107 - Rob Reiner, Three Films, One Legacy (feat. Ryan Lacen): A Few Good Men, Misery, & The Princess Bride

This week, Nick is joined by returning guest and friend of the Gimme Three Podcast, Ryan Lacen. 

The two celebrate the life, career, and some of their all-time favorites in this tribute to the legendary Rob Reiner.

• First up: can you handle the truth? Rob Reiner directs Aaron Sorkin's first screenplay—Tom Cruise, Demi Moore, and Jack Nicholson star in A Few Good Men. 
  
  
• Second: misery loves company. Rob Reiner directs his second Stephen King adaptation in the Academy Award-winning thriller, Misery. 
  
  
• Finally, we explore a film that blends all that makes a Rob Reiner film great; comedy, adventure, and romance are all on display in The Princess Bride.

What is your favorite Rob Reiner film? 

Transcript

Remembering Rob Reiner

SPEAKER_11 0:03

From the beautiful city of Los Angeles, California, we bring you the Gimme Three Podcast. Hello and welcome, Cinephiles, Cinema lovers, and movie appreciators to the Gimme Three Podcast. It's the podcast where we pick three films connected by one theme. Sometimes picking those three films is unfathomably difficult, such as the case this week. So I am very grateful to have a good friend join me for this nearly impossible task of selecting just three Rob Reiner films. We've got returning guest and good friend of the show, Ryan Layson is back with us. Ryan, thanks for being here. And how was the New Year festivities?

SPEAKER_13 0:54

New Year's festivities was good. And it's always glad to be invited back to spend an afternoon talking about movies.

From Meathead To Master Director

SPEAKER_11 1:01

Hell yeah. Hell yeah. Appreciate you being here. Appreciate your mind on this one. And sadly, as I'm sure everybody listening to this knows by now, we tragically lost Rob Reiner and his wife Michelle last month. And I'm not going to really talk about their passing here. We're going to talk about Rob's life. We're going to talk about his career. We're going to talk about his work. And as we mentioned, it's like, how the hell do you pick just three Rob Reiner films? But we, you know, you got like movies like This Is Spinal Tap, Stand By Me, The Princess Bride, When Harry Met Sally, A Few Good Men, Misery, The American President. These are just to name a few, obviously, but I it's like over the last few weeks talking to a lot of Cinephiles, or even not Cinephiles, just people who enjoy movies, or people who grew up in the 80s and 90s, chances are, for any of those people, Rob Reiner probably directed one of your favorite films of all time. That's kind of how we made our selections today, actually. So before we get into the films, give just a brief overview of Reiner's storied career, which of course started with him as an actor. He's the son, of course, of one of the great legends in American comedy, Carl Reiner. And in the 60s, Rob Reiner worked on several TV shows and small appearances, supporting roles. He was in shows like Batman, as he has a cameo in the original Batman series, That Girl, The Andy Griffith Show, Beverly Hillbillies. And of course, he became a household name and a household face when he was cast as Michael, more commonly known as Meathead, Archie Bunker's liberal son-in-law in the classic sitcom All in the Family.

SPEAKER_03 2:57

What kind of a name is Stivi? Where are you from? Oh, uh, Chicago. I mean, what's your nationality? I'm an American. I mean, where are your people from? They're from Poland. That would make you Polish, then. Anything interesting in the paper? Yeah, 200 arrested at Vietnam Day Peace Demonstration. 200. They should have thrown a whole bunch of them in the can. Look at that picture there. Here they are, throwing all kinds of junk and teepers at officers of the law, desecrating on the American flag.

SPEAKER_02 3:56

The hell are them peacemakers won, anyhow. Well, I think they just don't like the idea of America fighting an illegal and immoral war.

SPEAKER_03 4:06

Well, if they don't like it, they can lump it.

SPEAKER_02 4:10

Take it down the road and dump it. What do you say America love it or leave it? That's right. It's a free country, so I'm screen. Well, that would include me too, Mr. Bunker. In to the you to you too. Well, what would our leaving solve? I mean, with or without protesters, this country would still have the same problems. What problems? Well, it's the war, the racial problem, the economic problem, the pollution problem. Oh, come on, if you want a nitpick. Nitpick?

SPEAKER_03 4:44

Let me tell you something, Mr. Punker. No, let me tell you something, Mr. Stivik. You are a meathead. A meathead, dead from the neck up. Meathead.

SPEAKER_11 5:05

And Reiner's role won him two Emmy Awards on that show. So there you go. But his work as an actor probably was an apt primer, I think, for his work as a director, because in the 1980s, Rob went behind the camera as a director, and I think that's really where he soared as an artist. His first three films, this is Spinal Tap, The Sure Thing, which I actually haven't seen. Have you seen that?

Defining Reiner’s Authenticity

SPEAKER_13 5:31

I haven't. I think it's one of his few films I have not actually watched.

SPEAKER_11 5:34

Yeah. This is Spinal Tap, The Sure Thing, and Stand By Me. His first three films could not be more different from each other. Reiner just quickly established himself, not only as a filmmaker here to stay, but as a chameleon. And that's an asset I think he'd carry with him throughout his career. There's so many great directors, you know, they got calling cards. They got like visual techniques or visual stamps, shots that let the audience know that this is their picture. And other great directors may stick to like a certain lane in terms of his genre, you know, a language that they know, a language they love. They're total masters of this genre. Rob Reiner didn't really have a visual calling card. He didn't really stick to one genre and become a master of it. But what he did become a master of something more universal in all his films, whether they be comedy, fantasy, romance, or thriller, Rob Reiner became the master of complete authenticity. His characters, the actors, the worlds that Reiner builds, they feel so authentic. They feel so true. Even when you know they're clearly fantasy or they're clearly extreme, they are authentic. And when you become a master of authenticity like Reiner did, your audience is much more susceptible to fear, to pain, to adventure, to love. Those, in my opinion, are the ultimate calling cards for a Rob Reiner picture. Ryan, do you have any broad broad thoughts on Mr. Rob Reiner before we get into the films?

SPEAKER_13 7:14

Well, I remember being in a high school acting class, and I had to write down like my favorite film director, and I wrote down Rob Reiner. And then you had to kind of define like why. And kind of like we were saying, that answer isn't as easy as if you would have put down, like, say, like Tarantino, Spike Lee, or even Spielberg, you know, directors whose touch is a little more obvious than their films. But at the time, Rob Reiner just made the movies I loved.

SPEAKER_11 7:38

Right.

SPEAKER_13 7:39

Yeah. Right. I think about now, I'd say that he was he was definitely a fearless as a filmmaker, you know, not bound by having to recreate a certain type of film. After you make maybe like when Harry met Sally, one of the, if not the best romantic comedies of all time. He could have just been the guy that goes on to do films like Pretty Woman or Notting Hill. Instead, he makes a thriller, Misery. And after the success of that, he could have been easily like that Hitchcock guy. Instead, he makes a courtroom drama, then like a PG Kids movie, and so on and so on. Yeah, just like one of the few directors that I felt like wasn't defined by like the films he made. And also, like you were saying, too, like him being an actor, he felt the most accessible as a film director. You know, he would show up as like the best friend in Sleepless in Seattle, and then all my childhood films like mixed nuts. Bye bye Love and Story of Us, he was always like in, you know. So my relationship with him was like he was like the funny friend or the the character that came in for the strong but comedic advice. Right.

SPEAKER_11 8:36

Yeah, I think so many people have like a loving relationship with him, you know, but either either as an actor or as a director. A beautiful, dense body of work. And of course, as an activist too. Like he was a huge uh political activist and did did a lot of really wonderful work and philanthropy as well.

SPEAKER_13 8:55

So yeah, I think his temperament and his passion definitely shines through, which probably made him like the greatest like directors to work with actors, you know, such an actor's director.

SPEAKER_11 9:04

Kevin Bacon was on, I forget what interview I heard him say it, but he was basically saying that like on a few good men, Rob Reiner would have lunch with the cast and the crew, and Kevin Bacon was like, I haven't had cast, I haven't had lunch with a uh with what the director before or since, you know, like he was you know a man of of his team. Speaks to his character. Well, I want to consider our our friends listening. This is your official spoiler alert because we may be discussing some some spoilers with some of these classics. Gimme three Rob Reiner films, some classics coming at you. Here we go, and Ryan is gonna start us off.

SPEAKER_13 9:46

I think let's kick it off with a few good men. So, Few Good Men, adapted from Aaron Sorkin's own stage play. The film is directed by Rob Reiner and was released in 1992. It follows my favorite character of all time, Lieutenant Daniel Caffey. Danny to his friends at drinking buddies. Caffey is a Navy lawyer known for avoiding trials by negotiating plea deals, but all that changes when he gets assigned to two Marines who are charged of murdering a fellow soldier at Guantamo Bay. Well, you know's co-counsel Joanne Galloway soon discovered is that two Marines may have been following an unofficial disciplinary order known as a code of red. This code of red may have been assigned by a commanding officer. The film has a courtroom drama, but also somewhat of a who done it. You know, who's really responsible for William Santiago's death. A Fugaman went on to earn a best picture nomination for Rob Reiner, a best supporting actor for Nicholson, a nomination for sound and editing. But our boy Tom Cruise snubbed. Wow. If you like films about power, moral responsibility, the truth, whether you can handle it or not, then it's the review. And it's also my favorite film of all time.

SPEAKER_11 10:58

Ryan Layson's favorite film of all time, which is why I made the call for raw for Ryan to join me on this Rob Reiner episode. Tell us, Ryan, why or how this film came to be your favorite film of all time? What do you love about it so much?

SPEAKER_13 11:16

I mean, I guess it all started like, I guess when I was young. You know, I must have been like 11 years old. And, you know, like most 11-year-olds, when you, you know, you're that age, you want to get into that some mischief. So for me, it was convincing a friend's parent to buy us R rated movie tickets to go see a courtroom drama on a Friday night. You know, so such a rubble. Right. But no, honestly, like I was psyched about this movie. You know, I was reading Premier Magazine, had a relationship with Cruz from like Top Gun and Legend, and obviously Nicholson from Batman. And then just seeing these two guys go head to head in a film. It was the first movie I remember seeing in the in the theaters and just blew me away. Which for most kids it was like seeing ET for the first time. But I was like in the theaters watching this courtroom drama. I went back and saw it four times, each time like more excited to watch it again with my mother, my grandmother, any friend that wanted to watch our you know, adults argue in a courtroom for two hours. I had the whole film like memorized as a kid. You know, I started like adapting my personality to Danny Caffey. You know, he was cool and confident, which I was not in fifth grade. And Danny Caffey was always like one step ahead and trying to catch people in a lie, you know, with like all those like sly responses. So uh I remember being a kid and starting to do that too, you know, which was probably like super annoying and not gonna make me any more popular in elementary school. I would I would use I would start reusing like quotes from the movie in like day-to-day life. I remember one time we were playing like King of the Hill at recess, and one of the kids, you know, went and changed the rules. And I look at the group, I'm like, oh, I guess you were sick the day they taught law school. But all the kids would just like stare at me with blank stairs, like, what?

SPEAKER_11 12:57

Like, what the hell is it? Who invited this kid? Who's this fifth grader?

SPEAKER_13 13:01

In fact, my parents too. They did tell me to do something in like a chore, and like I'd answer like Jack Nicholson and be like, You have to ask me nicely. We have to ask you nicely. No, go do this chore. What are you talking about? We have to ask you nicely.

SPEAKER_11 13:15

Oh man, that is funny, dude. I used to do that all the time too, and like steal movies from quotes and like take them to the the schoolyard. And man, didn't go over well.

SPEAKER_13 13:27

Yeah, especially when half of them don't make sense in the real world, right? And if you get mentee, like one of the best moments, instead of saying fuck you, he says, You're a lousy fucking softball player. And then we just randomly say that in like a random day-to-day life. You know, you see someone you're mad at him, you're like, You're lousy fucking softball player. And like, I don't even play softball. What are you talking about?

SPEAKER_11 13:48

Right. That's what you meant when you told you told me I was a lousy fucking softball player.

SPEAKER_13 13:54

But I think that's a testament to like Aaron Sorkin's dialogue, too. It's like it's so sharp and quick-witted and engaging. It allows every character in this movie to make an impact. You know, it doesn't matter if you're the lead or you come in for a couple scenes. It's like everybody comes in with such a strong stance of who they are with these words.

SPEAKER_11 14:12

When we were watching this, Sonia said all of Aaron Sorkin's characters are so uh confident. They move through the script and the story with such confidence. And when you have all these characters that are confident, it's like puts so much uh boiling pressure into the story.

SPEAKER_13 14:30

Yeah, it becomes like a battle between each character, character, especially in a movie like this where like morality is such like a thin line, and everyone's kind of like trying to stand their own stance to be like who's right, who's wrong?

SPEAKER_11 14:42

Yeah, this really is I mean, it's a brilliant screenplay. Sorkin's first screenplay based off of his play. Brilliant screenplay, brilliant director, a brilliant team of actors, and I'm sure hundreds of brilliant crew members, just all working together in perfect harmony with this picture. It's like watching an orchestra perform. It's just so tight and like it looks so effortless, and I think that's why it was probably so like and continues to be so rewatchable, you know, like even as a kid, is just because man, it just flows, man. It just flows so smoothly.

SPEAKER_13 15:22

And again, too, like you're saying orchestra, it comes down to casting. Like all of Rod Reiner's films, too. He's he's not a showy director, so he really lets the cast and dialogue be the star of the frame. And I mean, this is my favorite Tom Cruise. I mean, he's so sarcastic, cool, but afraid of doing the right thing until he's like put to the test. You know, I I love the Mr. Impossible movies, but I would take five less of them if I could get five more movies of Tom Cruise than this, or like Jerry McGuire.

SPEAKER_11 15:50

Right.

SPEAKER_13 15:51

Then you also have Nicholson, Demi Moore. The supporting cast is insane too. Keeper Sutherland, JT Walsh, Kevin Bacon, and my favorite, you know, uh sidekick, Kevin Pollack. Oh, okay. Sam Weinberg is one of my favorite characters too, because he's like, he just comes in, he's got a couple of these one-liners every once in a while, but he grounds crews so much in this movie.

SPEAKER_11 16:14

Yeah, he does. He does. And he's like a new dad. It's like, man, guys, this poor guy's like dealing with these this maniac and this rookie, and he just lets like go spend time with your kid, bro.

SPEAKER_13 16:27

Dude, I worked with Kevin Pollock a while ago. Uh I ran Basecamp on uh Kevin Smith's Red State, which uh forgot he said that. Yeah, dude, in that movie, he's got such a powerhouse of a cast. You know, John Goodman, Melissa Leo, Michael Parks. But I was most excited because Sam Weinberg himself was gonna be in this movie. And I remember the first day he came to Base Camp. He comes out to me, he he puts his arm around me and he says, Kid, I need a key to my trailer. The transport captain said no, but back in 2006, I didn't have a key to my trailer, and someone stole$9,000 from my trailer. I don't like$9,000 to be stolen from my trailer, so I need that key or I don't go to set. I don't go to set, you get in trouble, and it's a big mess. You understand? And I remember just like looking at him. I've never even said hello to this guy whatsoever. His arm is still around me, and all I said was, I love a few good men. He just stares at me, doesn't say anything, lets me go, and then I run out trying to get the transport captain to give me a key to his trailer so you can go to set and I don't get fired.

SPEAKER_11 17:28

Did you get the key?

SPEAKER_13 17:30

I got the key, yeah. And uh Pollock was in the film, and uh, I gotta work another day.

SPEAKER_11 17:35

Great story.

unknown 17:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_13 17:38

That's always those moments too when you see people that you love, you're like, oh, this is gonna be such a great moment. I go up, I tell them how much I love their film, and we have this great conversation.

SPEAKER_11 17:45

We're best friends forever, we're hanging out, we're getting beers.

SPEAKER_13 17:49

Yeah. I was like, I have my own Sam Weinberg who's talking to me about his kids, but uh, nope, did not happen. Uh you also, too, for Pikachu Man, we also get drunk Tom Tom Cruise, which drunk Tom Cruise is the best Tom Cruise.

SPEAKER_11 18:04

It's the best Tom Cruise. It really is.

SPEAKER_13 18:06

He's also never had a drink in real life. So all this is like him thinking this is what drunkenness is, and it's awesome. I still think we can win.

SPEAKER_18 18:16

Maybe you should drink a little.

SPEAKER_14 18:18

Look, we'll go to Randolph in the morning and we'll make a motion for a continuance 24 hours. Why would we want to do that? To subpoena Colonel Jessup. What? Listen for a second. No.

SPEAKER_18 18:29

Just hear me out. I won't listen and I won't hear you out. Your passion is compelling, Joe. It's all so useless. Loud and Downey needed a trial lawyer today.

SPEAKER_16 18:41

You chicken shit.

SPEAKER_14 18:43

You're gonna use what happened today as an excuse to give up.

SPEAKER_16 18:47

It's over.

Sorkin’s Dialogue And Casting Alchemy

SPEAKER_14 18:49

Why did you ask Jessup for the transfer order?

SPEAKER_16 18:51

What?

SPEAKER_14 18:51

In Cuba, why did you ask Jessup for the transfer order? It doesn't matter. I wanted the damn transfer order. Bullshit. You could have gotten it by picking up the phone and calling any one of a dozen departments at the Pentagon. You didn't want the transfer order. You wanted to see Jessup's reaction when you asked for the transfer order. You had an instinct, and it was confirmed by Markinson. Now damn it, let's put Jessup on the stand and end this thing.

SPEAKER_18 19:11

What possible good could come from putting Jessup on the stand? He told Kendrick to order the code red. He did? That's great. Why didn't you say so? And of course, you have proof of that. Oh I'm sorry, I keep forgetting. You were sick the day they taught law at law school.

SPEAKER_14 19:29

You put him on the stand and you get it from him.

SPEAKER_18 19:31

Oh, we get it from him! Yes! No problem. We get it from him. Colonel Jessup, isn't it true that you ordered the code red on Santiago? Listen, we're all a little I'm sorry, your time's run out. What do we have for the losers, Judge? Well, for our defendants, it's a lifetime at exotic Fort Leavenworth. And for defense counsel, Caffey, that's right! It's a court martial! Yes, Johnny! After falsely accusing a highly decorated Marine officer of conspiracy and perjury. Lieutenant Caffey will have a long and prosperous career teaching typewriter maintenance at the Rocco Columbo School for Women. Thank you for playing. Should we or should we not? Follow the advice of the Galactically Stupid.

SPEAKER_11 20:16

Yeah, he does this like backwards backbend all the time when he's drunk. It's just like has no control over his body. It's like, oh man. But it's so, so much fun to watch.

SPEAKER_13 20:26

Yeah. So if you have not seen a fugan men and you're asking yourself, like, why should I see it? For this scene alone, when Tom Cruise comes home drunk and you know feels like a failure, it's the best five minutes of cinema. And that also gets us the line of, oh, I guess you were sick the day they taught law, law school.

SPEAKER_11 20:45

Right. Recited on many a New Mexico playground by Ryan.

unknown 20:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_13 20:52

So, like you were saying too, so Aaron Sorkin obviously wrote this as a play, which I guess interesting fact I read about, like he, I guess, hand wrote it on bar napkins when he was a bartender. So his first idea for this was like a bartender writing stuff on napkins, and then you know, it becomes a play. But I saw this performed in Albuquerque in theater. Have you seen the play version of this?

SPEAKER_11 21:14

I haven't.

SPEAKER_13 21:15

No. It's pretty damn close to the movie, which is obviously, you know, testament to you know Sorkin adapting it. But the the play version I saw in Albuquerque was very anticlimatic. It gets the big scene at the end, you know, the big like, I want the truth. And these actors I'm like, oh, I'm excited for it. I'm like, they're gonna, you know, like light this stage on fire. And it was literally like, Do you want answers? Yeah, I think I'm entitled to them. Do you want answers? Yeah. I want the truth. And I remember sitting in the audience, I'm like, wait, that is the most like boring, anticlimatic version of one of the greatest scenes in history. And because of that, I've never seen the play again. So anytime I need my fix, I just go pop in the movie.

SPEAKER_11 21:55

That's gotta be really tough because performing it as a play, everybody is gonna reference, or every all the audience members have that scene as a reference in their head. If you go big and ham, it's like you're just gonna be how do you not just do Jack and Tom? So you almost want to do something different, but when you do something different, it's just like, well, that's not what we came here to see.

SPEAKER_13 22:20

Yeah, and then afterwards, you're like, we should have just did Jack and Tom.

SPEAKER_11 22:24

Right, right. I was listening to an interview with Rob Reiner, and he was talking about directing that scene with Colonel Jess up on the bench, and Jack Nicholson comes in a set, and Rob Reiner goes up to him and tells him, like, hey, Jack, if you're ready, we can do your coverage, we can do your shot now. But if you want to take some time and warm up and get loose into it, we can go around and shoot, you know, different reaction shots of people. And so Jack's like, Why don't you go around and shoot different reactions? You know, so they go around, they shoot Tom's coverage of it, shoot Demi's coverage of it, Kevin Pollack, other reactions, the judge. They keep going and going. And every single time Rob Reiner said that Jack Nicholson was just giving it 100% like going full bore, like the amount of intensity that you we see in the final film, he was giving for everybody's coverage. And so Rob Reiner went up to him and was like, Hey man, do you want to like save your energy? Like, you want to save some of this stuff for like when we turn around and say Jack Nicholson said, You don't understand. I love to act, I just love acting. So when they end up going to Jack's close-up, he that man loves to act. He had a lot left in the tank, obviously, because that is pedal to the metal. You snotty little bastard. Your Honor, I'd like to ask for a recess.

SPEAKER_16 23:48

I'd like an answer to the question, Judge. The corporal wait for an answer. If Lieutenant Kendrick gave an order that Santiago wasn't to be touched, then why did he have to be transferred?

SPEAKER_17 24:01

Colonel? Lieutenant Kendrick ordered the code red, didn't he? Because that's what you told Lieutenant Kendrick to do.

SPEAKER_18 24:09

Cut these guys loose. Your Honor, you can't try the bunny transfer. Your Honor, you doctored the logbook. Consider yourself into King.

SPEAKER_15 24:16

Colonel Justin, did you order the code red? You don't have to answer that question. I'll answer the question. You want answers? I think I'm entitled. You want answers! I want the truth! You can't handle the truth. Son, we live in a world that has walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with guns. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lieutenant Weinberg? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Santiago and you curse the Marines. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know, that Santiago's death while tragic probably saved lives, and my existence while grotesque and incomprehensible to you saves lives. You don't want the truth because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties. You want me on that wall. You need me on that wall. We use words like honor, code, loyalty. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon and stand opposed. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to. Did you order the code red? I did the job. Did you order the code red? You're goddamn right I did!

SPEAKER_13 25:50

Can you imagine being like one of the extras to be like, you know, one of the jury during those scenes for two days? A lot of times as an extra, it can be kind of boring on set because you're seeing the same, you know, scene over and over and over, and it becomes repetitive. But to watch Jack Nicholson do that speech for two days straight and give it 110% each time, that would have been amazing.

SPEAKER_11 26:10

Yeah, you'd never forget it. You'd never forget it.

SPEAKER_13 26:12

Oh, going back to casting too. Another great Rob Reiner aspect, I don't know if you read this, was the actor who plays Lance Corporal Harold Dawson, who's, you know, one of leads of the films. This guy goes head to head with Tom Cruise through the entire movie.

SPEAKER_11 26:26

Right.

Nicholson’s Courtroom Inferno

SPEAKER_13 26:26

He was played by Rob Reiner's personal assistant. Whoa. So Rob was, I guess, like having a hard time trying to cast this role. And Wolfgang was like his assistant through like all misery. He became like a location scout for a few good men. And Rob just turns to him, I guess, and was like, Hey, have you ever thought about acting? And he's like, Nope. He's like, Well, I'm having a hard time casting and willing to lead roles. Would you mind reading for it? He read for it. Rob offered him the role. And the guy is a pivotal part of this entire movie. And a lot of it kind of hangs on whether or not you believe him, whether or not you you feel empathy for him. And also, like his, you know, him and Tom just like going back to back or back and forth with each other is a huge aspect of like what leads to that last, you know, climax of the scene. So only Rob Reiner would, you know, look at his assistant and give him like, you know, a chance of a lifetime.

SPEAKER_11 27:21

Right. Wow. I did not know that story. That's incredible.

SPEAKER_13 27:25

Yeah. Well done, Rob Reiner.

SPEAKER_11 27:27

Because that character has so there's so much unspoken tension between him and Cruz, also, because like Dawson is is kind of like a uh a placeholder for Tom Cruise's father, who's passed away in the in the film, you know. It's like he needs to like impress upon his father that he's like done a good job, but his father's passed, so he can't do that. So he's Dawson kind of is he's the placeholder for that. And there's a lot of that in the picture, but it's all unspoken. It's all just through looks and stuff. So man, that guy did a really good job.

SPEAKER_13 28:06

Yeah, and again, too, testament to Rob Reiner being able to see like, you know, that spark in a non-actor and be like, cool, this is exactly what this film needs. Another aspect that I read from, you know, internet gossip was I guess the studio really wanted like Tom Cruise and Demi Moore to have like a sex scene or some type of romantic spark. And they were fighting for it. They're like, hey, you know, we have these two huge stars. This is like really big for this movie. We need this. Rod Reiner was like, no, that's not what this movie is. That's not what, you know, Demi Moore, Joanne Galloway, like the character's all about. He's like, no, we're not doing it. And he really fought against that. And it's not in Aaron Storken's original script, too. So he's like, hey, trust the source material, trust us. We don't need to like lessen the film by creating like a random like love interest in this.

SPEAKER_11 28:52

Yeah. Yeah, it just would have taken it to a very cheesy place, you know, that it did not need to go to. That's not what not what the movie's about. Well, good for him.

SPEAKER_13 29:03

Yeah. And you almost see like two. There's like one like kind of like dinner scene in the movie, and you feel like it's gonna go that direction, and it kind of completely diverts. And it just becomes like Demi Moore talking, talking straight about like, hey, this is the case. We need to chat about this. This isn't about us like falling for each other. And that's, you know, great.

SPEAKER_11 29:22

I know you could probably talk about it for a thousand years, but do you have any final thoughts on a few good men before we move on?

SPEAKER_13 29:30

I mean, I would just suggest like everybody go out, watch it right now. If you're in Los Angeles, it's playing at Vidy's this upcoming week. So get your ticket, see the film, and then just start reciting, you know, lines in random places in your life.

SPEAKER_11 29:43

Yeah, next time you're at a bar, next time you're at a pickleball pickup game, whoop out the old Tom Cruise vernacular and see how far it gets you.

SPEAKER_13 29:52

Yeah, I'm sure you have a lot of friends who are lousy fucking softball players. It's time, so let them know.

SPEAKER_11 29:58

Tuesday, January 6th at Videot's. Get your tickets. Are you gonna be there, Ryan? Oh, I'm gonna be there. Oh, say hi to Ryan Layson, shake his hand, and tell him to go get you the key to the trailer. Alright, that is gonna take us. We're gonna switch gears quite dramatically here. Misery. Directed by Rob Reiner, written by William Goldman, based on the novel by Stephen King, of course, starring My Boy, Jimmy Kahn, James Kahn, and Kathy Bates, of course, who won an Academy Award for this film. And the film opens with Paul Sheldon, who's played by James Kahn, and he has just typed the last sentence of his new novel. Not just any novel, the novel that's gonna set him free from the Victorian romance novels that he's been stuck in for years. These romance novels that have no doubt made him rich and famous are about a woman named Misery Chastain. But Sheldon is thrilled to now be washed clean of this character. He's been trapped with for years. He's writing books for himself now. And he's on this write and retreat in Silver Creek, Colorado. He celebrates the completion of this book like he celebrates the completion of all his books with a single cigarette and a bottle of Don Perignon champagne. And as he's leaving Colorado, driving back to New York, the snowstorm proves to be too much. Paul Sheldon crashes his car, it's a brutal crash. But somebody saves him, though. Paul Sheldon wakes up in the house. He's being nursed to health by this woman, Annie Wilkes. She explains that she can't take him to the hospital because the roads are closed. But thankfully she's a nurse, so she can take care of him. And taken care of, he needs because his shoulder was separated, his legs are absolutely destroyed. Annie Wilkes promises she'll get him to a hospital as soon as the road's cleared. But that'd be a pretty boring film, right? Exactly. We learn soon that Annie is a super fan of Paul Sheldon and his misery books. She's obsessed, frankly. She's a little quirky and she's a little lonely, and she goes on these odd diatribes, and she's like off-puttingly Christian. And things go from odd to very unsettling to downright fucked. Because while Sheldon is stuck in Annie's house, his final misery book hits the shelves. And Annie is first in line to get it, and she loves it. Until she doesn't, until she finds out that Paul Sheldon has killed off misery, and thus the series, and Annie just loses it.

SPEAKER_06 32:50

You dirty bird. How could you?

SPEAKER_07 32:59

She can't be dead. Misery chestang cannot be dead.

SPEAKER_10 33:05

Annie, in 1871, women often died in childbirth. But her spirit is the important thing, and Misery Spirit is still alive.

SPEAKER_05 33:13

I don't want her bad! I want her!

SPEAKER_10 33:19

No! I didn't.

SPEAKER_05 33:22

Who did?

SPEAKER_10 33:23

No one. She she died. She just slipped away.

SPEAKER_05 33:28

Slipped away. Slipped away. She didn't just slip away. You did it! You did it! You did it! You did it! You better!

SPEAKER_06 33:49

I thought you were good, Paul. But you're not good. You're just another lying old dirty birdie. And I don't think I'd better be around you for a while.

SPEAKER_07 34:09

And don't even think about anybody coming for you. Not the doctors, not your agent, not your family. Because I never called them. Nobody knows you're here. And you better hope nothing happens to me. Because if I die, you die.

SPEAKER_11 34:36

She goes from adoring caretaker to psycho kidnapper, maybe turn murderer. She forces Sheldon to burn the manuscript of his post-misery novel, his baby, and instead she gets him a typewriter and paper, and she forces him to write a new misery novel. One where misery comes back to life, and her story continues, and Paul is just in hell. Furthermore, she explains that the entire world has already assumed Paul Sheldon dead. Nobody's coming to look for him. Not his daughter. Not his agent. Not nobody. Almost everybody assumes that he's dead. The sheriff in Silver Creek, Buster, isn't quite comfortable. He doesn't like how buttoned up this Paul Sheldon situation is. He thinks Sheldon is still out there somewhere. But can he get to Sheldon before it's too late? Ryan, Misery loves company. What are your thoughts on old misery? Two words.

SPEAKER_13 35:36

Kathy Bates.

SPEAKER_11 35:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_13 35:39

Dude, talk about one hell of a coming out of the gate for an actor who goes on to become one of the greatest performances in cinema.

SPEAKER_11 35:46

Yeah. So intense.

SPEAKER_13 35:49

So intense. I think you can always look at a movie and think, you know, who else could have played this role? For James Conn, who is incredible in this movie, I can imagine this with, you know, a handful of actors. Like Paul Newman would have crushed this role. But there's only one person who could have played Annie Wilkes. Yeah. And that is Kathy Bates.

SPEAKER_11 36:06

100%. Yeah. She is so so hypnotic in this movie. You just can't take your eyes off of her. And she swings that pendulum back and forth between being like lovable and so sweet to just nightmarishly off-putting at the drop of a hat. She just changes these gears with such finesse. And I don't know how she does it, but it is a delight to watch.

SPEAKER_13 36:36

Yeah, it's absolutely terrifying. And I think that's too like a testament to like Stephen Keane, you know. And I I've read a bunch of Stephen King books, and I've always kind of leaned towards more of his like short stories. And though Misery was like a novel, not a short story, it has a lot of like the similarities in the way that all wrapped around like one concept, you know, deals with only a handful of characters and escalates that ticking time bomb of what's going to happen. And I think too, as a filmmaker, when you have like that type of script, it kind of becomes like a little bit of like a gift and a curse. You know, you're confined to a lot of the script to be just in one bedroom, one bed. You're fully reliant on two actors to almost carry every single scene. And Rob Reiner even said too, like he studied a lot of Hitchcock to really understand how to like form a thriller. And you can kind of see some rear window in this too, where it's like the camera keeping the suspense, while the frame just literally holds on like one guy in a wheelchair. But the biggest gift you can have, like as a filmmaker, is you know, when your source material is Stephen Keen and then your script is adapted by William Goldman. Right.

SPEAKER_11 37:44

Yeah, yeah, for sure. That's uh that is a blessing for sure. Yeah, as you said, there's so many, like, there's so many big things about this picture that people remember, you know, Kathy Bates' performance obviously being the most obvious, the hobbling scene, which we'll get into in a little bit, but re-watching it this time, there was something that would just like stuck out to me, and it was the details in this picture. And this is what I'm talking about when with like a Reiner directed movie, he is always working for his pictures, not his pictures working for Reiner. His stylistic approach in this movie is so different from you know the movies that he did before and after it. His visual storytelling is probably at its sharpest with this film. It it opens with a series of inserts. You know, you got the end written on the manuscript, you got the single cigarette and match, you got the champagne going to the glass. And these inserts are like not only candy for the eyes, but they come back, of course, play a huge role in the climax of the film. And then throughout the film, you have all these other like amazing inserts that are so integral into the storytelling, the non-verbal storytelling and and the crux of the mystery. You know, like Paul taking pills and hiding them in the mattress. You have like all these tight inserts of this whole process happening. You know, Paul escaping the room and nearly knocking down the tiny ceramic penguin that comes into play later in the film. So yeah, the performances are great, obviously. The source material is amazing, the script is amazing, but there's so many visual, small pieces of the storytelling in this picture that I just think are really, really tremendous and a great like study tool for filmmakers.

Visual Tension And Hitchcock Touches

SPEAKER_13 39:38

Yeah, 100%. What a masterclass in filmmaking. I mean, like you said too, that opening scene, you know, without having like basically any dialogue, you know exactly who James Conn's character is. Right. Which is like, you know, the match, the cigarette, the champagne, finishes the book, gets in the car, he's singing, going down the remote snowy road. It's like by that point, cool. I don't need to have any other type of like dialogue or exposition. Like, I know who this character is. So much so that when the car crash happens, like three minutes into the film, you're instantly, you feel bad for this character that you haven't even really met yet. Right. And and also, what a great way to start the movie, too. You have the juxtaposition, this like fun, happy, you know, song. And then you have this drastic, crazy car crash. Which nowadays, too, like so much of that would just be like a CGI car crash. But they're like, nope, we're in Truckee, California, and we are gonna crash this car into a mound of snow. Right. Which also I didn't realize the film was like filmed in Nevada, too, for the most part. Which, you know, if like a snowy small town scene, like you don't think about like this being like, oh, this is definitely shot in Nevada.

SPEAKER_11 40:44

Oh, yeah. I had no idea. I thought totally thought it was Colorado.

SPEAKER_13 40:48

So I guess like there's like a little town in Nevada that kind of looks like Colorado's that they filmed there, and then they filmed all the snowy scenes like in Truckee.

SPEAKER_11 40:55

There you go.

SPEAKER_13 40:55

Fooled me. Yeah, movie magic right there.

SPEAKER_11 41:00

But yeah, also with Reiner's just like knowing when to implement some of the more creative or extreme shots, of which there are many. I watched this interview with him. He was talking about like some of his favorite shots throughout his career. And he talked about he really wanted to use a Dutch angle in this movie, Dutch Tilt, which is like basically a canted shot that was used a lot in like thrillers in the 40s and 50s. But he's like, I want to use it at the right time. I don't want to just like you know blow it early. So he uses it after Annie reveals that she has a gun and it's like pouring rain outside. She goes outside and and walks down the steps, and that's when he introduces the Dutch angle, and it's just like knowing when to like, for lack of a better word, pull that trigger of when to go ham with the visuals. You gotta save it and reserve it, and then when you use it at the right time, it's just wonderful.

SPEAKER_13 41:57

Also, what was amazing about that scene, too, and I caught that on this watch. Uh I just rewatched the film yesterday, but after she reveals she has a gun, it does that shot, it cuts back to James Conn, and all he does is just like turn and look out the window. And I think, too, as a filmmaker, you're instinctively you're like, okay, cool. Now we have to show like the fear on his face, or have this like big, you know, scared moment so the audience knows he's afraid of the gun. But you know, you don't need that. It's like by him seeing that and just literally looking out the window, you get the entire sense of like he knows he's fucked.

SPEAKER_11 42:29

Yep. Yep. He knows it. We know it.

SPEAKER_13 42:36

James Conn to you, man. He's great in this. He's great. I know you have a very torrid relationship with James Conn, but he is a damn good actor.

SPEAKER_11 42:46

If anybody wants to hear my about my my relationship with James Conn, they could go back and listen to our hundredth episode. Actually, we discussed The Godfather. I'll I went into that. I love him. I mean, I do love him, and I love him in this movie. He is, I think he's wonderful.

SPEAKER_13 43:03

Did you see all the other actors that were up for the role?

SPEAKER_11 43:06

No, actually.

SPEAKER_13 43:08

They wanted Kevin Klein, I think Michael Douglas, you know, Harrison Ford, which probably got offered every single role.

SPEAKER_12 43:13

Right.

SPEAKER_13 43:14

Al Bacchino, Gene Hackman, and Robert Redford. I guess William Hurt, he really wanted, and William Hurt said no twice. And then Warren Beatty was so close to landing this role that like they were starting to write different, or Goldman was starting to write different aspects that Warren Beatty wanted into the role, into the script. And then Warren Beatty's like, I'm out. Just like Dinkill Bill, Warren Beatty gets so close, and he's like, I think I'm good. I'm gonna stay in.

SPEAKER_11 43:40

Wow. What a what a different picture would have been with Warren Beatty or Robert Chino, or Alvin Reddy. Or like Alvin Chino, I can't, I honestly can't imagine it with Alvin Chino. I cannot imagine it. But Red Redford, I could see for sure. I could, and I could see Warren Beatty for sure.

SPEAKER_13 43:58

Yeah, won't be, I mean William Hurt too, like Dean Hackman, all those guys. Dustin Hoffman would have crushed it. But again, there's only one, Kathy Bates.

SPEAKER_11 44:07

There's only one Kathy Bates. She's she's wonderful. She's so there's moments where she gets so weird. Like when she brings in her pig and she starts snorting like the pig visery, and she snorts as the pig's leaving the room, and then she turns around and like starts snorting at him. It's just like, oh my god, what is happening?

SPEAKER_13 44:26

That that's gotta be like the moment for two for Paul's character when he's laying in that bed, and you're like, Oh, I am screwed.

SPEAKER_11 44:34

Oh man.

SPEAKER_13 44:35

It's speaking of that, should we talk about the hobbling?

SPEAKER_11 44:38

Yeah, let's get into the hobbling scene. For for our folks at home who don't know about the scene, I think it's a pretty famous scene. And if you don't want to be spoiled, maybe skip ahead, but I'll paint the picture. Our guy, Paul, was a dirty birdie and went outside of his room. So Kathy Bates explains that she's going to use this technique that was used, I don't know what century, but it was called hobbling. And she puts this wooden block in between his two ankles, basically, and she has his legs strapped down, so his legs are stuck, and she takes a fucking sledgehammer and cracks this dude's footslash ankles off on this piece of wood.

SPEAKER_08 45:28

What you've been out of your room.

SPEAKER_09 45:34

Paul, my little ceramic penguin in the study always faces due south.

SPEAKER_10 45:42

I don't I don't know what you're talking about. Ceramic penguin.

SPEAKER_08 45:49

Is this what you're looking for? I know you've been out twice, Paul. First, I couldn't figure out how you did it. But last night, I found your key.

SPEAKER_07 46:05

I know I left my scrapbook out. I can imagine what you might be thinking of me. But you see, Paul, it's all okay. Last night it came so clear. I realize you just need more time. Eventually you'll come to accept the idea of being here. Paul, do you know about the early days at the Kimberly Diamond Mines? Do you know what they did to the native workers who stole diamonds? Don't worry, they didn't kill them. That would be like junking your Mercedes just because it had a broken spring. No, if they caught them, they had to make sure they could go on working, but they also had to make sure they could never run away. The operation was called hobbling.

SPEAKER_10 46:58

Whatever you think about doing, listen to it.

SPEAKER_00 47:08

Shh.

SPEAKER_08 47:10

Trust me. It's for the best.

SPEAKER_06 47:18

Almost done. Just one more.

SPEAKER_08 47:30

God, I love you.

SPEAKER_11 47:32

They show it for like maybe not even a full second. It might be like 20 frames, but it is enough to stick with you for the rest of your natural-born life.

SPEAKER_13 47:45

I I've seen this movie 20 times, and still every single time I know the scene's coming up, I know exactly what's gonna happen. But to the power of the scene, it gets me every time. And you're right, it only shows it for a second on like the left foot and the right foot, they don't even show it. They don't even show it. You still feel it.

SPEAKER_11 48:04

Yeah. And brilliant to not show it that second time because it's like all you need to do is see it once, and then you can you the thing is you do see it the second time, it's just in your head, and which is makes it all the more worse. And Khan's performances, he's screaming in agony. Oh my god, it's horrible.

SPEAKER_13 48:23

It's just horrible, so good. Which in the book, I guess, she doesn't do that, she chops off his foot and stuff. Right. Right, right. Which I know they went kind of back and forth with when filming this, and they did, and I think Reiner was the one that decided like this was worse. And I think it honestly is, too, because obviously, if you get your foot cut off, that's you know, at the end of the day, probably worse than getting hobbled. But there's something about seeing that on screen that makes it so much more impactful than if she would have just chopped off his ankle.

SPEAKER_11 48:54

Yeah, it's the uniqueness and the like sinisterness of it all. Like, you know, this is America. We've seen limbs get chopped off in movies hundreds of times. Hundreds of times, but we never seen a hobbling, we never seen this kind of stuff. Like, this is some fucking archaic, twisted shit.

SPEAKER_13 49:15

Yeah, and honestly, we don't really see much hobbling since that.

SPEAKER_11 49:18

Yeah, it's true. Let's bring back the hobbling.

SPEAKER_13 49:21

Yeah, I feel like every other movie needs a good hobbling scene.

SPEAKER_11 49:25

Yeah, one of the most iconic memorable scenes in in any thriller probably contributed to Kathy Bates getting that Oscar. She's so fucking ice cold when she picks up that sledgehammer. My god.

SPEAKER_13 49:44

Oh, yeah. And I love too, like, she does all this like terrible stuff to him, and then she goes, I love you. And you're like, You are insane. Well, I think what also like solidifies for being insane is that she keeps the scrapbook of all her evil deeds. You know, it's like, yeah. I'm a big fan of keeping a scrapbook too. I like to keep the scrapbook of, you know, every year. So I remember, like, you know, good moments and like, you know, accomplishments. But she does the same thing too, but her accomplishments are like, I murdered a baby. You know, like killed my husband. Right. There's literally a scene where too, like, it talks about like, you know, she's a nurse and she's responsible for all these like infants' death. And then she has like this cut out of words on this newspaper article about another baby's death, and it says, like, add another baby. It's like, what? And I love too. Like, James Cow just opens up that scrapbook and like just flips through the pages. And again, too, such a subtle reaction from him, but just like you can see on his face, like, oh my god, where am I?

SPEAKER_11 50:49

And and how apt, you know, here's the symbolism. We actually see her kill a baby in the picture. She she forces James Conn to burn his manuscript that's killing his baby right there.

SPEAKER_13 51:03

Oh, nice. Do you even think about it in that respect? Another interesting thing, too, like thinking metaphorically, which I remember like maybe 10 years ago when I saw that interview with Stephen King, when he talked about writing the book, and he was saying that like he wrote misery as basically it was all about like his drug addiction, and that Annie, I think he said Annie was my drug problem, and she was my number one fan. God, she never wanted to leave. So going back and re-watching the film, thinking about it in that case, makes it like such an interesting watch too, thinking about the whole time, like Annie is basically drug addiction, and she's just ruining Paul's life. And he has to basically overcome it in order to be free of his addiction. It kind of turns into like this like psychological like horror film. Totally, yeah.

SPEAKER_11 51:51

Well, and it's also, you know, like I think he's also mentioned that it's sometimes he has felt pigeonholed and trapped in the horror genre, even though he never said he was a horror writer and he wanted to spread his wings, and he wrote one novel, a fantasy novel, and his fans hated it, even though the critics liked it, and he was just like he felt that sometimes fandom can get too obsessive and like forces people to do things that maybe they don't want to do. And Rob Reiner said that's how he kind of like that's why he wanted to do this picture and why he connected to it, because kind of like what we were talking about earlier is like after All in the Family, people were expecting him to just continue doing sitcoms and just be a comedy guy like his dad and just kind of stick to that one lane, and he has always tried to branch off of that. So misery's kind of like an amalgamation of his career, just trying to like always do something different and not get pigeonholed.

Addiction, Fandom, And Metaphor

SPEAKER_13 52:56

Yeah, absolutely. And Stephen King, who's also been very notorious about not liking adaptations of his films and not trusting a lot of directors, must have had a lot of faith in Rob because obviously Rob did Stand By Me, he did this, and then Rob's company, Castle Rock, also produced The Green Mile, too.

unknown 53:14

Right.

SPEAKER_13 53:14

Three of the best Stephen King films, you know, came from Rob Reiner.

SPEAKER_11 53:18

That's true. That's true. Hmm. That'd be a good gimme three right there.

SPEAKER_13 53:24

Yeah, exactly. Oh, another little fact I read about too, which kind of goes back to the Fugaman stage reading, was I guess William Goldman a couple years ago, like maybe 10 years ago, wrote a stage adaptation for misery. Uh huh. So the cast for the stage adaptation to misery was Bruce Willis and Lori Metcalf.

SPEAKER_04 53:48

Wow.

SPEAKER_13 53:50

Yeah. I mean, pretty incredible. I mean, again, Kathy Bates is still like the legend, but I do think Lori Metcalf on stage with Bruce Willis would have been a hell of a show.

SPEAKER_11 53:59

Yeah, hell yeah. Oh, but you could oh, Bruce Willis would be so good in that that role. Man, that's awesome. Missed that one. Misery. Misery. It is streaming currently on HBO Max, but I saw that it's leaving there soon. So check it out while you can. And on January 20th and 21st, it's gonna be screening at Harkins Theaters in both Cerritos and Chino Hills. So if you live in the Cerritos area, Chino Hills area, check it out on the big screen while you can.

SPEAKER_13 54:29

Oh, I've actually never seen Misery on the big screen. That'd be great.

SPEAKER_11 54:32

Yeah, hell yeah. All right, my friends. That is gonna take us to a break. During that break, you're gonna hear from Gimme 3 producer, LED FF director, and my wife, Sonia Maru, for a segment that we call Sonia's Movie Minute. So stick around for that and much more right here on the Gimme 3 Podcast.

SPEAKER_01 54:58

Hello, I'm Sonia, and this is my Movie Minute. As the news of Rob and Michelle Reiner's deaths unfolded, it went from bad to worst. And almost everyone in the world began mourning the loss of a legend who is known equally for his humor, talent, and kindness. In a career that includes some of the most beloved movies of all time, like Stand By Me, When Harry Met Sally, and The Princess Bride, my favorite is the one that started it all. This is Spinal Tap. I don't think a day goes by that I don't have a little private laugh over something from that movie. Sometimes it's the string of drummers who meet untimely demises. Sometimes it's the lyrics to Big Bottom. I met her on Monday. Twas my lucky bun day. You know what I mean. I love her each weekday, each velvety cheek day, you know what I mean. But more often than not, I think about turning it to eleven. While, of course, Christopher Guest is the one we all think of in that scene. It's Rob Reiner's straight man performance and leading questions that get us to unforgettable comedy gold. I think it's touching and telling that Reiner's last films were made with his lifelong friends. The documentary, Albert Brooks, Defending My Life, and Spinal Tap 2, The End Continues. And we have the forthcoming concert film, Spinal Tap at Stonehenge, the final finale. It's hard to say rest in peace about someone who is so clearly not ready to go and should not have gone the way he did. So I will just leave it at I hope you turned it to 11 while you were here.

SPEAKER_04 56:48

And I can play without all the murky match. You can run anywhere on stage with that. This is special too. No. See? Still got the uh the old tagger on it. So you never even played it. See? You just bought it. Don't touch it. Don't touch it. I wasn't gonna touch it. No, don't touch it. I was just pointing at it. Well, don't point even. Don't even point. No. It can't be played. Never. I mean, I've got to play. Can I look at it? No, you've seen a number. This is a top to uh, you know, what we use on stage, but it's very, very special because if you can see, yeah, the numbers all go to eleven. Look, right across the board. Eleven mostly.

SPEAKER_02 57:26

Amps go up to ten.

SPEAKER_04 57:27

Exactly. Does that mean it's louder? Is it any louder? Well, it's one louder, isn't it? It's not ten. You see, most most blokes, you know, be playing at ten. You're on ten here, all the way up, all the way up, yeah. All the way up. You're on ten on your guitar, where can you go from there? Where? I don't know. Nowhere, exactly. What we do is if we need that extra push over the cliff, you know what we do? Put it up to a little bit, exactly.

SPEAKER_02 57:52

One loud. Why don't you just make ten louder and make ten be the top number and make that a little louder?

SPEAKER_04 58:01

These go to eleven.

Sonia’s Movie Minute: Spinal Tap

The Princess Bride: Pure Movie Joy

SPEAKER_11 58:12

It's the Gimme Three Podcast, everybody, and we are dedicating this episode to the late great Rob Reiner. We had the nearly impossible task of picking just three films of this man's incredible catalog. Before the break, we discussed Ryan Layson's favorite movie. Ryan Layson, my guest, his favorite film of all time, A Few Good Men. And then we discussed the Stephen King adaptation, Misery. Now, we're gonna go further back in time. Discuss one of my favorites of all time, The Princess Bride. Princess Bride, directed by Rob Reiner, of course, written once again by William Goldman. Another adaptation or another collaboration with Rob Reiner here, and it's based off of his novel. And the cast, my god, the cast. Listen to this. Carrie Ellis, Mandy Petinkin, Robin Reitner film debut, Chris Sheridan, Christopher Guest, Wallace Sean, Andre the Giant, Fred Savage, Peter Falk, Billy Crystal, and Carol Kane. And that is just to name a few. And Peter Falk plays a grandpa who's reading a story to his grandson, Fred Savage, who's homesick from school. And this story that he reads, it starts with some romance, which the kid ain't into, but the grandpa's like, just relax, you little shit, because it's gonna be some adventure and some crazy things that are happening, and it's very true. But at the heart of it, it is this love story. This love story between Wesley, who's played by Carrie Ellis, and the beautiful Buttercup, who's Robin Wright. And they're both villagers. They're common folk who fall madly in love. But they need some money for the marriage. So Wesley takes off to seek his fortune. And in his absence, the prince. Prince Prince Humperdink picks Buttercup to be his bride, his princess bride, if you will. And she, of course, has no choice in the matter. She also has no choice in the fact that she's kidnapped by some small time thieves, this wannabe philosopher, a Spanish swordsman, an ego Montoya, and a giant, Fezik. But the three of them and Buttercup are being followed by a masked man. And one by one, the masked man defeats these three blokes at their own game. For the Spaniard, he beats him with steel in a fencing duel. One of the best fencing duels ever, because it's also accompanied by this barrage of brilliant witty dialogue. And he bests the giant, of course, in a battle of strength. And he bests the leader of this group in the Battle of Wits. So now the Smashed Man has Princess Buttercup, and it's revealed that this masked man is, in fact, Wesley himself. And Buttercup and Wesley are now on the run from Prince Humperdink and his army, and they make it through the hellacious fire swamp, but they are cut off at the end. And it seems that they're going to kill Wesley, but Buttercup makes a deal. She says, Leave Wesley alive, send him away on his pirate ship, and she'll go back to the castle with Humperdink. She just simply cannot live with the fact of Wesley dying because of her. So Humperdink accepts this deal. And later Buttercup just tells Humperdink, you know what? I'm probably just going to kill myself instead of marrying you. One of the coldest fucking backhands of all time. I'd rather die than be with you. But she loves Wesley also. You know, she's like, if I'm not going to marry this guy, I'm not why live? Well, Humperdink makes her a new deal. He's going to send four of his fastest ships out to retrieve Wesley and bring him back to her. But if she doesn't, if he doesn't want to come, or if they can find him, she'll have to marry him. Of course he's a lion scoundrel. He doesn't hold up to his end of the bargain at all. Because Humperdink kills Wesley. Or does he? The lovable characters of Enigo Montoya and Fezzick return. And they must bring. This is a crazy movie. They must bring Wesley back to life in time to storm the castle, avenge the father of Anigo Montoya, and stop the wedding of Buttercup and Humperdink. Simple, right? I did not do this description justice because there is just so much juicy plot throughout this film, and it's laid out with such ease, such finesse, such comedic brilliance. But I did my best and it is truly a masterpiece. Ryan, what are your thoughts on The Princess Bride?

SPEAKER_13 1:02:55

This was my first intro to Rob Rainer. But again, it goes back to being a kid. Yeah. It's one of the first times as a child that I remember my parents playing a movie for me that wasn't a cartoon. Like I was finally graduating into adult films. But the movie does such a great job of like ushering in the youth too to make them feel comfortable. Like you're like you're Fred Savage sitting on a bed, being told a fantasy about friendship, revenge, pirates, and true love. Right. It's so good. I mean, after the film, I pretended, you know, I took a wooden ruler and I pretended it was my sword, and I practiced in my bedroom, swearing that one day I too would grow up to be the dread pirate Roberts. Which uh I did not grow up to be a pirate, though I do feel like working in the film industry is like being on an adventure that revolves around betrayal, revenge, and some type of torture. Totally.

SPEAKER_11 1:03:52

Yeah, like you, I do remember watching this for the first time as well. And kind of like your story with a few good men, this was like a real shift for me. I credit this to this movie to being one of the movies that made me want to get into movies. At the time it was as an actor because I didn't know what a director was. But I remember it was fourth grade, and my teacher was out, and we had a substitute teacher, and she just threw this on so she can like, you know, whatever, fuck off and read it the her book or whatever. But you know, it's fourth grade, so the she puts this movie on, and everybody's still rambunctious, nobody's really paying attention. But by the middle, all the class was totally locked in, everybody was on the edge of their seats, and I remember when this movie ended, the cheers it got from my fourth grade classroom. And it we kind of went on the the same trajectory, the same experience that Fred Savage goes through in the movie. He's like, Oh, what is this? Some fluffy romance lovey movies. Yeah. And then by the end, we were totally, totally hooked, loving it. I would never forget that reaction that the movie got from a classroom full of kids who were at school. And I was just like, okay, this is something special here from that.

SPEAKER_13 1:05:12

And that's tough too, to make a film that, you know, you can love at seven years old and you can live at eight years old. Right. I mean, the film literally has something for like everybody and never feels like it's dumbing it down for the for a youthful audience or feels like all the jokes are just completely going over your head.

SPEAKER_11 1:05:28

It's funny, it's it's funny in a way that like, you know, those early seasons of The Simpsons are funny. It's funny for kids, but then like as an adult, you're just like, oh, I didn't get that joke when I was a kid. Oh, I didn't get that joke when I was a kid, I didn't get that joke. So yeah, it's just got layers. And now as an adult, I'm also like super duper into that romance stuff. And now that is the heart of the movie for me. When I was a kid, the heart of the movie was Andre the Giant. I was like, let's see Andre the Giant do some more mischief, you know. But now it's like, oh, okay, yeah, the romance is the heart of the picture. But you know, when you're in fourth grade, you don't realize that.

SPEAKER_13 1:06:03

Oh, yeah. I mean, it's all about true love. And I remember being a kid too, being like, Who is Robin Wright? Because this is the most perfect person I've ever seen.

SPEAKER_11 1:06:13

She is she is gorgeous in this. She is just gorgeous.

SPEAKER_13 1:06:18

And again, too, goes back to Rob Reiner, too, and just like such an incredible filmmaker when it comes to casting. You know, I mean, Robin Wright to basically take her out of nowhere and make her the titular character of the film. Carrie Owis, who was like also a relative unknown at that time, and for him to like, he's so dynamic in this film, too. And I'm I'm sure like that's probably the one role he gets asked about all the time because it still like holds up now 40 something years later, or however old it is.

SPEAKER_11 1:06:49

He he Reiner is you know, I was talking about the visual storytelling with misery with this film. It is like what he does so great in this movie is like he cultivates chemistry. Like, there are so many duos and trios in this movie that when they're on screen together, it's just electric, man. Robin Wright and Carrie Ellis, wonderful. We don't see them much on screen together, but when they are on screen together, it's just so wonderful. Carrie Ellis and Mandy Petinkin, my God, when they're like jousting, but also like shooting the shit and like cracking jokes on each other. Oh my god. Like you could watch those two bounce dialogue back and forth for hours and hours and not get bored.

SPEAKER_13 1:07:36

Billy Crystal, Carol Kane.

SPEAKER_11 1:07:38

Yeah, Billy Crystal, Carol Kane. I mean, Andre's got chemistry with everybody. Chris Sarandon and Christopher Guest are wonderful together. It's just like he Reiner creates these environments that just lets his characters and the actors and the script just fly off the page, fly off the screen, and it's just you get melted into the screen watching this stuff. It's so, so great. Did you ever read the book?

SPEAKER_13 1:08:03

No, I haven't actually. It's pretty fascinating. It's you know, usually like I'm like, oh, you should read the book before you watch the movie. But in the case of The Princess Bride, it honestly makes it better to watch the movie first and then go back and reread the book.

SPEAKER_11 1:08:17

Is the book as comedic as the film is?

SPEAKER_13 1:08:22

Yeah. I mean, my memory serves me correct. It definitely feels like it's got a lot of that same tone. Because it's basically like William Goldman is like writing this book as if he's adapting this old story they found from like a fictional writer named S. Morgenstern. So as like the story goes through, Goldman kind of writes in a lot of like his little like footnotes to be like, well, that's I cut this scene because this scene makes no sense. I wrote this scene because this is you know funnier. So he almost becomes like the Pierre Fault character in the actual like novel of like rewriting it all. So it has a lot of that same kind of like wit and humor that gets translated to the film.

SPEAKER_11 1:08:58

That's cool. That's cool. And then did you read also Carrie Ellis wrote a was it Carrie Ellis who wrote a book about his experience on this movie? Oh, yeah, it was like a like a 20-year oral history or something that I came out here or something.

SPEAKER_13 1:09:12

Right.

SPEAKER_11 1:09:13

I think it was called As You Wish, I think was Yes.

SPEAKER_13 1:09:16

Well, definitely uh wish I would have asked for that for Christmas, so a little late. My birthday's coming up.

SPEAKER_12 1:09:23

Right.

SPEAKER_13 1:09:24

Uh yeah, that that'll be a good kind of read too, especially seeing it or hearing it from like his perspective. I worked with Carrie Ellis on two films before, and he is a delight. Yeah.

Chemistry, Casting, And Craft

SPEAKER_11 1:09:34

So nice guy. I've heard nothing but great things about him. Yeah, there's there's so many great stories that come out of the making of this movie. There's so many great stories about Andre the Giant from this picture, and as a wrestling fan, like it's also like a uh it's a favorite among wrestling fans because they get to see Andre in like a totally different element. And he loved working on this movie and he loved Rob Reiner. And Andre would say like for the first time, other than being like at home, he felt at home on this set because people weren't just staring at him, you know, they treated him as an equal. And yeah, there's so many great stories about him. But Robin Wright has this great one of like it being a really freezing night on set. You know, I think they were like on one of the boats or something, or maybe it was the one where he catches her after she jumps out of the window, and it was like super freezing. Andre saw that she was super cold, and he just took his gigantic hand and put it on top of her head to warm her up. And she said, and it worked like immediately. But, you know, he is he was the gentle giant.

SPEAKER_13 1:10:48

That's so great. I read I read a bunch of like other articles too, talking about how since they're all kind of stuck filming in this like small town in England, that the entire cast and crew were staying at the same hotel, like everybody would hang out afterwards. And that's kind of one of my favorite parts of filmmaking is just, you know, I love being in the same hotel, going down to the lobby, seeing some random crew member or cast at the bar, chatting with them, planning dinner, doing an activity on the weekends with everybody. Those are the jobs, like the film summer camps that you remember and instantly drawn for your life. And it feels like the cast kind of was in that same type of situation, like, you know, for this one.

SPEAKER_11 1:11:27

Yeah, yeah, 100%.

SPEAKER_13 1:11:29

I was at Republican Pie earlier, and I was just kind of like reading up on uh, you know, some stuff with this too. And I was like, this movie's been around for a long time. And I was like, I wonder if they've ever made a uh a porn about the Princess Bride, since I feel like they've made one about like every single movie possible, you know, Edward Penis Hands, Google Humpy. And I'm sitting at the you know, the coffee shop, and I was like, man, I probably should not Google this here, but like now I'm like super curious. So I type in, I'm like, has there been a Princess Bride porno film? And instantly pops up the Princess Butterbutt, and then instantly on my screen, I'm like, oh God. One, I gotta delete all my cookies now. I had to delete my entire history on my computer. I probably had to leave this coffee shop before I get kicked out. But if you're looking for a double feature tonight, there you go. Did you go home and watch it? No, I've not yet gone home. You know, I'm afraid what my wife would say if I'm like, hey, I got a movie for us tonight. It's not the Princess Bride. Let's call the Princess Butter But. No questions asked. I mean, if it's half as good as Goodwill Humping.

SPEAKER_11 1:12:35

All right. Well, maybe we'll do a well, maybe we'll do a gimme three of porn spoofs of famous movies.

SPEAKER_13 1:12:44

That'll be the Christmas classic coming in 236.

SPEAKER_11 1:12:48

All right, I have here gimme three pieces of trivia, even though we've kind of been talking about trivia the whole episode. But here's a segment for you. Gimme three pieces of trivia for the Princess Bride.

unknown 1:13:04

I want to play a game. I want to play a game.

SPEAKER_11 1:13:08

Number one, you know, is kind of like one of the more famous lines, one of the most more famous sequences of the picture.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:17

Marriage. Marriage is what brings us together today. Marriage, that blessing arrangement, that dream within our dream.

SPEAKER_11 1:13:33

What is he credited as? The something priest. Oh, isn't that the priest? Yeah, the impressive priest, I think, is the impressive priest.

SPEAKER_13 1:13:43

That's a great title.

SPEAKER_11 1:13:44

Yeah. The the priest presiding over the marriage was inspired by a famous Chicago rabbi who had a speech impenetment, and William Goldman just thought it was hilarious because he's a dick.

SPEAKER_13 1:14:07

Oh, that's great. I did not know that.

SPEAKER_11 1:14:11

Wonderful. And has stood the test of time. One of the most quoted lines ever.

SPEAKER_13 1:14:18

I can't imagine how many marriages, like real weddings, that somebody pulls that same line out for it.

SPEAKER_11 1:14:22

Or it's got to happen. Or anytime somebody's getting engaged.

unknown 1:14:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_11 1:14:31

Alright, piece of trivia number two. The R O U S, rodents of unusual size that are in the fire swamp. Those were created with little people, actors actually inside the rat suits.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:46

Oh, wow.

SPEAKER_11 1:14:48

And on the day that Wesley was supposed to wrestle, main actor Danny Blackner, for that, you know, that famous fight with the giant rat, they could not find Danny anywhere. He was nowhere to be found when it came time to shoot that scene. And so finally, Blackner arrived hella late on set, and he had this long story about being pulled over for speeding the night before on his way home from the bar, probably driving drunk, and subsequently put in jail for hours for drinking because the police officers did not believe his story about having to work in the morning, go play a rat, a gigantic rat. They did not believe him.

SPEAKER_13 1:15:30

Oh man, that's hilarious. That'd be a fun, like one crazy night movie after hours.

SPEAKER_11 1:15:35

Right. Totally. So that dude probably got no sleep that night and then had to jump in that rat suit and wrestle Carriolis on the dirt for 12 hours.

SPEAKER_13 1:15:47

What's crazy is like now if this movie is made, like all that stuff would just be like all CGI.

Trivia: Rats, Riffs, And “Mawwiage”

SPEAKER_11 1:15:52

Yep. All right, and then finally, final piece of trivia, and I'm sure a lot of people know this, but that Billy Crystal sequence, Miracle Max, Billy Crystal was improvising a lot and basically just doing a stand-up comedy routine. And the entire crew was cracking up, and basically the sound people were getting so pissed that they had to start dismissing crew from the set. They're like, all right, you keep breaking, you gotta get out, you gotta get out, you gotta get out. It got to the point where even Rob Reiner had to leave the set because he was laughing so hard that he actually said he was feeling nauseated because his stomach was hurting so much. Mandy Potinkin claims that the only injury he sustained during the entire film was bruised, he got bruised ribs due to all the laughter from his scene with Billy Crystal. And that that line that he gives where Miracle Max asks, like, oh, you know, like I'm only gonna do if it's a noble cause, and Mandy says, This is noble, sir. Like you can almost see him breaking there, but he like holds it in. But yeah, Billy Crystal nearly killed several members of the crew just with his his improvisation here.

SPEAKER_13 1:17:08

Oh, that's too good. And that's also, I mean, again, why I love Rob Reiner too. I mean, you could just imagine him at View Village just cracking up and just enjoying Crystal's performance so much, and him having a walk-op set just to save a take is that's too good.

SPEAKER_11 1:17:23

Yeah. Yeah, that's awesome. Well, it must have been so much fun to work on this, man. So much fun.

SPEAKER_13 1:17:31

So, yeah, I mean, every day, what do you got? You got sword fighting, you know, you got you got boats, you got action, you got love. You're all across like the continent. It's gotta be one of the most fun projects to ever make.

SPEAKER_11 1:17:43

Plenty of opportunities to see this one on the big screen. We've got January 14th and 15th at the Frida Cinema in Santa Ana. Wonderful theater. Check it out. Sunday, January 18th at Videots. Also Sunday, January 18th at the Rooftop Cinema Club in downtown LA. Two screenings of that. So many ways to watch this one on the big screen. So go see it on the big screen. All three of the films we talked about today, opportunities to see them on the big screen in the Southern California area. If you live in another city other than LA, check the internet because of Rob Reiner's passing. I know they're doing a lot of repertory screenings of his work. So see not just these movies, but any movies of his that you can see on the big screen the way that the good lord intended. Let us know what you think of these films if you see them on the big screen or if you watch them at home. And of course, let us know what your favorite Rob Reiner film is, because I know we left some absolute bangers off of this list. Too many to choose from. But let us know what your favorite is. There's a couple of different ways to do that. You can go to Instagram and type in Gimme3 Podcast. That's G-I-D-M-E spell out three podcast. Gimme three podcast. You can slide into our DMs. You can message us to let us know what you think of the show. Let us know what you think of these movies, and you can also suggest different themes or different movies that you'd like us, like to hear us talk about. You can also send us a text message by scrolling down to our episode description and clicking the link that says send us a text message. Click that link and a message will go right into our inbox. If you enjoy the show, if you enjoy the Gimme 3 podcast, there's a few different ways to support us. One, you can download our episodes, that really helps out the show. Two, we have a Patreon for a mere five bucks a month. For five bucks a month, you can support our show. There's bonus content on there, but it also just really helps us keep the microphones on as well. And then the third way is if you've got a friend who's a Cinephile, a friend who you think would enjoy the Gimme 3 podcast, share it with them. Let them know the good word about the Gimme 3 podcast. If you've got a friend who's a big Rob Reiner fan, share this episode with them as well. Ryan, do you want to let the lovely folks know where they can find you on the social media?

SPEAKER_13 1:20:08

Yeah, find me on Letterboxd under my name, Ryan Latin. Let's see what we're all watching together. Hell yeah. Hopefully we're all out celebrating Rob Reiner.

SPEAKER_11 1:20:17

Hell yeah. And you can find me on Letterboxed, on Instagram, or on Blue Sky at Gimme3Podcast. No, you can find me at Nicholas Ibarra. That's my name. Ibarra is spelled with a Y. Once again, we want to thank you all for listening to the Gimme 3 Podcast. We love you, Rob Reiner. Thanks for all of your amazing work and your amazing films. We'll see you all at the movies.