Mobile Armored Podcast Show

M.A.S.K., Thundercats, and Mego Toys (with Kevin Abrams!)

• Adam Moore and PJ McNerney • Season 1 • Episode 38

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It's M.A.S.K. Episode 38 - "The Curse of Solomon's Gorge." After Scott and T-Bob are left to wander the desert alone, the predictable happens - T-Bob falls down a well, Scott and T-Bob are almost crushed to death, and Scott nearly drowns. But somehow, Matt Trakker evades the clutches of child protective services once again.

Writer, director, musician, and novelist Kevin Abrams joins us for a wide-ranging discussion that covers M.A.S.K., his love of Thundercats, and his family connections to legendary toy company Mego Toys. 

Kevin's first novel - Mt. Forgotten - will be released later this month. You can also check out some of his incredible films, which are available to stream on Amazon.com:

  • I Got A Monster (2023), a documentary on the Baltimore Gun Trace Task Force
  • Marisol (2023), a coming-of-age drama about an undocumented woman who is falsely accused of a crime

https://www.instagram.com/m.a.s.k.podcast/

Adam:

Welcome to the Mobile Armored Podcast show, the podcast that transforms into a bootleg Indiana Jones Adventure. My name is Adam Moore, alongside the co-host and best friend PJ McNerney. How's it going today, pj?

PJ:

I am doing well and I'm excited for this episode. one interesting fact that the audience will not have known is that, we actually recorded this once before, but there was some audio problems,

Adam:

I wanna point out, this is the type of dedication we have to our craft we will talk about episode 38 of Mask Twice. We recorded the entire episode and had to re-record it. But, um, that happened. Then spring, you know, we took a very extended spring break and had some time to think about, what direction we wanna take the podcast in now that we've hit the midpoint of the series, right? So what do we want to do? And we thought about switching up the format a little bit, because people are sick of the two of us making each other laugh

PJ:

I am not,

Adam:

No,

PJ:

other people probably.

Adam:

but others are. and we wanna bring in other voices to, elevate the discourse, which is why we're bringing in screenwriter, director, musician and novelist. Kevin Abrams to the show. Kevin, how's it going?

Kevin:

What's up world and graphic novelists, Mr. Moore, because I remember you and I publishing a couple of graphic novels together, sir. So let's not forget that. Resume builder.

Adam:

I wanna point out that, pertinent to our show, which, is a, you know, a podcast about a cartoon series that Adver ties toys in the eighties. You have a family connection to the Great Migo Toy Company.

Kevin:

Yes, that was my family's toy company. My uncle Martin Abrams was the CEO. My dad was in charge of manufacturing and sales and they, they in the seventies were very much one of the first people to spearhead looking at toys and media and content together. my uncle developed toys like Sky Dancer and Dragonflies and Visionaries, which were all predicated under the notion of toy half hour cartoon, go tell your parents to buy something.

Adam:

Migo also have both DC and Marvel at the beginning?

Kevin:

they were the original beast. They had DC Marvel, Star Trek and Planet of the Apes,

Adam:

right.

Kevin:

and most importantly, wonder Woman and, Farrah Faucet. They had a Farrah Faucet doll that a Cher Doll. They had a greatest American hero doll. They had Starsky and Hutch love boat. I mean, any seventies media extravaganza you can think of. They try to put their fingerprints on the black hole, which is a secret favorite sci-fi movie of mine,

Adam:

we're really, really excited to have you on this adventure now. Tell us about, mask. How did you watch it when you were young or is coming on this podcast,

Kevin:

definitely on.

Adam:

to it.

Kevin:

No, it was on the rotation. It was inevitable for it not to be. You come home three 30, you knew what was going on locally. Channel five or 11 where I live, being in New Jersey, so it was in the rotation. Was I a huge fan of it? No, I always thought it was sort of cool, but that was, I think more a residual effect of me just staying away from toy related stuff. Like, I know I probably sound like an obnoxious brat, but growing up in it, I could not give a crap about toys or any of that stuff. I was like baseball, basketball. And my dad would come home with literally bags of GI Joes, like you know, Just not in their plastic thing. He'd hand me like 250, he'd be like, here. And I'd be like, awesome. That's great. And I mean, I remember once coming home to the seven foot battle carrier.

Adam:

way.

Kevin:

Like constructed waiting for me in my bedroom and playing with it for like six minutes and being like, cool, and then forgetting about it. it just wasn't like, I just wasn't a toy kid which I know is weird being from a toy family, but, you sort of rebel against what's presented in front of you. my favorite ones were actually weirder. I was obsessed with like the gummy bear one'cause I just love that opening theme song. And I was obsessed with gummy bears in generals. we watched a lot of, an maniacs and like stuff like that. my sister was huge on care bears, and then of course for me the ultimate was Thundercats. That was the one I religiously watched

Adam:

good.

Kevin:

and wanted to be lion o very badly and hang out with Pantera and that badass crew.

PJ:

We all had a crush on Chiara. Okay,

Kevin:

I mean, I'm not gonna go there'cause my wife may hear this, but my wife is the human version of Jatara. Let's just put it that way.

Adam:

Well, why don't we, segue, into the episode here. It's episode 38. The Curse of Solomon's Gorge, mask goes to Africa to stop venom. Who has discovered King's Solomon's treasures? we open in the wilds of Africa in a campsite with canvas tents, and we've got these typical British imperialists who are discussing a gold scarab. That quote probably brought down here by Arab traitors long after the reign of the pharaohs,

Kevin:

Yeah. the color choice too is very interesting for these characters. It's like this orangeish sort of brown, which I would've loved to be in that conversation. Like two brown, two orange, oh, there we go. That's the Arab color that represents the dark continent. It's like a very bizarre decision.

PJ:

I love that you think they had a conversation rather than just like

Kevin:

Listen, there's no credit for a writer. I went to IMDB Pro and there's no credit for a writer. Is that commonplace on the whole series?

PJ:

there's very few episodes you can actually pinpoint a writer on. We've seen a couple, but

Kevin:

Mm-hmm.

PJ:

few and far between.

Adam:

the

Kevin:

So everybody was paid in cash

Adam:

Yeah, one of the,

Kevin:

Give me the episode. I'll give you the$400.

Adam:

or Koch whatever they wanted back then. But you know who one of the writers was and we can't confirm that he was or was not on drugs. It's Chuck, Lori was one of the writers of masks.

Kevin:

I saw that. That's incredible. I'm hoping to confirm he was on drugs. I know he is sober now, so it could have been during his fun period.

Adam:

well, suddenly the water level in the well nearby starts to drop and one of those locals says the curse SAA is coming, and it freaks them all out they all start running except like the British imperialists, And, they're telling'em like, it's saa, angry. We have defiled his land. This British dude's like, don't be ridiculous. Like, obviously don't trust the simple-minded locals, which for me, that's a Buddy Hawks nomination for Dr. Britt here. and for tho and, and for

PJ:

Huge.

Adam:

don't know,

PJ:

Yeah.

Adam:

Hawks nomination is for the, most racist comment.

Kevin:

Oh no, I'm caught up. I love your Roy Batty nominations. You got your buddy Hawks. I also think we should point out how they already also made caricatures of the British people, they literally look like the most cliched version. Of a 1940s British action film starring Ronald Coleman. They're in safari gear with safari tents. It's like as cliched sort of an imperial slick you can give to a bri

PJ:

I think they referenced the movie Gungadin to pull out this art direction.

Kevin:

I mean, it's incredible and I love the random shot of the jungle cat that seems to somehow open the show, which was interesting

Adam:

whose eyes, whose

Kevin:

Yeah.

Adam:

as the camera goes by.

Kevin:

Yes. For a desert set adventure.

Adam:

I guess it's hard to say where we really are.

PJ:

Is it a desert? Is it lush? They just refer to it as Africa.

Kevin:

I also love the screenwriting shorthand of just opening someplace without an explanation as to how they got there, where they are.

Adam:

every single episode of this show, there is no explanation well, actually, I'll take that back but there's no kind of real world reason why Scott, Matt and t Bobb are wherever they are, except what we will find out in about half the episodes is that they knew Venom was operating in the area, and so they went on vacation to Italy because they knew Venom was operating in the area.

Kevin:

Well, I look forward to actually discussing that when we get to that reveal in this episode.'cause once again, the screenwriting shorthand is very short.

Adam:

well just to wrap up with the Brits here, they look down in the gorge, their vehicles are gone, which seems to be the most shocking thing of all. Funny. We had paid for the extra insurance. meanwhile, Matt, Alex, Scott, and tva are in Thunder Hawk and they're riding inside a herd of rhinos, like a galloping herd of rhinos. It seems very safe.

PJ:

I wonder because Matt knows he can transform his car into a jet at any time. many times does Matt actually do something dangerous like this with his kid? Like, Hey, guess what we can do? just ride in this herd of rhinos. Fuck the fact that we're probably on some wildlife preserve and these are endangered. let's just go ahead and do this'cause it is awesome and I'm a billionaire.

Adam:

wildlife preserve, he can do whatever he wants.

Kevin:

I mean, once again, screenwriting, shorthand, like what the f How'd they get there? I mean, usually you establish something like this, but I love, that everything happens sort of like Med Rez, like we're literally meeting them in the middle of this action sequence that doesn't remotely feel like an action sequence.

Adam:

it's just what they do on a daily basis. inside Thunder Hawk, TBO sneezes. Scott says, are you still upset that you missed your proto service checkup? So it turns out that TBO has the flu, which stands for Faulty Linkage Unit, but there's this point where Tbo spells it out, he says, FLU. And it's pretty clear what he is really trying to say to Scott there

Kevin:

there's a lot of weird subtext of the relationship in this episode. It's feeling more like husband and wife than like best friend.

Adam:

Yeah.

Kevin:

Especially when you get to that section where he's complaining about how Scott gets when he is sick. Like I've literally had that same exact conversation with my wife. I actually think I had it two days ago, and she was like, were you sick? I'm like, oh my god. T Bobb. What's going on here? Are we heavy petting, like this is on the border?

PJ:

Okay, Kevin, we're gonna make it worse in this moment right now because, uh, that might be Scott's best friend or spouse. We do know that Scott built t Bobb and

Kevin:

read that.

PJ:

so whatever behavior is in there is what Scott has

Kevin:

I don't blame Scott. I got a suspect at best Dad. I don't really have a mom in this situation. I'm going through puberty. I saw weird science. I'd probably create a variation on this. I wouldn't use metals, but I get where he's going.

Adam:

the egg shaped, Uh, well, thunder Hawk arrives at the campsite where our cliche British imperialists are waiting. they point down into the gorge and we see these four vehicles Pancaked against the wall of the gorge. And Matt says, lucky thing, you weren't down there T bobb, we probably wouldn't even be able to find you. And I was just curious, why does Matt single out tbo

PJ:

I think the presumption is either you're really a vehicle. We would've just parked you with the rest of the vehicles because you're not alive, or this thing only affects metal.

Adam:

How little Matt cares about tbo. now we cut down to the

PJ:

I.

Adam:

in their investigating, the British imperialist continues insisting that the locals are idiots. He's like, they kept yelling about ulua. It's all superstitious rubbish. Really? And Matt agrees. He's like, yeah, it is. So we got just buddy Hawks all over the place here.

PJ:

So Kevin,

Kevin:

Mm-hmm.

PJ:

go into the woods and you have locals there that tell you, something bad's gonna happen, and then 10 minutes later your vehicle is destroyed.

Kevin:

Mm-hmm.

PJ:

your first reaction gonna be, ah, that's superstitious, rubbish.

Kevin:

I mean, fuck. Yeah. Who can I blame? This Buddy Hawks thing that you guys are doing is sort of genius because there's a lot of reality checking going on into what I think is like, once again, this shortcut thing that the screenwriters are consistently doing, which is like, what can we do to serve up the most obvious representation of something so we can get onto the most obvious conclusion so we can get into the next point. And it's like, I mean, I sort of wish I could write that way now. It's really fast and efficient.

Adam:

It's first idea world here. It's just like,

Kevin:

Yes,

Adam:

this, this'll work. Yeah, this'll work. Yeah, this'll work.

Kevin:

completely. And lunch

Adam:

So the only clues that they're working from right now is that the water level dropped in the well right before this craziness happened, and there's this, gold scarab that we had seen in the beginning. Dr. British says, never in the anals of the tracker archeological project has an object of this nature been found so far south on the African continent.

PJ:

Did you guys wonder how far south they were because.

Kevin:

That is the massive question because Egypt is not south.

Adam:

No.

PJ:

No, it is very northern af. It's like in the northeast corner of Africa, the continent, not the country folks. this felt like the border between maybe the Sahara and the jungle.

Kevin:

There was a lot of geographical questions Africa, very travel able. You can do it all in a day. It's like that's the one thing they got right. It's very efficiently manageable. I've done north to South Africa in like 10 hours, It's super accessible.

Adam:

when you got a fly in Camaro. I mean,

Kevin:

Oh dude. I mean he obviously took a lot of pit stops with his flying Camaro. Lunch in Ethiopia, gents. Sure thing.

Adam:

Well anyways, you know, they're talking about all this stuff and Alex believes that finding the scab could give credence to the theory of the lost tribe of Egypt. Uh, once again, Mr. Brit poops all over that idea and says that is nothing but a legend and a silly onet that, so just, he has a complete disdain for this culture that he's studying, and it's really shocking. Why is he even out here?

Kevin:

this episode, does it qualify as it presented by Buddy Hawk's episode? Does it get the Global Buddy Hawk stamp?

PJ:

and here's

Kevin:

Okay.

PJ:

because there's an earlier episode where Buddy Hawks appeared, in Brown face,

Kevin:

Oh my God.

PJ:

as he was walking into an Australian village. unfortunately, Kevin, hate to tell you this, it's not the worst one in the world.

Adam:

This is

Kevin:

Wow.

Adam:

to,

PJ:

This is mild

Kevin:

Wow. So this is the, this is the nons spicy version of, of this order.

PJ:

Yes. I wonder, do you think that, Alex is here to help translate Dr. British for Matt? like, oh, you're a British person. We're gonna bring you along as well,

Kevin:

I was wondering that too until I did, a search on the amount of episodes that character's in. And he's in a ton. I mean, he's in like 90% of the episodes. initially I was like, oh, it's convenient that they have this bald, sort of pseudo intellectual with a very dignified British beer to qualify all these pieces of information. But is the backstory, where is he the robin to Matt's Batman,

PJ:

No, it's interesting because you'll see these clusters of characters. Bruce Sato is there a whole bunch, like he'll go on vacation with Gloria. We're pretty sure he married her in Vegas. he'll have Dusty be his driver and probable cook. it's funny because they might be in the episode, but they'll often be called in as part of the team. vacationing together.

Adam:

brings up a question because it's typically Matt Scott, t Bobb, and a friend, like on

PJ:

It's true.

Adam:

on. So it is a, a little bit odd, unusual, uh, an unusual situation, as Matt likes to say. Matt finds all this stuff very fascinating, but, they do have a schedule to keep. So he sends, his British team back to Nairobi to replace their equipment and hire new workers, I just love that Matt keeps him focused on the task at hand. Like it's his money. He will not see it wasted.

PJ:

one thing to point out, scientist does make a point of calling him Tracker, whereas a few episodes back, the last time we were in Africa at the research facility that spawned the biological incident, the guy called him Matt.

Adam:

Yeah.

PJ:

So there's a definite pecking order for how you would dress Mr. Tracker.

Kevin:

so you're implying this guy's the new hire, he was like. We just quickly replace the previous because he wasn't listening or managing budget well enough.

PJ:

the previous thing wasn't about budgetary issues, Kevin. they spawned a creature that was consuming all biological life in its path. So slightly more than just fumbling the quarterly numbers.

Kevin:

but if he went over budget on that creature builds, I could deal with the damage caused by the creature, but what it cost to build it, I cannot support,

Adam:

speaking of that, Alex shows Scott pictures of Egypt and

Kevin:

I.

Adam:

that this lost tribe were the greatest builders in the kingdom, who for some reason moved south were never heard from again. But they brought with them a bunch of treasure, which was the richest in the world.

Kevin:

Yeah.

PJ:

got a question here. Okay. So again, we're centering this stuff very firmly on Egypt. We've mentioned a lost tribe and they were, quote unquote, builders in Egypt that left. are the writers leading us someplace, folks?

Adam:

Go on,

Kevin:

As somebody who did a lot of time in Hebrew school, I'm seeing parallels.

PJ:

Okay.

Adam:

except this is going in the wrong direction.

Kevin:

I know, right?

Adam:

south into Africa

Kevin:

that's how they covered their asses. They were like, we're gonna borrow 10 commandments as a reference point, but we're sending them south, dude, not north.

PJ:

okay. But the tagline literally says King Solomon in it. Okay. I mean, I dunno how to get around this.

Adam:

well, Matt and Alex take to the sky and thunder hawk, to get a better view of things. Leaving Scott and t Bob behind in a deserted camp. Were a terrible disaster. Took place the night before.

Kevin:

Do you guys have a prize for bad parenting?

Adam:

the Year Award, and Matt gets it every episode.

Kevin:

this is a stellar example of father of the earring because why not leave your kid in like a giant gorge environment with a robot that has questionable all-terrain skills and with no frame of reference or ability to find you again and take off to the skies where he will camouflage into rock and terrain from 20,000 feet above? It's a very bizarre decision.

Adam:

gets back to the camp.

Kevin:

But once again, an amazing example of visual shorthand where they literally make a statement, you cut to the car taking off and next thing you know, this whole plot point is put into effect. the kids exploring down below Matt's up in the sky. Like there's nothing besides maybe two and a half seconds of visual, like,

Adam:

Mm-hmm.

Kevin:

examples to connect all these funny dots. as somebody's come into this episode, without the backstory that you guys have, I will say as the editor in me is like, oh my God, they're able to convey so much with so little when they put on the helmets later, there's all these little things that they do and I'm like, wow, is this just the product of production costs or the fact that they're assuming people are watching this so consistently that these little. Cutaways or suggestions of visuals, tell exactly what's happening without further detail.

PJ:

Here's a que Actually, I wanna, I wanna continue on this point.'cause I think this is actually a really brilliant point. you feel like there's enough connective tissue in either the visuals or the dialogue to make it work or like we do? So much of the time, lends itself to so much like, like, hey, we can drive a bus through this to understand the intentions in a different way. Like, Matt hates his kid, so he is abandoning him in the desert.

Kevin:

Yeah,

PJ:

really curious from your perspective here,

Kevin:

but that's what's so weird about it, as a filmmaker, I would've made more out of those moments or had something more unifying where it's like you cut to Matt, he's in the sky and he is like. Makes a comment about like, you know, so is T bobb on the transformer or something that we can find his location, something that connects these things so it doesn't feel like they're running so independent. You know, I wrote with Adam for years and we would deconstruct stuff it was always about making sense of the emotional journey. And it's like, as a father you would sort of intuitive if you're like, Hey, we got the kid down there below on the right. Oh look over, there's the gorge. There's 1,001 easy ways to connect this stuff. So it all feels like it's living as a macro organism as opposed to these micro subplots that seem to be splintering off.

Adam:

know, you know, and I with our, abandonment issues with our dads, it's what really attracted us to this show because, there is an emotional vacuum here that we have started to fill in, and with only a handful of moments that actually show true fatherly love towards Scott. The only hypothesis we've come to is that Matt just doesn't care for Scott.'cause the number of times he leaves him, the only consistent thing he says is, he tells Scott to go back to the hotel in many episodes as a way to stay safe.

Kevin:

Mm-hmm.

Adam:

connects with PJ and I as kind of like, alright, you know, here's a, here's a TV dinner. Good luck.

Kevin:

I can relate to that with my father who would disappear for months on a time with work. maybe he's actually the best father of all time.'cause he's teaching the kid resourcefulness and self-reliance

PJ:

I was a wonderful father. Did I tell you to go to bed, eat your dinner, clean your room? No. I let you be and I taught

Kevin:

Dude,

PJ:

reliance.

Kevin:

there you go. Connery himself. Couldn't have said it better.

PJ:

So you're in the Henry Jones, senior Camp of Parenting for

Kevin:

Definitely not. Definitely not. I don't think this kid should have been left near a gorge by himself with a sick robot with questionable faculties at this point. but I do find it interesting as somebody who is toe dipping back in this world, how glaringly weird it is that he just does not give a shit about his son. which is another thing too about going back to your previous question is like, is it enough connective tissue? It is enough as far as advancing to the next beat, but it doesn't make much emotional sense in reality.

PJ:

Yeah.

Adam:

'cause here's what's happened. Matt leaves, and so Scott's immediately decides to go look for treasure. Like that's what he's gonna do. Uh, but when t Bobb complains, Scott calls him a hypochondriac. And then there's this exchange, where t Bob's like, well, when you had the flu, it was a different story. T bobb make me chicken soup, get me more covers. And then t bobb has this really illuminating, sentence he says to think if I played my cards right, I could have been a toaster of it. So what I, there's a lot to say about this, but I'll just, I'll say just the one thing in my head, which is he is in such an emotional tailspin that he wishes he was a toaster oven. Like that's basically saying like, I wish that I was dead. I wish that I'd never existed. That's just so sad.

Kevin:

what I found really funny was that Scott calls him out for being strung out,

Adam:

That's

Kevin:

is like a historically weird term that you usually like assign to drug addicts, not to people that are sick. He's like, dude, you're so strung out. What I mean is the issue that he is not getting his consistent upgrades and he is feeling the withdrawals. it's a very bizarre description and it also makes you think about what's going on in the writer's room at that point in 1985.

PJ:

Why did TBO choose in this moment to go on top of the well on a plank?

Adam:

well, to,

PJ:

Did we, I.

Adam:

of, to Kevin's ongoing thesis, it's to move the plot forward.

Kevin:

Yes. It was very bizarre too. And then there's also strange, like I called out this weird. Perspective cut to Scott walking in where the perspective's not in alignment and he looks like a giant for five frames and then shrinks back down to normalcy.

Adam:

well predictably Teebo sneezes and falls down the well because he's standing on top of the well. meanwhile up in the air, Alex spots parts from the damaged cars, on the opposite side of the gorge They don't do a very good job of setting up the mystery here, you know, as much as they're on moving the plot forward. And I'd love to hear your thoughts on this, Kev. there's not a really good setup of the mystery plot of this story.

Kevin:

I have no clue what it is and I don't want to jump to the ending where they actually spend a small portion clarifying everything basically there's the ultimate like. Do X mocking now that leads to it and you're just like, okay. Now let me recap in case you're as confused as the writers.

Adam:

where he is explaining

Kevin:

exactly.

Adam:

thing.

Kevin:

But like, I have no clue. There was a previous scene, the cars exploded, there's water, there's still questions on what part of Africa they're in. There's like, there's nothing that is like actually being like, clearly establishing what the mystery is and, and what really is the true, genuine purpose of them being there outside of the fact that they're, treasure barons looking to

Adam:

I mean, if we wanna boil it down, the great mystery that mask is trying to unravel right here, remembering that they don't know venomous here. Venom hasn't

Kevin:

mm-hmm.

Adam:

face yet, so the mystery is did four cars get damaged?

Kevin:

Exactly.

PJ:

Hold on.

Kevin:

where is this water coming from?

PJ:

Matt's question is how do I get outta paying the insurance premium for these four cars that my project rented? there's a financial stake for him here that I don't think you guys are appreciating. I wish you guys felt

Kevin:

Fair enough?

PJ:

Okay.

Kevin:

When you frame it that way, I feel very bad for not taking that POV into consideration

Adam:

now it makes a lot more sense. I take everything I said back. now we cut back to t Bobb and Scott and, they find a tunnel, underground. And so, they start exploring.

Kevin:

bigger than the Astrodome

Adam:

right, this underground cavern that's bigger than the Astrodome, which doesn't exist anymore. So, I guess as kids we had a reference point there,

Kevin:

I mean that was actually my favorite line in the whole piece.'cause I was like, oh yeah, that thing existed. There was an Astrodome,

Adam:

it's an underground lake, but then this golden light shines and a rumbling starts, and so Scott and t Bobb decide to run away.

PJ:

Which I felt like it was a very rational decision because right now they just decided to enter into the Earth, and I wasn't sure if they were like signifying between Scott's abandonment and, TBOs paranoia that they just wanted to die. Like they felt like there's something very morbid about their choices here up until this moment where it's like, no, I want to live actually.

Kevin:

no TBO in particular is definitely on a suicide mission.

Adam:

many times

PJ:

Yeah.

Adam:

this series, many times, well, we're back up top now and, Matt and Alex are at the camp and they're just, you know, enjoying a nice warm cup of coffee by the campfire, just kind of chatting about stuff and most importantly, not wondering where Scott is at all.

PJ:

Look man, we've all been there in the mornings. Kids can wait after some Joe.

Adam:

I mean, going back to what we were

Kevin:

It is amazing.

Adam:

the dad's not like, Hey, where's my kid?

Kevin:

And doesn't he, isn't it a crazy line when he finally does return and they're like, where have you mis Koreans been? Or something implying that they're the problem?

Adam:

Yeah, Alex has some line. He is like, well, look at these rascals,

Kevin:

the RA schools have returned.

Adam:

and then Matt, when he finds out where they were, he's pissed off at Scott. He's like, I thought I'd

PJ:

Yeah,

Adam:

away from that area. well, dude. What'd you expect him to do?

Kevin:

Maybe not. Leave me next to it and disappear.

PJ:

a hundred percent. What about Kevin's point earlier, like the connective tissue? Like did he never said that on screen.

Kevin:

Exactly.

Adam:

Yeah,

PJ:

I thought I told you to stay away from that area. I left you at.

Kevin:

Yeah. It's a great screenwriting spackle moment. It's like, oops, let me just throw something in here that addresses my lack of sensitivity.

Adam:

in that mug. And Matt's misremembering things I told you.

Kevin:

Oh my God. That.

Adam:

No you didn't. Dad. Shut up. I did.

Kevin:

I mean, your deconstruction of the Amsterdam episode and how he was like, made me want to go back and watch it. So yes, maybe Matt with an addiction issue could be a great underlying current, once again, eighties writer's room,

Adam:

well, Scott does have something though that he found underground. He has this motorcycle cable and Alex looks at it and is able to tell it was manufactured by the same company that makes the cables in venoms vehicles. Like what?

Kevin:

ultimate Sherlock Holmes, deductive moment.

Adam:

And lazy screenwriting.

PJ:

I, okay. my question though for you guys. they know what companies manufacture Venom's parts. Do you think Matt being a billionaire should actually shut those guys down? Or do you think Matt should buy those companies and get at least some of the action from Venom?

Adam:

I think it's true. if I'm Matt, I'd probably buy the company. Matt, and as we've established before there is a symbiotic relationship between Mask and Venom here, right? Matt can't do the fun stuff with his transforming vehicles that shoot lasers unless Venom is out there doing what they do. Right. So he has every, incentive make sure that their vehicles can constantly be repaired and, and back on the road. So might argue that he does own the company anyways already.

PJ:

This is from Reca Industries.

Adam:

quiet.

PJ:

We manufacture all the parts for Venom.

Adam:

he has it in a shell company. it's not connected to Tracker at

PJ:

This is from

Adam:

it's,

PJ:

Snake Oil Industries.

Adam:

funny when Alex is like, this is the same company that makes Venom's cables, and Matt's like, Hmm, yeah. Interesting. Same company. Weird. Anyways, moving on.

Kevin:

Yeah. I mean, they're brothers, right? Wasn't that the backstory? Veto and Miles and Matt are brothers or co-founders.

PJ:

if you believe the comics, miles killed, Matt's teenage brother, Andy,

Adam:

Mm-hmm.

Kevin:

I remember reading that. That's an aggressive backstory.

PJ:

it

Kevin:

For such a playful, globe trotting, fun adventure story.

Adam:

that is never mentioned in the cartoon series, by the way.

PJ:

right.

Kevin:

that's a heavy lift for a kid, eight years old to understand. Jacked up on peanut butter and SpaghettiOs like, oh by the way, we're gonna reveal this in episode 43 as a throwaway. it would be a throwaway based on their beautiful shorthand.

PJ:

that's actually a really interesting point you made earlier Kevin, because you mentioned loving Thundercats and in Thundercats the opening episode is a cataclysm of their planet.

Kevin:

I know.

PJ:

Like it's destroyed, and the fleet that they're in is lost except for their ship. There is so much murder on the screen. It's incredible. It's billions of people we're talking about

Kevin:

No, but I've actually had this precise conversation and my argument has always been, that's why I think we relate to Thundercats in a different way because you're going through something that has an emotional stake to it, you're watching a kid go on the hero's journey by way of puberty with these people around him that are trying to pr, like there's a lot of stuff that goes into it that mirrors Star Wars and these classic things we grew up with. So like relating to it on top of the aesthetics, which. Obviously they're the coolest, drawn characters of all time.

PJ:

They

Kevin:

But there's something in Lino that I feel the average kid could put himself into in different ways than Heman or some of these other characters because there was something general emotion sort of like as the backstory and they weren't afraid to tap into it.

PJ:

an earlier, guest theorized that we're on the villain's journey for Scott, that all this abandonment will eventually transform him

Kevin:

Oh my God. that is spectacular. I would love to ride that POV now I'm gonna watch the rest of the series with that POV. So this is all his like

Adam:

villain. It's his

Kevin:

story.

Adam:

It's the trauma because there's so many near death situations that he's involved

Kevin:

Oh, this is magnificent. And he's self-reliant now and knows how to build.

Adam:

he can

Kevin:

Yeah.

Adam:

he built tbo. It means he can build pretty much anything. If he can build a sentient robot, which by the way, Matt doesn't seem capable of doing, he can do anything.

Kevin:

This is incredible. Mac can fund the building of it with his opium sales in Afghanistan, but he can't build it himself.

Adam:

all Scott has to do is knock Matt off and he inherits the fortune.

Kevin:

Whoever came up with that idea, that is genius.

Adam:

our buddy Jason Burns from

Kevin:

Oh, I love it.

Adam:

yeah,

Kevin:

How cool.

Adam:

Matt can't figure out what all this means, so it's time for the agent selection scene. So asked the computer to give me the best team for service underwater and in the desert.

Kevin:

Once again, brilliant shorthand, screen widening wise,

Adam:

yeah,

Kevin:

I love this section. To me, this is actually, I don't know if this once again is commonplace. It seems like they do this device a lot, especially when you're across the world and you need to get your pizza delivery guy out there on a motorcycle.

Adam:

much better because they have the sort of like computer thing where it says what their specialties are, but then we usually get a shot, I'd say, what PJ? 50% of the time.

PJ:

Oh yeah, I'd say 60 and early episodes. It's been falling off. I mean, it was really consistent early episodes, and then it started falling off. So 50 to 60 is probably a good amount.

Adam:

to cut to the scene where we show them escape. So it's like, there's the pizza guy making his pizza, and then the alarm goes off and he drops the pizza on the ground and he, and he runs out, or the teacher's teaching, you know, thing goes off and he has to run out in some funny way,

PJ:

glorious slams. a full grown man who's twice her size, onto the ground, winks at him, and then runs away.

Kevin:

But I, I was expect, I mean, Adam, we've talked about the pizza moments and like stuff on some separate sidebars and once again, going back to the shorthand thing that I brought up earlier, is that just a product now of you've seen 37 episodes, we're getting through the fat of like. This beat, which we're very familiar with at this point, do we even need to like show them leaving anymore? It's like, okay, he made the call. We know what's happening next.

Adam:

of the series though. I think it's usually, if the script comes in long, it's cut for time.

PJ:

I think part of the charm of the series is the idea that, anybody could be these, like you as a kid, you could be running your normal life but have this secret other life how jarring is it, if you suddenly ran out of the classroom, to go save the world So I do think it's, part of that essence and charm. But I agree if it's long run time, there's obviously a lot of fat in this episode that, could have been cut away.

Adam:

lot. Um, our agents are Gloria Baker, champion, race Driver, black Belt and Kung Fu team, Hottie Matt's wife. the computer says underwater vehicle essential in the desert.

PJ:

He asked for two opposing things, the computer did not explode, and it's basically, go fuck yourself. Matt. Guess what? Here you go.

Adam:

Yeah. The computer's like, all

Kevin:

Covering my ass. Matt, you're getting all terrains covered.

Adam:

And the second agent is, Brad Turner, because air maneuverability could be a factor. I would agree with that. It's good to be able to fly.

PJ:

Uh, note, I think Bruce actually is clearly taking the call.

Adam:

Yeah.

PJ:

in Boulder Hill, he is not selected. and so I was curious, is he disappointed or he is like, oh fuck, I do not want to be in the desert this week,

Kevin:

I'm gonna go with the latter. I feel like Bruce hacked into the system. He took himself out of the population choice

Adam:

He is like,

Kevin:

and he is like, it's my fourth anniversary with my wife. I am not picking up this phone call like, Matt, stop.

Adam:

Well, I just wanna point out that after the two agents are selected, says, approved assemble, mobile armored strike command for immediate transport to

PJ:

You know, obviously Africa, the country is small enough that we'll be able to spot you from the air We're in Africa. Matt, come on. And so, you know, they mentioned earlier, and Kevin, you pointed this out, that the scientists should go back to Nairobi. So Kenya I guess, but

Adam:

Or, they could have been anywhere. And Matt's told him to go back to Nairobi, which could be a three day drive from where they were. He doesn't care.

PJ:

That is true. Like, once again, we got very little to go on.

Adam:

Lagos is actually way closer. Nope, do Nairobi.

PJ:

I am not paying for Lagos talent. Okay. That is way over the budget. After you destroyed my vehicles.

Kevin:

This is a Nairobi job

PJ:

so assuming it's Kenya or Nairobi, it's 11 hours away at Mach One from Colorado.

Adam:

they got a ways to go.

PJ:

Yeah.

Adam:

meanwhile, Scott and t Bobb are off wandering again. it's what they do. they're talking about how the Egyptians were always building secret entrances to their temples. Does he even know what he's talking about? Sure.

Kevin:

It.

Adam:

Jones and other adventures, there's always secret entrances. is this something that's common knowledge that the ancient Egyptians just built a bunch of secret entrances everywhere?

Kevin:

Well, common knowledge for somebody that doesn't go to school, I guess is also the other question because this is pre-internet and I remember when I was growing up, you had like tut in common and there was a little bit of like in history class, like they had Sikh, but this kid doesn't go to school and he got like one bad slideshow. So for him to make that intellectual jump is not only magnificent, but maybe he is a genius per your earlier things

PJ:

I,

Kevin:

slightly psychic.

PJ:

Kevin, I think Matt has provided him with a subscription to highlights.

Kevin:

God I loved highlights Every time I go to the doctor's office, I'd be like, gimme my highlights.

PJ:

we all did, we all looked at Goofs and Gallant, but they had those little snippets on Toot in common, right?

Kevin:

Yeah.

PJ:

And like, oh, there's secret entrances. That's where he picked it up from.

Adam:

I

Kevin:

Okay. Well, there you go, Adam. There's the answer. he goes to doctors a lot.

Adam:

he should go to doctors a lot, especially these psychiatrists. for the first time in this episode, we catch up with Venom, and Miles is talking to his crew of Cliff and Sly and Vanessa, and he says, the map led us to this control unit. I know the rest of it

Kevin:

I.

Adam:

be here. Sly has no interest in going back into that underground lake. He says there's nothing down there except rocks, water, mold, and vermin, which Vanessa says, perfect diet for you, Rex Sick burn.

Kevin:

Lovely banner. can I ask a quick question? Is he supposed to sound like Jack Nicholson? Is that the idea with this character? Okay.

Adam:

Rider because

Kevin:

Because when I heard that that thing come on, I was like, is this guy doing a jack? Like what sounds like rat environment? You're just like, dude, is he doing Nicholson? What's going on?

Adam:

and he rides the motorcycle and he is got the kind of goatee or the soul patch thing going on.

Kevin:

eighties writer's rooms the best.

Adam:

yeah. Slides a cool character.

PJ:

He has weird characterizations in this series where he's like, ah, like it's not natural, it's not ecological. He's got a weird sort of eco terrorist vibe at the same time. He's clearly on drugs.

Adam:

Well, uh, cliff spots, Scott and t Bobb down in the gorge and calls him a kid in a walking trash can, which couldn't be a truer statement. cliff accidentally pushes, a button on the wall of the gorge and a rumbling occurs we're back with Matt and Alex and they pick up the underground earthquake. They see the water level drop. finally Matt notices that Scott is gone and he says, there's your answers and takes to the sky. What is he talking about?

Kevin:

Matt is honestly deep in his eighth hour of the acid. there's no laws of physics or rationale anymore for the way he's approaching life. It's a very bizarre moment.

PJ:

I did really like though in this moment, if we take the logic at face value,

Adam:

Mm-hmm.

PJ:

because we have to, explanation to Alex is that Scott caused the earthquake.

Kevin:

Yes.

PJ:

Scott is powerful enough to cause earthquakes. That's your answer right there.

Kevin:

I mean, you either respect your kid that much or you have so little respect for him that any natural disaster that happens, you're like that fucking kid. He's up to no good again. God damn it.

Adam:

of your acid trip. My son can cause earthquakes, man. Well, the walls of the gorge begin to close and they're gonna squash, tbo, Tbo screams to Scott for help.

PJ:

I figured at this moment T Bobb was gonna find some garbage to prop open the sides of the gorge while communicating with C3 PO and R 2D two to stop the trash compactor. Oh shit. That's the wrong franchise. I'm sorry.

Adam:

right. because in fact, TBO, is going to die, we're in real bad shape here. Leads me to ask what's going to happen.

PJ:

I dunno. I dunno.

Adam:

We'll find out after these messages.

Mask will be right back, and so will Venom. Now back to math.

Adam:

and we're back. so when we left you t Bob was about to be crushed by the gorge. Scott's best friend, nanny. Mother figure, maybe also wife type character, was going to be taken from him forever, in, you know, increasing the trauma he's already experienced. But t Bobb uses a never before seen jet pack in his butt to fly to safety.

Kevin:

Wait a second. This was never before. This is not, this is the first time you were

Adam:

is r no,

Kevin:

that he has a jet pack.

Adam:

two in the prequel trilogy moment where you're like, wait, he can

Kevin:

What, That is a crazy first idea moment for the screenwriter,

Adam:

A hundred percent.

Kevin:

like the ultimate shortcut and on top of it, he's sick. So like where is this new energy getting mustard from to use this Never before used superpower. That's insane that this has never been established. I just took it at face value. I was like, oh, the guy, he's got a jet pack. I remember in the trailer or the opening, like he can fly off of things and

Adam:

off of things, but we've never seen this before. Bj, what do you think?

Kevin:

Wow.

PJ:

I'm gonna go for the Writer's Defense Award this time. we've seen so many situations where this would've clearly come in handy that it's a long overdue modification that finally got installed, and that's actually why he didn't get his regular checkup. Also, he's blowing it out his ass, which is hilarious. So I figured that was worthwhile.

Adam:

ill so it could with the

PJ:

He is.

Adam:

it could be that.

Kevin:

Listen, once again, pj, you have convinced me. I will now use that as my filter. Great job. Uh, na writer.

Adam:

in order to, escape, from the crushing gorge walls, Scott and t Bobb, kind of go through the, the temple door, and they discover a room full of treasure Scott says, now we can get anything we ever wanted. So does Scott not understand how wealthy they truly are? This happened before with

PJ:

Mm-hmm.

Adam:

what's going on?

PJ:

I think this is a dark moment, folks. It's anything they want, not what Matt wants.

Kevin:

I think this is Junior trying to get out of his dad's shadow and make his own bones. Following whatever his dad did, which is obviously being a tome Raider, but like, I'm gonna be my own to Raider now.

Adam:

That's,

Kevin:

Like

Adam:

that's If Scott and Tbo can get out of this tomb because the door's closed shut now.

Kevin:

I got money on t Bobb. he can fly. Anything's possible.

Adam:

Matt and Alex are flying overhead, and they decide to put their masks on and did you notice that they come out of nowhere?

Kevin:

Thank you. I wasn't crazy. going back to the shorthand element that is all over this episode, it's like, you know, the show, you know, eventually they're just gonna get masks. The framing on this is so weird because it looks like they're actually exposed completely. So where is even the helmet coming from? it is such a bizarre assumption that I think the creative team made.

PJ:

this was actually a question I had as a kid because even with the doors closed, they would frequently show the masks just coming down on their head. I. Even in vehicles where there's not enough headroom

Adam:

that kind

PJ:

or,

Adam:

or a motorcycle.

PJ:

so, this is a very frequent occurrence. In this case, they just happened to have the GU wings open. And did you guys notice the sound that it made when it actually landed on them? it sounded like dropping metal.

Kevin:

Yeah, it was very bizarre. going to sound there was some amazing score going on that is like Calypso with steel drums and it is such a bizarrely. Psychedelic aggressively bizarre creative decision over an action sequence to have these steel drums and this calypso thing going on I know you guys are familiar with the show, you listen to it all the time. One thing that was amazing to me in this episode was the spread of aesthetics when it came to the score. it opens with this really moody baseline that then goes into something more action oriented. And by the time we get to the Calypso score, I am so all in on wanting to buy the soundtrack, it's amazing and I just think it should get a little bit of love.

Adam:

theories about the longstanding love for this show, by, you know, folks our age is that it wasn't necessarily the cartoon itself, the toys the music specifically the theme song.'cause before PJ and I went on this crazy adventure, we would talk about mask, know, with, I mean really with anyone else. And it'd be like, oh yeah, I loved those toys. And that theme song was so awesome. And that's where the conversation ended.

Kevin:

I had a friend the other day. I told him I was doing this and He answered by singing the theme song to me.

PJ:

No.

Kevin:

I was like, I'm gonna go. He is like, and not even a beat, he just started singing it and he was like, mask. And I was like, oh yeah. Okay.

Adam:

great. It may be, we could argue about it. It may be the best eighties cartoon theme song ever.

Kevin:

I'm a gummy Bears fan for number one cartoon theme song, but this is definitely top three.

Adam:

one, this rocks, this is like

Kevin:

Oh yeah, without a doubt. Rocks

Adam:

like anthem.

Kevin:

We're gonna sort of boil some testosterone for these young prepubescent minds and get them to puberty.

Adam:

well, uh, Matt and Alex, land in the gorge and find Scott's footprints. meanwhile, miles sends Cliff and Vanessa to draw mask away from the Temple entrance. and, sly and Miles had this interaction'cause like Miles has a special job for Sly. and, he thinks it's to go help collect the treasure. miles decides to do it alone. Instead he leaves sly behind to do something he thinks he's capable of, which is pushing a button that opens the temple door. if I'm sly, I just decide to crush Miles as soon as he's in the gorge,

Kevin:

I feel like Sly has plenty of reasons to seriously tender his resignation.

PJ:

Oh, and this is mild Miles treats his employees, especially Cliff and Sly like shit all the time. there's an HR violation pretty much every episode.

Adam:

they never really get away with their plan, so it's not like they're making any money off of this. Why are any of them still with miles? Unless he's got compromising info on them.

Kevin:

Right or a large inheritance that we're not aware of, that he is able to.

Adam:

Well, we've got a cool, manta. It's actually Manta Jackhammer versus Thunder Hawk battle, in the gorge and in the skies, above the gorge. And the animation is some of the best in the whole episode. Mm-hmm.

PJ:

Like we're gonna see some pretty awesome action stuff. And I thought this episode, especially being the one right in the middle of the entire series was actually really great and emblematic of this bifurcation between a lot of crazy shit in terms of story stuff and some amazing action sequences. I feel like it really becomes this archetype for what the entire series is, which is, sometimes it's just like you're fucking around and a lot of other times it's like, oh shit, this is awesome.

Kevin:

I fully agree. Like the filmmaker for me was like, these are really well put together sequences. And once again, like super clean and simple, like putting this camera down by the wheel on the front and seeing the high angle shots. Like it tells geography. There's geography establishing, there's great shot to shot work. It's got good pacing and maybe you guys take it for granted. But those laser sound effects, man. Fucking top tier.

PJ:

Yeah.

Adam:

This show does lasers better than anyone else. the dog fight continues. the gorge begins to open, which reveals the entrance of the temple. Scott and Tebo make a run for it, but Miles shows up, so they're forced to run back into the Treasure Temple, and hide just in time. The mask, jet lands vertically. so I guess it's a vitol based on how it lands. But out comes Shark and

PJ:

Mm-hmm.

Adam:

Gloria goes after Jackhammer and Brad goes after Manta.

PJ:

if you guys watch the sequence of how aggressive Gloria Attacks jackhammer, it really hits home what Gloria would do to any former lover of Matt. Gloria doesn't mess around with anyone

Adam:

does

PJ:

who messes with her husband,

Adam:

is a total badass.

Kevin:

Does Matt ever show any affection for her as a wife?

Adam:

There's a great moment when they're down in Panama there's a joke about marriage and Matt is super duper uncomfortable about it. It's also that episode, they have an episode in where the two of'em are in Vegas. and it feels very clearly like they got married in Vegas in this episode.

PJ:

And the end of that episode has, the two of them by the pool. very comfortable, very close. admittedly, Kevin, we've inserted the idea that they got married in Vegas, but we've got a lot of evidence to showcases. That's probably what happened because you don't generally bring your female friend, to Vegas on a solo trip.

Kevin:

I like the backstory.

Adam:

as Brad goes after, Vanessa, he says, mind if I cut in on this one? And Matt says, be my guest, but she doesn't mean tango. And Brad responds, well, I'll just have to teach that Fox to trot.

Kevin:

that was a brilliant exchange. I loved it. I'm going to start talking about Fox trotting every day now. when I heard that, I was like, did I miss something? Is this like a call sign shot out? Is it like, you know, like tango, foxtrot? Like, what are we, what are we talking about here?

PJ:

Do kids know anything about dance?

Adam:

a tango probably. But I think the whole thing goes over our heads, mainly because of what I said earlier, like it's a complete non-SEC. Like it have to do about dancing? Like,

PJ:

right.

Adam:

if it was a sock hop or something going on the battle was taking place over that, that would kind of make sense in the context. But, all right. I guess The writer was saving these lines. He had'em in his back

Kevin:

completely saving these lines. I a hundred percent agree.

Adam:

is what I'm gonna do. And he felt awesome about himself when he put it.

Kevin:

he pulled the sticky off the Apple two C and he was like, finally. I could use the Tango Foxtrot exchange

Adam:

thunder Hawk is flying towards that cave entrance as it's closing. Alex screams, we're not gonna make it, but Matt does this really cool thing. He's like, we won't, but I will. And he uses Spectrum hang glider to squeeze through the gap in the closing door of the temple. so far a really nice use of laser rays and generally good use of a mask power here.

Kevin:

so this isn't a discovery of this power like

Adam:

yeah.

Kevin:

Tiba, okay?

Adam:

like, he has spectrum, but it can pretty much do anything we call it desex helmet. Like it can

Kevin:

Mm-hmm.

Adam:

it can look infrared, it can cause hang glide. whenever the writer needs something done, spectrum can do it.

Kevin:

Spectacular.

PJ:

only Matt's mask can do that.

Kevin:

Awesome. like all the other I.

PJ:

one power his as many as you need.

Kevin:

And so he basically has the AI suit that can.

Adam:

Very much

PJ:

Yes. But the spectrum hang glider had been established early on, and a cool sequence. Like he

Kevin:

Yeah,

PJ:

free, fall out of the plane, activates it and swoops into the cave as it's closing up.

Kevin:

no, it's definitely very mission impossible. Like you can picture Tom Cruise in, close up

Adam:

Absolutely.

PJ:

Yeah.

Adam:

miles celebrates getting the treasure and Matt's using Spectrum Infrared to see if Scott and t Bobb are okay. and he kind, he sees him many waves to them. Like, hello,

PJ:

he's concerned for them. this is fatherly concern, guys. I know it's a morsel, but it's all you get.

Kevin:

Or was it more like, oh look, other people who, Hey, good to meet you.

Adam:

Um, so what happens is t Bobb sneezes, revealing he and Scott two miles period. will not read to the audience what PJ wrote in the rundown, but it has something to do with t Bob's new jet that comes out of his butt. Matt uses spectrum hang glider to leap off a replica of the Sphinx and says, mayhem. Why don't you pick on someone your own size? And we have a cool, miles mat, head to head battle, which we rarely see them go sort of mono amano, miles uses Viper, um, after him. So get some cool Viper shots here, causes that big stone statue that Matt landed on to crash into the cave wall, releasing a ton of underground water into the temple. And again, to your point earlier, pj, this is all really cool action. Like this is what we actually tune into an episode of Mask to See. It took about 12 minutes of a 22 minute episode to get there, but okay, we're here.

Kevin:

One thing I'll just point out though, if you knew the backstory between Miles and Matt, this confrontation becomes really cool.

Adam:

Right. You killed my brother.

PJ:

Yeah,

Kevin:

Exactly.

PJ:

you

Kevin:

But.

PJ:

brother, which forced me to adopt a son who I neglect. So that's two on you, miles.

Kevin:

And, and inherit this annoying robot.

Adam:

Well, miles flies outta the cave and says another day, another treasure, which is a complete lie because they've never actually. Won any treasure in this series, but okay. he encounters a condor who fires at the sort of giant bucket that's, holding all the treasure, sends it plummeting to the water below,

PJ:

I kind of would've loved it if Miles had gotten away with the treasure, because then it would've actually, Amped, the saving of Scott, that Scott was actually more important than saving the treasure. I mean, they happen to be able to do both here, but actually think it would've been a more powerful, emotional moment.

Kevin:

Once again that filter, I will accept that PJ as lore now. I think that's a great idea and a simple thing to do.

Adam:

Yeah.

PJ:

Easy.

Kevin:

And also it makes those guys a little bit more scary, like to have them win once allows you to actually like, do a better job establishing that they're legitimate bad guys as opposed to like these bumbling sort of like comic characters.

Adam:

I did a whole angry rant a few episodes back where I was talking about like, the stakes are always so low. Like that the, the, we don't care about the bad guys. the reason in Star Wars that we're afraid of the empire is because they're capable of horrific things, including destroying an entire planet, right?

Kevin:

Completely.

Adam:

of rebels. They get together and like, are they gonna be able to do it? We don't know. In an episode of masks, it's like, yeah, they can defeat these guys'cause they're idiots.

Kevin:

They'll defeat themselves.

Adam:

which half the time they kinda do. So it's like the victories that mask have don't have any real impact.

Kevin:

Yeah.

Adam:

really afraid, only in a few situations, and I feel like it was much earlier on in the series, were we ever afraid that Venom was going to accomplish something awful.

PJ:

And there's been the best episodes have been the episodes where Venom has been the most credible threat. we had one where they were pulling an asteroid down or a comet, onto Oslo, would've also probably destroyed the world. There was them stealing the Statue of Liberty. It's them with the Rotax, which can threaten to consume the world. So it's not as if the writers don't have it be able to bring out these situations, but all too often we end up in these side shows where it's kind of like, at the end of the day, it's who's robbing the tomb?

Kevin:

Yeah.

Adam:

venom was, this is not a lie, Kevin, in one episode. Venom stole pandas to use them as human shields as they carved their faces on the statues on Easter Island. That was Venom's plot in that episode.

Kevin:

Dude, eighties writer's rooms. All I'm gonna say

Adam:

Yeah.

Kevin:

is that where the panda poo came from?

PJ:

Yes,

Adam:

where

Kevin:

Gotcha.

PJ:

that's our na dear episode of the series.

Adam:

ever.

Kevin:

Yeah. I mean, and this one is set up like he's literally flying away with the treasure. Like let him fly off. It explains, you get so many shortcuts from that. We understand how he's funding it. We understand why the people are still around Miles is actually capable and he is not just a mo. It's like all these different things you can do with just like letting him flo once, like that hall would cover at least four years of overhead.

Adam:

that

PJ:

Mm-hmm.

Adam:

Absolutely.

Kevin:

For that meeting. they're not very diligent with their expenditures but they would get at least four years covered.

Adam:

a hundred

PJ:

And, and, and Matt would know where they would sell it. It's Marrakesh. That's the only place.

Kevin:

And now we've established season three Africa.

Adam:

meanwhile, Alex is watching all this, who, by the way, has done absolutely nothing in this entire episode. He's laughing as he watches Switchblade fly away, and then he orders Brad to fly down and save Matt, Scott and t Bobb.

PJ:

Look, man, I just wanna say that I think you are way off base on Alex, shame on you. He had the most important job of all protecting the thing that Matt loves the most. Thunder hawk.

Adam:

I take it all back. He was the Thunder Hawk valet. so he had quite a lot to do, but I just love it that he is laughing at venom being foiled a big, hearty laugh from Alex. Well, uh, Condors rotors are damaged for some reason. Um, so it turns out that Brad can only carry Scott and t Bobb. Matt lets them go. He's planning to use Spectrum hang glider as he approaches a classic waterfall situation where he is gonna fall to his doom. but the mask has shorted out. these are cool stakes. the mask is shorted

PJ:

Yeah.

Adam:

gonna fall

Kevin:

Mm-hmm.

Adam:

waterfall to his death. More of this, please, in this series.

Kevin:

Actually, strangely, Hitchcockian things keep getting worse.

Adam:

but that's where Gloria comes in. Where has she been The

Kevin:

Yes,

Adam:

but she

Kevin:

yes.

Adam:

rising up from the water in shark, and saves Matt.

Kevin:

My favorite shortcut moment of the whole episode. ultimate boomerang moment.

Adam:

But

Kevin:

Like

Adam:

I mean, but there's a way you do this in a show or in a movie where you purposely make sure that you hide the Deo sex machina away in this case, we kind of saw her at the beginning and then it really does feel in this case, like the writer was like, we might as well have Gloria come in here.

Kevin:

a hundred percent. And once again, like how nutty is that? Like that, I mean we've used actually similar techniques, Adam with something like that. you always leave a little crumble so that you don't forget about that person. at least they're threaded into the crosscutting. So like. you, when it does finally have that reveal, you've earned it a little bit. What I sort of love about this is there's no earning.

Adam:

earning, and by the way, this is the only use of a vehicle underwater is needed in the whole episode. So if we go back to the very beginning, right? The

Kevin:

Yes.

Adam:

underwater capabilities may be needed

Kevin:

Mm-hmm.

Adam:

This is the moment. So was the computer seeing into the future here,

Kevin:

Completely, completely.

Adam:

I don't get it.

Kevin:

I thought it was really funny. I liked the shot from inside the car. Looking out at Matt. It was like they were doing like, once again, like good classic action coverage. And to me, I thought it was, I forgot about her. So when she showed up, I was like, what Good wrap up. Yeah. Coming to the end.

PJ:

I agree. It was a, it was definitely a fun shot. And they, they actually a couple of nice details in there too, because they've

Kevin:

Yeah,

PJ:

the periscope comes up

Kevin:

completely.

PJ:

face, like on the little, readout. But then it's also clear that Gloria's checking out his crotch underwater because of how that shot's formed. Like it's only the little like rear view mirror that's protecting it at that point in time. So, Matt owes her one.

Adam:

sorry, this is

Kevin:

Oh.

PJ:

it.

Adam:

but I also love how A very technically sophisticated, multimillion dollar transforming vehicle has a rear view mirror. Am I the only one who finds that

Kevin:

I mean,

PJ:

it's the eighties. It still has to be street legal guys I hate to tell you this, but she still has to get an emissions test in Denver, so they're gonna be checking.

Adam:

And they're wearing seat belts throughout,

Kevin:

don't forget those seat belts. No airbags on any of these, though.

PJ:

Mm.

Adam:

back on dry ground. The whole team is gathered together and Matt finds an amulet on the ground and he goes into one of his classic Matt Tracker leaps of logic. it goes like this. Mayhem said it was King Solomon's treasure Solomon. of course, the Lost Tribe of Egypt created the legend and built the gorge to protect King Solomon's treasure. It all makes sense now, and my question was, does it?

Kevin:

Yeah.

Adam:

think

Kevin:

Isn't there further exclamation though too about like how they flooded the waters and like how they were using this as a device to protect the treasure which feels very last crusade.

Adam:

somehow engineered

Kevin:

I,

Adam:

to close the gorge. I guess

Kevin:

that's a major technological lift.

PJ:

Speaking from an engineering standpoint, they had enough engineering knowledge with King Solomon's tribe to create an SD F1 size transformation, like with water. Do you think it might be useful to figure out how they're doing that?

Kevin:

Thank you. and just one thing I never understood. the button that mayhem pushes is a separate build, or did they find the trigger from what the

Adam:

he, he had no, he had a map. when we see him for the first time, he says, the map pointed here. So this must be like thing. What I don't get though, is that the night before, which kicked off this whole mystery someone must have pushed the button to cause the thing to happen

Kevin:

Yeah,

Adam:

So,

Kevin:

which also is weird because there's a history of this happening. So was there other people pushing the button before this accidentally, like, you know.

Adam:

Kevin.

Kevin:

Matt's making out with a girl up against the cliff and she accidentally backs into the button and oh guys,

PJ:

it's just hard to find the button

Kevin:

pj, I've been looking for the button for about 35 years now, and I'll tell you, I've yet to move mountains.

PJ:

and have water flow.

Kevin:

Exactly.

Adam:

well, we wrap up here, Scott is sad that they didn't get any treasure, and T Bobb pulls the golden scab out of his panda poo holder, and says, you can have it after my checkup. And everyone laughs, but there's a big question here. just stealing priceless artifacts?

Kevin:

The answer is yes.

PJ:

Venom stole priceless artifacts. Venom got away with the priceless artifacts. we should tell everyone that Venom has them.

Kevin:

So I got a couple of broad questions. As you guys being the experts, do all the episodes end with the tbo, sort of like punchline that everybody laughs at

PJ:

60%. It's high.

Adam:

Yeah.

Kevin:

And then secondarily, there's no recap on what just transpired. It was like, cool. off to our next magical mystery.

Adam:

exactly.

Kevin:

Okay.

Adam:

every

Kevin:

I mean, I, I,

Adam:

the more, you know, moment here, the, the lesson that allowed these eighties cartoons to purely toy commercials. They had to have some

Kevin:

this one's, this one's epic.

Adam:

So we're back at the tracker mansion and Scott walks into a massive game room with some kind of reel to reel tape machine that's spitting tape all over the place. First of all, dude's got his own like game room with like, you know, a Commodore 64 there, and a reel to reel like, must be very nice. but Scott says, we've got to remember to turn off all appliances when we leave the house, and says if it had been an oven, it could have started a fire. And he then, you know, we, we'd be, and Tebo says, yeah, crispy critters, and they both laugh.

Kevin:

Another chi line, that guy.

Adam:

got a lot of questions. First of all, if the lesson really is like, make sure you turn off appliances, just do the oven. That's the most obvious thing. we've seen garbage disposal incidents and, and things catching on fire in the show before it's like, have an oven left on and the muffins are burned and smoke is coming out. just go ahead and do that. Why are they showing some, some audio, uh, equipment here, expensive audio equipment that none of the kids watching the show. Had in their homes. Like I just don't understand that. So there's my first issue. My second one is, do they think being burnt to a crisp is funny because they all laugh after that. line.

Kevin:

Listen, as somebody who had just had a deal with the fires, I don't find humor there, people, But I will say I love that all these seem to be predicated on the fact that he has no parents. It's like basically you're left alone.

Adam:

Mm-hmm.

Kevin:

This is a lesson to be learned when you're left to your own devices.

Adam:

missed the episode where the warning was don't go hitchhiking because the person who picks you up might be a child molester.

Kevin:

that was a warning. Are you serious?

PJ:

yes.

Kevin:

that's magnificent.

PJ:

the person might be a venom agent or worse, a child molester.

Kevin:

Are you serious?

Adam:

that's the line.

Kevin:

Whole, oh my God, I gotta watch that. That's unbelievable.

Adam:

all right. Shall we look at our awards here? the Buddy Hawks Award? Anyone got some nominations?

PJ:

I

Kevin:

I mean,

PJ:

go ahead, Kevin.

Kevin:

I was gonna say the episode, but we can't do the episode. But I will definitely go with the first opening sequence of the, whoever it is, indigenous to this place in Africa, responding to the explosion,

PJ:

Yeah.

Kevin:

whole sequence.

PJ:

That whole sequence. I agree. I think I've written down Dr. British for treating the locals like shit repeatedly,

Kevin:

I mean, that one's great too.

Adam:

constantly is like haranguing or making fun of their culture? Like, you supposed to be like an anthropologist or an archeologist or something, like have a little respect So, yeah, agree.

Kevin:

That's super valid too.

Adam:

Rack's Ragdoll Award. Who? So that's the award. Who survives after something that should have killed them.

Kevin:

I mean, Matt,

PJ:

yeah.

Adam:

The floodwater should have

PJ:

Yeah.

Adam:

drowned them all. So RIP?

Kevin:

I mean tbo, if, you know, if it wasn't for the miraculous discovery of gas flying, whatever you want to describe that superpower is the budget. and also like Scott probably in every part of this episode,

Adam:

yeah.

Kevin:

climbing into a large gorge, going into caves. that kid was definitely playing with fire.

Adam:

never once does

PJ:

Mm.

Adam:

He's in the desert and never

PJ:

Mm-hmm.

Adam:

point that one

PJ:

Good call.

Adam:

Batty Award, any nominations.

PJ:

I mean, t bobb not getting fixed at the beginning. he was giving serious side eye to Scott, and so I feel like he's had enough of the shit.

Adam:

Agreed.

Kevin:

I feel like the whole episode for him is a bit of a Roy Batty existential crisis.

Adam:

The whole series, he's getting worse as the series goes on here at the midpoint. He's really not in a good way at all.

Kevin:

Well, this is the part, like this once again is his creation story then, right? Because Roy Batty used to serve humans and then had a moment where he realized that was a pretty futile effort. So maybe Tbo is getting to the point where he's about to turn and go off on his own.

Adam:

finally we have our Father of the Year award. Where did Matt really shine as a terrible

PJ:

Kevin, take it.

Kevin:

I mean, I'm gonna just go from the premise on this one. I don't know if I'd bring my child to the middle of a gorge excavation without supervision, no tracking device on him. he's got these magical masks, like throw an iPod tracker on him and just leave him to his devices with a sick robot that at best is operating at 30%.

Adam:

Yep. A hundred percent. and just bringing his kid around to where terrorists are operating.

Kevin:

there is that mayhem thing too.

Adam:

Alright, this episode Panda Poo? I

PJ:

For me, it's bifurcated. if you had just given me the first half of this episode, it would be panda poo. Nothing really happens. the issue of the mystery is jumbled up. It's spaghetti like crazy. Now, the second half of this episode when we hit the action is awesome. as I said earlier, it feels emblematic of the entire series.

Adam:

Mm-hmm.

PJ:

it's a half panda poo for me and half. Awesome.

Adam:

Agreed.

Kevin:

I am still in my honeymoon phase, so I loved it all. I thought it was magical. I love the opening soundtrack, like literally, like I watched it and I'm stepping back into this world. I'm like, oh my God, this is amazing. And I saw it two or three times and obviously by the second or third view, you can be a little bit more critical. But like, I, I, I don't know. I mean, I think this is a, a pless panda for me.

PJ:

All right.

Adam:

and that's why we bring on these other voices now

Kevin:

Fresh eyes,

Adam:

it's all panda poo at this point. it's been a blast having you on the pod. Kevin. you have,

Kevin:

Thank you

Adam:

we're gonna do a little plug here. We rarely have guests who have anything to plug, but you do'cause you have, a novel that's coming out soon. You want to give us a quick plug on it?

Kevin:

Sure thing, the novel is called Mount Forgotten. It's a multi-generational epic that deals with the death of a marriage, birth of a ski town, and an indigenous tribe caught in the middle. was a blast to write my first fiction novel. Adam and I have written fiction graphic novels before, but this is all pros, no pictures. And, yeah, I mean, I wrote it with the intention of earning your efforts, meaning if you pick it up, I really want you guys to enjoy it. that was the driving force of creating a story that could be fun again, and like, feel big and epic without the burden of present day situations clouding it. So if you want to enjoy a couple of days of your time and go in it for the laughs, this is it.

Adam:

And if you loved hearing Kevin's voice, he narrates the audio book version of it,

Kevin:

Yes,

PJ:

Oh,

Kevin:

That'll come out in high definition, two months later.

Adam:

Mount Forgotten. pick it up wherever fine books are sold. Thanks again, Kevin, for joining us.

PJ:

Thank you

Kevin:

Thanks guys. I agree that was a blast.

Adam:

week is episode 39, green Nightmare, venom Agent Vanessa Warfield Sabotages. Matt Tracker's private jet. Which crashes in the jungles of New Guinea while returning a priceless gem. His father was entrusted with the rest of the mask team goes to rescue them. This could be a great episode.

Kevin:

It also could have the most Buddy Hawk award nominees of all time.

PJ:

I'll say I've seen it and. Uh, Kev, Kevin, you might be sniffing on the right trail here, right?

Kevin:

I mean,

PJ:

The

Kevin:

new Guinea alone as a location just breeds so many questions. I'm gonna watch it. I wanna watch it.

Adam:

if you watch it and you love it and you wanna come back, you're always welcome back on the pod.

PJ:

Absolutely,

Kevin:

guys. It was a blast.

Adam:

for now, this podcast does have to transform and head back to hq. I am Adam Moore.

PJ:

and I am PJ McNerney.

Adam:

Bye-bye.

Kevin:

Peace.

PJ:

Bye-bye.

Adam:

And we

The mobile armored podcast show is written, produced and edited. Bye Adam Moore. And PJ McNerney.