Ep. 056 - Dawn Smith - Why Most Relationships Fail (And How to Fix It!)

Dawn Smith is the founder of Whole Life Solutions and Relationship Coach Dawn. She is also a keynote speaker who has worked with over 1000 couples nationwide.

Why do so many couples struggle to maintain healthy, fulfilling relationships? In this episode, we explore the challenges of most relationships, from breaking generational patterns to improving emotional regulation and communication. We also explore misconceptions about what a thriving relationship looks like, why therapy is often sought too late, and how curiosity and empathy can transform how we connect with our partners.

If you’re looking for actionable strategies to create a deeper, more meaningful relationship, this episode is for you.

In this episode, you'll learn:

• The importance of breaking generational patterns
• Common misconceptions about thriving relationships
• Why couples often seek therapy too late
• Addressing intimacy problems in relationships
• Building habits for emotional regulation
• The power of curiosity in relationships
• Plus much more

Follow Dawn:

Website: https://www.relationshipcoachdawn.com
                 https://www.wholelifesolutions.biz

Let's Connect.

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/danielmcianci/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/DanielMCianci

Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@redefiningwisdom

Email: https://www.redefiningwisdom.com/contact-2/

Website: https://www.redefiningwisdom.com/

Chapters

• 1:45 Why most couples struggle in relationships
• 4:49 Breaking generational patterns
• 8:14 Self-awareness in conflict resolution
• 11:37 Emotional regulation for healthier interactions
• 16:22 Biggest misconceptions about thriving relationships
• 21:52 Why couples seek therapy too late
• 25:46 How to break patterns that don’t serve you
• 30:35 Understanding different perspectives during arguments
• 34:19 How Curiosity Strengthens Relationships
• 35:50 Why empathy is essential (and how to improve it)
• 41:27 How to fix intimacy problems
• 51:13 Practical strategies for a happy and fulfilling relationship
• 56:53 Where to find Dawn

Transcript

0:00

Don as a relationship coach why does it seem that most couples are struggling to

0:05

sustain happy and healthy relationships oh starting off with a big

0:11

question Daniel I love it I love it doesn't get much bigger and broader than

0:16

that I know right oh well I don't have all the answers but I will tell you my

0:22

thoughts um I think this goes deep I think um you

0:27

know the more I learn about it the old older I get the more I feel that most of us at least in America were not taught

0:34

some really fundamental things in school or just in our early years like really basic fundamental how to see through

0:41

each other's lens how to communicate effectively how to find the right time and place to have certain

0:46

conversations um how to understand that often the things that feel personal or triggering are just because somebody is

0:54

seeing the same situation through different eyes and um once we get sort of disre at it can be very hard to come

1:01

back um I just think there's some very foundational things that that the good

1:06

news is they're pretty simple when you learn about sort of the Neuroscience of habits and patterns and why human brains

1:13

are designed to lock into things and then stay with them even when they're not working then we know how to fix it

1:19

and unravel it and find new ways but we're not taught that um so I think it

1:25

goes really deep and I think people struggle with happiness because once they feel that either the tension or the

1:34

separation they get locked into that mode and it becomes really hard to come back

1:40

sometimes you know it's very interesting what you said about that we are not being taught in schools or anywhere how

1:45

to communicate how to basically yes how to deliver message how to take message how to be more

1:51

empathetic how to control our emotions but to be honest with you I mean at least on my end I can look at at at the

1:59

teachers I had even my parents or even my uncles and they didn't know either so I like right

2:05

right to me it's like okay I thought for a moment we about to be that exception who was like I learned

2:12

everything no no no no no no no no no no no no I had I had to work but again in

2:20

my end just because I'm very curious I'm very much into the self-growth and and always learning new things but yes when

2:28

you were mentioning that I was like looking back it's like okay see here's the thing I can quote unquote blame my my

2:35

parents for a lot of things but even I even told him like you guys didn't know any better so you everything that you

2:42

guys did was from a place of love but even looking at their relationship like I can see things that I don't want my

2:47

relationship it to be like but that I can tell that they are having those

2:53

where relationship struggles or even communication issues based on learn

2:59

behaviors from their their parents and their grand grandparents so when it comes to this it's just how do we how do

Breaking generational patterns

3:06

you fix this problem if we assume again and and I don't have numbers obviously but that the that the large majority of

3:13

people don't know this because it goes from generation to to the next one and

3:19

no one is teaching the other one these skills oh gosh exactly I mean that is

3:25

one of the most Bittersweet Gifts of my work that I'm so passionate about is really is about breaking generational

3:32

patterns right both in terms of our triggers and our trauma but also just in terms of the things were passed on that

3:39

no longer fit right that just don't make sense um I think about this this old

3:46

Legend this story of like this family that passed down this pot this holiday pot roast that you know was this just

3:54

passed on generation to generation to generation and finally the the the you know great great grandson gets married

4:01

and they're showing her you know here's the recipe this is what you do and she's like why do you cut the ends

4:08

off and they're all like I know so go they trace it back they trace it back they trace it back and then they go oh

4:14

because the pan used to be too small right and it's just like we all do these

4:20

things that are just we do it because our brains are wired to stick with patterns they're wired to stick with

4:27

what's familiar and the comfort zone is really uncomfortable you can't grow and

4:32

learn in there and so this is generational and I'm sorry I'm getting away from your question which is which

4:38

then what do we do about it I'm so passionate about this work and um of course you know working with people

4:44

one-on-one the good news is that so often the most common heart of what people come to me for is are the issues

4:52

that we're having foundational or are they fixable that's it and probably 90

4:59

95% of the time they're fixable these are not things at the core of who we are

5:04

so often both people actually want the same thing they want to be heard they want to feel appreciated they want

5:10

deeper connection they want to feel like Partners so that's the good news the good news is there's really simple tools

5:16

all of us can learn that can help us build those connections and they work with parent and child they work with

5:22

siblings they work with parents they work with friends um the bigger picture is I'd

5:28

love to share some of these things with other coaches and counselors and I'd love to eventually bring it into

5:35

schools yeah I mean I think that that is something that not many people are talking about see here's the thing as a

5:43

society I think that we know how to communicate just because we know how to speak but we don't even know how to

5:49

deliver a message just because everyone has a different lens everyone lives a different reality and it just just it

5:55

just what you see is not what the other person sees by the way I i' really like your story of the of this family because

6:01

it showcase what we have experienced through the the habits or just learn

6:07

behaviors that oh we don't question anything just because that's how life is right we don't know any better

6:15

until we get face I mean until we find we struggle once we find those

6:21

struggles and okay something's wrong something's not working and if we have you know self- awareness we could okay it's probably on me and not on the other

6:28

person speak speaking of self-awareness because I think that this is to me is the biggest one of the biggest issues

Self-awareness in conflict resolution

6:35

especially when it comes to close relationships I say siblings or or um

6:41

father and and son or mother and son or just in couples having enough s

6:47

awareness to understand how they're being perceived things and how it's not about them but about the whole situation

6:54

is about the whole problem how can couples as an indiv as you know as a couples as an individuals gain more

7:01

self-awareness so they understand that it's not me against you but it's us

7:06

against the problem instead of going off on a long

7:13

tangent I'm going to give you one very very simple answer that may or may not work one of my favorite exercises for

7:20

myself is to just ask am I sure so whenever I think and I suggest this to

7:27

all my couples if you think your part part is saying something to hurt you to

7:33

offend you to disrespect you to forget to do something for you to you know be

7:39

inconsiderate towards you are you sure could there be another

7:47

explanation and often in that just that question it goes back to uh there's

7:53

whole school of of therapy called cognitive behavioral therapy which really has to do with sort of questioning your assumptions versus the

7:59

facts and often our assumptions not always but often when we make assumptions it comes

8:04

from trauma or it comes from difficult experiences in our past where we're assuming the negative by the way our

8:10

brains are wired for negativity bias that's that's a thing that goes back to Cave days when we had to always be

8:16

protecting ourselves physically so we are wired for negativity bias so it's really common to think your partner's

8:22

coming from a negative place when that's not their construct at all so so often

8:28

when arguments sort of De evolve into be nicer to me next time don't disrespect

8:33

me take me more into consideration the other person might be like okay I'll try but they don't know that they ever did

8:38

that to begin with so sometimes when you ask how can we do it from the self-awareness thing I

8:45

think that's a good start is just to say if I think that this is what's coming across from the other person or I think

8:50

this is the reality of the situation and it feels really negative am I sure could there be an alternate

8:56

explanation and then I guess the next step is then ask don't make assumptions ask hey did you was that said

9:04

intentionally to hurt me are you lashing out is there a reason for that or was that just did you actually forget or you

9:09

know what's going on here let me understand you know I've always said that assumptions get you in trouble and

9:16

anytime that I've assumed things like okay I was wrong but we are too afraid

9:21

to ask I think we're we're too either too afraid to ask or our ego doesn't let us ask because you know because we know

9:28

better right and and and I think it becomes at some point a battle of Egos and see who can who can win and when you

9:36

try to get a winner both of them lose that's right and to me honestly even

9:43

though all the things that you're saying because to me a lot of things in life are simple they're hard but they're very

9:48

very simple just to just to understand it's like okay when somebody is in the

Emotional regulation for healthier interactions

9:54

motion and somebody needs to ask themselves like am I sure

9:59

I I don't know if if that person can start training themsel

10:05

before the argument before the emotion because I at least on my I mean on my

10:12

experience in the past when I've been in the middle of the emotion I don't think rationally I mean I'm just

10:19

emotional so building some habits beforehand so we're preventive rather than just reactive and and and just

10:27

having that that knee-jerk reaction that a lot of us have and then we kind of

10:33

regret absolutely and then you're so right about that by the way um that's

10:38

really really true is once we're disregulated we're we're offline right there's no you have to be able to course

10:45

through that before you can come back to rational you're right where you can have that processing so I do think it's a

10:51

practice you can practice moment to moment to just go on almost everything where you feel yourself getting

10:56

defensive or reactive anywhere not just with your partner to go wait am I sure that I'm understanding the situation properly am

11:03

I sure that it's them and not me am I sure that right and it's you're I love what you said because I say that all the

11:09

time all of these things are simple but they're not easy these are not these are the hardest work there is because often

11:19

even as simple as that is to go is it fact or is it assumption we don't know it feels like fact in the moment when

11:26

you're triggered um and you have to stop and go is there is there even a 5% possibility

11:32

it could be something else um and that's true I mean all this stuff right politics religion sex all these

11:40

constructs that get passed down about what we should believe how we should act

11:46

and react in the world it's all the same thing we have to stop and go wait a minute do I actually know this to be

11:53

true or was it just instilled upon me and I took it at face value yeah not

12:00

easy uh that's honestly that's that's what I've been seen in in society

12:08

especially lately with how how divided everyone is

12:14

and not only politics but beliefs almost anything I was just

12:19

having a conversation probably three weeks ago with a good friend of mine that I've known for many many years and

12:26

we had a different I mean we had different opinions about particular topic now I I practice and I I know how

12:32

to you know be be calm be relaxed even in somebody's quote unquote attacking my

12:39

beliefs and I could see how at some point it was turning hostile and the

12:44

other person seem to be sort of attacking me in a very condenscending way but to me like okay something's been

12:50

triggered in him I'm I'm just just gonna try to because at the end of the day

12:56

here's I think one one of the things I learned during my relationship um was

13:02

that if you want if if you have different beliefs or different opinions about

13:08

something your if your goal is to change the other person's mind you don't you cannot start saying that you're wrong or

13:14

attacking the other person because the other person will shut down and I think that's what most people are doing if you

13:20

want to solve an issue just try to address hey I can see how you see from that point of view but what if you look

13:26

at it from try to find another way and we don't have the patience to even do

13:31

that I think that's so well put that's so well put and I love that you were able to be in that space when you felt

13:39

that the person was being condescending and you felt attacked and you had that moment where you're like wait a minute

13:44

this probably has nothing to do with me this is this person having an experience because they're they feel passionate

13:50

about this and it really is not about me H that's hard to do in the moment yeah

13:57

yeah uh and and and once again again it took me years just to become better at

14:04

this and all and and I will credit to my curiosity my my desire of always

14:10

improving and especially as and and we talk off cameras that yeah I got divorced a couple years ago yeah I had

14:17

to evaluate the last nine years of my relationship and see okay what things I did wrong what things I could have done better and what happened happened so if

14:25

I don't learn then it's kind of pointless because I got the experience but without the without the

14:31

lessons and because of we are in the topic of relationships and love I don't

14:36

know I do have the feeling that people have misconceptions about healthy and

Biggest misconceptions about thriving relationships

14:42

thriving relationship in your experience what are these misconception that that if it seems like that most people

14:50

have well one of the most common ones is that of course you're not supposed to be

14:56

um super physically intimate and have a thriving sex life after X period of time right that's like common thing that has

15:03

to go it doesn't have to go away right um I am honestly Daniel I am shocked how

15:11

many couples don't talk don't have real deep regular meaningful

15:18

conversations I I'm shocked how common that is that's shocking to me they might

15:24

talk about day-to-day stuff like how was work it was fine how are the kids they're fine but to actually have these

15:30

regular intentional thought-provoking intimate conversations it's not

15:35

happening a lot of the time um and I I think there's a lot of these sort of to me it I don't know even misconception is

15:43

like if that's your experience that's your reality but it doesn't need to be that way right

15:50

so you know one of the things I feel really strongly about is planned spontaneity or like schedule

16:00

time and rituals without that feeling like you're overburdening your schedule but it

16:05

actually can have the opposite effect is so often I think we're so swept up in the chaos of Modern Life in work in

16:13

social media in kids that every little ounce of space is filled up and couples

16:20

lose each other and that's where things I think that's an expectation that like yeah we're just too busy to do anything

16:27

else but that has to be blocked off first you have to schedule in regular

16:33

time for Quality conversation for romantic dates for in even scheduling intimacy like whatever it takes so that

16:41

that and that's what it takes to shift the pattern you don't have to keep talking about breaking the pattern you

16:46

have to actually like do some actions towards it and that can shift the the habits and the patterns that are built

16:52

up yeah I think that after a few years we kind of lose the intentionality

16:58

becomes almost like routine and and I wonder if other countries have are

17:05

having the same issue and the Reon why I'm bringing this up because I I do know that we live in a uh business culture

17:13

that we need to be busy all the time then we need to pack our schedule then we need to hustle all the time I'm part

17:18

of the problem I'm part of the problem I'm always trying to do more do more and be more productive and I think that when

17:24

when you are overload with task and especially if you have kids if you have and then you have to a soccer practice

17:32

and then you have to take it to ballet and then you need to take them to school and do work and the homework and and

17:38

then you don't have time to do any of this but one thing that you said that

17:43

I've been having this theory in mind for a while that when couples don't don't speak and to each other and to me I

17:49

thought about like wait a minute that is supposed to be quotequote your best friend and if you don't feel safe

17:56

speaking with your best friend then you're never going to feel safe speaking anywhere else and I'm one of

18:03

those people who believe and I don't know if this has been an issue you know lately or this whole been like this that

18:10

to me the uh uh friendship you know friends before lovers create the best

18:16

relationships because you already know the person and then you even early in the relationship you know how to

18:22

navigate those complicated Waters because you understand the other person and then you create like a like a

18:28

stronger Bond but those people who start dating first and then expect to become friends afterwards might have like a

18:34

harder time because there's not you haven't unlocked that level of vulnerability yet so I don't know if

18:41

that's true or just it's just my perception as something that have been feeling about lately and I've shared with other people my with with other

18:47

people I know my best relationship has been those who we were friends first and then that organically evolved into

18:54

something else sure no that makes a lot of sense absolutely yeah I I think

18:59

you're right I don't think you know to your point it doesn't have to be that way you know relationships can look all

19:04

sorts of ways um but I am surprised how often people

19:12

start from the relationship and never get back to that Foundation of trust and

19:18

communication and deep conversation and comfort and you know all of that so yeah

19:23

but it can you know you can get there it can be all different ways that you create this I think it's you know again

19:29

to me what's kind of Bittersweet is how often couples come in and they feel so far apart this is often their last ditch

19:37

effort this is it we' either been living in these siloed lives feeling like

19:43

roommates or we're sew at each other's throats and it's always tension but they want the same thing they just don't know

19:50

how to climb over the bridge to each other

19:55

oh okay because you said this and and and and and and and and I'm glad you did

20:01

because he just unlocked a thought that I didn't think about it before well I did but then now for this conversation

Why couples seek therapy too late

20:08

it seems to me well definitely happen in my relationship that when couples go to couple therapy it's already too late

20:16

someone already either has buil enough enough resentment or checked out

20:22

completely emotionally so it's almost like okay how do you prevent that cuz when things are

20:29

good nobody wants nobody thinks that should go into coule therapy or talk about I've talked to a couple of friends

20:34

of mine in the last few years because every now then they approach me hey I'm struggling with this I'm struggling with that and I've told them in the in the

20:41

past hey if I were you again you are free to do whatever you want I would go to C therapy because I see that you guys

20:47

need a third party that can help you understand each other no I think we're good we're good and a few months later

20:54

maybe a year later they will just you know break up and

20:59

even though that has been my advice to them I I was at fault as well for not

21:04

doing that with my relationship when we by the time we went it was too late how

21:10

can we get better at this because we don't do anything until things get really really bad but

21:16

then by the time things get really really bad it's almost like no comeback from that oh you're absolutely

21:24

right you're absolutely right well I told you I want to actually this in the

21:29

school system so we don't get to this point but um at this stage I you know I

21:35

started off as a premarital counselor that's my background and um so any

21:40

couple even if they're not already engaged but they're at that point where they're just saying hey we we we want

21:45

some tools to make sure we you know maybe don't make the mistakes our parents did or right so it doesn't have

21:51

to be even that you're having struggles but you you know you know what the statistics are about marriage in this

21:56

country right you you know most people have not had super positive family

22:02

models so even if it's for that with that lens then you say okay we'll do a few sessions of premarital sessions and

22:09

just to get the tools um when they do come to me I mean I think at that point you just got to say

22:15

gosh can we just get it just a just a little further back where this is not your last ditch thing but this is like

22:22

Hey we're wrestling with some stuff I wonder if there's somebody who could help us with some tools and and I love

22:27

what you're saying I mean obvious obvously I'm biased I come from the coaching and counseling background um but I have my own counselor and I really

22:34

do feel like ah we could all benefit so much just from having somebody who can

22:41

be neutral and mirror things back to us and ideally have some tools to share um

22:46

because our minds are are are their own Echo chamber it's really almost impossible for any of us

22:53

to step outside of that and really have a bird's eye perspective yeah seems we can we only

22:59

want to hear our own voice so we only want our own opinion and then when somebody challenged

23:05

that it's hard and I mean I get it I get it and then I can say I'm sure I'm

23:13

um I I have the privilege of of having like

23:18

a more emotional stability when it comes to this and understand how things work

23:25

in the brain to some extent but I once again I do see a lot of people that once

23:31

to start trying to plan an idea hey that this might work for you since that new

23:37

idea is so unfamiliar and it goes It goes against their belief it's almost a threat to their identity and and the

23:45

Brain I mean our nervous system wants to keep us safe so was like no we're we're going to stay in our mystery we rather stay in our mystery than try something

23:52

new that could be beneficial and to and to just um break that pattern is

24:00

tough speaking of patterns how do how do become aware of

How to break patterns that don’t serve you

24:05

these patterns not only how how we think about oursel and but in general how we

24:11

what we do as a couple that might not serve us might not be uh working for us

24:16

but then we're so caught up in the routine that we miss these patterns yeah that's

24:23

tough H that's all I feel like that's incredibly diff ult to do without a

24:29

third party I don't know how you do that because I think to even notice that it's

24:35

a pattern to even notice that this is a you know I tell people I'm really big on

24:41

formulas right like when you notice this plus this this

24:46

is going to be your new response but to even get to that point of observation on

24:52

your own is incredibly difficult so I I'll give you an example um there's a

24:57

woman named MJ ran who writes a lot about uh habits and patterns and you know neuroscience and tools you can do

25:04

and she wrote this great piece years ago about the three stages of change and the example she gives is that every day you

25:10

go to work you slip on a banana peel you fall on your ass and you're [ __ ] miserable about and you don't want to do it again but like every morning you do

25:16

the same thing head off to work walk down the path slip on the banana peel curse go to work do the thing we all

25:22

have things like that that everyday annoyances that are just like annoying but we haven't stopped to kind of

25:27

process and figure F out and could I do this differently so one day you go this isn't working anymore I I want some help

25:34

I got to figure this out and you go you know what this is not going to happen anymore tomorrow I'm going to walk around the banana peel or

25:41

whatever the next day you forget you slip again and you fall on it and that's

25:47

the point she says where you have to recognize that change happens in three stages and that middle stage is when you

25:54

go ah crap I did that thing again that I promised I wasn't going to do I said I

26:00

wasn't going to blow up at my kids that's M right like I said I wasn't going to let this thing this little thing annoy me where I wasn't I was

26:07

gonna set myself up to I have off the charts ADHD so I'm gonna set myself up to be on time for that meeting or

26:13

whatever it is right and then you slip up and that's the point where our brains go it's all me what's wrong with me this

26:21

is never going to get fixed forget it but if you can recognize no that's

26:26

progress because now you see it before you weren't even seeing it before it was

26:32

just you kept doing this thing over and over and over and you couldn't figure out what was wrong now you see it and

26:37

you have a plan but then to get your brain to actually implement the plan that's the next stage so stage three is

26:44

you pick up the banana field you throw it away and you're good so that's all of that to say we we often need external

26:52

help to even see it you can know something's not working we know when something doesn't feel right but it can

26:58

really help to have somebody to help us distill what to do about it and then to not get discouraged when you mess up

27:05

again so I tell my couples sometimes things are going to feel worse before they get better and that's a good thing

27:11

because it means you're now you're hyper aware of exactly what you're doing and then the next stage is you actually

27:19

Implement these things and do it differently and that can snowball quickly so building a new habit once you

27:24

unlock it goes fast it can that was a long answer for a short

27:29

question well but no no I no I love that answer because I like when when when you're very detailed about it and

27:36

explain because to me I think there's a lot of a lack of clarity in many different aspects of Our Lives that

27:43

people are just assuming things and they and they think at how things work it's like well do you really are you really

27:49

clear of what and it can give you like a just like lame example with even with

27:55

with the word narcissism seems when look at social media like no every I mean if your relationship didn't work that's

28:01

because you were dating narcissist like well not necessarily but yeah so to me is like i' I one thing I've trying to

28:09

really do a lot of this podcast is like bring Clarity to those kind of things and you giving lengthy answers okay this

28:16

is how you sort of identify patterns and through a story even just with a banana

28:21

peel helps people just to visualize things better now picking up the man of

28:27

Peel that's hard thing because that's when you have to start implementing new

28:32

routines or new actions and that feels extremely uncomfortable it's

28:38

true so because of that because of the communication issues because I do

28:44

believe that um this is my perception as well that many of these communication issu

Understanding different perspectives during arguments

28:51

come from different narrative in a particular event so let's say that you

28:57

and I are in a relationship and you and I had a a fight yesterday and then we're going to talk about it it today but then

29:03

we probably won't understand each other because you have a different version of the of the events right I I saw it from

29:09

one point of view and you saw it from a different point of view and and there are two different stories because at the end of the day our minds are tricky I

29:16

mean our our minds are not a very reliable narrator but then we relying on

29:21

them how can we get better at identifying this issue and and what can we do to actually change it

29:29

oh that's tough yeah there's a famous story about Three Blind Men and an elephant right

29:35

where they're they're all describing it but they're all touching bit different parts right so one saying that oh it's

29:42

so smooth and silky and another's touching the tail and it's rough and crinkly and they all think the other one's lying right but no they're all

29:49

they're all touching the elephant oh boy we do have such

29:54

different lenses and I think one of the things is assume the the best assume that your partner is seeing the world

30:00

through their lens and it's not going to look the same as your lens um timing is really important um I think you know I

30:07

just I just gave a Ted Talk on a similar topic um the this idea that we have

30:14

extremely limited critical thinking capacity in a day so it's not always ideal to try to figure things out in the

30:21

moment but there's also usually one partner that feels really strongly about

30:26

needing to talk things out and another wants more space and so the trick is

30:31

give some space to regulate but limit that space so that you know you're finding that balance and that often

30:38

means to your point not trying to figure it all out at night but saying something

30:43

kind to your partner even when you're angry which is so hard you know but hey

30:49

let's meet over coffee in the morning and talk through this right set a time to talk through it and talk through it

30:55

when it gets to that point I don't think there's easy answers I think the best I can give to what you're saying is just

31:01

to to know that we are going to have a different perception and a different

31:06

lens I mean it's proven that our brains

31:11

not strictly across gender lines but most men and most women do

31:17

neurologically process and compartmentalize and see things differently um that's part of it and

31:23

that's true in samex couples too we're usually drawn to our counterpart um but but also just all our different

31:29

experiences our childhoods our past relationships all of that is influencing

31:34

how we see a situation so hear each other assume the best um and be creative

31:40

coming up with a solution that works for both yeah assuming the best is something

31:47

that to me a little bit not easy well well here's the thing to me it was

31:53

always always common sense but again I realize many many times that common sense is not common at all to me one of

32:00

the things I I would struggle in my past relationships or seeing friends struggle

32:05

in their relationships like they would assume that their partner I mean they would assume the worst out of their

32:10

Partners like how I mean you are with that person for a reason what would I assume that that person wanted to hurt

32:16

you that wanted that that person wanted to put you down I don't I don't to me it doesn't make any

32:23

sense but going back to a point that you said about trying to understand each other and to the initial point when you

How Curiosity Strengthens Relationships

32:29

said well am I sure when if somebody saying something one common Trend I've

32:36

realized in this podcast almost with anything um is that that many things are

32:43

solved by curiosity if we are curious enough in a non-judgmental way we can just even fix ourselves fix other

32:50

problems but I think that we are lacking that Curiosity because even even if we as as I mentioned on my previous

32:55

question like okay you have a different story than mine even though we both live the exact same situation the exact same

33:02

argument to me it would be like well tell me exactly how you see it and then

33:08

I'm telling you what I saw Because by the way we can both be right and wrong I mean it's just it's

33:15

like if we agree that we could potentially be both right and wrong then let's find a solution let's be curious

33:21

about it in a non-judgmental way I'm not saying that you're wrong because you see differently you just see it differently

33:27

because you're a different person so I love I I'm actually writing

33:32

that down many things are SOL by curiosity I think that's such a beautiful line that's such a great line

33:38

and that we can both be right and wrong yeah I mean it's interesting

33:44

because I I just noticed it just recently when when I kept asking because

33:50

I as you probably know now I just like to go deep into the questions I I I'm

33:55

very very curious in in that regard and most of the common Trends as being that is being being curious which takes me to

34:02

even point out with I think that in society and in couples in general

Why empathy is essential (and how to improve it)

34:08

there's a lack of empathy and I think people feel the empathy is about okay do

34:14

I feel the emotion that the other person is feeling no can you put yourself in the other PE other person's shoes and

34:20

trying to understand not trying to feel the emotion but trying to understand how they see the world just be very just

34:27

curious make the effort because once you see that then you won't take things personally because now you you

34:34

understand how the person sort of operates or just at least you have a broad idea and and and put the ego aside

34:43

because I do believe that we live in a society that acknowledging your pain

34:48

diminishes mine I like we can sort of both coexist in in not that in that

34:54

sense but it's almost like okay how can I see I'm asking no for myself because I'm

35:00

aware of this but then I can see how can I I try to deliver this message to people okay to help them understand how

35:06

they can become aware of this and and and and um and address this lack of

35:13

empathy in a healthy way just become aware of the problems and hey it is okay

35:18

if you try to understand the other person you don't have to just be within

35:23

your own thoughts or reality I guess mhm that's so beautifully put yeah I love

35:30

that you're so right about that but in your experience how

35:38

do how can people become aware of or or or at least how

35:45

can they work on their empathy I guess okay so I have a tip for

35:53

that one of the things I walk through with my couples is a very spefic specific form of active listening so

35:59

most people have done active listening in some way at work or at school or something right active listening itself

36:05

simple but not easy very very very basic right so basically one of you talks the other person is going to like repeat

36:12

before they take their turn um there's a few tricks to it the big thing is to be extremely concise which is very hard to

36:20

do when we're worked up but your partner can generally remember a Max of two

36:26

sentences oh wow okay yeah so you have to hone in on the heart of exact and

36:32

that's a helpful exercise too when we're worked up is to be like what exactly is

36:38

my pain about right I have to concentrate it so first person speaks one or two sentences

36:45

trying not to be accusatory right the other person tries to repeat word for word no assumptions no paraphrasing

36:51

because the whole point is to try not to filter it through our lens of past experience on the issue and you go back

36:57

back and forth like that but to add on the and that often does just that is often really helpful because you're

37:03

taking some of the edge off of the intensity you're truly being heard and

37:10

just that being heard can really affect the energy the heightened energy of the

37:16

situation and you're both doing that for each other but one sort of like bonus element of it is if you can start when

37:23

you do your reflection with one piece that you you could own it's not about

37:29

blame it's not about blame but is there even a nugget even if you're furious

37:35

with your partner and it feels like what they're saying is complete crap can you

37:41

find a nugget 1% where you're like all right I can see that or I can own that

37:47

or I you know I take responsibility for that and you start with that when you reflect So Daniel if you were telling me

37:55

like God Don I can't stand asked you so many times to put your crap away You're So disorganized you're so messy

38:01

everywhere it gets into my stuff I can't find anything and I feel defensive you know that with my ADHD I can only find

38:08

stuff if I have it out in my way in my space it's not bothering your stuff leave me the hell alone but instead I

38:14

say okay I hear you that you've asked me this many times before and there is that

38:19

one part of the house that I committed and I messed up and I'm sorry and you know like starting like that

38:29

those those two sentences are even I was thinking when you were saying that like even when I'm just calm my brain goes

38:36

all over the place and and and it's hard to be concise but knowing that is is

38:42

very helpful because it would do two things one it would be as you said concise but then it would allow the

38:48

person the time to really think and trying to translate their emotions into wordss like exactly what am I feeling

38:55

and why am I feeling it and I I don't know where I read it I don't know where I read it but they read it in a book

39:01

that says that to just calm the other person down and to may make the other person feel that you validate their

39:08

emotions say hey if I were you I would I would feel exactly the same way that you

39:14

do right now it's like it's almost you're validating that but because it's true because if you were her or if you were him you would you would feel the

39:21

same way CU I mean you are that person but in that regard when the person feels validated that that they action is okay

39:28

it's not wrong then I think they're I think they they lower their defenses 100% that's a beautiful way to

39:36

put it 100% let's pivot a bit to a topic that I

How to fix intimacy problems

39:42

think a lot of people struggle and you mentioned at the beginning but not many

39:47

people talk about which is the intimacy and and and and yeah sure some couples

39:52

are thriving in this and and but but I think that many others are struggling and I feel that intimacy is one of those

39:59

topics one of those things that is hard to address because it requires a lot of vulnerability it just we don't want to

40:05

be judged or dismissed by by your partner because it's so intimate that

40:12

it's like if you're a woman then and then you feel that you're you know that you're not having enough sex then you

40:17

feel unattractive and or you feel fat you feel old you feel all these crazy stories that running your head and if

40:23

you're a man then then you feel that that basic basically your wife it

40:29

doesn't love you anymore or or any any any of these crazy stories and as I

40:36

mentioned to you off cameras or a few days ago this quote from from Neil stra

40:43

he said that uh unspoken expectations are premeditated resentments and I think

40:48

that many of these issues come from the fact that we are not uh saying what we need or what we

40:55

want sure we can say hey can you help me with the trash or can you help me with the dishes or can you help me with the

41:01

kids but but we don't express much of our needs when it comes to intimacy and

41:08

then we start expecting the other person to just know and when the person doesn't know then we start getting res we start

41:15

resenting them exactly well tell your audience I love

41:20

having these conversation so I think you know I think it's an area again I wish

41:26

we'd been taught this in school myself in particular that it's okay to talk about this right we are humans we

41:33

wouldn't exist without sex like this is as as universal as you can get there are

41:40

very few things as universal as sexual desire I mean it's right there um

41:47

physical touch is of course what you know one of the most common love languages it's how we give and receive

41:52

and understand love and it doesn't just have to be sex but intimacy physical intimacy

41:57

and it's heartbreaking to me how many couples again going back to the cultural

42:03

stuff the implications the generational stuff don't or feel that they can't talk

42:08

about it and then that thing about fact versus assumption gosh this is one of

42:14

the biggest areas I see it all the time and you're exactly right we're often again not

42:20

trying to make it about gender lines but often women do feel it's they're not physically attracted to me I'm not

42:25

beautiful enough I gain some weight there's somebody else they must be having an affair and Men often feel

42:31

right parentified happens a lot often there's a there's a thing where you know

42:37

one person makes the other person feel like they're doing everything and ordering them around and they fall into

42:42

a dynamic that feels more like parent child and that can be very emasculating if it's happening towards the man so all

42:49

of those things where it becomes more and more pulled apart and difficult to talk about um so that you know one of

42:56

the tips I i' say is don't assume don't assume because there's a very very more

43:02

likely than not it has nothing to do with any of those things where your head is jumping it's not about the attraction

43:09

not being there it's not about trying to reject you it's not about all the abandonment triggers that can come up

43:15

when you feel rejected which runs so deep and is so painful um so often again you both want

43:22

the same thing you just don't know how to get there and it is a tricky subject in the sense

43:28

that I don't want anybody married or not to feel like they have to do something

43:35

physically that they don't want to do of course and at the same time I do see so

43:40

many couples where they're not having sex because of the busyness because they don't know how to talk about it because

43:46

they don't know how to ask for what they need you know and and this is kind of piggybacking on the subject I know it's

43:52

a whole other thing but non-traditional relationships non- monogamous relationships open relationships what

43:58

about all of that those are conversations I think that are important to have you know ask for what you need

44:06

it doesn't mean the other person has to do it but this is your your partner let's have these conversations and if it

44:12

helps to have them in a safe space with another person then do that you know I love having those conversations there's

44:19

lots of wonderful sex therapists and coaches and intimacy coaches out there and I think having these conversations

44:25

with a safe third person can make it easier yeah asking

44:32

is I struggle with that in general just asking for help ask asking for anything I'm just very Ser line independent but

44:39

then we cannot do that and and even even in those easy things if we struggle with that

44:46

already once once we are in a relationship once we are having intimacy

44:51

problems or any other kind of problem if we don't ask we're just not going to get

44:56

any anywhere I just wonder how if somebody was

45:03

having I don't know I don't know if intimacy problems would be the way but then concerns or wasn't happy or it's

45:10

like you know what it could be better how can they start even addressing How would how would that conversation start

45:17

how because here's the thing we we all think about well I'm trying to find the perfect timing well there's no perfect

45:23

timing you either do it or you don't but then but then we procrastinate because we are avoiding the emotion and the

45:30

emotion of be of the uncomfortable of being vulnerable it's like okay how do we just go and take action and start

45:38

addressing something in a very delicate and and subtle way of hey this is what's

45:45

going on so here I love that question and I do have a suggestion for that um

45:51

and this is true of any vulnerable topic you're right that there's no perfect

45:56

timing don't do it late at night for reasons I already addressed check okay right um so

46:02

find a specific time schedule it tell your partner hey I have something kind of vulnerable I'd like to share with you

46:08

can you make and make it put constraints on it make it small so block off maybe

46:15

20 or 30 minutes don't try to make this if it goes longer it goes longer that's fine and have a concrete goal doesn't

46:23

mean you hit that goal but I think the reasons so many people put this off is

46:29

it feels so abstract so hard to distill it feels

46:34

so big so this is true of let's say finances often couples don't talk about

46:39

finances because it feels so big how do we sit down and have this conversation when we haven't had it in years to

46:45

really understand what we're going to do here when it's these heavy topics um

46:50

have a goal and have it be a small goal so maybe in that situation the goal is

46:57

um how would you feel about me initiating more or you know I want to

47:02

open up the conversation about bringing a third person in at some point or I don't know like whatever it is but

47:08

you're you're you don't have to resolve everything in that initial conversation I would say the goal is pick one piece

47:15

of the puzzle and have the goal be that I'm going to put it out there and tell

47:21

you that I'm just opening the conversation and maybe we you know think about it we can have a longer conversation this weekend or something

47:27

like that so keeping it manageable that would be my suggestion yeah I think I like that I

47:34

like that a lot because it because what you want to do is lower the stakes I

47:40

think exactly because when you and and and for you to lower the the stakes you need to

47:47

address it as as soon as possible because if you let it build up then it's just going to be a complete

47:53

nightmare I I like that I and I think that one thing that men probably don't

47:59

understand and then I found out later was that women feel connected or turn on

48:06

or in desire throughout it's almost like almost and maybe might be a

48:13

misconception of mine through the entire sort of day how it goes if you seem very

48:19

uh helpful on any or or or supportive or you listen to her and then she she feels

48:26

lovey that way right she would be sort of a a Rous which meant we don't work

48:32

that way we are totally different and then and and then and then we think well if we do X Y and Z then we ar Rouser but

48:38

then is not how most women work I think and if we and if we know this then we

48:44

can just start not doing not not not treating us a means to an end but

48:51

building that habit of just supporting your partner and then I think that your sexual life probably will improve as a

48:57

byproduct of it agreed I think that's a great way of framing it that's part of that neurological difference in how we

49:04

communicate and process and prioritize men are much more able in general to compartmentalize and women in general uh

49:12

form a lot of connections so things are very interwoven all day throughout the day that's a great way of framing it

49:18

you're right interesting Don I've been having an awesome conversation with you I could go for you know far longer it's

49:24

just I I'm really fascinated by the this topic but as a closing question what are some of the you know practices that

Practical strategies for a happy and fulfilling relationship

49:31

couple can start implementing into their life to have a healthy and thriving

49:36

relationship I love that um so the

49:42

number one thing I would suggest is have a little tiny ritual of daily

49:48

appreciation and uh I like to do it you know just as a bedtime thing let's say

49:53

three things I'm grateful for three things I appreciate about you um and it might feel weird and awkward

49:58

if you're not used to having those intimate moments and I say with this whole process we're talking about

50:03

breaking bad habits and building good habits lean into the awkward who cares

50:09

if it's awkward divorce is awkward like lean into awkward right um three things

50:15

I appreciate about you and that sounds so simple but it works on so many levels because it's it's deepening intimacy and

50:22

connection but it works for what I was saying about the negativity bias and our brains being wired like cave manes um

50:29

the Gman Institute you're probably familiar with them they're kind of the foremost Institute studying what makes

50:34

successful relationships and they talk about the magic ratio and the magic ratio is five to one Harvard did a

50:41

similar study in the workplace it takes five positives to balance every single

50:47

negative or perceived critique from someone five so sometimes couples come in and

50:53

one is like oh my gosh all this person's so negative all the time and the person person's like I literally just told you

50:58

how beautiful you are both are true if it's 5050 it's going to feel terrible so

51:04

having a little ritual where you say a handful of things every day that are positive and beautiful that you

51:09

appreciate that you're grateful for goes a huge way and then scheduling time for

51:15

these meaningful conversations for romantic dates for trying something new it almost doesn't matter what you try

51:22

new you're trying to almost trick your brain to shifting gears to bring bringing in new information try new

51:28

things explore have adventures together that those are my tips

51:35

ah I just I just want to know where was that advice when I was in in my

51:41

relationship because here's the thing I and I realized and this was probably can learn behavior from my parents and and

51:47

and I've told him this I grew up in a environment where let's say and I give

51:53

this example all the time that that my mom was working and then I was um at

51:58

home and then she would say just pleas please clean the kitchen so I would clean the entire kitchen but I forgot to

52:04

clean the countert the the countertops and she would come back and then say

52:09

come on what happened with the countertop so she would focus only on the negative things like well I did all of this now I grew up with that

52:17

almost as a second nature and I used to do that a lot in my relationship so when you focus on the negative when you focus

52:24

on the things that the other person didn't do and then you very little because um I think that a lot of women

52:30

love languages could be words of affirmation and and touch and to me to me are acts of service and a physical

52:37

touch but our love language is only I think that one of the misconceptions I

52:42

found out about love languages that I think most of people have like it's not about that you are going to give love in

52:49

that way it's like that's how you receive love but you need to give love in a way that the other person feels

52:55

love so to me my relation wor information was hard because to me it's like I never got I mean it doesn't

53:02

matter so looking back I was probably the ratio was like probably saying five negative things and one positive which

53:08

is like so paining it's so painful but as you were saying simple not easy because I still

53:14

do that to my kids too I really do it's

53:19

hard and then and then and then and the only way I was able to overcome that or

53:24

just after my relationship and it's like hey you didn't know any better but now you know so it's like use it and yeah

53:32

I'm glad you mentioned that CU again she said it's very very simple and it doesn't take much just just say things

53:39

that you appreciate about your partner even as a man even if if the same way

53:44

even if you tell her that she looks pretty whatever in your mind we think what what I wouldn't be with her it's

53:50

like it's like almost like Common Sense almost like it is known but it's like

53:55

well but she likes to hear so yes exactly put the a yeah um d i could talk

54:03

with you for hours too Dan you're giving me a lot of great insight into the the

54:08

not only the male perspective but with your upbringing and your divorce and all of that it's really helpful to hear it

54:15

um with your lens and all the people you've spoken with but you're you're right that that part is so interesting

54:20

that that doesn't come naturally to you at all and why it doesn't come naturally it doesn't come naturally from a good

54:25

place that of course you're beautiful I wouldn't be with you if you weren't you know yeah

54:31

yeah that's interesting yeah and yeah and so and and uh well first of all

54:37

thank you for the kind words I really appreciate them but also I as again I

54:42

really I'm glad that you said that because those simple things that we

54:49

Overlook we think that the solution has to be more complex or harder or something that we have never thought

54:55

about how come how come I can fix my marriage or my relationship just by doing this well you'll be surprised yes

55:02

exactly that exactly well thank you dadel this has been great once again

55:07

it's a pleasure uh bo where can people find if they want to work with you or if they want to keep up with your work appreciate that it's relationship coach

Where to find Dawn

55:14

dawn.com relationship coach.com perfect done once again total pleasure and I

55:21

need to bring you back again because I would love it there's a lot more things to talk about SP yeah wonderful thank

55:28

you so much Daniel thank you