20. Using Autonomous Tractors on the Farm with Matt Krueger

We talk with Matt Krueger about his field-level view of autonomous tillage with a 9R series John Deere tractor, from kit installation to dust-driven safety stops, and how better boundaries and AutoPath boost both uptime and data quality. Matt's story centers on labor flexibility, real costs, and where autonomy should expand next.

In this special hour-long episode we talk:
• autonomy kit details, JDLink Boost connectivity, dual receivers
• autonomy-grade boundaries and safe offsets near obstacles
• dust sensitivity, camera logic, alerts and overrides
• AutoPath benefits for cleaner headlands and data integrity
• remote control of depth, pressure and implement settings
• ROI framed as uptime and labor flexibility, not replacement
• likely next targets for autonomy: sprayers and air seeders
• subscription pricing models and reliability trade-offs
• NDVI plus as applied maps to trace application misses
• skills and fallbacks when GPS degrades or sensors fail

With GK Technology, we have a map, and an app, for that!

https://gktechinc.com/

Chapters

• 0:00 Meet Matt And The Autonomy Test
• 3:40 Why A 9,000 Series Needed Autonomy
• 7:55 Costs, Kits, And JD Boost
• 12:20 Mapping Boundaries For Safe Autonomy
• 17:10 Dust, Cameras, And Safety Stops
• 22:35 VT Setup And Deere-Only Integrations
• 26:45 Remote Control And AutoPath In Practice
• 31:40 Cleaner Data, NDVI, And As-Applied Insights
• 36:50 Night Runs, Alerts, And Peace Of Mind
• 41:20 The Real ROI: Labor Flex And Uptime
• 46:05 What Should Go Autonomous Next?
• 52:10 Sensors, Scale, And Subscription Models

Transcript

Sarah: 0:00

And now it's time for a geek speak with DK Technologies, Sarah and Jody.

Theme Music: 0:10

In the field again. I just can't wait to get in the field again. And I can't wait to get in the field again. Oh, I can't wait to get in the field again.

Sarah: 0:32

Welcome back to A GeekSpeak. We are very excited. We are going to have a conversation with Matthew Krueger today, who farms by East Grand Forks. And he's been a longtime ADMS user, software user as a company we've known Matthew Matt for a long time. So very happy to have you back. If you missed it, I highly recommend going back and checking out the episode on the Valley Corn Maze. He actually, the women in his family own a business, the Valley Corn Maze. And this year, 2025, they made the world's largest corn maize. So go check out that podcast. But today we're going to talk about something else. Matt loves technology and agriculture. And one of the things that he has been dabbling with is autonomous tractors. So, Matt, what can you tell us about your autonomous tractor experience so far? How's that for a broad-based, open-ended question? Where do you even start? How did you get good with an autonomous tractor?

Matthew Krueger: 1:40

Yeah. So we added this spring. It was on our tillage tractor for uh field cultivating, which we use to incorporate our fertilizer that's spring applied into the ground. And we, you know, I guess going back, John Deere, we're on John Deere farm. And so John Deere's had autonomy on their 8,000-frame series tractors for I think a few years now. However, up here where we're located, which is in the northern, well, Grand Forks, North Dakota, which is the valley. I'd say it's probably the Central Valley, probably. 8,000 frame tractors do not do chillage. We use big 9,000 frame John Deere tractors. We I kind of just told the dealership, like, man, do you think they're ever going to work on this in 9,000 frame? And eventually, um, I knew they would. I mean, it just seemed to be like Deere had to start somewhere. Fun fact uh John Deere does I don't know how to say this exactly. They monitor you more than you think they monitor you, but I don't think they like I think you're a number to them. So anyway, so I was chosen because I had the second highest click rate in my dealership's usage for operations center, which I don't know if I have to be proud of that or not, but they said internally like I was close, and like there's a pretty big gap between like me and a few others.

Sarah: 2:59

Click rate. What does that mean? Like as far as like the amount of uploads that you're putting up there, or like I think it's like how much you're in operations center, how much like clicking within the like within it and like using the features and everything else like that, apparently.

Matthew Krueger: 3:15

So I was behind black gold, which for those that know black gold, like I was behind their which I mean like to me, I'm like black gold's massive.

Sarah: 3:24

Yeah, they farm in multiple states.

Matthew Krueger: 3:26

Yes, they farm multiple states. I I mean I farm in multiple states, I have North Dakota, but uh we're nothing anywhere remotely. I mean, our farm is like one of their farm locations.

Sarah: 3:35

So for those people that listen to this podcast and other parts of the country, Matt farms in East Grand Forks. That's on the Minnesota side of the Red River, which is the boundary between Minnesota and North Dakota. So when he says he farms in multiple states, he just crosses the river.

Matthew Krueger: 3:55

Yeah, it's four miles away.

Jodi: 3:56

So it's and for anybody wondering, we do not keep track of your clicks in ADMS. We do not know who has the highest click rate in ADMS, if anybody was thinking about that.

Matthew Krueger: 4:08

Yeah. So we will not send you a plaque.

Sarah: 4:12

We're not taking, we're not noting who's got the most sample points in a field.

Matthew Krueger: 4:19

That's good to know. Yeah. So anyway, so uh I felt a little like violated and I was kind of like, I I don't know how I feel about that. Like, because I'm like, I thought the whole data thing, like, well it is, but like it did they can just tell your click rate, which then like even other software they do have like a tie to like even if you have an error, like they'll have a double click thing, like there's different things that engineers have to help them know like what working or not, what's not working. So anyway, so they came to us, our dealership said, Hey, John Deere's wondering if you'd be considered would you ever consider putting autonomy on your on one of your tractors? And I said, Absolutely, you know. Um, but I mean I said absolutely, but what's the catch, you know? So they they for for us being a demo farm, uh, they put the kit on full like they they they did that. We do have to buy out the kit if we want it at the end of the year, and then but otherwise than that, like we we self-pay the subscription cost, it is a subscription-based model. Um right now it's four bucks an acre, which is high. And so they're working on that they have said like they're gonna adjust that because it is I think they're gonna do it based on more like operation or or even how many acres you you use autonomy for, kind of like a tiered thing, like the first so many acres would be this rate, then it drops, you know, progressively. They've even looked at like whole farm models, like if you're using autonomy, it might just be a flat rate. So, anyway, so I'm just telling you what what I know today what it is. So they put this kit on, it included an extra like valve pack that I think it was tied to the braking of the autonomy. And put a Starlink um called JD Boost on top of the roof, which actually is super handy. Um, I actually bought one for I put it on my flat retractor, and I'm actually moving to my combine um because then I have cell phone connectivity all the time. I can do Wi-Fi calling, and that has been phenomenal. Because we do have fields that just are prone to poor pores poor cell reception. And it was fantastic be planting all spring long and be on the phone and not have a single issue. So um so yeah, so super I think that kit was like I think it was like I think it's a thousand bucks, so it's 300 bucks a year. And I mean like again, like worse people's priorities, but to me to have that cell phone not like to have cell phone calls, like it's worth three bucks a year for me to get a good cell phone call. So otherwise I can't get a hold of people, people can't get a hold of me, which is a whole the whole issue. So anyway, that was a kit. You also have a globe that goes on the on the uh implement, so then the machine, you know, so then the tractor and everything knows where everything's at, basically, you know.

Sarah: 6:58

So you have two globes, one on the tractor and one on the implement. But the entire system is keeping track of both of those pieces of equipment for for its exact location. Yeah.

Jodi: 7:11

And are these specific to the autonomy globes or are they like just regular John Deere?

Matthew Krueger: 7:16

Okay. They're just regular John Deere. Um you're gonna have the 7500 globe because of like there's an extra chip or something in there for that, or something like that. And then Deer also sent up a gator because with autonomy, you like we have good boundaries in operations center, but you have to have autonomy, they have to be autonomy, the quality has to be autonomy, which basically this so here's a best practice I found out with this whole thing, too. We have our good boundaries and operations center that are main boundaries, and then we had to go around with the gator. Basically, you have to hand you have to draw them again, but they're recording data points along the whole way. Typically, our boundaries up here in the valley, like we have squares, rectangles, like we have very nice straight edges. So typically, like our boundaries we we've driven we've driven them. However, it's we come to that corner, we hit pause, we go to the other corner, hit resume, and we've got a nice straight snap line. This way we had to actually drive it, and those lines aren't perfectly straight. So, so you but for autonomy, they just need to know like there's no issue there, you know, they need to make sure that boundary is true. Part of their deal as well with autonomy is that tractor will not break that boundary. They do say though, like if there's things out there like power boxes, telephone poles, everything like that, don't go up right next to it, but stay about five feet away. So give give yourself some buffer. Like the tractor may, as it turns, it might go out that boundary just a little bit, but it I'm it it will not do it just because it's it's just it's it's embedded in its code to just stay within that area. So um, so we had to go around and we picked out fields that we knew like, hey, this is gonna be autonomy field, this is gonna be a ton of field. So we spent you know quite a bit of time going back and remapping fields again.

Sarah: 9:03

As you, even though you've had really good boundaries in your op center, you actually had to go back and just put points out there. And those points along that straight line, even though there was no corner there, those points on that line verified that that boundary is valid.

Matthew Krueger: 9:22

Correct, yeah. So we actually had to like redraw the boundaries. So then the gator, they gave us a gator to do this with it had auto steering it. And the idea there was I could use boundary track, which is a feature within John Deere, where you could actually take your good boundary, make it run an A-B line, and or run multiple A-B lines. And so like it was close, but again, a gator, soft spring, it's gonna weave a little bit as well. And so first field, we just kind of like ran that as new boundary, but you could see the machine on that headland running kind of these little like it would, it would, it would pick up on that gator kind of weaving a little bit. So what we've just basically kind of done is the only machine that runs the autonomy boundary is the autonomy tractor, everyone else runs off the main boundary. So just again, one of the like things that I think best practice to use, like you'll just have multiple boundaries in your operations center for autonomy, and that's not a big deal. We also had some issues with like you're supposed to maintain like a 80% accuracy level with the RTK, SFRT, and it has to be done with SFRTK as well. It treat with what kind of SR with uh SFRTK, which is John Deere's John Deere's quote, RTK. Because it I mean they say it's RTK, but we all know in the ditching world, like Paul Kelly would be like it's an RTK. So like and people people will probably ditch with SFRTK. I that that don't do it. So yeah. I mean like just don't do it. I don't want to be more politically incorrect, but I'll no, we'll just let that be like that. So anyway, don't do it, even though John Deere will say you can, do not do that.

Sarah: 10:59

You mean ditch off of it?

Matthew Krueger: 11:01

Ditch off of it, yeah. Yep. So even people yeah, that's a whole tangent. That's another tangent.

Sarah: 11:07

Or another podcast.

Matthew Krueger: 11:09

Yeah, we're not gonna go there. So next, we had the SFRDK, all the boundaries again, and you can also choose you can also like say you didn't do with the gator and say that you pull into a field that you plan to run autonomy, you could run that tractor with the Tiladif win, just run the border really quick and like get the boundary done so that it has it, but it has to have a boundary to know like where to be. And so, yeah, we started it. You know, I put it, and I've said this in other interviews, and other people have asked me about it. It's like a seven-year-old running a cultivator right now, so it's it's pretty, it's pretty new, it's ultra conservative on safety. Dust is not its friend currently. I know they're working on overriding that right now, but if it starts to get too dusty, it it stops, waits for dust to clear, and it starts up again. But at the same time, when it works.

Sarah: 11:57

The dust. What's the deal with the dust? What's the dust messing up on the sensors?

Matthew Krueger: 12:01

Like well, because so with the machine as well, like part of the kit, there's cameras on top of the cab, four cameras pointing forward, four backwards, and four each side. So there's 16 cameras on top. This is part of the autonomy kit, is like, as well as these cameras, these are what's sensing and seeing and and and kind of making sure everything's fine. So that's also part of the kit. Sorry, I should say that as well. And um, so that when the dust starts happening, you can't see as well and it freaks out thinking like there could be a person up there, and there could be this or there could be that, you know, some kind of issue that could be happening. And so that's where they have to like kind of realize like if it's in the middle of the field, it's probably fine. Like let it just keep doing its thing. We talked about like, is there a way can they put sensors that like like we have on our cars that like you know detect like when a vehicle is getting too close, you know, like our parking sensors, and there's a way to put sensors as well there that can override the dust feature, you know, like different things.

Sarah: 12:59

LIDAR.

Matthew Krueger: 13:00

Yeah, LIDAR, yep. And they said they they've considered it, they just have to they have to weigh the cost part of it as well. But I think again, as they like get more comfortable with it, they can kind of figure that out. Um, some dust was definitely a hindrance, but it sounded like it's a hindrance for everyone that was kind of doing these um demo products of the autonomy. I just you know, is it's the thing that we deal with in the spring. Fall, maybe not as much, because like you can do a little more tillage in the fall, or you know, there's more residue. There's different things like you're not doing. I think even if you're cultivating four or five inches deep, there probably wouldn't be as much dust because you bring up a lot of moisture. But we're not we don't do that up here the spring. We're you know doing two, three inches at most, and that's all we want to do. And we're not gonna go when it's muddy because up here, like our soils are very prone to compaction, so like you just you can't. You have to only go when it's dry.

Sarah: 13:50

That's a good way to make dirt lumps in high clay soils.

Matthew Krueger: 13:54

Yes, exactly.

Jodi: 13:55

It it's funny because it goes back to like the autonomous tractor, and you haven't used a 9,000 instead of an 8,000 series tractor. Like that same soil property, the fact that it's a clay and holds onto water really well, also like contributes to the fact that it's gonna cause more dust when you're actually out there in the spring. So it's power to pull the po the baby.

Matthew Krueger: 14:14

Yep. And like also speed, like our machine, like the tractor we have in front of it and the machine we have, it's supposed to go 70 miles an hour cultivating. Um, because that was another thing, too. They're like, well, just go slower. No, I'm not gonna go slower. Like, because they said, like, we can go like four miles an hour, is it as dusty? And I said, No, it's not, but you know, that was part of the deal with deer is like we provide feedback and they'd also provide, you know, try to help guidance. And because early on, like, hey, you guys aren't using it as much as we want to. And I'm like, I can't. It's it wants to go slow, it has to go the same speed as a manned person in there, you know, to be able to do these things. So, um, so they're they're they're working, I know, a lot over the summer to get ready for the fall. Um, our plan is to have it on our VT this fall, and we'll see how that goes with vertical tillage. Yep, a vertical tillage.

Sarah: 15:04

Okay. What can I ask? What are you guys using for your vertical tillage tool?

Matthew Krueger: 15:08

We use a 2660 BT, so it's a uh adjustable angled disc, but it's not a high speed deep disc. I'm kind of uh anti things.

Sarah: 15:19

Fast do you normally pull that?

Matthew Krueger: 15:21

You can only go about nine miles an hour because otherwise you go any faster, it starts bouncing basically. So yeah, this is it it this does more of like sizing up materials, it doesn't really bring up a whole lot of dirt, which I like for just like keeping the cover on the ground so you're not balling in the winter. So we have a 2660 John Deere VT. The autonomy right now, you have to have a John Deere tractor with a Jaju implement because they're also they're also like utilizing um John Deere has a thing called accu depth, and so it's all the programmable depths and adjustments of angles of pressures. So again, it's it's just they it's their way to like monitor that that what's going on there with the tillage implement on top of the GPS as well.

Jodi: 16:04

Is there is there any sort of like control that you're doing, you know, based on what the sensors are doing on the tillage depth? Like, are you are you getting like as applied maps of like hey, we had to apply more down pressure in certain areas because it was uh we couldn't get the depths of tillage.

Matthew Krueger: 16:19

Like, yeah.

Jodi: 16:21

Tell me more about that. And like, do you have any plans to use that data?

Matthew Krueger: 16:24

Yep. So yeah, so it does provide as applied actual, like, here's what the depth actually was as you did it. Um, what it allows you to do too is like remotely adjust things. So, like, I mean, I I was able to get out and be like, hey, you know what? I actually want to go a little bit deeper. So I drop it down to the quarter inch, you know, or hey, I want the bowling baskets to be a little more pressure, a little less pressure. So all that's done remotely from the phone, basically. And setting it up for the first time, too. Like the crazy thing was like you uh put the machine in park, you hit start, you turn the key off, and it all still runs. You get out of the cab, you gotta be about uh 800, nine, you gotta be about a thousand feet away, because then again, it'll see you, and then it'll come up on your phone and it'll just be a little swipe where you go, you want to start autonomy? You just go swipe it, like you know, you're like you're you know, something. Yep. And then all of a sudden it beeps at you, the tractor beeps, and the flashers go on. The flashers are running the whole time, and it uh and then it starts in. So it uses autopath, which is John Deere's big thing. There's some works there that they need to work on as well with it. Um and it just what is autopath? Autopath is John Deere's like path generation for a whole field. So it'll generate the paths for your headland and then for whatever angle you want as well. Super like it's super cool for like maximizing like not having overlap and stuff. Um, I'm using a now combining wheat right now. I just pull into the field, I hit my header width, it does all my pathways, so it knows, hey, I want two pathways on the headland, and it strikes me out right where I need to be, versus being like, oh, I'm just gonna randomly do an you know an A-B line, just start taking off, and then all of a sudden you get the end of the field and oh gosh, I got four foot skip, or I've got, you know, like I mean it it maximizes your pathways on a field. So same thing for tillage, it does the same thing.

Sarah: 18:09

Okay, so I little side note, a little off the topic, but not really. So as we're talking about, you know, using that during weed harvest, right? One of the keys to getting good yield data coming in is making sure that you're always taking full headerways. You know, when we clean yield data, a lot of times that four foot swath that gets left over because you couldn't figure out where to strike out, that that's a swath that we actually have to clean and and delete that data out. So this is a really nice way to also help make sure that we've got good yield data coming in.

Matthew Krueger: 18:44

Absolutely.

Sarah: 18:45

Some people don't care about, but I do.

Jodi: 18:48

That's a really great point. And that's I think like with autonomy too, like you know, we and I I need to ask you too about like what you see as the benefits of this, but I think one of these things, you know, we've had previous conversations about artificial intelligence, but the data collection is going to be better too, so that over time we can keep feeding these models, you know, better data. Because these these auto-generated maps and like the data collection process when it's autonomized, you can get better data. Okay, I'll get off my top box.

Matthew Krueger: 19:21

Well, I mean, but uh I mean I think I have a little fun thing to tie into that, like now's applied data. So like I was pulling satellite imagery, running it in A VMS for I can't remember what I was running it for. I was just curious on like how one of the fields looking. Also, it was a shot where I could see one of my other fields just to the north of it, and also I saw why is there this like little area that seems to be behind? And so I then refocused that the imagery to that field, and I went back and I could see it, and I went back all the way to like right before sprayer application, and I didn't see it before that. So then I went to my Os applying data and my sprayer, and I pulled it. Up and the tank mix or the the rate was all the same and everything was fine. But I looked at the tank mix and what it does in John Deere is like see a whole different product in or out of there. And I think he ran out of a product or something happened. I'm not sure why, but he pulled the fungicide on this like last little 20-acre spot. So to me, I'm guessing he just ran out and it was late. I I knew storm was coming, like I could look at the date and everything. And sure enough, I can see that correlation of that area that missed that application of herbicide is the same area that is in my NDVI imagery right now. So I'm interested as we get to harvest, is there a correlation there as well with yield? So fun little thing.

Sarah: 20:42

That's that's really neat when you could take that as applied data, find that those spots on NDBI. I mean, plant canopy says a lot. And usually NDVI is highly correlated to yield data. So it will be really fun to see.

Matthew Krueger: 21:00

Yeah, because to me, like this is that this is that like four ounces of um Timiconazole that we throw in with our wheat, which I think we it's like two and a half, super cheap. We all kind of just do it because of whatever. And I mean, in tight margins, I think it's something everyone kind of asks like, well, do we still need to do it? And it'll be interesting. I'll have us on the field, I'll be like, this was accidental, but hey, it did X, Y, or Z, you know. So, and as far as I can tell, everything else was put in there. I'm working with my brother who runs a sprayer. Um, he's not the most tech savvy, so like I was proud of him for putting in that change in the monitor. But I asked him like why, and he's like, I don't remember. And I'm like, Do you know, like, was it this or was it that? And did you throw anything else out? He's like, No, I think I just didn't have that, and so I just kept him spraying because it was the last 20 acres of this, you know, like above our spraying. So anyway, beside the point. I mean, like, but again, it goes back to like you have to put the good data in. And even an operation center, like I've uh I've considered this is like totally random, but like I really like operations center. I kind of geek out on it. I like to have a good clean operation center.

Jodi: 22:02

I'm almost out of like let's remember that Matthew was chosen for a test uh autonomous tractor for clicks in uh JD Op Center. So this checks.

Matthew Krueger: 22:12

Yeah. I like I kind of geek out on projects like I mean, like to me, like if I could if farms want to hire I I would I don't know if there's a servers out there, but like if I could help people with their operations center, like make it more unified, I think they'd use it more often. Like it helped them. I don't know if there's a business opportunity there, and there probably is. I don't have the time to do it, but it'd be cool to do it, you know.

Jodi: 22:31

You could set up a booth at the corn maze.

Matthew Krueger: 22:33

I mean bring me your operations center. I will fix it for you.

Jodi: 22:38

But you you go take you go do the 20 miles of corn maze, and I'll fix your JDOP center while you're in there.

Sarah: 22:46

But I will state that um John Deere Operations Center has been a great platform for us to use here, even at GK Technology. I am partners with a ton of different growers on there. I I send a lot of prescriptions and upload prescriptions to that to John Deere Operations Center and send it directly out to tractors. The first time I did that without a USB stick, it was such a game changer. I was it was just so cool.

Matthew Krueger: 23:20

And it it's taken a long time to get it to where it's at today. I'd say probably the last three, four years, it's really gone a lot better. Early on, Operations Center was trash, you know. I mean it was it was it was formable. I mean, everyone was still going back on Apex. Um, you know, it just wasn't that thing. And and during that time we weren't all jo on deer all John Deere farm, but I would say Operations Center has made it to a point of why we're all John Deere farm. I even have a friend that they I let I gave him partner access to my organization just because he's not anywhere near me. He lives south, and you know, so like he's a case guy and and I'm a deer guy, and he'll hear about the things that we do with operations and like gosh, I just wish we had that. He's like, Ryan is just so janky, they're case AFS Connect. And so I gave him access, and I just said, you can just poke around, you just you can't break anything, you can see things, and he was just blowing away and you know, same thing, like setting out files, and like even the spray our um we're spraying fungicide on our driedable beans, and we had some heavy rain, so there's drowned out areas. I made a VR map out of NDVI and ADMS and sent that out to the sprayer just with a few clicks. I mean, it was just super simple, easy to do, you know, a few mod areas on some headlands. And I mean, yeah, like I said, ADMS, a little plug. I mean, they do have an app for that. And then I've been a user since I think 4.95. And like there's still things, I'm sure Kelly and Sarah does the same thing. Like, there's certain things that like I click and I'm like, oh gosh, I'm gonna break it. Like, I know it's gonna crash. And now like ADMS is so solid. Like, I I like double-clicking things, you would never double click, and now like I'll see Kelly on videos and it's called double-clicking. I'm like, oh gosh, like don't do that. Like, okay, it's fine, you know.

Sarah: 25:02

Well, and it it is interesting because so often when we want to we do really cool things in ADMS. I mean, I still I I make the argument that we are probably the most powerful software on the market today for actually being able to work with agricultural data. Um, as far as like if you can possibly imagine a variable rate scenario of any kind, we can make it happen. But once we actually make that happen in our software, we actually have to export it out to other platforms. And we can, and we do, and we go to all platforms. We can still actually export out to really old fertilizer spreaders that farmers have picked up that still have floppy disks. Yes, we've been around that long, and yes, we can still do that, but it sure is nice when just with like a couple clicks, I know that the prescription that I've written has gone right to the tractor through a system like John Deere Operations Center. And and I just know it's there and I know it's working. So um, it really is nice to to use, you know, what we can do so powerfully in our software and just have it go seamlessly where it needs to go. And then I can actually go back and validate how it was applied to and and what it actually how it actually turned out.

Matthew Krueger: 26:31

So that's that's really I will say like one thing like on the like operational center, not that this is operational center talk, even like the our corn maize planting. I went back, looked at the as applied map, and I was a little uh apprehensive because it wasn't quite as crisp as I'd like. And I was kind of like, oh man, and I've seen this in other applications too. You kind of look at like what the heck happened there, and then you go out into the field and it's fine, actually better than fine. But I was saying operation center isn't like the as applied data is it's good, it's not excellent, it's not gonna be perfect, but at least gives you a picture of like what could have happened, you know. So, but back to tonight now, yeah. So, I mean I I like I referenced it to like an eight-year-old because things with like autopath, it will jump lines, and that's just part of like sort of the steers sharp or you know super dusty, it wants to stop. Even like if you're going next to a road and the vehicle's on the road, it'll freak out because oh my god, there's something that it saw, it is and so on an alert. Actually, what happened is it will do two the first app the first alert that it has, it says down to a team of John Deere that apparently they're watching these machines and they just override it, like, oh it's a a bird flew and it's fine, keep going. If it receives an alert twice, then it pings on my phone and says, Hey, the tractor stopped, you know, and I get four minutes to respond. Like, do I want it to stop? Do I want to go around the object? Those are my two options basically. So typically the initially, it's same thing, like I saw a car, and so it sends you a picture too of like what the object it is that saw. And so for mine, it just showed me the road, so I figured it was a car. So I just said I had to say go around, and then it didn't know what to go around because it wasn't there anymore. There's different things like they're working on, like getting rid of those things. But I mean it it will do a field completely from like once you start it up and walk away, it'll even do your headland passes, which is super nerve-wracking. I watched it happen. So I actually I actually set it up one night at 10 30 to uh cultivate the corn mace field because I needed to be tilled again, just uh it was plowed and it just needed to be tilled again to try to pack it down before I planted it. And I was like, well, 10:30 at night, I'm just gonna set this thing up, and you know, I figured by two o'clock it should be done roughly. It does go a little slower. Again, like it's it there's just different nuances that they're working on trying to get better, and they and they will, John Deere will get it. I have no doubt about that. But anyway, set it up, and uh my dad was with me, and he goes, Well, that's a million bucks, I'll probably never see it again, you know. I mean, it's just it's it's just true because it's just like, oh my goodness, you know, I'm just letting this machine just go. I went to bed, I kept checking it just to make sure, like, hey, is everything fine? And and it was. Uh, my wife said, though, however, do not do it again, because she said you tossed and turned all night. Like, she said you just you're not willed, and am I alarming off at two? And I pulled it open and I was starting to do the headlands, and um, it had done something really weird, and I just decided, you know what? I was two o'clock. I was like, you know what we're just gonna send you to the corner and be done. So I had you know, send home and it went back to the spot and it shut down. And it, you know, but it had done the work, you know, those several hours.

Jodi: 29:39

But this is this is terrible, but like John Deo needs to send with like their autonomous kit not only like the stuff to transport it to or like transfer it to an autonomous or like give it the tran autonomy ability, but it needs to send like a bottle of like melatonin gummies or like some micwill, so you can do it at night too.

Matthew Krueger: 29:58

And that was the first time we ran it at night, otherwise we've been running it during the day. Um, you know, and for us, like why we where do we see the benefit of it? Because like it is gonna be more expensive than a person. Like, even right now it's four bucks an acre. I think they're looking at going two bucks an acre. That's still a hundred bucks an hour uh if you're doing 50 acres an hour type of a thing. So it's still more than person, but I don't see it necessarily replacing a person. Where it worked for us was hey, it's springtime, I've got everything going on, and I need a seed truck move from one place to another place. Who can go do it? Well, guess what? The guy on the till tractor can go hang out, turn autonomy on, turn autonomy on, hop in a pickup, go do what he needs to do, and come back. And the thing's only run for you know 30, 50, whatever it's done 50 acres. Okay, that costs me even at four bucks an acre, it's it costs me 200 bucks, but you know what? It was better than me shutting that machine down for a whole hour. Um, we run a high-speed planter and um have air drills. I mean, that high-speed planter does 200 acres a day of planting, no, sorry, 500 acres a day. I mean, and so that tillage cannot stop. Like, we have to the tillage cannot stop. Like, it just can't. So, for that reason, like that's where I see autonomy being a key part for at least our operation. I don't see necessarily replacing someone, I just see it taking the place of hey, my dad's on there now, but hey dad, something broke. Can you go help so and so with whatever? Absolutely, turn it to autonomy, it's still gonna do his job. He can go out and help out whatever needs to be done, and then return back the tractor and finish the job. Or again, like where I ran it at night, you know, like we have several half section sized fields that hey, you know what? It's 10 o'clock at night, but it would be nice if that's done by tomorrow morning. Go ahead, everyone go everyone go home, get a good night's sleep. Hopefully. I think the other reason why that field, how I didn't sleep well with that field was um it had like it was near town, it was next to like the corn maze, which has it just has stuff out there, and so I was I mean, I know it's not supposed to break the boundary, but you're just you're concerned. You got fiber out there, you just had different things, so I think that's why I didn't sleep well. It was on our other fields that like there's nothing around it, I probably slept just fine. So anyway, that's but any that's where I see the benefit of autonomy on our own operations. Some operations they see it as truly replacing someone because hey, it's someone I have to put, you know, have to worry about hiring. And that could be the case too. Like, even the BT in the fall, at least I'm getting some tillage done, you know. Um, even for me, like it's not being done maybe perfectly, but if it can at least be getting done. They did ask me, John Deere asked, like, well, you know, some of these like like our high-speed disc, you know, it doesn't see things, so like, do we need to put sensors on there? So like if a disk gets plugged, then it like stops. I told them no. If you put more sensors on tillage, it just sounds like a humble idea, you know. I can remote in, like, I can see and sensor farmers. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly. I can see on the Operation Center app, and everything's done through the Operation Center app, it's not anything special, but I can see on there, like I can see the cameras, so I can look at it and watch.

Sarah: 33:02

Cool.

Matthew Krueger: 33:03

We did have a field this spring that had sunflower stocks in it, and it was kind of plugging up. And so when I was running it, and I had to run for autonomy for a little bit, and so I just I kept checking in to make sure, like, is it plugging up or is it fine? But generally, I got it set in a way that I knew like it was no longer playing up with me being in the seat. It wasn't maybe the most ideal, and I think my drag teeth I had it set back a little bit differently, but at least I knew then like hey, if it's going into autonomy, I'm gonna be okay. Like, it's not gonna have a sweeping mound of sunflower stocks, you know, getting pushed throughout the spring. So that's kind of you know, that that's kind of the point there. For us, it was kind of a no-cost, like it wasn't gonna hinder us in operation wise, because we could also just run it like normal. Like it wasn't like putting an autonomy kit on a tractor doesn't if you know, doesn't change the tractor, it just gives that option to run autonomy if you want to.

Sarah: 33:58

So you can like you like you say, at this point, you're still kind of having a person on there, and then if that person needs to get pulled away to go and do something else, you can flip that on and away you go.

Matthew Krueger: 34:11

Yep. Absolutely. Yeah. So it's not like that's uh it's not like you're taking the cab off of the thing to, you know, it's it's you know, you still have to you know move it from field to field, you still have to set it up. It's just kind of uh it's three, four hours potentially per field that hey, maybe those three hours someone could be doing something else, you know.

Sarah: 34:29

That's so when you think about applications where autonomy can fit, I mean, obviously this right now is in tillage, right? And it's interesting when we think about tillage because there's still some things to think about the depth of the tillage, you know, is anything bunching, just kind of like you talked about. And obviously you're making it work with with tillage, but what's the next operation that should become autonomous? Is it spraying? Is it planting? Is it um combining?

Matthew Krueger: 35:01

Yeah, and and John Deere has made it public that they plan on being full autonomy by 23rd. Like everything from tillage to harvest will be fully autonomous. I think that's a bit aggressive because that's only five more years. I think they asked me, they John Deere asked the same thing, like my opinion about it. Um I told him like I don't see I think spraying to me makes the most sense with like all the cameras and everything they have going on with spraying. I could see that being the next thing. Because generally, I mean, yeah, especially when you got like autopath lines from your planter and everything else like that. I I just see that kind of being the next step. I could also see like uh seeding, air seeders being the next thing. Um planters, maybe, but man, like I run I run a planter in spring. Those things even I get nervous about that. Yeah, like I I I don't see I where I see it being a thing too with like the planter, same thing with the tillage. Maybe it's just it's running for a round. Maybe you can get out and kind of like observe things, make some changes on your phone and be like, all right, let it go by me again and double check, and okay, yep, looks good. But I don't think I could ever let the planter just go because all of a sudden, like, say a row starts, you know, low population is gonna stop, and like what are you gonna do? Like, well, I'd have to climb out, check what's going on. Typically, it's just the hose that seed got hung up somewhere, so it's not that big of a thing, but there's no person to do that. Uh even the Tommy tractor, we had it where it would stall it stop out for some I can't remember unknown reason, and then I ended up having to drive my pickup all the way in the middle of the field, park it off the side, and keep tilling, which is fine. But then all of a sudden now I've got to go back and pick up a pickup, you know, kind of thing. So planting, I just I don't see that one and that one. I just see how it was a harder thing. But even sprayer, like, I mean, again, if you're wrapping the field, maybe it's fine. But I mean, that first pass around, typically, like like the guys right now are out spraying a field and the wind's against them. I know that first pass is gonna go, we go we go low and slow. You can lower your pressure, lower your boom, just go slow, so not any drift issues. The sprayers aren't gonna know that. It's gonna do auto boom height, whatever pressure you want, the way you go, and your speed. So that's where I see spraying. And like harvest autonomy, I if the dust issue is the thing with like planting or like tillage, it's never gonna be able to do harvest. Like the dust in a combine it harvest is madness.

Sarah: 37:24

Right. And I I don't know, I'm thinking about like a planter. When we first, you know, okay, go back in the old days when you actually had to drive straight. That's what you focused on doing was driving straight. Looked at, and that's what you did. But once we finally got auto tier, it allowed you to basically turn around backwards, look at your planter, and look at all of your monitors. That's when we became curious about, you know, really focused on that seed singulation, the seed depth, the down pressure and all of those things. Adjustable row cleaners became a thing where people can, you know, watch that and adjust the row cleaners for higher residue areas. So, how do we get the autonomy to do those things?

Jodi: 38:16

More expensive sensors.

Sarah: 38:18

Yeah. And and which again, oh look, I've got a sensor that doesn't work. That makes every farmer out there happy, not just kidding. That's a joke.

Jodi: 38:28

And I I wonder too, um, I feel like I'm thinking back to like conversations like from 10 years ago, like where economists were thinking, you know, how can we make machinery more efficient? And it's like, okay, running at night and then just running all the time, right? Like if you've got a fixed asset or like a large capital asset that is your very expensive tractor, you're gonna get the most out of it by using it all the time. So I wonder, you know, especially if we've got to add more sensors to these things, do we have smaller tractors and smaller implements to just run all the time? And maybe not for this area, like the valley, our fields are very nice for autonomy, I think, compared to other places. But I wonder if that will help, you know, maybe you and the autonomous tractor both planting at the same time. One, the smaller the autonomous tractor going and then the larger implement. God, I but I mean from John Deere's perspective, right? They're they're putting it in the the tractors that they're already selling. So that probably isn't going to be the case, but maybe other companies might take that route.

Matthew Krueger: 39:33

Yeah. Well, and like I get like planting, there's now sensors that with cameras evaluating your seed trench, you know. So it gives you that feedback. So I I can see planting being the next thing, uh road crop planting. I'm sure like air seeding just kind of a easier, it's not quite as precise as like corn planting or sugary planting. You know, like it's not quite as like it's still an important thing, but it's like a glorified tillage toolbar. And hopefully I'm not offending any of the people that are running air seeders everywhere. Like it just that just It it is just it's a yeah.

Sarah: 40:02

Well, you just do not control the same down pressure situation, the seed placement just isn't as exact, and you're not monitoring that that stuff to the same extent that you are in a planter. That's just the fact of the matter. That's just a difference between air seeders and planters.

Matthew Krueger: 40:17

Yep, exactly.

Sarah: 40:18

That's how that works.

Matthew Krueger: 40:19

That's kind of where I just see it like that's where I see impossible next things, like the air seeders or sprayers. Planters, I just feel like that's gonna be a bit combines. I also feel it's gonna be a bit, you know, so but I mean I i I think it's coming. You know, if you're pointing Jody, I've heard different people's theories and like they think it'll be, you know, Sarah Farmer having one big tractor, it'll be ten little robot things that do the same kind of work, it's just ten of them that they load up on a trailer, and they're you know, able to just kind of let them go on the field and do the thing. I don't know what the future is. I mean, even one guy I talked to Eek thought more would be like uh Tesla's man thing. Like, why don't we just hire an AI robot that would sit in the tractor and do the things, you know? So I think there's so many different ways. I also think it's also the race to zero. Like with anything with technology, it's gonna be the highest cost right away because hey, it's a new feature, but everyone's gonna be good now getting access to that technology and bringing that price down, down, down. I know there's another firm that's working on autonomy tillage that's gonna do a uh non-subscription base, it's gonna be a one-time fee, which I mean ADM GK technology would do that as well. It used to be a one-time fee, and then you own the software, but that only is sustainable for so long for how do we keep paying our programmers and everything else to like allow these updates to happen, you know.

Sarah: 41:36

So and a lot of optors that way, yeah, exactly. So like subscription fees, yeah.

Matthew Krueger: 41:42

So like it has to be either like it can be the one-time fee, and then maybe just an annual support fee, you know, just to keep things updated. Sure, that's fine. But anyway, so I mean I think everyone's it it tillages right now is the easiest thing. Grand cart is another thing that's gonna be easy. It's after that, it's kind of the big giant question mark. And again, you're not gonna get right anybody are like, oh, they're getting rid of the poor farmer. You're never getting rid of the poor farmer. It's just we have such issues getting people to be on the farm, or like we're in a blue state, and I'm forced by our stupid state to provide benefits that are completely unnecessary, but they still cost me. I'm paying for so-and-so's maternity leave, even though like we don't have that. It's just it's yeah, it's just I mean, they're things that we deal with.

Sarah: 42:24

And so you're in Minnesota and I'm over in North Dakota, and we still have issues, labor issues all the time on the North Dakota side.

Matthew Krueger: 42:34

And if we are a very red state, so I mean, it has to be just to be fair out there at all political parties, it's not just a blue state, red state that it's an issue altogether, but like like we have different regulations we have to have on Minnesota's side that you don't have to North Dakota side, you know. Like we do pay, like we're mandated to be overtime in Minnesota. I'm honestly okay with that. I mean, like if you're working hard, I think you should be compensated for that, you know. So North Dakota, you don't have inventory overtime, you know. Get frustrated with other things that we have to do in Minnesota that my neighbors to the west don't have to do, you know. That not still we still have issues of labor, but technic I would feel like my labor would potentially cost extra 10% more because of different things we have to do in Minnesota that North Dakota doesn't have to do.

Sarah: 43:18

So in North Dakota, we just don't have the labor availability. We just don't have labor available. You your tractor's gonna sit there because you don't have anybody to drive it. End of discussion, period.

Matthew Krueger: 43:30

Yeah, exactly. So and we have H2A labor. Um, that's been awesome. But again, it just goes back to fall time, you know, for us, like where everyone like I mean, some farms are out there hiring people, they they're giving them full-time positions, even though they maybe don't have to work for them, but at least gives them a person for that springtime hard time and that full time, like those two times that we just need full. But most of people are like, I don't want to work two weeks, I want to have a full-time job, you know. So what does that also cost you as well? So that's kind of where again I see the autonomy being a part of it is it's alleviating maybe that labor again, not taking someone out, but maybe it just makes that, you know, instead of paying someone 40, 50 grand a year to be a full-time employee, hey, maybe I'm just paying John Deere a subscription fee to at least give me a person, quote unquote person, in that machine for those times that I need that extra.

Jodi: 44:25

Yeah. It's like the pinch hitter. I mean, I we've we talk about it all the time in the valley, right? Like in the spring and in the fall, especially the fall here, right? You've got agronomy centers hiring soil samplers, you've got the beet harvest, which is taking up so many of those like temporary workers. Everybody wants people in the fall. And so if you can have some like a tractor doing its own job, man, that's and let's be real too, driving a tractor today is not what it was tech years ago, 20 years ago.

Sarah: 44:53

You know, I I was raised on a farm where my dad said, if you don't know what to do with them, put them in a truck. Well, goodness gracious, you don't do that anymore today. The trucks are big, the tractors are big, and there's a lot of technology in these things. And you need to have somebody who understands how equipment works. Yeah, absolutely.

Matthew Krueger: 45:13

And yeah, I mean, like I grew up in a generation like where we still like I remember planting soybeans without GPS. Like I had to line up, like my dad said, sit in the middle of the seat, line yourself up in the middle of the thing, line your belly button up, and just watch that line. Sit forward, don't look back, you know, just kind of keep you know, you kind of look back every once in a while just to make sure nothing's plugged up. Well, that's what it was back then. And now, I mean, I've I've got my kids that my 11-year-old helped me out on the farm quite a bit, and he I still want him to learn those values because I think there's a grade button in that. So, like, but he's run grain card for me the last couple of falls now. Yesterday, we couldn't get the machine sync to work, which machine sync is a feature from John Deere where the grain card gets close enough to the combine and then the combine takes over. And so for him, you know, it wasn't working right away. And I said, you know what, just run old school and it's it's good for you to learn. And and he he did great, you know. He doesn't like it, but at least he he still knows that value because even in tillage, I'll have I've had guys where like, oh, the GPS doesn't work. I'm like, well then keep tilling.

Sarah: 46:14

I love that. I still say that all the time. The auto steer quit. What do I do? Okay, grab the wheel.

Matthew Krueger: 46:22

Keep going, yeah. But fun little like slide flip slide deal there. You know, the solar flares last spring we had May 10th, 2024. Yeah. You know, like the the theory was there, like, oh, the GPS doesn't work, just just keep going. I couldn't to my planter, I could not because my planter needed to know where it was at. It uses GPS speed to know the speed. Like, I had some I I mean, I didn't I I waited three days and then I finally went on like the day and was kind of comish. I almost got one field done, and then it like freaked itself out, and I'm like, all right, I'm done, I can't finish this field. But I mean there was a point where like we couldn't, and I love my mom, but she wears sometimes a tinfoil hat, and she quickly was like, the next time we are our planter, you need to put markers on it, and we need to have it ground-driven so we can still keep planting. I'm like, Mom, it's it's not that no the correlation. Okay, I'm gonna put my tinfoil hat on a little bit here too. The correlation of that event with Johnny launching SFRTK, just it's oh, there's a very high R squared value right there, so it's fine.

Sarah: 47:27

It just I do think you knew about the solar flares.

Matthew Krueger: 47:33

There there are forecasts out there about them.

Jodi: 47:35

Like, you can Yeah, we're we're in a peak cycle right now. They they cycle every what is it, nine to eleven years, and like we're in a peak cycle right now.

Matthew Krueger: 47:43

Stating like it just seemed very coincidental that John Tier had this magic SFRDK that I mean still wasn't great, but it worked better than mobile like base stations or even like you know, just forget. I mean, I just whatever, just it's fine, but just it's very high coincidence there.

Sarah: 47:59

So, would you order another planter with markers on it then?

Matthew Krueger: 48:03

No, the planter came with no markers, so it does not have markers, you don't need markers, it's fine. Because I think I told mom, like the planter, I said, mom, not it's not that I can't see her. I just like the point where I stopped is the planter went in front of my tractor and then went back behind again. You know, she's like, like I said, no, it's hard to describe. I said, literally, like on my screen, the planter just went whoop to the front and foop to the back, and the thing would turn on and off, and you know, had a heart attack. But I'm just like, I decided I had to stop and yeah, so you could go to ground, but man, I haven't had a ground drive planter since holy moly. My dad and uncle, I think they were one of the first ones that had hydraulic-driven planter, and that was like '98. So I mean, like, it's been 30 years almost of non hydr non-ground drive.

Jodi: 48:50

We just sold our ground drive drill, but you know what? We have a ground drive air drill now, so or air seater, so yay.

Matthew Krueger: 48:57

So yeah, we have that we have that kind of note too this spring. Well, the sensor went out for the ground for our air seater, and then mom same thing. What's wrong? I said, well, we lost the sensor. Just be ground drive, then we can keep going. I'm like, oh god. Love me dearly, but you know what? Things just happen. It's a two one, it's a $50 part. John Deere had one. I went and got it. We're up and going.

Jodi: 49:17

So this is so funny because it reminds me, you know, this technology, every generation is like this, right? We're all as human beings, no, no being is like good at handling change, right? And like now we're in the era where we're moving from like the horse and buggy to the Model T, or we're moving from like ground drive to GPS, you know, driven and and human-driven to autonomous, right? Like, how crazy are we gonna sound in like 10 years or like 20 years and look back like, oh man, we were really scared of like going from auto steer to autonomy, and we're gonna sound like, man, going from the horse to the buggy.

Matthew Krueger: 49:55

I mean, I mean, I think there was a rumor, or I think I saw Jason post it, Jason Hansen, you know, like when Chemical first came out, they thought, oh, agronomists are all like we're not gonna have jobs anymore, you know, like what round up Roundup the Roundup Ready era.

Sarah: 50:09

When that happened, they all said that agronomists were gonna be there there's no use for agronomists anymore.

Matthew Krueger: 50:15

I mean I used the same kind of a thing, you know, still need us. Yeah, I mean, uh you know, you're still gonna need all those people, and even like AI, it's a funny thing too. My back to my mom, my mom, I'm gonna have to tell my mom to listen to this podcast because she'll be like, oh my gosh, you know, but like mom, she uh I I was an early I wasn't early on ChatGPT, but it definitely like it helped things. So again, like I'm not an expert in many things. Like there's a few things I'll pride myself in, like I know this really well, but there's other things like writing macros in Excel. Like I like to write macros in Excel, but it is a horrible thing to do. And like, but I could have Chat GPT write a macro for me with all I wanted to do, and it saved me hours. I mean, I could do it, but it's not a it's not a thing I need to really learn or master, you know. And I say if if you're something like in a field of something, you do need to learn to master it properly. Um, use AI to help you with it. But for me, I did not need to learn how to run macros. I know the basis of it, but let chat GPT do it. And uh my mom was just anti-Chat GPT and AI, and I'm like, wow, I'm not, it just it like helps you with things. I mean, like it can meal plan, all this other stuff. All of a sudden, here I find out, I think I found out only like three, four weeks ago. My mom's been like on this chat GPT kick, and she's like in love with it. She's like, man, it helps you with this and does this and all of this. I'm like, how are we doing this? She's like, Oh, I've been doing it for months, but I didn't, I told all the siblings, do not tell Matthew because I be able to do not use ChatGBT. This is so bad. You need to do this. And I'm like, I mean, we use it. My wife and I used it when we went to Arizona. We said, hey, we have a week we're down in Phoenix. Here's our age of our kids, here's the things we're like to do. I put in all the prompts. I said, plan out our week. Man, I mean it we didn't use it fully, but it helped us with a lot of different things. Um, even helped us meal plan, like, hey, we're in Airbnb, we've got this grocery store nearby. Here's all the things that are in it. I copy and paste it from the Airbnb listing. Give us a meal plan for the week with we're gonna eat out, we'll eat out once a day. Um, prefer probably for dinner, you know, give it the prompts, and it gave us a whole meal plan. Again, just it again, not that it doesn't make you think because you still need to go through it all and make sure, like, yep, this works, but like I mean, AI is an incredible tool. I mean, again, it can be used in the wrong way where you kind of just turn your brain off. But I think if you're using the right way just to help aid you in what you're doing, and I know for like the autonomy that is part of like the process too, like you will learn as it's going along, like in terms of the dust thing, in terms of like um, you know, I think they're working on like field conditions because people always say, like, well, how's it gonna see a wet spot? Well, here in the belly, you're not tilling if it's wet, or not in West North Dakota, where you do have sloughs and stuff, but typically those sloughs you'd map around. But I mean again, you know, like I I don't know about those issues for my farm or in our farm. This is this is what we have to deal with. I have square fields, they're flapped. The only thing I could see is like if it hits a spot where some wheat residue or corn stalks kind of pushed up in one spot, I might put up the cultivator. Like those things I'm concerned about, and I think John Deere's working on remedies for that as well, you know. But for right now, it's a seven-year-old, is kind of what I said. It it it will it will graduate to being a teenager or a young adult eventually, but right now it's a seven-year-old at its infancy. So I'm excited to see this fall some improvements that they've made. Um, and it'll just be interesting to see like what that looks like, you know, in terms of like dust or what other what other facets are they gonna adjust to make it um just work better for us.

Jodi: 53:48

This is this has been so much fun to to listen to your experience with this autonomous tractor. No, this has been fantastic. Thank you so much for your time, Matt. This has been such a great conversation.

Sarah: 54:02

Um, it's so so fun to think about how things are gonna go in the future with autonomy. You know, I think we hear about autonomy uh in agriculture all the time, but we don't realize that it's actually real and that it exists today. And it's really fun to hear about how it's actually starting to fit in because we are just at the forefront of this. So thank you so much for sharing your experiences with us today. It was it was just so much fun.

Matthew Krueger: 54:30

Yeah, so thank you for having me on. I appreciate it.

Sarah: 54:33

Absolutely. With that at GK Technology, we have a map and an app for that.

Theme Music: 54:41

And I can't wait to get in the video to game. Oh, I can't wait to get in the game.