Lead it Like Lasso: A Ted Lasso Rewatch Podcast

Leadership Lessons from Mom City | S3E11

• Marnie Stockman and Nick Coniglio • Season 3 • Episode 11

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🎙️ Lens of Leadership | S3 E11: Mom City

In this emotional and revealing episode of Lens of Leadership, Nick Coniglio and Marnie Stockman dive deep into Ted Lasso Season 3, Episode 11: Mom City — an episode full of second chances, parental reckonings, and rediscovering purpose.

🧠 What We Explore:

  • The Power of Processing Pain
    Ted’s surprise visit from his mother Dottie forces both of them to confront their long-buried grief, revealing how unprocessed emotions can impact leadership, parenting, and self-care.
  • Redemption and Second Chances
    Nate’s return to coaching is paved with humility, growth, and Beard’s powerful backstory. What does it mean to be judged by your weakest moment—or your strength when you’re given a second chance?
  • Jamie’s Identity Crisis
    Without his father’s approval driving him, Jamie loses his spark. But with help from Roy, Keeley, and Ted (plus a meaningful visit to his mom), he learns the leadership skill no one talks about: forgiveness—for others, and for yourself.
  • The Leadership Archetype of "The Caretaker"
    Ted and Dottie both show how helping others without caring for yourself can lead to burnout. Marnie and Nick explore how this archetype shows up in real-life leadership—and why it resonates so strongly with audiences.
  • Keely’s Growth and Motivation Shift
    No longer driven by appearance or fame, Keely is embracing a deeper purpose. We unpack the idea that fear of success can be as limiting as fear of failure.
  • The Power of Support Networks
    Jamie doesn’t heal in isolation—it takes Roy, Keeley, Ted, and even his mom to bring him back. We discuss how leaders need their own “Diamond Dogs” to thrive.

đź“š Bonus Takeaways:
Insights on trauma and leadership from psychologist Dr. Benjamin Hardy, how moms really do have superpowers (science says so!), and why “hurt people hurt people” isn’t just a throwaway line—it’s a leadership lens.

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SPEAKER_01:

Hi again, everyone. I'm Nick Caniglio.

SPEAKER_00:

And I'm Marnie Stockman, and this is the Lead It Like Lasso Podcast. We are the co-authors of Lead It Like Lasso, a leadership book for life, your life.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, and as you know, this podcast is an extension of many of the elements outlined in our book. We invite you to join us as we take a deep dive into each episode and explore the leadership principles as they play out in the series. And for today's episode, we're diving into season three, episode 11, Mom City.

SPEAKER_00:

Moms for the win.

SPEAKER_01:

Moms for the win. So I, you know, I've probably watched this episode 15 times, like all the other episodes, and I never I don't think I've ever correlated it back to the episode in season two, Man City. Um, because I'm so familiar with the Premier League and the soccer club uh Manchester City, it just it's like, oh, but as I was thinking about it, and as I was kind of reviewing my notes, Man City was all about the dads, right? That's when we find out that um, well, Jamie with his dad, he gets bullied, he gets beat up, right? And then we find out Ted, Ted's dad committed suicide. And this is this is really the season three version of that episode, except with moms.

SPEAKER_00:

You probably knew all of that already, but no, I got the title, Mom City was a parallel to Man City, did not remember that Man City was the dad one's good one.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah. So we we I think we sound like rookies of Ted Lasso, but we'll we'll kind of get through that.

SPEAKER_00:

We'll see what people tell us.

SPEAKER_01:

We'll see if we can redeem ourselves here. Um so, real quick, I think a couple of storylines that we'll just highlight at the beginning. Um, some that come to mind. Obviously, Ted's mom, Dottie, comes comes to visit. We come to find out. Um, it's a surprise number one, and she's she's a lot like Ted.

SPEAKER_00:

Yes. Uh Nate is gonna get his second chance by the end of the episode.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah. And Jamie, in in a Jamie Tart fashion, he's kind of going through an identity crisis that's um that's funny and and hard to watch at the same time.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, and then uh we end with the big cliffhanger of a truth bomb that doesn't get dropped.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah. We kind of know where it's going. We got a lot of hints during this episode of and really a lot of the episodes leading up to this, but um we're excited to talk about that next time, but let's let's focus on the moms for this for this episode. Where where do you think we should start?

SPEAKER_00:

Well, as a random aside, and speaking of moms, I heard yesterday that there have been some studies that um that kids are heavy sleepers uh and that they often can't hear fire alarms going off. But if there's just a mom's voice saying, Wake up, it's time to wake up, this is the smoke alarm going off, that they wake up to that. Something about a mom's voice. So I find that interesting for sure. But second, uh, as soon as Ted's mom popped up in this episode, I said, Oh boy, let's hearken back to season one. I love meeting other people's moms because they tell us why you're so messed up.

SPEAKER_01:

It's like an instruction manual to figure out why somebody's so messed up. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Thank you. Yes, exactly. So um love that kickback and not any leadership element, but I find it intriguing that at one point she says, No, I'll just stay and have some tea. You know how I love my tea, Ted. Oh, that's why Ted doesn't like tea, has nothing to do with tea.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah. But but at the same time, my goodness, I mean, that so he's re rebelling against that, but everything else that Dottie does in this episode is is like looking at a mirror with with Ted specifically, right?

SPEAKER_00:

And it makes him crazy to watch her do it. And I think the the the leadership element to think about there is that you often get annoyed with other people's uh character traits that most mirror your own because you're really judging yourself on that. It's really something you don't like about yourself, it's highlighting something about yourself that you don't appreciate. And this entire episode is Dottie taking care of other people and not doing the self-care to take care of herself. And what do we talk about in all of our Lita Like Lasso workshops that we do? That that archetype, right? We give an assessment, the people that find out they're Ted, what we know one of the big weaknesses is that they care about helping others about everybody else and self-care.

SPEAKER_01:

Not yeah, and and they both come to you know, I I think they both they finally get it all out. Of course, Ted's been working with Dr. Sharon to kind of to kind of reveal this. Um, but in in this episode, I I think they they both finally talk about it, the old thank you and and F you and um things like that. But you know, I the other thing, and it's it's similar to what you just said, but they they are both doing something, and again, this is very much in line with that archetype, right? Is they're they're hiding their pain behind cheerfulness. And um I I think it's it's similar to what we say, they're always taking care of everybody else and not themselves, but it's different at at the same time. And I think that is again fairly common with this particular archetype because of the reasons that they're not focusing on self-care, they're talking, they're focusing on everybody else. So it's just another another indicator in my mind of of this particular archetype that we don't talk as much about. But um, I think it's funny because you and I both know because we do a lot of keynotes, and as part of the keynotes, uh when we when we do the character assessment, and just like you said, um the Ted Lasso archetype comes up, people identify with this almost immediately. It's one of the strongest indicators for sure.

SPEAKER_00:

The other thing that really came to mind is that, you know, when Ted and his mom finally go at it, it's with some strong thank yous and F you's, as you said, five of them, I believe. And uh I had heard recently from Dr. Ben Hardy that trauma is um is something that is unprocessed when it when a negative event happens, trauma occurs when you do not when you're not able to process that and that event with a caring adult. So not every bad event becomes a true trauma in your life if you're able to process the event with a caring result. And what is Ted so mad about with his mom, right? And I'm sure in talking to Dr. Sharon, yeah, uh, because Dr. Ben Hardy's a psychologist, so this is where he has probably learned that you need to process these things, and he's so mad with his mom because she never talked to him about her feelings and his feelings. And that's why the pan that is part of the panic attacks, because there's unprocessed grief that they need to work through. I just find that I don't I was surprised when I heard that definition of trauma because a lot of people are are quick to call things traumatic. Um, but in fact, you can put that in a place where you can deal with it, and it was bad, yes, but it doesn't have to be a debilitating trauma if you process it.

SPEAKER_01:

I think that's that's so well said, and I I think back to and this is the way it was framed in this episode specifically, right? Where Dottie says, you know, I just pretended I was okay, and I I and that was, as you said, the the lack of you know, having an adult to process this with Ted. But how many times as parents do we kind of take the stance, and at least I did, and you may not have been this way, but where instead of talking through something that's gone wrong, or especially when it happens to you or or the family as a whole, you pretend like things are okay because you think that's the right thing to do. Um, but if you add on what Dr. Hardy just said, right, clearly that's not necessarily the right thing to do. Yeah. Right. I mean, you you should process things because you're teaching your children to process those things in the future when they need to show resilience and deal with things. So I think that's that's a very, very big point you just brought up there.

SPEAKER_00:

And speaking of that, where does Jamie go to process what he's working through?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah. And you know, so I I I see this as the segue, smart move there, into the the Jamie storyline. Um the first thing that I'll I'll say to this is so clearly Jamie has has lost his motivation. Um, I think that's that's the big message here. And and we come to learn that I think he even says in this episode, right, he's like, I'm not I don't really care what my dad thinks of me anymore. Although there's there's a little bit of conflict with that as the episode plays out, but that's kind of the basis in terms of why he's in this rut. Um, but I just think back to it wasn't just a couple of episodes ago where Rebecca went through this exact same uh issue where she she came to the realization that Rupert was not getting revenge on Rupert was not her motivation. Right.

SPEAKER_00:

I still want to win, but not just to hurt him because I want to win for us.

SPEAKER_01:

But she was able to process it and run it, run with it and thrive with it, but but Jamie, Jamie sure needs some help with that.

SPEAKER_00:

Man, he starts out so meek and mild. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. I and I um I I love the way they the writers kind of demonstrate that, you know, whether it was uh, you know, with his hair and he didn't even use conditioner, or he he um you know, he talks about the old spiceman, I believe. There were there was there was a ton of metaphors in this that I I think was was just absolutely fab fabulous. Um but as we come to see through the episode, he has somewhat of a support network, and it takes every one of those um people in the support neck support network kind of each offering something a little bit different, but first it's Roy, and then it's Roy and Keely, and then ultimately it's it's Ted. Um, so so what are you thinking from a leadership standpoint with with Jamie's um?

SPEAKER_00:

First, I'm gonna add in there. Will comes in while Roy and Jamie are hugging, right? And as soon as Roy hears the door, he's like, You missed a good one, Will. You missed a good one. Um well I think it shows that you know, again, you've got this is an hour-long episode, but you don't have months to do the work. And one of the things that we have said about the show is it is brilliant, but it's processing of trauma or bad events from a psychological perspective. That's not how counseling works, it doesn't happen overnight. You don't go into one session with Dr. Sharon and everything's processed. So I think part of Jamie having to go to all of these different people or are the writers trying to show that it's not a magic turn on the dime. Oh, I said it, I got it out, we've identified the problem, I must be done. Right? It does, it's not that easy. So I think that's the first part of it. I also think you know, Roy yells and Beard says that's his love language, right? And that kind of throws folks off. So I think that at that point, Beard is saying, so let's pay attention to how everybody else deals with someone because they use different languages. And sometimes the person that can help you with one problem is not the person that can help you with all of the problems, and so Jamie's got to hear it different ways, you know, and each one makes them a little more receptive to hearing from the next person. But that was my thought is that that's why we say, yeah, lead it like Lasso, but maybe you lead it like Roy or Rebecca or Keely or Sam because everybody's got their own take. And when I was in the classroom, uh I had a supervisor that said, some kids will shine because you are their teacher, and others will not because you are their teacher. Because there you can't be all things to all people. Uh, and that always so you know it's it's the role of the teacher, the coach, to find the best way to be what everyone needs. But the reality of it is how many times have we said it throughout the show? The diamond dogs, right? You need a group to support.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah. So I think spot on with everything, of course. I I a couple of things came to mind with this, with this episode specifically. Um, first, they give us a little bit of foreshadowing because you know, as part of this process, um, you know, a critical part of where Jamie ends up is that he has to go home. And I think I think call back to the cliffhanger we mentioned out of the beginning of the episode. I think I think that's a theme that the writers were looking to to plant the seed. Um, and uh, you know, a lot of people talk about the tie-ins with Wizard of Oz and things like that. Um, but it's just one other thing that kind of reinforces that. Um uh a couple other things with this. Uh, what a unique relationship Jamie has with his mom. Yes. Um, a very unique one. Uh, but she's there to support him and she she knows how to communicate with him. Um, moms do have superpowers for sure, and it plays out in all sorts of different ways. There's no doubt about that. And yeah, the writers chose to a very interesting way to to show how that played out here. Um, but the big thing, I think, and Ted says this earlier, and this is a theme that's uh says this later, and and this is a theme that runs throughout the show. We saw it with Sam and his dad, you know, don't fight back, fight forward. Um, but the importance of um forgiveness, and that's that's really hard, especially with what Jamie, what we saw Jamie go through uh leading up to this. But um, it's important to remember sometimes that forgiveness is uh it's it's like the original uh performance-enhancing drug. I I think it it is something that um you know when you hold that grudge, when you hold that anger towards somebody, um it really limits you. Uh, it can get you in weird and different places. And the ability to forgive yourself is not about forgiving someone else, it's not about sometimes the relationship with them, and they point this out beautifully. It's about the relationship with yourself and being able to move on. And I think um, again, they've done it several times in this particular series, uh, so we're getting used to it, but it it kind of never gets old because it's it's a really important thing. It's a skill. I mean, it's it's literally a skill. And um I'm glad that uh in Jamie's case that he he figured out a way to do that.

SPEAKER_00:

So okay, so that reminded me of something else that I wanted to throw in, moving to Keeley if I can for a second. Sure. Um, you know, Ted specifically said um, if the same old motivations aren't working, maybe it's time you forgive them, right? And move on, basically find something else. So, what were Keeley's motivations before, as you know, someone who is famous for almost being famous? It was how she looks. It was all yeah, and then this time, a couple times in the show, Roy compliments her and she's unfazed by the compliment. She's not rude about it, she doesn't, but it no longer gets her excited and motivated to to do whatever it is Roy's suggesting. She's very excited to be able to help Jamie process because that's the Keely that she wants to be, right? The person that helps somebody, uh, not just for her good looks. So I thought that was an interesting play in there as well.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, and we get reminders and glimpses of the old Keely every five, six episodes when they're in a hotel and she has the uh the infomercial working and uh clearly how about the poster on Jamie's uh yeah, yeah. Well how about that poster of Roy Kent, a young Roy Kent. Oh gosh, the hair. That was that was hilarious. Um and then Barbara, of course, is not yet there because she was very moved by uh yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

It's good though, you know, we always talk about the power counterexamples. Yeah, yeah. Thanks, Barbara.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. All right, so um so I uh let's talk about Nate and Jade and Coach Beer. There, there's there's there's a lot there. I was, you know, we find out that um in this episode, Nate is really good at being a waiter. Um he's he's strategic in some peanuts, they'll get thirsty. Yeah, he's strategic in in every everything that he does. Um but uh we find out that he gets fired, and then we come to find out the reason he gets fired uh is because Jade um Jade is behind it, right? She threatens to reveal it.

SPEAKER_00:

The funny thing is, is he's not fired from uh Rupert, right? He left that, but he is fired by the person he loves, makes it happen.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, and you know what I what I pulled out of that is you know what I think the first couple times I watched it is like okay, Jay doesn't want her boyfriend, yeah. Um, you know, doesn't want to work with her boyfriend. But yeah, but really what she what she is saying, in my opinion, is that she knows what what Nate was meant to do. I mean Nate is it what makes him happy is coaching. And and this was kind of all right, I believe in you as a coach. It's time for you to it's time for you to stop wasting your time. Tough love in in this restaurant. Uh so I say I say bonus points for Jade and showing some some belief in in the person that she loves, right? But she believes in his abilities and she knows that he'll be happier. Um and I think I think that was well played by Nick by Jade for sure.

SPEAKER_00:

I I thought the funny little clip of a scene was when uh she walked in and Nate says, You want to know what's so magical about the penis? Or you're like, Do you think about uh you know work? And she says, I literally don't think about work. The second I think there's I I am very curious if in season four Jade comes back as any serious character in this, and if she finds a passion or if she's just gonna be continue to be sort of this counter example constantly. Yeah, maybe she and Beard can be friends because I feel like they've got some weird background that might be aligned.

SPEAKER_01:

They do, they do, and and I speaking of of the Jade Nate interaction, right after that, uh you know, uh Nate was writing his apology letter. Oh yes, to uh which was 60 pages long. I I thought that was uh that was absolutely brilliant. Um so there's a lot of there's there's a lot of discussion out there on whether Nate deserves a second, third, fourth, fifth, whatever chance that he's on. I mean, personally, are you rooting for Nate at this point? Uh what do you think?

SPEAKER_00:

Like Beard said, you should get a second chance. And and Nate's growing. Jade is good for Nate. He's talked with his dad. Uh, he is very good at what he does. Um, and I think he's been humbled and will come back stronger because of it. You know, I think you just like you have to people can't grow all by themselves. They have to grow because you've given them space to grow. And so we're all gonna have to give them a little space to grow.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, yeah. I, you know, um, we have for those that don't know, we have we have a newsletter called Work in Prague Pragmas, uh stolen from uh an earlier phrase from this this series. But you know, when we think about second chances, I I think it's important that, you know, and this doesn't just necessarily apply to leaders, but the really good leaders realize that everyone, including themselves, are a work in progress, right? Not or progmas, if if you say it that way. Um, and and the one line, and I have to read it because I I think it's it's such a powerful line, right? I hope that either all of us or none of us are judged by the actions of our our weakest moments um that Ted uses to kind of motivate Beard to get on board giving Nate a second chance. But so true.

SPEAKER_00:

That we have the strength we show when and if we are given a second chance. Is that right?

SPEAKER_01:

It's something like that. Yeah, I I can't read the the rest of my notes, so I cut it off there. Um full admission right there. I was hoping nobody would catch that.

SPEAKER_00:

Sorry. I just I appreciate where it was going. Go on. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

Um, but the reality is, and I I think it's what I take away from that is yes, I think we absolutely always have to realize that everybody is kind of a work in progress. Uh, but they put it in the context of everybody else, right? But I think as individuals, we need to give ourselves a little bit of grace and realize that we are all a work in progress, even ourselves, and sometimes go a little bit easier on ourselves when we when we don't do exactly the way the things that we should do, because that happens to us on a daily basis for sure.

SPEAKER_00:

At least maybe not throughout the line, hurt people, hurt people, right?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, no doubt. No doubt. Um Beard, we have come to find out that uh, you know, once hearing that full backstory, I get a little angry with Beard that he he he really, I mean, I I get it, he's kind of caught in that position where he he feels like Nate has done his best friend wrong. Uh, but of all people, after hearing that backstory, I I think Beard should have come across the line a lot quicker.

SPEAKER_00:

But he was being protective, right? Like it wasn't I don't think his intentions were to not give Nate a second chance. I think his focus was on protecting the man that he would run through walls for. Yeah. So I think Ted had to be clear that he was really okay with it so that Beard could let it go. Because if Ted said, you know, go with go baseball bat him in the knee, Beard would have done it, right? Because he's that loyal. So I think Beard needed to see for himself that it wasn't being disloyal to Ted by forgiving Nate.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. Yeah, I I think you're absolutely right there. Um anything else with this episode? I'm kind of working through my notes here. I mean, it was it was clear there was so much going on, and it's really set up for you know the final episode as we know it to be of the first iteration of lasso, but is there anything else that comes to mind from your end?

SPEAKER_00:

Uh I have been going through my notes. I think these were the those were the biggies um that I had written down. Uh oh, one more. Oh yes. When Keely goes to talk to Jamie at the hotel. And he says a suitcase is like a drawer without a home. Like, I don't know how you can make that statement sound so sad and melancholy, but by golly, your you know, heartstrings are being tugged by Jamie on that one. And then Keely tries a different route and says, if you win, you'll be on the uh precipice of accomplishing everything you've ever dreamed of. And then Jamie loses it the rest of the way. And you and I have seen from a leadership perspective, there's the fear of success. People talk about fear of failure, but fear of success is sometimes scarier, and that blocks people because then what? Right?

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00:

Um, so I know we've talked about that before with Simon Cynic's Infinite Game and other things, but I was I thought that was they didn't drive into that, but that fear of success is a very real thing.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, I I think spot on. There were a couple of lines that Rebecca said that uh just I thought either were funny or um on point or something to think about. You know, when she was talking when when Ted's mom was talking about stories, right, and and embellishing things a little bit like he was jumping on stage with uh yeah with Bruce Springsteen, uh you know, it was Courtney Cox, clearly. But um, you know, I I love when Rebecca says sometimes the truth can can ruin a perfectly good story. Um and that's that's true, but we don't want to start making up stories, and I that's a lesson, a parenting lesson that I've I've tried to impart on my son. But uh the other thing is, and this this reminded me of um, you know, when my parents would come to visit. So I I kind of saw it, but you know, when Rebecca says just give her one lovely moment of, you know, a memory to take back home. Um I think I think whenever you're dealing with family that may not be around you uh on a day-to-day basis, right? That's always something I think that's a val valuable lesson, right? You know, um, you know, memories are important. And and if you kind of reframe it in that way instead of the stress of seeing family, especially, well, this will air right after Thanksgiving. Yeah. Um but having a memory to take back home, if if you can just kind of reframe it instead of just thinking about the stress of uh dealing with family sometimes. Tactic seven. That's important.

SPEAKER_00:

Well, I'll throw out, as usual, another book, Priya Parker, The Art of Gathering. Uh, if you're if you if that resonated, right, think about getting that book because that really helps you focus. How can you make a gathering intent on sort of giving everybody a lovely memory uh the right way?

SPEAKER_01:

That's awesome. I think that's our uh whistle whistle. So game's over, but the leadership lessons keep on playing.

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah, they do. Uh, as a reminder, you can find us here, there, and every Effingware on social media at Leadit Like Lasso. Uh Nick mentioned we have our snarky uh satirical newsletter, Work in Progmiss. You can find that at workimprogmes.ai. And we would love for you to check us out on leaditlike lasso.com. Uh, subscribe, like, comment, all the things everywhere. It's super helpful, and we love hearing from you.

SPEAKER_01:

Yep. So until next time, stay curious, stay kind, and keep leading it. Like lasso. Thanks, everyone.

Head Shot

Marnie Stockman

Host
Head Shot

Nick Coniglio

Host