The Empowered Parent with Dana Baltutis

Unschooling Series with Paige Carter (Parent, Advocate, Community Leader, Business Owner): Week 5 - A Family Weighs CBD For Epilepsy And PDA

• Dana Baltutis • Season 3 • Episode 5

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What happens when you remove the biggest triggers from a child’s day and the seizures stop? We sit down with Paige Carter to unpack a remarkable shift since Oakland left school, the role stress and heat play in absence and atonic seizures, and why the family is cautiously considering CBD oil after exhausting conventional options. From risperidone’s early wins and later costs, to stimulants that sparked agitation, to a thick, red seizure medicine that collided with PDA-driven demand avoidance, this is a grounded look at tailoring care to a child’s nervous system.

We get practical about legal access, quality control, and avoiding THC in paediatric use, and talk through gentle dosing tactics that respect autonomy—tiny drops on bread, full transparency, and slow titration under specialist oversight. Paige shares why a psychiatrist may join the team alongside neurology and paediatrics, and how cause–effect thinking helps Oakland link heat, stress, and seizure risk to asking for support when he needs it. With summer on the way and a year on the road ahead, the family is planning for flexible care while keeping anxiety low and trust high.

inclusiveoak.com.au

danabaltutis.com, mytherapyhouse.com.au, https://mytherapyhouse.com.au/your-childs-therapy-journey/ https://www.danabaltutis.com/services

SPEAKER_01:

Hi everyone, and welcome to week five of Paige Carter's from Inclusive Oak Unschooling series. Paige Carter is a parent, advocate, champion, amazing mum of two children with PDA, one of whom is not attending school this term, and we're following her journey with Oakland. And I'm a speech pathologist who geeks out on PDA. And why I say that is because Paige and I were just having a chat before we started this podcast, and we started talking everything about PDA. And I said, let's stop and let's start talking on the podcast. Welcome, Paige Carter. Thank you so much for having me again. So, Paige, I want to know. Week five coming into oh, it's mid-November. The Christmas pageant has just been. So Christmas season is starting. How are you guys faring?

SPEAKER_02:

We're okay. This week has just been a bit boring, really. Oakland is really just like plainest iPad, plain's PlayStation, just really just wanting to chill out. Nothing much has changed here, but we're good. We're just preparing for our trip. It's all getting very close and just yeah, just taking day by day. Have you packed the house yet or where are you at with that? Uh yep. So we've gone through like all of the cupboards and everything. Everything left out is either stuff that we really need or it's going in our caravan. So it's just like really like the big furniture, like TVs and stuff like that we need left. So yeah, it we're we're if we had to, we could pack up and be gone within a couple of days.

SPEAKER_01:

And where are you going to be putting your furniture? Are you going to be putting it in storage or just leaving it in the house?

SPEAKER_02:

No, so we have a big shed on our property, so we are not including the shed in the rental and we're storing it in there.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, okay. So can do you think that Oakland sees a difference in his environment?

SPEAKER_02:

Not so much yet, not hugely, because all the things that he uses and he finds comfort in it are all still there.

unknown:

Right.

SPEAKER_02:

But he will also come this time next week. So next weekend's the big weekend when we start moving the bigger stuff, and then he'll he will start to get a little bit upset by it, I think maybe. Well, I don't know if he'll get upset. As long as we don't take his PlayStation and his TV, I think he'll be sweet.

SPEAKER_01:

So how are the transitions going to get Lacey to school? Is are they still difficult?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, still the same. I don't, yeah, I don't really haven't come up with an answer of how to make them easier. But yeah, we just we I think I just brace myself, we just know it's coming and try and deal with it the best we can. And just try and limit the amount of times like you know, I do the school drop-off, but then I don't expect him to go anywhere else and come in the car anywhere else with me during the day. Because I know that that transitioning from home to the car and back again is hard. So I just limit it as much as I can.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, right. So before we started this episode, you said, Do you want to talk about something controversial? And I said, Yes, always. And I said, What is it? And you said we are looking at starting Oakland on CBD oil. Okay, so sorry about this, everyone. I'm in a hotel in Perth, and there is a lot of traffic outside, and I can't, you know, I can't erase it or anything. So what Paige said was, you're thinking about starting Oakland on CBD oil, is that right? Correct, yes. So why is this controversial? Tell me.

SPEAKER_02:

Um, I think obviously it's you know, it's made from a drug that is illegal, right?

SPEAKER_01:

Like tell people who don't know what CBD oil is, what is it exactly?

SPEAKER_02:

Okay, so it's extracted from marijuana, is the I guess the easiest, most simple, blunt way to explain it. But it's not very well known for having good medical modalities to it if it's used in the right way. So we're we're considering trying it for him because we feel like we've tried everything else. I think I did say last week he's now refusing to take his epilom, which is his seizure meds, and he's not on any like ADHD meds or anything like that because we can't find anything that works for him. He was on Respiridone, which we called his magic med, and we loved it. It was great for him, but he just outgrew it and it no longer worked for him after being on it for four and a half years.

SPEAKER_01:

So his his uh nervous system habituated to it, is that right?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, um, well, yeah, so we used to up the dose every six months. We'd go to his pediatrician, and his pediatrician managed that for us. And then it got to a stage where one, he put on a lot of weight on Respiridone, a lot of weight, it was concerning. And also it got to the point where we used to up, obviously, like I said, every six months, but then it got to a point where two months in and we desperately need to up it again. Um, so it just wasn't having that like that lasting effect anymore. And the more we up it, you know, the worse it was for him. Um, so yeah, his pediatrician just said, like, this is when like when we get to this point is when it's not working anymore. So we had to take him off of it, but we have not found successfully anything else that works for him. We've tried Dex, we've tried Ritalin, we've tried Bivance, we've tried intuitive caterpress, all the things we've tried them and what else? New Lactol, we've tried lots of different things, nothing works. Um it's yeah, it either just has no effect on him or it makes him really, really angry um and keeps him up all night and you know, all those sorts of things. So it just seems like CBD oil is something that we haven't tried. Um and it's we thought it was good because CBD oil is well known for treating epilepsy as well as aggressive behaviours. So why not give him one thing that helps him with two of the things that he needs medication for?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. And you mentioned earlier that he's no longer wanting to take his seizure medication. What's that about? How, why, and how do you know, and and things like that?

SPEAKER_02:

I I feel like it's a PDA thing. I feel like he it's the demand of taking it, he's been taking it for so long. He we know he doesn't want to take it because he'll just throw it at you. And so he took, he was supposed to take 15 mil of it twice a day. Um, and the demand, I think, of like us giving it to him and him all he he's really struggling with eating at the moment. So him having to eat before he takes it, and there was just so many things that he had to do. So, yeah, it's just so what couldn't get him to consistently take it. So we spoke to his neurologist, and she just ended up taking him off of it because it's one of those meds where, unless you're taking it consistently, then you shouldn't be taking it.

SPEAKER_01:

Right. And is that like a capsule you need to swallow or anything like that?

SPEAKER_02:

So it's it's medicine and it's with a taste, yes, with a taste, and it's it's red and thick.

SPEAKER_01:

Uh-huh. So that could be difficult as well. So, what's gonna be the difference around his demand avoidance of taking then CBD oil?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh, so CBD oil is just a couple of drops, so it's it's not like he wouldn't have to take like 15 mil of it. And with it being a couple of drop drops, something that the urologist said, and you know, this isn't me recommending for anyone to do this. This is just what we were told is a way to do it, is you just put that couple of drops on like a piece of bread, and you just give them that to eat rather than them actually having to be like right now, it's time for your meds. It kind of makes that demand a little bit easier.

SPEAKER_01:

And do you will he know that he's taking the CBD oil? Will you let him know? Yeah, because absolutely affirming, right? That's about that's newer. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, it's not like tricking. I think it no, we we don't want to trick him, and we'll be very open and honest with him about it to his ability of understanding it. But I think so. When he was on Respiridone, he knew that Respiridone made him feel better. He liked taking it and he and he was always happy to take that. We never had issues getting him to take that. So I feel like if he sees that it does make him feel better, if it works, you know, we haven't tried it yet, we don't know if it's gonna work, but if it does work and he sees it does make him feel a lot better, then it might he might just willingly like want to take it.

SPEAKER_01:

And I've read research around children who are fussy eaters, and often children who are fussy eaters are the ones that have got gut issues, and they almost know intuitively what food is going to make them feel uncomfortable, whether it's gassy, whether it's constipated, whether it's nauseous. And I really believe children can feel, because that's the introspie, right? Children can feel when something is okay in their body and when something is not okay, just like yeah, yeah, definitely.

SPEAKER_02:

So and I think so it does make sense that he's now stopped wanting to take his epilom, um, which is the seizure medication, because so he's not at school, and so stressful environments are really triggering for his epilepsy. So we've taken out the stressful environment, and also the heat is a trigger for his epilepsy, it's not hot at the moment, so we've taken away the two main triggers for his seizures. So he's in his mind, he's like, Well, I'm not gonna have a seizure because it's not hot and I and I don't feel stressed. So, like I know his his nervous system is stressed, like I get that, but he doesn't feel he's not in a stressful environment for hours on end during the day. So I think in his mind, he's like, Well, I don't need it because like he doesn't have the understanding that I need to take that every day. In his mind, he's like, Well, I don't feel like I'm not in situations where I feel like I'm gonna have a seizure, so I don't need it. Like a cause-effect, right? Yeah, cause effect. So whereas if he because when he was at school, he would willingly take it and he would even say, like, Mom, I haven't had my meds yet. Because he's he gets scared of having a seizure. He doesn't want to have it. So I do predict that once it starts getting warmer and we take off on our trip and we're spending a lot more time outside, that he may ask me for it. He may say, Mom, I haven't had my meds. Um, because he is worried about having a seizure, but at the moment he's not worried about it.

SPEAKER_01:

If that makes sense, like yeah, absolutely 100%. Has he had any seizures in the last week? No, he hasn't had any since he's been finished school. Wow, Paige. Yeah, huge. And when he was in school, how many seizures would he have? Every day. Every day. Was it at a particular time of day, like in the afternoon, in the morning?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh it was it typically at school when they would ring me and they would say that he's he's seizing again, like you have to do you want him to stay, you're gonna come get him. Like, yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

And were they like the big ones, grandma, or were they petite?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh no, so he has absence seizures and atonic seizures.

SPEAKER_01:

So his atonic seizures are he'll either just go completely limp, he'll just be sitting there, he'll just like flop, or he will like say he's running, he'll just drop, and he won't say you'll know it's a seizure because he won't save himself, so he'll just splat like his nervous system is so overwhelmed, it actually stops, it just shuts off his body, right? Yeah, so I've heard about catatonia. Have you heard of catatonia? That's when someone is like really stuck. I guess I'm not sure. That's not my area, but I've seen I've had some clients with catatonia where they're just really stuck and they can't move, they can't get up. You know, is it something like that, or or does it does it like he'll drop and then like half an hour later he's okay?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh yeah, so he'll drop, and normally within like a max 30 seconds or something, he'll come to. And he'll kind of he'll come out of it. And sometimes he's alright, sometimes he will just get up as if nothing's happened and go. Sometimes he'll cry, sometimes he'll be really tired. It just depends, like every it can be different every time.

SPEAKER_01:

So basically, his brain has got activity that it can't bear, and that's when it shuts down. So there's been none of that got not one during his um schooling, deschooling phase.

SPEAKER_02:

No, no, and then so before all of this kind of started happening at school, so he had kindy not last year, the year before, and then to term like the end of term two last year. So we had a year and a half where he didn't have well, we had nearly 12 months where he didn't have any seizures. And we had like yep, so I so he I think he he did have a couple at Kindi. So, but within a year and a half, he only had a couple of seizures. Um, like, and literally, like I'm I'm talking two or three, like not many at all, over a whole year and a half. And I think that was where he did have a couple was in the first half of Kindi when it was kind of, you know, he was transitioning. Yep. Um, and it was hot. That could have literally just been heat that triggered those. But then there was 12 months, like nearly 12 months, where he had none once he was settled into Kindi. And yeah, he was going really well.

SPEAKER_01:

And then you said like last year, term two, that's when things changed in his class.

SPEAKER_02:

There were more so it's like yeah, end of term two, the well, like they had the transitions for the mid-year intake and then mid-year intake in term three, and well, it all went belly up from there, yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

And that's when there were quite a few seizures. Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

So that's when they started again, yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah. Wow, wow. And when you talk about CBD oil, is there anyone that has prescribed that for you, or is that something you guys have read? And what what how does that work? How does that work?

SPEAKER_02:

We haven't successfully found anyone to prescribe it to us yet. There's only certain doctors that are allowed to prescribe it. So unfortunately, Oakland's pediatrician is not one of them. He's not on the registered list to prescribe it. We are in discussion with Oakland, has seen two neurologists, so one on the public system and one in the private system. The lady, the neurologist that is seen in the private system. She, I have spoken to her, she is willing to prescribe it, but she's not willing to prescribe it until April because she's going on maternity leave in December. So she doesn't want to start him on it and then not have anyone to like contact, oversee it while she's on that leave. Um so we I've also I also am going to speak to his neurologist in the public system. However, she's off on leave at the moment, she's severely hurt herself. So we have an appointment with her in December. So I will speak to her about it, but I'm not sure if she'll prescribe it because apparently in the public sector they have very strict guidelines about when they're allowed to prescribe it or when they're not allowed to prescribe it. So we Oakland may not fit within those guidelines.

SPEAKER_01:

And is it different for adults and children? I'm not sure. We're not sure that could be the case. And it does say, I know that I've read about it, and it does talk about that it really needs to be overseen by healthcare professionals. So don't just go and get it. And and the other thing they talk about is the type of product that you have, you know, like it's gonna be the right thing, it's gotta be the right thing for the person.

SPEAKER_02:

A lot of advice that I've been given for because Oakland is a child, is don't get anything with THC in it. So THC is the I want to get this right, is part of it that I don't know how to say this politically correct, so just excuse me, I'm just gonna say it how it is because I'm a bit blunt like that, is the part that gets you high. Yeah. So that you obviously from you don't want that, so you that needs to be extracted and it's the CBD that you want. Okay, yeah. Yeah. Uh I'm not explaining that very well, but just go and have a look if you're interested.

SPEAKER_01:

Oh, it's psychoactive THC. THC is psychoactive and it makes you high. Yeah, so you've got to be really, really, and the side effects of that could be cognitive effect, it could have dependency risks and yes, increase the anxiety. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

Whereas when it's CBD, that you you take away a lot of that.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. So now I want to get into the medical professionals that you guys. So you've said you've got a neurologist, pediatrician, GP. What about a psychiatrist?

SPEAKER_02:

So, no, we haven't explored the idea of an ex a psychiatrist for Oakland yet. It is something that we are going to look for look for in the near future. We've been lucky enough that Oakland's pediatrician is amazing and he has managed Oakland's medication quite happily until now. But definitely when we see him at the end of November, we will be talking about the possibility of bringing in a psychiatrist because we we feel like we've come to the end of the line of what his pediatrician can help us with. We've tried all the things, and you know, now we're wanting to explore things such as CBD that his pediatrician can't help with. So we will look at potentially going down that route.

SPEAKER_01:

And I guess why I'm asking is that tomorrow at the PDA, inaugural PDA conference here in Perth, when I'm looking at the program, there is quite a few, or there's a couple at least, psychiatrists presenting. And one that's presenting, who's the chief psychiatrist of WA, Dr. Nathan Gibson, he's presenting on the impact of PDA on mental health. So that will be really interesting. And then there's another psychiatrist that's presenting on the psychopharmacology update of children with PDA. And I guess, like for me, I keep and I had Bianca on who has bipolar and autism and ADHD, and she was talking about her psychiatrist and how important her psychiatrist was for her, well, healing, it's it's not recovery, but for her management of her of her abilities, capabilities. So, you know, I'm just thinking, are there any psychiatrists that you know of in Adelaide that could be helpful for someone like Oakland? Unfortunately, I haven't come across any.

SPEAKER_02:

From what I've heard, it's really hard to find a pediatric psychiatrist in Adelaide. But like I said, it is something that I will look into. And we are willing to go interstate, like we have gone interstate before for medical things. Um, and I guess that ties in really well with the fact that we are going to be traveling Australia next year, so we will be able to, you know, maybe make it work for different places that we're in if there's someone that we really want to see. But I will be getting more information from Oakland's pediatrician on that when we see him at the end of this month and just see who he recommends.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, exactly. And I think, wouldn't it be wonderful if he knew of someone that is a pediatrician psychiatrist interstate, and he could actually work with them and with you, you know, so you could do that. Absolutely. And maybe because there is dual-trained pediatrician and psychiatrist also presenting tomorrow, and maybe this would be something good to give to your pediatrician, like the digital access to this conference. So someone like your pediatrician could actually access these doctors presenting about the latest research in pediatric. I'm sure that our pediatrician will he's probably there to be honest.

SPEAKER_02:

If not, he will he will be watching it. But yeah, if if he happened to not, I will ask him about it. Um, but I'd be very surprised if he's not there.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, uh, it'll be really, really interesting, won't it? Um, so Paige, how have you been looking after yourself? I can see your eyebrows are beautifully done. So thank you. Beautifying of your eyebrows, which is really important. Some pampering.

SPEAKER_02:

I did. I went and had my eyebrows microbladed on Saturday. It was one of my little like, it was my thing I wanted to do for me before we went away. I just don't like having my eyebrows done, and I normally just go and get them like tinted and waxed or whatever, but obviously when you're on the road, that's harder, it's harder to do that, and also it ends up being more expensive anyway. So I went and I it was really cool actually the way that this happened. So I got recommended this lady near where I live, and so I rung her and we you know had a good chat. I booked in and then I went and looked, looked on her Instagram, and I was like, I recognize this lady, and but for the life of me, I could not work out where from, but her face just looked familiar. Then I walked in and she's like, Paige, I'm like, yeah, she's like, I know you, and I was like, Oh my god, I know you too. Where? How? Like, I don't understand. She's like, I reckon I came to one of your events. So back when I used to do collaborative events with someone, and she was one of their clients, and she came to one of our events years ago, but her hair's changed now, like she looked completely different. Um, but I still recognized her face. Um, and it turns out she is mum of an autistic child, and she is recently diagnosed herself. So I just loved that it was like a full circle moment, and I was supporting another neurodivergent woman in business as well. Uh, it was so cool, and we just felt so comfortable there with each other, just chatting and just like getting each other's little books, you know, it was cool.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah. And you know, there is that whole uh theory about energy and frequencies, and we are attracted to like-minded, like-purpose people, right? And that's how you and I met, right? Yeah, so tell me, for I do not know anything about eyebrows. What is micro blading? That sounds like someone skating over your eyebrows. That sounds painful. What is that? Yeah, look, I don't know how to explain it.

SPEAKER_02:

I I guess it's it's it's not a tattoo, but it it lasts like a year. Okay. So yeah, she uses it, almost looks like a like a scalpel. Okay. And they just kind of like scratch and the I don't know how to explain it. I'm really bad at this. I just go and say, yeah, like do what's gonna last me a year.

SPEAKER_01:

So microblading, I'm just reading up on my my on my Google. Microblading is a semi-permanent cosmetic tattoo that creates the look of fuller shaped eyebrows, right? And it usually takes two to three hours for the first session, and four to eight weeks later, a short touch-up. And the results last 12 to 24 months. Wow, depending on type and aftercare. Wow, thanks, Paige. I had no idea that something like that existed, even so amazing, so amazing. Yes, I can see you're so expressive with your new eyebrows, they look great. What does Oakland think? Does he does he see them or not?

SPEAKER_02:

He hates them whenever I get my eyebrows done. Whenever I he's like, Oh, not again, get away from me. I hate them. He goes, I like your normal face. Bless him.

SPEAKER_01:

And that's probably because there's a lot of emotion in the eyebrows, right? Because when I look at you now, I mean, people can't see you right now, but you've got a lot of emotion because you can really see the eyebrows raising and going down and all sorts of things. So he probably focuses on the eyebrows and not the eyes, right? Yeah, yes. Wow.

SPEAKER_02:

He does not like them at all. He gets very frustrating.

SPEAKER_01:

Can he look at your can he look at your face when you've had them done?

SPEAKER_02:

He will, but not not like he'll he will avoid it. He will look at me, but he will avoid it for a little while, only a couple of hours or whatever, and then he'll get used to it, and then it's like it kind of just becomes the new normal and he forgets.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, that's right. It's like if you've got your hair colored or hair cut or anything like that, right?

SPEAKER_02:

He says to me, he said to me on Saturday night, yes, I had them done on Saturday, he was don't worry, mummy, me still love you, even if you have bad eyebrows.

SPEAKER_01:

Sorry, I had to clap there. I love it. And you know what they say, out of the mouths of babes. Yeah, literally. Oh bless, oh bless. So, Paige, is there anything else you want to catch us up on? What is happening in your business this week after you launched your wonderful new uh products and services? What is going on in Inclusivo?

SPEAKER_02:

So I've just got my my membership, the Inclusion Collective, and we've added some dads into the group this week, which is really exciting. Wow. We had our coffee catch up, which was awesome. I got to see some beautiful mums, and it's just really nice. We've made like a the dads have a group chat and us mums have one, and then we have a group one. I booked in the masterclasses for this month and next month. Yeah, it's just all really exciting. Just really kind of just getting into the swing of the way that it works now because it's slightly different. I read I had ran our live education call the other night, which was really good. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

So with dads, do you support the dads as well, or does hubby support the dads?

SPEAKER_02:

So I'm not in the dads group chat, however, I can support the dads like with education and stuff like that. Yeah, absolutely happy to support them. We're gonna do some like dad's catch-ups, and my husband will run those. So there'll be certain things that my husband will run, and then certain things that I can still help the dads with if they wanted to understand certain things.

SPEAKER_01:

Because tomorrow in the afternoon at the PDA conference, there's a whole thing about supporting dads of PDAers. And one is PDA Parent Admin Support Group, PDA Dads, What Really Works. And the other one is by Darren Brandes, he's the executive general manager and registered psychologist, a PDA parent, and he's presenting on PDA Dads, The Professional Perspective. So I think this conference will be for you, Paige. And I'm definitely going to be listening, that's for sure. I think that'll be great. And I guess the other thing is how do you fit in looking after Oakland and you know, having your coffee catch ups? Are your coffee catch ups online or are they face to face?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh so my coffee catch ups are face to face once a month. And I Work it in so that they're on the Wednesday once like so. My husband has one Wednesday off a fortnight to look after Oakland, and what I've done is work that in with when the coffee catch up is on a monthly basis. Okay.

SPEAKER_01:

So when you're on the road, when you're on the road, will you online the coffee catch-ups? Like, are they all going to get together? Because there might be people that are listening page that are all over Australia and they'd love to be at your coffee catch-ups. So are you going to have, I guess my question is, are you going to have an online coffee catch up?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh so at this stage, no. Uh, but what I'm gonna do, so for the mums that are in Adelaide or the the parents and carers that are in Adelaide, sorry, I'm so used to saying mums. Uh for the coffee catch-ups are for any parent or carer that that's in the membership. So I'll still organise the dates for Adelaide and they'll still go ahead face to face so that they can all still catch up. And then I will join via like FaceTime so I can still catch up with everybody. But what I plan on doing for now is in every kind of I guess place that I am for a week or more, I'm going to post in the community Facebook groups about the inclusion collective, explain who I am, and see if there's any parents of autistic kids that want to catch up, however, that may look.

SPEAKER_01:

Oh, that'll be amazing. So I'm just going to do that like all around Australia. Amazing. Like having a real face-to-face with Paige Carter, wherever you are, whether you're in Port Lincoln, Sejuna, Perth, Brisbane.

SPEAKER_02:

So I guess I've already connected, you know, because I've had my page for five years now. So over those five years, I've connected with lots of people around the country. And there's some that I've I talk to regularly. So there's some that I'm really looking forward to catching up with, and then hopefully their friends will like that. They'll, you know, will want to come and we can do a bit of a you know, coffee catch-ups around around Australia.

SPEAKER_01:

Are you going to be just on the mainland or are you going to Tasmania as well?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh no, not doing Tassie this time.

SPEAKER_01:

Sorry, Tasmanians, we love you. But not this time. Yeah, not this time. Doesn't mean we won't get there.

SPEAKER_02:

Right.

SPEAKER_00:

Um, but Rob doesn't have to see.

SPEAKER_02:

There's only so much you can see in 11 months. So that's right. That's right, absolutely. Yeah. But we do have the connection and clarity calls in uh in oh I nearly said empower her in the inclusion collective. So they are calls where you can come on literally just to sit and have a coffee and have a chat, or you can come on and ask questions, or going like gain clarity about something, or get one of those things off your to-do list that you've been putting off and you need a body double. But those calls are whatever you need them to be. So, like for people that are around Australia that want to connect, they would be kind probably what you would be more likely to join online as a coffee catch up, potentially. Yeah, quite unit. I run them twice.

SPEAKER_01:

And if you don't drink coffee twice a month, and if you don't drink coffee, that's okay. You can have a water catch-up, you can have a tea. I don't drink coffee. I don't drink coffee, I just call it a coffee catch-up. Love it, I love it. Thank you so much again, Paige. I can't wait to talk to you next week because I'm going to be coming in with all these ideas to discuss with you. And hopefully, you'll have seen a couple of these sessions as well, and we can start pulling apart some of this stuff that has been on the PDA conference tomorrow. And what I love, it's the inaugural one, which means it's the first one. And I think it's interesting that it is in Perth. And I think it's in Perth because PDA Perth hosting it. And, you know, they're they're saying that they're connecting over 700 adult PDAs, parents and carers, school and home educators, pediatricians, psychiatrists, GPs, health professionals, academics, and students. So I am really looking forward to this. And maybe one year it will be in Adelaide, Paige, where you posted in Adelaide. Sarah, love it. Yeah, she's I think she's on a panel tomorrow as well, so it'll be interesting to see. So exciting. So thank you, Paige. And I'll let you go for the evening. And I look forward to hearing what is in store for you next week. You and I clearly chat then and hubby. Okay, see you. Bye. Thanks. Bye.

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Dana Baltutis

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