Unravel the enigma of Ron Weasley with Professor Julian Wamble and the pod's FIRST EVER guest, Dani Alexander. This episode promises a deep reexamination of the often-misunderstood youngest Weasley son, challenging the ambivalence he evokes. Together, Dani and Prof. W. dissect Ron's insecurities, his quest for individual distinction, scrutinize his interactions with family and friends, and the often-overlooked depth of his loyalties.
They dive into Ron's ordinariness, deliberating why it might garner less empathy than the extraordinary hardships of his companions. Dani's insights enhance our discussion, encouraging us to extend grace to characters who mirror the human experience, even when their triumphs may not shimmer with the allure of heroism or extraordinary intelligence.
Join us for an exploration that's as much about the intricacies of Ron Weasley as it is about our own willingness to forgive, empathize, and appreciate the genuine friendship at the heart of the Harry Potter series.
Feelings about Ginny Weasley Survey
Unravel the enigma of Ron Weasley with Professor Julian Wamble and the pod's FIRST EVER guest, Dani Alexander. This episode promises a deep reexamination of the often-misunderstood youngest Weasley son, challenging the ambivalence he evokes. Together, Dani and Prof. W. dissect Ron's insecurities, his quest for individual distinction, scrutinize his interactions with family and friends, and the often-overlooked depth of his loyalties.
They dive into Ron's ordinariness, deliberating why it might garner less empathy than the extraordinary hardships of his companions. Dani's insights enhance our discussion, encouraging us to extend grace to characters who mirror the human experience, even when their triumphs may not shimmer with the allure of heroism or extraordinary intelligence.
Join us for an exploration that's as much about the intricacies of Ron Weasley as it is about our own willingness to forgive, empathize, and appreciate the genuine friendship at the heart of the Harry Potter series.
Feelings about Ginny Weasley Survey
Welcome to Critical Magic Theory, where we deconstruct the Wizarding World of Harry Potter, because loving something doesn't mean you can't be critical of it. I'm Professor Julian Womble, and today we are talking about the one and only Ronald Weasley. Have you ever wondered why Ron's insecurity seemingly affects him a bit more than they do Harry and Hermione? Is Ron too normal for us to like to want to redeem, to extend grace and y'all? Why is Ron one of the most divisive characters in these books Today? Oh, today we are talking about all of. At end, we have a very special guest who is, by her own admission, very much pro Ron, and that's the energy that we need today, because some of y'all brought some very negative anti-Ron energy and we need to cleanse the space. We need to hear from both sides. And so today we have with us our first ever guest. How auspicious, danny Alexander. Everyone clap, but not if you're driving. Danny. Welcome to the podcast. Thank you so much for being with us.
Speaker 2:Thank you, Julian. I feel like I've been preparing my whole life to be on this episode today defending Ronald Weasley.
Speaker 1:We're so glad that you're here, because I think that some of us really have a lot of thoughts, a lot of angst, a lot of emotions. And I want to make a very quick caveat before we really dive into things, because there are two different rons within the fandom Well, three actually. There is Book Ron, there is Movie Ron and then there's Fan Fiction Ron. We are going to focus most of our energies and by most I mean almost exclusively our energies on Book Ron. So for those of us who have not read the books and know Movie Ron, you're going to learn a few things today, because Book Ron and Movie Ron are not the same Ron, entirely different, just so different, so different. And so today we are going to be just enjoying ourselves in the world that is Book Ron. But first you know what we have to do, y'all, it's time to bop along to the theme song.
Speaker 2:I've been looking forward to this. Can I say I'm ready to bop.
Speaker 1:If we're ready to bop along, we're ready to get it done. I might even just play it for you and me, danny, so that we can just do it, and then we'll just, you know, do editing magic. We need to talk about Harry Potter. I wish you could see us. Y'all were bopping.
Speaker 2:Such a good bop.
Speaker 1:It's such a good bop. Oh wait, wait, wait. I have to make a couple of caveat. This is important because I keep forgetting. We are going to split this episode into two episodes because I talk a lot.
Speaker 1:So do I, and so I want to make sure that everyone knows that we're going to split this into two episodes, and so, for the first time, we'll have one episode this week and one episode next week, so that you can get the fullness that is Danny and I in our Ron Weasley Glory. I say this in every episode, but I want to be very clear about it in this episode, because I know that many of us have very strong feelings about Ron, whether they be in the positive or in the negative. Danny and I are voicing our own individual views when it comes to one.
Speaker 1:Ron, billy, as Weasley, we are not asking you to walk away, adopting what we believe. We are not asking you to change what you believe. We are simply asking that you think deeper, and if that deep thinking brings you to a place that feels more solid and firm and what you believe when you started listening, amazing, if it changes a little bit, that's also okay. But you don't need to think what we think. We want you to think what you think just a little deeper, and that's what we are inviting you to do with this conversation that she and I are going to have.
Speaker 1:When we go through everything, never feel compelled to adopt what we believe. That's not critical thinking, that's something else. We are asking you simply to think deeper, and I'm excited to hear what that deep thinking brings out for you. I want to begin with our favorite Ron moment, because I feel like there's going to be a lot of not so nice talk about Ron from some of the comments that we are going to dive into, and so I feel like it's nice to think about our favorite one. Danny, do you have one?
Speaker 2:Just going through the list in my head there's so many, but I'm going to choose a controversial one, and for me it's when he returns after leaving the Horcrux Hunt. Because that moment where we're listening to the Horcrux essentially air all of Ron's greatest fears telling him he's worthless, telling him he's nothing. And then he gets to see that, without any nuance, it's just very blunt, like this is what your best friend has been going through, and then you see him recount the story of what happened when he left, how he worked his way back, and you hear that remorse and also what he learned from that mistake that he made. I think it's a powerful moment. It's a better, but I think it represents Ron finally letting go of those fears and recognizing how misplaced they are, and it sets him up to them be able to go forward as a better person.
Speaker 1:I love that moment. I love that. I love that because I think something I've not thought about in that moment is you realize how much Ron has internalized and how much has just kind of gone unspoken and how much is just kind of in him and he's been navigating in silence and without much provocation and we do see it jump out in relatively unhealthy ways. But it makes sense when you think about it in those terms because he hasn't been dealing with it in healthy ways and so it would make sense that it would manifest in ways that are not healthy. One of my favorite Ron moments I just always love the moment where Ron gets to be in the spotlight because he always relishes it in a way that feels very kind of juliencoded, in that it's very like hyping up the drama of it all. And so one particular moment for me is when Sirius Black kind of breaks into the boys dormitory to get scabbers and he goes to Ron's bed and Ron's retelling of the story is just I always laugh so hard.
Speaker 2:It gets like more intense, like more dramatic and more dramatic every time.
Speaker 1:It is so incredible and I laugh so hard because, like that's absolutely something that I would do. Yeah, I'm just going to really milk this thing for all it's worth. And I think this is another one of these moments where we do get to see Ron's moment to be able to shine and we really do get to see kind of what he, what kind of celebrity he would be, and I just love that and I love that he does get these kind of these moments and we get to experience him as someone who is in the spotlight and he eats it up and he should, because it's such a rarity for him. And so, yeah, I don't know, there's something about those moments that really just like hits for me.
Speaker 2:I love it, like whenever, like he has a quidditch when or anything like that, when he gets to be for a moment the center of attention. It's so rare for him. He loves it.
Speaker 1:It is, and it's so funny because you also just get the sense that he has been preparing for this moment, like, whatever the moment is, he's been waiting and ready for it, and so he practices in the mirror. Like literally, which is also very Julie encoded.
Speaker 2:Very, danny, coded too Did I practice this in the mirror, maybe.
Speaker 1:Oh, I did a lot of practicing. I was like we have to make sure that there are some things that get done, which is so different than Harry, who kind of stumbles into these moments and it's kind of like, oh, I don't really know what I'm doing. Ron's like the script's in the bag, I'm ready to go, and I love that. I love it so much. It's time for us to talk about what words we believe best describe Ron. So the number one word was insecure, followed by loyal and jealous.
Speaker 1:Now, this is different than we've had in past episodes, where the words have kind of coalesced in a certain way. This one feels a bit different because we've got kind of two words that are more negative and then one that's very positive and a good thing, and I find it very interesting that these words kind of frank themselves in this order. I mean, we can talk about all three, but I think the number one word, being insecure, is something that comes up for Ron a lot and it's something that in a lot of the responses that we got in the survey we got to see, a lot of people really point to his insecurities. Some people were more forgiving of them and empathetic and some of us were absolutely not. What do you think about that, danny?
Speaker 2:A lot of the comments did talk about his insecurity and I think it is a defining aspect of who Ron is. I think it's something that's very relatable to people. But where it may diverge from relatability is how we perceive how he dealt with it, how he internalized it or how we perceive the validity of his insecurity, because I think some people think he's just insecure because he's not as popular as Harry or doesn't get enough attention, which can seem very shallow. But as you examine his character and where he comes from, I think it's just so deeply rooted in his sense of self-worth. Because of his ranking in his family, because of his ranking how he walks into a room red hair, hand me down clothes people already have an assumption about him. So he's extremely aware of how he's perceived and where he stands in relation to those around him and I think that could be very degrading as a person to carry all the time.
Speaker 1:And this doesn't come from nowhere. I think your point about the fact that he talks about where he's situated in his family is a really important point, because I think what we've talked about a lot in past episodes is how the ranking within the Weasleys plays a really big part in their characterization and who they are as people and how they behave. And what I think is true for Ron is that he experiences a lot of bullying for lack of a better term from Fred and George and there are a lot of moments where he is kind of belittled and maligned by them.
Speaker 1:It's really then difficult to kind of find out who you are as a person, and any bit of self-worth and self-esteem that you may have is also being quashed by people who claim to love you and are in your family. What I find so interesting about Ron's insecurities is that he seemingly doesn't overcompensate for them. He just is insecure. Some people will be insecure and work very hard to kind of overdo it, like Hermione for example, like she overdoes it.
Speaker 1:She's like I'm going to be the smartest person in this room and I'm going to make sure that everybody knows it, because she feels so insecure because she's muggle-born and she's new to this world, and so she really kind of amps it up.
Speaker 2:And.
Speaker 1:Ron, in most moments, I think interestingly and this came up in some of the responses it's kind of just like this is what you're going to get, and I'm insecure, and this is me and I don't know. There's something about that that I find really interesting and endearing actually.
Speaker 2:I agree. You see that he does have ambitions. Like when he looks in the mirror of Erisedad, it's him getting praise, getting attention, having succeeded. He has a ministry job, a quidditch cup, he's done all these things and they are and I think we'll get into this maybe later but they are once again these more surface level accomplishments that people can just look at and say, wow, that's an accomplished, successful, quality person, like a society puts a high value on those things and so he wants them so that he can be seen as high value. But at the end of the day, if we're going to say he overcompensates in anything, I would say he overcompensates and like how, like ride or die, he is for the people in his life, like he's going to pick on them. He's going to be, you know, have his little temper and his temper, tantrums and his moods, but the end of the day he's going to stand up like that and say you have to kill me first. And if that's not an overcompensation, I don't know what is.
Speaker 1:Especially at 13 years old, in the face of a criminal man.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:The idea that you would just be like well and also, it's important to note, with a broken leg with the broken leg, holding himself up on Harry's shoulder, saying you're going to have to kill us first.
Speaker 2:And Hermione's like, be quiet, stop it. And he's like, did you hear me? You're going to have to kill us first. Like, please, little baby child.
Speaker 1:Couldn't be me. I know I'd be. Hermione, Shut up, Shut up. You shut your mouth right now. He we don't even he's he is a criminal. He is 13 people.
Speaker 2:But side note, the movies gave that to Hermione. So once again how Ron was destroyed by the movies.
Speaker 1:I think to humanize Hermione more, they gave a lot of the more human aspects of Ron to her, and so what we get in the books is not necessary. What we get in the movies, rather, is not necessarily as forgiving, and so we don't really get to see him be this kind of ride or die loyal person.
Speaker 2:Yeah, all we really see in the movies is his insecurity and his comic relief, like those are the two main things that you have as a takeaway from the movies, which is really unfortunate, I think.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I also think that that was a perfect uptail into the second word of loyalty, because I do think that Ron is someone who is extremely loyal. This is something that I think we see from Arthur, which is how loyal he is, and particularly when it comes to friendships, we see Arthur willing to break laws, we see Arthur willing to kind of move mountains to do things, and we see both Molly and Arthur kind of being very loyal to Dumbledore for better or for worse, but loyalty nonetheless, and willing to again kind of lay their lives on the line in moments and situations where it's like completely unnecessary. And I think we see that kind of for most of the Weasley kids, like this is a trait that they have. You're right, and I don't necessarily give Ron as much credit for his loyalty to Harry, especially in the face of his insecurity and in the face of the third word right His jealousy.
Speaker 1:And I think we would be remiss to not acknowledge, like, yeah, of course Ron is jealous of Harry. I think we know that to your point. When he looks in the mirror of Eris said he wants a lot of things, whether they be surface level or not, and he is best friends with a person who gets a lot of those things without much provocation and without much work. And if you're an insecure person who is best friends with someone who basically taps into every single one of your insecurities, you're going to be jealous. It's just kind of the way that it works. And again, I think what would be a constant refrain is like Ron as a kid who is the youngest boy in this very large family, and so I think like his jealousy and envy makes sense to me.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think it very much, think it makes sense for who he is, where he comes from in a situation. One thing that stood out to me in the comments was someone said Ron continuously treated his friends poorly when they got more attention than him, which felt fairly reductive to me, because we do see all these instances of Harry getting tons of attention. And when he gets on the quidditch team Ron isn't mad, he's stoked for his best friend. He's in the stands cheering him on every game. He doesn't get upset when Harry's in the daily profit or getting glad handed by ministry officials or getting preferential treatment. He's just like, yeah, checks out, like that's totally fine, I'm right here beside him.
Speaker 2:But even with the goblet of fire, a lot of people and this was in a comment and it like lightbulb for me a lot of people think that he was jealous that Harry was getting attention when he put his name in the goblet of fire and like getting glory, because I think one of the things he says like oh, you just couldn't be out of the spotlight. But what the root of his anger and jealousy is is that he thought he had this best friend who trusted him and would not do things without telling him, and so he felt excluded and disregarded, which goes back to his insecurity. So the jealousy displayed there isn't because his best friend's getting attention. It's because his best friend didn't bring him in on the gag when he found a way to put his name in the goblet of fire.
Speaker 1:And what's so interesting about that moment, now that you put it in that frame, is that last episode I talked a lot about Fred and George really just having each other to bounce one another off, bounce things off of one another, and in this moment in particular, it seems like Ron really wanted to kind of him and Harry to be the Fred and Georgia of it. All right, like that. I think that that is what he kind of understood about. You know what friendships look like. I mean, they're his older brothers, they're always together and Ron and Harry in a lot of ways do embody a lot of that vibe. And so to see then Fred and George go and try to break the rules together and get their name in and be unsuccessful, and then to then see Harry put his name in. I'm putting up air quotes for those of you who can't see.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh yeah, they can't see the air quotes we were doing.
Speaker 1:I think it also again like does feed into this insecurity that he has. Because what is true for Ron, I think, and it's what's true for so many of us, is that when we go into situations like we talked about earlier, like you practice, like you envision it, you imagine what it's going to look like and then you try to execute it as close to that vision as you can. And I think Ron probably had an image of him and Harry like figuring out a way to get their name in the goblets together and to find out that Harry was successful air quotes again undermined. I think it like really did shake him and spoke to a reality. I think you're totally right that this isn't a. It was about feeling betrayed.
Speaker 2:Yes, it's like who am I to you, right, when you to me? Or from the get go Ron tree, terry, like a brother, his partner in crime, there for everything. And this was an instant where, by all appearances, yeah, harry did not, and like, yes, you can make the argument. Well, he didn't believe Harry when Harry said it wasn't him.
Speaker 1:But I mean, like again 14 and also the circumstances were pretty exceptional, like Well, and we're talking about someone who was raised in the magical world, who believes in the infallibility of magic and believes in all the rules and strictures and all the things that happen. So it stands to reason. Again, when you couple that with the fact that, yes, he is 14 years old, there's very little reason as to why he shouldn't believe that somehow Harry had been able to bamboozle the goblet. Ron's mind doesn't immediately go to someone else has kind of put you in danger because he's brothers, with Fred and George who always find the work around. So the logic there actually does make sense. I think what's true for me when it comes to Ron is that I can completely understand his motivations. I just really test his execution. But that is what it is. He's 14 and many of us brought up, you know, invited us to think back on our teenage years, which I reject. Yeah, I don't want to do that.
Speaker 2:I mean, that's such a huge thing Not to derail now. We'll touch back on it, I think, over and over, especially with Ron, because he isn't the hero. He isn't the logical, brightest witch of her age who's there to save the day with her book knowledge. We get more of an opportunity to see him be a failure because he doesn't have something else glossy and shiny to detract us from it. He just is who he is and honestly I find that so painfully relatable.
Speaker 1:And I think and we will get into this a little bit later, but I think that this is the root of our problem with Ron is that I think it's like in being girls when they say, like Damien is almost too gay to function, I think that Ron is almost too normal to appreciate.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, he is too normal to appreciate. I co-sign that wholeheartedly Also.
Speaker 1:I just want to point out how proud I am that I was able to slip in a mean girl's reference.
Speaker 2:So that yes 1010.
Speaker 1:Let's move on to the arrhythmacy lesson. I have been remiss in not pointing out how many people have done the survey, and so we're correcting that today, partially because we've also hit a milestone we got 1,002 people to respond, so wow, which is our controversial, divisive baby boy, ron Weasley, way to go.
Speaker 1:Bring it in the people. We really just have to give him a round of applause. Thank you, ron, for your service. Yeah, we've been working to 1,000 and I knew I felt very strongly that Ron was going to be the person to bring that in for us. And, true to form, he delivers. Weasley is our king. The first question that we have to look at is is Ron Weasley a good person? About 66% of us said yes, about 19% said no and about 16% said don't know. Oh hi, these questions are hard and people always get on my case because they're like they lack nuance, and they do. I recognize that and appreciate that. I think what is true is that I don't care.
Speaker 2:I think the lack of nuance invites people to not have a bias based on how the questions phrased and also invites them to have to explore the nuance on their own, and I think we see that in the responses.
Speaker 1:Danny, was there any comments in like reference to this question that stood out to you that you want to talk about?
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 2:So on the more positive side, the ones that stood out to me, it wasn't so much one response but a thread that was common, and a lot of the more negative responses was that he is toxic and abusive.
Speaker 2:Yes, which were set a fair amount of times, and I also encounter this sort of framing in the online discourse on TikTok, instagram, things like that and while I think we could really dive into that as a whole, nother can of worms.
Speaker 2:What stands out to me is it feels like a very dramatic overstatement of what we see on the page. We are assigning this very sinister and toxic motivation to behaviors that are extremely run of the mill, don't even cause me to blink an eye when it comes to adolescence, learning how to deal with their emotions and the changing like social dynamics and dramas that they are truly experiencing for the first time. So that one really stood out to me, because toxic and abusive are very strong loaded words that I think are being used a bit flippantly, and also doesn't give him the same grace and benefit of the doubt that we give to Harry or Hermione with their behaviors that could also, if taken to their extreme or employed by a fully functioning, mature adult, be described as toxic or abusive. Was that too? Did I go off the rails? I don't know.
Speaker 1:No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I think that it's so fascinating because I think that the biggest grace that we tend to extend most of the characters in these books and it's one again that I get called out on all the time is that like their kids. For me, I often have to remind myself of that because, coming in and kind of thinking critically about these characters, as an adult I tend to do what a lot of the adult characters in these books do, which is really adultify them and in doing so hold them to account in ways that I think is not always as fair or as generous as it could be. And I do think that Ron bears the brunt of that in a lot of ways again, because he doesn't have a scar on his head to kind of give us a narrative about why he is the way that he is and he's not someone who is part of the lower caste within the magical world. And so he just again, it's like almost too normal to appreciate and almost too normal to forgive. And the things that motivate him to behave the way that he does are so seemingly mundane relative to Harry and Hermione. It just feels like they are not motivations and they're not excuses at all, and so we just punish him for it in a way that I think is really fascinating.
Speaker 1:Someone wrote listen, I'm sure everyone will come with receipts to fuel the hashtag Ron bashing and I absolutely agree that he's got his moments, but at the end of the day, he's an imperfect child who grows into an imperfect teenager who, among us, was an insecure, ignorant cough, pure blood upbringing, temperamental or petty. As a teenager, the boy is full of heart and capable of growth. We see his growth. He messes up and takes initiative to do better, even if it's clumsy, like buying a book to learn how to treat women, and I think this sums up so much of what we talked about so far, which is the idea that Ron is just a normal teenage boy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that comment you mentioned really stood out to me too, because it does approach him with that nuance and grace of where he is, but also that he does have to be responsible for his growth.
Speaker 2:And I do think it is a weakness of the writing that we don't really get his ultimate like light bulb moment until the very last book, after he makes a huge, grave, impulsive decision to apper, to dissapear, and then he can't find his way back and he gets caught by snatchers.
Speaker 2:Like he had to make that mistake and see what his worst behavior could lead to for him to be like whoa, whoa, whoa. I've got to work this out. But we never got to see it comes after that, except for a few things, like in the battle he thinks about the house, elves and Hermione is like oh, to make them fight, and he's like no, to get them to safety. Like you see that thoughtfulness and conscientiousness come out there. You also see throughout the last book these hilarious moments where Harry wants to gag because Ron is like putting his arm around Hermione to comfort her when she's sad and shooting Harry a dirty look when he's making Hermione feel upset. Like how dare you make her upset? So you see him trying, and that's all we can ask of people, especially at that age. So I think we see him take, tip, like little baby steps in the right direction and then the series ends.
Speaker 1:And I think what is true, particularly for boys, is that, like we are not taught a lot of things, we're forgiven for a lot of things, very true, but in terms of teaching us how to navigate our own emotions, our own insecurities, our own anything really we are, the tool that we're given is externalize blame everyone else but yourself, and we see Ron exhibit that a lot. We see Harry turn inward, but I think that that's the kind of byproduct of abuse I think we see Hermione do both.
Speaker 2:Yeah, she launched it out and she.
Speaker 1:Yeah, kind of brings it all in.
Speaker 1:I think that that is also something that we know, that a lot of young girls are socialized to do right Like one, especially the latter. The theme that we're coming up with is that Ron is really just embodying a lot of what we see in the real world, and I think we'll talk a little later about like what that means for us as a fandom, in the way that we perceive him. The next question is is Ron Weasley a good son? About 68% of us said yes, about 20% said no and about 13% said don't know what did you think about this? Was there something in the comments that said out to you? Tell us everything.
Speaker 2:A couple of the comments touched on how Ron is ungrateful but grudging. One mentioned how he complained about his mother's handmade sweater, and to that I'm like. Who of us as a kid, who of us fully respected and understood the weight and gravity and length of our parents sacrifice for us and the things that they did for us? Which? What kid would like a handmade sweater over the fancy name brand sweater that all the cool girls are wearing at school? Like I would have been like thanks, I'm sorry, making a very cringy face that y'all can't see. I think again and I hate that this is. I don't mean it to be a crutch, but it's typical adolescent behavior. However, one comment said he only cares about his parents with regard to how they can serve him, and I think that, on its face, that's a very natural way for kids to behave. Your parents are there to serve you. That's how you see them, that's what they do, and you don't have that perspective until you're an adult and can look back. However and I'm gonna be so annoying about this horror crax hunt but what people tend to forget is that the catalyst for Ron leaving Harry and Hermione was they overheard a group of Muggleborns and Grip Hook, talking about how Ginny was punished at school for trying to get Gryffindor's sword and how one of them says the Weasleys don't need another kid injured. And Ron loses his mind. This is what sends him into the spiral. And you see him talking with Harry and he's like saying what about the rest of my family? Are you not bothered by what that meant? And Hermione's like we don't know that something bad is gonna happen, we don't know that they're not gonna be okay. And Ron says the most vicious thing. He's like oh, you're sure, right, then I won't bother myself about them, but it's all right for you too, because your parents are safely out of the way, which like that's when you're hurt and you throw that, that you dig that dagger in because of your own hurt. Horrible, horrible thing for him to say, to which Harry goes my parents are dead. And Ron retorts and mine could be going the same way. And then Harry says then go.
Speaker 2:And the fact that this was the catalyst for him to leave Harry and Hermione seems to just kind of be completely forgotten. I forgot about it too, and I don't know how you can say he doesn't care about his family. When it came down to that moment he was like I have to be there for them, I can't lose them. Harry, you're fine, you've got Hermione, whatever, I gotta go. Can't do anything, but he's like I gotta go be there for them right now, impulsively. So, yes, I think he's a good son. He acts like any other son, but when it like comes down to brass tacks, he's again gonna throw his life on the line or do whatever it takes, even if it's impulsive and ill-advised, to go be there for them. Try to edit that down. Ooh, I'm sorry.
Speaker 1:I won't. We're gonna keep that the whole thing in. Someone wrote.
Speaker 1:I would argue that Ron embodies the values instilled in him by his parents, making him a perfectly good son.
Speaker 1:He is, after all, and in spite of all of his insecurities, a loyal friend and channels their teachings of kindness, compassion and inclusivity.
Speaker 1:The Weasley family is, despite the financial struggles, always a welcoming family, as shown with remiss, tawks, and especially Harry. Ron is clearly his mother's son, even if the relationship that the two share is not perfect. Love that, and I think that it's amazing, because I think that so much of the way that we think of whether a person is a good son or a good child is based on the way that they treat their parents, not necessarily the way that they embody the lessons of their parents. I think what this passage points to is the fact that, yes, his relationship with Molly may be strained, but in his behavior he embodies so much of the way that he was raised in really beautiful and important ways, in spite of his insecurities and in spite of the way that his family has made him feel, and I think that we would be disingenuous to not acknowledge the fact that so much of what he brings to bear in his more positive moments is the byproduct of what he was taught by Molly and Arthur.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that's very insightful. 10-10, no notes. The next question is is Ronald?
Speaker 1:Weasley, a good brother. This is where things get a little bit dicey. Everything has been fairly positive, but this one, hmm, about 46% said yes, about 40% said no and about 14% said don't know. I'm just gonna go straight to what someone said.
Speaker 1:Someone wrote I think Harry's point of view is quite limiting in exploring the siblings' different dynamics, even if we share some time with all of these characters. Most of what we see relates to Ron's insecurities and struggles while comparing himself to his older brothers, or even Ginny because of her prowess in Quidditch and romance. But then I remembered that Ron is ultimately the only sibling that Percy reaches out to when he's estranged from the family. Even if Ron's not happy with his brother in this occasion, it shows that they clearly share a bond. I also thought of when Ron's protective instincts come to the forefront when Ginny is in danger in the Chamber of Secrets, ultimately helping save her life. He never doubts in asking Charlie for help with Haggard's dragon and talks about his siblings with admiration and love in a way that only a good brother could.
Speaker 1:Y'all were really, really in your bag when it came to these responses, because it just brings out these moments that I think we forget because, again movie. Ron doesn't do this, and so there are so many other moments where his behavior kind of clouds the beautiful moments like the ones mentioned in this passage. And so I really do think that this captures a lot of what we do understand of who Ron is as a person, and I think it taps in directly to what we saw in the last passage about whether he was a good son, right, really bringing to bear the things that he has learned from his parents and seen from his other siblings. And it's in these kind of little cracks and crevices of these relationships that we really get to see Ron be a good brother, and I really I love this.
Speaker 2:I love it.
Speaker 2:I love that response as well. I'm glad you brought that one up. I think no matter what jealousy Ron holds and we've said this with regards to the other questions he's going to show up at the end of the day and he does speak so highly of his brothers Maybe not Percy so much, but Percy kind of he kind of asks for it sometimes, but he loves them and I just don't think that's a question, but it's in spite of not in spite of, but it's even in the midst of the conflict he feels internally about how much he loves his brothers and his sister but how they all overshadow him. Like I feel like I can relate it to like when you're maybe in like your 20s and all your friends start getting engaged and you're like.
Speaker 2:I'm so happy for you and you are, but then you go to the bathroom and cry a little because you're still so sad and alone, Like I don't know if other people have experienced this, but I remember those moments in my 20s. I was like I'm so happy for you, I love you so much, but internally it hurt and I think that's what he's holding a lot of the time.
Speaker 1:What is also true for Ron and this also came up a lot in the responses is that he is constantly, constantly compared to them.
Speaker 2:And so it's not as literally.
Speaker 1:And so it's not even as if he is just like having these thoughts because, oh, like I'm insecure. It's also the fact that literally everyone is comparing him to them. So it's not only internal right, like he's getting external feedback and being constantly reminded. And someone wrote, and I can't remember if this week or whenever, but like someone wrote, you know, like the Weasley family is kind of like the Hunger Games, like may the odds be ever in your favor in terms of getting attention, in terms of all of these things. And I think Ron bears the brunt of it because you know he's one of six boys and that's just a lot.
Speaker 1:There's a lot to live up to and a lot of comparison and a lot of people to compare yourself to in ways that suggest that you're like you'll never be good enough, because even if you do good in one, this one thing, well, this other brother did a thing there. And so I think that, like the fact that in the midst of all of that, he's able to find a desire to, you know, say, hey, charlie will absolutely help. Or hey, you know, we've got to go get Ginny, it doesn't matter, what do you think you figured out how to do it. I think that like that is so telling about who he is as a person, and I think that this kind of passage really captured a lot of this dynamic, because I do think that what is true for Ron is that a lot of the more negative moments, where his insecurities really shine through, are the ones that stick out to us, and not so much these moments like being 12 years old and being like let's go down into the Chamber of Secrets where we don't know what's there.
Speaker 1:But we know it's a monster, but we have to get my sister.
Speaker 2:Like holding Gilderoy Lockhart at one point, like At 12. At 12.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly. So now is the moment where Danny and I are going to reflect on what we've talked about thus far and then thinking about our own kind of relationships with Ron, and so this episode, we're going to just kind of cast a question out for you all to think about while we reflect, and so that question is why do we extend less grace to Ron than Harry and Hermione? Danny, the floor is yours. Oh, thank you.
Speaker 2:There was one comment that really stood out to me with regards to this question. They said Hermione and Harry, whose issues are either self-stated or inferred, given Ron's role in the trio. Ron gets to have actual deep flaws, his prejudices, his deep misconceptions about Harry and Hermione's relationship, his thoughts about women in general, because his function is less rigid than Harry's, who's the hero, and Hermione's, whose defining function is to provide knowledge and logic. Ron is quote the friend, so his friendships are the ones who are tested and explored the most. He gets to be disloyal because of Harry or Hermione, where the narrative structure would fall apart. I think that goes back to what you kept saying is he's too normal for us to forgive? And for me it's. He's so normal I understand how to forgive him. I really just think it keeps going back to that. Like Hermione and Harry have such clear roles and Ron is the structure between them, like we see when he leaves in the Horcrux Hunt, harry and Hermione are like fraught, they're still friends. But he tells Ron Hermione didn't talk. We said there was days we'd ever even talk to each other while you were gone. He's really the glue and that's just not as flashy.
Speaker 2:We, I think as people and as a society really strive for these accolades or these markers of success, whether it's popularity, money, success at work, straight A's being the hero or having sports acumen.
Speaker 2:We don't lay in bed at night and fantasize about I want to be such a good friend.
Speaker 2:If my friends need me, I'm gonna be there Like they're things that we want, but it's far more passive in like decisions we make in the moment.
Speaker 2:It's not something we're trained and formed to aspire to as a culture and as a people, and so what he is is so stinking normal and I think because he isn't flashy in these ways, we don't forgive him as much. On the flip side, we can see Hermione and Harry act in really vicious ways, where Harry bellows, yells, shouts, explodes, like these are the verbs that are used in the book and so we get that Hermione and Ron, and we get it because he's under such immense pressure and he's so traumatized. And then Hermione can be manipulative and dismiss his fears and feelings and can show this like coldness towards other people's struggles if she doesn't understand that, Like Aluna or Lavender when her rabbit dies, like there's things like that where Hermione's just very deeply unlikable but she's so smart and saves the day and she sacrifices a lot to be so smart and save the day, so we're going to more easily forget and forgive that she actually can be very mean.
Speaker 1:So much of what you said resonates with me, and I think that someone wrote in one of their comments in Harry's story Hermione is the head and Ron is the heart, and I think that, and I would add to that that, like Harry is the brawn- yes, I think that's exactly it.
Speaker 1:What feels true about Ron, in terms of thinking about why we extend less grace to him, is because Ron is so normal that, like we don't necessarily feel as compelled to see him as, like a victim. And one thing that is true for this fandom is that we love forgiving even the worst behavior if there's even a hint of a victim narrative that we can like grasp onto See Draco, see Sirius, see Hagrid, see CCC.
Speaker 1:Everyone but Ron essentially, literally right, and so you know again. We have Harry, who has been marked for death since he was one years old, and we have Hermione, who is a muggle born girl, who's new to this place and just trying to make her way through, and so we can really make narratives about why we should forgive them for their worst actions, why it's okay that Hermione put Rita Skeeter in a jar as a bug and basically cursed her.
Speaker 2:I forgot about that.
Speaker 1:And like you know, that's cool and that we can acknowledge it and say, oh well, you know she was a child, or oh, rita was so mean to her. Oh, you know, you know she's a muggle born. And so it's really difficult, for we make lots of excuses. We do similar things for Harry because, again, of the pressure and the abuse and the trauma and the Ron doesn't have all of that in his narrative, at least not into the same extent.
Speaker 1:It's not as explicit it isn't and it feels so normal. It's like, oh, like your family doesn't have a lot of money, mm boo-hoo, and oh, like you're insecure, who isn't right? And so, yeah, don't use those things, or we don't allow those things to be excuses for his bad behavior, because we're like it's not, like you aren't in the same league of victimhood as your friends.
Speaker 1:There are these other people in your orbit? Do you have the right to be able to be upset about your law in life, your pure blood? Like do you get to be mad? And there are parts of that that really resonated with me, like I'm like yeah, I think there are questions there that I have to grapple with.
Speaker 1:When it comes to Ron, but I do think that there is something about how normal he is relative to pretty much literally everyone else that I think I personally think it triggers something in each of us. There are parts of Ron that are very much parts of us, and but when we read fantasy, when we read fiction, we're trying to escape that reality. We're trying to escape normal. We're trying to find a place where we can aspire to be something more, where we can be the brightest witch of our age or we can be the chosen one savior person, and Ron does not give us the opportunity to have something that is beyond us, to aspire to. Like yes, again, like you said, like we could all aspire to, want to be a good friend, but like that's not on the top of our list. No, I want to defeat Voldemort, I want to be 12 years old and do one of the hardest potions, right Like I want to be those people and Ron presents to us normal and real.
Speaker 2:I think he gives a little bit of a harsh look in the mirror. Oh, yeah. Do you have to be exceptional to be forgivable? Do you have to overextend yourself and rise above and beyond and be that high, super high functioning person to have your faults or your failings feel warranted? I think he really challenges our ability for empathy in a big way.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, and I think that part of our big issue with Ron is that we have been taught that you only give sympathy to the people that you believe deserve it, and normal issues and problems do not warrant the same level of empathy and sympathy and understanding. And so what it does is it really invalidates our own experiences, and I think that that is in large part due to the fact that society tells us like, well, you aren't entitled to that because you don't deserve to feel forgiven for a basic mistake. And again, like all of Ron's, mistakes are not small, but I do think that you know, one of the things that I kept as I was reading through the comments I kept saying aloud, was like I kept thinking about to the Percy episode and I kept saying to myself like some people were very forgiving and understanding and I kept being like we got to keep that same energy and I think that it as an aside.
Speaker 2:The Percy episode helped me see Percy in a new light, because I was a Percy hater Like, oh, me too. He's one of the people that I'm like. Oh, we gave him a little bit of a redemption over this. You know any other character and that episode really opened my eyes, so, oh, I'm glad it opened mine too.
Speaker 1:I it really did. And this episode, right now I'm like, okay, ron, I see you, I see you. But I think I I do think that there's something just about the genre in general, like it's rare that you get a regular, regular character who is very much like you in the world. You're trying to escape by reading the book you're reading or watch the movie that you're watching, and I think Ron really invites us to think about what are their normal things in our lives that we aren't giving ourselves or others grace for.
Speaker 2:Well, who knew, this is gonna turn into therapy.
Speaker 1:I'm just I'm gonna leave that question there because I have to grapple with it, but I do think that that's what run like. There are lots of normal things in our lives that we just Are really down on ourselves about and I just wonder like, what are those things and to what extent? And we Kind of think about being more gracious to ourselves for.
Speaker 2:I really liken it to like the gifted kids syndrome, where a lot of us Millennials were told we were gonna be so great we could accomplish ever anything we put our mind to and sure, some people did but then a lot of us are just like working Our nine to fives being. We're part of the grind. We aren't, you know, the CEOs, the entrepreneurs, the founders, the celebrities. We're just people and we're like oh, I thought I was gonna be greater than this. I'm just normal and Ron is just normal. Well, so it, like I said, it's a harsh look in the mirror.
Speaker 1:We're like, oh, you really shines a light on how much the world around us, like, highlights the exceptional and Minimizes what it takes, what it takes to get through the day.
Speaker 2:It's like, when people compare pain, like you were in pain, something bad has happened, you'd be like others have it worse, and I think that's true and that's something in general to keep in mind. But people use that mindset as an excuse to dismiss their own or others. Pain as something that shouldn't be taken seriously, and I think that's what we're kind of getting at with with Ron. It's. You know, he doesn't have a maniac after him, he isn't part of an of an oppressed class of muggle-borns, but he grew up in poverty. He's been Dismissed.
Speaker 2:All the things we've said about him that caused deep-seated pain. The one thing that, like it all boils down to for me with regards to why don't we, you know, ascribe much grace to him, as we do the others and we've we've danced around it, but I think it boils down to no one wants to project themselves onto Ron. We want to read and project ourselves onto Harry, want to read and project ourselves onto Hermione. He wants to do that with Ron. Really not even me, my. I'm his biggest fan and I don't want to read it as him.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think that it this, that idea, touches on the. You know, why is it that we go into this world in general? What is it that we're hoping to find, and, and what is it that we're hoping to find for ourselves in these places, and to what extent are the people that we project ourselves onto a reflection of that desire to be exceptional, to be more, and what does that then mean, mean for how?
Speaker 2:we.
Speaker 1:Look at the people who don't fall into those categories. This has been an episode of critical magic theory. We did it. We did it. Thank you so much. Everyone who lives, thank you so much to Danny for joining us today. Danny, where can we find you on the Internet?
Speaker 2:I'm on the Internet, I live in my computer. I am on tiktok as holding yokey and I am on Instagram as Danny dot reads dot things, and that is where you'll find me screaming about fanfiction books, the hot Ron agenda, all of the above.
Speaker 1:I'll follow her. Y'all, okay, follow her because it's so much fun and for those of us who are fanfic readers, the suggestions don't miss, and so I'm so happy to have you join me today to talk about Ron. This was so, so, so much fun.
Speaker 2:Should we say part two is coming.
Speaker 1:Part two is coming. Okay, we're actually about to record it, so you just get ready. Part two is coming. That will come next week. You're just getting a lot of critical magic theory. I know that you're excited, and so we're looking forward to that as well. In two weeks, we're gonna be talking about Jenny Weasley. Get ready, get excited. The Jenny Weasley survey is in the episode summary. This has been another episode of critical magic theory.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much for listening. If you like what you heard first off, thank you. Please feel free to rate, like, subscribe, follow. If you're on Spotify, you can actually make a comment about the episode. I love that. I love reading them. I love hearing what you all think, so please feel free to do that. If you want to continue this conversation, please feel free to follow me on tiktok at prof w pr oh fw, on Instagram at prof dot jw, or on YouTube. And if you want to send me an email, please email me at critical magic theory at gmailcom. Get excited for part two of our run episode next week. Until then, be critical and stay magical, my friends. Bye.