the Move with Justin Khoe
if you're looking more for conversations about the Bible instead of pre-packaged answers you're probably going to enjoy this show.this is our podcast where we vibe with the book, 10 minutes at a time.
the Move with Justin Khoe
S1E9 | Keeping God's Law Isn't Enough | Romans 2 Analysis
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Discover the transformative power of seeking God's glory—our latest session delves into the depths of Romans chapter two, where the quiet work of the Divine takes root in our hearts. As we traverse through the scripture, we uncover the true essence of glory, honor, and immortality, realized through the ultimate act of self-sacrifice exemplified by Jesus. Our conversation goes beyond the written commandments, challenging us to redefine sin as the failure to seek this divine glory. With every word, we invite you to journey alongside us, reexamining the pride of possessing the oracles of God and the greater revelation the law signifies.
This episode also casts a light on the profound impact others have on our spiritual journey, pressing us to widen our circle of inclusivity and embrace the Spirit's work in the lives of those we may not fully understand. As we reflect on these truths, the importance of nurturing our inner selves becomes clear—our private cultivation directly influences our public persona and actions. Join us for a session that promises not only to stimulate the mind but to ignite the soul, urging us to live out our faith with genuine authenticity in every facet of life. No matter where you find yourself on your spiritual walk, this conversation is a heartfelt invitation to grow, to learn, and to be transformed.*
*Description generated by AI.
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Seeking God's Glory Concept
Speaker 1Are you attuned to what God is doing in your heart or not ? Yeah , and what's crazy about it is that God could be working in your heart and you don't even know it . In fact that's how it always starts .
Speaker 2Welcome back to the move where we're vibing In the book 10 minutes at a time .
Speaker 1You're using this language a lot vibing . I don't know we ever explained that . Did we not explain Vibein ? It's a language that we use a lot . We use it in different contexts .
Speaker 2Yeah . So when we're hanging like if we're just if , me and Justin are out having a cup of coffee talking about Just things , life , somebody asks is what'd you do this morning ? I mean , me and Justin was just vibing , just vibe . So it's just about communing together and just experiencing . You know one another in this Relationship of you know , brotherly love and that's kind of the idea .
Speaker 1We're trying to do that not only together because we think community matters , but we're also vibing with the text , really what we mean by that . Reviving with God , yeah , it's just , this is just time .
Speaker 2Connecting with the father , yeah , and we're just coming to meet God on his own terms in the book and just trying to follow the flow . That's why we're on the move in the book , vibing with it . Yeah , so what are we vibing with today ?
Speaker 1We're looking at Romans , chapter two , verses 12 to 16 . Okay , did you read it ? I ?
Speaker 2did read . Y'all gotta go read it , check it out . Put this phone . Pause will be right here .
Speaker 1Subscribe while you're reading or after probably after focus on this , those verses in the meantime here we go , there we go , all right let me , let me address something , okay , right from the get-go . We're just , we're just having all kinds of preamble for this one Let me address something .
Speaker 2I want to address the fact that we actually need to start the ten minutes , and then I'll address the thing , because that's where I thought we were gone .
Speaker 1So I'll let you do it . So let me do that real quick . Three , two , one .
Speaker 2Don't worry guys , we'll get you out here on time go so when you're seeking for glory , honor and immortality , in the previous ten minutes , that Paul's argument and I'm just gonna give away a bit of the game as we're moving forward because you know , I think we're somewhat familiar with the Romans to do to a degree , and if we're not , it's alright if we give a little bit Away is that the glory , honor and immortality that Paul actually has , as I said , on that he's moving towards is the Glory of a crucified king , which is crazy . Which is crazy because he is Lord and what he's Lord . He's not sitting on an imperial throne in Rome , he's actually enthroned with a crown of thorns on a cross and he's seeking immortality by giving it away , and he's seeking the honor of the kingdom by being dishonored , by giving up his life . He's seeking immortality by being dishonored , he's looking for honor and by being broken in his body , he's seeking for the glory of yours , right ? Yeah , and so what Paul is saying is that there's this line of thinking , that Paul is saying like , listen , this is the end game of what it really means to do the will of God , and he'll give it away a little later , but he says anything short of that is Legitimately what the Bible calls sin . Hmm , and so anything less than seeking for that sort of glory , honor and immortality is what the Bible calls in . This will be really Important as we dive into these next few thoughts that Paul has .
Speaker 1Yeah . So with that said , I wrote at the top of today's passage Paul attacks the uniqueness of Judaism that's kind of what my my summary of this is ? Because you know , the Jews are very happy , it's very proud . They got the oracles . You talked about this us for STEM mentality , and here Paul really is coming to bat at the very root of this thing .
Speaker 2Yeah , and it's you know , rightly so . I think that if God had spoken to my people from a mountain and I held that history , I'd be pretty proud to hey , check it out . Yeah , I mean , that's , that's an awesome heritage to carry . It's got chosen people right . It's just a beautiful , beautiful thing . And yet Paul's argument is that the law actually prophesies towards something . It's not the end in itself . Hmm , right , yeah , so that law keeping right , doing law , is not just simply complying with Obedience , but he's saying it's actually seeking a certain type of glory , honor and immortality that we've already named . So that he says in verse 12 for all who have sinned and we know this famous passage that we'll get to later , but let's just put it here Go for it . All have sinned and fallen short of the glory . So that if you haven't actually sought the glory of another by this self-sacrifice , right , if you've sinned without the law . So if you're a Gentile , if you're a part of the nations and you're self seeking because you're like , why would I ever do that ? Why would I ever actually give my life for another one ? If you do that without the law , then you've sinned . But then there are those who have the oracles of God and they still do the same self seeking .
Speaker 1So I'm coming back to what you were just quoting and in , was it three , three , 23 . Three 23 , all sinned , fallen short of the glory of God . We can quickly point towards breaking the commandments . But what you did right there , trying to see if this is what you intended to do , is that you are kind of looking at that text to define what sin is and you're saying it's not seeking the glory of God , it's falling short of that glory of God .
Speaker 2Yeah , yeah , yeah , yeah . So , falling short of what , and above I understand what you're saying , right , Is that let's frame it like this , because I like to frame . So , if we frame it like this , that the law is not so much prescriptive prescriptive of what you will do when you hear it , that you will do this right as much as it's describing the heart and goal of what a righteous life looks like , right ? So in a sense , you could say that the law is prophetic as it's looking forward . So this is . Jesus says that the law and the prophets prophesied until John . Right ? So that , then , the law is looking forward and looking towards something . And what I think Paul is arguing is that the righteousness that the law is looking toward as the beacon of right , doing in keeping with the law , is to seek the sort of glory , honor and immortality where you would be willing to lay your down life for another . The Gentiles didn't have the oracles of God , so they would have never seen it . Oh , why would I do that ? But the Israelites , the nation that had the oracles , they didn't see it either , right ? So Paul goes on to say listen , it's not just the hearers of the law , because , israel , you had the pleasure to hear the law , but it's also those who do the law , and the question is have you actually done the righteousness that the law was actually pointing to ?
Speaker 1Yeah , there's this kind of juxtaposition between these two groups of people , and I think we do this us first them thing again in modern context , where we are the hearers , we're Christians , we're people of the book , as it were , and anyone who's not us , they're not as good as us or they're not as whatever as us . But Paul seems to be saying like , listen , it's not that simple . There are people and this is kind of one of the questions I have . He's describing Gentiles who do not have the law but who do what the law requires , which is really interesting . And then it says that they show that the work of the law is written on their hearts and what's interesting is that it's the work of the law .
Speaker 2And what is the work of the law ? If we fast forward just a little bit , the work of the law ends up being highlighting that we indeed fall short of a high mark , and we don't actually need the 10 commandments in order to To know that we've fallen short of a law . To demonstrate this to us right , I heard a preacher once say the way I summarize it , he says , is that you will end up being judged by all of the laws that you yourself set up for yourself , all the things you said that you could and should do . And , intuitively , when you hear that , you're like Amen , I never meet my own expectations , and this is what James is getting at right .
Speaker 1To him that knows to do good and doesn't do it . That's when it's in .
Speaker 2And yet , what Paul is highlighting here , that the work of the law is to actually have that awareness of , I always fall short . The work of the law is not to impart on you some sort of energy that then allows you to keep it . No , the work of the law is for you to come to this consciousness of that . Oh , there's an expectation I don't meet . And what Paul is doing is saying he's ultimately going to this place of saying listen , the highest expectation is this crucified Christ , who is really glorious , immortal and honored on a cross . However , we ourselves with the expectations of the law , you the Jew who have it , and you , the Gentiles who don't , we all fall short . And yet the Gentiles , without the law , have the very work of the law in their hearts , because their consciousness is constantly at war with the expectation of how they should live and how they don't measure up , so that they themselves are a testament to the presence of some sort of law , morality and not meeting up . This is tension . I read it somewhat differently .
Speaker 1The view of the Jew was that anyone outside , well , clearly they're lost . I see Paul kind of pointing at some hypothetical person outside of their communities , like no , no , no , look at that person . That person is showing by their works that the law is written on their hearts . That's New Covenant language , that's the spirit infused into this person language . And yet there's this person who , in a certain respect , hasn't even heard of the law but by the way that they live , is demonstrating that they're living unto the law and so they're showing , demonstrating that the spirit is in them .
Speaker 2Let me try this on for size , if you know this version of saying it , I know some non-believers who are actually better Christians than those who confess .
Speaker 1And that's what I'm wrestling through with this text , because in evangelical Christianity the idea is like oh , unless you audibly profess the name of Jesus , you can't be saved . But I don't know that that's what that's saying .
Speaker 2The work of the law is at work in the hearts of people , and they're actually trying to at least attain . Some try to attain , they seek it right . Others just who cares , who cares ? But yet , for those who are seeking , apart from the revelation of the law , it's obvious that the work of the law is within them , which then leads to this other thorny issue . That then , is the law the thing that actually reveals to my consciousness truth , or is it something else ? When you say law , you mean 10 commandments . I mean 10 commandments , I mean every sort of little thing that we have to do in order to behave .
Speaker 1Paul's saying that's not the thing . There's this other thing that's present , that's available to all people , whether they've seen the Decalogue where they have the oracles or not . Why ? Because God's spirit is moving on all people , because God shows no partiality . And the question for you and the question for me is what do we do when we sense God moving on our heart ? Because it's easy to look at that person over there and be like , oh yeah , clearly ain't doing it . But if we take this text at face value , that spirit's working in my life today . So what do I do with that ? Yeah , yeah , Ooh , ooh .
Speaker 2Listen , turn that thing off real quick and we're gonna get a plus 90 seconds real quick . Go for it . And here's why Because ultimately , this passage talks about that God will judge the secrets of man right . He will judge it according to the gospel of Jesus , and what I wanna point out is that the secret is what's going on in the heart . What is it that the heart identifies with ? Does the heart identify simply with the passions and the desires that then lead to self-seeking , or does the heart identify with that thing that's telling you there's a more glorious , there's a greater immortality and a greater honor ? You don't know quite know what that is , but you know that it's not the self-seeking way . And if you're identifying with that , even if you haven't heard the name of Jesus , that is the instinct and impulse of Jesus that work within you , right , so that then , when we are judged by our secret place , I think that it's the confession that you hold in the interior , being the place of your heart , is what is ultimately gonna determine what judges you .
Speaker 1It's that posture of your heart that's revealed , sure , by what you do . This is why we were talking about in previous ones that you're judged by your works and things like that . But all that is just the revelation of what's happening inside . Are you attuned to what God is doing in your heart or not ? And what's crazy about it is that God can be working in your heart and you don't even know . In fact that's how it always starts . When I think back to my life and I think back to my journey that God's brought me on , I had no clue what God was doing in my heart , but I had a heart that was saying , okay , I'm open to
Impact of Others on Personal Growth
Speaker 1this . Whatever this is , and what I think Paul is trying to say here is that , listen , there's people outside the walls , outside of the camp , who God's working on and they're following , they're moving .
Speaker 2And that's a sobering thing , because it ends up , at least for me , that those outside of my group , those outside of the wall , as it were , I would say , oh well , they don't know , and then it gets turned back around on me , where it's like the Spirit of God is working on them . To you , what about you ?
Speaker 1What about you ? It's like that thing that Jesus says at the end of John right , what do you care if what I'm doing with him or him or whatever ?
Speaker 2you follow me . So what am I putting on in the secret ? Because what I put out in the secret , what I put on in the secret here , is what's gonna come out in the open . Yeah , oh man , so much , yeah , quick . So that was AA a 10 plus 10 plus .
Speaker 1Thanks for hanging out , guys . Hope you enjoy .