime":2142.0,"body":"(upbeat music)"},{"startTime":2142.0,"endTime":2145.0,"body":"As we've talked about The Three Envelopes."},{"startTime":2145.2,"endTime":2150.2,"body":"So Peter, as people hear this story of The Three Envelopes,"},{"startTime":2150.2,"endTime":2153.66,"body":"what is the main takeaway from this story"},{"startTime":2153.66,"endTime":2155.44,"body":"that they need to remember?"},{"startTime":2158.54,"endTime":2160.82,"body":"- The people, everybody needs to remember"},{"startTime":2160.82,"endTime":2164.86,"body":"as they hear this story, that one, they're human"},{"startTime":2164.86,"endTime":2167.38,"body":"and that these are the natural ways"},{"startTime":2167.38,"endTime":2169.5,"body":"to deflect responsibility."},{"startTime":2169.5,"endTime":2172.38,"body":"Why? Because we're trying to protect ourselves."},{"startTime":2172.38,"endTime":2174.16,"body":"Look for ways to blame others,"},{"startTime":2174.16,"endTime":2176.62,"body":"look for ways to blame or alter the system"},{"startTime":2176.62,"endTime":2178.62,"body":"or throw our power in a way"},{"startTime":2178.62,"endTime":2181.7,"body":"that it's able to make us look better."},{"startTime":2181.7,"endTime":2186.16,"body":"And so it takes that conscious effort to fight those,"},{"startTime":2186.16,"endTime":2187.58,"body":"to be able to own it."},{"startTime":2187.58,"endTime":2189.86,"body":"And as I said earlier in the day,"},{"startTime":2189.86,"endTime":2193.38,"body":"when we are able to internalize the blame"},{"startTime":2193.38,"endTime":2195.02,"body":"for the negative things"},{"startTime":2195.02,"endTime":2198.84,"body":"and we're able to externalize the praise for the positive,"},{"startTime":2198.84,"endTime":2201.48,"body":"that's one of the best things we can do as a leader."},{"startTime":2201.48,"endTime":2208.06,"body":"So Daniel, Lightning Round,"},{"startTime":2208.06,"endTime":2211.82,"body":"as organizations are looking to restructure,"},{"startTime":2211.82,"endTime":2215.9,"body":"what is the one thing they have to do"},{"startTime":2215.9,"endTime":2218.7,"body":"to make sure they have a successful restructure effort?"},{"startTime":2218.7,"endTime":2222.82,"body":"- Great question."},{"startTime":2222.82,"endTime":2226.92,"body":"The main focus to have an effective restructuring"},{"startTime":2226.92,"endTime":2230.22,"body":"is to make sure you're restructuring around the work"},{"startTime":2230.22,"endTime":2231.56,"body":"and not the people."},{"startTime":2231.56,"endTime":2236.94,"body":"And that is one of the biggest traps that we can fall into."},{"startTime":2236.94,"endTime":2240.2,"body":"We have this temptation to look at all of the people"},{"startTime":2240.2,"endTime":2242.8,"body":"and to then create jobs to fit them."},{"startTime":2243.66,"endTime":2246.1,"body":"However, we want to start with"},{"startTime":2246.1,"endTime":2247.54,"body":"what is the nature of the work?"},{"startTime":2247.54,"endTime":2249.7,"body":"Where is the value being added?"},{"startTime":2249.7,"endTime":2254.06,"body":"What is the customer or client benefiting the most?"},{"startTime":2254.06,"endTime":2255.5,"body":"And then work backwards"},{"startTime":2255.5,"endTime":2258.7,"body":"and organizing the process and the workflow,"},{"startTime":2258.7,"endTime":2261.66,"body":"and then the structure around that."},{"startTime":2261.66,"endTime":2263.98,"body":"And then you can identify the people"},{"startTime":2263.98,"endTime":2266.58,"body":"to fit well within those areas."},{"startTime":2266.58,"endTime":2268.06,"body":"So the biggest guidance there"},{"startTime":2268.06,"endTime":2271.12,"body":"is to organize around the nature of the work"},{"startTime":2271.12,"endTime":2274.9,"body":"and not as much around the people, first and foremost."},{"startTime":2274.9,"endTime":2281.02,"body":"- Well, this has been a great conversation"},{"startTime":2281.02,"endTime":2283.78,"body":"on these three envelopes as we're wrapping up."},{"startTime":2283.78,"endTime":2285.46,"body":"I hope as you're listening,"},{"startTime":2285.46,"endTime":2287.14,"body":"you're thinking what's that one thing"},{"startTime":2287.14,"endTime":2290.54,"body":"you're going to do different based on this?"},{"startTime":2290.54,"endTime":2293.18,"body":"How can you be a better leader"},{"startTime":2293.18,"endTime":2295.06,"body":"and how can you avoid some of these myths"},{"startTime":2295.06,"endTime":2296.18,"body":"we've been discussing?"},{"startTime":2296.18,"endTime":2300.42,"body":"- Fantastic."},{"startTime":2300.42,"endTime":2304.1,"body":"Well, Peter, another great Leadership Growth Podcast."},{"startTime":2304.1,"endTime":2305.46,"body":"Always fun to chat."},{"startTime":2305.46,"endTime":2309.78,"body":"Listeners, please go on it, like and subscribe."},{"startTime":2309.78,"endTime":2312.18,"body":"And we look forward to having you join us"},{"startTime":2312.18,"endTime":2315.86,"body":"in a future podcast where we talk about tips and tools"},{"startTime":2315.86,"endTime":2318.14,"body":"to help elevate all of our abilities"},{"startTime":2318.14,"endTime":2320.2,"body":"to be the best leaders that we can."},{"startTime":2320.2,"endTime":2322.02,"body":"Take care, everyone."},{"startTime":2322.02,"endTime":2323.0,"body":"Bye."},{"startTime":2323.0,"endTime":2324.42,"body":"- If you liked this episode,"},{"startTime":2324.42,"endTime":2326.3,"body":"please share it with a friend or colleague"},{"startTime":2326.3,"endTime":2328.14,"body":"or better yet, leave a review"},{"startTime":2328.14,"endTime":2330.78,"body":"to help other listeners find our show."},{"startTime":2330.78,"endTime":2334.34,"body":"And remember to subscribe so you never miss an episode."},{"startTime":2334.34,"endTime":2336.24,"body":"For more great content or to learn more"},{"startTime":2336.24,"endTime":2338.34,"body":"about how Stewart Leadership can help you grow"},{"startTime":2338.34,"endTime":2340.42,"body":"your ability to lead effectively,"},{"startTime":2340.42,"endTime":2342.82,"body":"please visit stewartleadership.com."}]}