Unveiled Mindset

Unveiled Mindset Ep 26: ARE AFRICAN PARENTS LESS AFFECTIONATE OR JUST DIFFERENT?

• DNCK • Season 1 • Episode 26

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Noticing when someone gets their eyebrows done might seem trivial, but could it be a profound expression of love? We kick off with this intriguing question as we explore the myriad ways affection is demonstrated within African families and multicultural settings. Through a tapestry of personal stories, we unravel how the small acts of attentiveness—like ensuring a partner’s safety during an outing—can speak volumes about love and care. Challenging stereotypes head-on, we examine whether African parents are truly less affectionate or if their love simply takes on different forms, such as blessings and actions, rather than the hugs and verbal affirmations often celebrated in Western cultures.

As we venture deeper into the multicultural dynamics of affection, we shine a light on the unique ways immigrant families express love, emphasizing the importance of understanding these cultural nuances. From generational shifts to integrating into new environments, these rich and varied expressions of love challenge the notion that affection is a one-size-fits-all concept. By sharing heartfelt anecdotes and community insights, we invite listeners to appreciate the beauty in diversity and to recognize the underlying care in actions that might otherwise go unnoticed.

Switching gears, we dive into the male perspective on affection, particularly how cultural backgrounds shape how men express love toward the women in their lives. With a mix of humor and sincerity, we explore the balancing act between traditional roles and personal affection styles, shedding light on the realities faced in multicultural relationships. Navigating these complexities, we uncover the importance of blending cultural norms while staying true to yourself, ultimately finding joy in the diversity of expressions that make each relationship unique. Join us as we embark on this journey, where understanding and appreciation lead to deeper connections and a celebration of what makes us wonderfully different.

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Speaker 1:

oh my god, you see my eyebrows, like I got my.

Speaker 2:

I don't uh, ladies, your significant other should notice your eyebrows when you get it done thank you.

Speaker 1:

Nope, I can't tell the difference. It seemed. What is this attentiveness? I fall in that category, right there.

Speaker 2:

I don't even know at this point whenever we go out all right so I do. I cross the street.

Speaker 1:

Most of the time you don't. For me, showing affection, it would be, for example, like whenever we go out. Well, I don't even know at this point. Intimacy, friendship. Come on now, be honest. How many times have I pulled you back A lot? How many times have I pulled you back a lot? How many times that, um, you know? Affection. I thought that I was an affectionate, but I realized that I was the whole time it's something they never gonna get that, but it's cool.

Speaker 3:

It's like Numi got the Uzi man. She always speakin' facts, she be droppin' bombs, make all of them double back and then the crime raises. It's somethin' they never gon' get that, but it's cool. Let's sit back and chill, chill.

Speaker 1:

You gotta be stoic. You can't be frail If you get on the track. You can't derail If you stick around long enough you will surely be unveiled. What's good everybody.

Speaker 2:

Welcome to another unveil podcast episode um hosted by me daughter conda, my lovely right room socava hey guys, welcome, welcome, welcome back to the unveil mindset podcast, where we have enlightening and purposeful conversations that help to nurture growth and unveil the mind. Um, if you haven't done so already, please make sure you subscribe down below. As we've mentioned, we're trying to hit a thousand subscribers by the end of the summer. So come on, unveil family. Please go ahead and subscribe. Let us know, too, what your thoughts are.

Speaker 2:

Let's be engaging in this conversation yep so make sure you follow us on all platforms. Unveil mindset or unveiled underscore mindset yep.

Speaker 1:

So today we're gonna get into one of my favorite topic. I think one of your favorite topic as well, um, so let's just get into it, all right. So the question is do you feel like our parents are affectionate or do you feel like they're not? And if you feel like they are, you know explain. And if you feel like they're not, and if you feel like they are, you know explain. And if you feel like they're not, you can also explain. Not, you can. You can talk about your personal, you know relationship. But in general, in the community, what do you, what do you see and how do you feel about it, based through you know, through conversation and with other? How do you feel or what do you know per se about affection being part of our culture? Do you think it exists or do you think it doesn't exist?

Speaker 2:

I. So first I'll talk about my experience. I hundred percent, a thousand percent, believe that my parents are affectionate because they are, um, I grew up in a very affectionate households, um, and so I would say the answer to that is absolutely yes, um, in terms of uh, community, I mean from what I've heard or from what people say, like people will say that like, oh, um, you know, african parents are a little bit harder or may not be as affectionate et, but I believe that you know it's, it's it's easier to say that when you have different definitions of affection. I think here in the West a lot of people prescribe to and have learned this new definition of affection, which is, you know, hugging and telling each other like I love you and you know I appreciate you, like words of affirmation as well as you know physical touch and all this other stuff, like and when we're more talking about family members, even like when it comes to like hugging or handshaking or you know things like that kind of have. And then you know spending certain types of quality time where you're talking about certain topics and how you feel and whatnot, whereas you know we may have a different, traditionally uh, definition of affection.

Speaker 2:

Right, it may not be in the sense of oh, I love you or you know, whatever the equivalent, like french or mandingo or whatever language it is that you speak, fulani, et cetera term is. It may not be I love you, but it may be like your mom blessing you every single time you get off the phone, right, your mom blessing you every time you get out the house or anything happens, and wishing you you know amazing things, or you're in your dad doing the same thing. So I think you know, in this community I've heard a lot of people say like no, you know the stigma of African parents or immigrant parents or whatever the case may be, are not as affectionate. But I do think that a huge part of that misconception of not affectionate because there's different definitions of what that means, because of the multicultural experience, yeah, I agree.

Speaker 1:

So another thing, like, because we kind of talked about it a little bit, right, and then I kind of gave you my perspective on it, right. So are you saying that now, after the conversation or before, what was your initial like perspective on it? Did you think from, like, just speaking with others or talking to other people from the same culture as us, but maybe grew up back home or whatever, or end up coming over here later on and didn't experience some of those things that you did in your, you know, with your parents?

Speaker 2:

um, I would say before we had the conversation about it, um, my, my thought was or the way that people have made a seamer kind of what I said seem oh, there's a seamer the way that people have made it seem is is, um, essentially that, no, they, you know, know, african parents or a lot of African parents are, you know, harder, stricter, less affectionate. And that's that's in my answer. That's what I said. I said, you know, it may, um, from people around in the community and stuff like that.

Speaker 2:

You hear people say that, hey, no, their parents are not affectionate. But it may stem from what we discussed, but in, in part, in that first part of my response, I said, um, it can appear as if, like, they're not affectionate and because that's what a lot of people will voice, a lot of you know people, our generation, um, and a little bit older, the younger one, like super, super younger one, I think they're getting some of that affection because people you know, parents, have been here for a little bit longer. But the common theme that I would hear a lot of people say especially they'll say especially their fathers. They'll say like, yeah, no, fathers, um, they didn't really see a lot of affection with the fathers and then, even like between the mothers and the fathers, like the parents together, they didn't see that much affection yeah is what people would say.

Speaker 1:

People would say and did you, did you lean towards more, towards that I you know saying, or no, because my parents were at the opposite no, no, no, I get. I'm saying like for, like the general consensus, right, like, did you lean towards more?

Speaker 2:

like okay, maybe that's what it is yeah, to me it was, that's what I kept hearing, so that that was anytime. I would kind of gave my experience. It's more, it's mainly oh well, no, your case is. Your case is different so you don't understand so for me I felt okay, that's a hundred percent, not my experience, and I don't agree with it because that's not what I saw, but from what a lot of people are saying, that's their experience so okay, that's what's out there because the reason why I said it is that there's the general consensus about you, thank you.

Speaker 1:

There's the general perspective or idea of narrative of one thing and also there's an exception right so because, like I, people like me, me, me, I'm like yo, it's not, it's not about you, it's about the, the, the group in totality, right. So, and then I, because I would, I used to think about that. I was like yo, like I don't think we're necessarily affectionate, I think we're just strictly business, like I'm your dad, I'm your mom, your brother, your sister, like boom, boom, boom, everything is like functional, like a machine, right. And then like, as as time went on, like I started thinking about, I was like yo, culture there's, there's, there's difference in cultures, right, and each culture come with you know their own, like ways, right, and our culture, I was like okay, like if that's the case, if we grew up so harsh or like, let's say, there was no affection in the house, how would we really function? Because when I really think about the, the family dynamic, right, not just me, but others, right, or things that we talked about, it like they're not affectionate. And then they'll just tell you a story like I remember one time, me and my dad, we did this and did that, or me and my mom did, I'm like, but you don't even think about it, you're saying that there's no affection at home. Then you, you bring up a scenario or topic or situation that happened that was affectionate. Yeah, right. So, for example, like here in the state in america, like the way they show affection is they hug, like you say, kiss, um, you know, being all tender and all of that right, and for us it might not be that, and that don't mean we're not affectionate, we just have different ways of showing it. So, because we're multicultural, because we're we, we come from one culture and then we end up moving to another country that also have their own culture, like can become a little confusing if you, if you're not careful yeah, right, because you're like, okay, oh, this way, affection is, yes, it is, that's affection for them, but for us it's different.

Speaker 1:

I even give, I think I told I mean I'm like yo imagine being back home. You're going to to, um, I can't remember what's the name of it like um farm, like there, let's go. You're going farming with your, with your pops, or you know um, what you call it, probably building something with your pops. That's like, that's a, that's a way of showing affection, or send down with your pops. He's telling you stories, telling you the way to carry yourself, and all of that even on the simplest, you know people, oh, that's not affection, even caring, they're even taking care of somebody's showing affection, right, like it's completely different. Because here you see the kisses and hug. You know, okay, that's affection, not the fact that you don't see that in our culture, you automatically believe that we don't show affection. And to me that's where I kind of disagree, until we started going putting the layers one by one and then you get to see that, okay, there's affection there. It's just completely different from the other culture or the american culture. So that's that's, that's what I I really uh feel, because I know the general consensus is that we're not affectionate. Even with this, people are going to say, yeah, we're not. I just want you to sit back and just think about it.

Speaker 1:

You know, when they say affection, what do you? What do you really? What are you really looking for? What are you expecting? Right, because the kisses and hugs is just.

Speaker 1:

That's not the only way. There's different ways, you know, uh, of doing it. Because me, I didn't me sitting down on my dad, him telling me stories, or send down my uncles or my aunties back home. They're telling us stories or whatever, or you know, or giving us remember, like on clubhouse, we used to play these games called uh, like like riddles, right, and then we usually get that from from the elders, right and um, they have like double meaning and double entendre. Like those are all showing affection.

Speaker 1:

You guys laughing, or you're going walking through the mosque with your pops, like he probably holding your hands, like oh no, I'm gonna make sure you don't run and cross the street and get hit by a car. That's all showing affection. Caring, respect is affection, you know. So it's like you gotta dig deep and to really analyze what you're looking for, because without those affection, I don't think we'll be caring and loving people, because I believe our community, like we're very loving and caring, right, so the other culture too. So it's just the mentality of you know, one culture and another culture doesn't really align all the way. So then, instead of making you're making comparison to apply that to one culture, which one culture doesn't work that way, you know.

Speaker 2:

So pretty much that's how I feel about it.

Speaker 1:

I agree Do you have anything to add on?

Speaker 2:

I think you pretty much summed it up. I agree that there's different definitions of affection, you know across the world, and so it's important to understand. You know the world, and so it's important to understand. You know the person who's giving. And it's kind of like in america when you learn about word of affection, or what is it?

Speaker 2:

Um, not word of affection, but um, what is it called? Um the types of affection? Like your love language, right? And so, with regards to like the love language, um, it's the same thing. It's important to understand, like, what is the love language of the receiver? What of the love, the love language of the giver, right? If, um, I'm, I'm thinking that I'm giving you affection by doing xyz and you consume affection differently, it doesn't mean that I'm not giving you affection, I'm just not giving you affection that you consider is affection. Yeah, same thing, like so. So I think it's important to um understand, like you know, what your parents or what that can, in order to bridge the gap, it's important to understand, understand what that love language or what that affection type is that the person is giving, correct, so that you can identify when they are giving those and then you can, you know, solidify to yourself like yeah, no, actually that's how they're showing it to me.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and so I was going to go back the one other thing too.

Speaker 2:

Like, don't be afraid to like like the other side, just like a love language, right, like, hey, this is kind of my, here's how I like to receive, you know, affection or love or whatever. Don't be afraid to reciprocate and kind of teach the other person what you consider and how you view and take in and consume affection and love, because when you do that you can actually end up changing little by little. The person will adapt, and when the person adapts, then mutually you know how they consume affection and then you can also give them the affection that they need and that they want. I think it's important to understand how do people want to be loved? Right, there's how you love on someone, but how do people want to be loved. And an example there's how you love on someone, but how do people want to be loved.

Speaker 2:

And an example of that is like with my parents. I'm very like every time we get off the phone we say I love you. Right, every, every single time we get off the phone we say I love you, I tell them I miss you, I give them hugs, like every case with my eldest siblings, right when they first got it, came to the us and like, no, it wasn't right. This whole idea of, okay, I love you, you know, bye, whatever, it wasn't a thing, but it's something that, like, that's just how I show affection, and now, that's true um reciprocated you know, with what you're saying, that you know you say I love you on the phone.

Speaker 1:

I really don't recall, like you know, saying I love you like to my mom or my dad or stuff like that. But I but I know they do, you know, and I'm right, you know, and they know that I love them too. Right, but it's not something we just throw around. You know somebody's like you guys are not affection, that's not true. It's just we just operate, that's not your way of affection we operate differently, right so?

Speaker 1:

and the reason why I said that? Because, like, for example, me and you like, would you consider me to be affectionate um in the way that you give affection. Yes, okay, so like somebody, like because, and I know like how in the way that I give affection.

Speaker 1:

No because you're all like, because I'm like yo, because sometimes it's like I'm like she's annoying, like, like, like. When I said annoying, it's like oh, I want to cuddle, oh this and the other, because we're not used to that. Like you know, we're used to like. We're not usually um us, like who's us, I'm used to it. No, I'm talking about like us, like the boys, like we're not. I give my dad hugs. No, we give hugs like, like what I'm saying, like yeah, like my, brother's I don't maybe maybe exactly actually.

Speaker 2:

No, my brother hugs my mom.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I'm talking about my mom, like okay, okay dad, come here, dad, like, come on, man, like get off me. What I'm saying is like you know.

Speaker 2:

All right, yeah, who's us maybe define?

Speaker 1:

that maybe you're you're, you're just excessive with yours. No, maybe define that. Who is? Us like, like us, like the, the boys, like we africans, uh-huh so towards their wives and mothers and sisters, like towards women in their lives that they have, like, I think, with their mom they're more soft and gentle. That's your mom, like he's. It just naturally, just happens.

Speaker 2:

You know you want to hug your mom I think, naturally that's how people are also with like their you know their significant others.

Speaker 1:

I'm saying with moms like especially my mom is like it's always been like I told you I was like 24. My mom was like, yeah, you guys, come on, we're going to bed, like we're going to share the bed. She said we're still kids. I was like, no, I'm growing. And then she was like you know, you're trying to be, know, you're trying to be, you're trying to be defiant. You know you're not. You know like, you know stuff like that. You know mom and and son, you know dynamic or whatever, yeah.

Speaker 1:

Or it's like, oh, you're not sleeping here, like no, mom, I gotta go to my house. Like you know stuff like that, yeah. So it's like it's naturally like you know you. Little by little, you fight your way out of that. It's just look, I'm gonna hug you now, mom, but I'm not gonna like be your little boy, you know, man. Um, we're past that. But as the father, I think it's like a respect thing. It's like like a respect thing, right. So, and I'm not saying we can't be affectionate in that way, but I'm just saying it's like all the time sometimes, like honestly, let me not just say that, because I think sometimes men want space, like like yo don't be crowding my space all the time. It's like goku, goku do it all the time. Goku always want to lay on my feet. I want to get you see him, you know you come and touch him, yeah like you know.

Speaker 1:

So maybe you and goku got the same love language. Maybe we do. Yeah, but, um, yeah, but, but yeah, but like I think I'm like 50-50 or maybe 60-60-40. 60-40. Of what Like, more like and then more of.

Speaker 2:

You're not saying much.

Speaker 1:

What I'm trying to say is like I'm affectionate in your way, like 40%, and I'm affectionate in my own way 60%.

Speaker 2:

Oh, you think so yeah.

Speaker 1:

Like Okay, I think so.

Speaker 2:

You know what I'm saying, president? Oh, you think, so yeah like, okay, I think.

Speaker 1:

So, you know. It's like you know it could be 70, 30. What is affection in your way? Uh, my way is um. You come home, say hi. I say hi, how's your day you good? Are you good? Okay, everything went well. Okay, you feel safe? Great, go in the kitchen safe go in the kitchen and cook for us, right?

Speaker 2:

and then we're gonna that is not a thing, you're done, I'm gonna take out the trash.

Speaker 1:

I'm gonna take out the trash now, boom, boom. All right, you know here.

Speaker 2:

Those are like rolls, those are like, just like you asked me. Okay, sorry, go ahead, then I wash the dishes and um, yeah, I got a headache.

Speaker 1:

You okay, you need some medicine. Go in the cabinet, give you some water and medicine okay I can finally rest.

Speaker 1:

Now that's affection right there. Like, leave me alone, like affection, leave me alone. Sometimes I'm watching a game, or I'm watching my show, or kendrick just dropped the disc this and drake I'm trying to listen to, I'm trying to listen to the lyrics, and you're over here telling me about some. You know what happened at work today. I don't want to hear that, but nah, but honestly, like to me, I would say, like for me, showing affection, it would be, for example, like whenever we go out Well, I don't even know at this point, whenever we go out, I don't even know at this point.

Speaker 2:

This is great. How do you show affection whenever we go out? You never look left or right so I do when I cross the street most of the time you don't I mean, I mean okay be honest, how many times have I pulled you back a lot?

Speaker 1:

how many times I say noom? So I I worry about your safety almost probably more than you because you're there. So no, even when I'm not there, I tell you boom, boom, boom, look at this, look at that. Even when I'm not there, yo noom, so don't speed. This, look at that. Even when I'm not there, don't speed. That's probably why we got a ticket Don't do this, don't do that. When you're crossing the street, usually I'm the eyes.

Speaker 2:

That's protective.

Speaker 1:

That's affection. That's caring, that's loving.

Speaker 2:

What is the definition of affection? Okay, let's look it up, yeah like what is? What is affection?

Speaker 1:

okay, we see affection, okay, gentle, feeling Of fondness or liking, right. So they have an example she felt affection for the wise old lady and they have similar Like synonyms or whatever they have liking Endearment, warmness, devotion, care, caring. What is this Attentiveness? I fall in that category, right there. Intimacy, friendship. Come on now.

Speaker 2:

You're not stopping me. We even have a Come on man. We haven't done it in a while you know what I'm saying?

Speaker 1:

You forgot the. You didn't even finish. What is it? There we go. Boom Boom Bro, come on, come on bro. Okay, okay, we have favor. I do a lot of favor, bro, like massage my feet. Um, you don't mean massaging my feet, friendly, friendliness, super time attachment. That's goku and you. Um, what is this? What else?

Speaker 2:

it's, it's all of the above. Yeah, so so so I fall in.

Speaker 1:

I fall in some of the categories. You fall in some of the categories too respect, you remember I said that, respect right, a father and a son. Dynamic respect, you know, showing your son how to respect others, to respect you, respect your mom. Respect, you know. So that's all part of being affection. So like, come on now, so it's just culturally it come with. You know it come differently okay, do you?

Speaker 2:

So it's just culturally it come with. You know it come differently Okay. Do you feel like it's important for one to learn the affection language, I guess, or love language of the other, and give that love language to the other as much as you can.

Speaker 1:

You know you should implement it.

Speaker 2:

Yeah.

Speaker 1:

The way of how you show affection, and then the other your significant other should also understand that the way you show affection is different sometimes, so you should also be attentive, which is one of them right, you should be paying attention to that too. Yeah, it's like you guys kind of like balance each other out.

Speaker 2:

Yep, you know do you, do you feel like there's room for more of the you said 40, 60, so then. So then that means at 60 there's room for like hell.

Speaker 1:

No growth, no, that's growing. It was, it was. It was 90, 10.

Speaker 2:

That's a lot of growth no, that's not saying, that's not a lot yeah, yeah, that's a lot that is a lot. I'm I'm saying do you feel like there's room? I mean there's a lifetime to come, so you try and make me solve that one is important to go for seven years come on grow

Speaker 1:

no, I think it's perfect. Where is that? Like you know, I think, um, you know there's a room to like, for you to grow like in which way? When I'm watching my games, you leave me alone. Or when I don't want to way, when I'm watching my games, you leave me alone. Or when I don't want to talk, or when I'm watching my show, I got to pause every five minutes because you're saying something.

Speaker 1:

I don't care, I really don't care, but like, yeah, so, like you know, you feel me, it's like we're just different, we're different species, bro, I think that. And listen, because I just said I have to stop every five minutes to listen. So there you go, you need you know what you said. I don't care. Yeah, I say like I'm saying I don't care, right, because meaning, some of the conversation are nonsensical topic, and then I don't care, but I'm saying if it's like yo, you gotta run this number, all right, come on now, it's not the same. But I don't want to hear about oh my god, you see my eyebrows like I got my. I don't want to hear about. Oh my God, you see my eyebrows Like.

Speaker 2:

I got my. I don't Ladies. Your significant other should notice your eyebrows when you get it done.

Speaker 1:

Thank you. Nope, I can't tell the difference. It seemed like it looked like whenever you come out to the shop and I pick you up, it looked like you put some Vaseline on your eyebrows and they're just shining Like I'm like. So you just I'm not gonna have done that.

Speaker 2:

I could have put gasoline on your eye, just kind of rub it at all, and that's what they do.

Speaker 1:

No, it's not there's a lot more that happens. Come on now, but yeah, so overall the whole, you know, premise of this conversation is to make people understand that affection is not just one way and we should just kind of double down and just kind of do some deep research and see what, to understand what affection is and not to conflate one culture with the other culture, because you grew up in both culture and it's merged.

Speaker 1:

So sometimes you lean to because I would say that, like being multicultural, right, because of the diversity, of you know your experience, right, you tend to like, either lean on one side when it makes sense, and then you lean on the other side. When it makes sense, when we talk about affection in terms of like how this culture show affection and hugs, you say, oh, that's affection, this is not affection. And then something in this culture doesn't really align with this other culture, like like it's crazy, yeah, like all african-americans, they don't get it.

Speaker 1:

Blah, blah, blah, this sticky boom, and then you go more, search the african side. So whenever africans do something that you agree with, like yeah, see, the americans, they do this. So we, we, we tend to like like you know, go both ways. You know, one minute the pendulum swing this way, one minute swing the other way. So it's like try to find the baddest and stay in the middle. Understand one side, understand the other and don't conflate the two. And then try to make. You know, call that yo, that's not affection.

Speaker 2:

Don't make, don't combine two culture and then expect that to be everything if that, yeah, I think the way, yeah, the way that I think about it is under yeah, understand both of them and understand when people are behaving in each in in in one or the other, they're reasoning for it because of understanding that.

Speaker 2:

You know that that culture specifically, however, the beauty of and and you know the curse, or whatever the case maybe you want to call it of being a multicultural person, or being multicultural, is and and this also even means, like people who come from different socioeconomic backgrounds, right someone who came from one socioeconomic background and then worked hard and ended up being, you know, at the top, at a completely different socioeconomic background and then worked hard and ended up being, you know, at the top, at a completely different socioeconomic background.

Speaker 2:

It's, there's still a gap that needs to be bridged from something you know that the people of where you came from understood in the way of being in that culture and that community, versus where the current state that you're at. So I think it's important in that case, too, and the beauty of it is, you are both right, you are both. So sometimes you're one and uh when it comes to certain topics, sometimes you're another when it comes to a different topic, and that's honestly okay. But what's important is understanding the other side, understanding where the other side comes from, and that's where I think you said standing in the middle To me, I think it's fine to sway each way based on what the topic is, because that's what makes that multicultural experience dynamic. However, understand the other side and where they come from because of the underlining, like depths, of that culture and that community so when I say stay, stand in between, I get what you're saying.

Speaker 1:

When I'm just standing in between, like for balance, what I'm saying pretty much is like I can observe something from this culture and from that culture and apply it to my daily life pretty much, that's what it is, man. So, um, we, we just learned something new today. I guess I hope you guys took something from this. Um, what did we learn new? Well, I learned that, um, you know, affection. I thought that I was an affectionate, but I realized that I was the whole time.

Speaker 1:

It was just it's different that's what you learn different strokes for different folks, right strategy, yep, and understanding what works for who, and it all depends on your culture. Don't try to submit yourself to something that you're not be yourself and try to adapt. You know so that that's all I got to say yep, agreed sense.

Speaker 2:

Make sure you guys tune in to the audios as well. Make sure you listen to the podcast on Apple Podcasts as well as Spotify, and, yeah, make sure you tune in to those streams, because those numbers count. If you like the episodes, make sure you leave us a five star on those platforms as well.

Speaker 1:

Yep, and you know we'll see you guys next time. I'm Del Mar. I said never fail to see you guys next time. Mindset never fail to surprise you guys. We out bye.

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