Thrive In Construction with Darren Evans
'Thrive in Construction' is the only podcast that delves into the personal journeys of sustainability leaders and innovators in the construction industry across the UK. Our show differentiates by offering unscripted, passion-fueled conversations that go beyond the buzzwords to the heart of what's driving the industry forward. It's tailored for aspiring professionals, seasoned experts, and anyone with a keen interest in the sustainable evolution of construction. We're here at a time when the call for sustainable development is not just a trend, but a societal imperative, empowering listeners to build a career that contributes to a greener future.
Thrive In Construction with Darren Evans
Ep. 63 Passivhaus vs Standard Homes: The Hidden Health Benefits Explained
Discover how Passivhaus is reshaping the standard of affordable housing in the UK and why it's more achievable than many think. In this episode of the Thrive in Construction Podcast, Darren sits down with Emma Osmunden, a trailblazer in sustainable housing, to explore her journey pioneering Passivhaus developments in the UK. With over 15 years of experience, Emma shares how she went from initial scepticism to leading the delivery of some of the country’s first certified Passivhaus social homes.
Emma reveals the challenges she faced navigating local government, her creative strategies to get support for her bold ideas, and how she built trust with contractors and consultants to make Passivhaus the new standard. She discusses the importance of designing homes with both climate resilience and occupant wellbeing in mind, touching on building biology, air quality, mental health, and long-term energy performance.
Throughout the conversation, Emma emphasises the value of creating a culture of responsibility without blame on construction sites, and how quality assurance and collaboration can lead to life-changing results for residents. With a growing number of local authorities now following suit, this episode is packed with insights for anyone passionate about the future of sustainable construction.
Links:
Emma's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/emma-osmundsen-ab51a5b9/
Ealing Council: https://www.ealing.gov.uk/site/
Darren: darrenevans.komi.io
The next episodes of Thriving Construction come straight from FutureBuild. Huge thanks to EcoCocoon. The space was great for chats, acoustics and, even better, well-being.
Speaker 2:When they said look, emma, you know you work in affordable housing, you want to eradicate field poverty, you want to deliver the best council houses in the world. We think you should adopt Passive House in the world. Um, we think you should adopt passive house. And so, being a slight maverick and a bit of a disruptor, I kind of said, well, let's try. Let's try what's the worst that can happen. Okay, we don't get certifications, but we still have a really super insulated, healthy, low energy, low carbon home. And we delivered the first and I've never looked back.
Speaker 1:Who did you have to convince in order to get this project to move forward? And then, how did you do it?
Speaker 2:Well, I'm going to let you into a secret because I won't tell anyone, don't worry. I know Because I was working for local government and you know the public sector's got a reputation for being somewhat risk adverse and I knew that if I was going to suggest to them that I was going to be building, you know, some of the first passive house homes in the UK, they were very likely to say no. So I just said to them that we were going to build, you know, homes for older persons that would eradicate fuel poverty and would be really energy efficient. So who wouldn't want that? So we built them.
Speaker 1:So that's where you left it. That was the story. The story was energy efficient homes for elderly people, so we're helping with fuel poverty for elderly people.
Speaker 2:So we're helping with fuel poverty. Yeah, yeah. So it was part of a downsizing initiative to try and entice older people from family-sized homes into smaller homes, and so we did it. We got certified, we put the plaque up and the rest just wait.
Speaker 1:Just grew, grew and grew and and so after you had done that, did anyone come and tap you on the shoulder and say you know that thing that you said? Actually, I didn't realize it was this. Why didn't you tell us?
Speaker 2:um no, I don't think so, because is it just high fives all around? Well done, you've done a great job ultimately, for me, it's not about what I think. It's always about what the residents think. And the great thing about Passive House is it's such a game changer. When you go into a Passive House home, it is so different to a conventional home.
Speaker 1:How so? Because most people haven't been in Passive House.
Speaker 2:Oh, it's warm, it's comfortable, it smells good, you know, lots of fresh air. There's a unique sense of quietness, and that's typically because we're using triple glazed windows, we've got really heavy sealed doors, and so there's a really high level of comfort and, combined with passive house, we also integrated some building biology and features as well. So these homes are very natural. You know, natural color finishes on the walls, natural products in terms of timber or stone, and so they just feel nice. And so, instinctively, when people moved in, not really understanding the first thing about Passer House or, in a lot of cases, not even realizing it's a Passer House they quickly got comfortable and they certainly didn't want to move out.
Speaker 1:So for me, that's the measure of success that's really good in terms of success if someone doesn't want to move and they really love it there, that is.
Speaker 2:That speaks volumes and I think also now that we've been developing these homes for well you know, certainly in the UK for nearly 20 years, you we've got homes where people have been living for over a decade and what's really great is Passive House family is fabulous at really reflecting on their individual projects. So there's lots of data in terms of post-monitoring studies and the like, and so we know that these homes continue to form. So we know that our residents are happy, they're not moving on, they're staying in their homes. But also we've got some hard evidence in terms of that no energy comfort levels and those have now been measured over 10, 15 years.
Speaker 1:I love that. So just coming back to this story here, where you were a bit of a maverick, I don't think you lied.
Speaker 1:You told the exact truth, I did, but you didn't give the full picture I didn't put a badge to it but I think what you did is told a good story, and the story that you told is this is the outcome that we are after, because this is the need that I see, and that this is the need. This that is is being presented to us by those that are in our care and I've used the word that, those that are in our care because I think that that's what you do as a local authority is that there are people that you care for, that are in your care, and they present a need to you, and it's up to you, then, how to address that need.
Speaker 2:Definitely and I always wanted to deliver homes. That would be the envy of the private sector. So by adopting Passive House we were delivering homes that nobody could buy, because at that time in the UK even now there's very few Passive House homes you can buy. But certainly the private sector looked in with a degree of interest. What's going on here?
Speaker 1:Just on that. Actually, are you able to tell me who the contractor was? Do you remember who that was?
Speaker 2:so our very first projects um were undertaken with isg sadly no longer with us um but they started off on a very modest development of three homes, and from then we moved on to our next development, which was 18 homes 1818 yeah, okay, so Okay. So now, of course, I'm delivering projects of 100 and more homes Passive House homes across London.
Speaker 1:So is that the standard now for you as a local authority is just to provide Passive House?
Speaker 2:Yeah, certainly. So it's kind of the bedrock of the environmental standards that we adopt. So we've got passive house. We also continue to develop homes to building biology principles, so ensuring that they're really, really healthy, and also we want to ensure that they're climate ready. So we work with climate scientists and make sure that the way we design the buildings, the materials that we use, how we orientate the buildings are such that they are going to be climate resilient for the majority of their lifetime.
Speaker 1:Talk to me about the biology element that you're referring to with the properties. What does that actually mean? And you've mentioned about the colours of walls and so on and so on, but what does that actually mean, and what are you trying to achieve by that, for the tenant in the property?
Speaker 2:Okay, so I guess building biology is about really putting health and wellbeing at the heart of the design.
Speaker 1:So are you talking like VOCs and those types of things? Do you look at that as well?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so we're looking at air quality, we're looking at water quality, we're looking at the specification of the materials. So we want to be as natural as possible. We want to avoid, as you said, any items that are going to off-gas with volatile organic compounds, vocs. We also want to look at the impact that our homes have on our mental well-being. So we want to ensure that we've got plenty of natural daylight. We don't want to ensure that we've got plenty of natural daylight. We don't want to screen that daylight by putting shading or tints on our glass. We want that full spectrum of daylight to come through that enhances our well-being, from our Calkadian rhythms through to our hormone production. So that's really important. So we want really nice, bright, airy rooms, but at the same time, we don't want them to overheat. So this is balance. So we're always kind of having to pull leaders to ensure that we create that optimum mix of healthiness but also climate resilience and also thermal comfort.
Speaker 1:Sounds like you're really leading the way in the local authority, and I know that you said it's not about you, it's about your tenants and about your people, and I appreciate that and I agree with that wholeheartedly. I wonder, though, what could be done to try and persuade other local authorities across the country to maybe be a bit more bold or ambitious, or a bit more maverick, or a bit more whatever it is, or a bit less of maybe something else. What thoughts do you have in that area?
Speaker 2:I think we've been really fortunate because I guess I was an early pioneer. I've kind of dedicated the last decade or so trying to really share my learning, my experiences and share those stories of those tenants, invited people to come and visit our social homes and that's enabled a lot of local authorities and registry providers to adopt passive house and so over the last decade we've seen quite a gradual increase. Now I would say it's accelerating at quite a pace and we're seeing more and more local authorities now adopting it. Now they still are quite sceptical in terms of affordability and that still continues to be a bit of a challenge, but that's a challenge across the whole industry. But I think what I've sought to prove and to showcase over the last 50 years is that we can really drive down the cost of passive house to little or no additional premium.
Speaker 1:How do you do that? What would you say were the top three ways that you can make sure that that cost is reduced?
Speaker 2:I think first and foremost it's from day one being quite clear in your client's brief that you know you're going for certified Passive House. So you embed that within your sort of client document. You then have to guard that with your life because everyone will try and persuade you as a client to do maybe Passive House Principles or perhaps a different standard. So for me it's always bed it into your client brief and hold on to it for your dear life. I think the next pointer would be to really surround yourself with consultants that experience passive house. And again, we're really fortunate now in the UK we've got lots of consults that are qualified, they're trained but they're experienced and that can really make the difference between a successful passive house project or one that can be very costly and may never end up being certified.
Speaker 2:And I think the next thing is really engaging with constructors, working with those people that are going to be your partner to deliver your successful project, creating a culture of no blame and really creating an environment where people understand why you're doing Casa House and almost share the magic rhythm. And we've seen that on projects where you know contractors have been a little bit sceptical. Maybe they've not had experience of it. But when they start to work with the standards and realise that they're working on building sites that are a little bit more comfortable, they're warmer, they quickly get it. And then what you tend to find is, once the project's finished, they're completely converted. It's always like a religion, and then they're very kind of despondent to go on to any other project that isn't Passive House.
Speaker 1:I love that. That's good. There's one thing I just want to pick up on here, and what you've mentioned here is a culture of no blame. Okay, how can you foster or have you found it effective to to foster a culture of no blame and then combine that with a culture of responsibility?
Speaker 2:I think they're co-related. So I think with Passive House it's not rocket science, it's really very simple. We're not using any complicated materials or way of building. It's more the secreting of how we milled, and a lot of it is wholly dependent on quality assurance. So for me it's about how do we instill a sense of responsibility in our constructors, and that usually comes through really educating people as to the why, but also assisting them with toolbox talks, quite often working with constructors and helping them to nominate what we call an air tightness champion, so somebody who's going to be on the ground that is really championing some of those really kind of non-negotiable detailing that they have to get right in order to ensure that we maintain the level of air tightness is have to get right in order to ensure that we maintain the level of air tightness. That's going to get a certification.
Speaker 2:No-blame is really important because we have such stringent documentation and quality assurance methodologies that we need to ensure that we kind of record and photograph kind of all the detailing in the building. So we want to avoid people kind of cutting corners, covering up and then when we do interim air tests or even final air tests, we want to remove any risk of us failing that. So we want to encourage people to say look, if you don't quite think you've got a detailed crag, put your hand up. We're not going to shout at you, we're not going to punish you. You actually we're going to reward you, because what we want to do is change the culture into really divide, delivering really high performing, excellent buildings every and I secretly think contractors want to do that anyway. I do want to build best great buildings I think that that's everybody.
Speaker 1:I think everyone wants to do and be part of something great, but there seems to be, at times, a bridge to cross that there is. There is something that feels impossible to go from where you are and to this thing, which is great. And as I've listened to you, it's really interesting that the way that you crossed that bridge was with trusted people. So I think that that ties, for me at least, back into that. That point that you've made with reference to no blame and this transparency to say, look, I don't know or I don't have the answers, and I think that that's what is synonymous with a good relationship is that you recognize that the person that you are connected with is not perfect, because no one is. The person does make a mistake, which, which is what happens, but there's a difference between mistake and negligence. Negligence is when I know that if I do this work, it's going to be an absolute disaster, as opposed to I think this is going to go really well. Oh, it's not gone as planned. Can someone help me fix?
Speaker 2:yeah, and I think you know most people will tell you that one of the kind of unintended consequences of building to certified pacifier standard is the level of quality assurance. Now it's pretty sad that we have to almost enforce quite a stringent building standard in order to deliver that level of quality assurance. But what's great is those constructors, when they've delivered to those standards, that becomes their new blueprint. So even if they don't move on to another certified passive house project, they're actually taking that quality assurance process, that, that culture, that learning, and we're all benefiting of that across all the homes, whether they're passive house or not so we're here at future bill today and you're going to be speaking on stage fairly shortly.
Speaker 1:What's the topic that you're covering and what would you say are the key points to your message today?
Speaker 2:okay, so today. So today we're covering off Passive House but also looking at the future home standard, so we're going to be sort of comparing and contrasting. Obviously, we're going to be flying the flag in terms of Passive House really being the blueprint. We'd like it to be the blueprint for all future homes across the UK. But also we want to invigorate PINCOL in Passive House. We've achieved our 1% milestone, so 1% of all our new homes in the UK now are to the certified Passive House standard. But we've now set ourselves the ambitious target of 10% within the next five years. Now set ourselves the ambitious target of 10% within the next five years. So for the Passive House Trust, we're really keen to continue educating, to continue sharing best practice, facilitating visits, building confidence, encouraging that culture of help and support and openness, to really invigorate many more people now to adopt that Passive House standard, just as a blueprint and a peace of mind and, you know, that quality assurance mark that we all desperately want.
Speaker 1:I love that. I didn't know that there's 1% there 1%.
Speaker 2:I know it doesn't sound much, it's huge. But if you look at the statistics of where we started from in the UK, you know actually that's been quite an explosion, certainly over the last five years. It's really. And there's lots more in the pipeline. So we know that whilst we're recording 1%, now, if you look at what's on the sort of planning commissions and in terms of what started on site, we're probably well towards, certainly halfway through, that 10% target.
Speaker 1:Right, okay, that's really good. That is really good. What is it that someone listening to this podcast will be able to do, especially those people that have had experience with Passive House and that want to see the same thing in the future as you do? What is it that they can do to try and help and support the future as you do? What is it that they can do to try and help and support the cause that you're involved with?
Speaker 2:oh, I think it's about you know, how do we share the magic? So how can we continue to share the message, um, educate uh people? Um, through training, you know, through our training colleges, through architectural schools and the like, in terms of the physics and science that sits behind Passive House? But also, how can we open our doors? How can we open our doors so people can come and visit Passive House buildings? Because a lot of what I've been describing today in terms of what constitutes a Passive House really doesn't make much sense until you go into a passive house. So the more we can open doors, the better.
Speaker 1:Do you have a designated space where people can book an appointment to come in and view that living space? Almost like an innovation park type of scenario. Is there a place where someone can come visit?
Speaker 2:Well, we do have open days every year, um, across the pacifist world actually, but we also have them in the uk. So, um, we have open days every year where you have the opportunity to go into people's homes, uh, into offices, into public buildings, into leisure centers. You know they're all built to the Passive House stand, and that's a great way for really getting a sense of what Passive House is about and also meeting those people that either work or reside in those spaces. So, I would say the Passive House Open Days. They generally occur around about October, november time. It's a great opportunity to go and see for yourself.
Speaker 1:Sounds like you need a designated Passive House Day, a national Passive House Day. That would be great. Everyone with a Passive House, if they feel inclined, open up their doors.
Speaker 2:Yes, it's something to work towards, sure.
Speaker 1:What advice would you give to someone that is starting on the journey of recommending Passive House or working on a Passive House, either for a local authority or maybe even for a private organization? And it's their first step. They're not maybe as fortunate or as blessed as you were 15 years ago to be surrounded by people that you can trust, but they've listened to your passion and they've heard and seen other things that they think in my heart.
Speaker 2:I'd love to do this, but I'm just not sure where to start and how to get going well, I mean, what I would say is the Passed House family is really generous, so what I would suggest is get in touch with the Passed House Trust. We have a fantastic website with lots of resources. Maybe hunt out a buddy you know somebody that's done Passive House before. You'll find that most Passive House people are extremely generous in giving of their time, and I think when you can buddy up with somebody that perhaps has already done a Passive House project maybe done more than one they are very generous in sharing their learnings, what worked, what didn't work, and I think that can make a big difference in terms of helping you build your own confidence when you might be just starting on the journey or in the early years.
Speaker 1:Lovely, gareth. We'll put a link down at the bottom of the podcast of the website that you've made reference to, and so we just echo what you've said. You know, if someone's out there that feels as though they don't quite know what to do next, I would say just what you're saying Speak to someone. There's people there to help. They're keen to help. I love that. Good, it's been great having you here on the podcast, and I wish you well for your talk this later on today and thanks for being on the show. I wish you well for your for your talk this later on today and thanks for being on the show thank you very much thanks for watching to the end.
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