Paws, Reflect & Heal with Dr. Randy
This channel appeals to conscientious pet owners who prioritize their pets' health and well-being beyond conventional treatments. They are curious about holistic and integrative veterinary approaches and seek to understand their pets' behavior, nutrition, and health issues deeply. They value expert advice that combines traditional medicine with alternative therapies and want to be proactive in preventing and managing their pets' health problems. The channel resonates with those who view their pets as family members and are motivated to provide the best care possible through education and open-mindedness.
Paws, Reflect & Heal with Dr. Randy
Revolutionizing Pet Nutrition: Insights from Kay Stewart from Feed Real Institute
Summary
In this episode, I had a conversation with Kay Stewart from the Feed Real Institute and discussed the critical role of nutrition in pet health. We talked about Kay's journey into the world of pet nutrition, the importance of fresh feeding, and the offerings of the Feed Real Institute for both pet parents and veterinary professionals. Our conversation emphasizes the need for a holistic approach to pet care, integrating fresh foods and understanding the science behind pet nutrition.
Takeaways
- The Feed Real Institute offers courses for pet parents and veterinarians.
- Fresh whole food is essential for pet health.
- Veterinarians often lack time to discuss nutrition with clients.
- Kibble can be enhanced with fresh food toppers.
- Variety in diet is crucial for pets.
- Research supports the benefits of fresh feeding.
- Understanding pet nutrition requires ongoing education.
- Holistic approaches can lead to better health outcomes for pets.
Connect with Kay Stewart and learn more about Feed Real Institute
Website: https://www.feedreal.com
Instagram: @feedrealmovement
Chapters
00:00 Introduction to Pet Nutrition
03:04 Kay Stewart's Journey to Feed Real Institute
05:52 The Importance of Food in Veterinary Care
08:58 Feed Real Institute's Offerings for Pet Parents
11:52 Veterinary Education and Fresh Feeding
14:58 Understanding Fresh Feeding and Its Benefits
18:09 The Role of Whole Foods in Pet Health
21:06 Research and Innovations in Pet Nutrition
24:00 Practical Tips for Implementing Fresh Feeding
26:57 Conclusion and Future Directions in Pet Nutrition
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Products and Resources I Recommend
Microbiome Testing
Animal Biome - Gut Microbiome Health Test
Nutrition
K9 Natural
Other...
Yeah, and there's, you know, the uh when you mentioned chicken and rice, um, you know, in Chinese medicine there's there's uh a principle called thermogenic property of food. And a lot of times some of the hot meats that are considered hot lamb, venison, and sometimes chicken can can really make things worse on that score too. So I try to avoid those initially going back uh whenever I can. Um but that's a really good point. And you know, I I always cringe a little bit when I hear the the chicken and rice routine because it's everybody still does it. I mean, everybody still talks about it in veterinarian, and it's I know. Anyway. Hello, everybody, and welcome to Pause, Reflect, and Heal with Dr. Randy. Uh, we're gonna have another really exciting episode. A question that's always on my clients' minds and my uh seminar attendees is what do I feed my dog and uh or cat? And uh we're gonna talk a lot about uh feeding real today. And with me is uh Kay Stewart, who is from the Feed Real Institute. And uh Kay, tell us a little bit about what how you got there, what you do, and and then we can kind of get into what our conversation is gonna be about.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, thank you. Um my my story is a little different. A lot of people get into this because they had a dog that they could not heal and they went down this path. Um, for me, it was a career change. And so I've been a veterinary technician since the early 80s. I graduated from Purdue, and the majority of my career was spent in biomedical research. I was the associate director of the animal facilities at the University of Notre Dame, um, and where I was the voice for the animals, and that was a very hard position because of my love for animals, and um it so it didn't really align with my love for animals, but at the same time it did because I was their voice and I made sure that that they had the best life they could. However, that job abruptly ended in 2017, and I found myself at the age of 55 saying, okay, what next? Um, I floundered a bit and ended up in the human medical field right during COVID. Terrible choice, but it paid the bills. Um, and then I found this job in 2021 with the Feed Real Institute. Um, I had put in, I I just had to get back to my roots. I was I was bored out of my mind, and so I put in a search of remote and dog, and this popped up for Feed Real Institute for writer and researcher, and I'm like, oh my gosh, this can't be real. So I applied. Yeah, and um when Ruby, the the uh founder of Real Dog Box and the um director of the Feed Real Institute saw my resume, she said the same thing. This can't be real. So we connected yeah, we did. We connected and we talked and realized right away that I was a good fit because of my research and writing background, and they wanted somebody to do a lot of research and writing about dog nutrition. Because I was able to officially retire from the university, I have access to all of their databases, and so that has been instrumental in me being able to do these deep dives into these topics because all of those articles that nobody can access online unless you pay$50 or whatever, I can get into and really dig down and see if the studies are legit. I've had a lot of training on how studies are made and you know the stats and all of that. So that really, really impacted this position for me, and we just really ran with it. As soon as I started at the Feed Real Institute, we just kept pushing um our limits and decided that we wanted to go into the veterinary realm. Um, and that's why we have that professional nutrition course that is race approved for veterinarians. So we are really trying to get the veterinary professionals involved.
SPEAKER_02:Perfect, perfect. And it's so exciting because um I I want to just tell a little backstory about me. Um I um was classically trained in veterinary medicine at the University of Pennsylvania, stayed to do a rotating medicine and internship there, went to the Animal Medical Center in New York City, which is the largest veterinary hospital in the world. I am a visual learner, so if I see a case, I'll remember it. If I read about it ten times, I probably will forget. So uh having 60,000 cases at AMC, having 50,000 cases at the University of Pennsylvania, it was a no-brainer for me on absorbing a lot of the material. Uh came to Arizona to practice and found very quickly in my practice that I even though I had some incredible training, I was doing endoscopy, I was actually cutting backs for back surgery. There were no neurologists then, there were really no board-certified specialists uh anywhere in Arizona at that time. Um, but I found that I was putting out fires. I kept on feeling like I'd pick a medicine, I would do well by it, I would do great on the diagnostics, but I was never getting to wellness and health, what I call health spend. Uh so I went to uh Albuquerque to learn Chinese herbs because I met Dr. Andrew Weil, who uh a very famous integrative MD here in Tucson. And I said, well, you know, it would be great to have Chinese herbs to add to my armamentarium of what I'm doing in Western medicine. Only to find out that I had to learn Chinese medicine to apply those herbs, which then led to acupuncture certification, then led to uh rehab rehabilitation certification, which uh I love. Uh but in that process, I met a number of people along the way where I started learning a ton about supplements, vitamins, what is real, what is not real, um, but really the ultimate boil down to food. And you know, I tell my clients that every client that I see is an hour consult, and that's a luxury that I have being at my age and my experience level. But the initial 15 or 20 minutes is food. And what I know and you know to be the case is that 90% of veterinary clients want to understand what to feed their pets. Uh, six percent of that time is a conversation about food in a veterinary exam office. Many times it's a 15-20-minute exam, the veterinarian is under the gun because they really he or she did not have the time to get into the food conversation. And if it is a conversation, as you know, Kay, from your experience and mine, it's science diet, it's it's oil canine, uh, you know, and again, I don't bash these companies that you know, I think they try to do the best that they can in the world that they're in. But I quickly learned, as you know, that these are inflammatory products, these are not healing products. Uh, yes, they may put out the fire just like my medicines did, but they never really get us to wellness and longevity. Um learned about the dog aging project, long learned about the pedo obesity project, and so um I'm at a place where K is right in my wheelhouse because um this is so important. You know, when you look at the hierarchy of food, to me, you know, fresh old food is number one, and then it trickles down into the other things that I use. And actually, you know, I have to work in the parameters many times of what my client or pet parent can afford. And and sometimes some of this is not affordable, but some of most of the time it is when it's made sense of, like what the Feed Real Institute does. So I'm so excited that you're here because um this is such a great segue for my clients but and my patients, but but also I always learn from these these things too. So um so I'm I'm planning on doing probably some coursework with you guys, um, which I'd really love to do. Um, and uh and we can go from there. So um that's kind of how I got to this point.
SPEAKER_03:That's awesome. Yeah, I think um making pet parents realize that food is foundation, you know, that is where the foundation of health starts. Um, but at the Feed Real Institute, we always look to meet them at where they are. We are never going to shame you for feeding kibble. We're going to help you enhance it or improve it. Um, and so that's I think a big difference. There's so much criticism out there from people about real food, raw food, you know, there's just, and that's not what we're about.
SPEAKER_02:Right, right. And I I don't, you know, like I said, I don't, even though when I do my seminars and and wellness retreats and whatnot, I don't bash these other companies. I really don't, because uh, like I said, I think that in the in the realm of what they do, they do the best that they can. They've certainly done a lot of research, although, as you know, a lot of that research is slanted towards what they do. And so, and I've been in the medical research world also before I got into veterinary school, you know, and I learned the same things that you, you know, learned where when you were coming up through the ranks, that, you know, many of these studies are have a bias. Many of these studies have, you know, and they have to prove the point that they want to have they want to prove. And and so it's really important to weed out those things when you're looking at these things and read it, weed out them critically. And it and I'm so glad that someone like you can do that and offer that to the people that are on Feed Reel and whatnot. So that's that's very that's very exciting. Okay, talk a little bit about um what um feedreal institute offers and and and how does that look for the pet parent, but also maybe for the veterinary professional, the technician, the veterinarian, uh, those type of people too.
SPEAKER_03:So when I started at Feed Reel, we were basically creating a manual for the real dog box staff, and we quickly realized that this is stuff that the feed the dog parent needed to have. And so we developed this dog parent course, um, and it covers everything from all the nutrients that the dogs need and and then also how to put it together. So when I taught at the university level, my goal was to teach you how to implement what I'm teaching, and so that's what I carried over to the Feed Real Institute is we don't teach you just why to feed real food, but how to feed real food. And we have a lot of tips on how to do it on a budget. Um, so we have that for the dog parent. We also have a virtual DIY live workshop that I conduct two to three times a month, and you actually create bowls of food on the workshop with me guiding you. We go through a PowerPoint, we go through all the information of how to do each component of the bowl, why you're putting that in there, you know, tips and tricks and budget options, and we just have a great time. Um and so those are really, really good for the dog parent. Plus, we have all the articles that are on the feedreel site, which is over 200. And so a lot of those are free, especially the ones that get you started. The more in-depth ones are behind a pay gate. Um, but there's some options there too. You can join the feedreel membership for$9 a month and have access to all of that material. So then we decided that we really wanted to get the veterinary community online. And by creating a course that mirrors the dog parent course, I used the same outline basically, but just really beefed it up for the veterinary professional and got it race approved. Now, race approved it means that it is approved for continuing education credits for the veterinarian and and veterinary technician for 10 CEs, and every vet and every vet tech has to have CEs to maintain their license. So that's incentive for them to take the course and learn about fresh feeding. So that's really helped us. Um, and that was not an easy process. I am not a board certified nutritionist.
SPEAKER_02:Right, right. Right.
SPEAKER_03:So I put the app in and they're like, who are you to teach this?
SPEAKER_02:Right, exactly, exactly. I was gonna I was gonna mention that, but good good for you to say that, yes.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, so it took about nine months for me to get it approved. Um, and I had to either have endorsement from two board-certified veterinary nutritionists, which nobody would do. Um, and so then I went out into the PhD world and found two nutritionists that formulate species appropriate diets for zoo animals, and they're the ones that endorse me. So by reading everything about me and reading the course, they endorsed that I was qualified to teach this course. So that is how we got our race approval. And we've had race approval for almost three years now.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and I, you know, as I've mentioned in many of my podcasts, um, when I speak to the public, um, I've been asked to speak at a number of veterinary meetings per se, true veterinary meetings, either veterinarians and veterinary technicians. And um, you know, the thing that's frustrating for me is with foundational medicine, with integrative medicine, um, you know, a lot of a lot of these people think that I bang on drums and burn incense, and that's how I get to my, you know, or you know, or my crystal ball, which I tell people broke a long time ago. Um, but you know, um the public is so thirsty for this. And the the pet parent, you know, I love pet parents because they're so enlisted in what's going on for their pet. And, you know, I have slides about cancer rates and you know, all the things that you know you want to have a little bit of shock and awe because you want people to understand that this is critical. Um, but I think the thing that I love, you know, when I have a conversation in a room about feeding, you know, the some of the hardest things, and one of the things I say a lot, and maybe this will change it when I do your course, is uh, you know, balancing these these feedings, um, you know, making sure that we have the right calcium levels, the right vitamin D levels, so many of the the nutrients. Um, because I get people to come in and say, Oh, yeah, I'm feeding, I'm feeding uh fresh fruit, and I'm giving them hamburger, and I'm giving them some steamed vegetables, and that's what I'm doing. And I go, Well, you know, I'm not an expert on this, but it doesn't sound very balanced to me. So, and if I feel that way, I'm sure it's not. So I'm so excited that you have that ability to do that. So that that's great.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, and so the professional course, and even the dog parent course goes into it. Um, but the professional course really goes into how you can talk to clients and teach them that. Because one of the things I found when going to veterinary conferences is that veterinarians will tell me that they're feeding their dog raw food, but they won't talk to their clients about it because they're afraid that they won't do it correctly. So that is um one of the things that we really harp on. And for one thing, you have to think about how we eat. We don't eat off a spreadsheet and worry about micronutrients being to the micrograms of each nutrient. So we don't teach that. We teach to balance over time, and we have components that you have within the bowl. But those crucial ones, like you said, is calcium. How do you get calcium? You give them raw meaty bones, you know, and people are like, bones! How do you give dog bones? I mean, I'm sure you've had this conversation.
SPEAKER_02:Oh my god, almost every day.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, they have to be raw meaty bones, and these are bones that are flexible and um malleable, so the dog can chew them and then their digestive system can digest them. We're not talking about cow femurs and big knuckle bones, those are recreational bones that they can gnaw and get the fun food, the scraps off of, and then you take those away because those they can break their teeth on, right? So we talk about that difference all the time. We're talking about chicken bones and rabbit bones and and the small rib bones from the cow are great for some of the dogs. And we talk about how to choose the right bones for your dogs and where to get these bones. Um, and so yeah, we give them, you know, raw-meaty bones have to be in there, good quality muscle meat. You have to have organs in there, liver and some other kind of secreting organs. And we talk about what that means. Like a heart in the body is an organ, but as being fed is a muscle meat. So we go through all of that. Um, and we go through that with the course, with the workshop. Um, we also have lunch and learns for veterinary clinics that just an hour-long session that they can get on board with. Um, and so we really try to show all those components. We we talk about fish as one of the components uh with the real ancestral diet, and that is because of the omega-3 fatty acids. Those are so important. You talked about inflammation, about those inflammatory kibble um diets. If you get some omega-3 fatty acids, even with a kibble diet, you're gonna balance that out better and reduce some inflammation. So we put we recommend fish in every dog's diet, and then some kind of fiber, and that can be fur. We say that fur works really well for some dogs that will eat furred items because fur has a lot of trace minerals in it, and their body can break it down enough to get some of those minerals out. Or low glycemic fruits and vegetables work too. Yeah, so variety, yeah. As I say, variety and and sourcing is what we really, really push for balance.
SPEAKER_02:Sure, sure. Yeah, on the on the medical side, um, I um I do some things that of course a lot of conventional veterinarians don't do as far as testing. Um, I'm very, very big on food sensitivity or allergy type things. And the other side is I've worked with biome for over 10 years, and um I do a lot of biome work and fecal microbiome transfer and and whatnot. And you know, by doing this and then incorporating what you're talking about as far as getting that real food, um, we solve so many problems, and I know we're gonna talk about some of these disorders as we go forward, but um, there's hope, you know. When I get the allergy dog that's been on Apaquel and Atopica and Benadryl and Prednisone and every you know single ingredient prescription diet, and they're still having problems, you know, they look at me and they go, why? And I go, because really no one has gotten to your foundation of what needs to happen for your pet so that we can correct this. And it's you know, it's not rocket science, but it's miraculous to see these animals in six months or a year. You know, I as I tell people, and I'm sure you know, you know, many of these problems didn't happen overnight. They're not going to get fixed overnight. I don't like the silver bullets of prednisone and whatnot because of all the side effects. But um it's amazing that you can get there through what we're talking about.
SPEAKER_03:I think it is, and I but I do you do need to emphasize to people that it isn't an overnight thing. And that's one that's one of the issues because they want it to be fixed tomorrow. Um a good example is like you said, for allergies. If you use the right herbs and teas, um, you can prevent allergies from happening, but it's not overnight, it takes the body building up to it. I I drink green tea every single day for allergies, and I went from taking allergy meds every single day of the year to maybe five days a year when it's really, really bad seasonally. And so, and I've talked to people about that, and like, yeah, I dried that last week and it didn't work. No, it's not gonna work in a week.
SPEAKER_02:Well, you know, we're all into instant gratification in American society, so it's uh it's a little bit difficult to overcome that problem. But uh yeah, I love the fact that uh you're absolutely right. These things can can really make a huge difference, um, especially over time and especially giving it time. And and you know, um one of the things that I mentioned to my clients is that some many times toxicity has to come out of our animal's body. And we'll see flares, you know, where their diarrhea has gotten much, much worse or their skin has gotten much, much worse. And the hardest part is, you know, holding their hand, saying, let's walk through this, we we'll work on this naturally. Uh, we're not gonna go to antibiotics, we're you know, we're not, you know, we're gonna, we're gonna, and we'll get through this and and it'll correct. And so um, it's very exciting in my life. I mean, I'm 72 years old, I've been doing this for 43 years, um, that I still enjoy what I do day to day and uh and love passing it on, and that's kind of why we're doing this this kind of thing too. So um, I know you also do workshops, um and you also, when you talked about your research articles, um, are you um tell our listeners you you're I'm sure looking at what's out there coming out all the time and seeing what would be applicable for your site and and what you guys do.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I am constantly looking at um between podcasts and articles, and that's how I found you, um, and just looking to see what is relevant at the time. And um, like one of the article series I'm working on is biohacking for dogs. And you know, I'm about done with that, and we're talking about all of that. You know, finding little things like I was doing research for joint supplements and found that cartilage is very has a lot of anti-cancer properties, and so you stumble upon these things, and that's not something I have read anything about in the dog world, but yet there are a limited number of articles in the human realm that they're showing that some of the properties that are in cartilage actually reduce the ability of tumors to produce um blood vessels, so that anti-angiogenic effect is keeping those tumors from metastasizing, and they're looking at that for human medicine, but we haven't heard of it in canine. So, by giving your dog these cartilaginous treats and you know, animal body parts, you may be able to help prevent the spread of tumors. I'm not saying it's a cure for cancer, but it's one of those natural things you can try. And um, so I thought, you know, those are the kind of things that I'll stumble upon. You know, I'm looking at my microplastics and nanoplastics in our environment and how they impact dogs. So I'm always looking for relevant things and ways that we can extend dog longevity through whole foods and you know how we can even, you know, you talked about detoxifying. How can we detoxify with whole foods and whole nutrition instead of going to medications? And so there's a wealth of information, and people will say to me, There's no science backing fresh feeding.
unknown:Right.
SPEAKER_03:There's so much science backing fresh feeding. And we actually have one article on our site that is just a list of 25 articles to quickly go to and prove to you that there is science behind this.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, yeah. And that, you know, that's so critical because um, you know, obviously I get a lot from the veterinary community that, you know, there's no double-blind study on on what you're talking about. And, you know, some of it, of course, is experiential medicine, evidence-based medicine. And you know, some of it is there is science, but digging it out, like you know, you know, you do have to find little bits and pieces that you can utilize that make sense, you know, and some and will back up the things that you know that that we're talking about. So it's fabulous that you have those offerings. That's that's great. So let's talk a little bit about fresh feeding. Define that for us. What does that look like? Um, talk about maybe some of the categories uh of that. Um, I know you know, I know you and I could talk about this for probably three hours, but uh or maybe more, but uh tell tell our listeners a little bit about that.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, so at the Feed Reel Institute, like I said, we never kibble shame. We always say that you know there's ways to improve kibble, so that we can start with that is by adding kibble toppers. And that can be any components of the fresh food diet. That can be adding raw meaty bones to the dog's diet. Um, if we do that, we recommend that you do that separate. You give them their kibble in the morning and give them a bone later on so that their body can adjust to a different type of digestion. But if you want to transition to a fresh diet, that can either be raw or it can be gently cooked, and that really depends on your own preference or your dog's preference. My biggest takeaway in every workshop that I do is you are feeding that dog in front of you. I've given you all these tips, and then you need to see where they apply for your dog. Every dog is different, and so a PMR diet or the prey model raw that just consists of bone, meat, and organs may be great for your dog. Um that may be all they need. And that's where you'll see these um meals that say 80-10-10. So that's 80% muscle meat, 10% bone, 10% organ. And so those that could be fine for your dog. Other dogs need that vegetation. Um, and it really is what's your fooding feeding philosophy? Do you think dogs need that that vegetation? And so that would be the barf diet, that biologically appropriate raw food diet for your dog that includes 10% of the vegetation. And then the real ancestral diet that we promote is addition of 10% fish, which you take out of the muscle meat category, and then making sure that you have that fiber component, and that can be the low glycemic vegetables and or fur. And that just kind of rounds out all of those different um categories of nutrients. The other thing we really, really stress is variety. You do not want to find one diet that works, and that's what worries me about the um spreadsheets because you can work so hard to find that one diet that works and everything's in order, and you don't want to stray from it because it took so long to figure it out. Um, and so variety is so key. So every month or every couple of weeks, you change up what proteins you're putting in there, what organs you're putting in there, what veget vegetables, you know, just have a really good variety of uh food for your dog, just like you feed yourself. Um and that's going to get hit all those nutrient points. Um, and then the other thing that we always recommend is working with your veterinarian for tracking, you know, running those annual blood tests, running um hair tissue analysis, and making sure the minerals are all there. You can do omega-3 testing now right from your home. You don't even have to have the veterinarian there. There's so many different things you can do to if you're worried about your dog's nutrient levels. But the other thing I tell people is hands-on, you pet your dog, you feel those ribs, you look at their shape, you weigh them on a monthly basis. That's gonna tell you what's going on. And then also having um watching what your dog your dogs poop. I mean, we talk about poop all the time at the Vedreal Institute. That tells us so much.
SPEAKER_02:So, Kay, we um we talked um a lot about um the different some of the different categories of uh real fresh feeding. Um, talk a little bit about, you know, obviously, our clients, you know, pet parents, listeners always have concerns, and you've mentioned there's two major ones. Let's let's talk a little bit about that because I think that will dispel a lot of myths for people.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I think one of the biggest concerns I hear from everywhere I go is bacterial infection, um cross-contamination. They worry about if you're feeding raw food that your dog's going to contaminate other people, um, they're gonna get sick, that kind of thing. And so we have a full article on that in both of the courses. But the bottom line is this dogs have lysosomes in their mouth, in their saliva, that actually break down bacteria. Their um gastric juices, the stomach acid, is high is more acidic than battery acid, and bacteria can't survive that. Um, and that they're just made for that. I mean, that's what their bodies are made to do. And so you use common sense. When I go in and food prep, which I food prep for two weeks at a time for two dogs, I go in and you know get everything done, I disinfect my entire kitchen, including washing my floor. It's just common sense that you clean. Um, and then you know, people will say, well, that'll take forever. I can do two weeks for two dogs in less than two hours, and that's from start to finish. And so once you get good at it, I I get it. I've been doing it for a few years now, and and it's it's just second nature. But those are the things you do. I wash the dogs and cats, bowl. I too do have two cats that we transitioned also to raw feeding. All bowls get washed after each meal. Um, I have a doodle, and so her face gets cleaned frequently if she has anything on that bearded, you know, part of her muzzle. Uh, you just do those kind of common sense. You keep the yard clean, especially if you have kids around. But I have seen more cases or heard of more cases of toddlers, especially getting sick from kibble than from raw feeding because kibble stays in that bowl, they go and play with it, you know, and and so I think that that concern can be mitigated. Um, you get high quality meats and proteins and organs, and it's all human grade, you're going to um have good products for your dog. And if you are worried about that, then gently cook the food. That's fine. Sear the outside of it gently so you're not causing a lot of overheating where it breaks down nutrients, but the outside's decontaminated if that's what makes you feel comfortable. Those are all ways that you can mitigate that.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, we get a big big pushback here in Arizona because of our heat, and you know, people are worried about you know um contamination because of the you know the heat prop problems that we have, obviously, especially like when you get shipped you know frozen foods and and whatnot. Um, and it is a concern because you know, um you can get a frozen box of something in in the middle of July here, and I guarantee you in two hours it'll not be frozen any longer just because you could cook an egg off the sidewalk, you know. So um I don't know if you get that in Nashville very much, but uh but you know, we see it. So, you know, it it it obviously we get a lot of pushback on that side.
SPEAKER_03:So well, and again, that's something you're gonna have to be aware of as the consumer. Of course, and and be expecting that that box. Or if you do it a DIY at home, then you go out and get everything yourself and you have total control. That's what I love about doing it yourself and making your own meals and putting those components together because you have total control over that. And I think that that's a big issue.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and and um also just the other concern that I get is I have an awful lot of working people that I see, um, and their concern is not having the time to do it themselves. Through the coursework, you have recommendations for uh prepared meals and whatnot. Is that is that is that right?
SPEAKER_03:Right. We we teach you how to do it, not only um easily, but on a budget also. So people that are conferred concerned about money. I spend about$75 a month on my 40-pound dog. And that's with all fresh components. Um and I have found a co-op. I have to drive an hour away, and I plan ahead. So I buy two months worth at a time. I go and get everything there, and like I said, for about 70, I've spent about$125 a month for the two dogs. So it's a 30-pound golden doodle and a 40-pound Aussie doodle. And to me, you can't buy good kibble, if you will, for that. Um, and so you can do this on a budget. And we have so many tips that we give during the workshop of how to find good products a lot cheaper, you know, making relationships with farmers, and that's one of the ways I do it, you know. Like I get all the free turkey and chicken heads from my one friend who raises them, and when they harvest, she keeps the heads for me and gives them to me for free because they're gonna throw them away. You know, so there's so many ways you can do that. And as far as time goes, like I said, I do two weeks for two dogs and two hours. Um, so it's 28 meals. And so you just set that time aside. Every other Sunday, I know I'm gonna be doing food prep. And I just, you know, put that time aside and make sure that I have it done. So I think it's doable if you are committed to it. And you need to, you know, if you want to and you if you enjoy it, I love doing food prep. I have fun doing it. Um the dogs waiting there for me to drop something, you know, I've come in and of course, of course.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I'm sure the cats are also very interested.
SPEAKER_03:The cats are outside. I could not have the cats inside. They're there, I have a screened in deck and they're outside. They're my daughter's cats.
SPEAKER_02:And yeah, we don't have that luxury in Arizona very often just because the predator situation here is so bad. So we have people screened in. Yeah, we do have people have katios, which is great.
SPEAKER_03:So I'm that's exactly yeah. Yeah, and that's exactly why we did it.
unknown:Sure.
SPEAKER_02:So the other thing I want to ask you is uh the other concern that you mentioned when we talked is nutrient imbalance. And talk talk a little bit about that.
SPEAKER_03:Okay. So again, we talked about um this the components that you need to put in there. So you need you need bone, you need muscle meat, you need liver and some other secreting organ, you need um fish if you're doing the ancestral diet, and then you need some type of fiber. And by mixing those up and giving a variety of meats, uh giving a variety of bones, giving a variety of different even different fish. Um, will like I give sardines sometimes, I give um smelt, I get anchovies, I get, you know, whatever I can find. And other places that you can really find really good fish options is ethnic markets. And you'll find some unique um proteins there too. And they're usually more inexpensive than at your big uh box stores. So those are ways that by rotating what you're feeding, you're gonna be hitting all those different nutrient points. Shellfish have a ton of great nutrients in there. Um, zinc is one of the things that people worry about. Feeding oysters is a huge um way to a really easy way to feed zinc. But the other thing is if you're getting high-quality meats, especially grass-fed, grass-finished meats, they're going to have more of the nutrients in them too. So just rotating all of those around and getting all the different types of meat, different types of proteins, you're going to hit all those different nutrients. And that's what I said earlier. I don't like when people fixate on one recipe because you're, and yes, maybe you're hitting all those nutrients, but the bottom line is you really don't know because every time you get a new crop of beef or chicken or whatever, they could have a totally different nutrient profile.
SPEAKER_02:Sure, sure, makes sense. So we did have um a couple listeners that uh emailed us before the show, and one of the questions that came up, um, if you don't mind addressing, is um they were looking at some of the frozen, lightly cooked meals that are delivered. What what's the Feed Real Institute's position on that, or what's your what are your thoughts on that? I should say.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, my thoughts are there's some good ones out there. Um but you need to be comfortable with the manufacturer because you you know we keep seeing all these um issues with raw food. Yep. A company should be very transparent on what they're doing. Um, I refuse to give my dog synthetics because the synthetic vitamins and minerals are just not processed properly in their body.
SPEAKER_05:Right, right.
SPEAKER_03:So looking at those, um, I know there's a couple of them that we partner with at the Feed Reel, one of them is Ever Evermore, and one of them is goodness gracious, and both of them avoid using any synthetics. Um that's something I look for. But transparency is the big thing. You know, if you call and talk to them and they say, Oh, well, we don't want to go into that because that's proprietary.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, yeah. You know, hang up. Got it, got it, got it.
SPEAKER_03:You know, everything should be extremely transparent. So that's my my take on that. I mean, I get it. It if you don't have time, some of those, you know, um commercial diets are good, but you have to look, are they still putting a ton of carbohydrates? Some of them are still putting a ton of carbohydrate fillers in there, and that's one of the bad things with kibble is the the level of carbohydrates. Oh, dogs don't need those starchy carbs. That's what's causing all this inflammation. So you just need to do your homework on that and figure out which one works for you.
SPEAKER_02:Perfect. Thanks for answering that. Um, we have a little bit of time left. Let's talk a little bit about some specific conditions. Uh, maybe you could you could address that. Uh let's first talk about your skin and allergy because obviously that's a huge uh proportion of what I see in my practice.
SPEAKER_03:Absolutely. I think um with the skin and allergy issues, getting to fresh food really, really helps because you're dropping that inflammation down. Um kibble has really high levels of omega-6 fatty acids, which are inflammatory. And so by getting omega-3s in there and just bringing that inflammation down, that's huge right there. But like you said, a lot of them have been on these um elimination diets and they they still can't figure out what's going on. So, what you're talking about is getting that testing done can help. But elimination diets, I found one article that showed that they did DNA testing on these diets, and they were totally opposite of what the bag said. You know, it was supposed to be kangaroo and fish, and there was chicken and beef in there, you know. And so the poor consumer is trying so hard to figure this out. So, again, a fresh food diet, you know you're just giving beef or you're just giving turkey or whatever protein that you're giving, and you have so much more control. And so that to me is uh, you know, why we can really control this with uh the allergies. And by providing extra omega-3 fatty acids, you're giving the skin the foundation it needs to create a good skin barrier, create a good skin microbiome. You know, you don't want to keep disrupting that microbiome on the skin by constantly bathing and giving all these products. Um, so that's why I think the whole diet, the whole food diet, really works well with allergies. You can pinpoint what it is your dog is actually allergic to, which in most cases is very minimal. It was all the fillers and dyes and you know, palatins and all of that that they were actually allergic to.
SPEAKER_02:Absolutely. And you know, I find that um, you know, to jumpstart some of what you're saying, again, when I work on microbiome itself and get some DNA analysis and whatnot, I can jumpstart that a little bit. Uh, but only with the proviso that we go to this, what we're talking about, we've just talked about for the last 35, 40 minutes. Um because you know, without that, we're really missing that piece. You can't, again, it's like not a you can't just give a pill or do an FMT procedure and correct the problem and have it last.
SPEAKER_03:It's just you have to support that microbiome to make it last long term. So and that's why with people that you know can't give up kibble, the first thing I tell them to is we're gonna add fish to the bot top of that bowl then. If you consistently add a good amount of fish, you're gonna balance those fatty acids. And right then and there, you're helping the inflammation. And that inflammation impacts not only the skin, but also the joints and cognitive health. So you're you're you know, and a myriad of other things too.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, absolutely. Um we've talked a little bit about biome. Let's talk about GI disorders. Um, you know, again, another huge proponent of what I see in my practice. So maybe you could talk about that for a minute.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I think the hardest thing that I've seen, I had a a colleague that had a um a doodle that every three months was at the vet with the GI issue. Every three months she was putting her back on metronidazole. Every three months the dog it was just and I and I tried so hard. I had just started at the Fed Real Institute and really, really tried. And oh, I I you know I I trust my vet and this is what she recommends. And they put the dog down because of this. And I it was just so oh, it was heart-wrenching. Yes, and so if you can get that microbiome corrected with whole food and maintain it that way, it's so much better. I mean, even that that case of okay, my dog has diarrhea, well, give it chicken and rice. That is old, old school. Rice is so inflammatory, there's no nutrients to it. So, you know, we go into the whole thing of you know, fast that dog for eight to twelve hours, bring it back on some, you know, bone broth and some really soothing things for the tummy. There's a bunch of um herbs that you can use. I love slippery elm or marshmallow root to keep in my house to help control that. Sure. And you know, slowly bring them back to bland proteins, some maybe some puree pumpkin, you know, stuff like that that can slowly heal that GI tract and then get them back to a good uh diet. I mean, all of our dogs. I my dog, when I was gone last year, my daughter reached out to me and she's like, Um, she's been vomiting and having diarrhea for the last eight hours.
SPEAKER_04:Right.
SPEAKER_03:Well, you know, so I'm 2,000 miles away trying to diagnose it, and and we got her back, but she had found a toad and she had picked the toad up and it just destroyed her GI tract. Um what did we do? We fasted her for 12 hours, start giving her a little bit of water, and slowly brought her back with bone broth and some some uh really bland whole foods. Sure. 24 hours later, she was fine.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, and there's you know, the when you mentioned chicken and rice, um, you know, in Chinese medicine, there's there's uh a principle called thermogenic property of food. And a lot of times some of the hot meats that are considered hot lamb, venison, and sometimes chicken can can really make things worse on that score too. So I try to avoid those initially going back uh whenever I can. Um but that's a really good point. And you know, I always cringe a little bit when I hear the the chicken and rice routine because it's everybody still does it. I mean, everybody still talks about it in veterinary medicine, and I know. Anyway, we won't go there, but but we both know. And you know, if I never saw um another dog on metronidazole, I'd be so happy.
SPEAKER_03:So I tell you, that's just so disheartening.
SPEAKER_02:And when I tell people, you know, that you know, that antibiotic was created to wipe out your bacteria flora so bowel surgeons could go in to your abdomen, and if they spilled something, you wouldn't get uh peritonitis, you know, and that was kind of where it came from initially, you know. So wiping out all of the bacteria is not a great idea.
SPEAKER_04:Not a great idea, right?
SPEAKER_02:Um, so I see a lot of rehabilitation cases, and so we see a lot of joint pain uh and and joint cartilage type disorders. Of course, the whole cruciate ligament, you know, is such an epidemic in in our dogs and whatnot. And so maybe you could talk about that for a second.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I think we can address that in in uh multi-ways, but one of the things I like to remind people is if you have a really active dog, don't wait until their joints are shot, you know, start supporting them young. I give my dog uh cartilaginous stuff all the time because that's gonna have the cartilage, the collagen, the glucosamine, and the chondritin all in there to support those ligaments and tendons. Manganese is huge for those ligaments and tendons. And I think that's one of the things they're finding with these CCL dogs that they're a lot of them are deficient in manganese. Um so that's where we're talking fur is such a good way to give them manganese. But there's also other ways. Um, mussels have a lot of manganese, especially green lip muscles. Um, tripe, green tripe has a lot of it if you can give your dog tripe. Um, and even some of the really good quality meats will have a lot of manganese in the bones. So just those whole food nutrients are going to provide for those joints and ligaments and tendons. And and start them young. Don't wait until your dog is and you know and in need, you know, which I think most people do.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Yeah, and and you know, we you know, we we so harp on omegas here because it's so dry in Arizona, we have no humidity, and and uh and so you can see it in in, you know, as I tell people, the coat is a mirror to the inside of the body. Um we see it so often in excess nonessential shedding and and you know, white flaky skin, and and um obviously with you know all the joint issues. So it's it's great that you talked about that. I think that's wonderful. And I and I think we also want to make sure we mention that what you're mentioning is basically um, you know, when you talk about manganese, we're we're not talking about supplementing manganese as a synthetic. We're talking about okay, good. I just want to make sure that's the way because you mentioned that before, but but the first thing someone's gonna say to me is, well, can I go to like you know Whole Foods or Sprouts and buy some manganese? And yeah, okay, good, good. No, good. Um, you know, the obesity thing we we've talked uh you know, we've mentioned really because of all the carbohydrates. Right. Um, you know, it's such an epidemic. You know, I love the fact that the one thing I think I saw from the pet obesity uh work is that um 60% of our animals and you know are overweight, but when you ask the client, six percent of them will know or admit that they think their animals are overweight. And that's so true. That's so true. One of the hardest jobs I have is staring across you know uh the floor. I don't use tables, my animals are all on the floor, and and staring across the floor and looking at two clients that are very overweight, and an animal is very overweight. And you know, like I had a dog yesterday, it came to me, it was recommended to have bilateral TPO, so TPLO surgery for its cruciates, and it's um honestly, the dog weighed, I would say 90 pounds. It was a 45-pound dog.
SPEAKER_03:Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_02:But the surgeon surgeon never discussed weight. You know, they just wanted to go in and fix the cruciates. And I said, you know, please, please, please. Even if you decide to have that surgery, which I don't think you need, um, let's work on the foundation, let's get the weight off of your pet because we'll get so much further along. And the surgery will mean that much more if you really have to have the surgery. You know, most of our animals are coming here because we do the rehab, we don't, you know, they they don't want to have surgery. Right. Which works in our hands works great most of the time.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, and the obesity thing, and it's funny because I'm reworking some of our articles on that because some more new language has come out, and just really focusing on the health of the animal rather than the look of the animal, or you know, talking about it being fat or obese. No, the immobility and the pain and you know, focusing on those things. But you're right, you know, people I have a uh Aussie Doodle, she's 92% poodle. Um, and standard poodles are supposed to be very lean and have that nice, you know, hourglass figure, if you will. Um, and so people are always, I mean, strangers will come up to me and tell me my dog's too skinny. And I always always she's perfect, you know. Yep, and they just aren't used to seeing a lean dog. That's correct. So, you know, and I just you know tell them, well, you know, according to what I know, this is the perfect body score for her.
SPEAKER_02:And so um, we have a bunch of other things we could talk about. We're running out of time. So maybe you could just talk a little bit about cancer. And I know again, we could spend episodes on this. Right, right. Um, talk about the relationship of what we've been talking about with cancer prevention.
SPEAKER_03:Well, you know, cancer is an inflammatory disease. All of us have cancer cells in us, and our body keeps it from becoming cancerous. So by feeding the body correctly, um, you can mitigate cancer, you can keep it from taking over. And one of the key things is that cancer thrives on sugar. Kibble is just full of sugar. All those carbs break down to glucose, and that feeds cancer cells. If you switch to protein and fat and the body is is relying on those for energy, the cancer can't survive. They can't the cancer cells can't grow that way. Um, and so all of this inflammatory issues that we're talking about, and it also goes into diabetes, is another thing that we have a problem with with um all these carbohydrates on obesity.
SPEAKER_02:Yep.
SPEAKER_03:It's all linked together. So, yes, there's other things that are going on with cancer, genetics, toxicities, you know, all this other stuff. Maybe some of it you cannot control, especially the genetics, but you can control control the epigenetics, you can control how those genetics play out in your dog by properly feeding them. And so I think by giving all of these foods that have some anti-cancer properties, mushrooms are a huge anti-cancer additive that you can put in your dog's food, along with just a fresh food diet in general.
SPEAKER_02:Yep.
SPEAKER_03:There's a lot of things you can do to prevent them, or if you get the diagnosis, work with one of these holistic pet coaches that really go into all of these modalities, all these different food um additives that you can do to help the dog's body fight the cancer. Um so there's so much we can do for that.
SPEAKER_02:Sure. Uh it's great. And and you know, in my seminars, my my public seminars, we talk a lot about epigenetics and neutrogenomics, you know, Gene Dodds' term. And it's it's really fascinating how that affects you know what we're set up to be and and do. And and so, and uh, people love that because they they realize they can make a difference. And just like all of this, this is where we can make a difference in our own.
SPEAKER_04:Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, Kay, I can't thank you enough. I mean, this has been so enjoyable. One, I will see you in San Diego um this summer. It's it's in my backyard, so uh it's easy to do. And um, I will I I'm definitely looking forward to some coursework. Um, my time gets a little bit crazy as of course of what all I'm doing, but yeah, but that's okay. I I you know this is really important, and I'm looking forward to more learning more myself. Um, but everything you've said has been so um educational. Again, we're gonna post uh the Feed Real Institute uh contact information on the show notes and all that, um, and hopefully we'll have all of the follow-up. Um, but I can't thank you enough for for your time and and for for educating our our our listeners because it's just it's invaluable.
SPEAKER_03:That's great. It was very enjoyable. I love talking to you.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, thanks again. Hopefully, we'll talk soon.
SPEAKER_03:That sounds good. Thank you, Randy.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, thanks, Kay.