Crystal Skull

This is Stargate SG1 For the First Time! From the creators of Babylon 5 For the First Time, Jeff Akin is watching this iconic show for the first time while Brent Allen, who has seen it at least 47 times, is watching for the first time for those sci-fi messages that hold a mirror up to society or show us how to be better human beings.

Crystal Skull - Season 3, Episode 21

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Transcript

[0:00] Music.

[0:14] Welcome to Stargate SG-1 for the first time. Still not a Star Trek podcast. My name is Jeff Akin, and I'm watching Stargate SG-1 for the first time. And I'm Brent Allen, and I'm watching Stargate SG-1 for the 47th time. But for the first time, I am looking for what Stargate is trying to teach us. Delivering those good sci-fi messages. You know, those ones that give us hope that things can be better in the future. Maybe they hold up a mirror to society and show us just how ugly we are. Or perhaps, how about here's how to be good human beings to one another. Speaking of human beings, we're going to get a look inside of one, I think, in this 21st episode of the third season, Crystal Skull. Because I think we're going to see a human crystal skull. My prediction was that it's going to have some message, maybe have some frequencies or something that disrupt things and they got to get to it. It'll have some big meaningful message for our SG-1 crew. Do you, Brent, have any meaningful, fun messages for us? Pre-sci-fi messages, just episode messages about this one. Oh, I've got a few. A nice little couple heads up. Yeah, 21st episode, penultimate episode of the season.

[1:26] Original air date, March 8, 2000, on Showtime, a few days earlier, over in England. Or the UK, I should say, not just England. The teleplay here credit goes to show creator Brad Wright. However, the story credit goes to two guys, Jared Paul, poor guy with two first names, and Michael Greenberg. Now, this trio of Brad Wright, Jared Paul, and Michael Greenberg have worked together before. They brought us the episode Message in a Bottle. Jeff, you remember that's the one with the little sphere alien device that shot out little rods from all over the place, caught O'Neal in the arm, that one.

[2:02] Well, let's talk about Michael Greenberg first. You already know about Brad Wright. Michael Greenberg's been around for a while. He's more than just a story guy on a couple of episodes. He's actually been one of the show's producers since Children of the Gods on every single episode. Started in season one being credited as a co-executive producer, elevated to just the role of executive producer starting in season two. I'm not really sure why one's better than the other, but there you go. And he's going to maintain that role through the end of season eight. Wow. Now, the reason he gets that credit is because he co-owns a production company with Richard Dean Anderson called Gecko Productions, which if you watch the show, it's one of the nameplates that comes up at the beginning and end of every episode. Okay. So that's Michael Greenberg. Now, Jared Paul. On the other hand, not an executive producer, not a director, seems to just be a friend, a friend that hangs around and they've done a few things together.

[3:01] Anyway, that's the trio of how this is written. Jeff, I will tell you when we get to that spot, which understandably is going to have to happen after we watch the episode today, there is a rather lengthy God check coming up for this episode. Oh, okay. Like the God from the episode sort of a thing. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. yeah when we do like our god goddess check like this this one will be lengthy and i think it's fun we're gonna dive into it i think it's gonna be a whole lot of fun so cool that'd be that'd be awesome well jeff uh with that being said then let's waste no more time why don't we jump into this episode what do you say let's do it all right well hey listen if you're joining us for the very first time because you know every episode is somebody's first time welcome you're amazing you're awesome the way this works is jeff and i are gonna go watch the episode right now if you're You're hanging out with us here on YouTube. Just stick around. You're going to catch our reaction. We're going to do a full-on reaction video to this. If you want the full, unedited version of this reaction, head over to our Patreon page at patreon.com slash... Bye, nerds! If you're listening to us on a podcasting app, we're about to meet you on the other side. You're going to gate into the future, where I'm going to share my first-time reactions, Brent is going to share the sci-fi messages he found, and a pretty exciting God-Goddess moment, God-Goddess check. deck. We're going to get all that here in just a moment as we gaze into a crystal skull.

[4:24] Music.

[4:43] All right jeff we have just watched crystal skull for the first time you my friend get to take us through your first time watch your first journey uh but perhaps not your first journey with crystal skulls in general you seem to be pretty familiar with the uh the the name that he threw there at the end, Quetzalcoatl and all that sort of stuff. Talk to us about your journey through Crystal Skull. But yeah, I totally recognize Quetzalcoatl, the name. I know here momentarily you'll do the God breakdown on his history, but I, gosh, many, many years ago, actually a little bit before the release of this episode, I was a professional musician. I was in a band, and I toured through Mexico quite a bit and spent a good chunk of time in different parts of old Mayan and Aztec bits of the country and got to tour a lot of places. I actually got to climb on some of the ruins that are no longer, they won't let people climb on anymore because we're humans and we're sloppy and we ruin things.

[5:52] We ruin ruins. We kind of do, but it's like Chichen Itza and some of the other pyramids I got to climb up, which was pretty cool but learned a lot about quetzalcoatl and some of the other gods so i'm excited for your your breakdown and really what a cool just a cool idea so i what was neat in this episode for me was frankly it was the writing in it like this was just a really well constructed episode throughout so daniel's phased out or whatever and he's following everybody around And he keeps having these almost faux conversations with people. Like somebody will say something and he'll respond or he'll say a thing. And the way they craft their response, it's almost like.

[6:35] They're they're talking right and then at times they intersect to a point where they're like hey do i feel do you feel that is there somebody here but that was it was neat because i made a note that it was so natural with him and his grandpa just in different points throughout that his grandpa would say something daniel would respond and then his grandpa would respond again but the way they did the cadence and the timing tried to make it feel like it was just coincidence but But it turns out it wasn't because his grandpa knew all along that he was there. During the watch, you talked about there's supposed to be a big reaction at the moment. You knew that his grandpa, that Nick, could hear him. And, yeah, that was a big reveal. But, again, I think because this episode was written as well as it was.

[7:24] I knew. It was just a – oh, yeah, of course. Of course he can see him. That makes all of this make sense. It just fell into place. But i also just love the way it's stacked uh it's stacked the story on top of it so when nick the grandpa's talking about going there he talks about these giant aliens that showed up and the giant aliens saying that the enemy of my enemy is my friend so that's the question right the questions are how did nick get there which was never really answered and that's okay you don't have to answer all the questions and what does that mean the enemy of my enemy is my friend and so i was trying to piece that together well it's got to be the gould but it was in 71 so like humans towery aren't enemies at this point they're not even aware but it all came together at the end when tilk didn't phase out because of junior in there it's like ah so if you can phase if you can see quetzalcoatl then you're not gould and if what we've learned pretty clearly through all this is if you're not gould you're an enemy of the ghouls that's super fun super fun episode i'm I'm not sure what Quetzalcoatl is.

[8:31] I'm sure we might find out again in the future, some sort of a thing. It's a neat mystery. He showed up. I was like, oh, it's Jason Ironheart, which is a big first season Babylon 5 throwback. Right, right, right. So there are a lot of unanswered questions in this one that if this were an episode that took place 10 years prior and came out, awesome. Don't need any of these questions answered. It's just kind of this sci-fi-ish thing with some mythology and interesting and cool.

[8:58] But what we know about Stargate, while it's not serialized, there are pieces that are dropped for reasons or not necessarily for a reason but become a reason later on. And I think this is beautifully set up that, hey, this could literally never come up again. And we just know that Daniel has a long family history of science and discovery and archaeology and these things. And people who are not just a family history of it but also a family history of people that –.

[9:27] Like excommunicated from their peer groups or whatever yeah from their peers and from society yeah yeah they're they're the weird ones they're very othered in uh everywhere in what they do also, they're right there might be something to that right we other the people who are saying the things that aren't popular but are actually actually right but yeah so i i have a feeling like again if this never gets touched on again cool great story interesting but there's a lot lot here that can get picked up on again and really interested to see when and if it does enjoyable episode we need to before we get to the god breakdown and the sci-fi messages we need to update our tracking board yeah i say we count the death you think so i do okay because i mean the whole thing has been does michael shanks to have a death scene or a supposed death scene and you You know, I think what we saw was we saw him get knocked out. We saw him get knocked backwards. And it was supposed to be a question mark. But even Daniel at one point goes, am I dead? And so, yeah. Yeah. And they were kind of getting ready.

[10:37] We've seen it before. We're going to go back and we're going to get him. Well, I don't know if we can go back and get him. It's too much radiation. He's probably already gone and stuff. And so I think we should count it. I like, you know, it's been a while since we've gotten to count one. So I'm going to count one. That's going to bring us up to seven Daniel deaths. seven daniel deaths through three seasons so it's wild there you go i'm curious though when someone dies in aztec culture or mayan culture because that's another thing too quetzalcoatl i don't feel you'll get here but technically it's an aztec god but a lot of the central american mesoamerican religions actually by the same name have a quetzalcoatl in there so uh i'm curious why don't you lay some knowledge on us well let's talk about that with our our god goddess check Quetzalcoatl, I will probably mispronounce that name numerous times, not through any trying to be rude or anything. It's just, it's a weird name for my tongue to say.

[11:29] Quetzalcoatl, he's one of the main deities of the Aztecs. Now, for people that are remotely familiar with the Mesoamerican major empires, you had the Incas, which were way down in Peru many, many years earlier. Then you had the Mayans, which really were prominent in the hundreds up through about like 900 shortly before 1000 A.D., although they do date back to about 2000 B.C. So they go back pretty far, but their main empire really was about 280 to 980. And then the Aztecs actually really short, short time, like 1300 to 1500, somewhere around there. Really, really short. I don't even think it was that long. I don't know that it spanned a hundred years, all of that being said, he really was codified during the, the Aztecs, the final time he is often presented as the God of the wind and the sun he is associated with several planets. He is the protector of merchants, crafts, knowledge, and learning. He is often represented as a feathered serpent, and that's very, very important to the Quetzalcoatl mythos. He is thought of as the wisest of all men, and he was so important that he was one of the creator deities. And what makes him the most important here is, in this case, he created mankind.

[12:52] Now, he actually has his roots, as Jeff pointed out just a second ago, as one of the major gods of the Mayans, although it is unknown if he was known as Quetzalcoatl back then, at least as far as I could tell. There may be somebody out there that knows more than I do, but that's kind of what we always just say. That's who he is. However, he was so popular and so powerful in ancient Mesoamerican culture that after the fall of the Mayans in 900, the cult of the feathered serpent arose and had lots of little pockets all over the place and survived all the way to the time when the Aztecs would take over and they would re-deify him and bring him out of cult status back into major religion status.

[13:40] Given the name, build the temples and all that sort of stuff straight to him, which is kind of neat because you think about it. He's lasted over 1,500 years through multiple cultures, right? Yeah. Now, perhaps a part of that is because part of his realm of protectorate, whatever, as a god, was he also was the god of the priesthood. So, you know, if the priests die off when they go else, they're going to keep their guy going as best they could, right? I will note this, and they did note in the episode that the one pyramid was over a kilometer high. Well, the world's largest pyramid is actually one that is dedicated to Quetzalcoatl. It is larger than the Great Pyramid out in Egypt, Khufu's Great Pyramid, which was a tomb, but out here was actually a temple worship, this pyramid over here in Mesoamerica. I should have looked up to find out exactly how tall it was. I do not believe it was a kilometer tall.

[14:39] Now, some of the mythology surrounding Quetzalcoatl, I found very, very interesting, Jeff, and it may sound a bit familiar to you. I don't know how much of this you know or you're familiar with, but here are some of the things. Quetzalcoatl was a creator being existing from ancient times who was also known as the wisest of all men. Quetzalcoatl, born of a virgin. He is the son of the ultimate creator god. He is the morning star. He is the symbol of the defeater of death and resurrection himself. Well, we'll get to that in just a second, showing that it was his own blood that would bring life to mankind. I just want to note this was not a salvific event. This is not a salvation event. This was just a creative one. But it would be his blood which would provide life to mankind. Kind, there was a point at which, um, he was kind of tricked into doing stuff, but he took, he takes on the guilt and shame of humanity. Um, not substitutionally. It's just like he experiences it and takes on all this guilt and shame, uh, the, the guilt and sin of mankind he takes on and he winds up sacrificing himself by setting himself on fire. Like he's Byron.

[15:55] Sorry. I just, not as lame as the actual Jesus Messiah, not a Byron one, but he does it for the guilt that he, that he feels. And out of the fire, he rises from the ashes like a Phoenix. He resurrects himself. Also, he gave us chocolate. Yeah, he did. He gave us chocolate. Later on, when the Spanish conquistador Hernan Cortes arrived on the shores of Mexico in 1519, the leaders thought him to be Quetzalcoatl reincarnated. However, for those of you who have heard that before, this claim has since been refuted by many historians saying that that was an apocryphal thing that was later added about 50 years after the events themselves that nobody really thought it was Quetzalcoatl. This was just part of their, you know, to the victors who write history and sometimes they fluff it a little bit, right? So anyway, that's Quetzalcoatl. For a guy who appeared and had, what did he have, Jeff? Three minutes of screen time there at the very end and barely spoke. We didn't know anything about him. Just a cool god who, like I said, really lasted through multiple eras and multiple times and multiple cultures and just had a lot of staying power.

[17:14] You know, a lot of very familiar sounding mythology to me. To, I think, to a lot of people, especially in the Western world. Right, right. Which I, this is not the place to have that discussion, but I definitely think it begs a lot of questions about how that works. So a lot of the, a lot of them honestly have been answered. Like I said, so in my experience, I have not a lot of experience, but more experience. And I think a lot of people maybe in the United States and stuff have, but Quetzalcoatl specifically Specifically, it's known in Mayan culture as Kukulkan, or more specifically as Kukulkan. There's some differences, but the mythology is pretty much the same. One of the really cool things that the Yucatan Mayans did in the ruins at Chichen Itza is there's what they call the Red Room. I think it's called the Red Room, and then there's Chichen Itza itself.

[18:02] But things line up to the summer and winter solstice with just astronomic precision. Precision that in the room at the solstice it literally like the light shines through everything and hits a point on the it's a it's just mathematically incredible that it happened but the way that the pyramid chichen itza and what's remarkable or to be noted in the mesoamerican pyramids is they're stepped or steeped or whatever as opposed opposed to the kind of flat that we see on the egyptian pyramids but when the sun comes up i think it's yeah when When it comes down on the summer solstice and up on the winter solstice, Kukulkan, the feathered serpent, appears to climb up and down the stairs. Yeah. So he's here and he's with us. And then he left and he goes back in the winter. And it really is a life and death allegory of come down and provide life as the sun and the harvest. And then I want to leave. Freezes over and everything goes.

[19:02] Um, an interesting thing about the Mayan culture itself, and that ties to some of the mythology around Kukulon and Quetzalcoatl is they just disappeared. Um.

[19:12] Like with the Aztec, there's Aztec or, you know, they were one of the more recent of, of the, uh, the, the, the tribes and the cultures that were there. And it was the Spanish coming to, you know, the start of the colonization conquest.

[19:25] Pick your term there that the ended, ended their reign. But the Mayans, there's no record that they just one day were all mostly gone. On and there's legend myth in that still talked about in those areas that they were in touch with aliens essentially or higher beings or something like that and they came and picked them up they're just like okay you reached you reached everything you can accomplish on this planet now you can come and live with us where we are it's very fascinating stuff it's cool that uh it's cool that they're going there with uh with this especially making quetzalcoatl different than the goa old gods that we've seen i think that's really remarkable i love that you know all that i like like there's so much that i like thinned down because you know but i i love dude you're getting into that man i love that that's all i was so fascinated with it the first time first time i went there was a tourist uh tourist activity you know i went down and we toured the the ruins and i was i was just blown away blown away but i remember i remember when we toured chichen itza and then some of the other ruins like at Tulum and some of the other places, but they have like these sports fields that are set up and there's these little like circles that are vertical.

[20:43] It's like basketball, but vertical. So you got to get it through the hoop instead of down into the hoop. And you're like, oh, so they played ball. They're like, actually, yeah, but they played it with the severed heads of their sacrificial offerings. Offerings a very different culture than what we're accustomed to these days excellent god breakdown brand thank you for that i just want to note you noted uh tilk is getting chubbier uh through his face and stuff and i also just want to point out that and i think these two are are connected like i think if you put them on a graph they're going to plot together at least for the time being um the chubbier tilk's face gets the faster daniel talks really start noticing it okay he's just and and the man must have like full page monologues that he delivers like that like it's crazy all the way through it's so funny and it's all just hopped up on the donuts and he's like yeah yeah anyway messages we're here to talk about messages That's what I'm here for. That's what I'm watching this for. You know, here's the thing. I'm going to take it through the litmus test. Okay, did we hold up a mirror to society here? Not really. I mean, you might.

[22:04] Um, are we talking about hope for things being better in the future? Not really. Are we talking about how to be better human beings? I think we can, I think we can zone in on this particular one, specifically just this concept. Family is family. Be good family to each other. There is a special bond and we see it in this particular episode, a special bond between grandparent and grandchild. Um, and really it is a shame and I know, I know lots of our, our listeners out there have had familial issues or they've had familiar losses, but it, it is a shame when this particular, relationship can get strained for one reason or another, because it, it really, I know from my own self, I, I had a phenomenal relationship with all of my own, with all my grandparents. Parents um and i think you just see that and and i can tell there is something special between my kids and their grandparents that is different from my relationship with my kids you know and and like i want that and i want to encourage that because it's it's just different you know um i'm not going to get into the whole thing about forgiveness but i will tell you i think nick had the perfect apology to Daniel. I mean, it was textbook all the way.

[23:31] And if you guys want to go see a bigger discussion on that, I invite you to go check out our episode on The Very Long Night of London Malari from Season 5 of Babylon 5. Jeff and I really dug into it there. We dug into it on a few other episodes as well, but that one specifically, I think we kind of zoned it in. Encapsulated it well. Yeah, and the last thing I think that this really shows us is children need to hear the words I'm proud of you and it doesn't matter how old they are they also need to hear words like I love you and it doesn't matter how old they are to hear that from your grandparent to hear that from your parent and aunt and uncle an older relative is so important.

[24:14] Is just so important this was a great relationship that had fractured over something stupid and frankly if daniel hadn't gotten lost on abados like they would have had contention but daniel would have still gone back to see him totally it's like no he kicked me out last time you don't want to see me ever again i was like no he absolutely did and you would have gone back to see him you know it's just a shame he couldn't be told where his grandson was for the last two years and just thought he hated them uh so anyway where do we go as far as how do we rate this well that's a hard question it is we're going on a scale of seven chevrons and the question is is how strong is the message right and we usually throw some sort of thing about it was it intentional or was it not i do think there were certainly some intentional things like let's show what daniel's relationship is like with his grandfather and it's a fractured relationship it needs some healing but they're there here's how we think parent grandparent uh relationship should work you know so i i do think there was probably some intentionality there was it the point of the episode though no were we able to pick it up from auxiliary pieces to the episode yeah was it really the thrust of the episode or was this just really the adventure of the crystal skull.

[25:30] Yeah, I think it was just The Adventure of the Crystal Skull. Jeff, I'm going to give this one two chevrons. Two chevrons. Two chevrons. I don't think it was super strong. If you want to stump for more, I'm happy to hear it. I think it was definitely an intention of the writing for it. I was thinking three myself if I was doing it. But I think what really would make me comfortable with that, too, is you can take all that stuff out of this episode, and it makes no impact on the episode itself. You can just be like, oh, yeah, my grandpa and I had a strained relationship, and now we're here. Well, here's a question, Jeff. Okay, let's say you do take all that out. How many minutes short is the episode now? Not a lot. One? Ish. I mean, you know, so we go there. Now, here's the fortunate thing. Whether we say two chevrons, three chevrons, 12 chevrons, what really matters is the message, not the number of chevrons. The number of chevrons is just something fun that I'm just sort of assigning to it. But you know what really particularly matters? Now, this one counts more than anything else. It's where this episode gets placed on the 100% completely immutable.

[26:36] Definitive ranking of Season 3 of Stargate SG-1, which, Jeff, my friend, you are the one who gets to place that there. Now, we're here at the end. We've got a whole list of these stinking, freaking episodes. You know what I mean? like they're all here so how do we how do we do this where do we go I am I gonna read the whole list I'm gonna read all 19 entries that we have so far because we had two of them that were combined I'm just gonna go with the top five I don't know where it's gonna land for you Jeff but our current top five number five is pretense four is shades of gray three is fair game two is forever in a day and the first number one the double episode Joel and ours memories and devil you know Jeff where does crystal skull fall into our.

[27:24] Ranking for season three this is a good episode like i said and it was the writing that really separated it from a lot of the other episodes on here this one's going to fall just outside of the top 10 and where i'm looking right now is really ironically is in the neighborhood of legacy right which was another very daniel centric and misunderstood you know sort of a sort of a piece i like that one quite a bit it was our last you know look at michello and or the week that we've had so far and all that was good this one i think planted a lot of seeds that could be done picked up moving forward and again just like i had a lot of really cool stuff in it i am going to.

[28:04] Place this one just above legacy as the new number 12. I i don't i don't fully disagree with that although i do like legacy i think a lot better than what you're putting on here that's brent's personal opinion of it um daniel going crazy is always a fun time to me it's a great episode I will tell you, this is one of those episodes for me is a great, if I just need 45 minutes with Stargate and I want to watch something, this is an episode I throw on. Yeah, a little bit of everything. Yeah. Right? I mean. It's fun. It's not super heavy, but it's not just slapstick comedy either. You know? I enjoy it. It's not ergo. Yeah. I love ergo. It's so good. It's so good. And I'm almost looking at this being like, maybe I swap ergo and legacy. That is ergo. Ergo is the criminally low-rated one that you have here. You're wrong for that one. I just think they're swapping it with Legacy, moving it to 13. Hey, Jeff. Come here. Yeah, what's up, Brian? Come here. Come here. Come here.

[29:05] Really good internet connection it's a high speed stuff man all right jeff well hey listen that's gonna do it for us this week on crystal skull we're all done here next time jeff we've hit it we are at the end this is the final episode which means two-parter time we're doing a two-parter next time we're gonna combine the end of season three into the beginning of season four jeff can Can you believe you're this far into the show? Name of the two episodes, closing out season three with an episode called Nemesis and starting season four with an episode called Small Victories. I'll give you a moment to think those through, but give us a prediction. Just pull something out of the air and let us know. What do you think it might be about? Nemesis and Small Victories. The Nemesis is Apophis, right? So it's going to be an Apophis focused thing. small victories because no matter how many times he dies he's he's he's the daniel jackson of gold dying well you know when you have a sarcophagus you can just sort of pretty much do whatever you want kind of helps a bit that's always gonna be an apophis thing but it's not gonna be the uh.

[30:20] End of that story small victories it's kind of you know in fact i think i think that's gonna be an apophis thing they will suffer some pretty serious losses no main characters dying or anything like that, but maybe part of the Cheyenne Mountain facility is destroyed or something like that. Maybe one of the Stargates or something like that gets taken out. It's some big thing, but they have some small victories that they're able to build from. So this is just really going to ramp up that whole thing.

[30:46] You're a good guesser, Jeff. Sure. You're a good guesser. All right, well, we will see if Jeff is right right here next time on Stargate SG-1 for the first time. Time. Hey, listen, thanks so much for joining us this week. Don't forget, subscribe wherever you get your podcast, wherever you get your YouTube stuff, wherever you get your whatever, however you're consuming this whole thing. Please be sure to subscribe. Leave us a rating and review wherever you are. Hey, if you want more content from what Jeff and I have going on out here, gosh, Jeff, we have so much going on these days. And there are ways you can hang out with Jeff and I, like ways that you can connect with us. You can check that out over on our Patreon page at patreon.com Bye, nerds. And the biggest thing you can do for us, if you like what you're seeing here, or even if you don't like what you're seeing here, the best thing you can do for us is share this show with someone who you know who does love Stargate or somebody who you know who loves to laugh at people who think they like Stargate. Whatever the reason is, just share the show. That's all I'm trying to say. Share the show with somebody that you know who likes Stargate or somebody who, like Jeff over there, needs to get into this series for the first time. So until next time, folks, I'm going to get out of here. My name is Brent. That's Jeff. Hey, Brent. Oh, my gosh. Yes, Jeff. What's up? Oh, my gosh. Me on this. I just I just want to say, man, like, I'm really proud of you. All right, Grandpa.

[32:04] Music.