How We Role: A Podcast for Actors by Casting Networks
How We Role: A Podcast for Actors by Casting Networks, breaks down an actor's journey, one topic at a time. Join award-winning actor, writer and host Robert Peterpaul alongside industry talent and experts as they discuss how to build a successful career as a performer and beyond in the entertainment industry. From inspirational casting stories to practical advice on the craft of acting, tune in to expand your skill set and book that role.
Get cast today at castingnetworks.com.
How We Role: A Podcast for Actors by Casting Networks
Optimize Your Casting Profile and Get Booked with Casting Director Virginia Anello & Casting Network's Jason Teresi
A casting profile is like a 24/7 audition—even when you’re not in the room.
In this insightful conversation, Casting Director Virginia Anello and Casting Networks’ Jason Teresi join host Robert Peterpaul to break down what makes a standout casting profile.
In this episode, they cover:
•The #1 thing that impresses casting directors
•How to appear in the right casting searches
•What to update every 4–6 months to stay competitive
Virginia Anello, CSA, is a Casting Director and Partner at O’Connor Casting Company with 17 years of experience. A Columbia College Chicago grad, she champions Chicago talent and loves helping actors thrive—plus quoting movies and embracing all things nerdy.
Jason Teresi is Casting Networks’ Client Success Manager and a former actor. With over 24 years in the industry, he brings deep insight into actor profiles and works closely with casting professionals worldwide. He’s a proud dad, Chicago theater alum, and industry veteran.
This is - How We Role. Get cast today at castingnetworks.com.
Follow Host, Actor and Producer Robert Peterpaul (Amazon's Sitting in Bars with Cake, The Art of Kindness podcast) on Instagram @robpeterpaul and learn more at robertpeterpaul.com.
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When it comes to working in entertainment, there's a lot of hows, and they all boil down to how we navigate this wild industry. While how we follow our dreams is uncertain, how we roll along the way is in our hands. Welcome to how we Roll a podcast for actors by Casting Networks. How we Roll a podcast for actors by Casting Networks. Hello, fellow actors, Thank you for tuning back in. This is your friend, Robert, Peter Paul, and you've caught me in the midst of spring cleaning Dust dust.
Speaker 1:Yes, I think it's a great time to take a look at my materials, specifically online casting profiles, and do a little actor spritz. Whether you're just creating a profile or looking to optimize your online presence, this conversation aims to take your casting profile to the next level and hopefully multiply your audition opportunities. Joining me on the mic are two wonderful leaders on this very subject. First, we have former actor and current casting network's very own client success manager, Jason Teresi. Jason works with countless casting directors around the world and is extremely knowledgeable about the ins and outs of creating actor profiles. When I mentioned this episode topic to him, he immediately recommended I reach out to longtime casting director Virginia Anello and, lucky for us, she said yes. A partner of the O'Connor Casting Company. Virginia has an admirable goal, which is to provide talent with as many employment opportunities as possible, and likes nothing better than seeing working actors making a solid living doing what they love.
Speaker 1:Oh, Speaking of love, I had a lovely time chatting with this delightful duo and I hope you enjoy it just as much as I did. I also want to shout out Casting Network's user at DuchessAnnaCurve, who submitted a wonderful question about social media that you'll hear answered throughout this conversation. Stay tuned to the Casting Network's social media pages for a chance to submit your own questions and be featured in an upcoming episode. Now, without further ado. This is how we roll with Casting Profiles featuring Virginia and Jason. Well, hello, friends. Today we're talking all things Casting Profiles. We have the lovely Virginia and Jason here with us. Can you both please just start by introducing yourselves so we can get used to your separate voices, In a nutshell, what you do, who you are on the casting end of things. That would be great.
Speaker 2:Do you want me to go first, Jason?
Speaker 3:Absolutely Of course. How polite, how polite.
Speaker 2:I'm Virginia. I'm with the O'Connor Casting Company. I've been with O'Connor for about 17 years, been doing casting that whole time. So I've been a casting director a lot of that time. I started as an intern back when I was just, you know, like 10 years old, like a baby, just like a baby, and I worked my way through there. Before that I did production in all kinds of things Production. I also painted. I did some, some paintings, some sports collectibles painting for a bit. So that was weird.
Speaker 1:Wow, I've done that. That's amazing. Oh, my goodness, any fan favorite things you've painted in that regard. I just feel the need to ask.
Speaker 2:You know, I know I liked it when I got like an official game ball. I got like an official game ball. I got an official game ball. Occasionally I get to paint that oh that's cool. When I had to paint like Brett Favre stuff. I was not a fan, so and we all understand. So basically, I decided I needed some stable work and I was like acting and not acting agents, or not acting you quickly, definitely not acting. It wasn't that.
Speaker 1:But like, did I want to be an agent or did I?
Speaker 2:want to go into casting and uh, just ended up being casting, so really happy. 17 years congratulations, that's amazing, thank you. It is, uh, it is a long time, uh, I think, in the business, but there's so many people out there, so many casting directors who've done it so much longer, like they're just legends, um, and they've been around forever, so and slowly, casting is getting what it's due.
Speaker 1:In regards to recognition, I'm very excited to see things changing a bit so yeah, that's very exciting after all this time. Jason, my friend, would you mind introducing yourself and I will, you know, call you out and just say you had a fake mustache on a second ago. You took it off. I miss it. Nobody can see it. That's listening, but I've just painted that picture. I didn't paint Brett, but I did paint that.
Speaker 3:You know, virginia, I just learned so many new things about you. That was incredible. My name is Jason Teresi and I currently work at Casting Networks on the Client Success Team. I have been in the business for a long time, just doing other things sometimes. I went to DePaul Theater School, columbia Theater School. I was an actor until I realized what a bad actor I was and needed to go into. I wanted to stay in the business, so I started working at a company that was acquired by our competitor in the industry, and I worked there for 22 years or thereabouts, and now I've been at Casting Networks for about four.
Speaker 1:That's amazing. Also, I do think it takes a lot of bravery to pivot. I mean, both of you kind of have explained how you pivoted over the years and especially to kind of say hey either, like I mean, I don't know if you were a bad actor, but you just didn't feel good about what you were doing and so you changed the narrative, which I think is great and a good lesson in itself, and we're about to get into many more lessons as we break down casting profiles here. So to start, I just would love to know either of you can answer both of you, everybody in the room, all personalities how do you each think an actor should approach making their profile? Is there like a certain mindset or overall guidance you would recommend we go in with, because it can be slightly intimidating. You hear different things from different people. There's all these different features, you know. But what's just your general advice there?
Speaker 3:I'm going to just really quick say in my opinion it's simple Be thorough, be honest and complete everything you possibly can. You don't want to not fill out your entire profile. If a casting director can search our database of actors and you speak a language and you didn't put down on your profile that you do speak that language, and the casting director is looking for someone who speaks that language, they're not going to find you. So the more you have on there, the more thorough you are. Fill everything out and don't don't lie.
Speaker 1:I think Virginia can weigh in there, maybe on the lies that you've seen over the years and how that's worked out.
Speaker 2:No one lies, come on, nobody lies, but like. I do believe in being honest.
Speaker 2:Yeah that's the difference. That's the difference. No, yeah, you can't. I've seen a lot of people just check every box on skills and stuff like that. You don't want to do that. You got to just be real about you know. Yes, I speak Spanish, but I'm, you know, conversational or whatever it is. Don't say you're an expert at anything unless you are an expert at that level of stuff. Yeah, I've just seen so many profiles where either nothing's checked off or everything's checked off, and that's not true. It's obviously not true. Either way, you have some skills you check off and you don't have all the skills, obviously.
Speaker 2:But you know, you can be like oh, I can put up so much media, or you know so many photos, so much media, but like that's not needed necessarily.
Speaker 2:Like more isn't better for me usually, and I just obviously I'm just speaking for me. I don't know I can't speak for every casting director out there, but for me it's like I need like a few photos, different ones, and I and if you have a real, if it's good, if you have some good stuff on it, fine. If you don't and you just want to upload like a nice little slate or something like that where I just see you talk to camera and introduce yourself, that's nice for me to see you on camera if I don't know you. And you know I look at resumes, obviously. I look at photos and if I get to it I get to a reel. Like usually there's not a whole lot of time to spend on any one profile in general, but like if I'm looking for something specific I'll go as deep as I need to go, but like uploading 20 photos when they're all the same doesn't do anything for me.
Speaker 1:We're going to get into that. We're going to get into all that. Also, my cat agrees. I don't know if you hear my cat. My cat's like, yeah, I just don't have a lot of photos. Well, she has a lot of photos. Anyway, before we sort of dive into the nitty gritty of it, what are the basic details that you think people should have at like a bare minimum, to create their profile? It's all laid out there for us and I would like everybody to use them all. There's a ton of features on casting networks especially. But what would you say is like okay, get this up right away.
Speaker 2:Photo photo, the main photo, the headshot, usually a vertical one so that it presents itself in the box the nice way like it frames itself correctly for casting networks. If you're using that and a resume like that's what's the basics, that's the minimum I think you need. I've seen people up there with just a photo and no resume and I I can't do much with that. Um, I usually can't do anything with that If I'm being generous.
Speaker 3:No, no, I like that Usually can't do anything On a resume, I am going to throw in their contact information. If you're going to get hired or someone wants to go further, give you a call back. How are they going to get in touch with you? And I think the size card is pretty important. I've certainly been on auditions where they say you need to be under six feet. You cannot be over six feet or you have to wear these specific size pants. Yeah, kind of thing.
Speaker 1:So yeah, casting people for costumes sometimes is real. Just coming from the theater, I know it's. I mean, obviously you want the talent too, but then it's like, well, this person fits in the costume, so we're going to go with them. So that's an important note. Casting networks allows you to have many profiles. So I would just love if you could speak to that for a second, either of you, I think, for me. I understand it, but I could see maybe people being confused on sort of how many profiles they need. Many profiles they need. I know you want one for different agents, you know. So what would you recommend?
Speaker 3:to start, let's say no one has representation, you need one profile. Okay, it's your personal profile. Robert, if you become my agent, you send me an invite to join your roster and I get an email as an actor saying hey, Jason Robert at so-and-so talent agency has invited you to join their roster. If you've never used Casting Networks before and you don't have a profile, click here. If you have and you do have a profile, we'll copy that profile onto your agent's roster and all the information will be copied over. Click here.
Speaker 1:Link it in. Yeah, that's it. I love that. I'm glad you brought that up, because I do have paperwork for me to represent you that will sign up for this.
Speaker 3:But don't get me wrong. There's actors who who will create four different profiles and that's probably not a good thing. I would always suggest to the actor calling in or emailing into support and saying hey, I've got two or three profiles, I would like them merged together.
Speaker 1:And that is possible? Yeah, because sometimes you know you're supposed to have that commercial resume, the theater-driven resume, the film, and they might all be sort of the same with different pictures, but it's like the ranking of credits changes. So I was wondering if you've seen people use it that way. But you know that in mind I think Virginia, you can probably speak to this, and Jason as well, from your work with casting directors when a casting goes to look on their, on that submissions, what is usually the first impression, like what's the first thing you're seeing of an actor's profile?
Speaker 2:That photo, that photo, that's it.
Speaker 1:Like a lot of little thumbnails, a lot of thumbnails. It's a lot of thumbnails.
Speaker 2:So, like I said, like usually you want a vertical 8x10 because that fits in the box, the best way that fits in the framing. If you had a horizontal photo, casting Networks will crop it or make it farther away so that it fits in there. It does something to them, so your photo is automatically going to look different from everybody else. Either it's going to be cropped weird or it's going to be smaller. So I always recommend like a vertical eight by 10 for that.
Speaker 1:And you actually can change your thumbnail.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. And so like, if you're like going for a dramatic role, you're you or your agent right Can can switch your photo. So it's not the smiley commercial one, it's the serious one with the leather jacket right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely right.
Speaker 3:Every time an agent submits you or an actor submits themselves. You have the ability to customize. I'm going to choose this picture. I'm going to choose this clip or reel to go along with it, because this reel and picture match the tone of what I'm going to be auditioning for. If I'm auditioning for a one-hour drama, why do I want to send my comedy stuff and so on? Virginia, I was really surprised when we first started. You had said that you look at resumes, and I appreciate that as a former actor. But I never thought that anyone looked at a resume.
Speaker 2:Well, okay, here's the thing. This is true. I look at resumes. If I don't know you like if I know you, I don't have to click on anything else except the button to get you on my job Like if I know you and you're right for it, I don't have to go further. But if I haven't met you this is all assuming you know, these are new to me people and if I see a photo I'm like this looks right to me, I go on to the, I click on the photo and the easiest thing is when people fill out the casting networks resume section because their resume is the first, is the thing I see first. If people upload a pdf resume instead, then I have to click further into it to get to that resume. So it's already taking up so much more of my time.
Speaker 1:I know I apologize. That sounds really stupid to say no it's good because as actors, we're sort of like oh, I have my resume that I've been making, it's formatted, now I have to add it into this platform. But think about that times a million, times a million, like I had to go through a job If you had to do that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I had to go through 1,400 submissions for like one role and it just wasn't going to happen, like I wasn't going to be able to deep dive onto people. So if I clicked on your thing, at all cool, you win already. And then if I have to like go deep, it's like, oh my gosh, how much time do I have to like go deep? It's like, oh my gosh, how much time do I have I have to get through this um. So, yeah, usually the best thing is to have the casting networks resume um filled out.
Speaker 1:I will go into the pdf resume if it's not there um it's kind. So yeah and I don't. That's a great reminder to the win. In this oversaturated self-tape era it's like to have that many submissions just to get clicked on. Yes is a win. So, have that thumbnail to be golden.
Speaker 2:Just to be submitted is a win because already, like, your agent thinks you're right for it. Right, your agent thinks you're right for it. If I click on you, I think you might be right for it. If I audition you, two people really think you're right for it.
Speaker 3:You know A couple of things. I wanted to touch on A couple things I wanted to touch on. An actor doesn't realize it's your job as an actor and it's your agent's job as your agent to make the casting director's job as easy as possible. You don't want to send them links that they have to click on that take them outside of the system that they're using. Oh, click on this link and go to YouTube and watch this. No, they want to stay inclusive in the platform so they can do their jobs. You spoke about resumes earlier. We do have the option. You can upload a PDF or you can type it all in. If it's typed in, it's a searchable field for casting. If it's not typed in, they have to, like Virginia said, click on another link, go somewhere else, see your stuff. This is your vocation, this is your livelihood. Why wouldn't you take the time as an actor, 10 minutes, to type everything in and get it the way you want it?
Speaker 1:and have it look really good, and I'm glad you brought up resumes because I have this whole structured thing here, as yesterday I went through my own profile and be right back. Let me go change my resume now. No, I actually I had a good time. This was a great conversation to have coming because it forced me to sort of go in there and check out my own stuff, and I heard a great quote once that I would love both of your thoughts on, if possible, which was a great resume should show casting where you're going, not where you've been, and so I wonder your thoughts on formatting a resume. I think a lot of us think we have these digital options now, so we're going to have that as like a log and a history of everything we've ever done and just keep adding it. But would you say it's better in the sense to have like less is more, sort of have the credits that?
Speaker 2:fit the parts you want to play? Yes, yes, I think the answer is yes to that. Okay, because, um, I mean too much stuff on a resume I'm not going to, I'm not going to, my eyes aren't going to focus, it's going to be like. It's going to be like, oh, there's tons of stuff Great, and I'll have, and I'm searching for stuff which is not bad. It's just, it's just what it is.
Speaker 2:But if you had just like some like I've seen people come back from LA to Chicago and I get their resumes and it's like I, obviously I know what you're doing immediately, I don't need a deep dive. I know there's a million things that are not on this resume. Um, so yeah, like, if you're not looking to do whatever kind of work say you know industrial work or whatever, or that then don't put it on your resume. You know you don't have to. I believe you, if you want to, if you're into film and TV, this time that's what you want to do, then that's, that's what's your resume should be. I guess Commercials I almost never see anything commercial on a resume. It's always, you know, conflicts available upon request. But, like, make sure you have those if I do request that. I've hardly ever done that, but sure yeah. So I don't really even see like something tailored to commercial work really ever. It's just usually their film and TV work.
Speaker 3:former actor. I always put list available upon request If I've got a Coca-Cola commercial running. I don't want anyone to know that that I'm about to go audition, for they might say oh well, shoot man, this is for Pepsi products. He's already got a Coke commercial running.
Speaker 2:I don't want to even use him or see him, so it might hinder me um when it but even if it was like five years old, if your, if your coke was 10 years ago, five years ago, just showing that is kind of bad, like, even though you're free and clear of that conflict for pepsi, like yeah, they're just gonna be like uh okay, this is blowing my mind because I think on some level I knew that, but I thought thought having that is like, oh my gosh, he was in a T-Mobile commercial I did.
Speaker 1:That was like 10 years ago. It's like that's expired, but it's like having that on there, oh, that's cool. So just having that full list is a better option You're both in agreement on which.
Speaker 3:Absolutely. If I played the paper boy in our town when I was nine years old, I don't need that on my resume. That doesn't matter. You know why? Because unfortunately, this is a what have you done for me lately business, not what did you do for me 10 years ago business. They want to know what you're working on now. Like you said, where am I going? And the only way you can show that is if you update your resume all the time. Everything you do, you should put your newest stuff at the top. Here's where I'm going. Where I've been isn't as important for sure.
Speaker 1:Okay, now I really got to go. We mentioned media headshots and reels. We've kind of touched on a bit. I wonder, virginia, what kinds of headshots really are the ones that stand out to you in the grid?
Speaker 2:Okay, okay, okay, this is my favorite. This is my favorite.
Speaker 1:Oh, yeah, let's do it. Can't wait.
Speaker 2:I can't no, like I said, I just speak for me, so it's just me and I'm a human being.
Speaker 2:So spoiler alert heads up. Everybody, like, I'm not super picky about, like, what you're wearing, um, what angle you're taking, I just want to see your face. I want to see your face as it usually appears as you would walk onto set, um, as you would walk into my studio, um, like, what can you do? What? What is? What is your normal kind of look, something you can achieve, you know, for any type of shoot, not, you know, not some crazy thing that you know, like a big beard that you can't, can't get anymore because you shaved it. Um, I like, obviously, I like it lit well, and I, like, you know, I don't want it to be like you in a black turtleneck with a black background, like you know and a skull just that's kind of cool.
Speaker 2:Actually, I might be into that oh, okay, that might make me pick you, um, no, but if it's just like floating head and like your elbows, like like you know, like I mean like pop yourself from the background a little bit, maybe separate yourself. But in general I like a close up shot. And you know there could be a couple different kinds of close up shots. You know women could have their hair different in a close. In two different close up shots you can have an open mouth smile, closed mouth smile, no smile, just different kind of facial kind of looks. As you know vary those those slightly. And then I like a full body shot for some jobs.
Speaker 2:There's a lot of work in commercial world where I need to kind of see what you look like, full body. So if you have one of those, great. What I was saying earlier was you know, I've gone to people's profiles and it's like 20 photos and they're all the same framing and they've like just changed their shirt. It's's like the same angle, the same smile. I can't see their teeth ever in anything. It makes me wonder what's going on in there. So like I like some variation. I don't need a whole lot. It's not like quantity, it's like quality, it's like what kind of very different looks. Can you show me in a headshot? So, like I said, a close up, maybe in the close up, not like super close. Don't fill the frame with your head. Give me a little space, back it up a little bit. Shoulders, collarbone, um, and yes, I like, uh, I like to have a full body available for at least for commercial work. Uh, I know it's annoying to have, but that's that has helped a lot If I'm trying to see what someone looks like.
Speaker 1:That's okay to take on your phone. Something like that, like a nice full body shot, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:I mean, I'm super easy with that type of stuff. It doesn't have to be like a full-on professional shoot for that, but if you're going to get headshots anyway and you can get one of those great.
Speaker 1:And now I'm thinking of Moira Rose in the glittery gown, walking with that gif.
Speaker 2:Have walking with that gif. Have you seen that when she her hands are open, I miss?
Speaker 1:her. Okay, that's super helpful. So it's not like. It's not like wardrobe changes. For me it's like facial changes and framing changes, the acting basics which is important.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, absolutely. When I was a young actor and living in los angeles, I went in for an audition for a pilot and I walked in the room and it was like the casting director, the director there were several people in there and the director said who are you? And I said I'm. I'm Jason Teresi, and he turned my own picture around that he had in his hand to show me and he said that's not you. The person in this picture is who I was expecting to walk in the room. How, how old are these bar pictures? It's just what he?
Speaker 1:said to me and I was like deadpool too are we getting catfished like it's dead I think so I didn't have a bar mitzvah well, that's important to bring up too in this, in this ai age. You know you're gonna do yourself a disservice if you use an AI service because it's ultimately not going to be the real you and even if you get to the point where you're on a live Zoom with casting, it's going to be revealed. You know you can't really hide that for too long. So I think that's an important thing to bring up.
Speaker 1:I also and we don't have to speak to this, I don't have to speak to this, I don't know if there's too much to say, but I think some people sleep on the arranging of the photos. You know, like the primary photo is is easy to find, but you can also arrange your photos and I think that's helpful right to have, like the photo that's next to the primary be different and then the one that's next to that be different, and sort of arrange them in a way that very like oh, I mean basically, you know, commercial, legit, dramatic, comedic, I think. I just want to point that out.
Speaker 3:I think it could help. I think it could certainly help. You're leading the casting director in a direction. How do I want them to see me with all of these pictures? But the most important thing, in my opinion, is that it represents who you are right now. Like Virginia said earlier, who's walking into that room? When they look at the picture and they look at you, walk in the room or into the virtual room or whatever it is they want to see. They've called you in for an audition based on your photo. And if you, because they're like hey, the person in this photo that works for me. This is what I want to see. If the person who walks in the virtual room or the real room and doesn't look like that picture, they're like wait a second, where's this person?
Speaker 1:Catfish. Yeah, and to that point too, I wonder, virginia and maybe Jason, you've heard of this have there been times I'm guessing that probably have where you've booked someone just right off of a photo and their media because it's like such a quick turnaround? Have you had that at all?
Speaker 2:Um, I don't do that. I advise all my clients to basically get a current selfie. Um, so we don't. We don't just because I I'm not going to get tricked. I'm not going to get tricked by you guys who don't look like your photos anymore. There's some people who look exactly like their photos and if I wanted to show them a pool of people who I know look exactly like their photos, I could do it. But usually if I'm doing a full casting, it's like we're going to get current selfies, current full body shots and, um, you know, tape if you want tape. But we usually don't let them book off of. But everybody's different and, like agents sometimes do that too, probably have direct bookings that they'll just book off photos.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, you know, speaking of tapes, I would say I'm tempted. I'm always tempted to like put a piece of tape on my face and it's like a self-tape. That's really dumb. Anyway, I'm a corny person, is it? Would you say it's better to have maybe self-taped? You're really proud.
Speaker 1:I'm sorry about that wait, I'm not sorry yeah, oh, yes, okay, I, I am a dad already. I don't have kids, but I make dad jokes. Is it better to have you think like one polished real or do you? I know you're very chill. Virginia, which is awesome, but awesome. But do you appreciate seeing multiple short clips? Show different skill sets and tones in the different clips. A nice self-tip you're proud of In the sense of video media what's your advice?
Speaker 2:Thanks for calling me chill. I told you to say that Honestly, in terms of timing and how much time I have to go through stuff, being a lazy person, I'm also a lazy person. I probably like to click on one thing because, again, you think of clicking on it, it coming up and loading, and then you know, I scrub through it to find some bits of you. That's probably all I'm going to do. I don't want to click on, I don't want to close that window, open another one. I probably just like one. You could have a comedic and a dramatic and I would go to the one I want to go to, but then I wouldn't see any other stuff. So you could take that with a grain of salt. You could assume I'm cool with just saying one. But yeah, I probably am not going to click on more than one.
Speaker 1:So well, that's smart advice too and that always reminds me of with even with video self-tapes. I think most casting directors say they're, if they're hooked within 10 to 15 seconds, like do something in the beginning of your tape that brings people in, they're going to keep watching. And most casting is like I do watch the whole thing or I try, but like those first 15 seconds are super important. I think the same is true for a reel. Right, you don't want to just throw something up because you're on camera you know, and you look nice yeah, sometimes reels start with um 20 seconds of other people.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like I. Who are you? Where are you? Who did I click on? I can't remember who I clicked on. Is this you? And then I'm oh, no, this is the guy I clicked on then you're like oh wait, but I would book that other person I would I like that other person not bad you're real, like you guys are saying.
Speaker 3:I think they should be in clips and the clip should start on you and it should end on you, because guess who the star of the show is and who you're trying to sell is you. If you were talking about time, oh, if they're hooked within the first X amount of seconds, I have seen research that shows that a casting director only has a certain amount of time to really watch what they're trying to see you do, to really watch what they're trying to see you do. So if you have a three-minute reel up and this is a comedy thing you're going in for and all your comedy stuff is at the end of that reel and all your dramatic stuff is first, they may not even get to your comedy stuff. You know, a clip is a nice short, sweet way of matching that clip to what type of role you're auditioning for. I'm auditioning for something dramatic. I'm going to throw up this dramatic clip and they can see me do my magic. You know short clips, short clips.
Speaker 1:Think of the world we live in. Think of even picking a TV show. I mean, I guess that's not true, because Severance is like the number one show and that takes a little bit to get into, if I'm being honest. But anyway, you know.
Speaker 2:In my head. I always think of it. Not that I'm on any of these sites, but are you swiping left, Are you swiping right, and how fast do you make that decision?
Speaker 1:There you go.
Speaker 2:That's a great way to put it, you make a decision and you know that's Instagram.
Speaker 3:YouTube, snapchat. These are all like quick turnaround things. People want to just oh hey, they're auditioning. Great, they've got a comedy clip up here. Let me just watch it real quick. Oh, that was awesome.
Speaker 1:Boom next yeah, people want to make a decision which I think we forget. Like you want to decide what restaurant to go to on Grubhub. You don't want to be like hungrily sitting there for hours deciding, you know. So I think that's an important reminder. I wonder if you both could clear up something on the back end that I've heard rumors of, which is that a lot of these digital casting sites actually, once it goes to casting, if you have media, you're ranked higher, or if you have an agent, you appear higher. Like is there something to how you're appearing to casting in the submissions or is that just the rumor mill? Like is there an algorithm there? Jason, maybe you could. On casting, networks.
Speaker 3:You bring up something very interesting On casting networks. The casting director has they can timestamp it and see who came in first. They can alphabetize it or they can have it in random order. We don't want to give anyone a leg up because they've spent more money than someone else, and I don't believe in that. I want it to be random. Hey, if I submitted myself five minutes ago and someone else submitted an hour ago, they could come before me. It doesn't matter, it's all random. I don't want to be stuck somewhere because I couldn't afford to put up a reel. That's not fair.
Speaker 1:No, that's nice to know. I'm glad it's a little bit more fair in that regard, because we hear things as actors and you don't know until you're on the other side. So it's interesting because then you feel like you got to keep doling out money and the joke is kind of like actors really, for the most part, don't have the money to keep doing this stuff. So it's nice to know that that's taken into account. I also wonder, as far as, like coming up in searches, we touched on special skills. But how important would you say they are when you're filtering Virginia? I guess it's project to project depending on the union and all these things. But yeah, how important would you say special skills are? Because I think we sleep on them in the PDF version, but we can do a lot more on Casting Networks which is great.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the Casting Network networks skills section that is searchable is what we would use. Um, sometimes if an agent's doing the submission and I've asked for like just people who are, you know, wrestlers or dancers or whatever it is, if, if, hopefully, they've given me a submission, note like this person's been a wrestler for 20 years and I'm like cool, great.
Speaker 1:No.
Speaker 2:I don't need to see any more. I trust you. Or, or I'll go, like I said, I'll go to their resume and see if there's a skill on there. But if I'm doing the search myself, I'm just doing the search. I can't search your PDF resumes. I can only search what you have on casting networks.
Speaker 2:So if, then, that applies to anything like languages, um, sports, anything you know like, whatever I need uh is heights, even like heights and weights, like I can only search what you have on casting networks, so I have to type in the, the, the search field and I have to type in if I want you, if I need you to be like an expert level, or just like a intermediate level, or whatever, um, if I get too many results, maybe I'll narrow it to expert level, uh, you know.
Speaker 2:So those are the things that I need, um to search for something, and it is, you know, it happens, you know not. It's not rare that I need to search on stuff like that, but sometimes a client will just come to me and like Virginia, uh, what's the Chicago market like for, uh, samurai wrestlers? And I'll be like cool, brah, hold on one second. And I'll go to casting networks and I'll be like don't come here. Nobody has that. Go to another market. It's not going to be Chicago or whatever. So if you have it, it's got to be searchable so that A we can get the jobs and then B I can find you.
Speaker 3:There's a couple of things I want to say about special skills and resumes. There's something that you can do on casting networks that you can't do on other sites that I'm aware of. The first thing is, if I've done an episode of it's Always Sunny in Philadelphia and I have a clip of that, I can attach that clip directly to my resume. Only if I type my resume in and I can take that clip, attach it to the resume.
Speaker 3:If Virginia's looking at my resume on Casting Networks because my agent submitted me she could see on the resume, oh, it says it's Always Sunny in Philadelphia, and then there'll be a play button next to it and she can actually click the play button and watch my clip from it. You can do the same thing in skills. If I put down that I'm an expert in yoga, I can do a quick clip of me doing some yoga moves and attach that clip to my special skills area. And then, if Virginia's looking that up oh hey, we need a yoga expert. Oh, jason, it says he's an expert. He's got a clip here. I can click on the clip and watch him do some stuff.
Speaker 1:So, you have that ability, which is really great. Yeah, I'm going to call my mom and get my home video from when I was the wise man. I think I was wise man number three in preschool, in the nativity and, fun fact, I actually only got it because I was the only one that could say frankincense, because my dad's name was Frank. So that's how casting works. So anyway, okay, frank is my middle name. Oh, jft, I love it. I got an F middle name too RFB. What about you?
Speaker 1:Do you have a middle name, virginia, I do. It's not any of your business. Get out of here.
Speaker 2:Let's go. It's not, frank, I'm sorry.
Speaker 1:Okay, now I'm scared. Jason, speaking of being searchable, do you have any tips you can give our listeners for how they can actually appear in more searches? As far as how tags and filters work, on the back end We've kind of covered it a bit, but is there anything else you'd like to add?
Speaker 3:I think it's just a matter of being thorough and really filling everything out and using what you had talked. Virginia talked about this a little bit. If I play piano and I'm a beginner or intermediate or an expert, I need to rank the things on how well I do them and only write expert if you are an expert. But everything that you add, even things that you don't think about, add an asset. Oh, I have a GMC Sierra truck. I'm going to put that down as an asset. I own an animal. This is the type of animal it is when you have more things you have on your resume that are honestly things you do, can do, or you have the more you're going to come up in searches.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I will say my cats own me. I don't think I own them, but that's definitely happened. Thank you, that's true.
Speaker 2:They're just okay with you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, honestly, especially even like featured background work, you know when you're starting out too and people make a living that way. You can book that because you have a specific car like they want your car and they want you there. So it is super important to add these assets, like you're saying. I think people sleep on that sometimes and I'm wondering if there's other sections you both think people kind of sleep on a bit. As far as on the casting profiles Across the board, do you wish actors paid a bit more attention to a certain section of their profile?
Speaker 2:Personally, I think they could be better about current sizes. That's probably my biggest issue, uh, with searchable stuff. I I can't even send size cards to to producers, basically because they're either not all filled out or there's some things missing or they're old. So I have to always every job kind of get um current sizes from actors and just send our own kind of size sheets to them. So current sizes all filled out would be fantastic because those are pretty size cards. When I can send them, yeah, that's nice and they're searchable, like I need. Like sometimes you can't be 6'5 and stand next to this car because you'll make the car look small, so I search that stuff out.
Speaker 1:sometimes it happens, yeah and that's nice too, because it reminds you it's not personal. Sometimes if you're not cast, it's like you're just too tall for the car.
Speaker 2:You're too tall, you can't make the car look small.
Speaker 3:Every four to six months? Why don't you take a look at your profile on casting networks or wherever and say is this current? Are my sizes current? Is my resume current? How current is everything?
Speaker 1:Am I helping myself? Yeah, get work, that's a great idea. I'm gonna, when we hang up, I'm gonna set a reminder in my phone for that, a recurring six month reminder. I think everybody should do that, because then your agent won't hunt you down and you won't get into trouble and suddenly being a callback whether, like play the tuba, it's on your resume and you're like well, I haven't played that since preschool, if you're, and you whip If you're a woman and you're pregnant and that is something that you have going on for months and there are a lot of times, a lot of real people casting.
Speaker 3:in a real castings. Right now you might get booked on something because they're looking for someone who is pregnant right now. So if you have that, you might want to update your resume because they may need that. Yeah that's really smart Is that something you can search on.
Speaker 2:I had no idea. That's amazing you can list it.
Speaker 3:You can certainly list it on your resume area.
Speaker 2:If we could search on that, Jason, that'd be super cool. Oh, but I don't know, Like I don't they keep it up to date.
Speaker 1:That's interesting. I'm wondering too, like I wanted to ask you both, about features you think are going might change. But, jason, are there any features that maybe we don't know about that you think actors also aren't taking advantage of the resume? One you gave was great Playing a credit. That's pretty genius Stuff, that's upcoming for actors.
Speaker 3:I'm not thinking, oh, one thing that we okay, this is a good one, we just came out with this. Okay, okay, this is a good one and we just we just came out with this. Okay, if you have a premium membership, you can list your social media, your social stuff. So if, if you're on instagram, robert, and you have 500 000 followers, that will show up it's about 7, it's not 500, but I did just connect it yesterday. And I'm grateful for all 7,000. Same thing.
Speaker 1:There's no difference between 7,000 and 500,000. My mom created 7,000 profiles.
Speaker 3:Okay, sorry, keep going so you can put your social media handles. The first one we have is Instagram and we're working on other ones. So below the actor's picture it'll say Instagram and the amount of followers you have, and if you self-submit or your agent submits you, the casting director can see that, and that's important these days. I talked to a casting director one time who said, yeah, when we get down to two to four people, we at that point and this was theatrically they will look at your social media.
Speaker 1:Would you say that's true for you, virginia, too? I feel like I've been seeing actually coming in on the commercial front a lot of social media ad castings or you know the want people that are active on social and content creators of that sort.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:But do you feel like to across the board? It just could give you a leg up. Yes, another.
Speaker 2:It can, it could give you a leg up, yes, another it can, it can give you like ever could also be a bad thing sometimes. You know, sometimes you know, I I see it a lot, you know, for, like, stand-up comedians and performers of that nature, where they they have great, like, their stuff is funny, they're all over instagram or tiktok or whatever, and you know a brand. If they're up for an audition, they're up because they're really funny instagram or tiktok or whatever. And you know a brand. If they're up for an audition, they're up because they're really funny people and they do great at improv. And that's the type of person you want and you can go and see their stuff and see it online and and usually people these days are kind of fine with whatever people have up I would say sometimes you can have up stuff that's maybe not good for the brand and that could be a detriment.
Speaker 2:Sometimes I've seen that happen. Uh, yeah, so I, you know it's whatever you want to put up on there, it's out there, it's in the world, as long as it's doing what you want it to do for you, then live your life and do it, you know be intentional, but like just know that you might not be the next spokesperson for like the United States post office or something you know, like that might be looking for something certain people Dream job unlocked.
Speaker 1:Your brand is you.
Speaker 2:Do your thing. Yeah agreed, do your thing.
Speaker 1:I love that. That's very motivational.
Speaker 3:Your brand is not usually your political views, your religious views.
Speaker 3:I always suggest to actors, if you're going to put up your whatever social link, you might want to have a Facebook page that's dedicated or an Instagram page that's dedicated to the business and then have your personal one where you can talk about other things. I have seen a casting director say oh well, yeah, we looked into this guy and the crazy stuff that they had up on their Facebook page made us feel like we couldn't hire them. Their political views and all this craziness they were talking. It just it rubbed us the wrong way and we were out. So always have a separate one that's business oriented and you're not talking about a bunch of personal stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's smart, and I think too, I've, like over the years, thought of it as almost a digital business card in an authentic way, and then recently I've begun to think of it as you still want it to be authentic to you. So sprinkling in personal things, I think, is also nice, because then they can go there and see OK, this person isn't just trying to get a job, they're actually, you know, out with their family, whatever it is. I think showing the human in you is also nice, because we like humans. We like humans, yeah, and we love casting profiles, and I think this has been extremely helpful. I would love, before we go to play a surprise game it's called Casting Keywords, da-da-da-da-da-da Insert little theme song here that I'm going to record after this. It's a little bit of a flash round and so I'm going to throw out some statements or topics around. Well, we're keeping it specific to casting profiles-ish today and you, both of you, whoever buzzes in first? Maybe? I've never done it with two people. It's kind of fun.
Speaker 3:That's nice, here we go.
Speaker 1:Oh, here we go, let's roll Right. You both just say the first piece of advice for actors, like a tangible tip that comes into your head. It's kind of like word association, but it'll be like a piece of advice. So like a sentence or two. Are you ready?
Speaker 3:yeah I'm gonna let virginia go first and then I'm gonna say mine, or would you? Would you rather have me do it the other way?
Speaker 2:cheating, and I don't know that I want it any that way, for sure well, what?
Speaker 1:what if we do? Should we do a fake buzzer? What do you feel comfortable with?
Speaker 2:I mean, I think we'll just our faces will light up.
Speaker 1:Why don't I alternate? I'm going to alternate between you and then, if you feel passionate, that you want to add something in, just do it. Okay, because we all know I probably will do it too. Okay, so, virginia, we'll start with you. The first one is self-tapes, just your overall tip this is not going to be fast.
Speaker 2:There's so much self-tapes.
Speaker 1:Read the directions. What's the number one? Tip Read the directions. Oh, that's a good one, because I think that probably makes all the difference in miscasting a little bit. If you're not reading them.
Speaker 2:If you read and do the directions, you can't really miss.
Speaker 1:Same with file names, right? Isn't that super important?
Speaker 2:Yeah, you should probably, but the way casting networks puts them up, for me I don't care.
Speaker 1:It's okay, Jason. Did you want to add in there as?
Speaker 3:I start listening to Little Mermaid. I would say if you're going to do them, do them. And I would say if you're going to do them, do them and do it by the deadline. If you're not going to do it, tell a casting director that you declined the audition and let them know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because that's probably annoying if someone confirms and then they don't do it, or they don't confirm at all and they just sit there pending and I'm like, are you coming to this party or not? Are you serious?
Speaker 1:Well, speaking of that party submission notes, we touched on it a bit Short and sweet. She looks like she wants to add something.
Speaker 2:I don't get a whole lot of submission notes, to be honest. Only when I beg for them do some agents give me submission notes, so I love them. I love a submission note. It's got to be relevant, obviously. But I love a submission note. It's got to be relevant, obviously, but I love a submission note. That's relevant.
Speaker 1:Okay, that's good to know. Training section we didn't really talk about education. Let's start with JT, because he's got a man like a statuesque pose.
Speaker 3:I wanted people to know. I think it's important. I wanted people to know that I had a theater background. I went to depaul theater school. I went to columbia theater school, uh, and that was important to me. So I would put things like that or if you've had training with, you know, private acting classes with denzel washington, you might want to put that.
Speaker 2:It could help oh, he'd be all over my resume if I did it. He'd be like I met denzel eight times. Right command f denzel um. He's back on broadway.
Speaker 1:Now, too, my grandma, command f, my grandma once was walking in new york and she saw him leaving at the stage door. She didn't see the show, but my grandma's just like the best, most magical person and went up to him and I got a call and I just hear this muffled voice going college first. And I was like that was and went up to him and I got a call and I just hear this muffled voice going college first and I was like that was. And then they hung up and I was like that was weird and my grandma had literally called me. Put it up to denzel washington. It was like my grandson's an actor, what's your advice?
Speaker 2:and that that's what his advice was that is adorable education first yeah, education, yeah, well, I mean I want to know if you've taken some improv training. I mean that's a big thing in Chicago If you've got the improv, the sketch, any of that stuff, great On camera experience Training is always good. Well, you said.
Speaker 1:Chicago. So I'm going to say location that was the next keyword here Because I think we live in an age where it's almost like you can work as a local even though you're not a local like a lot of people are kind of fudging it, you can. What are your thoughts?
Speaker 2:you can as long as you mean it, because you can't say like, oh yeah, I'm on a first, I can be on a first refusal or hold for the wardrobe date and the shoot date and then realize later that like the wardrobe was this week and then the shoot was this week and like I'm supposed to stay in chicago that whole time, I'm not going to be there for the wardrobe. Then like you gotta like really commit to being a local if you're gonna say it.
Speaker 1:So yeah, yeah and for things to change too, like like you have to be there in case the appointment times change and all that yeah go where the business is, if and and the business that you want to do.
Speaker 3:if you want to be an actor on Broadway, why would you move to LA? You're not going to get a lot of Broadway shows in LA, so go where the business is and where the business is that you want to get into.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and make it worth it for you to be intentional, because I know I booked a role in a film and then it turned out to have to be a local, but it was worth it. Enough for me to say, okay, if I buy a hotel, I'll kind of eat the money, but it's worth it to have the credit, you know. So I think it has to just be a personal decision. Oh, the next one that we have? Wait, what is the next one that we have here? Okay, resume categories, like I think we've covered. I know this is a very rudimentary basic thing, but for people starting out, what categories do you like to see?
Speaker 2:I guess it's based off of the work you've done um, yes, I personally don't need to see like any extra work that you've done. I'm not looking for that, I don't care. Anyone can be an extra to me in my mind, like, if you look like the part, if you look like the person who can be the extra, then I'm usually basing extra decisions off of photos, uh, as in terms of like on camera, principal type stuff. That's that's what I like to see on a resume, like you know any. You know any type of stuff that makes me feel like you're legit and you've been on set.
Speaker 2:You know, so the bigger stuff.
Speaker 1:You have put that stuff to the top yeah, I'm glad you said that, because I think some people do add a lot of extra work and then maybe they try and fudge it and pretend it was maybe a co-star or something, and I think it's just important to learn that early on that you shouldn't really do that yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:So popped in my head film, tv, theater, commercial, education if, for some reason, commercial list available upon request. That could be very, very simple. Uh, definitely put stuff that matters. When I was a young actor in chic, which is where I was born and raised, my theater was first on top. That was the most important to me. When I moved to LA, theater went down, film and TV went to the top, because that's what's most important there. So you can switch things around, but those are the main categories.
Speaker 1:I love that. And one more little category here as we end this game Boop boop, be-choo, coo-coo-coo-choo. I don't know what that means. Boop boop, be-doo. I just saw Boop the Musical. That's my one, boop be-doo. It was really fun. So breakdowns.
Speaker 2:The breakdown to me. I don't know if there's the business section to it and there's the role section to it, like role descriptions. So obviously, as an actor, you need to know about the business stuff of things. You need to know what you're agreeing to, what terms you're agreeing to. Conflicts it's holding, how long is it running? Do I have anything conflicting with this currently running? So you have to be aware of the business side a little bit. Hopefully your agent is also, you know, looking out for you, but they rep a lot of people too. So you have to do your job and know your business. Plus, you get on set. If you see a contract that doesn't match what you thought this was, then you you shouldn't be signing that and you should be talking to your agent before you sign anything.
Speaker 2:But, like the role breakdown, like the character description, some of that stuff is very helpful. Some of that stuff is like, take it with a grain of salt. Um, some of that stuff is written for us and we get it as casting directors and we put it out because it's very clear. It's here's, here's the character. It's super helpful. Sometimes we're like making up stuff to help you out. Sometimes it's not very helpful, um. So understand that. You know here's. Here's what we think the role is. But we've picked you, so do your thing. Yeah, you might not fit this, but if I put you on it there's a reason for it. So, yeah, read the breakdown. Read that. You know there's sometimes there's helpful stuff in there. Um, but understand the business end and the creative side of it and then get that script in your hands and sometimes you can, yeah, show casting.
Speaker 2:And the producers, maybe what they didn't know that they wanted yeah, you know there's so many stories those things are written a long time ago in the process yeah and things evolve and you know they don't see it. Until they see it, you know they work you in the room or they see you do something on a self-tape and it's like, oh yeah, that feels right, and sometimes they're really clearly written and it's like I know who this is. I don't even have to audition anybody. I know who's going to book this based on this super clear description.
Speaker 3:Nice there's a reason why a casting director is doing that, and it's because if they put out a project where the character description is I need someone who can breathe in and out Great, that's just about anyone and everyone, but they have to be specific.
Speaker 2:Not with the allergies these days, jason, I know Only when I take Claritin I've got the asthma.
Speaker 1:Oh, born with it. Maybe he's born with it. Maybe it's asthma, maybe it's asthma.
Speaker 3:The writer wrote a specific role and the casting director is trying to find someone who fits it. If you have an agent, they're submitting you hopefully on the right stuff, because your agent knows who you are and what you can do. And if you're self-submitting, then be honest with yourself. Like Virginia said, read the character description. Hey, I can do this or I can't do this. I know that every actor thinks they can play from two to 92 years old, anything. I can do it all. I'm versatile. But you really have to know who you are and what you can and can't do.
Speaker 1:Oh, I love that. I think it's important too because you want to be happy as a person. You know, I'm preparing for an upcoming interview where this person in an interview said that their agent was leading them one way and telling them not to take certain roles and so the roles they were going on they weren't passionate about and they weren't booking and then they just had nothing. So it's like, kind of think about what you want. You can self-advocate in this business, even within your own quote, unquote. You know, team, it's okay and I think that's a great piece of advice to end on. But we always end with a got and a give.
Speaker 1:So the best piece of advice you've gotten in this industry and the best piece you have to give and because I have two of you and I know it's sort of like a big thing, I'm going to split it up. So let's say, jason, you do the gotten, since your, your acting career is behind you, but you're still knowledgeable in that sense. And Virginia, I'll give you a little bit of time to think of the best piece you have to give. Just and it you know it can change. This is just what it is for this little recorded time capsule with this Muppet over here, but you know it'll be helpful, I think either way.
Speaker 3:When I was a young actor in Chicago, I had reached this point. My agent was Harice Davidson phenomenal company, phenomenal woman and I was working my butt off. I mean it was crazy how much I was booking and I wanted to go to LA. I was ready to go and she said, jason, don't go, I don't think you're ready, I don't think the time is right, don't go yet. And I went anyway, and look at me now. So I wish I had taken her advice and not gone. Maybe my career would have ended up somewhere else.
Speaker 1:Well, maybe it wouldn't be on this podcast, and we're grateful you're here.
Speaker 1:And this is magical, I'm so happy to be here, but I know what you mean. It's important to kind of trust your gut, but also really keep asking yourself why. And sometimes when you look deeper you're like, no, maybe I'm just going because I just want it now, but I know I'm not ready in the back of my head. And I think that's important to assess for all of us, because if you're not ready and you're given the opportunity, you might not get it because it's just you know it's not your time, but you're not ready to kind of step up to that plate. You don't have the bat. How many more metaphors can I put in here, virginia? I don't know, but maybe you'll give us a metaphor with the best piece of advice you have to give.
Speaker 2:I don't, you know. There's so much you can say, and some people are beginning actors know it's not you. You know most of the time if you don't book something, it's not you. If you do your best, you know I work in a commercial kind of industry where it's a lot of marketing, so a lot of people have to make decisions about you and agree on you and you have to check some boxes sometimes. So I would say you know the job is auditioning, the acting job is the auditions. If you book things, that's fucking great. Like can I say that Is that cool, that's fucking great. If you book stuff.
Speaker 2:But the job is auditioning. So you just go to auditions. I don't know how actors do it. They're so focused and um, like on top of their stuff, going to multiple auditions a day or a week, like that's amazing to me. So, um, being focused and like doing the job of auditions, that's the key and you do. You know, like be open to all kinds of stuff.
Speaker 2:You know some people will tell me like I don't want to do industrials and it's like I just want you to make a living as an actor. Industrials pay a lot of people's bills and I have done some industrials lately. I've done are the funniest scripted material I have ever done. Like I've seen some really funny stuff in industrial. So like not everything is dry and not everything is maybe your cup of tea, but like don't be closed off to doing anything. You think your agent wants to hear that you don't want to do something. Like they just want you to like do everything that they can submit you on. So if it's fun still for you, do the thing. If you don't like auditioning, if that's not doing it for you, if it's only about booking, then like I don't know if that's the right way to take this job.
Speaker 1:I think that's phenomenal advice because it also puts the emphasis on the fun and I've been reminded to over the years, even if you don't think you're going to get something, which you know. First of all, yeah, second of all, it's another chance to be seen and make a connection with a fellow human who happens to be in casting that wanted to see you yeah so it's like it's another chance.
Speaker 1:It's a chance that maybe actors are paying for. Now, in all these workshops, you know why not just do it and have fun with it and, honestly, usually those are the ones you book, the ones you don't even care about.
Speaker 2:And you just kind of are like if you just do it for you and me, like if we just have a good time, I'll get you on another job that's going to book you. Yeah, you know you'll be a bridesmaid for a few jobs, but we'll get you a job and you'll get married.
Speaker 1:Okay, throw me the flowers, virginia. I love that metaphor. That was a. That was a worthy metaphor of Paul Feig, of Melissa McCarthy, kristen Wiig and all those bridesmaids out there.
Speaker 3:Robert, you're an actor. You're an actor. You know what it's like. Thank you, jason. You will go into an audition and you will come out of there going, oh my God, that was the worst audition I ever had and you'll book it. And then you'll go to another audition and say oh my God, that was the best audition I ever had and you don't get it. You just never know.
Speaker 1:You really never know. So you just got to enjoy the journey and have fun. That's. That's the hardest part, is thinking you're going to be happy once you get that dream job. But really the dream job is what you said, virginia, it's it's just auditioning, it's doing this, it's being called in, it's making friends, you know, and hopefully enjoying your life. And I've enjoyed this time with the both of you. I know I got to let you go, but to have a little transition here, I just want to say I'm so grateful for your time. I'm grateful for all you do for actors and I know, on behalf of everyone listening, that this is going to help so many people. So, and that's what this is all about, I really appreciate it and I just hope you both continue to shine in your own regards.
Speaker 2:Oh, you too, Rob. This was so nice. Thanks for having us. I appreciate it.
Speaker 1:Thank you.
Speaker 2:Beautiful thing.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much, love you. I'll probably cut that out too. Okay, I love you. Bye, I'm sorry.
