#63 - Shot Twice. Abused. 10 Years in Prison. What Redemption Really Looks Like w/ Victor Villarreal

What happens when a 13-year-old boy, sexually abused and desperate for protection, turns to gang life—and survives a decade behind bars, two gunshot wounds, and addiction? In this week’s episode, Victor pulls back the curtain on a life shaped by trauma, violence, and ultimately, redemption.

This isn’t just a story about survival—it’s about transformation. Victor doesn’t hold back as he shares the darkest corners of his past: the fear, the prison corruption, the emotional numbness. But it’s his raw honesty and emotional breakthroughs that will stop you in your tracks. From ayahuasca ceremonies that forced him to confront buried trauma, to the quiet strength of fatherhood after being told he'd never have kids again—Victor’s journey is nothing short of powerful.

The most gripping part? Victor’s realization that leaving prison wasn’t enough:
"You don’t just stop doing bad—you gotta do good every fcking day."*

If you’ve ever judged someone by their rap sheet, this conversation will flip your perspective. If you’ve ever struggled to forgive yourself or start over, Victor’s story might just give you the courage to try.

To follow Victor on IG visit: @realtimeresultsllc 

To follow him on TikTok visit: @realtimeresultsllc 

To follow along and help support Victor's awesome business that helps give back to the community visit: https://www.realtimeresultsllc.com/

Chapters

• 0:00 Meeting Victor: From Gang Life to Redemption
• 15:42 Growing Up in Caldwell: Family Struggles
• 38:27 First Shooting at 16: Prison's Revolving Door
• 1:05:48 Second Time Shot: Deeper Into the System
• 1:30:31 The Prison Experience: Finding Himself Lost
• 1:54:22 Getting Out and Relapsing: The Cycle Returns
• 2:10:09 COVID Lockdown: Forced Self-Reflection
• 2:21:03 The Barber Path: Finding Purpose Outside
• 2:29:22 Ayahuasca and Healing: Confronting Past Trauma
• 2:36:24 Fatherhood and Forgiveness: Breaking Generational Cycles

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:09

dude, victor, yeah, cool, victor, right, yeah, I appreciate you joining me, man. Um, like we were kind of talking briefly is I? I just I love having conversation with people. I've seen you around the gym a couple times and then somehow I got served your one of your videos on Instagram.

Speaker 2: 0:27

I was like I've seen this dude, I'm like is this the guy that was in the gym?

Speaker 1: 0:29

And I started digging and sure shit was you. And I saw what you're doing now, business wise, and what you got going on, and so I reached out and we kind of talked briefly and I was like dude, you got to come on the show yeah and so we're here I, I appreciate you coming making time.

Speaker 1: 0:44

I know you got a busy schedule coming up and you're taking off, so it was kind of a last minute thing to get you on and but, dude, let's uh, before we jump in, something I do is I give veterans and law enforcement, small businesses opportunities to send us stuff to give to guests. Um, so I don't know if you're a cigar guy. We got the the platoon cigars with a war machine. He was a active active duty combat Marine, got out, became a cop, got shot in the line of duty and then C-State Coffee will send you home with some cold brews. These things are like crack, especially if you're going to be traveling, doing driving. They'll keep you wired for days with some coffee beans as well. He's a recon Marine and a local guy here, so really cool dude. So yeah, we kind of just give everybody opportunities to send us the gift to guests and it's just to help out anybody with a small business trying to grow and give them some love. So, victor, welcome to the show.

Speaker 1: 1:33

I'm excited for this because you did some time behind bars you did about 10 years for gang violence or gang affiliation. You've been shot two different times. You have, you know, been through the ropes a couple of times. You've come out on top, I would say, after going through and digging, you've kind of changed your life around. You're running a business now and doing the tattoo and the guys with their hair loss I might have to hit you up on that. Fatherhood's new and just you. You've changed your life completely from what it looked like in the past. And that's where I I'm really curious and wanted to have this conversation with you, because I love talking to dudes that have been through it all and and they've gone from the the highs to lows to highs again, and it's part of life and you've probably have learned a lot and have grown a lot from that. So, yeah, let's just dive into it. Dude, where you from, I'm from caldwell called oh you're, you're a local boy.

Speaker 1: 2:32

Okay, I wasn't expecting that. Okay, yeah, I'm from caldwell businesses in boise.

Speaker 2: 2:38

um, there's more money out here and I ain't never heard of anybody get rich off of hey homie hook it up. So so business is good, good dude, it's good. It's a different little environment, still away from home, but still close enough to go visit?

Speaker 1: 2:52

Absolutely so. What was it like growing up as a kid and Caldwell back in before? It was what it is now.

Speaker 2: 3:00

So I'm half Mexican, half white and there was that where I wasn't white enough or Mexican enough for certain sides of my family. So I was caught in this like limbo. Okay, school-wise, I guess. Family. Family life was a little hectic. I got six sisters, a single mom. Role models that were in the picture weren't the best, so they normalized a lot of stuff growing up. That, uh a lot of chaos, okay. So there was a lot of, uh, drug abuse, uh, physical abuse, yeah who were the role models when you were a kid Cousins family members, just like people around my mom, okay.

Speaker 1: 3:53

And as far as the pecking order, you said you had all. Are you the only boy out of all girls? Only boy. Where do you fall in line with that? I'm second to the oldest, okay, okay, so you weren't bossed around by all the sisters growing up?

Speaker 2: 4:06

yeah, oh were you yeah, no, it was. It was different growing up. Yeah, my uh, my uncle, told my mom you're, you're either gonna have a really uh, a really gay son or really mean daughters. And they ruthless are they. I'm gonna tell you that right now they're, they're mean, but it's cool, it's been. Uh, yeah, it's been fun how was your mom?

Speaker 1: 4:28

I mean a single mom, with with. So you're the seventh kid, right? You'd say six sisters. How was that for your mom? I mean you're, you're the second oldest watching your mom grind it out as a young kid I grew up with my mom.

Speaker 2: 4:40

I grew up with my mom, so it was you know. I'm seeing this from a child's perspective and now, looking back at it as an adult, I'm like, damn, there's a lot that comes into play when being a parent, absolutely like I'm experiencing that right now with my daughter and, yeah, it's hectic, it's very like I'm going, going into the restroom and I'm having to use the restroom, I'm having to change your diet, like there's just so much that I don't think we really fully understand even women going through, you know.

Speaker 2: 5:11

So, to be like seven kids.

Speaker 1: 5:15

They don't get enough credit. Huh, no, they don't, they don't. And as a kid and being young and dumb, I mean we don't respect it or appreciate it. I should say at that time what our moms are actually putting up with, and not only trying to keep a house together, but raise kids, bring in funds put food on the table.

Speaker 2: 5:34

And the support right, that unconditional love. Like I was 16 years old, I got jumped at a house party and I shot. I shot this guy and, um, like my face was blasted on the news for the shooting gang involvement. And my mom she was still there like that's, that's my son, right? So she always seen the good in me, my my fullest potential, regardless of where I was at in my life. So to to switch up everything that I've done, and she's like, yeah, it's still the same support, but she's like I could tell she's seen it this whole time, you know.

Speaker 1: 6:13

That's something that's pretty special, and the fact that you're able to see it now as an adult, yeah, and I'm sure it's one of those things where you're able to go back and be like you know, like thank you for never giving up or never quitting.

Speaker 2: 6:28

Yeah, I remember. So, 31 years old, I'm walking out of prison and I got 10 years in and out of the prison system and I've felt like I painted myself to be the biggest, the baddest, the, the, the most into. Because when you're in prison it's like, all right, I'm going to work out, I'm going to stay ready, I'm going to be active with it, and that's going to be holding a lot of people at bay right of going to test this guy. You know, but I don't know. Man, I got out of prison at 31 years old, not knowing who I was and trying to figure that out.

Speaker 2: 7:06

And when you start digging, you start finding out shit. And I think during covid, especially during covid lockdown, for the first two months of covid, we were locked down. For the first two months we were able to come out of our cells every two weeks for 15 minutes like damn, that's a whole lot of time to be in a cell with your world's biggest critic yourself and then somebody else going through what they're going through, and you know these death tolls rising um in red numbers on all the tvs. So it was, it was, it was different and you're not.

Speaker 1: 7:44

I mean, you can't even reach out to the outside world and see what's actually going on. You're just going off of what the news is is portraying on on tv. Yeah, okay. So let's back up. You're 16 years old, you're at a house party and you shot a guy. What? What led to that?

Speaker 2: 8:00

so I had my daughter at 16. I was pretty actively. I got jumped in at like 13. And I was just escaping, running away from like. Looking back at it now I know what I was escaping from and it was sexual abuse at the house from my aunt.

Speaker 1: 8:23

Onto you. Yeah, really.

Speaker 2: 8:24

Really so. She wasn't my blood aunt, but she grew up, she changed my diaper, she brought me my first jersey and there was so many like I didn't have a male figure that was there that I could go to and be like, hey, this is what's going on Like, do I like it? But I don't like it. I know it's wrong, wrong, but I'm just so lost right now, used right so for me to escape. I actually escaped to the streets and it wasn't like my mom was like all right, son, I want you to be a gang member when you grow up. But but it was my way to escape from that situation that led me into the relationships that I built out on the street. You know, and and it kind of sucks looking back at it you know a 13-year-old kid escaping home, where you're supposed to be safe, you know to getting jumped in sawed-off shotgun walking around Like ain't no kid needs to be walking around with a sawed-off shotgun. You know, like I, just it's crazy to think that.

Speaker 1: 9:19

But at the time it's the mindset and you know. Like you said, you don't know where you're escaping from.

Speaker 2: 9:28

And I feel a lot of people never find out what they're escaping, and it didn't hit me until later on, until I this self-discovery and just this.

Speaker 1: 9:32

You know where I'm at in my life yeah so how long did the sexual abuse go on for?

Speaker 2: 9:39

happened for like a month, okay, and it was, yeah, within that month, like three times, and it was usually at night, you know everybody's in bed and and, yeah, in the darkness no shit.

Speaker 1: 9:57

And obviously you, you have no idea what's going on. And so when you I don't want to say we're lashing out, but when you started to go to the streets, how, how were you? How are you pulled into that? How are these kids because obviously it's different ways they're using, you know, like the gangs will use kids to push drugs or whatever, to carry out whatever they need to do. So they're not getting hit for it because, obviously being minors, but like did you know these guys? Or was like a friend, through a friend, where his brother was in a gang, and then you got pulled in, like how do you get pulled in as 13 years old to a gang.

Speaker 2: 10:32

Who I went to school with, who I you know like there's a lot of similarities growing up and and I feel like you, you attract what, what's going on in your life For sure. So there was other kids out there probably experiencing the same thing in your life for sure. So there was other kids out there probably experiencing the same thing and we, we clicked. They were escaping too, like why weren't they home.

Speaker 1: 10:48

Yeah, you know so you started skipping school and just yeah, I was.

Speaker 2: 10:50

I was a shit stick man. Um, to the point where my mom's like trying, she's trying to control me, she's not understanding what's going on. Right, I don't speak on it and you know, bipolar ADD all of these pills that they were trying to feed me where, like a lot of that time growing up, like too much weight, I'd gain too much weight on these pills, lose weight, not sleep, sleep too much, like there was just so much going on. I was getting diagnosed with these things that they were trying to pinpoint what was going on with me and I feel like the biggest thing was like nobody asked me, hey, what?

Speaker 1: 11:28

what's going on? Because you're battling trauma, not adhd and everything. You're just. You're just trying to figure out how to cope, yeah, and they're just feeding you pills, which is probably compounding on everything else yeah, it was a mess.

Speaker 2: 11:39

So, um, school, school is just in and out, skipping school, um, getting high selling, selling drugs, just just a mess, yeah, yeah. And then, uh, I made my way up to like, like I said, 16 years old and and I was still going to like alternative schools and I tried to do like me and my, my daughter's mom thing, my mom. So our house got shot up on I think it was mother's day and, uh, she goes. I mean, luckily my daughter wasn't there, but my mom goes. You know, you want to give me something for mother's day? Take you and your family and get out, like, go to twin falls, go work out there. You know, figure figure something out.

Speaker 2: 12:22

And um, and I did, I did so, I dipped out to to twin with my family, with my, my daughter and my daughter's mom, and we were just 16 years old. That's wild, you know, like to think that, oh, yeah, hey, we're packing up, leaving, like I had no business packing up anything and leaving. You know, I mean I was still a kid. Um, so we went out there and and again, there was just the chaos was normalized, right, the relationship with my daughter, like I knew. Okay, I gotta work. I gotta support my family. And I got a job doing dairy work. I was herding cows, and that was seven days a week if I, or six days a week if I wanted a day off, I'd have to put in a double shift and it's like you ain't trying to do nothing on that seventh day, if you just leave. Yeah, so to find balance, um, with my daughter's mom and and like even her, she was a kid, you know what I mean. And then we have a kid and we didn't, we were playing house, you know, and it didn't end up working out and she ended up moving back to uh, caldwell napa and uh, like three months later, I was like I want my daughter, I want to be sure, involved, right, so I come back and and uh, at the time caldwell napa was was popping with just gang activity and and uh, there's a lot of shootings, a lot of killings. And I came back and I remember stopping at this pond pawn shop and I got a little 22. I'm like I'm buying it, it's legit a little 22, I'll keep it on me, it's enough to, you know, cause a spark and hear bang.

Speaker 2: 13:57

And I remember going to this house party and right before I got off, I'm like I told this girl. And I look back at him like if I had to tell this girl hey, let me see who's here before we get off, the fuck am I doing there? So I get off and, um, you know, I'm walking up and before I don't even know, before I I even hit the sidewalk, I seen just a whole bunch of people. Um, look over, I kind of feel like it was a setup, like they knew I was coming because they were. They were just out there, right, and they started throwing up. You know where they're from.

Speaker 2: 14:30

And I turned around, you know, I mean, I'm not dumb so I turned around and, uh, I just remember going and reaching the hand on the door to open it and I hear hey, what do you claim? And when I turned around, that's when he got one on me and it got into a little confrontation and last punch I got on him, he stumbled back and then I just seen everybody else rush in and I started dumping, I emptied the clip.

Speaker 1: 14:56

Really.

Speaker 2: 15:00

And yeah, there's a lot of these kids, a lot of these people. They think I'm going to be a gangster, I'm going to bang on someone, I'm going to shoot someone. They're aiming for that, but they don't understand what comes with that. Everything was slowed down. It was the cry from this guy, from this other kid. It was the bang it, the, the, the, the flash.

Speaker 2: 15:26

It was the screams, the scatter, like there's so many, there's so much that comes with that for sure, the split, split of a split, yeah, yeah with the quickness and it was like I knew at that point, like I jumped in the car and I dipped out and uh, I just remember, even with the girl that I was with, I was, I was like I'm like, yeah, just like, let's go, let's go, let's go. And like I don't know, five minutes into it, she's like her, her verbiage kind of changed to like is it okay if I turn? This way? Is okay if I turn, can I? And I'm like, uh, she, she's now scared. She like she's asking me permission. She's asking me like, and I'm like are you good? She's like I just I don't know if you're gonna kill me. I've never been in a situation like this and like, again, a split second can turn shit sideways for sure, with everybody involved did you know you hit somebody immediately, I knew it.

Speaker 1: 16:26

Do you remember like what went through your mind when you was there any regret, or were you just fight or flight at this moment?

Speaker 2: 16:31

I was. I was straight survival mode, right now or in that moment survival mode that's scary man, yeah, and then to leave and then to leave and not know hey, did this guy die? Did I did? You know what I mean?

Speaker 1: 16:45

like you, hear stories all the time and it just takes one were you repping anybody at this point, or were you just getting back into the? Okay, so they knew.

Speaker 2: 16:54

They knew they were rivals, they knew what it was when they seen me, and and yeah, it all went down that quick.

Speaker 1: 17:02

You didn't even get on the sidewalk. No damn, it almost does seem like a setup yeah.

Speaker 2: 17:07

So, uh, I was on the run for like two weeks. They hit my grandma's house. They hit my moms, my sisters, my aunt's house. Um, where were you hiding out at? I was in oregon.

Speaker 1: 17:19

Oh, yeah, I was gone. Yeah, I was gone. Blame you?

Speaker 2: 17:21

but there comes a point where it's like they're hitting your grandma's house. Yeah, what the fuck's wrong with you? You know what I mean. Like go turn yourself in, don't Don't. It's too personal. At that point it's like grandma don't need to see that, my mom don't need to see that, you know. So, yeah, I turned myself shot, you know, I mean once, once they know that, and at this time it was me against them, right, that was the mentality. So it was like, yeah, I'm gonna turn myself in because I ain't trying to get got so can I ask you a personal question?

Speaker 1: 17:56

yeah, let's hear it, since you're repping and you're getting in a gang rival shootout and shoot one of them. Did your boys have you back or are you on your own at this point?

Speaker 2: 18:08

Define that because I have a hard time Like did they have my did?

Speaker 1: 18:12

you have support from from who you were repping.

Speaker 2: 18:15

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 18:15

Did they stick it, stick it out? Were they helping you through this? Or were they like yo, you got to go and and that was it?

Speaker 2: 18:20

I think that's what it is in any situation like this. You know what I mean. A, you're not going to bring the heat around here, but then again you get to a point where I wouldn't expect that you know.

Speaker 1: 18:28

And the reason I ask that is because you know, I well one. I had personally a buddy that was in a got caught up in a bike gang and I told him the whole entire time dude, you get, you're done. And then he ended up getting caught up and he was done immediately. But as a kid and these kids get pulled into these gangs and it's family and they're your boys. Were they there or was it just, were you on your own?

Speaker 2: 18:48

That's the only reason. So I was still a kid right when I got jumped in. I was 13. I handed a sawed-off shotgun. Hey, here you go and they asked me. They didn't know how old I was really. And my homies asked me, like they asked me how old I was. I told them and, being still a kid, looking at these grown men, once they they heard my age, you could just tell that they felt bad really, like the whole energy shift.

Speaker 2: 19:15

They're like fuck, this is I've always got yeah so I've always been bigger than than my age, you know. So once they heard that, heard that, you could tell, you could tell. So I've always got a lot of love from the older ones, okay, and it's because of that and that's kind of how I knew like, hey, these guys like I'm dealing with my aunt, you know there was no remorse, there was no nothing. And then to come to the streets and after I get fucked up by all these grown men and to see that these guys gave a fuck, they felt some type of way afterwards that connected me even more so with them.

Speaker 1: 19:57

You know, it was like yeah, what was it like getting jumped in when you're 13 years old and you're getting jumped in by grown-ass men. I mean that's a pretty legit, it's a pride thing.

Speaker 2: 20:07

It's a pride thing, I'm a part of something, and then again I grew up with six sisters, so for me, like that's what we did, that's what we did.

Speaker 1: 20:18

It wasn't just a normal thing. Huh yeah, that's wild. So when you went to turn yourself in, what was, what was your thought process? I mean there's, there's a build-up. I mean your, your stress level's got to be maxed. I don't care who you are, if you know you turn yourself in there, you got to be thinking like fuck, like how's this going to play out? Like what, what? You're coming back from oregon, what's what's? At this point?

Speaker 2: 20:48

it was the unknown right, and at this time I'm 16 years old. I just I'm on the news for this shooting and then my daughter right, my daughter comes to mind and it's like I knew my whole life was just at that. In that moment it was done like I wasn't a father. I wasn't. I wasn't a son, a brother. I wasn't this, this dairyman anymore. Right, like I know, I'm gonna be locked up for a while and the only reason why I turn myself in really is because they're like hey, you fight this. You fight this because there's communication. Right, turn yourself in. If you don't, you fight this because there was communication. Right, turn yourself in.

Speaker 2: 21:25

If you don't, then you're going to get hit with the gang enhancement. You get charged as an adult and once they they. So I already knew I was, I'm coming into this and I already knew that I'm getting charged as a juvenile. So it's going to be on my juvenile record and that's what it was, you know. But there's a lot Like like I don't. I don't really think. I thought that far in advance, like what was to come in in again 16 to my first three and a half years. I was 16 years old when I, when I went in. That's a big transition period in anybody's life, huge, you know.

Speaker 1: 21:58

So I I didn't know what was what was coming so you, when you say you got what, how long did you end up getting? You said three years for that, three and a half years.

Speaker 2: 22:09

Three and a half years for that.

Speaker 1: 22:11

What was it like going to juvie?

Speaker 2: 22:16

It's more confined than now that I know about the adult side of things. You're confined, you're locked down.

Speaker 1: 22:24

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 22:24

Yeah, and it's just. It's crazy to think that a lot of these kids are in there right now, secluded they're. They're just. There's a lot that's going on in there and they're dealing with this shit all by themselves. But there's a deeper hurt there.

Speaker 1: 22:42

There's a deeper trauma event you know, is there help in in juvie? I mean, do you guys get to talk to people, or they?

Speaker 2: 22:49

so you can tell that there is. There is staff members that actually do care, right, but then it's just like anything else. Even as an instructor, in what I do I have to like shield myself because there's only so much you could do with somebody okay or for somebody and like they got to do it, only so much you could do with somebody, okay, or for somebody Like they got to do it themselves.

Speaker 2: 23:06

And I feel like when you're on that side, you're a correctional officer in a juvenile facility. I don't know Like I know how I would feel. I have over 20 nieces and nephews. That'd be pretty hard for me, but you could feel that some of these guys, they really did care. I know you were a lot Go ahead. More so at the juvenile prison than this turnover juvie.

Speaker 1: 23:35

Because the reason I asked that question, or have some curiosity for, is because me personally, I feel our correctional system is the most broken, corrupt thing that we have in this country besides politics. Right, and it's. It blows my mind even talking to like law enforcement officer or correctional officers and they even speak on it like it's so corrupt by the money and how it's run. I could only imagine, when children are involved, of what the dark side is going on in these, these juvenile facilities. Have these kids locked up for 18, 19 hours a day during such a crucial time of their life? Oh man, a whole bunch of yeah. And then now, instead of learning skills and learning how to be a young man, you're they're prepping me for prison.

Speaker 1: 24:24

That's really good. That's what they did.

Speaker 2: 24:25

That's what they did. I was, that's how I felt, like it was, hey, but again, in the juvenile prison it was different because it was more of a they call it a therapeutic community at the time. Okay, and then there's out there in St Anthony, there's 12 groups. There's 12 people in these groups and they're broken down into categories of charges. So you got two sex offender groups. You got a gang group out, drug and alcohol. You know, there there's two female groups, uh, and and it's just broken down and and you're like the COs there or or the staff members, they don't, they don't put you down, like they don't hold you down, like, let's say, me and you, we get an altercation, right, both of us are getting laid out by the group and we're getting held down. It's called pure restraint.

Speaker 2: 25:20

There's circle, like session ups where, like I'm telling you, hey, put your behavior in check. You either agree to it or not. And then it goes into something deeper where we all circle up if you continue the behavior. And we're focusing on just a variety of different like behavior patterns, misleading others easily misled, anger, just so many, right, and it's up to us, as these kids going through this program, to pinpoint what behavior problem you're dealing with, to better look at our own. You know, and during this time frame everybody's different as far, like for me because of the shooting, like I had a gang, a gang PO and there was no love there. Like she's hey, he's friending, he's friending, I don't care how good he does in this program, he's, he's friending.

Speaker 1: 26:09

We don't fronting. Oh, okay, okay, yeah, oh, really. So no matter if you were actually making progress or not, it didn't matter.

Speaker 2: 26:16

So it took. It took three and a half years for me to even I was ready for my release in this program, probably a year in, and it sucked because I kept seeing people go, go and at the time I didn't see my family because I was on the other side of Idaho. My mom had six sisters and she was her business and I didn't. I didn't see any of them, my daughter, you know. It was phone calls home, but we didn't. We don't come for money. So it was. It was different home but we don't come for money, so it was different.

Speaker 1: 26:46

So you're there on your own.

Speaker 2: 26:47

Yeah, there was a lot of frustration there too, because I'm seeing these sex offenders get these visits and it's like somebody showed up for them. You know, and it was hard at the time. It was hard because, like I didn't fully understand what my mom was experiencing Like taking care of six kids. Like you, little fucker, you went and shot somebody, you got locked up. I can't be there. Like I didn't understand that at the time, you know.

Speaker 1: 27:10

Was there animosity like built up? Did you come out?

Speaker 2: 27:15

angry because of that it was almost just like I was completely separated from everybody To be connected to my family, family. Now, even in a relationship like I, I'm disconnected, emotionally unavailable, as as my exes have said, and when, when?

Speaker 1: 27:34

you laugh, yeah, yeah, when you lose, like for me.

Speaker 2: 27:38

I lost my daughter at 16. I lost my whole family it. It felt like at 16 years old, I lost myself. So for me to get in relationships and be like, oh, you're going to leave, oh, okay, like bye, I've done it Like there's nothing anybody could do, that will put me in that headspace. It's happened Even in relationships now. Now I'm like it's fucked up, because when I get involved with a female, in my head I'm like you know, it's a prison thing where I'm like I already envision her sleeping with somebody. That way, if it was to happen, it hurts less and that's a fucked up way. Uh, how do you connect with somebody on an intimate level? How do you build trust? When you were, you've already seen them as an enemy, you know. So there there's a lot of things that I felt like prison. It fucked me up.

Speaker 1: 28:35

Yeah, I can imagine, especially as a kid. And then you come out, where were you welcomed home?

Speaker 2: 28:40

with. I was kicked out of. I was kicked out of Kenyon County. I wasn't able to come back because of the crime and I got put out here in Boise and I was at this juvenile halfway house. It just sucked because it's like, all right, there's these checkoff lists, right. Getting out and looking back at it now, it was like the system taught me to live here. It never taught me how to fill out an LLC, what to do to pay my taxes. It taught me one of these checkoff lists is all right, you must eat five meals. At what is it? The wife's kitchen. It's like a homeless shelter where they go and feed right, they feed people. And you go and show up and you get, hey, I went and I ate there here to check this off. And then, oh, hey, this is how you feel you know how to fill out uh, um, um, food stamps. And again it was just like it was. It was twisted. It was twisted to be like all right, cool, I got food stamps.

Speaker 1: 29:47

Do you look at that now like being as an adult? Was that just like an accountability check for the state, so like, oh, hey, he's eating food or hey, he's able to take care of himself? Was it them actually carrying and forcing you to food, because would you even eat? Or are you just going up getting a signature and dipping?

Speaker 2: 30:06

I would give my food away to somebody there and I would just do yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 30:09

So is this more like a state?

Speaker 2: 30:10

just okay, yeah, this, this kid you got to think about it too is state requirement. They're these facilities and these, these. They're making money. Yeah, they got funding coming in and you can't put a a program together without these requirements of this. It's money, it's money, that's what it is big time money driven.

Speaker 1: 30:30

Say so after you get out and you come to boise, you're in this youth halfway house. What's what's life like? Are you able to get back with your daughter? Is your daughter's very?

Speaker 2: 30:39

distant um, it's very distant just because she's out here in in caldwell and I was out there in Boise and then I had all these programming stuff to do and then I also had two jobs at the time it was like KFC and Burger King and then group on top of it all. So there was a very like little time for like me. I think there was like Sundays or something that I was able to have my daughter come out.

Speaker 1: 31:03

And then after that, what was life like? I mean, you start getting back on track or did you fall back into the game I got?

Speaker 2: 31:07

out. I actually I ended up getting out of of that uh program and, um, I ended up moving out to twin again and I got shot out there and I was at this. I got approved to go out there one night. I ended up going to this pool hall and I'm in this pool hall and I get in. It was all ego, it was all kid shit.

Speaker 2: 31:31

Where I'm, I lock eyes with this guy, he pops off, I say something, I get kicked out of the spot because I think they knew him there and then I leave. And I just remember when I when I left, it was probably four or five blocks down and I see this big truck pull up and he gets off his truck, starts walking up to me just talking shit. And I'm going to be honest, I'm not a very good shit talker, but I'll smack you pretty clear. Yeah, by the time I get in reach of him, I start going at him and I remember the last punch I get on him. He stumbles back and then I just seen it come out. He lets loose and, yeah, I get shot.

Speaker 2: 32:15

It was a gut shot. So it hit, uh hit. My stomach came back out my backside and I think it was a shock for him because you're gonna shoot one time. I don't know. I don't know what was going on through his mind, but I know he what he did was he got in his ride and he he dipped out pretty quick. So I was left there and I just remember like kind of like snapping out of it. I'm like, okay, I'm not gonna die, but I need I need a.

Speaker 1: 32:41

I need an ambulance and we knew you were shot immediately. You felt it. Yeah, okay.

Speaker 2: 32:54

So I remember going to this bar that was open and I went up and they're like where's your ID? I'm like, I'm not here to drink, I need an ambulance. What do you guys call it? They're like no, you're good, you're good. And I lifted up my shirt and I was just drenched with blood, right. And good, you're good. And I lifted up my shirt and I was just drenched, drenched with blood Right, and there was an old timer. He's like sit him down, sit him down. So they're on the phone with the ambulance. Um, the cops get there first and instantly. Like I was there, I'm the victim, they seen me and they, they, they actually throw me around, start frisking me, put me in cuffs and the ambulance get there and they're like what the fuck are you guys doing? Really, shot, he's shot. Is there any weapons? Is he the shooter?

Speaker 2: 33:37

And what's like where I'm at in my life right now is I want to be very clear about. I'm not, I'm not placing blame and I got, I deserved everything that was coming to me, because that was the energy that I was putting out, and I realized that now, absolutely you know. So me being a little shit, stick me being involved in gangs, like I got what was coming to me and I can't be mad about that, but it took me a long time to understand that. Um, because again, the first time I get it, I shot somebody. Um, but what sucks about even that situation is like I jumped. If I was somebody different, I don't feel like I would've got. I would've got time. I felt like if my mom had money if we come from money I wouldn't have gotten. No, it would have been self-defense.

Speaker 1: 34:26

You got time for a dude getting out and shooting you.

Speaker 2: 34:31

No, no, so I was talking about the first time. Okay, okay, okay, okay. I was like, well, we'll check this out. So second time, this situation they actually violate my probation, not for getting shot, because I was out past curfew, and if I wasn't out past curfew I wouldn't have got shot. So that was the technicality that they got me on and they threw me in county. They brought me back to Cannon County and it was at the time where they had three bunks stacked and it was a frustrating situation. It was a frustrating situation because, again, I know was that was. It was a frustrating situation. It was a frustrating situation because again I I know the first time it was me. I still feel some type of way about it, like it was self-defense, but I'll take it.

Speaker 2: 35:14

Second time I get shot. You guys are throwing me in the cage and the judge was like you know what, mr ruler out, we understand the situation. Um, this is what I want to do for you. I want you to. I'm going to give you 30 days in county. You could heal up in county and, um, you're off juvenile parole. Good luck as an adult. So he threw me in county and, uh, they put me on the third bunk and you have to climb up and down this bunk with a bullet wound through your actually I actually I had 26 staples.

Speaker 2: 35:47

It was exploratory surgery, so they they took everything out. Made sure that clean job you know, the.

Speaker 2: 35:54

A lot of the time when you get hit anywhere in the stomach, like there's there's some sort of internal bleeding or vital organ that's hit and again in and out, but yeah, 26 staples. And I remember, uh it was. It was another situation that, like, like, my homies were there, they had my back and uh, I ended up getting out of the shower one night and I'm getting up on my bunk and I slipped and my stomach tore and like I started bleeding and the CEO or these, these, these deputies they wanted me to fill out a medical form and a kite comes in. That's like a two week thing, like I'm bleeding right here right now. And then they're my older homies, they're like, nah, we're going to get you a bottom bunk, you're going to take my bunk. And it was almost like this, like this little riot popped off because they wanted to make a big issue about giving me a bunk and making me wait two weeks. And again, it was one of those situations that, like, they got me. You know, yeah.

Speaker 1: 37:02

So you do 30 days there. Yeah, so you do 30 days there and the judge by the judge telling you like when you're done with probation, everything, good luck as an adult.

Speaker 2: 37:10

That's his way of saying you fuck up again, you're, you're yeah, well, I I think there was genuine like, like it was a genuine good luck being an adult. Okay, I don't think there was no ill intent behind his words. I think he understood like man, this gang, this prosecutor, attorney, they do not like this kid and it was very, very clear.

Speaker 1: 37:38

So you do the 30 days there and get out, and then what's next for you Back in Caldwell?

Speaker 2: 37:43

Straight back, huh, and get out, and then then what's next for you in caldwell? And I'm straight back, huh, I'm trying to figure out. Well, it's even worse because now, like, I've spent time away from my homies and I come back and it's like now there's this more of a connection and it's it's the older homies and and now it's different hoods and you know they're it's just networking, networking and and more involvement. And, yeah, I, I didn't know what I was doing, I didn't know how to, like, really maintain a job. I didn't know who the fuck I was. I there's just so many things that I just didn't know. Um, and I was kind of just in limbo, I like I was trying to be a dad, but I didn't know how to be a dad. Um, I'm trying to connect with this, this little girl and and she's what?

Speaker 1: 38:29

four by now, four or five yeah so she doesn't really does. She know you do you have a?

Speaker 2: 38:32

she, she knows that I'm dad, but she doesn't like. There's a. There's a completely different understanding of what like what a father is, and absolutely this guy he's, he's, they say he's my dad you just hold the title at this point.

Speaker 1: 38:47

Yeah, and that's not. I mean, is that affecting you at this age? Or I don't think it didn't affect me.

Speaker 2: 38:53

it didn't affect me because I got, I was prioritizing relationships with other females. I was not my daughter, not with myself. Um, I was disconnected from my family. So there was that connection was more towards my homies, because they were there with me in misery For sure, and that was kind of a hard thing to that loyalty to kind of break away from. Yeah, yeah man.

Speaker 1: 39:21

It's so crazy how, from such a young age, and one one mistake, right or wrong, just it, just you just instantly peel and there's no. This is where I feel like our, our, our facilities and these correctional and juvie and everything like they're not. All I could have taken was a little correction pulling you. Hey, cool, there's no money in that there isn't the money's in the facilities.

Speaker 2: 39:51

I've been to all the facilities here in uh in idaho, and you know I'm thinking as as an addict, right, I'm like these, these are potentially these prison compounds could be converted over into detox centers, and it's like why isn't that happening? Why is it that these prison beds are always booked? You know what I mean Now, in the service industry. A book that was preplanned, that was premed, that's what I want.

Speaker 1: 40:22

Well, when you look at prison not as prison, but as a business, that's when I want. Well, when you look at prison not as prison, but as a business, that's when it makes sense yeah it makes sense from a business point of view.

Speaker 1: 40:31

But if you look at it like, hey, this is how we're taking care of people that are making mistakes, eat big or little, when you get pulled into the correctional facility you're almost being pulled in as a permanent member because, like I've talked to guys that have gone in for the like the stupidest drug charge and then they instantly get pulled into a gang. Then they're they're they're tasked to carry out whatever the gang needs them to, and then they're stacking time and stacking time. And then here a kid that went in for maybe six to eight months stint has now got five, six years on them and face tattoos.

Speaker 1: 41:10

You know it's yeah, no, uh it's wild man like and it's so corrupt to me and like I it's. It just blows my mind and that's where a big part of this conversation was. When you know, I saw that you did 10 years like. I have so many questions behind it because it's like how is this happening? How, how does our government or our states look at our facilities and be like this is the best option for these people? Now I get it. There are some motherfuckers that need to be in there for life, like anything kid related, sexual assault, shit. You're. You're beating the shit out of cool. You. To me, at least, for my opinion, you're going now. If you're getting caught with pounds of fentanyl and shit, that's hard to argue. But if you get some kid that's getting like a weed charge or he's got some coke or a couple pills or whatever and they're getting put into this instead of like a rehabilitation program or hey, let's clean your shit up.

Speaker 2: 42:01

This is how you start a business, how you start your life, but instead it's good luck so, even even as an addict, right, you're like, okay, a lot of these people that are getting hit with these charges that are carrying five years. Chances are they just needed a taste of what misery was to snap back and be like I don't want nothing to do with it.

Speaker 1: 42:20

But you put them into the system.

Speaker 2: 42:23

You hit them with these charges. They're labeled as felons and you pull them out of society for a very long time, like a year or six months is a long time to be pulled out of this, yeah and how do you snap back from that?

Speaker 1: 42:36

so I I do feel like the yeah, it's twisted I understand what you're saying too, and I I've never done time, never. But on deployments, I mean, did you're gone a year? Better? Yeah, and I remember we would come back and it's like there's all new phones, I mean there's there's new models of cars that come out. It's we, you don't think about that type of stuff, but when you come back, it's like you're coming back when we would come back from you know overseas. It's like everybody's life continued and also you're like, hey, I'm back, like what's going on? And you think you're right where you left off, and and I mean I'm not comparing it- in any ways, but there is a comparison.

Speaker 1: 43:11

That's how I would. I remember it was weird for the first week or two, but obviously we're not coming out with a felony. We're able to. We're still in the military and able to continue our job. But I couldn't even imagine being like young 18, 19 years old doing three, four, five years, doing what you had to do to do, be in prison to survive, depending on tears and what, what cell block you're in or get stuck on, and then you all of a sudden, now you're back in the society and they're like, yeah, good luck being fitting right back into being an uh, an upstanding citizen again like good luck, you have me in in max.

Speaker 2: 43:44

You have me in in these, these more secure parts of the, the county jails or whatever, and you don't trust me to do this, but then you release me out to society.

Speaker 2: 43:54

That's weird you didn't trust me yesterday, but now I'm free today and not only that, but think about how many other people are like. There's a lot of bad people out there and what I know what people will. I know what people are capable of, for sure, I'm sure I know. I've read paperwork, I've seen what monsters could do and that's another mindfuck. That's why I'm so protective over my sisters.

Speaker 2: 44:28

Yeah, so from when I got out, I was kind of like in this autopilot and I was, I was selling dope. Um, it led up to the second time I got shot. So this time, like I said, I was just, I was doing me, I wasn't, I wasn't doing any, like there was no goal, there was no, nothing. I was just existing, making money, not saving up for nothing, not trying to make it out of nowhere. Like, yeah, I ended up getting shot, and this time it was by some tweakers from where I'm from, okay, and it hit my left hip, grazed my right well, it was a pinhead away from my urethra. Grazed my right well, it was a pinhead away from my urethra. It grazed my right. Nut came outside, my sack went back in and my inner thigh came back out the other side. It didn't hit a femoral, it didn't hit nothing.

Speaker 1: 45:20

Did you get shot from behind or at an angle?

Speaker 2: 45:23

So I went to turn, oh, and as soon as they started dumping, I just yeah, it was just the angle that they got me at.

Speaker 1: 45:30

Were you targeted or was it just into a crowd Like, walk me through that situation. How did?

Speaker 2: 45:37

you end up getting shot. For the second time I was going out. I was going out to Cowgirls in CUNA at the time and I was in Caldwell. We were gassing up and getting drinks to head out and, like I said, they were tweakers, they knew who I was and they were just meth, you know, methed out and yeah, what were you selling at the time?

Speaker 2: 45:58

So up until then it was just green. I didn't want nothing to do with anything white. I seen what it did to my family growing up. It just killed every temptation for me to even want it, okay, or want to want to do it, want to sell it, want to, you know, um yeah, when did that switch?

Speaker 1: 46:21

what did you? Always just stay selling weed, or did you? Um, so after I got shot, okay, yeah, so back on that. Sorry, there's, so there's. So I have somebody. My mind is like it's fascinating, so okay, so you get. You get caught up at a gas station with a couple tweakers. What do you? What did they come specifically like?

Speaker 2: 46:38

they were already there. They were already there. They just seen me and how did it start?

Speaker 1: 46:43

I mean, was it shit talking?

Speaker 2: 46:44

I mean it was, it was a look, it's always a look, it's always that fucking, you know, and it turns into something bigger, and then ego gets involved and I'm going back. And when you're a big guy, you know I Everybody wants to challenge you.

Speaker 2: 46:59

Well, they don't want to fight you, they probably want to shoot you. You know and that's what happened is I went to walk up to the car and they just started dumping, really, and they let off six shots. As soon as I seen that gun come out, I went to run, and I ain't never been a quick runner, so like I got.

Speaker 1: 47:18

Did you drop? I mean you get shot in the hips, it's almost.

Speaker 2: 47:22

I was gone. Really, I ran like five, six blocks down and then I see these headlights come over. I'm like, ah, so I'm hearing cops coming. I don't know if it's them, I don't know if it's the cops, but it ended up being my ride and they took me to the hospital. And yeah, I got to the hospital and I just started ripping off because I knew I was shot and there was just blood everywhere. Right, are you feeling it? No, and I?

Speaker 1: 47:49

there's just blood everywhere right are you?

Speaker 2: 47:50

feeling it. No, what'd they shoot you with uh 45?

Speaker 1: 47:52

damn. You took a 45 through your hip, through a testicle, through your right leg and you ran five blocks. Damn bro, oh for sure. Yeah, adrenaline is a hell of a drug, for sure, damn dude so, yeah.

Speaker 2: 48:08

So after they, after I got shot um, it was, it was a big situation, especially like who was involved? This that I don't really want to. Yeah, yeah on that. But uh, cops said, hey, since you want to be uncooperative nobody's been found guilty or has pled guilty and it's not a life-threatening wound you got to pay for your surgery yourself. I come from all I know is hustle, all I know is hustle.

Speaker 2: 48:34

Three days later I saw an undercover, the first time I ever sold meth. I went to go pick up. They said, hey, we ain't got nothing green, but we got this. And I just felt like the stage was set and I fucking performed. Damn, they waited a whole year to hit me with charges. Were they just building on you? They were trying to get guns. They were trying to get me to sell guns because at the time I had my concealed license permit. Okay, so you know, in Idaho, if you purchase a gun 90 or what is it 90 days, 30 days out from that purchase, you could sell that gun to somebody. That's legit. And anyways, they were trying to get some guns off me and it just never so you never got caught for the guns no, because it was legit sales, you know, damn man.

Speaker 2: 49:22

So yeah, I ended up. They went. They waited a whole year to hit me with charges and at this time, um, I was smoking weed at the time, just because for the pain right, two different times getting shot six bullet holes in me, exploratory surgery, like I'm pretty beat up, scar tissue, tears and whatnot. And yeah, they hit me with the charges. I got a paid lawyer and I got hit with. They hit me with trafficking, trafficking methamphetamine. I got dropped down to delivery of a controlled substance, withheld judgment, and I took the charge. At the time I could have fought this case because a whole surveillance team was there. No pictures were taken, nobody could identify me. Uh, the color of my vehicle was was there's four or five different colors? And it was enough to right. Yeah, but it's like I don't know. I don't know what it was. I was like, hey, felon, I gotta drop to delivery. That was a win. I ain't locked up, I got to do three years and I'll get off paper. Cool, run it. So I took it.

Speaker 2: 50:37

Damn dude, just like that, huh, yeah. And then they told me, all right, we only better see opiates in your system, Because that's what I got. Scripts for it, okay, but more weed. And I'm like, all right. A year later, man, like those scripts turned into heroin, heroin IV, drug use, methadone.

Speaker 2: 50:57

I tried to get on methadone to get off it but it was trading one high for the other and it was legit and my PO was cool with it and they ended up hitting the house. Gang unit, the task force hits the house. And I was just gone on methadone and they're like what are we going to find? I'm like eight grams of weed. It's downstairs, you're going to find it.

Speaker 2: 51:18

And they're like what were you going to do with it? And I was so fucking gone on methadone that I was like, well, I was going to celebrate, I was going to smoke it, I've been on for a year. And they're like and I was like, but that was a dumb idea, I decided I could have made an extra buck off it to pay for cost of supervision. I was like, yeah, that sounds good. And then my POs I remember him looking at me like, okay, that's what we're going to do. And he goes. You know what? I'm gonna give you seven days discretionary and I want you to get out, keep doing what you're doing and I'm like all right, so I go in stay, stay high the whole time in county.

Speaker 2: 51:58

They. They're bringing me methadone in county. You know what I mean. So I'm, I'm, I'm.

Speaker 1: 52:04

You know that's like a delivery, delivery of of you're still getting high, so are you using it all? Or, now that you're getting a script in prison, are you able?

Speaker 2: 52:13

to.

Speaker 1: 52:13

It was in county sorry, county if were you able to make something on the side, or are you using it all?

Speaker 2: 52:18

there was other stuff to make okay money off of. Okay. So, yeah, I get out from doing those seven days, probably a month in um from from being out. I'm yeah, I end up seeing these undercover cars pass by and I'm like there's too much traffic, Something's up and I dip out the back. 30 minutes later they hit the house and they hit a for they hit a the house. The warrant was felony possession with intent to deliver up eight grams of weed that they already got you on prior. Well, they gave me the discretionary.

Speaker 1: 52:58

They didn't hit me with the charges okay, so you think they were just building, building everything they could during that time that they let you yeah for that seven days.

Speaker 2: 53:06

But that was, that was the weed that they found eight grams of weed felony possession because I said I could have made an extra buck off it, damn dude. So so I took I was in this like limbo thing, I was pissed, I like I took it as I could have fought the charge, and I reached out to a buddy of mine. I'm like, what do you think, what do you think I should do? And he's like, well, dog, like you're pretty gone, you could detox, use this as a detox, get out. You'll go through a rider program, a three-month rider program, six months. You'll be out on the streets like, take it as that. I'm like you know what? Yeah, so I end up doing it and and, uh, I go through this, this program, um, through the prison. It's up in cottonwood and they called it, uh, the tc or I don't know tc. I think, yeah, tc, um, again, it was another holding people accountable, right. So people would hit people with with misdemeanors, like leaving your id at the bunk. You have to do this program if you're going to be there. Everybody knows what it is. When you walk in, some people are hitting motherfuckers with some pretty serious things because you've got a variety of different types of people and there's not a lot of people that are wanting to go to prison, but they're not made for prison, but they're made for this program, okay, you know. So you've got a variety of different people and everybody's just trying to get out.

Speaker 2: 54:27

And you know, I came from the streets to get away and detox through this program and, uh, a three-month rider turned into a nine-month one, and then I had a public defender that they don't. Uh, this guy's like hey, redo your, your PSI. You're supposed to do your PSI pre-sentence investigation. You, you, you could, even if you get hit with it within a year or two years, whatever, it's still the same points. Okay, so what they did was I retook this one Cause. He's like yeah, retake it, you could get a lower program, maybe you won't even get a program if you don't qualify. Well, they stacked the points against me from the first time I did the PSI to the second time and it doubled up on me and I ended up going for the most intense program there was.

Speaker 1: 55:18

Really.

Speaker 2: 55:19

Yeah so.

Speaker 1: 55:20

I mean, is that a good thing, or did you not need it? I mean cause, obviously, if they're stacking points on you from past shit, it was destined, it was destined to happen. I'm just going to put it like that.

Speaker 2: 55:30

It was destined to happen. I'm just going to put it like that. It was destined to happen. But I'm going through this program and this whole program is to hold others accountable while looking at your own Right. And still, I'm with my homies. There's some homies there and one of my homies like we don't come from this. All right, I'm going to hold you accountable. I'm going to put my, you, my, you know. I mean, it's not like that. You mind your business, you know you stay in your lane yeah.

Speaker 2: 55:55

So there's three cardinal rules in this program. It's uh, no sexually acting out, drug and alcohol or violence. You do any of those three, you're done, you're gone right, I ask you a question real quick.

Speaker 1: 56:06

This is you're in a full facility. Is this a set its own separate? Yeah, up in cottonwood. Okay, so you're not in in like prison, prison setting. Yeah okay yeah, okay, so this is you're in up cottonwood for this program that is specific to help get you back on track okay, yeah, so so those are the three cardinals, right?

Speaker 2: 56:29

and uh, I grew up with a lot of these guys. Not only did I grow up with a lot of them, I was in juvenile prison with them as well. And now I'm in this, this, this prison or this program. So there's a relationship already built and established, right? And one of my homies got relinquished. Relinquished, being kicked out of the program since it due his time Because when he would do the program, when he would hold others accountable, he would be too aggressive comparison to the two me holding somebody accountable and not understanding the feelings that come with it is so similar to to a confrontation for sure, right. So that's what this this guy, when my home was aligning it with. So every, all these feelings of, of comparison, like what if he jumps? What if he?

Speaker 1: 57:28

you know I mean.

Speaker 2: 57:28

So your boy is holding people accountable, but not knowing how to hold people accountable too aggressive okay, and he ends up getting relinquished and sent to do his time because it was frustrating to me, because I understood him right, I understood what was going on, but this facility that's in charge of teaching us to think differently couldn't figure it out so now you're watching this system kick your buddy out because he's doing what he thought he was doing the right thing, but he doesn't know how to correct people.

Speaker 1: 58:02

I mean, y'all are in there for a reason. It's like it's not like you guys are coming from being a leadership position, but now you're, you're expected to police your own. I feel like that's kind of a almost a setup in a way, like if you're doing what he feels is right, maybe it's not the right thing.

Speaker 2: 58:18

Yeah, and I think it was a month later, two months later. Um, it has nothing to do with the race, it has nothing to do with so. There's two white guys, one was gay. They were in the shower. The gay guy grabs this guy's dick and, uh, that was a sexual advancement, right? Well, that guy goes to the CEO and says, hey, this, this is the situation, this is just what happened.

Speaker 1: 58:42

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 58:43

And that CEO told him go, go get an apology from him and see where that goes. And when I heard this situation go down, I'm like I was pissed. I was pissed because it's like how are you going to do that with my homie? You just sent my homie to I don't care who if we're playing this fair card.

Speaker 1: 59:05

Yeah, he's principal, you know.

Speaker 2: 59:06

Why so? And again, it was just time after time after time. The system wasn't fair and I just felt like who's going to say something? And I ended up in this program. There's a booking slip system, right?

Speaker 2: 59:22

So, you write out the. So I'm writing up CO Erickson for not following through with job duties when it came to a sexual advancement on another inmate. I didn't care what happened between these inmates, I was, it was strictly the CEO. Yeah, the next morning I put this, I put this slip in that night. The next morning they called me to the bubble, my case manager, the CEO and the corporal captain, whatever. And, uh, captain tells me you're sticking your nose where it doesn't belong. Really. You sure you want to do this Really? And I'm like that's this whole program is to hold others accountable while looking at your own.

Speaker 2: 1:00:07

And we got into this like back and forth conversation and like I knew it wasn't going to work out in my favor because the ceo that I feel this slip out. My case manager is here allowing this conversation to take place and she's in control of my release, and then the captain is supposed to be looking over everybody and keeping this balance in power. Right, this is all playing out and and I just told him, I said you know what, I'll leave it alone, I'll leave it alone, I'll pull out. And I left it alone. And then, probably another month later, at my eighth month mark, they shut down the program Since the recidivism rate was. It wasn't working. The program wasn't working. Within 24 hours they had everything pulled off the wall, all the program that we've done for this past eight months in the trash. Nothing counted. Booking systems nothing counted.

Speaker 2: 1:00:54

It was like county jail all over again oh my and and I'm like a month out, right, I'm like I don't even know what's going on. Am I going to be released? Is there another program I'm going to have to do there? There was just so much and you know what, going through that, I still felt like I don't. I think maybe it was ego, maybe I. I just felt like I got punked out by this motherfucking captain, yo, the ceo, my case manager, the one that I'm supposed to like, I'm supposed to, hey, if there's any problems and you need to talk about anything that's going on on the on, on the outs, what about what's going on right now, right, right here, in this situation? You want me to go through counseling and talk and let you guys in, when I know who you guys are.

Speaker 2: 1:01:41

It was very frustrating. I was heated and I remember I called my mom. I'm like, hey, mom, I'm going to do a pre a call on this situation. What's that Pre a call is? Is a prison rape prevention? Um, you call in if you know that you've been sexually assaulted or you know of a sexual assault. Right, and it's. It's supposed to be. Honestly, man, I thought it was like a very hush-hush thing and there was an outside agency that was going to fly in on a helicopter, pull us out and take it. But yeah, I told my mom, I'm like Mom, I got to do something. She's like son, just keep your nose down and just get out. And I just I couldn't let it go. It was faster than you and I did the call. Hey, I'm aware of a sexual harassment that took place on another inmate that a ceo was aware of, and they didn't do nothing about it. Shortly after, 30 minutes later, that same captain and same ceo came and got me and they said you couldn't just leave it alone. Huh, so they did the paperwork, this paperwork that I've never seen after. After this, after I signed everything. I've never seen it before um two weeks later.

Speaker 2: 1:02:56

It was a very, it was militant in the beginning, but that was part of the program. Right marching, uh, during count time, you had to stay up and they got me on this bullshit as, oh, I was laying down during count because my belt loop was touching the bunk. That's what they sent me to prison for to do my time. That's what they relinquished me to do my time. And I was so, I was so pissed, I was so mad, I was so I didn't have control over anything. Uh, they sent me to to this holding prison or Fino, uh, for transit. To get back to the prison, I never was able to talk to the judge and be like hey, this is a situation, this is what happened. All this paperwork that I signed with the priest all got, I'm pretty sure, tossed in the trash. Oh for sure. And again, this is the system. This is the system. This is their representatives.

Speaker 1: 1:03:45

This is the people that are saying hey, we're holding you accountable and we're teaching you how to hold others accountable, looking at your behaviors, but don't look at ours and it just… it's all for thee but not for me. You know they're expecting you guys to…. This is what blows my mind when these guys? You're in a program that's built off of accountability structure, holding you guys in policing your own, but meanwhile you're trying to report something that's happening and the CEOs or whoever's in charge are doing the most blatant shit right back to you.

Speaker 2: 1:04:23

And it's just, it's weird because it's like again like I got love for my homies because I was there with them.

Speaker 1: 1:04:29

Yeah absolutely, it's like again, like I got.

Speaker 2: 1:04:30

I got love for my homies because I was there with them. Yeah, I am very I understand. It took, it took a while to understand that. You know, my homies weren't there because they weren't like, hey, vx, locked up. Right now I'm gonna get locked up, I'm gonna catch this felony, I'm gonna go hang out with him just to make sure he's safe, just to give him this soup, just to give him this soap, just to make sure he has some shoes or whatever. You know, we were in a place of misery. So so I understand that now, but I do understand that the love that was shown was genuine and we were all going through it and we were all getting mistreated, and and that brought us even closer together.

Speaker 1: 1:05:05

You know, because getting trauma bonded in there even tighter.

Speaker 2: 1:05:08

So you know, I know I leave this prison. I didn't like for two weeks. This is the prison. They send PC cases to the lowest of the low and they put me in general population and I already got wind from the homies. Hey, just don't talk to nobody, Don't fuck with nobody, don't buy nothing off nobody, don't associate with nobody. Make fuck with them, but don't buy nothing off nobody, don't associate with nobody. Make it out here to the to the yard.

Speaker 2: 1:05:35

So, yeah, I, I went through this. Uh, I ended up getting out to the prison and I was really hoping I would be able to get in front of a judge and never happened. And now I'm over here, I'm calling my family. Hey, mom, it wasn't me. Hey, this is what happened, mom, now that I could talk to you and tell you what's going on, because I I couldn't at the other facility, because they're listening um, I had to talk to my daughter's mom and tell her hey, like, like, this time it wasn't me, like I wasn't being a shit stick, like I, I stuck up for something, something right. And it was yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, big. You know, it was hard. I was in a place, and especially right there in the, I stayed away from meth because I seen it growing up. Right Now I go to prison and you know everybody's active.

Speaker 2: 1:06:27

Like I'm looking around this tier and everybody's looking at you like what are you going to do? Who are you? What makes like, what are you? What are you? And I remember the first time I did meth was in prison. Really, that first two weeks there, within that two weeks at the, the prison, when I hit, and again it was, it was like there's some homies and then there's some motherfuckers that love the chaos, the havoc, everything that comes with it. They don't care, they want this misery right and um, it's. It's kind of hard to decipher who's who or what they're going through in life. That's going to determine that, right. But yeah, the first time I got high was was right there. And I remember looking around and again, when you're being sized up and you're you're being questioned, like all right, if this is what monsters do and I'm labeled the monster, this, this is what we're going to do.

Speaker 1: 1:07:27

Question for you Never done meth before, right Until this point. What? What going to do? Question for you never done meth before, right until this point. What? What possessed you to try meth misery?

Speaker 2: 1:07:36

misery. I was pissed, I was heated. I I felt like I was unheard, I was forgot about. Uh, I I just didn't care. He's kind of. I didn't want to feel nothing yeah, I didn't want to feel nothing damn dude, that's, that's scary that you went from a program I back up.

Speaker 2: 1:07:59

I I came from the streets to escape addiction, to to sober up, to, to get in my right state of mind and then to be put in a program and then sent to prison and then be fucking. Hey, here's meth in a needle. What are you gonna do? You know? And at the end of the day again now where I see it, where I'm at in my life, I know that the accountability is on me, like I know what I've done absolutely no.

Speaker 1: 1:08:23

But but you're putting a cauldron, you're putting his pot, it's just. It's created it to create chaos.

Speaker 2: 1:08:30

But if you don't know, if you don't, if you don't know absolutely then that's the problem that's the problem is is we don't know what else is outside of that. If we've never been shown it, you know so when you got transferred to prison from your.

Speaker 1: 1:08:45

The program is supposed to be helping you with all of this. Your first this is your. I mean, obviously you've done juvie, you're in this program, so you've been in and out of the system. You have a taste of it. What was it like going and getting transferred to gen pop in a prison for the first night? Like was it a different feeling and in like an atmosphere for you and how I got so many questions. Yeah, we like an atmosphere for you and how I got so many questions. Yeah, we'll start there. But like, also, do you have to put on like a persona, like a, like a front of even bigger than who you are? Because you're walking in the gen pop at the same time and you're getting sized up and you're going to be tested by everybody.

Speaker 2: 1:09:25

So, so the prison that I was at the landing is called the yard, okay, and you got a variety of different types of people from different types of areas and it's it's very like y'all motherfuckers are going to get along and if you don't, then you don't get along, and that's what it is. And fight it out, yeah, so so it was in being on meth. Being on meth in the war zone, I remember, uh, yeah, in the war zone. I remember, uh, yeah, being on meth in the war zone enhanced it even more, like, like I, I, I fucked around for like three weeks and I was done, I was done, I, I could not just be in that.

Speaker 1: 1:10:07

That prison's already prison's already bad, so to be in yeah to be compounding meth on top of trying to survive in prison.

Speaker 2: 1:10:19

Yeah, but even even the the spot that I was at was intake right. So there's just a lot of things that aren't established just yet. Because you're getting processed, you're going to get sent out to wherever right.

Speaker 1: 1:10:31

How long is that process? Two, three weeks, okay, so you're not just showing up. Here's your strip clothes, here's your cell. You're in it. So you're in a process, so you're not thrown to the wolves. The first right when you walk in you are.

Speaker 2: 1:10:47

It's even worse because nobody's been, nobody. Your, your prison ink, hasn't been captured. They don't know who you run with and and their, their house and all of you guys. So it's even a. You're really even charges. You got sex offenders that come in and you, like, you're doing paper checks making sure that your house is clean pretty much what do you mean by that?

Speaker 1: 1:11:08

like everybody on your cell or in your room is a sex offender? Yeah, not a sex offender.

Speaker 2: 1:11:13

They're checking for that and then there's some guy like it's just, it's twisted. It's twisted because it's just. And then again on meth, you're dealing with all this shit going on.

Speaker 1: 1:11:23

You're, you're, you're so you okay, so said you did, you started at your second weekend.

Speaker 2: 1:11:29

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:11:30

So you're still getting processed and you're not even.

Speaker 2: 1:11:35

I'm still not even getting pictures taken of my tattoos, right. So I'm over here on meth dealing with CEOs taking pictures and stuff and everybody is everybody's getting observation and assessment Right and their charges are getting all right. Hey, where does his points fall? Stg tattoos, all of it's getting laid out right. And again to be in that headspace in war zone like there's so much going on and then you think you have enough time to call out to your family, you don't, you don't. And then you ever been on the phone in prison on meth trying to, trying to? It's all bad, god bless her.

Speaker 1: 1:12:18

It's like, how do people hearing this? It's like, how do you even make it out of there? I headstrong.

Speaker 2: 1:12:23

There's so many people I've seen like think that they want that type of life. It ain't it, it ain't it. I've seen so many people that were really, really with it fall short, fall shy, and they're the ones that are saying, hey, if this ever happens, I'm jumping. If this ever happens, this is what I'm doing. Don't ever say that Until you're put in that situation, you don't know what you're going to do.

Speaker 2: 1:12:51

That was one thing that I got taught was I would be like just you judge, and when you place judgment out there and then karma comes back around, and how are you going to react and respond like that that hits different. So you, you learn what I don't know. For me it was like okay.

Speaker 1: 1:13:16

I won't speak on nothing until until I know. So, once you get processed, you go through that, which was a couple of weeks, so my points they drop. Well, you speak of points, I know what points are, but for people listening when you're getting processed, or every time you get caught up and get sentenced again, you're going back. You're earning points, or or are they earning the?

Speaker 2: 1:13:30

different type of point system when you're going in through, like a rider program, okay, and then when you get to a prison, it's a different point system that that is taken into consideration, your dors, things that you've been written up for your charges themselves, like they will stack up, um, so, yeah, it's just, it's just where they, they, they see, your see where you're at, okay, yeah, so so they, they finally observed, assessed and they're like all right, you're going to the farm, my, my charges were eight grams of weed, felony possession arm. The farm is a work center. Okay, not, not a work center, but it's. It's a lower, uh, security prison. And I had homies that are like, bro, go, you're gonna be doing this over there and I won't get into it, but we'll have you do some stuff over there, and like, yeah, go, go, enjoy, and like your points are low you know it'd be, that's a privilege yeah, okay, so that, so I was able to work.

Speaker 2: 1:14:29

I was able to work in the go-off compound and work on the road crews. So these highways, cleanup whatever. Sims the fruit. You know what I mean. Like there was things that I was able to do. I got my CDL there Okay.

Speaker 1: 1:14:45

So this is benefiting you. I don't hear much of these types of things, so this is a good program for you. Are you still on meth at this?

Speaker 2: 1:14:51

point. No, like after that two, three week period I was done, okay, I didn't want nothing to do with it. And then when I found out I was going there, I'm like Can't fuck this up, you know. So there's just a lot of weight that was going and, but there was still this yeah it's, you're in prison, but you're not in prison, but you're going to conduct yourself as if you were somewhere higher up in the prison system. You know what I mean like still conduct yourself accordingly okay, so you're not letting your guard down.

Speaker 1: 1:15:22

You're, you're, you're still head on a swivel, even though, yeah, why, though, I mean, if all these guys are in this program and you're getting benefits when I say benefits, you're able to leave and you're not locked up for 20 hours a day, it's?

Speaker 2: 1:15:35

all ego everything goes back to it huh, it's all ego, it's all I remember. After I got my my parole date in 2017, I I paroled out, but before I got my my date for a, I had it for a year and it was over the microwave. It was over a fucking microwave, me taking somebody's foods out. Once it beeped, okay, and I put my food in and dude's banging on me like, hey, you touched my food without the beeper going off. I'm like it beeped and I ain't got time for this. Like, if you want to deal with it, we could go to the bathroom. And I'm hoping that this motherfucker is smart enough to be like okay, no, right. And he's like let's go. And I go and I break this dude's nose and as soon as I break it, I'm like right, I'm like you, good, you done. He's like, yeah, but they're gonna know. And I'm like, yeah, they are, because just the tear, the this facility, people talk okay, right, it's a very minimum yeah, like people will talk.

Speaker 2: 1:16:42

So in the next day we got, we got put in the hole and, uh, I told him. I said, hey, doc, I know you're from caldwell, I'm easy to find in caldwell. It's going to be real easy to find you. What's the story? What do you want to do? And he's like I went in the bathroom, I scared you and you lifted up, you hit my head with your nose Like I scared you, and that was the story. And we ended up we both got to keep our dates, really, but again it was like it was ego.

Speaker 1: 1:17:14

It was ego over a fucking microwave, you know, and and I ended up getting out and yeah so during that time you're locked up, you're doing this, this program, you're able to go out, you're at the farm. Was there any significant changes in your life that you found then? I mean, are you, are you, are you starting to?

Speaker 1: 1:17:30

autopilot yeah, are you not? Are you at this point I I just ask? I don't know if you know a religious man or not, but are are you starting to kind of figure your life out and get things on track? Are you talking to god or are you just you just grinding out and trying not to get in any more trouble?

Speaker 2: 1:17:46

so when it comes to religion, it's it. It's scary being in the system and understanding what comes with religion. Let's say I'm an active gang member and I start saying, hey, I'm religious, now You're going to get a pass, but if you fall out of line you're going to get caught. You get caught with with pornos. You get caught calling your mom, yelling at her, you, you there's things that are not Christian Like. You will get held accountable Really. And and that's the scare factor, cause it's like and you know.

Speaker 2: 1:18:22

Then you got other prisons. It's like I've seen it all man. I've seen it all man. I've seen some really Like what People go into church in certain prisons for ulterior reasons, absolutely Like I don't know what it is, but I guess back in 80s, 90s, I was told that men were raping other men because they were told either you take their life or you take their manhood Right 2020. This generation that we're living in, like people are just freely doing gay shit.

Speaker 1: 1:19:05

Do you see? Okay, I got to ask, ask, ask away.

Speaker 2: 1:19:09

I see a lot of that shit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's just weird because in the prison system now before maybe it was once like honorable it was once, but I don't know because I'm looking at it from a perspective of looking in and I'm thinking that's what it is, and then I get to prison and it's not what it is. Like you could be a lame, you could be you, you could they have pc and imsi, they have protective custody in max prisons, just because you're in a max prison doesn't mean you're a solid guy.

Speaker 1: 1:19:42

See, and this is a huge problem that I actually I think the wife and I were talking about not too long, because I was talking about how they put these sex offenders and rapes or you know, child predators and protect npc. And she's like what do you mean? They separate them? And I'm like, yes, like that blows my mind that a child predator gets special treatment because they can't put them in gem pop, like if you're going to get sentenced and you're a child predator, you should be thrown right into the fucking wolves with everybody else but that's the thing is.

Speaker 2: 1:20:09

Okay, let's talk about that. Let's talk about you know how frustrating it is to to have society once given many, many, many, many chances of of you touching kids or you doing this sexual bullshit right, and then you getting tossed in with because they will come through and then you put hands on them. Guess what You're you're.

Speaker 2: 1:20:32

I'm getting charged, I'm getting thrown in the hole. Why, why am I only good to society when, when I'm taking care of this dirty laundry that you guys have, but I'm still, there's still repercussions for me, like that's hard, that's a hard. Like at that point you feel used, you feel you feel like what the fuck is going on, what, what is this? You know?

Speaker 2: 1:21:02

and again, like man I know what monsters are capable of Like. There was this one situation where I read through this guy's paperwork and he put a baby in a and like the feelings, the feelings that come with that you know, I, you know I'm, I'm a dad, but then I'm, I'm like I'm active with it, right, and it still touches your heart for sure.

Speaker 2: 1:21:37

You know there's just a lot, there's a lot that people don't know about, that's not out there. And you know, going through the prison system, we see things. We see things and it's hard to snap back, it's hard to to see the good in people, it's hard to put trust in people.

Speaker 1: 1:21:55

You know I feel, and here you are, trying, trying to survive, and then you're, now you're I mean you're reading this guy's because you're doing a paper check, obviously, right. How does that feel when you see this guy and he gets special treatment because he put a baby in a microwave? And here you are with Gen Pop, trying to survive?

Speaker 2: 1:22:21

Yeah, the world is not fair.

Speaker 1: 1:22:23

It isn't the world's not fair, since that that environment is the most chaotic, confusing, corrupt world, and here you guys are just just trying to make it and get to that date and get the fuck out of there.

Speaker 2: 1:22:45

you're dealing with dudes like that and it's a lot of like moral, like like where do you stand as a man? Like, okay, you got this other thing going on and then you got you like I've looked at guys and I've seen like there's no, there's no soul left in them.

Speaker 2: 1:23:00

And I don't know, I don't know. It's hard to judge why there's no soul. Is it a sexual abuse situation? Is it because they've seen these monsters and they've seen what they're capable of and they've lost themselves in it? You know, I mean, it's just so much deeper to where, like, yeah, I appreciate sharing this man.

Speaker 1: 1:23:18

I know it ain't. It's not easy and in the majority of this world lives so sheltered and comfortable and this is why I I want to thank you for for opening up about this type of stuff. I know and it's hard for I look at a guy like you and I think society would see dudes that are tatted and you're like, oh that, that dude's got a pass or he don't give a fuck, but it it shows how real and raw and in that you no matter anybody's history and past, it's like dude, you, you.

Speaker 1: 1:23:46

We feel that shit and then to be able to share this man. I I know it's not easy, dude, and I know the things that you've fucking seen in there and uh and had to deal with and just living around evil. And when you say monsters like, I know what you're talking about and I know just the pure hate that people are capable and what they're capable of doing is, and then don't forget that shit it comes down.

Speaker 2: 1:24:15

we talked like earlier about like a split, split second that deters, like completely goes changing somebody's life forever. And it could be that one bad day, that one dumb mistake, and you are paying. Like I got homies that are never getting out, that are never getting out for the longest time, like I'm over here, like I can't even enjoy a hamburger or a steak because I'm like these motherfuckers are never going to experience this.

Speaker 1: 1:24:47

You know, never hold a woman again, or their child.

Speaker 2: 1:24:51

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:24:52

All for something. It it's like how do we correct this? I mean, how do? How does the system? How do we fix this problem where a guy that's in there let's say he's got two years and then get some you fight over a microwave or over the phone because he's been on it too long and egos rise up like and this is where I feel it's, it's this racketeering. Where it's like oh, you broke a dude's nose because you were just handling it like men. Well, here's fucking four more points. Hey, that puts you over the top now or what about this?

Speaker 2: 1:25:22

oh you, you hang out with these group of guys that we put you in with and then you built a relationship with, and now you're stg'd. Now, anything that you do, you're, you're gonna have enhancements to this. Oh, what like? Oh, you're gonna get out, you're gonna, we're gonna keep you away from everybody that you were locked up with. But you've, who else are we supposed to trust, like that motherfucker right there that I've been locked up with I've. He knows what I've went through, he's's seen what I've seen and now I cannot communicate with him at all. You know what I mean. Like that's, and, bro, like you spend a lot of time with your brothers, you know. So have I. And just like you, like I'm aware, I've sat down in sacred ceremonies with, with fed agents, first responders, veterans, law enforcement, right the trauma events that do take place. We one situation from going to prison or going, but they're escaping something. They're always escaping something, absolutely. So it's just hard. It's just it's hard to really, kind of like, connect with.

Speaker 1: 1:26:38

Wild man it is. It's an interesting world and it's I don't know how to explain how I feel for it, except for it's just. It's just a like a zoo, mixed with a circus, with corruption and politics, all built around money. And there's so many I don't I want to say good people that are good when I and when I say that like just have good hearts and they're not like a guy like you. It's.

Speaker 1: 1:27:09

You get these scenarios. You get in situations, you get caught up ego, whatever it is, but you're not out here maliciously at least from our conversation and what I know about you, you weren't out here breaking at home. You're not raping women, you're not doing these horrible things that I feel like people should be put away for. You get caught up and then it's just, it's a snowball effect, and then these guys just get into the system and they get into the I don't want to say games or the politics of the prison, but you have to fall into this in order to survive, like you have to. The guys that I've talked to in the past like I'm like why couldn't you just stay out of it? Like why couldn't you just stay in your own lane? And they're like it's not how it works, like you get pulled in and it's it it, at least for certain areas I can imagine.

Speaker 2: 1:27:50

There's there's different, like there's county different there's. There's state time different, there's fed time different. There's California different Arizona different there's there's there's different. Right, I'm speaking solely on on what I I'm not speaking on any other type of prison. I'm speaking on Idaho, absolutely Time, yeah, and on Idaho, absolutely Time, yeah, and, and this is what's going on. This is what's going on, and and yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:28:12

So how do you feel you we, I mean in your opinion, how do we fix it? How do we fix the system? Since doing time in there and being in and around it and seeing what's going on, where do you?

Speaker 2: 1:28:26

see the worst. Where's the most corruption inside, inside? So that's that question. I I've heard it a lot. I don't know how to answer it because I know what it took in order for me to get right and I just got tired. Okay, I got tired and I started understanding who and how and why I am the way that I am, and that's a whole lot of self-discovery that a lot of people, a lot of people, can't even look the man in the mirror and they need to figure out a whole bunch like your trauma events, like what has happened. Why do you move the way that you move, like there's a lot, there's a lot Too many layers.

Speaker 2: 1:29:09

Yeah. So for me here, I'll back. Okay, I get out 2017. So try this CDL thing. I didn't realize that these truck drivers out here they're on meth, all of them. They are. They are on a go, they were on upper, yeah, and, and I didn't know how to stop. I was driving truck and I was trying to work and and I got a taste of it in prison and then out here, it was everywhere that I was because I was looking for it at this point you know what I mean and I ended up going back. And then this time, when I went back, I went to the pits. What I mean by that is like I went back for a traffic infraction. So it was a situation where I relapsed. I relapsed, I ended up at my homie's pad and I do a shot. I do a shot of meth.

Speaker 1: 1:30:10

Is this your first time since being out, or no, you got into it because truckers are on all the pills.

Speaker 2: 1:30:15

Yeah, but this was like the first I snorted meth when I was doing the thing right, and that was my justification as far as like, oh well, I'm not banging it, you know. But the first day that I banged it, I went to my buddy's pad and one of my other homies was there and I do this shot, and then it like instantly opened up this. These guys start talking hey, the feds are watching, they're watching the house, blah, blah, blah. And I'm just like now I'm like Tripping, all right, I'm like I'm good, I'm dipping. I'm just like now I'm like, all right, I'm like I'm good, I'm dipping, I'm leaving. I don't want to, you know. So I go to leave and my homie's like hey, can I come with you? I had my girl pick me up at your pad. And I'm like, all right, cool, just leave everything here, make sure you don't have nothing, my ride's clean. So I'm still thinking that they're tripping and they're just being tweakers. I get in my ride, we take off. Sure enough, we get, yeah, we get hit.

Speaker 2: 1:31:17

And um, I don't want to say what happened in the car, but I kept going and um, I pulled into my mom's. How far did you go for? Not very far. My, my, my reason, my intent was I knew that they were going to tow my car and I'd rather be right here in front of my mom. So that that's what happened.

Speaker 2: 1:31:44

And, um, my, my po shows up. Hey, if we find anything, like anything, you're done. You, you're gone. I'm like that's cool. And he goes. What's going on? What's going on with you? I'm like I just need to work, man, I just need to get back into the motion of things. I've been telling you I'm high, I've been pissing dirty. I've been telling you I need rehab. You want to throw me back in County and tell me that's just as good. Like, so there's this guy that walks over and he goes. So you need to get paid. Huh, and I'm like I look at him. I'm like who are you? He goes. Well, my name is mr colwell or something. He goes I pay for information. I'm a fed agent and I'm like all right, I see where this is going. Like, cuff me, cuff me up and take me in front of the parole board and tell them that you pulled me over and I violated my parole for a traffic infraction. Like.

Speaker 2: 1:32:36

I ain't got nothing to say to you you know, and they're like that's the game you're playing.

Speaker 2: 1:32:41

I'm like that's what it is. And I end up. They're like, all right. So they tear my ride up. They don't find nothing. They send me on my way. Probably six months later they hit me with a parole violation for running the stop sign because it was a technically a crime. I broke the law, so I'm back in the pits. I'm back in the pits and now now I gotta put myself on front lines because ego is like, nah, hey, you came back. Nobody's gonna tell you what to do. Are you gonna tell your homies that, hey, this is what it is? I'm front lines because ego is like, nah, hey, you came back. Nobody's gonna tell you what to do. You're gonna tell your homies that, hey, this is what it is. I'm front lines. If anything pops off, nobody's telling me to go in, sending me as a torpedo, I will be here. I'm gonna be a gangster to the fullest. And um, covid hit, covid hit, covid hit, covid hit and everything was shut down.

Speaker 1: 1:33:34

Including the prisons.

Speaker 2: 1:33:35

Yeah, everything shut down, no movement, no, nothing, like nobody was doing nothing. And I'm not saying that thank you God for COVID, but I'm a big guy and in that mindset that I was in. But I'm a big guy and in the in that mindset that I was in, I've seen so many situations where somebody puts hands on somebody in a cell or going in for some work and someone dies, okay, and and that's more time, right, that's more time. And and you just, you, never, never know, you never know what's what's going to happen. You can't pinpoint, you can't, you can't tell the future, right? So that was my biggest worry before being as big as I am, like, and then the whole thing is, you're not going to stop until the to the CEOs come, and that could be a while, you know. So what are you going to do? Like that, I've seen some bad situations happen where they just keep going and going and going and yeah, is it scary?

Speaker 1: 1:34:37

no, never.

Speaker 2: 1:34:40

No, that was that was. That was like that was where I knew there was something wrong. So really, yeah, um so fast forward through covid. There's so much shit going on right and, um, there was a lot of self-growth in that cell because, you're locked down.

Speaker 1: 1:34:57

Are you by yourself or you got selling?

Speaker 2: 1:34:59

I got a homie okay and, uh, he was down nine years and he had another six left. And prison was a little different. Mando workout still, um, but you were locked down. Bird bathing what's bird bathing? You? Just, you shower in the, in the sink you just clean yourself up in the sink, put a uh like a blinder up, and you know do you think?

Speaker 1: 1:35:23

did you prefer the lockdown over? I know it's probably was hell but for now.

Speaker 2: 1:35:28

I loved it. I loved it. Like you gotta understand, when it comes to prison, like you are active from five, six in the morning till 11 last count, when those doors are shut, and if you're you're, it's mandatory. You need to be out there and, and like you don't sleep, your mattress is, and like you don't sleep, your mattress is rolled up. You don't, like people think that it's something more than like it's just that mindset is straight, war zone, straight anything Survival yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:36:01

Anything can pop off like that. Doors open if any, and it doesn't even have to be on me. If something else pops up with somebody else, I'm there, you know. So.

Speaker 1: 1:36:13

So it was almost. So you, which I understand, I mean fuck, if you're head on a swivel 24, seven from six in the morning, 11 o'clock at night, there's so much time for shit to happen. So now you guys almost went from that style to full. Yeah, locked down, you're almost in a max security. Now it's probably what it feels like, and for you that was like a breath, fresh a breath there, in a way, where you're yeah, but now, now it's, it's be careful what you wish for okay, why so?

Speaker 2: 1:36:40

because now I'm in that cell with my the world's, my world's biggest critic myself. Okay, now these conversations in my head are getting a whole lot serious, like what, what started I? Felt like a cartoon. I felt like a cartoon that I had all these ideas and I, like, I started, like I had enough time to breathe and think.

Speaker 2: 1:37:01

And then, yeah, I started analyzing stuff for what it for what was going on in my life, and it was like I was tired. I was really tired. Um, you could only escape. Like for me, when I was locked up, it was working out, getting tattooed, that I was escaping my pain with. That's what it was for me. Just to feel something right, just to hold on to that, like, hey, you're still human, you know what I mean. Like you still feel something. It may not be a hug, it may not be a kiss on the head, it may not, you know, but you're feeling something and that's where you want to be in in that place, absolutely. So, yeah, um, I walk out of prison. I walk out of prison at 31 years old.

Speaker 1: 1:37:57

So you had a lot of time to reflect. A lot Did you start? I mean so, during this reflection stage, what was your mindset Like? What are you preparing for Because you have your year out date? They go into COVID.

Speaker 2: 1:38:10

No well, I didn't. I was topping out, they denied me, they pulled all my street time up until that traffic infraction that was the last time in there, you were like okay, okay, okay, I'm tracking now. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:38:20

Okay, so you don't even really.

Speaker 2: 1:38:22

People were getting let out from COVID and I'm like eight months, 10 months, 12 months, they're letting people out, but what they're doing is they're letting out people that are going to come back. They're not letting out people that are are hey, these guys are are willing to put in the work and be productive members of society. That's what it is. That's the game. That's the game. Why? Why send out people that yeah?

Speaker 2: 1:38:46

money yeah they know that they're going to cash out on these inmates that are are not going to give them a headache. They're going to release these motherfuckers straight out of fucking the the pits and and they will come back. They will return setting the stage god they just set the trap for y'all, huh no but it's. It's a good you gotta accountability. That's a good business model it works.

Speaker 1: 1:39:08

It's a great business model. It works. So you're, you're self-reflecting, you're getting your, you're starting. Are you starting to get like self-motivated?

Speaker 2: 1:39:18

Yeah, are you okay? I'm just. I'm just like nah, I'm not, this ain't me, this ain't me.

Speaker 1: 1:39:22

You're done. You're done at this point, yeah, were you telling yourself you're not coming back, or does everybody tell you I?

Speaker 2: 1:39:27

wasn't going to come back. I remember telling my homies, hey. I'm front lines. I'm front lines right now and I'm going to be a gangster till I walk out that door. And then I'm going to focus on myself instead of these guys being like I can't live a gangster's life in prison anymore because I fucked up, I I'm not accepted there, no more. So I'm going to start doing good. I wanted to be the homie that got out from being active and doing good, because that's okay to do too.

Speaker 1: 1:39:57

Is that more acceptable?

Speaker 2: 1:40:00

Your reasoning behind it. Well, what's your reasoning behind it? Is it because of that? Is it because you can't go back and live this lifestyle? Or you're going to go back and you don't think PC is the place to be. So you're going to start doing good. Why can't you just do good, just to do good? Why can't you just?

Speaker 2: 1:40:16

You know, because I've had a lot of in-depth conversations with killers, with killers that weren't killing out of like this is what I am. It was a fear factor. They were one situation that changed their whole life. It was a fear factor. They were one situation that changed their whole life. And to hear a killer say like, hey, get out there, do good, I can't get out there, I will never get out, I will never walk out there, I will never have a job, I will never have a paycheck, but I want you to get out there. And, bro, send me some pictures. Send me some pictures, I don't even want money, just send me an experience that you're doing, that you're going through right now. Send me, like, like, a picture of of on your way to work, being stuck in traffic, gas prices. Take a picture of that, send it to me that's so sad.

Speaker 1: 1:41:05

Man, you don't think of that kind of stuff, is it? And hearing that is that kind of solidify like holy fuck, like this dude, I, I can't come back here yeah, yeah, when you're, when you're like that's what I want to bitch about.

Speaker 2: 1:41:18

I want to bitch about fucking traffic on the way to work, I want to build pay bills, I want to bitch about that, you know, and I'm like, damn, that is. That is pretty deep, that's pretty important. Yeah, you know. So people don't think of that. No, we're just walking out. Just walking out when you need a fresh breath, just walking out the door what's that feeling like?

Speaker 1: 1:41:37

walking out like you're, you're, that's it, you got your. You got whatever belongings you guys you went in with, which is probably nothing except for the clothes and your shoes, a couple, probably a couple bucks in your pocket, and you're walking through those gates at the for the first time out.

Speaker 2: 1:41:51

I didn't want to look back I just it was one of those. It was like you know as a kid and you're walking down a dark hallway and like that darkness is creeping up on you and you're just like trying to get the fuck out of there. It's very similar to that, like I didn't want to look back, I didn't want nothing to do with it, I didn't want your socks, I didn't want these clothes. I just I didn't want nothing.

Speaker 1: 1:42:10

You were in a shed, everything, yeah. So then, what was, what was it like for you?

Speaker 2: 1:42:17

Walking out. This time I walked out with just. I knew I was going to do something. I didn't know what I was going to do, but I knew I was going to do something different and it, just it fueled me. I was so ready, ready. I didn't want a day off. I got 10 years in the prison system. I've had enough days off and I was just hungry. I was just hungry. I knew I didn't want to do driving truck I, I it was a confined area, away from home, on the phone, potential relapse. I didn't want nothing to do with it.

Speaker 2: 1:42:49

Okay, um, and and I remember I was with my barber and I'm like trying to game plan him, this barber, my barber at the time, like he's seen me grow and he's seen me like he was the homie that did the barber thing and he's successful, right. And every time I went back or I was stuck in my addiction, he was still there cutting hair and I was thinking that's a pretty good life, right. So I remember talking to him. And during COVID, I remember looking out, looking out one time where these guys are coming out to get their trays and I'm just people watching, right, and two by two, these two men cells are coming out, getting their trays, they're going back in and I'm like noticing, very like people let themselves go during covid. They, they stop caring about like their, their haircuts, their beards, their, their eating habits, their hygiene. Yeah, like they let themselves go. And I remember, after like the fifth, sixth cell, I went and looked in the mirror and I I let myself go. I was still working out but I looked rough. I looked rough. I had nobody to impress and I was just like that wasn't a, that wasn't a thing, right. And I remember going and getting my, my food coming back up and I was just excited to pull out this beard trimmer that was set aside for a tattoo machine, just in case they took ours and I used it, what it was intended for. And I remember cleaning myself up, gave myself a taper, cleaned up the beard, lined it up and, uh, I felt good. I felt good.

Speaker 2: 1:44:25

And then my homie that's been locked up nine years going through this. He's not getting out anytime soon before covid's done, like he don't give a fuck. So there's not a whole lot. This man smiles about and he looked over at me. He's like, hey, clean me up. And I remember I cleaned him up and he was happy. He was happy and it just it showed me not only that, but me and him. We have this. You know, I clean him up and he's happy. I notice it. I'm like that's crazy, that's weird. Then we go get our tray for dinner and now, as we're walking out, people are noticing. People are noticing and they're asking hey, where's the barber, where's the uh, who's?

Speaker 2: 1:45:04

trimming, yeah, yeah and oh, they're letting, they're letting the barber in who's cutting hair.

Speaker 1: 1:45:08

Blah, blah, blah and I remember the homie was like the homie's's a barber now.

Speaker 2: 1:45:13

He's a barber now and it just showed me how a simple haircut could make somebody feel and stand out to others in this chaotic time, right. So I'm like you know what, fast forward to me and my barber's job. I'm like I'm gonna do it, I'm gonna do it. Fast forward to me and my barber's job. I'm like I'm going to do it, I'm going to do it. So I signed up for Paul Mitchell in Nampa and so, before I get into that, there was a situation right, there was a situation, a life changing situation for me where we get off, lockdown from COVID, they give us our weights back and I remember being in the gym and I'm working out and I'm just in my zone, I'm the weights drop, dropping the grunts, the right feels good again.

Speaker 2: 1:45:57

Yeah, and uh, covid lockdown, everybody gets off. And then there's things that are coming out about certain people getting held accountable and and there was this guy and the three guys jumped on him and they, they, they got him, they got him and there was blood, they were stomping him out, got him, got him, got him. And for 15 minutes they had to drag this guy in front of the bubble to where the CEOs were, cause they were watching some YouTube video. And, uh, I watched this whole thing go down and I watched it so peacefully and so like I'm working out and I'm just so lost in this like I'm I'm noticing, like I'm like I'm not feeling nothing you're numb to this, I'm this.

Speaker 2: 1:46:47

This is normal. And I knew like that's not okay, that's not normal to see that much blood, to, to see these CEOs, to not want to say hey, co, co, hey, like do your job. You know what I mean. And I knew there was a problem. I knew I had a problem and that was it. I wasn't emotional, I wasn't feeling nothing. So when I got into Paul Mitchell in Nampa it was the first startup day and, uh, there was there was like six, 12, I don't know. There was a big number of us, there was a handful of us that started that day and, uh, all walks of life, all ages, both men and women, and the startup to Paul Mitchell is they have a clapping right and it's where they're encouraging you. They're encouraging you to take this step in this career path, and they line up on either side of you and you walk through them. Okay, and as I'm walking through them, like I'm noticing like physical responses happening. I'm noticing sweaty palms, I notice my face feels like it's red. I'm like what the fuck is going on.

Speaker 2: 1:48:01

And I make it to the big meeting room and I look around at these other people that I started with and their physical responses are very similar too, because I read people, because I want to know, hey, what he's gonna jump, what good, yeah, yeah and I'm noticing these people are having similar feelings and physical responses that I am and, and man, how the fuck am I gonna walk on a tier full of killers, or killers in the mist, you know, amongst everybody, and not, not, and watch this situation with this, this guy, but not be scared. And then this, this beauty school, this beauty school. I'm fucking scared. And then I'm trying to analyze what's going on with me. I'm like, okay, so, okay, so I'm. I'm scared because what? The growth, the, the, the, the, the encouragement part, like what is it? And then, when I realized everybody else was feeling exactly how I was feeling, for the first time in my life, in a very long time, I felt like everybody else really.

Speaker 1: 1:49:10

I felt pretty good. I felt real good, felt alive again.

Speaker 2: 1:49:13

Yeah, so like yeah it was good that felt real good, felt alive again, yeah. So like, yeah, it was good. It was good, I hadn't felt that in a long time um how did you process that like that that night when you home?

Speaker 1: 1:49:23

did you reflect on that at all?

Speaker 2: 1:49:24

I mean because these are new feelings for you yeah you went from such a cold I don't, it's just weird because it's not something that I can explain and talk to somebody about, because they don't know for sure you know?

Speaker 2: 1:49:35

I mean, they don't know, and the motherfuckers that do, chances are there's just the statistics of People getting out of prison. You know, you last good three months. Maybe you got a good three months in you and you're waiting for these programs that take off to pay for some sort of schooling and like it's like Are you gonna relapse? Are you gonna fall back into something? Are you gonna get with the female that's gonna put you back in prison over a like whoa? There's so much that could happen, but I wasn't able to talk to everybody that I got out of prison with at the time. They've went back. You know, I mean, and this is this is like two, three months later they're that quick yeah so processing it was.

Speaker 2: 1:50:16

It just came with time and it's like, okay, I know something's going on here, I know something's going on here and with the program that I, I, uh, I took advantage of everything. I took advantage and there was modeling stuff that I did there was. But you know, there was people that believed in in, like, hey, this guy like he, like he really wants this. And I didn't have that. I didn't have that because, you know, the energy that I was putting out was where I'm at in my life right now. I see a lot of people trying to heal, seeking for forgiveness, seeking for, for healing, right, because that's the energy that I'm putting out. At that time I felt like drugs were everywhere and everybody was getting high because that's where I was. So it was just that transition, that shift of who I kept around and who I had and who I latched on and wanted to connect with. It was completely different, yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:51:12

And that felt good. Yeah, wanted to connect with. It was completely different. Yeah, and that felt good. Yeah, that's incredible, how such. I don't want to downplay by saying such little encouragement because it's, it's a cool event and you're you're changing your life, but just just a little impactful yeah, and it's sad to think of how many men and women both sides that are have gone through time behind bar and they that's.

Speaker 1: 1:51:35

All they're missing is just yeah a little bit of encouragement, a little bit of motivation yeah, so I, I latched on to the beauty industry.

Speaker 2: 1:51:47

Okay, because how it made me feel, and you know you accepted.

Speaker 1: 1:51:51

I mean you're.

Speaker 2: 1:51:51

You're a big dude but this is the thing is, I stand out and for the longest time, I try to hide that. I try to hide yeah, this is where this is where it is. But people love that. People love, people are intrigued by it, right, and I don't know why. Even even look at the analytical part of of 60 days in. Why is it that these numbers are hitting what? What is it about this lifestyle that people are? They want to know.

Speaker 2: 1:52:23

Um, I stopped hiding who I was. I, I, I started building my branding page. I still started building real time results and, uh, like it was like the dope game for me. Being in the service industry, being in the barber industry, I was like, okay, when I sold, when I was in the game, I didn't just, I also one thing I had a variety of different clients. This is no different than the dope game.

Speaker 2: 1:52:47

Right, I want to do a shave. I want to do a different types of haircuts. I want to do a facial. Why do I want to do a facial? Because I could charge more. Why wouldn't you want to do a facial? You use cool with 25, 35 cuts, not not me. So I ended up doing like I said barbering aesthetics, found out about scalp micropigmentation and I'm like, okay, hair tattoo. I ended up getting my whole head blasted when I was locked up because I was receding on my hairline. I'm like, ah, it's not the look. I don't want that look. I went to the most extreme. Now I look like this MS-13 cartel, like I have to smile a whole lot more. Hey, but your average person isn't going to go to that extreme, right.

Speaker 1: 1:53:31

Yeah, that's what I saw you. I, your average person, isn't going to go to that extreme.

Speaker 2: 1:53:34

Right, yeah, that's what I saw you. I was like this dude sees some shit, yeah, so, but but it's good. What it does for me is I'm able to tell that I'm able to to understand what somebody's willing to do to conceal their hair loss. And now the clients that I'm working on like I. So I got into this S and P thing and everybody thought I was crazy. Everybody thought you're gonna charge that, you're gonna tattoo hair. People are gonna buy that, bro, focus on just cutting hair.

Speaker 2: 1:54:01

And I didn't like that. I didn't like being told what to do. I'm free now, you know. I mean, I didn't get out of a box to put myself in a box, for sure I love that. So, yeah, I, I bro.

Speaker 2: 1:54:10

I looked at it. I connected with people just like the dope game. All this energy that I was putting into this negative lifestyle. Now I'm turning it into this positive.

Speaker 2: 1:54:21

And what's crazy is I thought, getting out of prison, I just had to stop doing bad. It's like no, you got to do good every fucking day and match yesterday's and keep surprising these motherfuckers and you keep going. You know, and I was so stuck on my business and I was I knew I wasn't ready for the relationships that I've been in. I've been in two serious relationships since I've been out and both of them have been the same type of female and deep down inside is because I've I've learned that there's some internal things that I've haven't I haven't dealt with.

Speaker 2: 1:54:58

Like what, if you want me asking, okay, so I started doing, um, I got 10 years in the prison system. I'm growing in my business, but I I know that there's something more right and now I'm having issues connecting with these women because I grew up being the protector, like I got six sisters. You're going to protect yourself. You're going to know how to take care of yourself when it comes to these guys. Right, I got it. I had it all twisted. These women in my life are not soldiers, they're civilians and and they, they need to be, they need a I. I should have held space for them to be in their divine, their, their femininity you know what I mean.

Speaker 1: 1:55:41

They're? They're you expecting them to be something else?

Speaker 2: 1:55:44

I just wanted to make sure that they were taken care of. If I wasn't there, okay, and and again. Like it's like breeding a pit bull puppy and then that little motherfucker bites you.

Speaker 2: 1:55:55

You know, like you created that yeah and now you let's get in the conversation of like energy. Like I had this invisible energy blueprint in my mom and my sister's lives of what a man is right. So I'm aggressive, I'm big, I'm telling them, hey, you're going to not anything a man should be doing to a female right? I may have been doing it out of good intentions, but if you look at the blueprint of what like a bad guy is and then what I'm acting like they're too, it's too similar, they're over, yeah, overlay. They're. It's too similar to where it's bringing confusion into these women in my life. They're looking at me like I'm a good man, they know I'm a good man, but there's just too many similarities and they're getting involved in relationships that are not like that. I should have created this blueprint that way, when another man comes in, it's not good energy. They, they, they could see it. You know what I mean. But instead it was just so. There was so many things that from that we're familiar with it.

Speaker 1: 1:57:06

So when did you, when did that switch Like, when did you realize, or are you still processing that I mean?

Speaker 2: 1:57:14

let.

Speaker 2: 1:57:14

When did you realize? Were you still processing that? I mean so, uh, let's see, probably a year, year and a half, two years maybe after, after I got out, I ended up, uh, realizing that there was things that were holding me back, that were no longer serving me and my belief systems. And, uh, I went through some personal business and development seminars and, like it started hitting me. In these seminars they're talking about, like, they're like, what's your relationship with money based on, okay, a child's program? So they say you're programmed at the age of zero to four, at 30%, at a 50%, at 18, 95%, right, so a lot of what we do is based on a child's programming. We're not even like there's just that's weird, that's to understand that like, wow, running a stop sign or making certain like adult decisions is based on what your upbringing was made me really think about. Like, okay, my first, uh, okay, my my first relationship with money, right, they asked me what's your first relation? What, what things, what comes up?

Speaker 2: 1:58:24

When was the first time that you connected with money as a child? What did you see? And I'm like, um, I'm going back and I'm like I see my mom, what did you see? And I'm like I'm going back and I'm like I see my mom, my sister's dad. He had a business right and when this business would do good, money would come in and my mom would rush to pay these bills before he got his hands on it and we would go to Chuck E Cheese. I remember going to Chuck E Cheese. We'd stay there for like less than an hour. We'd play, eat pizza to go, and it was because his connect lived right down the road, so he would go spend the money for the family on dope. Rush us out of Chuck E Cheese. My mom knew, she knew what was coming and we wouldn't see him for three weeks. I didn't want nothing to do with money. If that's what came with money, okay, right.

Speaker 2: 1:59:22

So my relationship with money was based on a child's programming of what I experienced. I had to change that, right, and it couldn't be just and I realized it can't just be just with money, like there. There's other things that are taking place where I I've programmed myself Absolutely. So my last, uh, my last attempt was uh, I, I get out of this relationship and you know, we, we call it and I'm entering this other relationship, and I knew I wasn't ready for it and I was still like my business is what I'm focusing on.

Speaker 2: 1:59:59

It's the only thing that I care about, because I'm somewhat successful and I'm not letting that go. It feels too good. I don't care what happens with this relationship, but I knew that that's not something that I can continue. And eventually ayahuasca came into the picture through through certain relationships, um with my ex and got presented to me and I was like you know what I heard about ayahuasca being like a factor reset for your belief system and and I got a lot of shit I need to deal with and I felt like me going into the medicine. I wanted to be, even with all the like survival mode did help me get through a lot of things.

Speaker 1: 2:00:41

You're living in a different world, then yeah, but it didn't justify the violence.

Speaker 2: 2:00:45

I still hurt people Absolutely. And before I felt like my business was going to take off and I was going to be blessed and I had a good family and everything was good. I had an answer to that. So I went and did ayahuasca for the first time. It was like my ego is the first time I actually understood my ego. I seen my ego for what it was and it was. It has helped me through survival, but it's also preventing me from growth and survival. But it's also preventing me from growth and accountability.

Speaker 2: 2:01:18

And I remember the first time that I do ayahuasca, I I went in and it was like a rebirth for me. I was naked in a womb and like I'm flexing and and like it's almost like I'm being like brought back, reborn again. Yeah, and while I'm in, there's beautiful lights going on and it was just a beautiful experience. And and then my ego jumps in the mix and he's like we're not here for that. You didn't come here for that, you came here for the violence and destruction that you've caused the world. And, as my ego saying this, there's situations that are coming up and just bloody, just just a lot of and uh, they call the spirit that comes with, uh, ayahuasca, grandmother. And as my ego is doing all this, I just feel like this connection with like, like we're not going to continue something that you already know. You're not here for that. I'm not putting you through that, that's your ego, okay, and it was like the medicine knew that I could. I could handle being hurt. I've been hurt my whole life. I could be in a situation where where I'm not safe and I'm going to be just fine and I know how to deal with that. But to be loved, to be nurtured, to be hugged, to be just told that everything was going to be okay and I haven't heard that in a long time.

Speaker 2: 2:02:49

So after I got shot, I was told I would never be able to have kids again. There was 12 years where no scares, no, nothing. Two months later, after doing the medicine, my daughter's mom was like hey, I'm pregnant Really. And for me there was this whole bunch of feelings. I knew she wasn't the one for me, but then I knew I have a second chance at being a father and I hear all the time like your kids deserve that absolutely and um, there's just a lot going. She didn't know she wanted to keep the baby and I couldn't force her to keep the baby and there was just a lot of feelings, a lot of emotions. We weren't ready and she ended up keeping my daughter.

Speaker 2: 2:03:38

And through this relationship I just I've noticed my belief system as far as, like, when things were bad, it was like, all right, I'm done, I'll step out. And you know, now that I'm, I'm a little bit more successful. Now ego's coming in even heavier. Now there's there's, there's females coming in and not distractions, right, and I'm like not knowing how to handle myself. They don't talk about this in pre-release. They don't. They're not. Hey, you're going to be successful, you're going to get a lot of exposure and there's going to be a lot of females from everywhere. And what are you going to do? You know there was just so much that was coming into play.

Speaker 1: 2:04:16

It was a distraction, yeah, so.

Speaker 2: 2:04:19

So two months, uh, it was probably it was. It was, uh, easter weekend and there was an opportunity to do another uh ceremony, and at the time, I'm like, okay, why am I unhappy? I, I I've never, I never thought I was going to be able to have a daughter, like a child, my girl's pregnant, I have money coming in, I'm driving a nice Benz, my business is doing good, my conversations are filled with substance. Why the fuck is? Why am I not happy though, inside? Why am I not happy inside? Why am I not happy?

Speaker 2: 2:04:54

So I took that opportunity and, for the first time in my life, I had a maid. Right, my mom would be pissed if I had a maid. She'd be like, hey, motherfucker, you know, but my girl was pregnant. I felt like I had to uh, take the stress off her, and what ended up happening is is, this is where I learned about energy exchange, right? So I'm the guy that everybody looks up to from where I'm from, and they're like, hey, you made it out, you became, I became this mentor to people, both good and bad, people that want to fight me on. Oh, you're just you're, you're built different. You're, you're it's. They're just using excuses, right. So after these conversations of all this field excuse, just I'm mad. I'm mad at these conversations. I'm coming into it with good intent but I'm leaving walking away pissed off. So I'm going to the gym, I, I'm going to work making money.

Speaker 2: 2:05:55

Going home she's pregnant maids cleaning the house, but I'm not cleaning the house I'm not cleansing the house, I'm not, I'm not paying attention to what energy that I'm bringing in. Okay, and this is when it hit is. I went and did the medicine for the second time and, um, they said when, when the medicine gets scary, it's trying to show you something. And I didn't understand what that meant until this situation. It was so the visual was as I was going through these hallways, right, and it was like an old school screensaver. And I'm going through, and I'm just going through, and and I turned this corner and there's this stairway that comes down and there's this little girl on the stairway and as soon as I lock eyes with her, like I get, I've never been this scared before in my life. I'm hyperventilating in the medicine Like I'm, I'm like in a panic attack. I rip off the mask medicine, like I'm, I'm like in a panic attack. I rip off the mask and, um, I just remember. I just remember like, hey, go back in, go back in, go back in, slow yourself down, calm yourself down.

Speaker 2: 2:07:03

After like the fourth or fifth time it was the fifth time I was able to keep my mask on and then go back in. This time I'm looking for this little girl, this stairway right and again I turn through. I turn around this corner and everything slows down and I see this little girl and now I'm noticing things about her. She's very pure, very innocent, very. She's not some grudge girl coming down the stairs like this. This she's very innocent, right, and I ask her why did I get so scared of you? I was instantly shot into her body and I was looking at myself after processing it that I take it as that little girl was my daughter in the womb, and the energy that she was feeling, that I was terrified of, that she was terrified of, was the energy that I was bringing in from these, these different encounters and relationships. And then we get into this conversation of energy exchange, uh, lineage trauma, generational trauma, like it's being passed down, and we're not, like I'm my daughter's scared of me, she's scared before it is, yeah, before it even starts.

Speaker 2: 2:08:14

Yeah, before it even starts, and that's something that we don't, we don't pay attention to, we don't, we're not aware of who we bring in our home and like that's the biggest thing. Like when I asked you, hey, do you take off your shoes here? That that's keep that. Tell people like, hey, we do take off, this is how I clean my home, this is how I, I respect my home. Um, but like but, but that's the thing. And then we go like the cleaning the maid was a big big thing too is when you clean your house, you cleanse your house, you love your house, right, nobody's gonna do it like you. So so there's so many good feelings that comes with that that that cleansing ritual you know what I mean um, but yeah, I left that even more connected.

Speaker 2: 2:09:02

I've third journey was more of like ancestral lineage. Um, and keep in mind this this whole time that I'm doing, I've done five different, five different ceremonies and I've sat down with people that us against them. I've sat down with first responders, veterans, law enforcement, just a variety of different types of people, right, and now these guys, these guys are my brothers. I've, I've, I know, I know why it's us against them. I understand that I can no longer walk in a room and not understand their perspective. You know what I mean, especially these guys in law enforcement. You got generational trauma right, lineage trauma that's being passed down. My dad was a cop, his dad was a cop. It's almost like this.

Speaker 2: 2:09:51

Okay, it made me think about it, cause I'm so connected with the prison, because I've been there. I felt the energy that comes with it. So imagine this somebody's on on death row, they're, they're, they're going to die. You know they're going to die that day in the prison. Up until those, the lights are dim, everybody's quiet. There's an energy exchange, right, and everybody knows this is happening. So you got a lot of guys that are going through the prison system that this might just be their last time in prison. They might have learned right, but now they're experiencing these feelings. This energy exchange is coming on to them. Now part of that is lingering on, it's holding on to them. They don't even know, they don't know, they don't know. And then you know you got the, the inmate that that dies and and he leaves behind something and it's nothing that's going to help the next person, right Again, I know it sounds really deep and there's just so much. There's so much when it revolves around trauma events.

Speaker 2: 2:11:07

For sure, what I've found with even relationships right, you heard the song. It's a thin line between love and hate. It's a thin line between love and hate. It's a thin line between love and rape. And what I mean by that is you like we're out here having sexual relationships with like for me, with women that we don't know their traumas. We don't know their traumas. I don't know what they've experienced and and and we're thinking're thinking sex is just sex, right, we're rubber For us.

Speaker 2: 2:11:40

There's more to that. There's more to that. Let's say, like men, don't think about it. I don't think women do either until really put in the moment. But it could be, you know, during sex. It could be something that you do, it could be a hand motion, it could be just whatever. It is a sound, a smell that's putting these women or these men back in that situation and for a split second. Or it could be like they could look at you like the abuser and it will change. It will change the whole dynamic of the relationship. So what happens? Like? What is it that? Where does it change? What's the stopping point? What's the healing point?

Speaker 1: 2:12:26

You, know what I mean.

Speaker 2: 2:12:27

Yeah, and this is when I first, one of my last times doing it, my fourth time, like. I know people are going to hear this and they're going to think this medicine, this ayahuasca, is like, oh, this guy's tripping balls, and they're going to discredit what I'm saying, right, discredit what I'm saying, right Me. I know that this medicine is. I've been on pills, I've been on these therapies, I've done the most to try to heal and okay, so I ended up going in. I could talk about this because where I'm at in my life and I know it's going to help the next person. And I know some people when they do discuss this or want to put this out there, they're putting out anger, they're putting out insecurity, they're putting out the fears, the hurts right, they're expressing it that way, they're not verbalizing it. I'm able to do that because of where I've went in the medicine and what I've learned but a path on healing yeah, that's that's.

Speaker 1: 2:13:39

That's part of healing is being able to talk about it.

Speaker 2: 2:13:41

So with my daughter's mom. I I'm gonna lay out a situation. So, two weeks prior to taking my, my daughter's mom, to do this medicine, we were fooling around. And, um, to do this medicine, we were fooling around and um, she goes down on me and I'm like just just keep it in your mouth, don't do nothing. And I didn't know why I was asking. I didn't know why I was asking for this, but I was. I was deep down inside, I don't know. I did not know. Okay, well, after two, three minutes, like it just got weird, and so many feelings of anger, like she looked at me like I was crazy and like I got mad, I left. And then, two weeks later, we ended up going and I do the first night by myself. Second night, she comes and I've never been this connected with a woman before. I seen her without her insecurities, without her angers, without her hurts. I seen her for what? For I've never been this close before and, um, after, after a long night of just being in the medicine and just there's so much, that happened.

Speaker 2: 2:14:46

Um, there was a, there was a situation that was laid out where I told her I'm like don't feel bad for me, don't judge me, don't just listen to what I'm about to say, and that's what I just need to get it out, because it was very clear of what happened. So I was six years old and I was at the babysitter's and I was in the back room with her husband and I remember the carpet, I remember the jeans. He came and he goes hey, he actually pulled me into the room. He goes hey, you, you want some coins, you want to meet a dragon? And I'm a kid and again I'm in the medicine and this is being displayed. Um, so he goes and sits down, he shuts the door, he sits down in this rocking chair that he has and displayed. So he goes and sits down, he shuts the door, he sits down in this rocking chair that he has and he goes. Okay, he goes, you want this money? I'm like I'm a kid. I'm like, yeah, I want the money. He goes okay. So he puts it on his lap. He puts this whole bunch of change on his lap and he has me counting them and as I'm counting them, he has me dragging them across his lap and putting them in my pocket. Right, and eventually there was no more coins in the pile. And he goes okay, if anybody asks you got this from the dragon, I'm like okay, he goes, you want to meet? Asks you got this, you got this from the dragon? I'm like okay, he goes, you want to meet the dragon?

Speaker 2: 2:16:25

Long story short, how I had my girl that night and my daughter's mom with her in my lap is how he had me right and that just showed me. That showed me like we are doing things that we are unaware of, based on trauma, events like that, sexual abuse like that. Like I knew the, the 11 year old me going through this thing with my aunt. I knew about that and I I didn't fully understand. I I knew why I escaped, but 31 years old, walking out of prison, I knew that there was something more, absolutely, in this situation with with uh, like, what other medicine, what other type of of therapy or what like would have laid out that scenario, that situation we are, we suppress so much and again, like me sharing, like there's going to be a lot of men that are too masculine to bring up a situation like this.

Speaker 1: 2:17:18

But they're not helping anybody. They're not helping anybody, yeah exactly, and me.

Speaker 2: 2:17:25

I know, I know, I know it's deep, I know it's something. But after that situation and laying that out, I felt so relieved because I understood my inner child. I understood why I was so mad and angry and fighting off the world, why I didn't trust, why, you know, I understood myself.

Speaker 1: 2:17:46

Once you process that, did you have this? Moment where you almost got just. You felt all the years I felt one with myself.

Speaker 2: 2:17:59

I just felt like there again, there's invisible chains of trauma that are holding us back, that you know what?

Speaker 2: 2:18:05

And sometimes people aren't ready to go in the medicine. You got to be on the path of forgiveness. You got to be on the path of forgiveness. You got to be on the path of healing. Just, I did a post the other day and it was about like when I say I'm sorry, why is it that when we say we're sorry to somebody and they don't accept it, we're mad. Why is that they're not on the path of forgiveness, as long as we know it's genuine and it's coming from the heart? We got to accept sometimes I'm sorry isn't going to do anything for the other person. It should. I'm sorry is for you, absolutely.

Speaker 1: 2:18:44

You know, and I know that that may be a little selfish, but you have to understand that, like you just said, everybody's in their own stage, everybody of healing or not, or acceptance or not, and so for you to be able to genuinely tell somebody that it, that that is for us, I mean because you're truly meaning it now it's up to that person that, whatever stage they're at, to be able to accept it or not. And so, yeah, no, I agree with you. 100 when you like, as a man, when you, when you hey, I'm sorry, it's my fault, we truly mean it. And and if people aren't ready for it and I think a lot of people expect things in return- yeah, like when you big problem.

Speaker 1: 2:19:25

When you gift somebody, somebody or you give somebody even a compliment or anything. We I feel as a society, or just who we are as humans we all like, want to. Where's mine?

Speaker 2: 2:19:35

I give it to you, I give you a compliment where's my behavior, though that's a learned behavior and like another thing I learned about the medicine was like we're constantly doing one of three things at all times finding balance within and without. Okay, healing, no matter how big or how small. Right you get a thorn, you get a sliver, like your body's reacting to that and it's healing itself, right. And then like the third one is like this is one is to learn. Behavior I feel is we've disconnected with is helping the next person. Why is it that there's 10 people in a room. One person falls comes in, they fall Two people, three people are on that phone trying to record the situation. One or two maybe go up and help and the other ones are maybe standing back like that's none of my business, it's like that's not me, I don't care, I don't know this person. Those are learned things that we've definitely disconnected from, for sure.

Speaker 1: 2:20:37

And it sucks. It does, I think, as a father too. It's a huge that falls on a father's role.

Speaker 2: 2:20:43

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 2:20:43

From a very early age is, you know, obviously we don't. I don't have sons, you have two daughters that I know. I feel that's where it's, it's us as as not a dad, but as a father, yeah, pick them up.

Speaker 1: 2:21:00

Yeah, how don't expect anything or just just just be that person when they see you. That guy helped me, you know, or hey, she helped me up or lended a hand and just cool, hey, have a nice day, and that's all it takes. And you don't even know, really, that hand that you put out, what that path of that person was on that day or that month, or what they've lost or they're grieving or anything along those lines of something so simple as just being there without expecting anything in return, to help somebody and what that can do for for somebody else and to set the example for our kids.

Speaker 2: 2:21:34

Yeah, the kids part. It's huge's huge. Because, you know, I look back at 18 years ago. I I was a 16 year old kid. That was a father that didn't know about my traumas and didn't understand why I was so angry at the world and I was supposed to be there. There's no way, there's no way. And then now, 18 years later, now I have a beautiful baby girl that comes into the world and I'm over here trying to hold on to my relationship, like I'm putting myself through misery. Both of us are unhappy and I'm still putting it and I'm still like, oh, that's what families do sacrifice, sacrifice, right.

Speaker 2: 2:22:17

There comes a point where you have to pull out and I learned that the hard way and like, even in the medicine, it showed me like, okay, me understanding my daughter, I, I don't know what she's experienced, but by me being there for my daughter, now I understand my, my oldest more, me rushing to go pick up my daughter, cause she has a dirty diaper, me like me changing the diaper, me bringing comfort to this, this, this little human, this little baby girl. It's incredible, isn't it? Yeah, and, and I wasn't there, I wasn't there for my daughter, like that, her first heartbreak, her first, you know her, her bottle of burp me burping her like that, that connection, me understanding my daughter and what she like. Hey, this isn't normal for her. Hey, do this.

Speaker 1: 2:23:04

I didn't have that connection with my oldest and do you now, if you don't mind me asking, I mean, you're you got an 18 year old or 19,. She's right in that age, but have you had the opportunity to reconnect or is it?

Speaker 2: 2:23:16

So we're connecting, reconnecting on a slower pace, okay. Or my daughter wanting to change her last name before she walks down graduation aisle to her mom's name because I, I'm, I'm not, I wasn't there and that was a hard pill to swallow, but that did bring up like this, like I gotta respect her, I want to respect her, I want to, I want to make sure she knows that I hear her, but I'm not okay with it.

Speaker 2: 2:23:50

I'm not happy, as a father and especially being a girl, that you, you know that there's some hopefully a good guy yeah, it's gonna come and and that last name, your last name, is gonna change and for that reason, because I wasn't there like that, just hit, hit differently and that's why I move the way. I don't want to relive anything like I. I know the fire's hot, I know the hurt that it's caused. Why am I going to continue that? Um, and with my daughter now, like you know, I'm going, I'm in the heap of it.

Speaker 2: 2:24:23

Right, people say, hey, I'm changing, I'm changing. Are you well like? What are you going to do when, when you are put in a fucked up situation where you are being tested, when your reputation is being destroyed, how are you going to react and respond? And I'm in the, I'm in the mess of it right now. I hadn't seen my daughter, for a restraining order got put on me. Uh, my daughter's mom is just so angry and pissed off and hurt that it didn't work. And it's because of what I've done as well.

Speaker 1: 2:24:58

This is your oldest daughter's mom, or your youngest, my youngest.

Speaker 2: 2:25:01

I've stepped out on the relationship when things have gotten hard. Cool, it's not going to work. I'm dipping that disconnect. It's not okay. That's not okay. And I'm not saying I don't want to get into the details of what she said, but these are some, some things that, like my prison belief system is like, and for me to experience what I've experienced, you just don't say these things I get it, man, but at the same time it's like are we, how long are you going to live in that, in that mindset?

Speaker 2: 2:25:32

yeah, no, and I had to. It's tough. It's probably tough for you. You've been programmed you know, but me to be aware of that and be like, okay, this isn't it, I can't react and respond to this right.

Speaker 1: 2:25:42

Those are huge steps.

Speaker 2: 2:25:44

And again people say, yeah, I'm a good guy, okay, Are you? Are you a good guy? Like, again, I haven't seen my daughter? And the restraining order gets dropped. The judge sees and hears what my daughter's mom's saying is like he's like. No, for the first time I went to court and I didn't even have to speak and like I had a paid lawyer and I had the evidence just to back my plate and and for the first time, I I I wasn't judged. I wasn't judged in this judge. I actually was like, hey man, like if it's not clear, it is clear now. I hope that you're, you're smart enough and just be a good dad. So we're going through this court process right now and she has to be served and she has 21 days to respond, but she's dodging the server.

Speaker 2: 2:26:31

And I went from. I was there when my daughter was born and I've been there every day since. I go out and travel, I do a lot of education, but I was there, I've been there right, and going from like full-time job, work, gym, father, father, father, father, father to not having my daughter, not feeling like'm, like I'm, I'm lonely right now. I'm lonely and it's not because I want intimacy with the. I know what an intimate relationship with my daughter is and me and my daughter's mom had been disconnected on a sexual level for a very long time, where that I'm not missing that, I'm missing this, this little girl, and it's just being a daughter. So I hadn't seen her in a month and, um, the restraining order gets dropped and, uh, I've been paying a child or a child daycare.

Speaker 2: 2:27:21

And I reached out to the daycare. I'm like, hey, is my daughter there? She comes Tuesdays and Thursdays. Like, is she there? And they're like, yeah, she's here right now. So I brush over there and I go in and I didn't know what I was doing yet. Well, I did. I didn't know what I was doing, I knew I was going to go over there and I was going to see my daughter and I knew I had every right to take my daughter and play this game that my daughter's mom's playing by by. Hey, once the petitions, the custody is established, then you can see your kid'm better than that. I'm a protector, I'm a father, right and? And for me to sit there. I sat there with my daughter, um, for like close to 40 minutes and I'm in tears and I'm just seeing my daughter. My daughter wakes up, she looks around, rubs her eyes and then she looks at me and the biggest smile this this little lady is is the only person in my life that's excited to see me like that.

Speaker 2: 2:28:17

It's such an incredible feeling and for me to take my daughter back into the daycare, not knowing when I was going to see her next. It showed me where I'm at in my life. It's not easy, Um, but I know. Right now I'm, I'm building and while I'm being destroyed on my reputation over here, I need to build even more and I'm good. I'm good because I know what type of man I am. I know when no one's looking and why. I'm a protector of this beautiful baby girl and I'm not going to match this energy from this hurt and this anger from another woman. No, I can't do that.

Speaker 1: 2:29:06

Ain't worth it. Ain't worth it, man.

Speaker 2: 2:29:09

So I'm good, it's good to feel, it's good to just be able to talk about it and just be like, yeah, cause there's not a lot of men out there that are going to say, hey, fuck, no, I gave into ego and I gave into my, my selfish wants, and I took my daughter and I I did what she did to me. It's not about me and her, it's about my daughter, you know so what's been your biggest lesson from that?

Speaker 1: 2:29:31

so, what's been your biggest lesson from that? Which part, from the time in to having a baby girl, to the battles you're doing now like what, what's been your biggest learning? Because I mean, dude, you got, you got a history man, you got a past, and I'm sure people were just wanting to throw that shit around and and use it against you. But having all of that and learning and going through the fucking trenches to be able to go to school, get licensed, start building a business, and then you're. You've gone all this, but it's that that baby girl, man, that's those are the greatest lessons, or the greatest gift that we'll ever have. Like, what's been your biggest lesson of being able to control everything and stay level headed, and it's, it's it's not about the money, it's, it's about family and I never had that before.

Speaker 2: 2:30:21

I never had, um, a male figure to come in and what's crazy is like. Again, I know what it's taken for me to get to where I'm at and I know a lot of people aren't going to go down that path. Even doing ayahuasca like again, some people can't even look, be honest with themselves, like for me right now. I understand that family is important, the energy that I put out I will receive. I need to be cautious of what I bring into my life, who I bring into my life and what they have and need healed in their life. Like I don't want to be judgmental, I want to be. I don't know these women, men, the traumas, if you are not healing yourself and then you're getting into these relationships.

Speaker 2: 2:31:10

For me, I'm getting into the exact same type of relationships because there's things that I'm attracted that I'm not dealing with and I haven't. And for me to be honest and just like being in my head space now I know I'm not aiming to get within. That's not my goal right now. If it happens, cool. But I know with the energy that I'm putting out, I am going to attract some really good people in my life, absolutely so. The accountability part's huge, the just awareness, being aware of everybody in the room, not just my selfish ones.

Speaker 1: 2:31:43

Do you pray?

Speaker 2: 2:31:43

at all. So the ayahuasca a lot of people walk by faith, right Okay?

Speaker 1: 2:31:49

I know there's a God, okay.

Speaker 2: 2:31:52

I know there's a God there. I know there's a god. There's no, like there's no doubt. No, yeah, I, I pray, I pray and I go to church how has that helped you?

Speaker 2: 2:32:08

so in the darkest times I I've looked back and I'm like in the darkest times. I've looked back and I'm like in the darkest times in my life, even as a child. My mom's getting beat in the other room and I'm talking to somebody. I'm talking to God and I'm asking him why. And when I'm in these miserable spots I'm talking to and I'm asking them why. And then now life is like. This is why. This is why, like you, like, there's always lessons to be learned, and if I never went down the path that I went down, I wouldn't be where I'm at, I wouldn't know, I wouldn't have tried to dig in deeper, I wouldn't try to be the best man that I could be, the best father. I'm just open. I'm open and letting go is a huge thing, but God is good.

Speaker 1: 2:33:05

God is good. Can I ask you a personal question? Everything you've gone through and battled and overcome. When you look in the mirror, who do you see?

Speaker 2: 2:33:26

I see somebody. I see me for who I am. I see me without the tattoos, without the ego. I see me as a kid. I see me without the tattoos, without the ego. I see me as a kid. I see me. I see my fullest potential, my fullest capability. I see my struggles, but I don't let that define me. It's just. I see why I am the way I am. I love me Good man?

Speaker 1: 2:33:54

Last question am I love me, good man? Last question if you could tell your mom one thing, what would it be if you could leave a message for her? She's been through a lot, she's watched her son struggle, she's raised six daughters and and you, if there's one thing that you could leave for your mom that you'd want her to know, what would it be?

Speaker 2: 2:34:15

That I love her, and it wasn't her, it was me. But it had to be done to get to where I'm at.

Speaker 2: 2:34:27

And not all the bad and hurt and chaos was for no reason. It would be for no reason if I'm not at this point that I'm at now, but I thank her. I thank her for believing in me when you know he almost killed this guy. He's a gang member, he's a drug dealer. And she said I see she believed in me and that's unconditional love. And I think just to understand that right there, that's something that I want to be, that's something that I want to contribute to my daughter.

Speaker 1: 2:35:04

Well, man, I see how passionate you are about your daughter and, as a girl dad, just be there for her. Yeah, about your daughter and, as a girl dad, just just be there for. Yeah. I know it's going to be shitty times and baby mama, drama and people trying to test you and your ego. Just put her first for everything and however you can help with your oldest and men, that might take years, man, just don't give up on that either, because holding the title of dad is is a lot different than holding the title as a father yeah, I've never understood it.

Speaker 2: 2:35:37

I never had a dad I never. I, you know. And now that I'm like, this is a dad, this me, walking around smelling like my, my daughter's, piss. That's me being a dad. It's not my piss, yeah, it's not my throw up, it's not my. I'm proud to wear these stains on my shirt from her, her nose you know yeah yeah, life is good, man, and I'm good damn dude.

Speaker 1: 2:35:59

You know you've lived a hell of a life man it was. It was incredible talking to you. Yeah, this was great. I, uh, I appreciate your vulnerability. I appreciate you just opening up and having this conversation with me. Like I told you in the beginning, I don't know where these go, yeah, um, but it it takes a lot for I feel like a man of your stature and look and appearance and everything to to to be real. I, I, I feel as our society and social and what a man is. I feel we're going too far Alpha, raw, raw shit. When I look at you and you you're able to sit here and talk about your vulnerabilities and your strengths and your weaknesses, and to me, as somebody that I've, you know, seen some shit and been around the world like that, that to me is a fucking man. Yeah, it's not some dude that's hard and goes to the gym and walks around with his chest puffed up ready to fight the world at all times, which I thought that was a man for a long time.

Speaker 2: 2:36:56

I think we all do.

Speaker 1: 2:36:57

Absolutely it's. It's it's chapters and phases and as we grow and mature, I feel the ones that are lucky. We see what really matters in life and those are our little girls or her kids, and taking care of whoever we can and helping along the way, man. So I want to say, from not knowing you, from Adam, except for this conversation, I'm super proud that you. You've made it out to where you are. A lot You're, you're the small side of statistics that are getting out of the system. There's not a lot of guys that could sit here and and be as proud and be able to talk about the things that you have and what you've accomplished, because we're how our system is set up. It is not in favor of anybody.

Speaker 2: 2:37:36

But, with that being said, you start taking accountability and start redirecting that energy and what you're doing, like you will win. You will win.

Speaker 1: 2:37:47

Absolutely.

Speaker 2: 2:37:50

For the longest time. I lied to myself and I played the victim and you got to let that shit go. Yeah, so, but for me to be here and be, I know again. I know my story is not something that everybody wants to go and share to the world, and I know there's going to be people that are like I don't know why he's up there, he looks like I don't care. I know that those people that are are right here and they're listening to me. Those people that are stuck in their addiction and they know that they're better than that, the the people that are in those cell blocks that are like nah, man, like I want to live. I don't want to just survive, I want to live, thrive. You know like I'm talking to them and the misery and happiness, like whoever's meant to see this, is that they're going to get something from it and that's.

Speaker 1: 2:38:32

that's what keeps me pushing. A hundred percent man Thank you.

Speaker 2: 2:38:36

Thank you for having me on.

Speaker 1: 2:38:38

I will have you on anytime. I even fucked this episode or podcast. I want to. I want to just sit down and get to know you more. I think you're an incredible dude man. This is. This was great to for you to be able to share everything, and it's not every day I get to sit down and talk to somebody and like like, feel good and have that conversation. You've been through hell and it's. It's been pretty cool man to be able to, to hear the little bit, the couple hours that we've been able to talk. I mean it's. I know there's so there's so much more to to you know coming.

Speaker 2: 2:39:10

It's beautiful when I'm going to be at in five years. This is the longest I've been out of prison. I do keep in touch with my homies locked up that are never getting out. I send them pictures and videos of my accomplishment. I'm sending them celebrity pictures that the SMP I'm doing on them. You know what I mean. I still keep in touch. Life is good. God is good.

Speaker 1: 2:39:36

Thank you.

Speaker 2: 2:39:37

It was a pleasure, man.

Speaker 1: 2:39:38

This was great. Yeah, Appreciate you. Thanks, dude. Yeah, Honestly, man, that was. I wasn't sure. You know, you never know. I wasn't sure.