Hiss & Tell: Cat Behavior and Beyond

Leaf It Alone: A Cat Owner's Survival Guide to Houseplants

• Kristiina Wilson • Season 2 • Episode 31

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Ever brought home a beautiful houseplant only to discover your cat treating it like an all-you-can-eat buffet? You're not alone. The delicate balance between maintaining a green home and keeping our feline friends safe is something many pet parents struggle with.

Hiss and Tell welcomes plant and pet specialist Anastasia from Leaf & Paw to explore this crucial intersection of plant parenthood and cat guardianship. With over 200 houseplants coexisting with her pets, Anastasia shares practical wisdom gained from both personal experience and professional expertise.

Our conversation dives deep into which common houseplants pose dangers to cats—those trendy Monsteras and trailing Pothos might look beautiful on Instagram, but their calcium oxalate crystals can cause serious irritation if ingested. But don't despair! You'll discover a wealth of pet-safe alternatives that can satisfy your plant addiction without putting your fur babies at risk. From elegant Hoyas to dramatic Calatheas, there are plenty of options for the plant-loving cat parent.

Beyond just identifying safe and toxic plants, this episode tackles the behavioral aspects of why cats chew plants in the first place. Hint: it's usually not spite, but boredom. Learn practical strategies for redirecting this behavior and creating harmonious multi-species households where both your plants and pets can thrive.

Whether you're dealing with a plant-munching menace or a soil-digging troublemaker, this episode provides actionable solutions that respect both your love of greenery and your commitment to your cat's wellbeing. Subscribe now for more insights on creating healthier, happier lives with your feline companions.

Kristiina Wilson:

Hi and welcome to Hiss and Tell a cat behavior and more podcast hosted by me, Kristiina Wilson, animal behaviorist. Today we're tackling a topic that every cat guardian should know cats and plants. We all love bringing a little greenery into our homes, but did you know that some very common houseplants can be dangerous or even deadly for our feline friends? Stay tuned to break down which plants are safe, which to avoid and how to spot the signs of poisoning in cats. Welcome to another episode of hiss and tell. I am your host, christina wilson, and with me today is anastasia. She is a pet and plant specialist from Leaf and Paw. Welcome, Anastasia. Thank you for having me.

Kristiina Wilson:

You are very welcome, that seems like a weird thing to say in response to that. I'm already off to a great start here. What an idiot I am today. Okay, doing great. So can you tell me a little bit about yourself, about your background, how you started your business?

Anastasia:

So I pretty much had a full career by 27. So I'm older.

Anastasia:

So I will say that I graduated with a degree in art history, a long time ago, and then I co-owned a bakery, I worked in nonprofits, and then I worked in marketing and at some point I started to get into plants a little bit more. And then, for the heck of it, I worked at a greenhouse, like a plant store, a greenhouse for a summer, and I was like, oh my god, this is like. Plants are amazing, health plans are amazing. And so I was kind of like any woman in their 20s they're kind of feeling out what they want to do with their lives. And so I was an avid Pinterest user and I brought home a plant, styled it, and my little chubby black cat that I have her name is Harlequin. She ate one one day. She ate a part of it. It turns out it was toxic. A part of it, it turns out it was toxic, and so began a very deep dive into this whole idea of toxic houseplants.

Anastasia:

So this is back in 2017. So this is like really early before the houseplant movement.

Kristiina Wilson:

Again.

Anastasia:

I've been doing this a while and so I had all of this, all this information in my head still collecting plants, still very involved with plant safety. But I'm like I have to put this information somewhere. And so I began Leaf and Paw, my blog around 2017 and then really started to pick it up in 2018. It went completely viral by 2020. And I was like I couldn't believe that. I was like making money from this. So I quit my marketing corporate job in 2020. And in the middle of a pandemic very reckless, but it turned out to work out okay and then I kind of began doing my blog full time but also wanted more time outside. So I do like two different things. Now. I'm a like blogger still and I do consulting through like Leaf and Paw, and then I also do landscape design because I've always liked it and that like throws me outside, which is great.

Anastasia:

So I have like both both things going on and it balances out. I don't have to sit at a computer all day, which is the worst.

Kristiina Wilson:

So yeah, it's. That is that's tough. It's tough to sit at a computer all day. So tell me a little bit about your pets. I saw them on your blog, but everyone listening probably hasn't seen your blog, so let's hear about your pets.

Anastasia:

So I have I am pretty much an I only adopt and I usually get. You know the broken animals, you know the ones that come from, like the sad cases, and so because of that I always have a nice variety of animals in my house. So I have three cats. They all match. They're all black and white or all black, harlequin, harvey and Krusty All black, harlequin, harvey and Krusty. That's an amazing name. Yeah, she was a foster fail last year and she came to me completely crusted over and we fell in love with her and she's insane. So her name is Krusty and we never changed it. And then I have four guinea pigs, all rescues. And then I had a hedgehog who passed away last year.

Anastasia:

But I also had a little African pygmy hedgehog. I love hedgehogs, cute. It's still a very like. It's still a lot of animals.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yeah, I mean I can't talk to anybody about having too many animals. You know we've got 13 cats, so, oh my God, yeah, 13 cats and like a million raccoons outside and possums that we also take care of, and yeah, it's, it's pretty crazy.

Anastasia:

A raccoon or a skunk is like on my list.

Kristiina Wilson:

next that's getting back to the conversation at hand, what are some of the most common houseplants that people have that are toxic to cats?

Anastasia:

I would say so. I talk about a lot of this, a lot of this type of thing on my blog, especially Monstera's. So I will highlight the Monstera, which is like the it plant I know Of the houseplant world. I have a ton of them, I'll talk about that later, but I would say Monstera's are like the main one, diffenbachia. Those are like typical in like dentist office, but a lot of people have them because they look really jurassic parky and pothos like very common but also a toxic plant.

Anastasia:

so all of these contain this biomineral, or these biominerals called calcium oxalate crystals, which look like little swords or like little knives in the leaves, so like if a cat were to eat it, like that would obviously be an irritant, so that's why they're considered toxic.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yeah, so when you say an irritant, that's not like like lilies, which if they get the pollen right, that immediately shuts down their organs and it's very difficult to save them.

Anastasia:

Right.

Kristiina Wilson:

But irritants often, at least from my understanding, can cause nausea and vomiting and some gastrointestinal distress, but they're not necessarily leading down that same path like lilies do.

Anastasia:

Right If they were to eat a piece of a monster, a leaf, it's not lethal, whereas it is with a lily. Right, and I have a note to talk about lilies later, but still so. And one and one thing I'll mention later too is that, um, the problem with these, like these little oxalate crystals, is that, like the damage is done, sure, it's done, like in you know, the mouth and the lips, because obviously that hurts, but it's also internal. So if you notice your cat has eaten a chunk of Monstera, don't be like oh, he's not frothing at the mouth, he's fine. No, he might be having a burning esophagus. That's why I still always recommend, if your cat is, eating a.

Anastasia:

Monstera one, move the move the monster. And two, don't wait to call a vet. Yeah, yeah.

Kristiina Wilson:

That's good, that's good advice. So, on that same token, are there plants that people generally assume are safe, but they're not. So I know, I think a lot of people, a lot of people I know, have monsteras and they have cats and I think they think especially that, like green leafy plants are not going to be toxic to cats. So are there any any ones that are surprising to you that people think are safe and then they're not?

Anastasia:

um, I would agree with you. I would say that a lot of people just kind of see these giant like like bird of paradise or monsteras or snake plants and they're like, oh, it's fine, and to an extent it is, depending on your animal, but at the same time, um, you know, they're not so technically it's not right. Honestly, the only one that really came to mind was string of pearls. I know was like that's like a pretty like novelty common plant and a lot of succulents are actually pet safe, but that one's not. So that was the only one that really came to mind when I thought about that. So I would say string of pearls for one, but many other, like string of dolphins, like those little dangly succulents those are all pet safe except for string of pearls. And then, yeah, I would also mention the big, big houseplants you can get at Lowe's probably not pet safe, yeah, got it.

Kristiina Wilson:

So also like the palms and stuff like that. Palms are safe.

Anastasia:

Yes, okay, there's only one, so there's the Sago palm which is Orsego Sago. I'm from New York, so I don't know how to pronounce it. I don't know how to say it either. I'm a very much a New Yorker, yeah, so I mean, we don't have any of those here, obviously, or in Connecticut, but they are like the only palm that's actually very like, that's extremely like lily level toxic.

Kristiina Wilson:

So what are some of the symptoms of plant poisoning in cats, and what should a cat owner do if they think that their cat has eaten something that is toxic?

Anastasia:

So I have kind of a breakdown again on my blog about this, but there really isn't any like breakdown. It's like call your vet. But really what you're looking for is to make sure that your cat indeed like usually you'll see vomit for one Because they have that. Like plants have that thing, they do that thing to cats that make them vomit for some reason, and so usually that's like your first clue and you can usually tell if there's plant bits in there. But the other symptoms are like them being a little bit lethargic, drooling and just generally unwell.

Anastasia:

You know, not wanting to eat. But again, like I don't anticipate, if you find you know the cat vomit pile with a piece of leaf in there and you know that it's a leaf of a monster, like call your vet. If pets are typically typically eating, you know, if they eat like a piece of spider plant or what you know a tox, a non-toxic plant, then you're probably fine. Just always, no matter toxic, non-toxic. I always tell people like, look for symptoms. Just like people are allergic to random like stuff like chocolate. You know cats cats can have the same problem, so you know they can have a weird allergy. So I always say, if your pet is a chronic plant snacker, you know, always call your vet if something looks off.

Anastasia:

Right, that's the first thing, oh the other thing is calling the pet poison helpline. That's another like after hours thing.

Kristiina Wilson:

All right, I did not even know there was a pet poison hotline.

Anastasia:

They're fantastic oh really Cool.

Kristiina Wilson:

Do you know what the number is to the pet poison?

Anastasia:

hotline I can look it up. So Krusty, that little wonderful kitten I mentioned in the beginning of this interview, went through the garbage, and so I don't like milk chocolate, so I threw some milk chocolate out. It's not real chocolate in my opinion it's not, it's fake news chocolate, and so I threw some out and Krusty, who's possibly a raccoon in disguise, she was like a dumpster cat. So, she wants to.

Kristiina Wilson:

We have a few cats like that, who will just eat anything.

Anastasia:

Yeah. So she went into the garbage, dug it out, ate a bunch of chocolate, and I had to call the pet poison helpline and they were fantastic and I was like my cat's an idiot. Um, yeah, can you help me? Um, but yeah, it's like you pay like 80 bucks for them just to, in my case, they like said how big is she? How much chocolate bar did she eat? And then they say like, hey, you should go to get her stomach popped or you should go like she'll be fine. So it's like and it was like 3 am, so it's a good, it's, it's a great resource for the 3 am panic attacks. It is 855-764-7661.

Kristiina Wilson:

And they're great, thank you. What was the end result for Kr for crusty so?

Anastasia:

she must have a stomach of steel, and she was fine, so yep.

Kristiina Wilson:

But now we have child locks on our garbage I've had to do that before, like on everything, because of super smart cats. But we also have well, we have several garbage cats, but our cat, one of our cats move. She has that same kind of stomach of steel. Yeah, and at one point two summers ago I was like soaking acorns because I wanted to try to grow, like you know. So I just was like soaking acorns in water and had like the cup covered and she kicked the cover off and drank this like nasty you know acorns are are toxic to cats and drank the water.

Kristiina Wilson:

And I didn't even realize until like probably a day later, when I like walked by and was like, oh my God, and then I saw her later trying to get in there and nothing ever happened. She was totally fine because she came from the, you know, the New York city street, drinking like those green toxic puddles or whatever, and she was just like straight bleach. Yeah, yeah, just, but it was insane.

Anastasia:

Those green toxic puddles or whatever.

Kristiina Wilson:

And she was just like Just straight bleach. Yeah, yeah, just. But it was insane. She just drank a whole cup full of like nasty old acorn water and was like delicious, do you have any more? That was great.

Anastasia:

Yeah, I don't. I'll never understand her. My other two cats are pretty dignified, so I don't really have that issue. But, yeah, cresty is extremely intelligent and she also was an orphan, so she has single cat syndrome. She's like two, and my other cats are like 15 and 16. And so, yeah, it's been a really fun year With two geriatric cats and one absolute. Again, I don't know what kind of animal she is.

Kristiina Wilson:

We're thinking she's a cat, but we don't know what kind of animal she is.

Anastasia:

We're thinking she's a cat, but we don't know. Yeah, well, sometimes they're crossed, you know, with, like you said, raccoons or um demons. You know, you never 100, you never know what's going on and there's at least an eighth demon in there.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yeah, 100 okay, so, um moving on, what are some good non-toxic plants that uh, we as cat owners can like safely have in our homes? So I.

Anastasia:

I love when people ask me this because usually they're like I don't know if there's any. I'm like, no, there's a ton, yeah, um. So hoya, um, there's a ton of hoya plants and they range from like trailing to like a little bit like shrubby. Those are fantastic. Peperomia same thing. There's like trailing Peperomia. There's Peperomia that gets these giant leaves and they have cool looking leaves. Orchids, like the orchids you see everywhere around Mother's Day or whatever. Those are pet safe and they're really pretty and they flower. Ferns almost all types of ferns are pet safe and I usually recommend those to people who really want like a jungle, like are starting to do like a jungle vibe and also calathea, but they are a little fickle. But they, if you can, if they learn to trust you, the reward is very high. But I know they can be difficult for you know beginner plant people, but they're really pretty. So and then, like I said before, like a lot, of, a lot of succulents even some cacti are are pet safe too. Okay.

Kristiina Wilson:

What about for people who like to grow herbs? Are there any herbs that are safe for cats and that cats might also enjoy?

Anastasia:

Yes, so I have a little list on my blog. I have a blog post called the Pet Safe Kitchen. Oh cool, so it basically has, and it's for dogs and cats, because I try to be inclusive in my blog, but it's for it's basically safe herbs, not toxic herbs. Safe herbs toxic herbs, and these aren't necessarily herbs that you want your cat to like eat, right, but it's almost like. But if they were to, they would be okay. Yeah, you know what.

Anastasia:

I mean. So if you have a problem with a cat snacking on herbs, I always tell people grow catnip or cat grass next to them, or your plants. You know that is always a help.

Kristiina Wilson:

While you're bringing up your list, that catnip really loves to take over everything, as I'm sure you know, like any kind of a mint is like yes. Woo, does that love to just take over everything?

Anastasia:

everything yes.

Kristiina Wilson:

So just as a note to people who may be like oh, I'll just grow a little bit of catnip here, like be prepared for the catnip to be like no, it's all mine yeah, yeah, 100.

Anastasia:

I always tell people, if they grow any kind of mint, to just put it in its own quarantine. Yeah, its own solitary confinement, because it will overtake everything um, yeah so my list is basil, parsley, thyme, sage, cilantro and then dill, rosemary and lavender. Like they're considered pet safe, but if a pet is continuously snacking on them?

Kristiina Wilson:

yeah bad yeah, I thought lavender was like a no.

Anastasia:

Yeah, not great for cats, but they also put it in some catnip like mixes now. So I mean it's fine and small. Yeah, it's like fine and small, very small doses. But again, if your cat's, like you know, all consuming atlantic city buffet, you know we're not gonna right, I'm not gonna do that.

Kristiina Wilson:

So yeah, I also just haven't noticed that cats like lavender, so I don't know why? No, they would put it into something that's for cats, like here's drugs that you love. We're gonna mix it with something you actively dislike. Yeah, I don't know why they would put it into something that's for cats, like here's drugs that you love. We're going to mix it with something you actively dislike.

Anastasia:

Yeah, I don't know Make it worse for you, yeah. I sourced my catnip from the best places, but I feel like we grow ours. Yeah, that's perfect. It's just like there's so much junk in a lot of like cat like. If you buy catnip from like, no offense, but like randomly from Amazon, like there could be weird stuff in there.

Kristiina Wilson:

Oh, that's why we grow ours.

Anastasia:

Yeah, because.

Kristiina Wilson:

I am paranoid.

Anastasia:

Yeah, yeah. So the pudding lavender there's probably like dust, you know, just like sawdust, and a bunch it's like meh, meh, no, yeah, so, yeah, but those are. And yeah, and I know that valerian is also something that people grow for cats. But yeah, that's also like getting into like drug territory, so like I wouldn't like actively grow it for your cat to like administer. You know, sure we get into doses, but some people do that. Yeah, I would not recommend, not recommend.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yeah, no, yeah, no. We grow catnip all the time and um cat grass for them, so that they always have something to munch on and, like sometimes, we're in between cycles on the cat grass and they get like they're really like where's our catnip? They love it or not, catnip, but the cat grass they get, so into it and they will like pick the plant up, cause just grow it in like a little square. It's light, yeah, and they'll like pick it up and like drag it around the kitchen and get really into it, so I really do encourage people.

Kristiina Wilson:

It's really good for your cat's digestion and can actually help them bring up hairballs and and um it's. It is something that they naturally do seek out to just try. And you can even buy like little kits where you know you it comes with a little bit of dirt and you know the seeds and you just grow it your own at home, and I think you can probably like just go to the health food store and buy wheatgrass too that they've already grown for you. It's the cheapest way to do it, yeah.

Anastasia:

A hundred percent. Yeah, no, it is really actually. I just, I just Harvey one of my. She looks like a little cow but she always has chronic hairballs, and that's literally. I don't do anything else except just buy her cat grass and get her through her bouts and she's good. Yeah, yep, yeah.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yeah, so speaking of kind of that kind of stuff, like why do you think some cats like to chew on plants? And like how do we redirect that behavior safely?

Anastasia:

You, were right, like they seek it out because they want the purging effect, but a lot of cats do it because they're bored, yep, and I would say that that is probably more common. So having to start my like having to look at my house through the eyes of a kitten this last, you know, year and a half, you really notice things that you probably wouldn't if you only had cats like six and up. I feel like there's there's a hundred percent of demeanor change.

Kristiina Wilson:

Oh, there is At age five. There's a huge demeanor change at age two and then another one at five and up.

Anastasia:

And so it's been really eye opening, especially since it's like sure, I help clients with their cats, but it's different when it's your own cat and I have 200 houseplants in my house and Krusty will just go like this to a leaf of a large plant and make direct eye contact with me, Like she'll just hit the leaf over and over, like she's, she's a hundred percent bored or she'll just like open her mouth, like go to bite it, while still making eye contact, and so it's.

Anastasia:

I think it's more often than not boredom. And as far as redirecting, I could talk about, I could talk about that for hours because that's the bread and butter of my you know whole schtick. But what I would recommend and again it depends on the age of your cat but what I would recommend is if you see, like routine plant consumption or plant pillaging or plant destruction, like it's not newsflash, it's not really their fault, it's yours and you know that's. I think that's another like thing that I try to explain with clients. It's like don't get mad at your cat Like you put, you put them in a house and then like sometimes there's nothing, but you know all of this fun stuff that they can't touch.

Anastasia:

And that's not ideal, and so what I usually recommend is you know if you see if your cat is is routinely doing these things that you're upset with, like you need to take initiative and move those plans. Place them higher, put them in the glass cabinet like, relocate them, put them in a locked room and also play with your cat more. And I just find that I have never had a client come back to me and say that didn't work.

Kristiina Wilson:

Right, because it's almost always boredom.

Anastasia:

And then we're read, instead of redirecting with like sprays or like orange peel, like I'm like no, that's not, you're just band-aiding the problem like you're better off, just like you and your cat sit down together and you talk it out and then you move. You move plants where you know they'll be out of reach. Um, if you have like spider plants everywhere and your cat keeps eating them, of course that's going to happen. So, yeah, I always tell people just it's like you have to work in tandem. It's don't ever get mad at your cat, stop with the weird sprays and the orange peel and just try to look at it in a different perspective.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yeah, that is so spot on. That's absolutely, 100%, totally correct. And something that we always like to say to clients in the behavior world, especially when you want to redirect, is you have to think about what do I want my cat to do instead?

Anastasia:

Right.

Kristiina Wilson:

Like you can't just say I don't want this behavior, right, that's not a full thought. You have to say well, ok, so what do you want them to do instead? Like I don't want them to eat my plants, what do I want them to do instead? I have to provide an alternate, similar, yes, behavior or source of, in this case, entertainment, like purgative, like whatever it is.

Kristiina Wilson:

I need to provide that, whether it is wheatgrass, whether it's dangly, if you know, if it's the spider plant you said it do they need like a dangly flirt toy? That's like hanging from the ceiling. Do they like? What do they need that is similar and provide that and you can redirect towards that and then, like you said, also just boredom.

Kristiina Wilson:

You need to add intellectual stimulation, like so many cats are chronically understimulated and they're so smart Most of them, and even the dumb ones we've got a few in our house they need they still need intellectual stimulation because they would be outside hunting for 10 to 12 hours a day, right, and now they're just sitting in our house. Of course they're going to mess with your plants. Yeah, so you got to get stuff like some bird feeders. You've got to get some toys they can play with on their own. You've got to set up like food puzzles. You've got to get stuff and refresh those and change them, because cats get bored, mm-hmm.

Anastasia:

So yeah, I think that's even the dumb cats, like they're all very smart and what I even recommend, like what I've recommended too, like if cats are bored and you live in like a studio apartment and you're like, and you can't do bird feeders, like you can't do big toys or whatever.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yeah, put cat TV on.

Anastasia:

Yes, like that's really really good for kittens.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yes, it's like putting a toddler in front of a TV as long as your TV is secure, yeah, well, yeah, if you have a. Tv, that is secured to the wall and not on a stand, because our TV in our house is just like it's like on a stand on a cabinet. Yeah, I didn't think about that, I'm just going to say, especially if you have feisty but chonky cats who are on a weight loss journey, as we do, you cannot leave them unsupervised with the cat tv, because they will try to get behind, like into the tv.

Anastasia:

Yeah, I didn't think about that. Yeah, so secure tv only, yes, and cats under 30 pounds.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yeah, that's a good solution yeah yeah, otherwise it can definitely get dangerous, but yes, yes, that's very true, that's right are there any cat friendly plants that can be grown specifically for their enrichment, that are, you know, like cat grass, catnip? Are there any things that I missed, or is that kind of that's kind of that's?

Anastasia:

kind of it. Yeah, Cat grass, so there was. I know you asked me a question about like outdoor but outdoor, like plants, but I know that like if, if you happen. So all of my cats are indoor. I'm like strictly an indoor cat household but I know a lot of people have indoor outdoor cats and so cat mint, which is again the mint family, that's a good outdoor. I don't know how fair it would do you know how it would fare inside?

Anastasia:

but it's it spreads like wildfire and it's great for if you have a lot of.

Kristiina Wilson:

You know, if your cat goes outside, they usually lay in it in the sun a lot of you know, if your cat goes outside, they usually lay in it and yeah, yeah, we have a lot of that outside, like in our gardens, and absolutely they do love to lay in it and it's really pretty. It has like really nice purple flowers, it's it. It flowers beautifully um I was gonna say in the summer. Obviously in the winter it's gorgeous what a moron. Covered in snow. Yeah, it's so pretty. I am such an idiot today, wow.

Anastasia:

But it's really good for bees too, like it's a good bee. It's a good bee plant.

Kristiina Wilson:

It is.

Anastasia:

But yeah, otherwise inside I don't think there really is anything that is like scientifically proven to just be like completely pet safe that you should grow for your cat, I wouldn't do anything else, okay cool.

Kristiina Wilson:

Do you have any solutions for? I've had a few clients come to me about this and we definitely have had this problem in our house cats who like to dig in dirt and toilet in pots.

Anastasia:

Yeah, yeah, that seems to be like the number like that. It's not even eating plants, but that is very common. It's also. It's very gross. So I'm really sorry for anyone dealing with that. So my good friend actually had this happen and I always recommend large pond rocks. So there's a couple hacks you can do, like putting forks in your planters, and I'm like who wants to live that way? You know that's not pretty, so I or you could do a gorgeous art installation what are you talking about as an art?

Anastasia:

history major. I do not approve um yeah, we're not, we're not doing surrealist yeah, no post-modern art in my flower, yeah there.

Anastasia:

So I I don't recommend doing the weird again. This is like the weird hack things, like I just they don't work. Yeah, so I my pretty much go-to is always large pond rocks, and so what I mean by pond rocks is not aquarium rocks, because those look like litter Right, yeah, we don't want to do that. It's always like and this always happens. You know, cats always go in large planters. So, like, it can, can handle a large, you know a beefy rock, but yeah, they're, usually they're, I don't know like three inches in diameter and, um, you don't need a lot of them, you just need enough to kind of, you know, deter, right. And also another thing, kind of going on a behavioral thing if a cat is consistently using a plant, a planter, as a litter box, like, are you checking? Like, are you cleaning your litter boxes enough? Like, is there a reason they want to use this? Like, do they want more privacy? Like, do they want less privacy?

Kristiina Wilson:

Like, maybe there's, or is there, a substrate problem, because dirt is soft right. And that's also where cats especially I've had this issue with cats who were feral, who came from outdoors- and had only toileted, you know, in new york city, but like in dirt that they were finding right and so they would come in and then toilet in the plant pots, and so I had to teach them.

Kristiina Wilson:

I had to first put dirt and rocks in the litter box and then slowly cover that with small amounts of litter and teach them that way. But I do think sometimes, especially people who use pellet litter or those larger litters that that really causes litter box avoidance because it can really hurt their paw pads. And sometimes they may excuse me, choose your pots because dirt is so soft. Me choose your pots because dirt is so soft. So I would also go to looking at the substrate in your litter box, if you're finding this to be an issue.

Anastasia:

Yeah, there's almost always. If a cat is doing something, there's always a like. I know cats are spiteful and kind of like dirt sometimes they're not spiteful, but they all yeah but yeah, they, I, there's always like a reason for their madness for the most part.

Anastasia:

But yeah, so I would say, try the Pond Rock thing Again. I have like a. I've never had it not work and yeah and then assess your litter box thing Also. I've noticed I've gotten calls about for people who have the litter robot, which is great, like it's a great invention, but it's not for every cat and so sometimes if they have a litter robot, they find that their cat is, you know, peeing in their plants more and it's probably because they don't, you know, they don't want to go into a machine to go to the bathroom. So yeah, if you have like a more industrial type litter situation, that might be hurting you more than and again, I've had more than one client with that.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yeah, so if somebody has an outdoor garden, what precautions should they take to make sure that their plants are safe for, like neighborhood community cats, their own outdoor, indoor outdoor cats, if they have them? Is there anything that people can do?

Anastasia:

Ironically, in my little notes I wrote like well, well, actually, if you have a lot of uh local cats, you should start tnr-ing. Yes I actually mentioned that because I was like that's the first thing you want to do, it's true, control that population so you don't have all those cats on your property.

Kristiina Wilson:

But the second I would say if I, if you don't mind, I'm sorry, I'm just interrupting you.

Kristiina Wilson:

the first thing I would do is put, if they don't have a collar on right, Like if you see them they don't have a collar on, put a paper collar on them if you can touch them, so that you can see, like does that paper collar get removed? Does someone call you? Like, put a paper collar on, write your phone number, see if that cat is does belong to someone, before you trap it and try to do all this stuff to it.

Kristiina Wilson:

Because at least I can say where we live. So many people have indoor outdoor cats, which I am also really against, especially now because I love birds and because it's unsafe for the cats but also because of avian flu. It is very unsafe for cats to be outside right now, but definitely it bears checking before you try to trap a strange cat and TNR it to make sure that it doesn't actually belong to someone and they get you know you spend money or they get mad at you.

Anastasia:

Yes, yes, exactly the latter is important as well. No, that was like. My first note was like hey, like, let's control that problem first. Yeah, problem first, yeah, um, but otherwise I I was. I've actually never been asked this before, but what I have noticed from living somewhere prior to where I live right now, where there was a lot of like community cats, is they tend to not eat like plants like I know they just tend to eat grass they almost know and the only thing I would say is, if you have lilies like, just like the lilies that are very common everywhere, like what I did in my old house, was I just dug them up and I was

Anastasia:

like it's not worth having them. If we have all these, you know community cats, they were actual community cats and I just like didn't trust them, right, but lilies and oleander, which is not over here, uh, but those are like the two main offenders and I think. And and sagopoms, which on the west coast, um, those are really toxic but I don't think they usually grow really big and, yeah, cats aren't. They got other things to worry about. They're not eating those. So yeah, I mean, I would say if you, if you notice cats like eating, eating your outdoor plants, you may want to just like, and if there's lilies, you may want to. You know, dig them up, but let's you know, you should probably address to make sure you know whose cat that is first.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yeah, Are there any flowers? That people typically plant and have outside that are really unsafe for cats um aside from lilies, aside from lilies not it's there's.

Anastasia:

So I feel so. I am a landscape designer but I know that new york plants are wildly different from like california plants. So I would say most, most cactuses are so like west coast. Most cactuses and stuff are fine. It's the little thorns that are the worst.

Anastasia:

But here and but cactuses do bloom and everything. But I would say here, no, there really isn't anything. That's like crazy toxic. I know that. I think it's a. I want to say like a cacao plant or coffee plant, oh, castor plant, and that is outside and that is in the list of very. I want to say like a cacao plant or coffee plant, oh, castor plant, and that is sometimes outside and that is in the list of very, very toxic to dogs too. And but I don't, like I've never planted that. So I'm like, if you know that that exists, like that would be very toxic.

Anastasia:

Lily very toxic, but that's just a plant. I would say no, there really isn't any. Any flowers that will really do that. And cats I've never seen a cat eat a flower oh god, I have our cats eat so many flowers.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yeah, we can't. We have to be so careful about what flowers we bring in um we have you know flowers growing all over the property and like I have to like look things up every spring and be like, oh wait, is this safe? Is this safe? Is this safe? To like cut and bring in the house because they will eat everything not all the cats, but definitely some, especially moo, the like garbage can, yeah, water cat. They will go to town and I have never had a cat eat leaves like leaves and arrangements yeah, but never flowers actual flowers steve.

Kristiina Wilson:

You know my old cat steve, this guy he would, he loved roses. He would chomp like just eat the whole road like that's hilarious. That's not funny, but it's really funny now, and roses are totally safe so they can do that, but like yeah we can't bring anything in here, because they'll just be like, oh, what's this?

Anastasia:

yeah, yeah, no, that's. That's not good. Um, I will say so. I know that there was someone a listener, asked a question about um easy, safe flowers to buy, like, yeah, as so I will say this so, if you are looking to give someone a floral arrangement, you know, if you wanted to send christina a floral arrangement, um, maybe don't now, but um, you could do.

Anastasia:

Zinnias, alstroemeria, gabaridazes, pink cushion flowers, orchids, roses and sunflowers are all excellent ideas, and a lot of florists now actually are more mindful about this, and they'll either have something like ready to go for someone who wants a pet safe, you know, arrangement, or or honestly like, just ask for, like roses, yeah, just ask for roses, it's I'm. It's nice to see, though, like after so many years, that florists are, you know, finally addressing that. You know this random bunch of stuff could be yes, because like it's, it's not labeled. There's no labels, there's nothing to tell you anything. It's just like you're just like, oh, hope no one dies. Like that's not. So yeah, I'm actually working on a blog post with a local florist like about this, oh cool, because it's such a problem and no one ever thinks about it.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yeah.

Anastasia:

You know. But, yeah, Are there any common misconceptions about pet safe plants that you would like to clear up or discuss? So I won't go too much on a tangent, but yes, I would say the number one misconception is that you can't have large plants, and I know that this sounds sketchy because in the beginning of this interview I said that most large plants from Lowe's are toxic. But hear me out. So I have like over 200 plants in my house and so at some point, with the exception of a cat pooping and you know, a giant planter, cats will typically avoid giant plants because they tend to look like furniture, Right.

Anastasia:

So if you end up with a giant Monstera, for an example, and it's, you know, huge and you and you love it like you want one, it's jungly, like you. Just you're just like I, just want this, I want this plant and you try to make it work, I would say you, you can have that plant again, monitor your cat to see if they're eating it, or you know all of the above, like we talked about before. But I have found that nine times out of 10, if the plant is larger, you know leafy, you know the leaves are like rubbery, not very frondy, a cat is not going to go for it to consume it.

Anastasia:

So I would say that that's like that's the number one thing that new pet parents will say. They're like well, I miss my big plants. Like well, you could still have them. You just need to need to make sure your cat's not going to climb them, you know, or do anything weird to them. That's, you know. What people leave behind are really big plants when they get a cat. That is true.

Kristiina Wilson:

Are there and we may have touched on this, but do you have any favorite cat safe plants that you recommend that people get?

Anastasia:

so I yeah, we talked a little bit about that. I mentioned, uh, hoya orchids, peperomia um, ferns again are still really good for jungle jungle cup, like bromeliads are really great they can and calathea are both really great again, they could be a little temperamental. Um and uh, palm trees too. So palm trees are still and sweater plants. They're still frondy, but if your cat is not a plant snacker, then you might be able to be one of the few pet parents to have a palm tree that doesn't have bite marks in the leaves, and that would be great.

Kristiina Wilson:

So I want to move on to the listener questions. I feel like we covered most of them already just in our chat, although there were not any listener questions about bangs, which is a shame.

Kristiina Wilson:

That's upsetting. It is upsetting, but maybe next time Somebody wants to know where they can find good, trusted information about safe versus toxic plants online, and I guess that's other than your blog, which obviously we have talked about and I will link to at the bottom of our episode website. But is there, are there any other online sources that you would recommend?

Anastasia:

So yes and no. This is kind of a weird question, because every so I've again, I'm not to age myself but, I've been doing this for a little while, like before every site, and their uncle had a blurb about pet safe plans.

Kristiina Wilson:

Right.

Anastasia:

So at this point it's so oversaturated and add TikTok on top of that and it's just like people constantly like taking from each other and, you know, re-vomiting all of that information. Yes, while I think it's great that pet safety like plant safety, pet and plant safety is getting out in the world, that's great. One thing that I do on my blog is it's like triple checked. So I use the ASPCA website and that's still my number one, like my number one choice. And the only caveat with that is that sometimes they put common names to plants, so like a peperomia is called a rubber plant. Like that's not helpful to anyone.

Anastasia:

Because a type of ficus which is toxic is also called a rubber plant. But, that's not helpful to anyone. So I would say, no matter what site you're looking at, always look at the Latin name and that's what you want to go by. You don't want to go by the common name. And what I like about the SPCA is that they usually have both and they have like a bunch of other types of common names.

Anastasia:

But I did some research prior to this interview and, my God, like I haven't looked in a while but there's so much information just about pet safe plants and they're all using common names, so like the information is useless. Yeah, so I would say, stick to the ASPCA website. Aspca is almost always correct. Right, it's. It's really hard with all of this information. I know it's like you want to trust it and just when it comes to like safety of your pet, like you just have to be really careful. No, I agree, so disheartening. All of my content has been like double checked and I think, yeah, it's just especially with like AI, like it's so everything's a little sketchy. Yeah, it's, it's tough. That's why, like I say, like if you have a cat that, like you know, ate a plant, like don't search the internet, like just call your vet. Just it's, save yourself a headache and more expensive vet bill yeah you know, absolutely fair.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yeah, um, okay. So let's go to another question. Someone wants to know the best pet friendly fertilizer and bug spray for houseplants.

Anastasia:

So I use Jack's fertilizer and I use water soluble fertilizer, so water that dissolves in the gallon jug before I water. I don't ever use any type of fertilizer like sticks or anything that is like tactile, because it kind of looks like litter, so like I never use anything like that. I would highly recommend not using anything like that if you have cats for fertilizer, for any kind of like pesticide type of thing. I'm kind of a hippie and I prefer not to use pesticides if I don't have to. But I have a bit of a Mealybrook outbreak right now and so I've been on my Hoyas and so I've been just doing rubbing alcohol, which is fine, but otherwise I've used neem in the past and I've just sprayed outside and I let them sit outside.

Anastasia:

As long as you kind of let the neem oil like cure, and neem oil is like natural, it won't like rub off on your pets. Do not use like seven, like never use any of that type of thing that is so harmful for the environment. Always use like as natural as you can get, you know, and that will be fine. And also, if you can let it dry, slash cure on the plant before you bring it back in.

Kristiina Wilson:

That would be the best, but yeah, that makes sense. Okay, any essential oils beneficial to diffuse for cats or just a bad idea in general, and I can definitely answer this one if if you don't.

Anastasia:

Well, I just have a little tidbit I got, please, well, I got pretty sick from, so there was like that craze, remember, like, like in 2018 where everyone, the doTERRA, yeah, yeah. I remember that Everyone under the sun tried to, you know, sell me doTERRA. Yeah, oh, yeah, yeah. So I did it and I got sick from the oils. And so I and not just like, oh, did I get? Like I got sick from the oils, according to a doctor and they're like stop diffusing oils.

Anastasia:

and I was like okay. So that obviously led me to think what is this doing to cats who have? A much more sensitive nose so my answer is a pretty solid there is no reason to diffuse oils for cats. Use the fell away diffusers if you need to calm your cats down.

Kristiina Wilson:

Absolutely a lot of scents that people like to put in diffusers, like lavender or cedar or like orange, are not only toxic to cats, but also the cats just would actively dislike and if you want to look at the five pillars of a healthy feline environment, which all cat owners should look at, one of them is giving them a safe and respectful environment, and one of those ways that we do that is by respecting one of their most dominant senses, which is a sense of smell.

Kristiina Wilson:

And if we are putting out a bunch of stinky, perfumey smells into their environment, we're not allowing them to smell their own scent markers that they leave, like when they bunt. When they leave scent markers in the doorways or on you or, you know, just around the house, that tells them this area is my territory, it's safe for me, it's safe for my family. That is very distressing to them and could lead to behavior issues. I just do not recommend scented litter, scented candles, scented room diffusers, essential oil like none of that. You want to respect your cat's environment, their respiratory system as well, like you mentioned, um and just I. I personally don't think that they're good for anyone. If you want to do something to make your house smell different, you could make a simmer pot.

Anastasia:

I was gonna say that.

Kristiina Wilson:

I do that in the wintertime sometimes, especially like if I feel like the house, because again we have 13 cats and one who's a real farter. You can just google what do?

Kristiina Wilson:

I do to get yourself started yeah, you can throw in some orange peel or some bay leaves, cloves, cinnamon, like whatever you've got lying around the house. That smells nice Rosemary, if you have rosemary in the house, and just let that simmer on the stove and that's a nice way to diffuse smell into your home. That isn't oily, that's not going to actually clog up anyone's respiratory system. Yeah, um, it's the oil that is. Yeah, yeah, cause that's not going to actually clog up anyone's respiratory system.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yeah, um, it's the oil that is. Yeah, yeah, because that's actually going up into the air and you'll see it on your walls. You'll see it like, yeah, that's no, it's no good. So if you really need a smell in your house, your cats probably won't love the simmer pot either, but I think they could tolerate it much better than like some kind of essential oil diffusion system. That was really such a moment in time, wasn't it? How can people find you if they would like to hire you or read?

Anastasia:

your blog, sure. So my blog is leafandpawcom and that's L-E-A-F-A-n-d-p-a-w dot com, and I'm active on instagram, occasionally facebook. I post plant stuff, I post cat stuff, I also post. I'm a very avid reader and so I also post book content. If you're interested in book content, I would say I just hope that this helped either new pet parents or new plant parents. I just hope that this this helped a little bit in knowing that you can still have plants in your home.

Kristiina Wilson:

I'm sure, I'm sure that it absolutely will. Not all hope is lost and I just really appreciate you being on the podcast and thank you so much for all the information and I really highly encourage everyone listening to go to leafandpawcom and check out the blog and to contact Anastasia if you want more information or consultation. Oh yeah, there's that too.

Anastasia:

I'm not a very good salesperson. If you want to hire me, I am very full, but at the same time, like I will take um, I do like zoom calls. So like someone says, my house looks like this, my cat's eating my plants like this, and I look at their house and I'm like, yeah, this is your problem and that's, that's the consultation. So it's pretty quick and it's really for people who have tried everything, who need, you know, just an outsider perspective. Right, so yeah, but I do consultations.

Kristiina Wilson:

Yeah Cool, all right. Well, thank you so much and bang voyage. Thank you, bang voyage, cool. Thanks for listening. If you enjoyed this episode, please rate and review wherever you listen. It super helps. For more information and to support our podcast. Check out our website at hissandtellpodcastcom. You can also find us on Instagram at hissandtellpodcast. Music provided by Cat Beats.

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