Part 2: From Chaos to Confidence: Building a Business That Lasts | Bob Negen

Welcome to Wickedly Branded: Marketing, Magic, and The Messy Middle, the podcast where real conversations meet real strategies. I'm your host, Beverly Cornell, founder and fairy godmother of brand clarity at Wickedly Branded. With over 25 years of experience, I’ve helped hundreds of entrepreneurs awaken their brand magic, attract the right people, and build businesses that light them up.

Most entrepreneurs think they need a better marketing strategy. But what if the real issue isn’t strategy at all?

In this special episode, part 2, Beverly sits down with retail expert Bob Negen to unpack what actually drives long-term business growth. And it’s not quick wins, hacks, or doing more.

It’s habits. It’s mindset. And it’s learning how to stay in the game when things feel messy.

Bob shares his journey from starting a retail business with no experience and $2,000 to building a thriving company and helping thousands of small business owners succeed. Together, they explore the truth about the “messy middle,” why most people quit too early, and how real momentum is built over time.

Three Key Marketing Topics

1. The Long Game of Marketing Strategy

Marketing isn’t about quick wins or instant results. Sustainable growth comes from consistent habits and showing up over time, even when the results aren’t immediate.

2. Escaping the “Messy Middle”

Every stage of business growth comes with a frustrating middle phase where things feel unclear and hard. Learning to push through this phase is what separates businesses that grow from those that stall.

3. Mindset, Habits, and Momentum

Your results are a reflection of your habits, not just your strategy. When you shift your mindset and commit to small, consistent actions, momentum begins to build naturally.

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Transcript

Bob 0:11

Just recognize that you have done something that is so significant.

Beverly 0:16

Yes.

Bob 0:17

Most people only dream of starting a business. You know, how many times do people, you know, if, so, if you have a, a woman's clothing store and you go to a party. I know that you've heard 10 people say, oh, I've always wanted to have a clothing store, right? Well, I've always wanted, but guess what? You did it and good on you. Congratulations. You have officially set yourself apart for most of the world, and I applaud you and honor you for that.

Beverly 0:48

Welcome back to the Wickedly Branded Marketing Podcast. To part two of this very powerful and inspiring conversation. In our last episode, we laid the groundwork and shared insights you won't want to miss, and today we're picking up right where we left off and taking that conversation deeper, unpacking the strategies, the stories, and the inspiration that will help you bring your brand boldly to life. If you haven't listened to part one yet, I recommend starting there. The link is in the description. So you can follow the full journey. So without further ado, let's jump back into the conversation,

Bob 1:37

right? And then, so they commit to 15 minutes. A day.

1:44

Right.

Bob 1:44

And then every day they get a little more confident. Every day they feel a little wiser. Every get a little more, more momentum.

Beverly 1:51

Yeah.

Bob 1:51

All of a sudden their business is working the way that they wanted it to work.

Beverly 1:57

Right.

Bob 1:57

You know, we all get into the business, you know, Bob, me, oh my gosh, I'm gonna be rich in two years selling tights in a store around the corner in a seasonal store in northern Michigan. What the, was I thinking? But you just keep grinding. Does that make sense to, so, you know, so, so where does it, where does the shift come? The shift comes unexpectedly. The shift comes from a magic moment where all the work you do, somehow it gets the unit it, it gets triggered and it all starts to work the way it's supposed to. Napoleon Hill in Think and Grow Rich, which is a great book. Mm-hmm. Um. Has, uh, a quote, then I'm referred back too often. It's a, and I'm not saying it perfectly, but he said the money known as the big money. Once it starts, uh, showing itself or flowing, you'll wonder where it ever was hiding. It'll be like water running down a hill, right? And the point there is. You are always looking, you're looking, you're looking, you're doing the work, and then all of a sudden it shows up and that's just not money. That's everything in life. If you just do the right work

Beverly 3:11

mm-hmm

Bob 3:11

and you just stay with it, eventually the power of your intention is gonna get you the results that you want.

Beverly 3:21

We call it the momentum mountain because, or the mountain of of momentum because it is a climb. Like you do have to, you're gonna be sweating, you're gonna like look down and go, oh shit, you're gonna, the things. But when you get to the top, you know, the winds of ease are up there. Like there's something that happens that just changes your confidence, changes your, I mean, I think so much happens in that moment that is very powerful, um, for our clients as well. I, you know, I think the thing that. You're talking about the, the 15 minutes of consistency, is that the, the learning versus the wishing?

Bob 3:57

Yes.

Beverly 3:57

You can't wish your way to success. You have to actually put that in. You have to learn every day, get better every day. Make mistakes every day. Like that's all tuition, right? Like, that's all the stuff that makes you better, makes you a better leader, makes you a better person, makes you far more interesting as a human being in the world. So I, I love this idea of like this momentum that builds in it.'cause I, I have felt it, I have felt it. That momentum that happens and like, you're right. You can't kind of go back, like you can't undo. Learning. Like you can't undo that.

Bob 4:32

No, no, no. It's like this giant store, you know, wisdom doesn't just just happen. It, it, it, it's accumulated.

Beverly 4:39

Yeah.

Bob 4:39

And then, you know, so, uh, I, I'll just share something. Uh, and another example of this. So I have a yoga nidra practice. And every morning when I wake up, while I'm still in bed, I put in my headphones and I do a yoga knee dry. Uh, guided meditation, we'll just call it, for lack of a se, better term. And one of the, uh, things that happens is they go through peas of opposites. They make you think of peas and opposites. Think of hot, think of cold. And I always thought it was dumb, dumb, dumb, dumb, dumb. You know, of course this is a 3000 year old practice or something like that.

Beverly 5:20

Okay.

Bob 5:20

But, but I'm smarter than it, of course.

Beverly 5:23

Mm-hmm.

Bob 5:25

So I've been doing this for, I don't know, two and a half years. I mean, almost every morning. And then one day I got it. I got it. And so, so, so lemme just explain the concept for your listeners because. Applies everywhere. Once I saw it, I couldn't unsee it. So we're entrepreneurs, right? So what are we trying, we're trying to hold opposites together. What are we trying to do? We're trying to hold achievement and acceptance at the same time.

Beverly 5:53

Mm-hmm.

Bob 5:54

Right? We're trying to hold, um, desire and um, and lack of desire at the same time. Mm-hmm. So once you start seeing that. Once you start getting frustrated about something, you can see that there's always an opposite. And they all, they're always together. It's the Buddhist concept of duality. But you know, this whole idea,'cause I was thinking, man, oh man, I really want another level for our business. And so I had this achievement right. You don't to talk about Momentum Mountain Workshop

Beverly 6:32

performance person? Yes. I

Bob 6:33

don't have, I'm sweating. I'm sweating on the mountain, but then meanwhile I'm reading Michael Singer and David Hawkins and you know, there's whole idea of surrender acceptance and how do you reconcile. Desire for achievement and surrendering and being present with whatever it is. And the answer is, you don't have to reconcile'em. They exist together. They're pairs of opposites.

Beverly 7:04

I

Bob 7:04

mean, and, but the, the reason that I brought that up is it's another example of you just do work. You do work, you do work, right? And then all of a sudden a truth reveals itself.

Beverly 7:15

Oh gosh, yes.

Bob 7:16

Oh.

Beverly 7:19

That's what problem. No, there's this, um, this I think philosophy or this idea that even like when you go to church, for example, um, I, I go to church every Sunday. My family is Catholic. We go to church and you're, you're like, you're meant to hear what you hear.'cause you know, when you're in church for an hour, you might like zone out a little bit. Come back to. It's like you're, you're supposed to hear what you're supposed to hear,

Bob 7:43

right?

Beverly 7:44

Like, so you might not need to hear the parts that you zoned out on, or maybe that zone out is what makes you think about the thing you need to think about, whatever that is. But you're, you, you're, you hear what you're supposed to hear, you learn what you're supposed to learn, and it comes to be as it's supposed to be kind of thing.

Bob 7:58

Yeah.

Beverly 7:58

When you are ready, when you have done the work, when you have, yeah. Opened your yourself to the, the idea of learning of, of this new skill, of this new awareness, whatever that is for you. Um, but yeah, there's like, you learn what you're supposed to learn when you're supposed to learn. It is a really interesting concept and it happens all the time. It's specifically more so I think in church'cause we're quieter in church.

Bob 8:21

Well,

Beverly 8:22

but

Bob 8:22

I, he's just gonna say that's exactly right. Se uh, serendipitous and synchronicity. Yeah. And all of these insights, they cannot come to a busy mind.

Beverly 8:33

Yes.

Bob 8:34

You know, you cannot accept through a closed fist. Right? You can't accept love through an open heart. You can't, you know, I mean, God, the universe, whatever, you know, your better nature, all those things. Can't be heard if you are always, if your mind is going at a million miles.

Beverly 8:54

Absolutely.

Bob 8:55

And that's where

Beverly 8:55

presence,

Bob 8:57

having the breath or a meditation or a yoga or a yoga knee practice

Beverly 9:02

Yeah.

Bob 9:03

Is so valuable because it slows your mind.

Beverly 9:07

So you have this amazing system, the Whizbang Retail Mastery System. Kind of talk about what that does and who it's specifically for. Like I know you work specifically with retailers. Talk a little bit about that and, and what that looks like for you guys so that Sure you are in that space. Can. Maybe get some more, you know, structure, mindset.

9:26

Sure.

Beverly 9:27

And, um, what was the other one? Structure, mindset and

Bob 9:30

mindset. Mindset. Skillset and structure.

Beverly 9:32

Skillset. That's the one that's skillset's the most important thing.

Bob 9:34

Yeah. Well, so, and, and you know, so mindset has to start. Right? Right. So they're perfect example of all these things. Fear. So people, you know, so it's not inexpensive. It's$3,000. So there's fear it won't work. I won't do it. I bought things before and I never did it. Or, you know, there's a, there's all these fears associated with it.

Beverly 9:57

Absolutely.

Bob 9:57

You have to make a commitment to doing it. But it, it, but it, it's really, truly filled with all the skills a retailer needs. So I'll just, you know, so a lot of the information that's in the retail mastery system is all the things that I sort of learned the hard way on my own, but what makes it so comprehensive? What makes it so special is it also includes all the things that Susan brought in. So, for instance, I didn't know what an open to buy plan was, you know, so when Susan came to work for us, she had been a buyer at Macy's and, uh, we had a, a partner at the time who was a, the CFO of a chain of sporting goods stores here in the Midwest. And Charlie told me, he said, Susan's gonna make you more money. I go, how's Susan gonna make me more money? Right. How could you make money buying? You know, I mean, I thought that buying was caught picking up the phone and ordering a bunch of stuff.

Beverly 11:00

Yeah.

Bob 11:00

Money by selling stuff. But of course I was wrong. I didn't know what, uh, a merchandising philosophy was. I didn't know what assortment planning was. There were just all of these retail skills that I didn't even know existed.

Beverly 11:14

Mm-hmm.

Bob 11:14

I, I was, uh, unconsciously incompetent.

Beverly 11:18

Yeah.

Bob 11:19

And then all of a sudden, I didn't know what, I didn't know Susan came along and now all of a sudden, now I know what I didn't know.

Beverly 11:26

Yes.

Bob 11:26

And that's one of the beautiful things.'cause there's 11 modules in the retail mastery system. Every one of them represents a different skill. And so if you get into retail, I guarantee, unless you come from a retail background and even then. I'm gonna say if you, so if you came from Target and you open a retail store, there's a whole nother skill that's specifically for, you know, but, uh, this whole, all of these skills, there's a module for each of these skills, and there's over 25 hours of, you know, information. There's, you know, there's over a hundred downloadable forms. So if you're a retailer and you're ready, you know, and you, you're ready to make that commitment. Ready to get past that fear. You know, it's got a 90 day unconditional money back guarantee, so you shouldn't have any fear. But you know, if you just say, what do I, if you go through it, you'll be more knowledgeable about what it takes to run a retail store than 97% of independent retailers in the world and a store period. I feel confident in saying that and you know, I would agree.

Beverly 12:40

I've worked with, with you that, that, that do the retail mastery. The clients that I have helped and have done the retail mastery system are far more sophisticated. They're far more intent intentional. They're far more confident that, like it has, it does change them as a leader and a business owner, and as a store owner and a community person. Like, it just, it, it, it, it changes everything for them, even from like, you know, how you do, um. Uh, there's gonna be a name for it.'cause you have a name for everything. Bob, you know, I the bob is in, uh, but like, how, how you do donations to, to

Bob 13:14

Oh yeah. Cause marketing. Sure.

Beverly 13:16

Marketing to, um, how, you know, because I'm the marketing side, right. So I see a lot of that side, like the, like the, um, Saturday sales and things like that.

Bob 13:25

Yeah.

Beverly 13:26

So I just feel like you have, uh, really honed down some of the things that are just incredibly important and powerful for retailers to really maximize every single customer that comes through the door. Maximize every single piece of inventory that comes in the door. Maximize your team in ways that you didn't even know was possible. The six, is it six steps to selling that you there?

Bob 13:47

Six steps, the perfect purchase. Yeah.

Beverly 13:49

Um, so I, I don't wanna know all the words, but I do know

Bob 13:54

you.

Beverly 13:54

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh, don't quiz me, but I do know a lot of the things that I feel like even though I am not a retailer, I have learned a ton from what the, the concepts. So I have an eight step to a perfect purchase kind of based on your six steps. So I have taken a lot of what you have offered to my clients because I've been in their orbit and your orbit for so long, um, and applied it to my service-based business as well. So I feel like there's just, it's incredibly thorough and, um, just general skills you need to understand as a business owner that I don't even think a business course can teach you. So,

Bob 14:30

no, a business course can't because a business, they, they look at things differently. And if, if I could add one thing here, Beverly, I think that. Not just as importantly, but something that is also very, very important is it teaches you how to think.

Beverly 14:46

Yeah.

Bob 14:46

Because when you get into business, everybody's telling you things and all of the beliefs from your past are all of a sudden raising their ugly head. If you have somebody, if you have beliefs that people are gonna try to take advantage of, you. That's how that belief is gonna show up in the way that you do business.

Beverly 15:05

Mm-hmm.

Bob 15:06

And, you know, sort of, you know, an, an example is, uh, I teach that you shouldn't have a return policy that you, your return policy should be, if you're not happy, we're not happy. And that runs so contrary to the way most people think.

Beverly 15:22

Mm-hmm. But.

Bob 15:23

You know, to your point, I'm good at explaining things so when I explain it, people go, oh, that makes sense. And I think that, you know, what we talked about at the very beginning here, this whole idea of heart of service. You know, another way to say it is love your customers. The money will follow.

Beverly 15:41

Yeah.

Bob 15:41

And you know, if, if just going through that, yes, you're gonna get all the tactics and all the things that you talked about, but you're also gonna learn how to think in this very customer focused. Heart of service, way to do business. And I think that that's so valuable.

Beverly 15:59

We talk about that too from, um, so many websites are built based on like, it's all about me and not about the customer. What would the customer do? It's one of the things that you guys talk about. Um, but like we say, it's the customer's journey. It's not. You're the guide and the customer, it, it needs to be written for the hero, the customer, not you. And so we really center the customer as well with the work that we do. Uh, and that is comes from, I mean, my husband's in the military. My mom was a nurse, my dad was a teacher. Service was, is like in my blood. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, definitely comes from that. But I, I do think when you, instead of s instead of selling as yours, like central as serving. It does change kind of how you approach things. I believe that entrepreneurship, I have a graduate degree in communications, but I believe that entrepreneurship has been the graduate degree of life. Like it is taught me things that, and I've encountered things that I would never have been possible with without doing entrepreneurship. Anything that you have struggled with. We'll probably be magnified somehow in the entrepreneurial world. Anything they've done really well will probably be minimized in some way in the entrepreneurial world. Like it's just, it's kind of this world that turns things in, in ways you never thought possibly.

Bob 17:16

Well, you know why? It's because, uh. The market doesn't lie. The market is what the market is. And if you're, and you know, so, so what is business? It's a value for value proposition. And if the, if you're not putting enough value out into the world, the world's not gonna give value back to you. Value, meaning money. Mm-hmm. And so, you know, you can't fool yourself.

Beverly 17:40

Yeah.

Bob 17:40

You know, or if you do try to fool yourself, you, you're gonna go outta business. But if you're looking at it from a realistic perspective, Hey, this ain't working. What am I, what am I going to do is your question. So, you know, I told you about our son running Stain Solver and you know, it, it didn't go the way that we had hoped it would go. I mean, we sold it. It's all, all right. But, you know, Joe is young and you know, he kind of see, saw it as a, as a failure. And I kept, got keep, I keep going back to him and saying, dude, you have no idea. What you have learned.

Beverly 18:19

Yeah.

Bob 18:19

And right now he's applying for jobs, you know, with startups and AI companies. He's sort of got networks there and you know, everybody's digging his what he did.

Beverly 18:31

Right,

Bob 18:32

right. And it's that whole idea of, you know, it, it goes back to I I, so if any of you, any, all of your listeners are entrepreneurs.

Beverly 18:43

Mm-hmm.

Bob 18:43

And I wanna say this to, to them. Even if your business doesn't become what you want it to, to become. So if you're a retailer and after you give it a good shot, you say, this isn't for me.'cause it's not for everybody.

Beverly 18:59

Yeah.

Bob 18:59

Or you open your own service business and after a couple years you go, this isn't fun. I don't wanna do this anymore. That's, it's all okay. Right, right. It's all part of your journey, but just recognize. You have done something that is so significant.

Beverly 19:16

Yes.

Bob 19:16

Most people only dream of starting a business. You know, how many times do people, you know, if, so, if you have a, a woman's clothing store and you go to a party, I know that you've heard 10 people say, oh, I've always wanted to have a clothing store. Right? Well, I'm always water, but guess what? You did it and good on you. Congratulations. You have officially set yourself apart for most of the world, and I applaud you and honor you for that.

Beverly 19:48

Mm-hmm. Absolutely. 100%. And, and it takes that, all those things we talked about, grit and heart and resilience and courage. To be that person, to put yourself in that position, to be vulnerable, to be, to be even open to learning all the things that we've talked about in this conversation. It's been amazing. We really haven't talked much about marketing, even though it is the Marketing Magic and Messy Middle podcast.

Bob 21:20

And that's one of my, I mean, our book is marketing your retail store in the internet age, so, yeah.

Beverly 21:26

Well, what I do always ask every single guest to answer a couple questions about. Sure. Um, so, um. The business that I have, I changed my name last marched from BC and Associates Marketing of Wickedly branded. And when I rebranded, it was for lots of reasons. But, um, I wanna know what it means to you to be wickedly branded. How do you show up or how does your business show up as Wickedly branded? And then what tips would you give to our listeners to be more wickedly branded?

Bob 21:57

Sure. Can I say a, a, a, a mild swear word?

Beverly 22:01

Yeah.

Bob 22:02

Okay, so here, here's how I'm wickedly branded. I know my shit and I care, right? Yeah. I mean that, there it is. You know, I know my shit because I have been there, I did this for 19 years,

Beverly 22:17

right?

Bob 22:17

26 years I've been doing it. So if, if I have an opinion, it's based on something that is real and tangible, and I'll defend it if I don't know. Okay. I'll tell you, I don't know. You know, that's, I mean, I'm not an expert. I'm not an expert in anything, but, uh, or in everything, but, and, and caring, you know, I, I just think that just showing up as yourself.

Beverly 22:44

Mm-hmm.

Bob 22:44

And, you know, and, and staying focused on it, because when I get tired, I, I sometimes stop. But, you know, authenticity. Especially in a, an increasingly impersonal digital world, or if you're in retail, you know, if you have a brick and mortar retail store, uh, you know, uh, just the ability to make people feel. Good about themselves by you being the best version of themselves. You know, one of the nice things about being a small business person is every day you have the opportunity to put some love into the world, to, you know, if you're in retail, especially if you have a coffee shop or

Beverly 23:32

mm-hmm.

Bob 23:32

You, you have, you know, you have a, a, a, a public facing business, you know, that whole heart of service. If you can be that way and you can build a culture that way, you're gonna build and, and you have skills, right? You have to have skills. You can't just say, oh, I love this, I love my customers. You have to be a good merchant. You have to be a good business person on top of it. But when you show up as the best version of yourself, and you build a business around the best version of yourself, you know, uh, and, and you back it up with skills, uh, I, that's always the qualifier. It's really hard to not be successful. You know, uh, that's, that's what I would say. That's how people need to be wickedly branded.

Beverly 24:20

That's beautiful. I appreciate that. So tell the listeners where they can find you, your website, where you hang out. Do you have a maybe for them?

Bob 24:29

Uh, so, uh, you can, if you go to ww Whizzbang training, there's an H in whizzbang training,

Beverly 24:36

like jeans whi

Bob 24:37

Yeah. Uh, you can sign up for the retail buzz, and if you sign up for the buzz every Wednesday, you'll get a, it used to be the tip of the week, now it's the retail buzz. And every Sunday you'll get, uh, an episode of my video blog, real Retail tv. We also have a very active, very positive Facebook group

Beverly 25:01

and

Bob 25:02

called Whizzbang retailers. Thank you. Yeah. I mean, it's a really great community. Mm-hmm. And, and now, uh, we have retail brilliance, which you talked about. And, uh, I would encourage everybody, retail brilliance. We're building it so that all of your retail education is all in one place. It costs you nothing to register. And, uh, you can look around, you can see all the courses, including courses by you, Beverly. Yeah. Uh, the retail mastery system is there, but you know, if you want skills, they're there. You just have to make that commitment to your education, to your growth, and to your future, right? I mean, it's not about my future, it's about your, you getting better. It's about your future and your family and your community. So. That's where you find me.

Beverly 25:53

Yes. And I will say that the, that the retail, the, the Whizzbang group on Facebook is probably one of my favorite Facebook groups. And I am in a lot of Facebook groups'cause of what we do. Bob, like I, yes, I'm all over the Internets. And so, uh, I feel like very engaged. You, you put out a lot of great content, you answer questions through videos, like you are just very active on there, curating that content. And I think you guys do a really good, you and Indian. Your team does a really good job there. Um, it's, it's really, it's, it's stellar. I feel like you, from the content and the people that are there, I think that retailers are like great people. Like there's just something about'em. They're just down to earth, you know?

Bob 26:34

Absolutely.

Beverly 26:35

They tell you how it is. They're.

Bob 26:38

Hey. And there's one other thing. Uh, the Retail Success Summit is our big event, and it happens, it, it, this year, it's live again in Grand Rapids, Michigan, uh, June 13th and 14th. I think I, I'll be there, I promise.

Beverly 26:54

Oh, ouch. Put your calendar right,

Bob 26:58

but, uh, you know, so just imagine yourself in the room with 350, 400, you know, really, really growth minded. Uh, customer focused retailers, the energy is just great. So that's something that, uh, I would encourage everybody to look into for sure.'cause you come to the summit once, you will leave fired up. You'll, you'll leave with great perf

Beverly 27:21

with, uh, enthusiasm. When you, you'll, you'll be drinking from a straw in the ocean like you're big. The ocean from a straw because there's so much good stuff that you guys offer. Last year I was, I was a part of it, gave a talk as well. It's a great conference for sure. You should attend. Um, the people you're gonna meet are gonna be amazing. The speakers are gonna be phenomenal. Some of my favorite people have been, um, the, um, oh, the deli.

Bob 27:47

Erman, Ari Wewe,

Beverly 27:49

some really good people you've had. Yeah. On stage, uh, talking about their experience and what they do, and like Bob said, with retail brilliance, we have three courses on there. One of the favorites is the marketing binder that, that you can kind of like, organize and keep all of your marketing stuff in workplace.

Bob 28:06

Can I pitch that for you for a second though? I'll tell you what that. Piece is so important. You know, this whole idea of you when we talked about mindset, skillset, structure, mm-hmm. Structure. One of the most important structural pieces you can build in your business is to have a marketing plan that is all in one place. Because if you have a marketing plan, if you build a good plan and you plan each thing correctly, and you recap it after it's done and it resides in that binder, all of a sudden that binder becomes yes, that that binder becomes the foundation of all of your marketing plans in the future. And if you want your business to be more valuable, you need to have these structural pieces. So if somebody comes in, they wanna buy your business and you can show them that really good looking book and say, look, you don't, you can do other things if you want, but if you just follow this marketing plan mm-hmm. You're good to go.

Beverly 29:20

Yes.

Bob 29:20

And then you have a training program. If you just put your people through this training program, you are good to go. Mm-hmm. You know, those are, you know, there's a whole bunch of structural Yeah. That's what a savvy buyer will be willing to pay a lot more for.

Beverly 29:35

Well, we also give the example in there that if you work with vendors that you can, if you're showing you know how an event is profitable or how a particular type of inventory moves during that event, you can start to create collaborations and partnerships with vendors where they're paying you for marketing. Now, I don't know any, any listener or any business owner who wouldn't love, it's some infusion of cash to help you with your marketing budget.

Bob 30:01

Yeah. So

Beverly 30:02

when you are organized and you are more sophisticated, and like you said, 97% of the people out there and you have a plan, you know it works, you can see the numbers and you show it to them, they're, they're like, yep. Like when, when you can make a really sophisticated ask and they know that they can rely on this partnership to help them grow. Like there's, it's what's in it for both of us. It becomes a really powerful tool to help you create those collaborations and. Also benefit you, whether it's some infusion of cash or even like free samples or whatever the thing might be for that event or that particular promotion. But it does really elevate you as a business owner in their mind for sure. No,

Bob 30:40

it's so, yeah, it's just, it's a level of sophistication and I don't know if you learned this from Lewis and Joe, but you know that whole asking, creating partnerships is something that I learned. From Lewis and Jill, and they use it with that book. Lewis and Jill own the pet bistro here in Michigan, and they're members of our platinum Mastermind group and their, uh, clients of Beverly's. But you know, I mean that whole idea of going and asking, but not just asking, showing them the value that they are going, that the vendor is going to get. I mean, when they first started talking about doing the strategy that you just shared, I mean, I was like,'cause you know, I'm, I'm around, I, I talk to retailers all the time and when I hear a brilliant idea, man, a light bulb goes off at my head. And I thought that was a brilliant one. And to your point, and so for everybody who's listening, you know, if you don't have that, uh, marketing binder. Make that investment, it really is a great investment. You can find it on retail brilliance.com.

Beverly 31:46

Thank you for the, the hype. I appreciate it, Barbara. You're

Bob 31:49

welcome.

Beverly 31:49

I actually was really blessed to be able to go to, to, to some of their conferences with them. The PET Bistro, they've been a client of mine for 15 years. Uh, uh, 15 year.'cause you know, I was like six when I started.

Bob 32:01

I was just gonna say, but no, it was never, ever happened. Never.

Beverly 32:06

Um, but, uh, I, I, they were opening their second store and I was there helping and I presented, um, all of this stuff that we had built for them in, within the binder, like, you know, presentation style from a marketing perspective. And we were able to get them six figures worth of. Some either promotions, you know, money

Bob 32:27

reserves. It was

Beverly 32:27

crazy.

Bob 32:28

It was crazy.

Beverly 32:29

It was crazy. Yeah. And I was there and it was, it was so incredibly powerful, um, to be a part of that and to see how powerful it just, how like everybody was like, yes. Like there wasn't a lot of people who said no. I know the market's changed a little bit late lately, but it was, they couldn't say no to it.

Bob 32:46

Right. Well, you know, and so for all of your listeners, you know, I, I think that, I just want to, you know, sort of dial it into to, and, and state it more succinctly. So asking your vendors for, uh, money, for samples, for product, for all those things, you know, everybody does it. What Beverly is talking about, what we are talking about here, what Lewis and Jill do so well is asking for money or asking, asking for something, but then showing exactly, you know, we sort of, we've talked about it, but I'm trying to get it right. I want this.

Beverly 33:24

Mm-hmm.

Bob 33:25

But I want this, and here's what you're going to get from me if you give me this, you know, and be very, very specific about it. Mm-hmm. Then to your point, Beverly, they go, oh, how can I say no?

Beverly 33:39

Right.

Bob 33:39

I'm gonna give you this. I I'm gonna get flee freezer space. I'm gonna get an end cap. I'm gonna get, I'm gonna get, I'm gonna get it. It makes sense.

Beverly 33:46

Yes. So I'm gonna get in front of your 10,000 newsletter list. Yes. That's gonna be on social media every month. Oh my gosh. Like it being, when you give them that and you show that, and you show like, here's our reach in these areas, and you're really organized in that information, that is the key and that's why the marketing mind are so incredibly powerful. Going in with such intention, there's a difference going in and saying, oh yeah, I'm doing, you know, I'm so and so for, I'm Lisa from so and so, and uh, do you have any examples versus, yeah, perfect. I did this event last year. This is how much we sold. This is my reach. This is where our intention is. We grew 12% in this area. We wanna do this with your product. Are you interested in being part of this? And they're like, yeah, what else can I sign up for?

Bob 34:32

Yes,

Beverly 34:32

they are eager to have those relationships with you, and they're eager to have those collaborations because there is something in it for them, but there's also a lot that can be in it for you as the owner of the business. That's

Bob 34:44

exactly

Beverly 34:45

right. So I, I am a big fan of the marketing binder. It's my, it was a labor of love. Let me tell you, Bob,

Bob 34:50

it's, and it's a wonderful thing. Highly recommended.

Beverly 34:53

Yes. Thank you so much for the hype. I appreciate it. Bob, this has been an incredible conversation. We went far longer than me and Todd then, but I feel like we could go another hour. It'd be really easy. But for my listeners, I just want you, you know, if this episode did one thing, I hope it challenged, um, the story that so many businesses, business owners tell themselves that if things are hard or that something must be wrong with them because as you heard today. Most small businesses don't struggle because of the economy or the algorithm or the lack of passion inside of them. They struggle because no one ever taught them the skills they actually needed to run a profitable, sustainable business. And that, that truth is incredibly powerful.'cause it means growth is possible for you. It means you can learn these things. Confidence can be built. Brilliance can come from education at a point of exhaustion, right? So I really hope that maybe a little fire, uh, was let under you today, gave you tons of ideas and reminded you that your work actually really deeply matters. I believe that marketing isn't just about visibility, it's about the impact you can create. It's about this using the skills that you have built to connect with the right people and the way that feels true to you. So I want you to keep learning, keep refining, and keep showing up with intention. And if you know the Retail Mastery system is great for you, or the the Retail Brilliance Program is for you with those courses, please check them out. But if you ever, ever feel stuck or unsure of your next step. Just know this. You don't have to do it alone. People like Bob, we're there for you. We're there to help you turn what you've learned into some momentum, real momentum for your business, and really spark your, your growth and your business in a way you never thought possible. But until next time, I really want you to dare to be wickedly branded.

Bob 36:37

Wow, what an incredible conversation we just had. I hope that this episode lit a little bit of a fire under you to

Beverly 36:44

finally bring your brand to life in a way that feels true to you. Remember, clarity is the spark, but activation is that fire and flame that keeps your message and your visuals and your strategy aligned and the confidence that follows. So does that lovely thing called momentum you've been waiting for. So if today's episode, if you loved it. Make sure you are subscribed to the Wickedly Branded Marketing Podcast so you never miss an insight or a conversation. Until next time, dare to be wickedly branded.