The Consider Podcast
The Consider Podcast
Examining today's wisdom, folly and madness
Ecclesiastes 7:25
www.consider.info
Hosts: Timothy and Jacob
Sound Doctrine Considered
The Consider Website
The Consider Podcast
#95 The Consider Podcast
Ecclesiastes 1:18
For with much wisdom comes much sorrow; the more knowledge, the more grief.
Scripture just declared that with much wisdom comes more sorrow and grief.
Let us fully enter that sorrow and grief.
The sorrow and grief of Jordon Peterson
The sorrow and grief of Erick Kirk and Turning Point USA
The sorrow and grief of what is coming upon the whole world
In this, the year of our Lord, 2025.
www.consider.info
Ecclesiastes 1.18. For with much wisdom comes much sorrow. The more knowledge, the more grief. Scripture just declared that with much wisdom comes more sorrow and grief. Let us fully enter that sorrow and grief. The sorrow and grief of Jordan Peterson. The sorrow and grief of Eric Kirk in Turning Point USA. The sorrow and grief of what is coming upon the whole world. In this, the year of our Lord, 2025.
SPEAKER_02:Welcome to the Consider Podcast, where we examine today's wisdom, folly, and madness. More information can be found at www.consider.info. Now, here are your hosts, Timothy and Jacob.
SPEAKER_12:Jacob, I know you will be disappointed, but I don't have another career opportunity for you today. Yeah, bummer. I almost went for one that, you know, you could lie, your pride gets puffed up, you're beyond the law, but I figured you would guess it was becoming a prosecutor.
SPEAKER_10:Prosecutor, deputy, maybe a deputy prosecutor, an assistant prosecutor.
SPEAKER_12:I guess it would have to be assistant corrupt prosecutor, because the law doesn't it'd be very, very I'm gonna cut you short.
SPEAKER_10:I'm not interested in that job.
SPEAKER_12:Well, I'd love to send a missionary, true disciple of Jesus Christ.
SPEAKER_10:Undercover, yeah, in there.
SPEAKER_12:Oh, you couldn't be undercover. No, you wouldn't you would not last. You could even leave out prayer, you could leave out Jesus' name. You just go in and be honest and not tell a lie and not exaggerate anything and uh have mercy with uh with judgment. Wouldn't happen. Which brings me to the point that there is a vast difference between the Christian religion or Christian faith and actually being a disciple of Jesus. Because I'm sure there's a lot of indignant uh prosecutors going, well, I'm a Christian, I go to church. Uh-huh. Give me a buzz. I'd love to put you online and let's just put that to the test and come into the light. All right, so let's play this clip here, which demonstrates real clear what the Christian religion or the Christian faith looks like versus being a disciple of Jesus. You ever seen that video?
SPEAKER_07:No. Pull that video up because it's one of my favorite. What would be your favorite book? I have two that I would recommend on a daily basis that people read. One is the book of Proverbs, which is written by King Solomon. It's 31 chapters, and they're fundamental truths and values and wisdom that applies to anybody regardless of religion. The second one is a book by an ancient samurai known as Miyamoto Musashi. He wrote a book by the name The Five Rings, and he wrote it in a cave a couple weeks before he died, where he expresses the art of war and the art of being a samurai, but he does it in a very poetic way that translates into simple values. One of them I tweeted about today says, The journey of a thousand miles begins with the first step.
SPEAKER_12:Wow. Rich stuff. You're gonna go on a journey. Guess what, Jacob? It begins with that first step. That's poetic. That's rich. Yeah. I know we're kind of making fun of it, but when you put the two books together, one's, you know, Proverbs, and you can apply it to your life, and you can go down. And you have to remember, according to the Babylon B, oh no, I guess that was um Elon Musk who became a Christian. Yes. Who was it that was saying, well, there was just all this speculation that Joe Rogan might become a Christian, was headed that direction, attending church, you know, yeah. Now, the course there's hundreds of those. This is my favorite, so somebody's tacking that on that, whether that's him or not, I couldn't tell you.
SPEAKER_13:Yeah.
SPEAKER_12:But what we see here is a classic example of how most people actually approach Jesus, which is to read the Bible. And we think by reading the Bible that somehow we're Christians or that we have faith. Am I correct on that?
SPEAKER_10:Yeah, or that that's going to get you closer to God. Read your Bible.
SPEAKER_12:Exactly. Go to John 10 27, and this is true faith in Jesus, and everything gets measured from here. John chapter 10, verse 27. Go ahead and read that, Jacob.
SPEAKER_10:My sheep listen to my voice, I know them, and they follow me.
SPEAKER_12:It all really does come down to listening to the voice of God, and there is no time to discuss all the different ways God, and I'm putting this in quotes, talks to his disciples. Uh, if you want to, I wrote a book many years ago. It's Ears to Hear by Way of the Cross. Because what's missing is people will quote this scripture and say, Oh, I'm a part of Jesus, I follow Jesus, I hear his voice. Okay, that's fine. That's that's quite the claim. So then let's go down through scripture because obviously, what is Jesus going to lead us into, Jacob?
SPEAKER_10:Uh he's gonna lead us into sufferings.
SPEAKER_12:Going to lead us into sufferings, lead us into more and more obedience to scripture, correct? Correct. I'm reminded of John chapter 5, verse 39, where Jesus says, You diligently study the scriptures because you think that by them you possess eternal life. These are the scriptures that testify testify about me, yet you refuse to come to me to have life. When I watch and when we examine Charlie Kirk's life and all these people and Jordan Peterson, they're all trying to avoid going to Jesus. They're all trying to get away from the cross and following Jesus. So you find this study on religion, you find this claiming of faith in the Bible and scripture and its basic tenets and so on and so forth. But that is the Christian religion. Really, it's a form of idolatry. Remember Acts chapter 32, where they build a golden calf to worship the Lord. And then what does Aaron say? Do you remember? Uh, we're gonna have a festival, festival for the Lord. To the Lord. Yes, right. For the Lord, to the Lord. So he takes the idolatry of fashioning all of how we want God to be, which happened to be a golden calf for them, all shiny, new, and exciting. You got to sit down and eat and drink, and in order to justify it or to redeem it, I you know, I don't know what went through Aaron's head, but the main point is they tack on the name of the Lord. So when you look at Turning Point USA with the razzle and the dazzle and all the fireworks and the fine clothes and the movement like a sporting event, and then there you're just kind of tacking on belief in Jesus. Now, and really, even in their structure, remember we talked about this in the last video. They the Christian element is a subsection of actually turning point USA. Yeah, correct. All right, so let's go to John chapter 12, verse 25. I know you're well familiar with it. To follow the voice of Jesus Christ is to head into trouble, is to head into suffering, to go where we do not want to go. Just one, this is just some base example. Let's not just do some grandiose thing, although that that could be there. You've got pride in your life, the Holy Spirit, the voice of God, not you yourself. It's not you going to scripture saying, Oh, yeah, I've got pride, so I'm gonna kind of deal with it and wrestle and dig it all out. No, no, that'll never work. Pride cannot crucify pride, it won't work. Pride will become proud of crucifying itself. So that's a trap. You can't get there. And that this is true with any sin. Yeah. So what happens is to a disciple of Jesus, he loses his life. He's no longer in control of his Bible study, he's no longer in control of what church he attends or she's no longer in control of his money, anything. Everything is surrendered to the cross of Jesus Christ. And people will say that, except what you don't see is okay, well, where is the sufferings? Where is the crucifixion? Uh, you'll find people that even aren't Christians saying, you know, I really can't tell any difference. In fact, Jordison Peterson will say that, and that's because the message is not even being preached, let alone it being lived. Yeah. Go ahead and read John chapter 12, and I'm gonna let you go through 25 and 27, and we've covered this a whole lot in past episodes, I'm not gonna be able to spend a great deal of time on it today.
SPEAKER_10:The man who loves his life will lose it, while the man who hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life. Whoever serves me must follow me, and where I am, my servant also will be. My father will honor the one who serves me. Now my heart is troubled, and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour. No, it was for this very reason I came to this hour.
SPEAKER_12:Think about it. Jesus is just getting ready to be betrayed, go through all the humiliation, be crucified, and he's telling us that's where we will head. That's where God will lead us. It's not gonna get softer or better. You're not gonna save America. I don't want to get too sidetracked, but I'd love to have a bunch of missionaries that go to colleges knowing they will be kicked out, but facing the sufferings of Jesus Christ as God leads. There's a lot of people on college campus doing a lot of debate. Whether that's of God or not can be measured by how much of the gospel they are presenting. The man who loves his life will lose it, while the man who hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life. We have to give up and not just give up. It's a hatred. I hate when I want to get up and I hate when I want to go to sleep. I hate what I eat, I hate so on and forth. Your whole life, your money, your car, your pleasures, your wife, your children. It's all there in scripture. Sometimes they quote it, sometimes they don't. Verse 26: whoever serves me must follow me. So we become servants of Jesus Christ, following him. Now, everything that I just listed and more is what he's going to lead us into, and it's going to lead into suffering and conflict. And where I am, my servant also will be. So the disciple of Jesus is following the Holy Spirit where God wants him to go. And that always leads to weakness, humility, brokenness, further, how can I put this? Imaging of God's word in our whole life and soul and spirit. It's not us reading the Bible or, yeah, I love it when you go to buy a Bible, you can get the full year study Bible. You can get the candy cane Bible. You know, I don't know what all they are. Um, all these outlines, you know, the preaching Bible, everything's just laid out. Yeah. So Jesus is not in those things. It's an absolute w waste of time. It's in the way because when Jesus comes to you, you go, Well, I study the scriptures because I think I have pre-eternal life. Yeah. All right, verse 27. So you get up in the morning and you say with Jesus, now my heart is troubled. I don't want to see my pride. I don't want to see my sexual immorality. I don't want to see my impurity. I don't want to see the pollution of the world in my life, or the lack of love for my neighbor, or whatever it might be. It's a it's a it's everything because your whole life is laid bare. And what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour. That's how most people like Jesus save me from. That's what we're talking about. No, it is for this very reason I came to this hour. When I'm discipling people, they'll often agree with, okay, yeah, that is the suffering of Jesus, and yeah, yeah, I know you're right, and I need to go there. And then they kind of grit their teeth and endure it. And I always have to turn to them, well, you need to press on so that it becomes a joy to do. Because once Jesus had gone through the wrestling process, what did he do? He said, Here comes my betrayer, rise up and let's do it. He went on in the joy of the Lord, so to speak. He went in on the power of God. He accepted exactly what God wanted to do. And he didn't, he wasn't grudgingly. Was he up on the cross, Jacob going, Oh man, this is God's will, and I can't wait till it's over with? No. No, he pressed on to the place of joy. And so many people that I know that have fallen away or left, they always got up to that point where, okay, I realize I need to suffer with this in my life, whatever it might be. And they agreed with it and they knew it was the truth, and they they would play at it and go, okay, I'm going to suffering, but they never pressed on, never surrendered to the point they said, This is a joy, this is perfect. One example I can give you early on when I was going to college, God was telling me to drop out. At that time, it was the I was just a Christian. It was like this horrendous thing. Oh man, am I hearing the truth? Is this God really want me to do this? I mean, my parents want me to stay in college, and there was all this turmoil going on, and I barely knew the scriptures. And like, am I delusional? And all of those things. So it literally took me a year and a half to even get up to speed. And then when I finally did, of course, I only had about um six weeks left to graduate. So you can imagine how my parents felt about that particular thing. My main point is you suffer through to the point it becomes a joy. Once I made the decision, once it was clear, then the joy began to follow. So it was a very early lesson for me. Do not take that long. So the whole Christian of me following Jesus Christ, God starts going, okay, you got that down. Now we're gonna go faster, now we're gonna go deeper, now we're gonna go further, and I won't bore everybody with my story today. John chapter eight, verse thirty-one, Jacob. Go ahead and read that. And let's just savor it. Take it in.
SPEAKER_10:Chapter 8, verses 31. And 32. And 32. To the Jews who had believed him, Jesus said, If you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples. Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free. They believe, don't they, Jacob?
SPEAKER_12:They are believers. Tucker Carlson can't claims to be a believer. Megan Kelly claims to be a believer. Charlie Kirk, his wife, everybody that's attorney claims to be a believer. To the Jews who believed him. So they they believe, yeah, that's it. But then Jesus says, if you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples. What comes down to the testing is then is all the teachings, all the obedience is what Jesus taught in Matthew 28, teaching them to obey everything. Then Jesus says in verse 32, then you will know the truth. So you have to not only just believe, okay, yeah, Jesus, what you're saying is really true. You have to then take that teaching and hold on to it. And why would I have to hold on to it, Jacob?
SPEAKER_10:Because you're gonna need it for all the sufferings ahead. Correct. So you're holding on to a teaching.
SPEAKER_12:Now let's think about that. You're holding on to a teaching that you don't want to hear. Who wants to hear? Yeah, I want to go to the cross. Yeah, I want to go suffer. That takes some real maturity to get there. Even Peter says only those who've suffered against sin in their body have overcome. So we're talking about a teaching here. That's one reason why nobody comes running to my door. Oh, I want to be a disciple, because here's the teaching. The teaching is going to make you afraid. The teaching is going to make you suffer. The teaching of holding on to Jesus is going to lead you every single day of every hour of every day where you do not want to go. The freedom is hidden in the offense of the cross. Once you take hold of that, once you embrace it and allow it to do its work, then you really do know a freedom. Then you will know the truth, and the truth will what? Set you free. Set you free. Again, just one example when I was a very, very, very, very young Christian, taking God at His Word, poor family, that kind of thing, just getting started, and somebody needed a car. I gave them away my only car because it's what Jesus said to do. That's what he was working. Now you can imagine, how do you think my parents viewed that, Jacob? Uh, like you were insane. Totally. Not only I was all also an embarrassment to them because even though I had quit college, which was an embarrassment enough, and my my dad was known around town. So then I started debating with the gays that were on the college. Now, this is way back when when gays weren't out front and all of that kind of thing. So it was a much more serious, they didn't have the upper hand, so there was this kind of embarrassment just to accept. My parents got all kinds of ridicule. You can see why the relationship disappeared. Now, naturally, I got the blame that I wouldn't talk to them and I wouldn't associate with parents. The other way around, they didn't want to talk to me. I was a, as I repeated, a complete embarrassment. All right, a little bit of a tangent there. Any comments or anything on that question on that, Jacob? No. All right, then let's go on to James chapter 1, verse 27, because we're down to now holding to the teaching of Jesus. We're now measuring anyone who claims to be a Christian. Okay, let's look at the scriptures that by the power of the cross that God has worked and fashioned in your life. I don't expect perfection. I'm not even perfect, but there has to be this overwhelming testimony to not only just the basics of how you become a Christian, but then how the Christian life works and lives and how the Holy Spirit is moving and how much the cross is manifesting itself. James chapter 1, verse 27 says, religion that God our Father accepts is pure and flawless. So we're looking, we're looking at what religion is, what it means to follow Jesus, what's pure, what's flawless is this, to look after orphans. Everybody would kind of agree with that. And widows in their distress. We're going to look at a widow here in a moment. I'm not 100% sure how distressed she is, but nevertheless, there are certain scriptures that apply. Widows in their distress. And look at this last one. And I don't, I don't know. Have you ever heard it quoted much, Jacob? It says, and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.
SPEAKER_10:Yeah, you'll hear it. You'll hear it in some circles, but then they just usually circle about back around to, well, don't watch bad movies and read your Bible, and you're not being polluted by the world. That's you know, super generically.
SPEAKER_12:Gotcha, gotcha. Well, there's since the whole world is a source of pollution, religion, philosophies, how we dress, what we do, how our hair looks, everything. We we should back up and look at everything inside our heart, outward, yeah, movies, all that kind of stuff. And I'm not going to lay out a bunch of rules for everybody because that's to avoid the power of the Holy Spirit. That's religion. When you get rules of don't watch this, don't do that, don't wear this, don't go there, that's religion because it's a source of laws and principles and ideas. Following Jesus Christ means those things will happen in due course and due time. You'll see this overwhelming obedience, being water baptized to be saved because that's where the power is. You'll see a good foundation, and then you'll see them cleaning up their lives as God moves in their life. So it gets manifested by seeing God working in their lives. They're no longer the same person. All right. One of the things we would be on guard against, though, would be any philosophy, any teaching, any concept that sets itself up against Christ, correct? Correct. Well, let's play this next clip by Charlie Kirk, who it's indicative of his polluted ideas of Jesus. Go ahead and play it.
SPEAKER_04:He was pointing towards the divine.
SPEAKER_03:Absolutely. Now, have you ever watched or listened to the play, The Magic Flute by Mozart? I highly recommend it. It's deeply esoteric, and it's about something that most people wouldn't ever expect. Alright, I have my homework at the Magic Flux. Absolutely. Yeah, he was actually a Freemason, is that right? And he made his final and most popular play about Masonic initiation. So when I went and first saw it, under that context, it was really mind-blowing what you see. I highly recommend it. You got it. And on that note, what do you think about the Freemasons? I've seen a lot of conspiracies and a lot of good strong opinions about it, honestly.
SPEAKER_04:Um I've known some people that have been Masons that have just been like regular everyday people. But I'm I'm open-minded. I don't have I don't have strong opinions on it. Cool. Very cool.
SPEAKER_10:Now uh very cool, huh, Jacob? Very, he's open-minded. Why why are we gonna be open-minded about the Masons?
SPEAKER_12:Go to Second Corinthians while I gather my thoughts, chapter 10, verse 5. By the way, my dad was a 32nd degree Mason. I remember very early as a kid, uh, eight years old, he he'd go into the bedroom, close the door, and he had a it's the old reel-to-reel type tape recorder where you actually had to feed the tape and all that stuff. And he was busy memorizing codes and or chants or whatever it is Freemason do. But it's not a Freemason is not a good thing. No. And you don't besides, what okay, Second Corinthians chapter 10, verse 5. Go ahead, Jacob, and read it, and let's see if Charlie Kirk reflects this.
SPEAKER_10:We demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God, and we take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ.
SPEAKER_12:There was no we demolish arguments and every pretension, Freemasonry is a pretension. And why in a ministry, supposedly, do you have Freemasons involved? At best, it's an impure thing of uh the world. At best. I don't know about all the conspiracy theories. You try to dig on, of course, you got both arguments that no, it's just this fun thing or whatever. It's this club, and then you got the other dark side. I have a feeling the truth is somewhere in the middle.
SPEAKER_10:Correct. I mean, they everybody knows they do very weird, semi, you know, demonic rituals. Like they do super weird rituals that are very not Christian like. Like everybody knows this. A quick, a quick, a quick glance of what they do is is it's not good.
SPEAKER_12:Not only that, they have a I think they throw in some concepts about Jesus, but it's all watered down. It's just he's a tea. I don't know, a teacher, whatever. They really don't know we're good that came from it, that's for sure.
SPEAKER_10:Yeah, even if they're like, yeah, at best though, you're you're yeah, it's you're mixing stuff and not good stuff.
SPEAKER_12:My dad was, as I said, a 32nd degree. Yeah, I think you can only go one more, but like I'm no expert on this stuff. I don't even want to be an expert. But they're not needed. What's the point? There, yeah, there is no point if you're a disciple of Jesus, then you have the fellowship with the brothers and sisters and churches around the world. So this is complete nonsense. There was a thousand other ways to answer this question other than the way Charlie Kirk answered. And of course, there's speculation that he might himself have been a Mason, um, and they're very quiet about who does it, very secretive. Let's go to First Corinthians chapter two, verse two, because what Christian religion does is it sucks out all the power of the cross to really deal with a man's sin. You can you can embrace a religious Jesus and cherry pick and choose which scriptures. In fact, you'll find, yeah, here's a list of scriptures when you're feeling down. And here's a list of scriptures when you just want to praise God. Here's a list of scriptures when you're going through suffering. That's just fact, okay, that it's like what? You just go in and pick and choose what you want to believe at the moment and think you're gonna be all well. I mean, it's not like Jesus up on the cross going, well, you know what, I'm gonna think about Psalms 23, or I'm gonna think about how God is always with me. No, that that's to deny the very spirituality and the movement and walking with Jesus. When Jesus has me in valleys and when dark times are coming over me because of his leading, I can't step out of that by going, okay, I'm gonna just claim this scripture over here. I need to know that every scripture that I'm looking at and taking in is something the Holy Spirit is inspiring or laying in my heart for a different time. There's times of joy. But even those you have to be very, very careful. That's why in James it says, if any of you is happy to sing songs and hymns to God. You don't go out partying or go church and have fun ton and all that kind of thing. You can only have the joy when God brings the joy. Jesus was a man of sorrows, and as he walked on the earth, there are no points when it says the Holy Spirit filled him with joy. The Christian life, as we just read, the more knowledge, the more sorrow, correct? Which means the more God enlightens a disciple about this ministry or this person or this going over here, what do we gain?
SPEAKER_10:More sorrows. More sorrows.
SPEAKER_12:Exactly. Most people don't want that. We're stuck to whatever we want to believe, whether it's being a Baptist, Methodist, or whatever. Jacob, let's go to 1 Corinthians 2.2. For I resolved to know nothing while I was with you except Jesus Christ and Him crucified. Now, would you say turning point, USA, then when you look at them, you go, they know nothing but Jesus Christ, Him crucified. It's the same message over and over again. Ooh, definitely not. Jordan Jordan Peterson, when you hear all of his teaching and his knowledge of this world and how the psychology and all, would you say you walk away going, Man, there's a guy that only knows Jesus Christ and him crucified?
SPEAKER_10:Definitely not.
SPEAKER_12:Definitely not. That's why Jesus said the workers are few. People flock around an entertaining message or a political message, or let's save America, let's protect our lives kind of thing. Anything but the cross. Now, it goes on to say in verse three, I came to you in weakness and fear and with much trembling. When you saw Erica Kirk up on the stage, was there a lot of weakness and fear? No. And much trembling? No. No. Verse 4, my message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit's power. Read that again, Jacob, for everybody.
SPEAKER_10:My message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit's power.
SPEAKER_12:You know, that's why when prosecutor Jason Simmons and King County prosecutors said, What attracted you to Sound Doctrine Church? He would the truthful answer would be, Well, let me do the negative, because I can't really do the positive. Would you say my words were all persuasive, Jacob? No. Like razzle and dazzle and entertainment and little drum set here and a little fireworks here, and like you'll be blessed, and it's all gonna work out, and all of this kind of thing. Or, you know, really join. We'd like to see you a part of it. We need workers, we need laborers, you know, all the persuasive words that churches use, correct?
SPEAKER_10:Uh yeah, you definitely didn't have those words.
SPEAKER_12:No charismatic part of me is you know, come to the church social, the church dinner, the church dance. I there's so many gimmicks out there. It was like raw scripture. It was like there's the cross, and this is what's about to happen. Yes, I presented both in equal measure the suffering and the joys, but the one came after the other. My message and my preaching were not with wise. Did I come in with all the Greek and the Hebrew and the in-betweenies and all that kind of stuff?
SPEAKER_10:No. So to put this in perspective, I didn't come with a wise biblical knowledge, correct? Correct. Well, there was biblical knowledge, but no, not like uh not literally wise, yeah. Correct, not Jordan Peterson knowledge.
SPEAKER_12:Or the your typical pastor that's really preaching from commentary books. Sure. But with a demonstration of the spirit's power. And by that, don't get confused about what you see on TV. This wasn't me walking up. Again, this would be the charismatic, you know, putting my hands on them and And slaying them in the spirit, or everybody speaking in tongues. And I don't deny the miracles, and I don't deny that God does things in a miraculous way. But you know what? It always leads to the sufferings by following Jesus Christ. Now, verse five says, so that your faith might not rest on man's wisdom, but on God's power. What's happening is that the cross of Christ, in terms of its power to really crucify people, and I could go, we could go down the list again. I could just do five things like if Charlie Kirk or Eric Kirk or Jordan Peterson stood up and quoted any number of offensive scriptures that really demand everything, they would lose their falling because they're not preaching the gospel of Jesus Christ. They don't even understand the resolve to know nothing but Jesus Christ and him crucified. Play this next clip. This this is Pearlie. She she recognizes these things. Not that I give her any credit for it. We can all a lot of people can recognize the faults in these things, but whether they live it themselves or not, usually that's not the case.
SPEAKER_08:The cries of a widow will echo around the world like a battle cry. Um, the evildoers who took Charlie's c life, they have no idea what they have done. If they thought my husband's mission was powerful before, they have no idea what they have just unleashed. Not across the country, but in me. Charlie will always say, Never surrender. This is a sad situation, and we're asking for donations. I feel guilty that I'm having this thought because of how sad the situation is.
SPEAKER_12:You never saw in the first church, did you, Jacob, after the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus, Paul and them going, and Peter and the apostles going on a fundraising thing to continue the message, correct? Very correct. They were so devastated by the message of the cross that it was all weakness. It was all like none of that means anything. So in the same way, anyone encountering the kind of true gospel of Jesus Christ, this this fundraising, these kinds of things, they become abhorrent. You wouldn't even do it. There's no power to them, it won't rescue you from anything, correct?
SPEAKER_10:Correct. It's it's uh this is a total side note, but like every time there's a tragedy, don't most people say like, hey, please respect the person's privacy like as they grieve. You know what I mean? Yeah, where was the where was the grieving process? They just jumped like literally like like 48 hours. We're talking hours, not even like enough days, and like bam, we're raising money. That's what you want to do. It's ugh.
SPEAKER_12:I I agree. And the ug is really your your best.
SPEAKER_10:And even the other, this other lady, the pearl lady, Pearly, even she picks up on the ug. That's why she's like, Oh, I feel guilty thinking this because she obviously it is tragic because the guy died, but there's like a ug factor.
SPEAKER_12:Correct. It and it does us no good to walk away from it and ignore this. This whole thing is like it's not of God. So, what is God working here? What what is he bringing about? Let's play this next clip first, Jacob. I call this the revival bikini because this is what Turning Point USA and Jordan Peterson and Megan Kelly and Tucker Carlson are all telling us to accept that belongs to Jesus Christ. It's of Jesus Christ, that this is a foundational thing, this is this is okay, this is proper, this is what should be done. Go ahead and play this and let us contemplate for a moment that Jesus is like in the audience. I mean, he overturned tables in the temple just for collecting money, right?
SPEAKER_11:Correct.
SPEAKER_12:So this is supposed to be a woman who's going to lead Turning Point USA involves the faith of Charlie Kirk, because that's what it's really being called. And by the way, a lot of people die for their faith. Buddhists die for their faith, Hindus die for their faith. China attacks the Tibetan monks, they die for their faith. Dying for your faith is meaningless. Dying for Jesus Christ because you're a disciple of Jesus. Now, that's the only place that you get meaning. Everything else is a waste of time. The Reformation, uh, Baptists were burned at the stake by Catholics and so on. And then when the Baptists got in charge, or who I use Baptists as an example, but I don't know who was the Protestants got in charge. They went after the Catholics, right?
SPEAKER_10:Yeah, correct. Yeah.
SPEAKER_12:So everybody's dying for their cause and their faith, but that does not mean it's of God or of Jesus Christ or of the truth. And in the case of Turning Point and Tucker and Megan Kelly and Jordan Peterson, whatever hill they're dying on is not of Jesus Christ, even though they claim it. And Jordan Peterson doesn't even quite claim it. So what is God working here? What is all this razzle and dazzle happening? Well, God is sending a powerful delusion. Go ahead and play that first revival bikini clip. And this is what God is offering the Christian church.
SPEAKER_05:Revival USA bikinis are available now. Look over here. Turn the USA away from the gospel. Get your revival USA bikini today. Bikinis on sale today. Yeah. USA. USA. USA. Turning heads for the USA. Turning point, USA. See the curves. See the waves. See the smile. God declares. 1 Timothy 2.9. I also want women to dress modestly, with decency and propriety, not with braided hair or gold or pearls or expensive clothes. Satan was judged. Ezekiel 28 17. Your heart became proud on account of your beauty, and you corrupted your wisdom because of your splendor. The Consider Podcast. Donning our hot bikinis. Examining today's wisdom, folly, and madness.
SPEAKER_10:Comment, Jacob? Um. Yep, that is exactly what is happening, that's for sure.
SPEAKER_12:Do we really have to be told that that's not something God would accept?
SPEAKER_10:Uh nowadays, yes.
SPEAKER_12:And they would throw stones at me if they had the chance. If this is so godly, if this is the foundation of turning point, if this is the beginning point, and I even hate to say this because it could happen. Why aren't churches having beauty contests? You know? I don't even want to make fun of it because it's to make light of the fact. Who is this going to attract? Subconsciously, consciously, whatever. You've got all these people looking at this. They they know where she comes from. She they know she was in this. In fact, there's other aspects of her dress and so on we'll get to in a moment. So what's being appealed to here? Are those are those judges looking at her going, Wow, what a Christian woman?
SPEAKER_10:No, this is all worldly, 100% worldly. This is not Christian at all.
SPEAKER_12:No, it reminds you Revelation, where God says he will judge the world for sexual morality. There in this time period, we we need this? Sure, yeah. It has nothing to do with the purity. All right, let's go ahead now and look at 2 Thessalonians 2.11. And again, I've covered this in detail before, so we're just kind of going to go skim through it. Once again, I wrote a book called Insanity of the Church, which kind of addresses this powerful delusion. 2 Thessalonians 2.11. For this reason, now, now picture the revival bikini, and you can just simply say, for this reason. This is what the people want. This is like the golden calf. It's all shiny, it's all fashioned out, it's for this reason, God sends them a look at this, powerful delusion, so that they will believe the lie. What is Turning Point USA? What is Jordan Peterson, Tucker Carlson, Megan Kelly? It's also that people will believe the lie. God is giving the us or the Christian, false Christian church, what it is they want to believe in. Verse 12, and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth. All of this again comes back to not saying, Well, I believe God exists. Because you'll see this theme throughout the whole all these people and these movements. I mentioned it's like to believe in God. We've repeated it over. I've written the book. Jesus or James says, even the demons believe. It's the teaching, it's the obedience, it's the cross. Let's go specifically. Let's begin to allow the Holy Spirit to really deal with our hearts as he presses in in his own will and way the sc living scriptures into our lives, making us go where we do not want to go. And have delighted in wickedness. Clearly the Turning Point USA and all of these people that are supporting it and their little fellowshipy groupy approve of this, right?
SPEAKER_11:Correct.
SPEAKER_12:I mean, there's nobody saying, forget all the conspiracy theories like, well, did the Freemasons kill Charlie Kirk or the deep state or this spiritual state? You know what? That's all meaningless talk. Yeah. I mean, Tucker, you just need to shut up. It's not gonna what what happens at the end of the day? Megan Kelly, what happens at the end of the day? Okay, so what if it was a conspiracy? The whole world is under the control of the evil one. What really will come down to is you're delighting in things that are impure and unholy, but have delighted in wickedness. This is all wickedness. Verse 13, but we ought always to thank God for you. Now, why? Why would he be thankful, brothers, loved by the Lord? Because from the beginning, God chose you to be saved. Now, Jacob, is there a period there or a stopping point? No. Okay, I'm gonna let you read the last part of it. How then is God saving us? How does this salvation work? Is it just asking Jesus in your heart, a believer prayer, a half prayer, a dunking, a semi-dunking, a sprinkling? How is it that God how what does he go on to say that saves us? Go ahead, Jacob, and read that.
SPEAKER_10:God chose you to be saved through the sanctifying work of the spirit and through belief in the truth.
SPEAKER_12:When's the last time you heard anybody talking about the sanctifying work of the spirit? Never sanctifying work that involves hammers and nails and crucifixion and going where you do not want to go. Even the YouTubers that mention this stuff, like, oh, look at what look at this scripture, look at here. There's no real suffering here. It's it's all playtime. It's not being confronted with the living God, it's not his holiness being spread out. It's because that people can tolerate a certain amount of like you need to clean up your life. But we're talking a sanctifying work of the spirit that goes deep into the soul, that goes that crucifies self in the spirit and in the soul of man and his body and his life and his work and the turmoils and the peace and the pain in the family. Look, there's a scripture, 1 Corinthians 5, that says, if anyone claims to be your brother but is sexually immoral, greedy, a slander, an idolater, we're not even supposed to eat lunch with them. Do you hear Charlie Kirk saying, Don't eat lunch with these people?
SPEAKER_10:No, he ate lunch with these people.
SPEAKER_12:He would eat lunch, well, I would do it for reach out, um uh Freemasons. Correct. Uh let's see, and through belief in the truth. You see, they both go hand in hand. Correct.
SPEAKER_10:You gotta have both.
SPEAKER_12:Gotta have both. Part of the and what we're being pointed to here is that the sanctifying work of the spirit is powerful enough, but then you have to hold on to the truth. And many, many a Christian has fallen away or decided they don't want to do it, and so they just let go of the truth, and then the Holy Spirit dies down, and the sanctifying has stopped. Verse 14, he called you to this through our gospel that you might share in the glory of Jesus Christ. So then, brothers, stand firm, hold to the teachings we passed on to you, whether by word of mouth or by letter. The church has been so dumbed down, the the increase of wickedness is going on that the love of most for God is growing cold, correct? Correct. So they don't even know what I'm talking about here.
SPEAKER_11:Correct.
SPEAKER_12:Now, it's one thing like people first come to the church and they they kind of got it, but it takes a while for this to sink in deep and hard, and there's a lot, just like the disciples, three and a half years, like he's completely humbling them, he's breaking them. They think they understand. They even go on missionary work and they come back all excited. Oh, the demons submit, and every and this happened, and we did this miracle over here, and Jesus goes, Don't get excited about that. Can you imagine? I mean, I can because I've been through where I go do these works for Jesus or whatever, and then he comes and goes, wasn't quite the purity that needed to be. And what about this over here? I mean, the work, the sanctifying work is going on and on, and I never let go of the message of the cross. Keep holding on to the teachings. People don't even have an idea of what that teaching is because they're too offended to even look anymore. They're I the debates are like not even exist anymore because they really think this is some outward kind of esoteric or something that's not a part of Jesus Christ, correct?
SPEAKER_10:Correct.
SPEAKER_12:Any comments or anything on that, Jacob?
SPEAKER_10:No.
SPEAKER_12:Hmm. I'm trying to debate here. Do I need to share the scripture? Do you not even eat?
SPEAKER_10:Uh, we can.
SPEAKER_12:Yeah, let's go to 1 Corinthians 5.11. Just I want to make sure people like um at least are confronted. They stand before God going, Yeah, I kind of sort of heard it.
SPEAKER_10:In case they think uh it's being made up.
SPEAKER_12:Yeah, well, or just you just I because I voiced it, it's like you're tuned out kind of thing. Um but can you imagine Charlie Kirk, Jordan Peterson, um, well, all these people, they stood up and said, Yeah, if you find anybody in the church, like most people couldn't find anybody because they're so blind, but first Corinthians 5 11. But now I am writing you that you must not. Now that's a commandment, is it not? Isn't that that clear? Now you'd be asking, well, the Holy Spirit, well, how do I do this? When do I do it? This doesn't mean I go on a self-righteous rant. I let God crucify my own sin, my own pride, my own judgments. It it takes a while to get the discernment and the love from Jesus Christ to know how this is applied. But but Paul is writing to people who at least have the basics of the message down. So don't take this as some commandment to check off that, oh, well, Tim Williams will approve because I accepted what he had to say. I applied it to the Christian religion, and so I don't associate with these people. You might get thoroughly rebuked. That's just nonsense. Jesus Christ has to lead you into that. There is a timing and a place, and yeah, but now I'm writing you that you must not associate with anyone, anyone who calls himself a brother but is sexually immoral, you know, revival bikinis, does that apply? Or greedy, an idolater? Oh, I know, combining the world along with turning point USA, or a slander, a drunkard, or a swindler with such a man, do not even eat. What business is of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? God will judge those outside. Expel the wicked man from among you. Did you see a lot of people being kicked out at Turning Point USA?
SPEAKER_10:Do.
SPEAKER_12:When they were passing out the white freedom caps and the freedom t-shirts, and everybody is entering into the auditorium. Did you hear a commandment that says, Yeah, you know anybody in here who claims to be a Christian but is sexually immoral? And defining that properly? A greedy doesn't hate and despise money, an idolator just fashioning his own opinion into what he thinks Jesus would be, a slander or a drunkard or a swindler, so on and so forth. And don't get the idea that this is a complete list. We can go to other scriptures. Did you see any of this talk? And anybody leaving with their head down like, yeah, I'm that, or maybe one or two people actually repenting?
SPEAKER_10:I didn't see any of that.
SPEAKER_12:Okay, I'm not even gonna go look because I think I'd be there a while. All right, so Erica Kirk now becomes the CEO of Turning Point USA. Let's talk about it and play the clip, Jacob.
SPEAKER_05:Erica Kirk is now CEO of Turning Point USA. Erica Kirk is now chief executive officer. Erica Kirk is now the front and center big banana of turning point. Now, here's what a living God commands. Here's what a holy God expects. Here is the turning point of love Jesus points to. Consider Titus 2.5. Women are to be self-controlled and pure, to be busy at home, or consider 1 Timothy 5, 11 through 15. As for younger widows, do not put them on a widows list. I counsel younger widows to marry, to have children, to manage their homes, and to give the enemy no opportunity for slander. Some have in fact already turned away to follow Satan. The Consider Podcast. Examining today's wisdom, folly, and madness. www.consider.info.
SPEAKER_12:All right, let's break this down, Jacob, because she claims to be a Christian. Obviously, I'm repeating that, but they've set up a whole trust fund for her and her kids, and there's donations going in to for her to support herself. Never mind, they lived in a very nice house. But that's not our point. The point is she made herself CEO. Well, let's go to God, let's go to the Bible at least, and let's say, okay, God, what should we counsel? Erica Kirk comes to me and goes, I'm a widow now. That's obvious. What would be God's will? Well, let's break it down. First Timothy 5, verse 9 there, Jacob. Go ahead and read that first line.
SPEAKER_10:No widow may be put on the list of widows unless she is over 60.
SPEAKER_12:Okay. So there's this list the church keeps. The church, Christians are in charge, right? Mm-hmm. Yeah. And she has to at least be over 60 before it even applies. Correct. And has been faithful to her husband. Verse 10 tells us what? And is well known for her good deeds. Not teaching, not ministry work, just good deeds. Such as, and he gives us an example, such as bringing up children. So clearly these are mature widows, right? Because they've brought up their children. And so you can look at that's not to guarantee the child becomes a Christian, but it is to guarantee that the raising up of those children was done in a very holy, humble, quiet manner, correct?
SPEAKER_10:Correct. And it's the first thing on the list. So there's a list here, but that like that's the top. So we can we can confidently say that is the number one priority, right? If if they have been raising up children all the way up to the age of 60, then they've been doing it a lot. And that's been their number one goal.
SPEAKER_12:Are you sure? Can you repeat that one more time? What is it you're saying?
SPEAKER_10:I'm saying that they should have been doing this. Oh, and if we should be doing what, Jacob?
SPEAKER_12:Doing what?
SPEAKER_10:Bringing up children. Number one. Top of the list. Before all the other stuff, right? So you're supposed to do other these other deeds, but the top one, the top one. It's not a career. It's not uh whatever all these other women want to do, running around doing the number one bringing up children.
SPEAKER_12:I thought it was shopping at Walmart, having Target, little retirement.
SPEAKER_10:Yeah, yeah, running around. I I don't even know what women do these days, being an influencer. I want to travel the world. People don't even want to have kids. You know what I mean? But that's a totally different subject. But you're supposed to be bringing up children.
SPEAKER_12:Actually, it's not a separate topic because what do women complain of? I don't want to raise kids, that the burden is trouble. Yes, it's called a cross. It's called laying down your life for somebody else. For women, raising up and bringing up children, as Titus says, being busy at home is a cross. So when a woman says, Well, I don't want to be busy at home, that's right. You don't want to pick up a cross.
SPEAKER_09:Yeah.
SPEAKER_12:It's that simple. Or the I like the class use, well, you know, we don't have the money, got to do two jobs. You haven't even tested God to see if we'll provide. So you haven't followed him, so that she's just not gonna work.
SPEAKER_10:No, I know. Yeah. Everyone likes, oh, society nowadays, you have to. You're like, really? You have to?
SPEAKER_12:Says who? Exactly. And not only that, verse 10 says, well known for good deeds, well known, such as bringing up children. They have to be well known for this, not this, well, I'm busy at home, but then you look at him and you go, No, you're not. You're busy doing crochet or doing your business or doing whatever else, you know, things you want to do. You're you're happy to send them to public schools just to get rid of them. All right, we beat up on that just for the moment, but it is significant, such as bringing up children, showing hospitality, washing the feet of the saints. Wow, can you imagine? Oh, I would be humbled even to walk into a house and have a godly woman wash my feet, serve me in that kind of humility. You don't even see it.
SPEAKER_09:No.
SPEAKER_12:Helping those in trouble and devoting herself to all kinds of good deeds. Do you see anything there about CEO work or going outside the home? I mean, if a if a woman attempted to do all those things, is there time for any of that other stuff?
SPEAKER_10:No, there is not.
SPEAKER_12:This generation it's amazing to me how the Christian church will not acknowledge with weeping and tears of how the children have been abandoned. And even among those who are quote busy at home, there's been having fun at home and versus raising them up in Jesus Christ, or at least prepared with God calls them and they respond. Yeah. All right, verse 11 says, Erica Kirk is a younger widow. Would we not agree?
SPEAKER_10:Yes.
SPEAKER_12:All right, so here's here's the counsel that I would have to say to her. As for younger widows, do not put them on such a list. You don't get a list, you don't get a trust fund, you don't get all these things. Guess what you get to do? You get to trust God. So you don't put them on any kind of list. They're not held up in any other way. So would there be a fundraising? This woman's not in need. She can sell the home, she can get they're rich people. As for younger widows, do not put them on such a list. Is that not a direct commandment?
SPEAKER_10:Yes.
SPEAKER_12:For when their sensual desires overcome their dedication dedication to Christ, they want to marry. What Paul is trying to do is circumvent the point with which the younger widow wants to marry. Do you get that?
SPEAKER_09:Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_12:So there's this, and we we see a little bit of this reflected on YouTube where these women are just crying out for a man and all of these kinds of things. So they're not being taught to first put their trust in Jesus Christ. This is hating for Jesus just in a nutshell, meaning that a woman always puts her trust in the living God, not in her husband. You don't see that at all anymore. Because what you see is the woman wants a good husband up front, wants a godly husband up front. It leaves no room for God to actually refine the man. And then when he doesn't live up to their expectations, they dump him or divorce him or they don't love him anymore, and they're not able to carry on because they don't have the love of Jesus Christ. Don't have time to get into all that. Did that make sense? That makes sense. So what takes over is essential, the biological, the chemical, the hormones overcome their dedication to Christ, and they want to marry. He wants to keep it from getting to that point. Can you imagine there's no way a church couldn't even live this out? I'd be in, don't have a church, there's no church to join. Don't worry, we're not going there. Never even really face this. But this is literally like a younger woman coming in. Yeah, I'm a widow, and I go, Well, you need to go get married. Anyway, verse 12 thus they bring judgment on themselves because they have broken their first pledge. A younger widow, overcome in her desire to be married, has broken her first pledge to Jesus Christ. There's some serious ramifications, obviously, to this, and he ends with it here in a moment. Verse 13 is kind of what you alluded to earlier. Besides, they get into the habit of being idle, going about from house to house, and not only do they become idlers, but also gossips and biddy busybodies saying things they ought not to. Any comment on that, Jacob?
SPEAKER_10:No, other than uh it he does seem to be lumping in any widows or like all of them together. Uh you know what I mean? I don't know. He doesn't lumping in all of the younger ones together. And so technically anything under 60.
SPEAKER_12:Well, and actually beyond, at one point in another scripture, he'll write and say, uh, the widow who lives for pleasure is dead while she's alive. Okay, yeah. So you're you're right on target. Besides, they get into the habit of being idle. Let's just kind of stop there at a moment. So the widow is a single mother, I don't know, the state provides whatever, church feels sorry for whatever. So there's a great danger in just being idle. You can have kids and be idle. Correct. And just doing what you want. And then they go from house to house because you got time on your hands. You know, I don't have a husband anymore, I don't have the responsibility of the kids. I, you know, they're off at public school, so you're just kind of home by yourself, right?
SPEAKER_09:Yeah.
SPEAKER_12:So then you just kind of get idle, you get a hobby, you start doing these things. There's so many needs in Jesus Christ and so few workers. Again, I realize being a mother is picking up your cross. Scripture's very clear on that, and most people have put it down. Not only do they become idlers, but also gossips and busy bodies. Yep, you start filling your time. What do you think tweeting is and uh messaging and all this, right? Correct. Saying things that ought not to be said. Megan Kelly ought to be doing something else. Which would be what? Raising her kids busy at home. And none of this, well, I have my studio in my home, and then I have my babysitters or my husband watching the kids. That's not what scripture is saying. We don't need more talk, we don't need more conspiracy theories. We need a generation of women busy at home, learning from experience, raising godly children, and older widows teaching the younger widows how to love their husbands and raise their kids. The whole focus of all women, whether older widows, younger widows, or whatever, is to manage the house, to raise children for the Lord. Correct?
SPEAKER_11:Correct.
SPEAKER_12:So I counsel younger widows to marry, to have children, to manage their homes and to give the enemy no opportunity for slander, you know, like a revival bikini. Look at verse 15. He says, Some in fact, this is a fact. Everything that we just looked at, if a woman is not living, the church is not emphasizing, turning point USA is not demanding, and all these people are stating this in very clear terms of the gospel, some have in. Fact, already turned away to follow Satan. Man, he's not mincing words there. No, we didn't read 14 though. We didn't? No. Oh we did not, and I have it highlighted in my notes, Jacob. So you get to read it. Go for it.
SPEAKER_10:First Timothy four five, fourteen. So I counsel younger widows to marry, to have children, to manage their homes, and to give the enemy no opportunity for slander.
SPEAKER_12:So I counsel younger widows to marry. You came to me, I'd go, you need to go get married. To have children. Yeah, I know. You got several now, but it's there. To manage their homes, not manage turning point USA, not be a CEO of a political movement, and to give the enemy no opportunity for slander. That's the council. Then, of course, as you pointed out, some in fact have already turned away to follow what? Satan. It's very clear what all these things are about. Alright, let's read and play the next verse. We're gonna go to 1 Timothy chapter 2, verse 9.
SPEAKER_05:The song America the Beautiful begins with honest words like this: Oh beautiful, for spacious skies, for amber waves of green, for purple mountain majesties above the fruited plain. America. America. Well, consider the God who created the heavens with sparkling lights, the God who created the vast array of beautiful birds, the God who created the soft colors of the rainbow, has his idea of a beautiful woman. Does Erica Kirk reflect the holiness of the living God? 1 Peter 3:3. A woman's beauty should not come from outward adornment, such as braided hair and the wearing of gold jewelry and fine clothes. Now consider what must be on the inside of Turning Point USA. The Consider Podcast. Examining today's wisdom, folly and madness.info.
SPEAKER_12:Jacob, do you know who Tammy Faye Baker is? Um vaguely. Man, she looks a lot like Tammy Faye Baker. Minus the tears and the the crying, because Tammy Faye was could cry on command and the mascara would run and so on and so forth. Anyway, does the dress look remotely anything, anything like what scripture has in mind? Yeah. First Timothy 2 9, I also want women to dress modestly. What a shock that has to be written down, people. With decency and propriety, you have to pick and choose what's proper, not with braided hair or gold or pearls or expensive clothes. What do you think? Did it look like she got those clothes at goodwill? No, it did not. Again, we're back to in verse 10, 1 Timothy 2 10, but with good deeds appropriate for women who profess to worship God. First Timothy 2 11. A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. Do I how do I need to explain that?
SPEAKER_10:Uh it seems pretty self-explanatory. It seems pretty clear.
SPEAKER_12:It does. I mean, the people that don't obey it spend their time talking about how it doesn't apply. Correct. A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. She's in a submittation. First Timothy 2 12. I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man. She must be silent. I don't hear turning point saying that. No. Now there's a very good reason for this. And this is not beating up on women. This is not like blaming women for the fall in the garden. In fact, both fell in the Garden of Eden, as far as I read the story, and as I experience dealing with my own sins in my own life, it's not like I run around going, I'm superior to women. No, the reality is we each, if we're a man, we have certain things that must be crucified in Christ, certain sins that must go. A woman must do certain things to allow the Holy Spirit to work, to save her, to sanctify her. We're both in the same boat, so to speak, in the same position, but we have to admit the truth in order to deal with the reality. In other words, I'm an older man. So if I went down to the Marines and said, Yeah, I'd like to join today, and they said, Well, no, because you're such and such age, you can't even do that many push-ups, you're of no use to us. Would I blame them for pointing out all my weaknesses? No. No. In fact, I at the end of the day, if they said, Well, sure, come on in, start marching, I'd probably thank them for kicking me out, don't you think?
SPEAKER_11:Correct.
SPEAKER_12:There's a reason why women are not to be in leadership, a CEO, busy at home. There's reasons for that. 1 Timothy 2.13, it's kind of obvious. For Adam was formed first. That's not a cultural thing, that's a creation thing. Then Eve. Reason number one, why a woman should be busy at home, why a woman should not teach or have authority over a man, why she must be silent. The first reason is because God, the living God, created Adam first and then Eve. Again, kind of clear. Is anything I need to add to that, Jacob? No. Now see again, 1 Timothy 2.11. Let me back up. A woman should learn in quietness. Notice the key word full submission. There is a submission that's not full, meaning, oh yeah, I'm quiet in church, but at home, I'm telling my husband what I think.
SPEAKER_11:Yeah.
SPEAKER_12:That's my domain. That belongs to me. It's not full submission. Please. Yes, I saw it, my wife, her advice and her viewpoint and things, but there was an attitude of full submission. And if I don't ask for it, I don't want it, or if I reject it, and so on and so forth. Nobody's going to imagine the love that was behind that because this is massively offensive. Massively offensive. So you people can't see the love in it. That's the reason that prosecutors, Simmons and Satisberg and all these people couldn't see the love behind Christianity and the gentleness that was there at Sound Doctrine Church was because all they could do is see the offense and they hated the offense of the cross. All of this is done in love. All of this is done in gentleness. That's what God is working. All of I don't have time to go into it. I'm just telling you, Jacob, what was there not a just an overflowing of love and the seeking of the Holy Spirit and the gentleness of God and all these things? Yes. Let's leave it at that. First Timothy chapter 2, verse 14 gives us another reason, Jacob. Go ahead and you get to read that one.
SPEAKER_10:And Adam was not the one deceived. It was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner.
SPEAKER_12:Now Adam's sin was he just stood there because Scripture says Adam was there watching the whole thing, and he let this transpire. This actually explains why men like to watch women sin. And I'll leave it at that for now. Adam was not the one deceived. He wasn't deceived about what was going on, but he was enticed by what was going on. Am I kind of clear there?
SPEAKER_09:Yes.
SPEAKER_12:All right. But the woman who was dis who was deceived and became a sinner. This is why when you're dating and you tell a woman lovely things, she believes it, right? Correct. I mean, I I never was involved in that kind of dating situation, but it's like I'm amazed at how much the the guy's using the same line on a bunch of women, and then eventually women complain and whine about her, some do anyway. But why they believe these things and why they're deceived up front is goes back to the Garden of Eden. They really believe these things. I mean, I look at these women that supposedly went off with these groups or you know, all the stuff that's in the news, and like they didn't know where they were going. They thought they were going to prayer meetings and so on and so forth. The woman was deceived and became a sinner. You know, you've heard the saying that behind every good man there's a good woman, right? Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_09:Yep.
SPEAKER_12:Well, it's actually the other way around. Behind every good woman is a righteous man.
SPEAKER_09:Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_12:Because a man is there to keep her from being taken in by the deception. Why why do you think in Proverbs it talks about that if a man catches a woman, his wife, with another man, who does he go after, Jacob?
SPEAKER_10:Uh he goes after the other man.
SPEAKER_12:The other man. And why is that? Because intrinsically, we know that the woman was just taken in. Now I'm not telling you some men aren't taken in, but but they're not deceived about it. If a woman's coming on to him, he's not deceived about what's taking place. Whereas a woman, you can play with the emotions, you can reel her in kind of thing. She can be deceived with all of that kind of talk. And you go, why? What's going on here? It's because of the fall in the Garden of Eden. That's another reason why Paul is saying younger widows need to marry. First Timothy 2, 15. But women will be saved through what, Jacob? Childbearing. When they talk about the salvation of Jesus Christ and revival breaking out, right? Do they ever tell the women, hey, by the way, you can ask Jesus in your heart, you can hop and skip, you can do whatever it is we're doing, you can sign this, you can say the believer's prayer. Do they ever say, but hey, as a woman, you will be saved? Now think about what he's saying. Saved through childbearing.
SPEAKER_10:No, they never talk about that.
SPEAKER_12:Wow. Do you in in the Bible covers? Do you ever see it listed like ask Jesus in your heart? And you know I'm saying things I don't mean, like get water baptized, get the full message, and then note at the bottom, women, you'll be saved through childbearing. No. But women will be saved through childbearing if they continue. See, there's an if even to that. It's amazing what God has put on women. But I that sounds negative. When it's not, it is a salvation experience to lay down your life for your children and your husband. Did not Jesus willingly obey the Father out of love and lay down his life for us? These women who obey this by the power of the Spirit are sharing in the love of Jesus Christ. The love of the Father, right? Correct. Saved through childbearing. And not just childbearing. It's not like the Catholic Church where you just have a bunch of children. It's as if they continue in faith, love, and holiness with propriety. Are we getting the idea here of a very humble, well-dressed, and by well-dressed, I mean conservative, rich in faith, trusting God with her husband and her family, in love that flows from the Holy Spirit, that only is a result of the fact that she's hating her children, hating her father and her mother and so on and so forth, and letting hating her own life and letting the love of Jesus Christ flow to her children, flow to her husband. She's broken of self. She's breaking the jar at Jesus' feet. She's worshiping a holy God by loving her family and being busy at home. And then you add on to that holiness with propriety. I mean, how how many things are being spoken about this and shown by Erica Kirk?
SPEAKER_10:None of these things.
SPEAKER_12:None. In fact, the opposite, it's revival bikini time. Not man, that's just blaspheme.
SPEAKER_10:Just there's a lot of groups that will dismiss this and they'll say, no, she is continuing in faith, right? She's carrying on the husband's ministry. I'm just saying, you know, there's plenty of people that will say, Oh, but this is true of her when it's actually not.
SPEAKER_12:Exactly. It's the same sin as Saul when he was confronted by the prophet and said to obey is better than sacrifice.
SPEAKER_11:Correct.
SPEAKER_12:So you don't go around going, Well, I serve this ministry, I'm honoring my husband, I'm carrying on his faith. Disobeying God's word is not an honor.
SPEAKER_11:Correct.
SPEAKER_12:Now, somebody might also say, Well, my wife can't have children, and so on and so forth. Look, every woman should be involved in helping to raise and bring up godly children. Think of all the Christian women, and I'm by that I mean disciples of Jesus, were totally united, working together, not just homeschooling, but just in this kind of spirit, and then the government comes along to touch on that, there'd be that then would be a holy uprising. We're getting close to getting out of time here, really, Jacob. Let's finish up with Megan Kelly and Tucker Carlson, obviously Erica Kirk, Charlie Kirk, all these people, turning points. Everybody says they believe in God. So go ahead and play that clip, Jacob, and then we'll just talk about this a little bit.
SPEAKER_00:You knew him well. You talked to him all the time. It's just trying to understand the void that's been left by this senseless murder. It feels impossible.
SPEAKER_01:I I agree with that, and I but I do think it makes a kind of sense. I mean, above all, Charlie represented belief in God, and that is the divide. I'm sorry to say, I mean, there's an effort to recast this as a different kind of contest between worldviews. It's no, the dividing line is do you think God exists or do you think you are God? And it's that simple. It has always been that simple. It will never change. And I think our souls are at stake. I really, really believe that. I think Jesus is the only answer. Sorry.
SPEAKER_12:That is so the whole emphasis there is on believing in God, correct? Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_10:Jesus. You gotta believe in Jesus.
SPEAKER_12:Yeah. Again, and we're defining what belief would be, which is actually following the Holy Spirit into obedience, correct? Correct. Um, well, demons believe in God, they just don't obey. So that would be a common denominator, would it not? Yes. Go to James chapter 2, verse 19, just for make sure people really know what we're talking about, and then we'll come back to our main scripture here in just a moment. James chapter 2, verse 19. And he's being sarcastic here. James chapter 2, verse 19, you believe there is one God. Good. Even the deleman butchered that. Cut that out, Jacob. James chapter 2, verse 19 says, You believe there is one God. Good. Even the demons believe that and shudder. Tucker Carlson and Megan Kelly need to shudder. That's why verse 20 goes on to say in James, you foolish man or woman, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless? Did you catch the word useless there? All right. So I know they claim they obey, and that's why we're pointing out what scripture says. If you claim the name, then let's go down and look at scripture by the power of God to see if it matches up with the gospel of Jesus Christ. Doesn't that seem reasonable?
SPEAKER_10:Yes, it does.
SPEAKER_12:Well, let me give you an example. Go to Acts chapter 16, verse 16, and this is what people need to watch out for that a demonic spirit can tell you the way to be saved. Acts chapter 16, verse 16. Go ahead, Jacob, and read verse 16 there.
SPEAKER_10:Once when we were going to the place of prayer, we were met by a slave girl who had a spirit by which she predicted the future. She earned a great deal of money for her owners by fortune telling.
SPEAKER_12:Okay, let's kind of break this down just a little bit. Where are they going to, Jacob?
SPEAKER_10:A place of prayer.
SPEAKER_12:So you would think, like, we're going to a place of prayer, and since we're the average schmo Christian, we think we're in a place of safety, correct?
SPEAKER_11:Correct.
SPEAKER_12:We're a church, we're praying, we're seeking God, I'm protected, I'm a believer, sound doctrine, or that considered podcast as nonsense, right?
SPEAKER_09:Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_12:So they meet a slave girl who had a spirit, clearly an unclean spirit. Yes. A spirit by which she predicted the future. So she has all kinds of wisdom and she could point to stuff and she could go over here. Now, in this case, it was predicting the future. There are other spirits like they know things about other people and they give, you know, the preacher, the pastor, or the member, or the church member whatever wisdom about their life, right?
SPEAKER_09:Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_12:She earned a great deal of money for her owners by fortune telling. Now, you tell me, Jacob, is uh Tucker Carlson earning a great deal of money? Sure is. What do you think about Megan Kelly?
SPEAKER_10:Yes. She signed a massive deal with Sirius XM.
SPEAKER_12:Well, how much is she getting? Do you know? You're up on the mic?
SPEAKER_10:I don't, I just know it's in the it's millions. I don't know. I i it may only be like, oh, four million. It may be low millions, but I'm pretty sure it's millions.
SPEAKER_12:How come they're not offering me like two million to I could do it?
SPEAKER_10:Well, there's a lot of reasons.
SPEAKER_12:Really? Okay. So I got myself sidet. She earned a great deal of money for her owners by fortune telling. So just tack in, like, you know, talking conspiracy theories or doing this over here. Uh has Jordan Peterson made a lot of money? Oh, oh, yeah, a lot. And we won't even be able to get to him today. We're gonna have to kind of wrap this up. The point is there that the spirit is saying you can be saved by what they're preaching. Acts chapter 16, verse 17. This girl followed Paul. So it would look like, well, I'm following Paul. I'm seeking to follow God. I'm interested in these guys. Right? Well, from outward appearance, like, okay, you know, I'm following Paul, I'm following scripture, I'm listening to these sermons, and the rest of us, like, oh, you guys are really at it, you're doing good, right? Shouting, these men are servants of the most high God. Like the flattery touch. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Now, now, wouldn't you can you imagine you walk into Turning Point and I go, Charlie Kirk, he's a servant, or he was a servant of the most high God. Would I be rejected? Oh no, they would like that. Would anybody test me to go, oh, by what spirit are you saying that? And where's that coming from? No. Not only that, the spirit also said these men are servants of the most high God who are telling you the way to be saved. Is that all true? That is true. It's all true. Let everybody let that sink in. It's all true, but it's not of the living holy God. It's not of Jesus Christ. And yet it's an affirmation, it's a recommendation, it's an agreement. I would venture to say 99.9% of so-called Christians would fully embrace this woman, take her into church, she'd probably be in charge. She might even be preaching for all I know. These men are servants of the most high God who are telling you the way to be saved. Okay, verse 18. She kept this up for many days. Now you've heard this sermon before, Jacob. I don't know whether you remember or not. Why did Paul allow her to do this for many days?
SPEAKER_10:Um I don't actually have the answer.
SPEAKER_12:Well, and we won't have time to look at it today, but once he rebukes the spirit and the spirit is kicked out, and these folks cannot make any money from it, they attack Paul. He goes to prison. He has all he knew the consequences of what would happen.
SPEAKER_11:Correct.
SPEAKER_12:It's kind of like if I were invited to speak at Turning Point USA somewhere, right? And I know that when I go there and I begin to preach the word, what is going to happen?
SPEAKER_10:Persecution.
SPEAKER_12:Persecution, run out, turned away, whatever. So let's say I'm invited, I go there, and I'm first talking with people and I'm sharing the gospel because I know that once I get on the stage and I begin to preach, that's it. Correct. It's over with. So he's trying to make the most of the situation to preach the gospel. Finally, it says Paul became so troubled that he turned around and said to the Spirit, In the name of Jesus Christ, I command you to come out of her. And at that moment the Spirit left her. What can I say? We have to have true faith in Jesus Christ. Quit paying attention to every spirit that says, This is the way to be saved. And these people are ser you know, and it's true, Paul was a servant of the Most High God. It goes on, we're we're really out of time. Anything you want to want to talk about, Jacob?
SPEAKER_10:No, other than yeah, the the clear warning. Because nowadays, as soon as somebody says, Well, I believe in Jesus, oh, they're like a a brother in Christ, a sister in Christ, right? You should accept them into the fold.
SPEAKER_12:There's no thought of application like, well, in fact, just kind of today, somebody told me that somebody's gonna get baptized, right? And I said, Well, now the work begins. They've sat down and count the costs, they've done these things. This is not a self-promotion. They read Even Demons Believe. I have not talked to them. This is stuff they're doing on their own, but now the work actually does begin. Will the person be obedient? Will they allow God to actually do that? This is a big if, but they've at least counted the cost and moving forward. Go ahead and play Even Demons Believe, and we probably should call that a wrap for today, Jacob.
SPEAKER_06:JF, who lives in Brazil, said of the book, Even the Demons Believe. I would like to tell you that I'm doing chapter seven right now. It's the second time I have read the book, Even the Demons Believe. And I think it's an impacting book. Literally impacting. Let us say the first time you read it, you get shocked, outraged, and maybe sort of mad at the author. However, a second reading makes you go deep into your own spiritual life and church experiences. I presume it has gotten people exactly where Pastor Williams wanted them to be. Cornered and faced off by their own attitude towards the Almighty. If you are interested in the full and complete gospel message before becoming a disciple of Jesus, then the book Even the Demons Believe might prove helpful. As the angel told the Apostle Peter in Acts 5 20, go stand in the temple courts, he said, and tell the people the full message of this new life. The book Even the Demons Believe will also guide those claiming the name Christian to test themselves. As the Apostle Paul wrote in 2 Corinthians 13 5, examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not realize that Christ Jesus is in you? Unless, of course, you fail the test.
SPEAKER_02:Nothing on the Consider Podcast should be considered legal or life advice. Each is admonished to seek a holy God and obey by picking up a cross to follow Jesus. The Consider Podcast.