AI, Affordability and the Renters' Rights Reality Check - What we Learned from the ARL, LD and Inner Circle Events

This week, we are breaking down the standout themes from some of real estate recent conferences, including: 
- The Association for Rental Living Tech Conference; including where AI goes beyond resident comms and into planning, development, and even the legal work behind projects. 

- LD Events Property Student Housing Conference; we talk affordability as the real crisis, the “value gap” students feel when price and product don’t match, and why universities and operators need better alignment.

- Inner Circle Events in Bristol; discussing the Temple Quarter regeneration, showing how placemaking, infrastructure, and housing connect when you’re serious about keeping talent in cities.

We also discuss the Renters’ Rights Act and what we’re seeing from operators and students, and why clear resident communication matters right now.

Make sure you follow this LinkedIn page plus subscribe and follow the podcast to be kept up to date with all the key happenings and takeaways.

Dan Smith is Founder of RESI Consultancy and Co-Founder of Verbaflo.AI.

Sarah Canning and Deenie Lee are Directors and Co-Founders of The Property Marketing Strategists - Elevating Marketing in Property.

Thank you to our season four sponsors:
Mystudenthalls.com -  Reach thousands of students searching every month with 0% commission student accommodation listings.

Utopi - The smart building platform helping real estate owners protect the value of their assets.

Washstation - Leading provider of laundry solutions for Communal and Campus living throughout the UK and Ireland.

Howden  - With a lifetime of expertise, Howden provides tailored insurance, property risk management, and wellbeing solutions for accommodation providers across the UK.

Who this episode is for:

• PBSA and student accommodation professionals
• BTR, co-living and rental operators
• Property developers and investors
• University and higher education leaders
• Anyone working in or around housing policy and shared living

The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are those of the hosts and guests alone and do not necessarily reflect the views of their employers, organisations, clients, or partners. This podcast is for general discussion and informational purposes only. Nothing said should be taken as professional, legal, financial, or investment advice. While we aim to be accurate, we make no guarantees and accept no liability for decisions made based on the content of this podcast. This was a jointly sponsored podcast. 

Transcript

Welcome And Post-100th Buzz

SPEAKER_04 0:00

Welcome back to House, the Shared Living Podcast. We are coming off the back of a hundredth episode. So this is our 101st, and we're still buzzing from our housed party that we had in London. A huge thank you to all of our suppliers, partners, and sponsors who came along to the live recording and our little birthday shindig. Kept it quite light and low-key this year, but maybe we'll do a proper housed party next year. So yeah, it was great fun. It's proved really popular because we had a good look back at all of those key moments that we've talked about over the last couple of years, getting to a hundredth episode. So yeah, thanks very much to everyone who's come along and everyone who's ever listened to uh an episode of Housed or two. Now, Sarah is not with us today, so just me and Deanny, and she'll be back very soon and certainly be back for UK Reef. So look forward to welcoming her back. But in the meantime, I'm Dan from Resi Consultancy and Verbaflow AI, and I'm Deanie Lee from the property marketing strategist. Um we're going to cover five things today, we think. The Association for Rental Living Tech Conference, LD Student Housing Conference, Inner Circle event that Deanny attended, where we're up to with the Renters' Rights Act, and a quick look ahead to UK Reef next week and the Housed Shared Living Summit. So let's crack on, but before we do, let's hear from MyStudentHalls.

Spotlight Boost And Answer Engines

SPEAKER_00 1:16

Housed is sponsored by Spotlights Boost on mystenthalls.com. Use Spotlight Boost to stand out in search results and drive more leads to your properties.

SPEAKER_04 1:28

Massive thanks to Dan and the team at MyStudent Halls. Definitely worth getting that Spotlight Boost on as we move into peak season. It's really important that your uh properties are seen anywhere and everywhere. And let's not forget that all of these answer engines, the ChatGPTs and the Claudes and the Geminis, they are using a lot of marketplaces and listing sites as effectively their source of information. So, you know, that is certainly something to bear in mind, not just SEO and the listings that it's good for, also it's good for AEO, answer engine optimization.

ARL Tech Conference AI Reality Check

SPEAKER_04 2:02

But uh let's crack on and talk about the ARL Tech Conference. So the Association for Rental Living, this was the first in their tech conference series, and they were launching their uh report on AI in BTR in particular. So really enjoyed this event. Brendan Gerharty did a great job of uh of coordinating and and hosting that with Graham Sibley as well. Now, in terms of some of the talking points, this wasn't just about operational AI, and that's what I was there for, obviously to talk on behalf of Verbaflow on on my panel in particular, but it was much as much about development and acquisition and how we're taking things through planning and what that could look like as well. You know, it was good to hear Verberflow name checked a few times, but a lot of the operators were actually really open and they were they were sharing the best practice that they'd been through. And it's it's fascinating to see where everyone's at on the journey. You know, some people are going all in with uh building their own, and some people are you know kind of dipping their toes in with suppliers, and some people are very much in bed with certain partners, and and I think there's just a real mix. But one of the key takeouts that I saw was that I think BTR and Co-Living, which this you know conference was designed towards, is is quite a bit further behind than the likes of student. And I I don't know about you, Dini. I wonder if that is because of the target market. You know, students are, I think, expecting AI a lot more. And and I think that's why BTR and Co-Living maybe are, you know, they're able to be that that little bit slower. What do you what do you think?

SPEAKER_03 3:42

Well, I was gonna ask, kind of, I guess, where the general view is on AI. Whether it sounds everything that you said there sounds like it's really kind of positive and everyone's thinking positive and everyone's trying new things. And was there any kind of concern about what the wider impacts I guess could be, or that that people can't keep up with it? But my thing around student was I was wondering, is that is that just the verb flow impact of why that it's more a heading student? Is it just the operational piece or is it and is it is AI going in deeper than just the obvious places we can see it?

SPEAKER_04 4:16

Yeah, it's a that's a really good point. I think that Verbaflow obviously takes care of the operational communications and any kind of communication with the resident. And I we we hear therefore a lot about that, but it's the things in the background, it's the how do you deal with your planning application. Actually, that brings me on quite nicely through to through to the panel that I was on, which was,

Planning Feedback And AI Objections

SPEAKER_04 4:37

I mean, it it felt it felt in the preliminary call like it was possibly mismatched. And and that's not that's no slight on Brendan or the ARL, but we had Cherry from um Shared Voices. Now, that is a company that effectively collates planning feedback from real people and then makes sure that that is that is all heard and that all of those planning applications are then using that genuine feedback to to hopefully improve their chances of going through planning. And they're dealing quite a lot with effectively AI campaigns against certain developments. So all it takes is someone to send around a template and then you've got a thousand people who have then uh objected, but a lot of those are tech technically just going to be the same things over and over again, or AI generated, or whatever it might be. So there was a real human element there on that panel. So there's some things that are being streamlined and automated, and some things where actually there's a bit of a doubling down on no, no, we need that human element for for this. And then I also had Catherine Crowley from Wumblebond Dickinson, that's such a great name, big law firm. In the first call before the panel, I just thought this could be a bit of a disaster if if I go too hard about the fact that I don't think that law is going to be untouched by by AI. To put it to put it lightly, I actually think that law is going to be one of the most disrupted industries out there. And so, you know, in the prelim call, I I think it was it was a little cagey, but actually on the panel, Catherine was great. She was really super open and sort of saying, look, there is definitely going to be an impact here, but it's not going to impact me. And you know, she's a senior partner in a very large law firm, and they need that, you know, the the key sort of strategic decisions and strategic work and the critical thinking in particular. Not to say that, you know, uh it that Claude, for example, can't do any critical thinking, but what she was saying is there's going to be a big impact on junior roles and paralegals. And I wasn't sure quite how open that was going to be, but I literally ended up asking that direct question, you know, saying, look, your job seems safe. What about the people who are starting to join uh your firm? She was like, Yeah, we're we're just hiring less people, and their roles are going to be quite drastically impacted because AI is doing the work of a junior paralegal or a junior lawyer. And that led on to a

Law Firms Face AI Pressure

SPEAKER_04 7:12

conversation about universities and whether they're preparing, you know, people for the real world. So it kind of almost came full circle. Like we had people saying, look, and and you know, the the audience, I'm pretty sure felt the same. I'm very much of the view that there's going to be quite a lot of disruption. And I do see that, you know, for example, in BTR and student housing and effectively, you know, hospitality, you could say as well.Anywhere that there is a peak season for bookings or customer support, that seasonal staffing is going to be the first thing that is just not needed as much. Not saying that you won't need it at all, but if you hire, say, 100 people normally without AI, maybe you would hire 20, maybe 30, and make those savings and then have those automated responses. And the stat that we're able to give is that Verbaflow handles 90% of inquiries just using AI and hands off 10% to a human. So that is having a direct impact.

SPEAKER_03 8:12

And that I guess that is what what you're saying about kind of paralegals and those more junior roles is like, yeah, that seems like the obvious place that AI can take on those jobs. But then where's the stepping stone? You know, if you don't have seasonal roles, where's the stepping stone into these jobs? And I think this is this is the real risk, and this is kind of where you know, I think your conversation around what do universities do and how do we train this in is actually we kind of almost have to have that stepping stone piece probably in education, because if employers can get AI to do it, they're not gonna get paid people to do it ultimately. So that is fascinating. I think that comes back to my point about whether there's a positivity around AI, or are we looking at kind of where the risks are and where the flaws are, and it kind of feels like you had that balanced conversation on that session to say actually you've got to go full steam ahead, but you've also got to manage how we deal with the other side of it.

SPEAKER_04 9:06

I totally agree. And it's people I came off stage and people were like, wow, that was refreshingly honest. And that was because I basically talked about the fact that there were there was going to be disruption in every industry, but what it was going to look like specifically within each role. It was the same when I came off of the Class Foundation keynote in Florence at the Smart Living Conference. Everybody was like, Whoa, okay, so you've actually listed the roles where there's going to be disruption within student housing and co-living in particular. So I just worry that yeah, I I agree with you, Deanny. Where what is the stepping stone? Uh, are we missing out on bringing the next real estate industry leaders through? But is every industry going to be missing out on that? Because universities are completely being found wanting when it comes to actually integrating AI into courses and modules and curriculums, and and as are schools as well. And I think that you typically have a view where you know it's it's very polarizing. AI is very, very polarizing. You either see that there is massive potential for disruption, and you can see that there are some operators, for example, in in PBSA, moving towards that where they're able to streamline and their you know their investors are looking for that too. And then you see somewhere it's a bit more, you know, focused on the the sort of uh there there may be a bit slower moving. I don't mean that in the sense of being sort of condescending about it, because it just being slower moving just because I, you know, you haven't implemented AI the way I think that you could or should. Everybody is moving at a different pace. BTR is clearly a bit slower than than PBSA, and you know, probably because of the customer. But but I think you're at everyone is at different stages on this journey, and you can you can maybe accept that yes, it's gonna look very different. We're gonna be getting Waymo's and we're not gonna need to drive fairly soon, and all of our AI agents are going to be automating absolutely everything. So it's gonna be reallocating the value, and we can just focus on the high value tasks and things like that. But yeah, it does become potentially quite polarizing in the way that people are approaching it, but also quite concerning in terms of those graduate jobs and also the jobs within our industry, within real estate, as to how you take that stepping stone into senior management. Because if we don't have the junior managers coming through, or maybe some of the you know resident support or leasing or whatever, that starts to become

Graduate Pathways And Talent Pipeline

SPEAKER_04 11:32

a leadership feeder problem, which will expose itself within the next five to ten years, I would say, because this transformation is happening over the course of the next two to three years realistically. So yeah, it's just gonna be it's gonna be fascinating. The the the conference was a real was a real eye-opener. One key thing just to just to add was that it was quite clear that the PMSs are are a bit concerned about what about people building their own stuff. Uh, about people, you know, some people are getting a little carried away and saying, oh, I can just get Claude to do that, or maybe I'll um you know we will get a consultant in. And and I I could I could tell from some of the uh people from tech firms on the stage where they were kind of it was almost self-protection, just to kind of say, or self-preservation, just to kind of say, look, you know, it's gonna be tough to build uh build your own stuff. We've done it, don't reinvent the wheel and all uh and and all of this kind of stuff. But but equally there was someone on stage, oh we employed two ex Google execs to create this thing for us. Are these these are guys with like 2,000 beds tops employing two Google execs, you're looking at half a million quid. And so so for me, thinking like, wow, they are dropping huge amounts of money here, and I'm not 100% sure what they'll have to show for it at the end. It's it's I think the I I've not read the ARL white paper um as yet on AI and B BTR. Uh, i we're actually going to start creating some of our own because it it's it's about time that we were able to show from our learnings what we've what we've understood from how people are implementing, what customers are are saying about it, and also what what residents are talking about it. But it's clear there's a massive mix of approaches.

SPEAKER_03 13:15

Yeah, but that's also a massive opportunity for PMS providers to actually go away and create a system that does all the things that it should do. And I mean, I we do um sales and marketing training. I was doing some sales and marketing training last week um to a team, and we were talking about that still the fact that we don't have systems doing what we need them to do. So instead of PMS people moaning about people go and do it themselves, go and get it right, would be my call. So I think when it comes to AI and technology, I think like most things in life, I think it's gonna be a balance. And the thing that I always talk about is gravitas, and there's certain points in a relationship that it has to have that human, it has to be human to human, and it has to have that gravitas. And I think it's we're all gonna be finding our way in that of where our thresholds are on where we're willing to talk to a computer and where we're willing to when we're gonna need human. And I think that's the bit that we need to navigate through and find. And I think these conferences that ARL putting on around tech, around AI, are gonna be more important that people go to and attend to get themselves educated on what's coming and how we can adapt.

SPEAKER_04 14:21

I think uh yeah, I mean that we talked a bit about the SaaS pocalypse, which is where you've seen that they're you know, the likes of a HubSpot, a sales force, because you know, uh pretty much most SaaS companies have really seen a massive share price drop, you know, in the region of between 40 and 60 percent typically. And and I think that's where a lot a lot of the PMSs are a little bit concerned about, you know, making sure they've got that walled garden effectively.

Build Or Buy Property Tech

SPEAKER_04 14:46

But the great thing is that you know, we're seeing with Verbaflow, we're seeing PMSs being open and we're seeing them, they're taking their sweet time over some of these integrations. And but you know, some of them are saying, look, we know that you guys can do this better than us, so you go for it and we'll integrate with you and we'll build. That's what we're trying to encourage. I think everyone needs to encourage this openness, but I would say that because we're trying to integrate with the PMSs that are traditionally working on this old revenue model. So it's it's uh I think that is starting to become more of an open conversation. We'll uh we'll we'll cover that a lot more later on. But um, but yeah, well done to Brendan and the team. And that was going on at the same time as LD Student Housing Conference. But before we cover that, let's hear from Utopia.

SPEAKER_03 15:30

Utopia

Utopia On Data-Led ESG

SPEAKER_03 15:31

is the trusted partner for high performance asset management, cutting energy costs, reducing risk, and delivering proven ESG results.

SPEAKER_04 15:38

With billions of data points and 75,000 rooms monitored, utopia turns real-time intelligence into measurable value, protecting investments and driving continuous improvement.

SPEAKER_02 15:48

Choose intelligence that delivers, choose utopia.

SPEAKER_04 15:51

Thanks very much to Ben and Jonathan and Chanel and the team at Utopia. Um, we're very grateful for all your support through uh the this season of the podcast, but also with UK Reef as well. Really looking forward to hearing uh Ben and Chanel on stage and uh and learning where Utopia's up to with regards to all things sustainability, AI, and uh asset management in particular.

LD Conference Mood Shifts

SPEAKER_04 16:14

So the LD conference was on at the same time as ARL. It was it was a real Sophie's choice for me as to which one to go to. But uh given that um Brendan asked me to be on stage and I'll go to the opening of an envelope, I um decided to uh to go to the ARL. And I did then turn up at um at the Oval a bit later on to be greeted by Andrew saying, huh, someone must be opening an envelope. I have to say that was some of the best feedback that I've had independently about a conference. It sounds like it was very well run, very relevant, and captured the mood almost perfectly. So uh I I would say a big congrats to Andrew and the team there because it's not easy to do that. And and I think the worry is that a lot of the time we we see some of these conferences, especially when they're at investor-led, that are either sponsored by agents or agents are there because they have the credibility and the knowledge and the experience to be on stage and uh and capture the investor imagination. But a lot of the time we end up thinking, where did you get these numbers from? So the number being talked about now is closer to 72,000 um PBSA beds that we need to build by 2030. But there was a real acknowledgement that you cannot just build it and they will come. You have to really focus on those certain markets that that you know don't have the supply-demand challenges that others might. And the mood was constructive overall by the sounds of it. Uh, and and I think that's the feedback that we're getting across the board. You can tell that the mood music has changed. It's not a case of watching an agent panel or reading an agent report and thinking, oh yeah, great. 200,000 beds need to be built, so let's just, you know, build some in Sheffield or Nottingham or wherever else. And it's it's much more nuanced now. There's more of a focus on that regionality in particular. And that's what I think. I mean, we've been we've been pushing for that for quite some time. And that's what I think we're starting to see in some of these presentations.

SPEAKER_03 18:18

I think as well, the conversation that I heard was around that there's investors looking for that mid-market property now, and I think that's great because we're moving away from that high end. What I'd still argue is that actually there's a lot of people still in the mid-market, actually, and that's not potentially where the gaps are. And I guess whilst I think the conversation is going in the right direction, I think that needs to move now to where are the gaps, because that's the way that we're gonna need to build these 72,000 beds is plug in the gaps. If we just keep building lots of mid-market, we're gonna have the same problems that we're getting, and we're gonna be pushing more and more students away from going to university and living away at university because mid-market is still at a cost that is on the threshold. And you know, this where viability comes in. And I know that's not as simple as just say let's build something and and make it more cost-effective, but I think this is where we need to move now, is where are the gaps, where can we find the gaps and where can we make those gaps work so that we provide that broad spread of options in the sector for investors and customers.

SPEAKER_04 19:26

Exactly. And now I had a really good chat with with a CEO after uh after the conference who was saying that yes, there is a bit of a focus on the middle in in that sense, but there is a lot of there are a lot of people in the value gap here where you know they are distinctly average products and yet they are extremely high prices for what you're what you're getting. And and effectively, and the the analogy that was used was you know, this is this is an Aldi product at a weight rose price. Now the issue is that we cannot build Aldi. You know, we we just we just can't do it. Building affordable is just not viable at the moment. So you have to kind of build the weight rose and then know that that will end up getting recalibrated, and the current version of a weight rose will end up recalibrating and moving to more like a Tesco or whatever it might be. I think that analogy does actually work. So bear bear with me on that. But but yeah, I I I think that overall it felt like, and the feedback that I got from from this, and and and it was, you know, well over 20 people were were messaging me and and and saying to me

Affordability Crisis And Regional Nuance

SPEAKER_04 20:35

at the time, like this was one of the more realistic conferences. So I think Katie O'Neill from Night Frank clearly did a great job of setting the tone. And that number, 72,000, which is you know, a big drop from the 600 odd thousand that that we saw from a different agent last year, feels more realistic in the sense of there is an opportunity there to fill gaps. I I certainly would not say that we do not need to need to build PBSA. I absolutely think we do. It's just a case of how can you make sure that that PBSA is filling a gap so that all PBSA and all student accommodation options become more affordable because once again, this is not a supply crisis that we have, this is an affordability crisis. So the more that we can do to help build, the better. It will affect occupancy. Yeah, we've seen that. Nottingham is a perfect example. You let the supply get completely out of control and everybody's occupancy drop. And you can see that in um the city council releasing their latest occupancy figures as well, you know, showing that occupancy is moving to below the 80% mark. And I think that's something that we do need to think about, you know, long term. But very much more nuanced, much more of a realistic, pragmatic, and constructive picture rather than just a blind like, yeah, keep building, don't worry about it, everything's fine over here, no problems. And I think we need to be really mindful of the fact. PBSA is still incredibly solid as an asset class. You know, it's it's one of the strongest by far in terms of the alternatives in the real estate sector. It is not just a case of build it and they will come. You can't just expect to underwrite 99% occupancy at mid to high range rents anymore and with a significant number of studios. There is a much more nuanced picture across the regions with exposure to different universities. It's still a very good income play. And I think for the right investors that have the long-term mindset, it is definitely a really good asset class to invest in. And that's what we want to encourage long-term investment and those pension funds plowing money in, give us the security and go from there.

SPEAKER_03 22:44

So it was. I mean, I wasn't there, but I did from a couple of people had mentioned that there was a bit of lack of knowledge on the sector on renters' rights, which is both surprising and disappointing, really. And I think there's a lot of inconsistencies across the day of what people said it meant, what the rules were, and that I guess needs to change. I think, and that's probably possibly a factor of the PBSA sector as thought I'm exempt, so I don't need to understand it. And it's it's that's not true, I don't think. I think you do need to understand it. So that was that was a bit disappointing, and obviously, I think there's obviously ways that that can be picked up in the sector. And the other thing I heard was just around the the need to develop university accommodation, which has been an ongoing discussion for many, many years. And but with the change in student demographics and with universities struggling to fill those beds, that's really hard for the private sector to come in and invest when the demand isn't necessarily where it needs to be. But the problem is that the demand's never going to get there because the bed's not good enough. So it's a real catch-22 situation, ultimately, in that scenario. But yeah, it's it did sound like a really good conference, and and like you say, Dan, I think a really positive response and realistic response about kind of where the sector is and what the sector needs to do.

SPEAKER_04 24:02

Agreed. And that that university partnerships side of things, that is tricky. It really is, because I'm not sure you can rely on the numbers as much as you once could. Russell Group to a certain extent, but still, you know, there's there are some Russell Group universities that are really struggling with their figures, but uh sorry, that with their application numbers in particular. But I uh you know it's it's making the economics of that stack up. Uh the viability of doing a university joint venture, you know, public-private partnership in that way is is really tricky now. And there are some that are just avoiding it altogether. Some some have, you know, really gone all in, Unite, Arlington, etc. And you

University Deals And Nominations Risk

SPEAKER_04 24:40

know, they're picking up things uh, you know, as and when they can, but but I think that there just isn't the need. Universities right now are shedding their nominations agreements. We've seen that, we've seen that in the likes of Bristol. There's various other places as well that that would love to shed their nominations agreements, and yet they've written in like you know, 10, 15-year noms. And so the operators are laughing in that sense with a cap and collar on it. It's gonna be really tricky for universities. There needs to be a complete recalibration of how how university accommodation is funded and what that model looks like. Do you need a hard nom anymore? Can you just rely on referral agreements? What does that do to the communities? Same things that we were talking about last year, but just the can's been kicked down the road. So no one's gonna thank me in operators for saying to universities, don't sign these long nominations agreements and just work on referral agreements for sure. I've already had that feedback, guys. You don't need to write in. So that was quite a long bit on the event. Think it's worth covering LD and the ARL events in particular. Shame that they're on both days. Can you all just get together and coordinate dates and calendars well in advance, please, to the events organizers? That would be much appreciated. But first of all, let's hear from Wash Station and then we're going to hear from Deanny about the inner circle event that she attended.

SPEAKER_01 25:54

Wash Station proudly sponsored this episode of Housed. We provide best-in-class laundry solutions that complement your buildings. Wash Station. Smart, green, clean.

SPEAKER_04 26:05

Thanks very much to John and the team at Wash Station. Really grateful for your supports. If you have any laundry needs, whether you're in development or you're looking at retrofitting and new laundry, do get in touch with uh John Stotter Mardin and uh and the team at Wash

Bristol Temple Quarter Regeneration

SPEAKER_04 26:18

Station. So, Deanny, how was the inner circle event?

SPEAKER_03 26:21

It was great, and that was a great link because John Stotter Marden was there. So it was nice to catch up with him in person. So the inner circle events are organised by the lovely Mel Goth previous of the class foundation. She's just actually moved into a new role as partnership director at Student FM. But she brought together these inner circle events as a way to talk about regeneration in focused locations, and she very kindly brought one to Bristol, which is my hometown. So I was very excited to go and do some networking actually, not in London, not in Manchester, not in other places, but actually in Bristol in my hometown and meet with my local network, which was great. But what is also interesting, and this is what I really like about these events that are outside of your kind of shared living comfort zones, is that it's a real mix of people across kind of real estate infrastructure and placemaking. So you get a much wider, a wider sector of people to talk to, which really takes you outside your comfort zone and engages the conversation much, much wider. So this session was focused around the the Bristol Temple Quarter regeneration programme in Bristol, which is a massive regeneration programme right by the station, which the university is a big part of it. On the panel was Karen Mercer from Bristol Temple Quarter, Peter Lysowski was from the University of Bristol, Nick Allen from Cushman and Wakefield, David North from Osborne Clark, and it was moderated by Amy Dimmond from Osborne Clark. And it was a really good introduction into what is going on at Bristol Temper Quarter, the breadth of development that is happening there with the university at the centre around it. And there was a lot of talk around housing, affordability, and making sure the houses in that, which are both kind of student and non-student, are engaged as part of the community. And there's also talk from David around kind of retaining talent in those cities and actually not making sure that everyone runs off to London. Actually, we managed to keep people in these cities, and Bristol University is doing an amazing job of bringing people from all around the world to study in Bristol and actually having these regeneration developments, and also Brabazon is another one, the opposite side of Bristol that's going on, is bringing all these developments together to really encourage people to stay in the cities that they study in and not run off to not run off to London. So it was yeah, it was a really great event. There's there was this great panel discussion which really opened your mind into kind of the greater regeneration and placemaking that goes on in our sector. And then we had some local wine and cheese tasting, which was brilliant, and a lovely drinks reception outside on Osborne Clark's beautiful balcony looking across Bristol. So it was a really, really good event. And I do advise you to go and check out Inner Circle because they are moving around the country. The next one is in Glasgow in October, and it's just a really nice way to talk about shared living, but actually in the greater place of real estate, which it is, and I as I've said several times before, I think we don't think of ourselves enough as real estate. And this is a really nice event and organization that that Mel is building that enables that to happen.

SPEAKER_04 29:34

Love that. Well done, Mel and team. I really hope, I really hope they take off because I do think it's important to get people out of London and start to understand those regional markets. And actually, a lot of the feedback we get at Houst is can you talk about certain markets? And we've just had a few people say, can you talk about Europe a little bit more as well? And and I think that feels like probably the right time to do that because uh, you know, there's I think there's a lot of development opportunities in in some cities and countries in Europe. We don't want to lump Europe together in one, but um, we've had people ask for you know, Netherlands episodes, Spain, etc. So yeah, maybe maybe we start doing a Bristol episode and looking at the regionals and great that that Mel's managed to get in a circle of events off the ground. Do sign up for anything that comes to your uh you know, your city or town. But um, yeah, we'll uh we'll always happily publicize those. So yeah, well done, Mel and the team. We're

Renters Rights Act What Changes

SPEAKER_04 30:25

gonna move swiftly on to the Renters Rights Act. Now, this could be an episode in itself, so I think we'd probably just need to keep it relatively light for now. And then we know that there's gonna be a lot covered at UK Reef in particular, where of at the housed uh shared living summit next week. But I think it's worth talking about because the act was switched on on the 1st of May. So we're 12 days in now, and I just want a bit of an idea of what's going on on the ground. So I think this is probably just as much of an appeal to operators, um, whether you're BTR, PBSA, HMO, uh, co-living, whatever else it might be, um, do let us know how you're getting on with it because quite a few PBSA operators have obviously reissued their contracts on the 1st of May. And I know firsthand that there are already students who are giving notice. There are some templates doing the rounds as well, and that's within PBSA, but also for the rest of the board as well. That should be an exception for PBSA for this year, as um as those tenancy agreements are switched and the fixed-term tenancies have gone. So they're now sort of assured periodic tenancies in that sense. But you know, there is a statutory exemption for PBSA as long as they are part of the ANUC code, uh, you know, part of part of Unipol, but it is not retrospective. So there's going to be a bit of upset this year, I can see in in PBSA, with you know, students not necessarily or students taking the opportunity to potentially cancel a contract, given that they've, you know, they've not actually had to really sign anything yet. It's it's just been so badly handled. I don't mean by our sector, I think everyone's just, you know, a lot of people are asking around. There's a bit of a coordinated approach in that sense of like, well, what the hell do we do? We've got zero guidance from anyone. And and I think, you know, looking at the likes of a David Smith who's who's a really great commentator on all things renters' rights bill, just literally search David Smith Renters Rights in LinkedIn and and you'll bring him up. I think, you know, we we have a real gap in information. And so I think we'll we'll have a bit of an issue with some students giving notice this year, and uh that may be a continuation for HMOs and BTR and co-living beyond that. PBSA, it should be less so. That should be, you know, almost a one-off loss of revenue and potential cancellations right now. But I do know that operators uh are working quite hard to make sure that those contracts are now signed, but they are seeing a little bit more than they thought in terms of the cancellations. So, yeah, hopefully, you know, that this isn't widespread, but you know, there does need to be an information sheet that goes out to each resident before the 31st of May. And I think this is all just a stress test. So we'll keep sort of tracking it. But but Deanny, what what have you heard and and seen? And and I think how can yeah, how can we help operators better?

SPEAKER_03 33:23

Yeah, I mean, I think like you, I have heard of a few switched on students who on the 1st of May sent out their notice straight away to say, well, I I've given you my two months' notice. I think that's minimal, partly because I think, as you say, Dan, the government haven't done a really good job of communicating these changes or preparing the sector for these changes and preparing renters for the changes. And I think that's where a lot of people still don't know as much about it as they should. And actually, Housing Hand have recently done a survey on this, which I urge you to go and check out because it kind of shows the extent of the problem of how little kind of renters understand around renters' rights and and just generally renting in particular. So I think there is definitely some switch-not students that are using this as the as an opportunity to get out of their tenancy. I don't think it'll be massively widespread because they don't really know, but I think, as you say, I think there's a period of adjustments that we're all in, and we all need to go through that adjustment and make sure that, like you say, Dan, those information sheets are going out on the 31st of May. Um, HMOs do have ground for A notice to be served if they need it. So there are there are opportunities out there, and it's just making sure you understand what you need to do, when you need to do it, and that your tenant understands the process.

SPEAKER_04 34:42

Totally agree. And this is this is going to impact PBSA in particular this year, whether you're ANUC or not, but also BTR, HMO, co-living across the board. And the sector will never be the same again. Do go back and have a listen to our Ask the Expert sections with Howard Kennedy. We have covered kind of what you need to do and and you know what that should look like. So just go back through our back catalogue and have a look for those specials. But in the meantime, there's just very little places that you can go for for real help. And I think that is unfortunately what a lot of operators are coming to us for. We are not renters' rights experts in any way, shape, or form, but we have had to do a lot of reading in it, partly because of client work, but partly because of people starting to demand it. So I would just encourage people to go and have a listen to those Howard Kennedy episodes that we did. But also I think it's just start talking as an industry. Like use those forums, use those events to say, look, what are you, what are you seeing? What are you doing? And that's you know, ensuring it's it's all above antitrust laws and things like that, and that you're not breaching anything there. But there's no harm in talking to industry leaders and saying, like, what's what's the plan here? Because we have zero guidance from government. Unipol and Anoc are doing all of this for the first time, of course. So uh, you know, don't expect them to be a helpline uh as you know, as much as we've seen Victoria and and Sam talking about renters' rights bill and feeding into it, of course. It is it we're very much on our own, whatever sector we're in. So best of luck, everyone. May the odds be ever in your favour. But but yeah, do please reach out and let us know what you're seeing and and what you're hearing uh on the ground so that we can hopefully start to you know almost coordinate a bit more of an approach to it. Now let's finally hear from Howden, our final sponsor of the episode.

UKREiiF Summit Preview And Meetups

SPEAKER_02 36:34

Howden is the fifth largest employee-owned business in the UK and one of the largest insurance groups globally. With over 60 years experience, Howden's specialist education division delivers tailored insurance, risk management, and well-being solutions for the education sector.

SPEAKER_04 36:50

They're the trusted partner of nearly a thousand schools, colleges, universities, and student accommodation providers across the UK.

SPEAKER_03 36:56

Howden helps owners and operators protect what matters most. And so they are the perfect sponsors for Howes. Thank you for coming on board for season six.

SPEAKER_04 37:04

Thanks very much to Howden and the team. Do please get in touch with them for all of your student insurance needs or pretty much any other insurance needs, given that they are the largest insurer in the country. So, yeah, we're very grateful for them for their support for the podcast, and we look forward to working with them in in the future as well. And that is us for this one. Uh, we look forward to Sarah returning. We look forward to UK Reef in particular. Now, that is going to be a very big event for us. Um, the next few podcasts, they'll probably come in a bit of a flurry because we'll have those live episodes and um maybe a bit of roving reporter content from UK Reef. They'll come in quick succession, but we'll be effectively summarising each of the days and what we've had at the Housed Shared Living Summit. If you are heading to UK Reef, please do use us as a base. We're in department. We're next to the bar, we're next to the cafe. Come in, grab your headphones, have a listen to some brilliant panels, really, really great sessions, and some live podcasts as well. So we'll be summarising the day, talking about what's coming up and just making sure that we're ahead of everything on the second.

SPEAKER_03 38:06

And we will also be having a special kind of UK Relief shared living house, shared living summit uh WhatsApp group for the summit for the three days, just so that people can connect and find out what's going on and we can send out kind of alerts of WhatsApp panels up. So when you get to UK Relief, come and kind of take a zap of that QR code and then you can come and join that WhatsApp group.

SPEAKER_04 38:30

We'll no doubt put that on LinkedIn, etc., as well. But um, but yeah, do come swing by department. It's on the way to the food trucks and it's indoors. So if it's raining, it'll be nice and warm. If it's super hot, it'll be nice and cool. It's literally the perfect location. So do come and find us, great panels, should be really good network events as well. We look forward to seeing you all there. Thank you again to our sponsors and partners across the past hundred episodes that we've had now. And we look forward to seeing you all at UK Reef. Thanks for listening.