Diamonds Restored at 55 | The MOB Interview with LA LA LAND Records Producer Neil S. Bulk & Mixer Chris Malone

World exclusive. First Listen. You’re hearing this before anyone else.

On this world exclusive episode of Music of Bond, we sit down with producer Neil S. Bulk and mixer Chris Malone for a deep dive into the brand-new Diamonds Are Forever 55th Anniversary Expanded Edition from LA LA LAND Records.

Released today, this is the first conversation anywhere unpacking how one of John Barry’s most iconic Bond scores has been restored, expanded, and reimagined for a new generation...and for everyone who listens to MOB.

From unreleased cues and fragile tape elements to the art of remastering and the debates behind what makes the final cut, this is a rare, inside-the-room look at LA LA LAND Records, how Bond history is preserved, restored, and reshaped.

This isn’t just an interview. It’s the conversation MOB fans have been waiting for.

Now available worldwide on the LA LA LAND website. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:01

Welcome to the music. Join us for an in-depth under times provocative conversation about the best in 007 sounds. From Oscar winning favorites to guilty purges.

SPEAKER_05 0:21

Hello and welcome to Music of Bond. For the love of music, for the love of Bond. I am John Williams, No Relation, and as always, I am joined by my partner in crime, Chris Wood. Chris, say hello. Hello, great to be here. Exciting show we have planned today. I mean, this is the one everyone has been asking for years in the making. You wanted it, and here you go, and it is going to be a banger of an episode with the announcement and release of what?

SPEAKER_04 0:53

Well, what we're announcing today is the 55th anniversary, La La Land edition of Diamonds Are Forever.

SPEAKER_05 1:04

Oh my God. I mean, if I had a if I had a choice between getting the new who's the new bond or this release, I would be all over this release all day long. And we have basic. I mean, forget about it. This is the one, the big one. And Chris, who do we have the pleasure of speaking with today?

SPEAKER_04 1:24

So today we are honored to have on the show producer Neil Asbolk. Say hi, Neil.

SPEAKER_02 1:30

I can't over all this applause.

SPEAKER_04 1:33

Oh my God. Woohoo!

SPEAKER_02 1:37

Hi, everybody.

SPEAKER_04 1:38

It's a pleasure to be here. Wow. Yeah, along with recording engineer Chris Malone. Welcome to the show, Chris.

SPEAKER_05 1:47

Yes. Thank you very much for having me. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_04 1:50

Thanks for coming on.

SPEAKER_05 1:52

Gentlemen, right out of the gate, and on behalf of Chris and myself, and I mean, if you think about it, anyone who's listening to this podcast, thank you, thank you, thank you. Because you guys, the work you have done, these releases that you put out, the surprises, you just never know what's going to happen one morning. And you you guys have just kept, I dare I say, the Bond, you know, spirit mantle alive with this gorgeous music and these releases and the CDs and the vinyl. So on behalf of all of us, thank you for all of your hard work.

SPEAKER_02 2:32

Absolutely. I I know Chris and I will accept all the credit, but there's there's certainly you know a lot of people behind the scenes. You know, obviously Michael Gerhart and Matt Rapois of Flawlow Land Records, you know, Dan Goldwasser, Jim Titus, the art directors, Doug Schwartz, the mastering engineer, all the people at Amazon MGM, Universal Music, and other you know, record labels that we work with, you know. Yeah um, you know, it's it's it's a lot of work. But but we're happy to uh to accept this on on all of everyone's behalf.

SPEAKER_05 3:03

Absolutely. And I do uh we do want to get to some of those those key um you know characters in the process of making these albums. But but guys, before we get into that, I always like to we always like to do a little get to know you. So we're gonna ask a few questions and help us and help our f you know the fans of this podcast, the fans of uh Bond music to get to know you a little bit better. What was the first Bond score that you two fell in love with?

SPEAKER_02 3:36

Chris, why don't you answer that while I think about it?

SPEAKER_01 3:40

Okay, very good. I can do that. So it it starts really with the first film that I saw, which was Goldfinger, and that's a great one to come in on, really, because you're getting the humble temperament of Bond and the whole height of Bond in the 1960s. And so I was very attuned to listening to the music as I was watching the film. This is probably about the age of 12 or so, I guess. And I just thought this is absolutely fantastic. And so I I went out and purchased the album, and I remember coming home and showing my mother, and she said, Oh, what's this? And I said, It's the gold finger, it's the music. And she was disappointed that it was just the music. She was like, Why would you buy just the music? And not the whole sound for the movie, including all the dialogue and the sound effects. And I said, No, no, this is just the music.

SPEAKER_02 4:43

Wait a minute, that was sort of what's that? Did did did your mom produce the RICO Octopus ECD?

SPEAKER_01 4:52

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, and and a lot of those RICO CDs at that time.

SPEAKER_02 4:56

Yeah, I didn't know that.

SPEAKER_01 4:57

Oh yeah. Yeah, yeah, she was behind that. Incredible. Exactly. So so it's almost like the antithesis of the sort of stuff that we liked as as film schooler and soundtrack fans is this intrusion of dialogue. She was certainly disappointed that it wasn't on there. But I think what cemented it for me was then as I was getting to know these films, perhaps the next one or the one after that that I saw was You Only Live Twice. And that just really set me off as that 13-year-old of this idea of escapism and exotic locations and seeing things that I would perhaps not ever see, and just really enjoying the space aspect of it as well. And really the whole escapism, but the John Barry music for that just really pulled me into this other world where he had his space march and his exotic Japanese flavour, just that sort of sousong that he put into the Tarta song with Nati Sinatra. So it's really those two that just totally cemented my love of James Bond and the James Bond music.

SPEAKER_04 6:09

Well, do you know what, Chris? About five minutes ago, we dropped our latest episode, which is a deep dive into the LP lineup of Yon You Live Twice. And during the episode, I said to John, if I had to pick one Bond album to be my sort of desert island, I think it would be Yoni Live Twice because you get all of the different flavours. You get the darkness, the light aspects, you get that beautiful, lush title song. I feel like it's got it all in one package.

SPEAKER_01 6:36

It absolutely does, and it's such a beautifully produced album.

SPEAKER_05 6:40

Yeah. I mean, so basically it kicked off your career and David Arnold's career.

unknown 6:46

You know?

SPEAKER_05 6:47

Um a lot of people can credit this album. So that's a great answer. Neil, what about you?

SPEAKER_02 6:53

You know, I I really I really don't know. I got into Bond really hardcore Bond fandom around 1987, and I remember just going to the record store and I got the soundtrack albums. I think I got Live and Let Die first just because they had it. You know, it was like, okay, so I listened to that constantly, and then later on I got Octopusy. Um I had those records and I listened to them quite a bit maybe even before I saw the movies. I don't even remember. And so I've always enjoyed the Bond films and and the music, but it was I guess it was around finally when the the 2003 reissues came out that you know I I hate to sound like a broken record or whatever, but again, you I couldn't wait for Thunderbolt, I couldn't wait for Secret Service, couldn't wait for all of them, but the one that stuck with me was You Only Live Twice. Yeah. That was the one where you went, oh my gosh, this has everything.

SPEAKER_04 7:48

And what what was it about that that that when you say it's got everything, could you elaborate? What what was it that really struck you with that one?

SPEAKER_02 7:55

No, no, I can't elaborate. No, it's the whole package. I couldn't I you know it was beautifully recorded. It it's it's it's um like as much as I love Goldfinger and I love Thunderball, you know, th they are sort of this big brass jazzy scores, and Yom of the Twice suddenly goes in a little bit more romantic direction. Yeah. And and and you know and of course you've got that music for the that great helicopter shot during the the Kobe Doc on the play to Kobe Dock. Just go, oh my gosh, what what is going on here? And Space March and this great song. So it's it's all there. So incredible. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 8:32

Absolutely. That's a great answer. Have have either one of you guys been to Japan by chance? No, never. I went last year for the first time, and again, being in that location and being on a bullet train and having, you know, that music in your ears is one of is single-handedly one of the greatest experiences of my life. Wandering around Tokyo with that soundtrack in your ears is just magical. You know, I I highly, I mean, you can sort of you can make that trip happen with like, you know, your significant other by going, hey, let's go to Japan culturally, it's incredible, and just get that soundtrack on immediately. Yeah. My girlfriend knew exactly what I was doing. You know? So, well, one of the things, and we'll talk about this a little bit later, is when I listen to your the La La Lan soundtracks, your additions, the the sound quality is so good, especially under like a good pair of headphones, cans, that I almost feel like I'm in the room while they're composing the music. Given your vantage point of of putting together these and mastering these soundtracks, what bon cue do you wish you could have been in the room for when they were recording it? Oof.

SPEAKER_02 10:03

That's a that's a good one.

SPEAKER_04 10:09

You can hear the cogs going through the speakers.

SPEAKER_05 10:12

Yeah, I know.

SPEAKER_01 10:13

Or I can jump in if you like anymore. Please go for it. You know, I I would like to hear the 1962 James Bond theme that John Barry had orchestrated and performed in as they were recording that, because that's the first time it had been heard in that particular form that we all know and love.

SPEAKER_03 10:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:39

But it was never seen to be recorded in stereo. So we've only heard it in mono for all these years. And I just like to move hear perhaps the process of how he he got to that, whether or not he was kind of came to it almost fully formed, and that he was like, let's run it down, they performed it, and then they recorded it, and they may have done a few takes bit, but it didn't evolve, it was just that was it. Or he made changes to it as he was going through the recording, because as Neil knows, on some of these scores we have found that there has been little changes from take to take to suit the needs of the picture, or something wasn't quite working, so he adjusted things. So I wonder whether or not there was some evolution to it, or he just came to it with sort of complete in his mind.

SPEAKER_04 11:31

Yeah, that would be incredible being a fly on the wall for that. Just legendary.

SPEAKER_05 11:37

Neil, what about you?

SPEAKER_02 11:39

Oh, I gosh, I don't know. I wasn't I would go back in time to that James Bond recording with Pro Tools.

SPEAKER_05 11:48

Oh. Nice. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, you would have been quite popular.

SPEAKER_02 11:54

I was like, yeah, guys, you know, I I know you I know this mono thing is is what's what's happening, what the kids are doing. This is this is experimental government secret. Just just bear with me. Let me just patch in here and I'll be on my way. Little dog brown. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. By the way, don't ever mention this, you know.

SPEAKER_05 12:15

Here's a few little Martin McFly, some Chuck Berry.

SPEAKER_02 12:20

Oh yeah, we we found the original digital 1962 recording from Dr. No. And just go, yeah, oh yeah. In flaps. Sounds pretty good. Sounds pretty good.

SPEAKER_05 12:32

Well, I've got one more quick question here. And again, I'm gonna talk more about this uh later on, but when I listen to your releases, you you listen to them with fresh ears. It's such a complete different experience that it changes the very nature of how what my opinion is of that soundtrack. And none could be more true than of Man with the Golden Gun. When I listened to to your edition of that soundtrack, I went, holy moly, this is a masterpiece. This does not get the credit that it deserves. That said, the question is, what do you feel are the most is the most underrated bond score out there? Chris, I'm gonna start with you again.

SPEAKER_02 13:29

No, you know what? I I'm gonna I I will attempt to answer that, but I don't know if it's the correct answer or or even answer to your question. But it has to be Moonraker. Beauty of the soundtrack. Because because all we had previously on Moonraker was a 30-minute album with a questionable mix. And that's all we had. It's all we didn't know, and it was just like well, maybe there's some more stuff, who knows what it'll sound like, who knows? And then to to get it, and to get all of it, and to realize it could all be remixed and sound good for once, it went from underrated to arguably the best. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 14:14

Well, just to just to pop in on that one, I'm on all of the forums, all of the all of the geeky forums that we all love, and the the general rumors were that all of that stuff was lost. And it was just something we'd have to live with, and we'll we'll we'll never get an expanded moon raker, and that's that. And I remember Oh, sorry, go on.

SPEAKER_02 14:32

That was the internet doing what the internet does best. Yeah, which is and somebody, in this case it was Lucas Kendall, just saying we couldn't find the masters, which is true to the to the masters are lost and we're all doomed. Yeah. Yeah to the point that even I b you know, I believed it. So it was like when when I started on Moonraker, I I said, you know, I I I approached you know the you know the studio and and Eon and said I'd like to to to work on this album. I don't know if it exists. Yeah. So I'd heard rumors that it did, I thought maybe, and then you know, when I got the inventory, I went, okay, there it is. So so yeah, the the internet likes to do stuff like that.

SPEAKER_04 15:14

Well, I I remember because the La La La, I live in the UK and the La La Land really when they announce one, it's always morning time here. It's obviously just the time that they pick. So it was about 7 a.m. and I choked on my cornflakes while I refreshed my phone and saw that beautiful artwork as well. So shout out for that too. Oh yeah, yeah. That was DM. Just oh, just minimalistic, just Raj on a beautiful silver background.

SPEAKER_05 15:38

Oh, that's the LP, that's the LP, that's uh I think we need to sort of let you guys know Chris and I are like hardcore vinyl fans.

SPEAKER_03 15:48

Yes.

SPEAKER_05 15:49

Um, you know, we're all I mean, we're we're every about we buy everything you guys do, but when the vinyl releases hit, it's the tectonics start to shift, you know, uh conversations about credit cards sweating in our wallets.

SPEAKER_04 16:07

Well, you Goldfinger, we set an alarm because what time was it for you when Goldfinger dropped on vinyl 3 a.m.?

SPEAKER_05 16:14

Yeah, it it was. And you you were kind enough in the UK to contact me in the middle of the night, woke up, got out of bed, or do it, you know, like what is he doing calling me this late at night, you know, cursing his name? And then when he told me what he told me, I was like, let me get the credit card.

SPEAKER_04 16:29

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_05 16:30

Let me get all the different copies. So, you know, we're when you guys release, well, when you released Moonraker, it was a game changer, and then when you dropped it on vinyl, I mean it was just I still didn't believe it. I was holding it, going, This there's no way this exists. I'm not holding this, you know.

SPEAKER_04 16:49

So I love the font on that CD release as well, the Moonraker fonts. I know we're getting into the weeds a little bit.

SPEAKER_02 16:54

I know, I but no, no, it's true, it's true. And that I I picked that font and I they No way. I did, yeah. You're talking about you're talking about Pump Demi, the sort of sci-fi font. Yeah. So yeah, I I was just like, well, it's 70 sci-fi. Yeah, it should be pumped demi. And I was even questioned about it by by some of the people approving this. What is this? It's like fresh. And I was like, oh, it's pumped demi. It's in all the sci-fi in the air of the air. It's a motion picture, it's an alien. So this was it has to be in Moonraker. So anyway, Chris, Chris, what is the underrated James Bond score, in your opinion? Uh to me. Um Malone. Oh, sorry. So no. See, this is how it works. We you asked us the questions. Yeah. We answered them.

SPEAKER_05 17:37

Yeah, yeah, yeah. We're probably dying to answer these questions ourselves. Yeah. So far, we've done all the talking, by the way.

SPEAKER_01 17:45

You can answer those questions because that you're the aficionado as well. Look, I I'll give a facetious answer, which is Dr. No, but no, I of the in particular of the Jambarry ones, I think you were on to it there, John, when you said that you felt The Man with the Golden Gun, not because he didn't have a short album, it had a lengthy album of the time, and much longer than the Moonraker LP was of the period. But I think what what really struck me with this expanded edition that Neil produced and I was able to work on with him, is that there's a lot of extra cues of these sort of connection pieces that we hadn't heard before, and they'd really bring you into more flavour of that uh environment John Barrett was trying to bring us into. So we're not just hearing sort of action versions of the title song all the time. We're hearing all this other really evocative kind of scoring, a bit like what he was doing with Yonny Move Twice, where he's capturing the mood mood of of where we are, the locale of the picture as well. So I found that to be a real ear opener, I suppose. It was great.

SPEAKER_05 19:00

I the complete listen, you know, that to me is such a joy when you get to listen to all the the soundtrack in its entirety, sequence correctly. It just it's it's it takes you on a journey. And I love soundtracks and I love music that take you on a journey as opposed to sort of jump all over the place or you know, the second half hadn't been recorded yet, so we don't have it on Thunderball, the original release, or whatever that story is. You know, it just I listened to it and I, you know, it just it's it's riding high on a wave or something. I don't know how to describe it, but no, I completely understand what you're saying. Well, guys, we are here today with this massive announcement that as of today, March 31st, that the new La La Lands Diamonds Are Forever, 55th Anniversary has dropped. Uh, you know, hit pause on this podcast, get over to the website and order this now before they are gone. So we are thrilled to dive into the world of diamonds. Obviously, composer John Barry. We're in Vegas, you know, it's playful, it's 1971. And it's kind of interesting for me where this particular score sits in John Barry's Bond Evolution. And I wanted to ask you guys about that. I mean, coming off this incredible run of Goldfinger, You Only Live Twice, Majesties, and then to Diamonds, where where does this score sit with you guys? What are your initial thoughts on the score prior to the remastering process?

SPEAKER_02 20:41

Well, uh, I'll I'll go first on this one, Chris. You I'll give you time to think on it. I've always enjoyed the score. It I I was not a fan of the movie for for a long time. And then there was a an event up in New York City where they showed all six of Sean Connery's James Bond films in a day on 35mm. Wow. And my friend and I, being very young, went up, drove up to this. It was about a 90-minute, two-hour drive just to just to get up there. And we watched Dr. No through Diamonds Are Forever. And Diamonds started, I guess, around midnight at you know and and and so I was a little punchy at the time and absolutely fell in love with the movie. And ever since then, that it's it's been, you know, one of my favorite, you know, James Bond movies. And I and I can't explain why because I understand that it's you know, it's not hard hitting, it's not Ian Fleming so much, you know, it's a little more jokey, it's it sort of shows the the direction that the series is gonna take in the seventies. And but I I've loved it. And then the album came out a few you know, the expanded album came out a few years later and it's it's just a it's a terrific score. What we know. We all love Capsule in Space from You Only Live Twice. Well, this one has its own, this has, you know, 007 and counting, which is sort of like the cousin.

SPEAKER_04 22:08

Yeah. In the same family.

SPEAKER_02 22:10

Yeah, oh, totally. It's John Berry's space, James Bond's bass music, and it's terrific.

SPEAKER_04 22:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:15

And then you've also got, you know, John mentioned going to Japan and listening to You Only Live Twice. Well, I go to Las Vegas and I put on Diamonds Are Forever. Oh Circus Circus. Circus Circus and yeah, you know, what I call Los Angeles to Las Vegas on year that, you know, all that. Yeah. Nothing better. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 22:34

So well, I feel like this film and the soundtrack gets better as you we grow older. You know, the older I get, and as I start heading into what I call my silver years, I just this soundtrack makes so much so so much sense to me. And it's just, it's such a pleasurable listen. You know, it Barry is just so confident at this point and laid back. And I always like to, you know, take into consideration it's 1971, leisure suits. You know, we're on the cus of disco. The the hippie years are over and everyone's uh waistline's expanding. So you need music that complements that, and I think it complements it perfectly. Chris Malone, what about you?

SPEAKER_01 23:25

I love it, John. I think it's a terrific score. And as a film, I used to really enjoy it when I was younger, and I still enjoy it now. I don't I don't really pick at the faults of the film. I really just enjoy it for what it is. One thing I would say though, that's quite interesting about it is it's the last of the John Barry kind of scored films before he took a break with Live and Let Die that he was unable to do for whatever reason. So this is kind of him with the last Connery film giving all the cool stuff that he gave to the earlier films. And what disappointed me as a younger person was getting that original LP album because I felt that it did a disservice to kind of that architecture of all of his music, in that I said before, you only live twice, but I thought was a brilliant album at distilling the best bits of the score. Whereas I felt that Lyman's album just had too many sort of loungy versions of the theme on there. And whilst that's perhaps appropriate given the setting of the film in itself, it did miss out on the the action music that was used in the elevator fight, for example, and also in the pre-credits scene. It it missed out on just giving me some more of that underscore that I guess I was expecting. And to Neil's point though, it it did include one of the absolute best cubes that I just love so much, which is 007 and Kem Hunting. I think that's just an absolutely phenomenal view, how Barry was able to catch this the space theme aspect again, but cut between the space and then the interior location it was the dialogue and you know every every it just his his approach to structuring that piece was just so grand. So it's it's an album that I was disappointed with as a teenager, but then when the 2003 expanded edition came out, I was really able to reassess it and thrilled that all of the pieces I wanted to hear were actually on them. And it it changed it completely for me from this this score that I knew from the film, was happy with it, but having it able to listen to it on its own merits was so much better.

SPEAKER_05 25:51

Yeah. I I you know, to your point about being youthful and and whatnot, I mean I feel like the loungey gets better the older you get, you know.

SPEAKER_02 26:00

And and and that original soundtrack album has been lovingly re-edited and remixed and remastered on disc two of our set.

SPEAKER_01 26:08

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 26:09

You can listen to it again.

SPEAKER_01 26:10

But I think I think you're right, John, to that point is that w the disappointment disappointment that I might have had saying as a teenager is something that I don't so much in the album now because partly because there's the freedom of choice to listen to any part of it I want, but also you know, it's one of those things of sort of saying, well, why did they pick that versus that? And and to understand that there was somebody making that choice. It wasn't just a random decision, you know, you you kind of gain to respect that as well.

SPEAKER_05 26:43

Absolutely. Well, let's talk a little bit about why this release, incredible release, matters. Gentlemen, can you speak on the unreleased cues, the film versus album versions, and the sound improvements that you guys have, you know, worked, I imagine, very hard on for this particular release?

SPEAKER_02 27:04

Well, well, Chris handled the the mix and he he can he can talk further on that. It is the same material that was used for the 2003 album. Um so it's the same exact transfers, and that's been sort of our modus operandi since you know Live and Let Die was the same way, uh Secret Service, Thunderball, and now Diamonds. And so it's the same multi-tracks, but we've done a fresh new edit and mix on it. As far as unreleased material, the great thing about the 2003 album was that it was pretty complete, you know. Um you could, you know, you could edit it and sequence it in such a way that you, you know, I had a friend, you know, listen to this and say, hey, this plays really well. And I'm like, well, that's a weird thing to say. I've been listening to it this way for 20 some odd years. I guess he just never re-sequenced his album, but you could, and this is basically what I've been listening to all that time. Just, you know, freshly re-edited and mixed and mastered. As far as unreleased music, I think we have like some extra music from Slumber Inc., you know, some of that extra organ stuff. Uh we have a longer version of the White House, which is we included that because so much of it is used in the movie, and I wanted to make sure that the film performances are reflected on this album. So that's on here. Some of the overlays from Circus Circus are included now. So that's really it as far as unreleased, you know, score cues.

SPEAKER_05 28:41

The sequencing alone is worth the price of admission. It's just again, it's sequenced so beautifully. And I did the same thing with that earlier release. I, you know, took the tracks individually and tried to sequence them myself in a playlist. But to have the album remastered, sequence, to have the original album, some of the alternative cues, it's just it's just incredible.

SPEAKER_02 29:06

Yeah, the the original album wasn't all that different from what's what's on disc one. Circus circus is a different take. Okay. And and that's it, and so what's on disc two, circus circus, it's disc two, track four, that's not on the 2003 CD.

SPEAKER_05 29:23

Nice.

SPEAKER_02 29:24

The 2003 C D presented only the film version of that take. So it's a different performance. So so so there's something that that that's kind of cool that you know wasn't there on the on the previous one. It was on the obviously the original album.

SPEAKER_01 29:37

Yeah. And and we've got a point out there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then the the uh Italian version.

SPEAKER_02 29:47

Well, the Italian version is available, and we just thought, well, it's out there and we can license it, so we should put it on here so so the internet doesn't complain. I I also think uh sounds better. It does. It yes, we and and Chris did a Chris really did a terrific job on our because I I f I I can't confirm this. I you know what I'm not even gonna bother saying it on what the source was for the uh you know, for that. But but regarding the alternate Diamonds or Forever song, the Shirley Bassie song, I this the score needed needed an ending.

SPEAKER_05 30:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:27

Because I as I was working on it, the last track recorded is the end of Mr. Wint and Mr. Kid. And it's like, is that really how the this you know hour-long score is gonna end? It just ends it because it it felt unresolved. It just goes da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. I'm like, but it needs it needs something. And I went, oh wait, we have this, we have this extra, you know, this alternate tape with extra lyrics. That could work as a pretty good close on the album. So that's why it's it's on there, and that's fine.

SPEAKER_05 31:01

It rounds it out perfectly. I mean, to let everyone know, obviously, this episode's gonna come out the day of the official release, but Chris and I were able to get our hands on a little advanced listen to it. Where the hell did you get that? Exactly. Oh, wait. Oh, wait, oh yeah. The album is out now. Please go buy it. And as I was, you know, looking at the titles, I had two hours with between both discs to basically lead up to that. And to be honest with you, I had not heard that. No. So the entire two hours are spent going, wait, what is that? What's gonna happen at the end? And then I started to read the liner notes, which are fantastic by Berlingame and yourself. And I didn't realize that it was Take 20 that they actually used, correct? That's that's right.

SPEAKER_02 31:49

Yeah. So Take 20 is the one in the film and on the soundtrack album. It's the one we've heard for 55 years.

SPEAKER_05 31:56

All right, well, we have to talk about the sound improvements and the the mixing on this release is a masterclass. Chris, can you tell us everything about that process?

SPEAKER_01 32:08

Sure. So John Barry recorded at a studio called the Cinitell Sound Studios, CTS, was it was what it was known, an acronym, in Bayswall, in London. And that was a converted banqueting hall that was owned by the Whiteleagues Department Store. And they started there in about 1956, but it was 1959 that things really took off. And they did a huge amount of film music recording, TV spots, TV music, jingles, all sorts of stuff. They were very busy, and the reason they were busy is because they had great acoustics, excellent engineers, and the best equipment that could be found really in the UK of that time. So Diamonds Are Forever, cut them to Diamonds Are Forever. John Barry had done all of his earlier James Bond scores there. He had done many other film projects there, and it was his favourite studio to record him. But Diamonds was one of the last scores recorded there because in 1972 they lost their leaps on the studio space and they needed to relocate. So what we're hearing by that time is an evolution of John Batbury's familiarity with that space and the engineers, and also the evolution of the equipment that they were using to record with. So Come Diamonds Out Forever, it's an eight-track recording. What that means is that across eight different tracks, or perhaps you can visualize railway lines on a tape, we have separate sections of the orchestra. Now, because there's only eight of them, there are decisions that are made by the recording engineer who was John Richards. He started recording James Bond Scores with You Only Lift Whites, and he continued all the way through to Octopusy actually with John Barry, except Moonracker that was done in Paris. And he had decided how he would allocate the sections of the orchestra down to the tape. So he would give us a left and right string section, so that's taking up two tracks. He would separate out the winds and things like saxophones, he would separate out the trombones, the trumpets, and the French horns, and then through percussion keyboards, that sort of stuff to sort of fill out the rest. So when it came to mixing this, there are decisions about where do you put those instruments in the stereo field? How loud, how soft do you want them, how much reverberational echo do we want to add to it, so that when we're listening to it as the final mix stereo mix, we're considering all these things and listening and thinking, yep, that sounds like we'd expect it to sound. So one of the things that Neil and I are very keen on, especially with these James Bond scores, because they have such a connection and embedding into our soundtrack listing history, is that we don't want to stray too far from what the original sounded like. And while we have the luxury of sending some of these cues that had never been released before, or certainly prior to the 2003 editions, we're only heard in mono in the film. But the the stereo album was generally our reference for how things could sound. Now, when it came to diamonds though, there were some ideas I had with Neil about the type of stereo spread and where we would put trumpets versus French horns so that we could get a bit more of the effect that I think John Barry perhaps had in mind for things like the elevator fight music, where we're having one part of the orchestra almost talk to the other side across the sound stage. So I was keen to do some things like that that didn't really work against, I suppose, what John Barry was intending to do, but really fitted in with what I knew of the CTS kind of sound of that era and how engineers like John Richards recorded these things in the first place. So we're very keen to kind of be authentic to the period sound, but also make some choices that allow it to be perhaps modernized a little bit just to connect with the audience a bit better and serve perhaps some of the composition choices a bit better.

SPEAKER_05 36:42

What what in all of that was your biggest challenge where you said, Oh, okay, I gotta roll my sleeves up for this?

SPEAKER_01 36:49

I don't think anything actually was a particular challenge because there'd be the scenario with these guys is that by then John Richard was a very accomplished engineer already. He knew what he was doing. There's nothing that was technically insufficient about the recording. It was executed very nicely. And I don't think there was any particular challenges other than really, I think the first thing that I dive straight into was 007 and counting. I was like, I've got to hear this and see what we can make of this. So that's where you started the thing that I went to straight up.

SPEAKER_02 37:22

I obviously remember that. Yeah, because like I remember emailing Chris and okay, well, our next one is gonna be diamonds, and it was like, oh, double seven and counting. I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 37:33

So you dove right into the deep end of the pool with that cue. Yeah. That's fantastic.

SPEAKER_04 37:40

Yeah, Chris, go ahead. Yeah, just just a question, because I'm a I'm a diehard Beatles fan, and obviously we've been quite spoiled recently with Beatles releases and isolated strings off of Abbey Road, and I I lap all that stuff up. I love it. And when I've listened to interviews with Giles Martin, for instance, it it sounds like you're kind of treading a bit of a tightrope in that obviously you want this this recording to sound fresh and enhanced, and for lack of a better word, sort of blowing dust off of it so it's it has new life, but at the same time, you don't want to divert too much from the original mix that you're gonna put fans out saying, Oh, you know, that guitar's way lower in the mix than it would be normally, and uh, you know, I now have beef because of that. Is that something that you think about when you're actively working on the project, or do you put that to the back of your mind and just trust your own ears and think, right, well, we can only do what we're doing? How does that work? Like the mindset.

SPEAKER_01 38:32

Yeah, I I think it's it's but yeah, go on, Nickman, you've got an idea.

SPEAKER_02 38:35

I was just gonna say, yeah, between Chris and me, we're both I I as far as I can tell, we're both pretty fanatical about maintaining what others did. Yeah. Because you really at least my philosophy, and I think Chris goes for the same, but he'll tell me if I'm wrong here, is that you know, we're not reinventing the wheel. You know, I I want to honor what John Barry and John Richards did. Yeah, yeah. And I think we've gotten really close on these without being revisionist, but you know, given the the the technology, we're able to go a little bit further than you know what what was able to be achieved 55 years ago. And you they could do great stuff 55 years ago. It's just sort of like you know, we're yeah, just a little bit uh a little bit clearer now.

SPEAKER_04 39:26

To get into the weeds a little bit, when it comes to sort of the cli the cleaning up, for lack of a better word, of this audio, you know, there there are there are things out there now like the the whole Peter Jackson technology that they can separate, you know, what what kind of what what does cleaning up look like for you? Are we talking EQ to sort of bring different levels up and down? What what does that look like?

SPEAKER_01 39:48

I I think to to answer this bit and to also just extend on what Neil was saying, yeah, we're we're not trying to be historically revisionists with any of this. We're we're both fans of this material and we be know it very well to start with, but we also want to overcome some of the things that they probably would have overcome at the time if they had the option to do it as well. So we're just kind of we're respecting the ear, but then we're just modernising things just enough so that it doesn't draw you back into straight away going, oh, that's definitely 55 years old. You you it's fresh enough to stand on its own merits now. And I think to the point of what does cleanup look like? Well, most of the time it starts with saying, what can I hear that I perhaps shouldn't be hearing? So it's things that are defects in terms of tape dropouts, if there are any there. It might be things like musicians banging into microphone stands. It will be pops and clicks that that might not in terms of vitamin pops and clicks, but sort of electrical noises that sometimes creep into these recordings. Things like at Maine's electrical hum being recorded in the UK, that's at 50% like it is in USA. And it's really just getting everything in order such in such a way. This is how sort of Neil and I do these things in such a way that you can then build out your balance, mix with your EQs and your reverbs and things on it, so that you can then output it, we can listen to it, and we can say we might want this a bit louder, a bit softer, whatever adjustments we want to make, but no, that it's basically completely automated so we can then re-output it again and listen again and not have to go through any sort of clean up or tidy up process again, because that's done across each of the individual tracks on the multi-track to get them as sounding as as best as we can and as clean and clear as we can before we even start the mixing process.

SPEAKER_04 42:03

Yeah, so you know every ingredient as such is as clean as it can possibly be.

SPEAKER_03 42:08

Could I ask the question?

SPEAKER_01 42:10

I was just gonna say there's another benefit of that process, even though it's it's quite time consuming, because in the case of documents being a say an eight-track recording and things like Livin' Lake Die and Golden Gun being 16-track, is that I'm going through each of those individual tracks for each cue and and making that little body up process. But what it does is it gives you a mental dissection of the score. So you then sort of mentally recording for yourself things like saying, okay, so I'm now just checking the the trumpet trap to what's going on there, and you'll hear things instrumentally as the musicians are performing it that you'll think, ah, actually we we want to maybe bring that out a little bit more than what we've heard previously, just a bit, or actually that's you know, overbearing what I remember the flute to do at that point, so just remember to bring that down a touch when we're mixing it. It's all that sort of stuff that you then just create in in your mind as the roadmap for when you do actually do the mix.

SPEAKER_04 43:12

Yeah, well, I I've got to say, I I've been obviously you've been kind enough to give us this release early for a sneak peek, and obviously since I've received it, it's all I've listened to over and over again.

SPEAKER_05 43:22

Yeah, it's like they're good for the rest of my day. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 43:27

Two of my standouts, well, three of my standouts, one of them is the Hotel Tropicana cue, which why? I mean, waste is the wrong word, but to write something that phenomenal for that kind of scene just blows my mind because you wouldn't, you know, composers nowadays wouldn't put so much effort, I don't think, into I'm gonna call it a throwaway scene like that. But that that cue is just unbelievable. Love obviously love the slumber ink organ, really cool. Love how the audio dips in and out. I love that. But one thing I want to just touch base on the alternate version. Version of Diamonds. I played it, I had it, I listened to it a few different ways. I had it in nice noise-cancelling headphones. I played it through my stereo here, through the hi-fi, and I've played it in the car. And what one thing that gets me every single time is the clarity on Shirley's voice. Because obviously she comes in, I know you've got the electric piano and it's it's quite sparse at the beginning, but I remember hearing the clarity and thinking, how are they going to mix this? What how is the rest of the track going to come in and not feel like Shirley's too loud? And what you've managed to do is maintain the clarity of Shirley's voice because you can hear every single syllable, but then when the rest of the tune kicks in, everything has its own space. And it just blows my mind because when you hear it, you can really hear the separation in everything. So one thing I wanted to ask was with the alternate version or the title track if you like, what what would the what would the stems be for that? Because I know there's a funky wahwa guitar in there. Was was that isolated? Were you able to listen to just the guitar on its own track? I'm assuming you had Shirley's isolated vocal, which must have just given you shivers. You know, I'd love to know if you can remember what kind of tracks make up that multi-track.

SPEAKER_02 45:16

I yeah, I don't know, but maybe Chris does. Maybe Chris has like his notes or something.

SPEAKER_01 45:21

No, no, I don't I don't have anything in front of me to tell me. But um my memory is that yes, there's a track reserved for Shirley's vocal.

SPEAKER_04 45:28

Oh yeah. Wow. Um you've listened to that in isolation.

SPEAKER_01 45:31

Yeah, that's completely isolated. And then then there's the the rhythm section. Maybe that was drums and bass, I recall, were together. Because there's two of the orchestra, which is not in the way that we have for the rest of the score, where it's strings and then say trumpets, trombones, horns. This was, I think, more or less a left and right of the entire orchestra.

SPEAKER_04 46:03

Wow, okay, like a stereo spread.

SPEAKER_01 46:05

Yeah, yeah. So you had the the strings in there, you had the the trumpets on the the left, trombones on the right. And then the remaining tracks were uh splits out of the the guitars, as as you've said. Bit of additional percussion, the just those cymbal hits by them by themselves, but I think maybe that was with the organ, perhaps, on that one.

SPEAKER_03 46:30

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 46:30

So yeah. It's separate enough that you can rebuild now what you expect to hear. But it's but it's also got some things baked into it that maybe here and there now. We I would have probably liked to have a bit more discrete as aspect about it, but that's okay. Like it all turned out beautifully, but you you c you can't you can't, as Dil was talking about earlier, go back in the time machine and and grab each individual track off the mixing console and and scroll it away and use that later. So all these things, when they're working with something like eight-track or even sixteen or twenty-four-track, they're making decisions with the end goal in mind to just have the enough flexibility, but at the same time having to make some choices that they know are baking into the the process in such a way that if John Barry would say after he'd recorded it, Hey, look, we really need to hear the violins a lot more than we're hearing them, then they'd have to just re-perform it because it's it's already that choice is already.

SPEAKER_04 47:43

And just give more in the performance. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 47:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 47:45

God, that's that's unbelievable. So you're probably one one of the few, you know, people that I've heard Shirley Isolated, one of the best vocals in the world. Do you do you sort of has the not the novelty worn off as such, but has working on so many projects numbed you to that, or do you still pinch yourself and think, wow, this is something really special that we're hearing surely in isolation?

SPEAKER_01 48:08

I think this is a good question for Neil as well, but for me, it's it's marvellous. It's just so good to hear this stuff that you've known pretty much all your living memory, and then to say, wow, I'm just hearing this, like nobody else to this point other than Neil has actually heard it. And so it is very special. And every project, I think, no matter what it is, if it's James Bond or anything, you have to find something that you fall in love with it, because then that makes you give it as as good as you can give it. And the past is no exception. So gearing those things like double ANE counting and being able to sort of dissect the orchestra and work out what John Barry was really doing with that, and then hearing Shirley Bassby singing this in isolation, and I did listen to it by itself, and I did go back on some of the earlier tapes too, just to see what she was doing back on those.

SPEAKER_04 49:00

And it's just the breath, you know, the in-breath and and all the little nuances that you you're not going to hear when it's in the full mix, but you're almost having a little sneak peek to hear the actual performance, you know. And and maybe when you when you do listen to vocals in isolation, not that I would ever say that Shirley would do this, but with some vocalists, you can hear where maybe they fall slightly flat. And the alternative take, because we're used to that title song, you know, for so many years, when you listen to that alternative take, she's she does a few lines in different ways, cuts lines off a little early, whereas usually on the original track she would let those those lines carry on slightly and extend them. So it's quite jarring to hear it and go, oh, you know, that feels familiar, but it also feels completely different. So I think to to be able to be in that room with you, just to hear those those in breaths, the you know, I I th I just think that must be so special. That that to me is the stuff that really excites me personally.

SPEAKER_02 49:59

Well, because I I I can't speak for Chris, but he might have a you know a similar view at this point, you know, like we're both grizzled and jaded soundtrack people who've been doing this for a long time now. Yeah. So but see, there is always one of those moments where you go, oh my gosh. Yeah, look what I found.

SPEAKER_04 50:21

Yeah, look what raid is the lost arc.

SPEAKER_02 50:23

It's one of those moments where you just go, oh my goodness, we're gonna make a billion dollars. You know, and and yeah, so so yeah, it is, it is, and it is cool to sometimes sit down and just go, you know, here it is. You know, like I had something similar. You talk about Shirley Bassey. I had come back from vacation in 2024 and I got an email. You know, I sit down at the computer and it's oh, your transfers are ready. I go, okay, well, oh, it's Goldfinger. Oh, you know, when I woke up this morning, I wasn't expecting to listen to multiple takes of Shirley Bassey singing Goldfinger. And that happened. And I was like, okay, well, that's a thing. And I didn't, I didn't have I don't think I had the film take of her in isolation, but I had the mono takes of her in isolation. So I was able to listen to those and recut it. And we did that for the album for Goldfinger. So yeah, so you do have those moments. Yeah. So the novelty hasn't worn off. It hasn't. No, no. You just have to be a little patient. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 51:23

And do you remember you'll say on on Thunderbolt with Tom Jones with that story that's been getting around forever, which is a great story of how he supposedly fainted after the last night. And we're listening to the vocal just by itself. You're like, I can't, I can't really tell that that happened. Oh, you hear a crash bang wallop at the end. Yeah. Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 51:43

I I never I never heard I never heard Shirley take her bra off.

SPEAKER_05 51:50

That was my that was my next question. I was like, what are you guys holding out on over there? Like what didn't get this release if you've got all these? I mean, could you just keep going with additional disc? I mean, is there that much material? Or do you have to show some constraint and go, okay, this is a commercial product. We've got two two CDs, we got time constraints. You know, how does that work?

SPEAKER_02 52:11

Absolutely. It's always well, the uh obviously a time constraint is is a real thing. You know, CDs have a lot of space on them, but in the end it's about close to 80 minutes and and you're done. Yeah. You know, so so that's a thing. But you also w want to present this music in the best way possible. And that means you don't necessarily want somebody to hear somebody's outtakes, somebody's mistakes. You want to hear the final polished, perfected version of a cue. Yeah. Where possible. I mean, if if there's something that was abandoned, and that you know a perfect example is Street Chase on Thunderball, which we did.

SPEAKER_04 52:56

Uh the the orchestration thing, the mistake.

SPEAKER_02 52:59

Well, no, and and Street Chase, they did an early version of it. In the movie, Street Chase is the 007 theme.

SPEAKER_04 53:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 53:06

But they did an early version of it where it was Mr. Kiss Kiss Bang Bang. Da da da da da da da. Da. They never did a finished polished take of that. They they did three takes of it and moved on and they abandoned it. Yeah. And the take, the the take that we had had mistakes in it. It was like, it was like, well, it's cool, but can we put this out?

SPEAKER_03 53:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 53:32

And so what I did is I went back and digitally recut it to get rid of the mistakes. So it's like, okay, now we at least like it it may not be what was wholly intended, but it's presentable now. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 53:53

No, you want it to sound the best it can possibly sound and the best out of it.

SPEAKER_02 53:56

You want the best performance, obviously. Yeah, of course. So so so that that's something I'm I'm very tough on myself on with these, is making sure that the performances are correct. Yeah. That that I've I've done the research and and and matched them to the movie or matched them to the soundtrack album and figured it all out. So that and and then hope it all fits.

unknown 54:19

Wow.

SPEAKER_04 54:19

Yeah, well, that's not lost on us. That's no, yeah, we appreciate that.

SPEAKER_05 54:23

We cr Chris and I have an ongoing conversation that, you know, is this is this show about music or is it about Bond? And to be honest with you, we're we're it's really about music, and we're just huge soundtrack fans. And you know, Lala is so much, does so much more than just the Bond catalog. I I couldn't live with myself now that I got you guys both here. I want to pull back the curtain a little bit on La La as a company. And, you know, you had mentioned some of the core players at La La Land Records. As far as behind the scene goes, how does the process work, not just with the Bond catalog, but other soundtracks? I mean, is it a Monday morning meeting and you guys go, you know what, we're gonna do basic instinct. How does that what's the politics behind the choices you make and the end results? How does that work?

SPEAKER_02 55:25

Um gosh, it's i i I wish it was that formal. Um but it's really, you know, I I the no, in the case of something like James Bond, just to use that as an example, they came to me and said, I guess I I you know this and this is you know nine years ago now, so forgive me if my memory isn't a hundred percent perfect. But they came to me and said, you know, we're gonna be doing Die Another Day. We got the you know, we got the rights to it and we'd like you to produce it. Okay, great. Like so perfect. And then the same thing happened on The World Is Not Enough, which was you know, and and and and I've said this before and I'll say it again. Once Die Another Day was done, I had no grand visions of visiting the Bond catalog again. I thought, well, that's it. I got to go to the CV.

SPEAKER_03 56:20

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 56:20

And and there you go. What you know, we have it. So so when that came out, I guess in the the end of November, beginning of December in 2017. And then around April 2018, they said, Oh, we got the rights to World Is Not Enough, we're gonna put that out. I was great, one you know, wonderful. And uh we did that album and it came out in November uh 2018. And then there was sort of a pause. I don't know why, yeah, you know, I didn't I didn't ask or anything. And then they came to me in 2022 and said, Oh, we're doing Tomorrow Never Dies. I said, Great, wonderful. And so now we're doing Tomorrow Never Dies. And it came out in I guess November, December 2022. And but while that was going on, I had started doing a little because at this point you're like, well, let's let's you know, I need to eat. Let's see what's let's see what we can get. So I started doing some research into the Bond albums and talking with MGM, you know, with with Lola Land's Blessing, of course, you know, you know, to see what was available. And and and it didn't really, I can't say it didn't go anywhere, because I think it planted the seed. Yeah. That we were interested in this. I I take I don't take any credit for it, but I'm saying this might have happened, because I, you know, I don't know. Started the ball rolling. It might have, because in early 2023, MGM came to us. Wow. And said, hey, given the dying octopus you're having anniversaries this year, do you want to put those out? And MV Gerhard and I, we were texting and we dropped some curse words and said, fuck yeah. Yeah. And we uh immediately said yes, of course. And and that goes back to the 2003 albums and and Lucas Kendall. Yeah, who I Chris and I had both worked with over the years. We both did Star Trek, uh, the original series with with Lucas, and I did you know uh a lot of films for monthly titles with him. So I had backups of his hard drives, which he, you know, he's like, I want these you know protected off-site. So I had all this material. I had uh was it Thunderball and yeah, I had the five 2003 albums. I had them. Wow. So so literally the getting the go-ahead to do Live and Let Die, the next day I was already cutting it. I was like, well, it's on this hard drive, I'll just copy it off and start working on it. And I did instantly. And and so after those two happened, that's when I was like, okay, well, what about Golden Gun and Moonraker? Yeah, and and oh, sure, go ahead. So in and in those cases, it was sort of you know, the the label was making and and you have to understand the label is the one making these decisions meant much much of the time. They'll come to me or they'll come to Chris and say, Hey, we're doing this album, we want you to do XXX on it. Yeah. And you know, I can certainly pitch, I can say, Hey, have you guys considered this? Have you thought about you know, because they're soundtrack fans too. And I don't know if that comes, you know, if that's known. They're they're as you know, they're as big as nerds as we are. Yeah, yeah. Um, you know, so so they're always open to to and this goes for you know entrata as well and quartet, you know, they're they'll come to us, but they're also open to well, it would this with this thing that's available. And that's so that's been my experience. It's very, you know, like that's that's how I got to do first blood with entrata. I was just talking to Roger and I said, Hey, you know, have you ever considered revisiting first blood? And he was like, What? And I was like, Yeah, but we could do this, this, this, this, and this was it. We did that last year. So so there's a lot of give and take.

SPEAKER_04 59:47

A quick question about that. Obviously, you you're saying, right, should we do this project? Should we do this project? Do you have to bank on the fact that there's already digitized versions of tapes, or uh have you ever had to do a project where you've had to go to the original tapes and uh you know extract digital versions?

SPEAKER_02 1:00:02

Oh, all the time. All the time. Really? Oh, yeah, yeah. Oh, you'd never that's one of the weird things about this that you discover. It's like, wouldn't it be great if we did well happen with Octopussy? You know, they asked us if we want to do octopusy. We said, Yeah, we'd love to do octopusy. Absolutely. Oh, you don't have any material on it.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:21

Oh wow. So yeah. So you just assume all these things have been, you know, looked after and buried away on the hard drive, but then of course I just it's not so bad.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:32

I mean, you you most of the time they have the material. Yeah. The bond with the Bond films, you have to remember United Artists wasn't really a a studio in the sense of having a lot and having storage. UA was sort of like, you make the movie, we'll distribute it. Yeah. Yeah. So there wasn't really a place to store this thing. Now with Octopus, you know, at that at that point, MGM had taken over, so it was like, well, where's the tapes? So do they have an art are they do they are all the tapes in one place? Are they scattered? What does that look like? Oh, I've never seen it. Uh I've just I've just seen the spreadsheets. Right, okay. Oh, it's here, it's here, it's here sometimes. Um yeah, you know, so sometimes stuff is here, sometimes it's in the UK. Yeah. Um in the case of Octopusy, the tapes were with Eon, so that was cool. We were able to get them from there. We had we just did new transfers on them for the album. Incredible. Moonraker, they had already transferred. Golden Gun, they had transferred for the video release, so we just pulled those tapes. They they had you know all the takes on.

SPEAKER_04 1:01:33

And these are these are 24-bit transfers. So if so if if the if a transfer wasn't up to scratch, you wouldn't work with that transfer. You need to make sure that that's top quality first.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:43

Well, you always want to start with the best transfers, like the foundation of a house. Yeah. Um and as long as you, you know, you get you as long as you you know they have a good tape and you get a good transfer off of it, you're you're golden. Um Moon Ricker, they'd already transferred. Moon Ricker they transferred in 2015. Right, okay, quite fresh. Yeah, and then they it was great. It was like it it it it sounds great. So we didn't have to do anything on that.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:09

And would that have been transferred with a view to there being a soundtrack album in the future, or would that be for a you know movie release? Why would that have been transferred in 2015?

SPEAKER_02 1:02:18

Preservation, you know, studio asset. Studio asset. I don't think I seriously, the a soundtrack album was probably the furthest thing from their mind.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:26

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:27

Um you know, because it's just it's just not it's just not a priority.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:31

No, no. God, I just find that fascinating that there would be some tapes that still aren't transferred. That just blows my mind. If if I sorry, go on.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:40

No, no, it's it's just you know what what these are still businesses. Yeah. So they have to look at it and say, where do we allocate resource? Now, obviously preservation to you, you know, is an important thing, but yeah, I don't know if if it's it's just tough to say. I you know, and some studios are great at it, some you know, they they just they all have different different uh things going on.

SPEAKER_05 1:03:08

Speaking of the business, circling back around. If I hear you right, Neil, uh in the Bond case, you've got you know the producers coming to you, but as far as the other releases of scores that you you guys have put out into the world, how do you guys determine what you're going to release? Like how do you choose those projects? Or in every case, is it the studio coming to you saying, hey, you know what, we we we we we want to do a expanded basic instinct. You know, I mean, or do you guys get to go after what you're most passionate? And I'm leading you into a conversation about Jerry Goldsmith, by the way.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:49

Okay.

SPEAKER_05 1:03:49

And so so how does that work?

SPEAKER_02 1:03:52

I mean I don't I don't think it's that I don't I my experience again, I again I don't run the record label. I you know, I I talk with them all the time, same as you know, Chris does too. But my experience is is that the the labels will go to the studios in most instances.

SPEAKER_05 1:04:09

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:10

And say, we are interested in putting this out.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:13

Okay, that's really what Chris is is that telling you.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:19

I I agree, Neil. That's been been my experience is that that discussion is and it's and the and the legal aspects around that are handled by the label. And the label will often then come to us and say, Hey, we're gonna do this. Are you interested in working on it? Um and from that point everything starts rolling in the in the world that we work in. But they've already done some work, or potentially quite a lot of work, to try and negotiate this as a process well beforehand. So some projects, by the time I've come onto them, they've already been sort of worked on, not in the audio sense necessarily, but worked on as a project for a long time.

SPEAKER_05 1:05:08

Putting it together. I just I'm trying to imagine, you know, the amount of emails La La Land must get saying please do this. Now, in all honesty, I might have sent a few of those emails. And, you know, so and continuing our conversation, uh, Neil, do you still have uh a photo of Jerry Goldsmith on your wall? Yes, I do. Excellent.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:32

Um and because we've got it's not a photo, it is an illustration by Bob Peak. Oh, and it is above it is above my tone set. It was incredible. It was at a Bob Peak gallery, and I bought the one that was on the wall, so I bought it framed. And as soon as I bought it, it was sort of it was definitely a splurge, but I was like, Well, I I gotta have this. Um as soon as I bought it, my check engine light came on. So

SPEAKER_05 1:06:00

It's better than if it came on after purchased. Yeah. Well, because I've just discovered Breakheart Pass by Goldsmith. And I'm I am dying to hear this is me probably making a pitch, you know, hear that soundtrack remastered by you guys. I it's unbelievable. I I feel like almost at least monthly I discover a new Jerry Goldsmith soundtrack. And no matter what it is, I always get some enjoyment out of it. So I heard that immediately thought of you and thought, when on your, you know, went on La La Land's website, did they do this?

SPEAKER_02 1:06:36

And you know uh They did it in 2006.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:40

They did? Oh yeah. What? Yeah. I didn't see it.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:45

Yeah, I was not involved. I was pre-Neal. I think okay. Somebody else to put off to us or reissue? They might have. Yes. Critzerland put it out in 2013.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:56

Because I just bought at Amoeba uh the soundtrack on vinyl and got home and it was a bootleg.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:01

Oh no!

SPEAKER_05 1:07:02

Yeah, and I went, son of a gun. I mean, it sounds like the soundtrack through like a brown lunch bag or something.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:09

Oh no.

SPEAKER_05 1:07:10

Yeah, yeah, yeah. That one's going back next time I make it to LA.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:13

You guys sold me an illegal album. I won't be like that. Yeah, no, there was a CD. I don't, you know, it's it's you know, uh Jerry Goldsmith did a ton of scores. Yeah. And, you know. So I I I've I'm sure I've heard Breakheart Pass. I couldn't hum one bar of it, which is probably going to offend many Goldsmith fans suddenly. Um I'd I I'd love to, you know, if if if there's something there, I'd I know I'd love to, you know, tackle it. You know, Neil, we can bite a handle that's a good one. Yeah, check it out. That's a good thing that's a great leader.

SPEAKER_05 1:07:47

Listen, I hadn't heard it either. And then over the holidays, I went down to a deep dive Charles Bronson phase and went to like the films of his that you might not know. And this was a great Western by oh god, Alistair McMain, who did Where the Eagle's Dare and Ice Station Zebra, a film that he actually wrote the screenplay to. So I said, let me check this out. Charles Bronson Undercover on a train. And by the end of it, I couldn't stop humming the the song, the music, the score. So much so that I think my girlfriend could actually hum it. It was on heavy rotation. But you know, I always think of you when I hear Goldsmith, my dark horse favorite is Outland. I can that that is just Outland and Alien double feature, you know, soundtrack double feature is just a hell of a night. What as a goldsmith, as goldsmith fans, what what are your guys' favorite dark horse underrated scores?

SPEAKER_02 1:08:54

Oh boy. The the the he wrote so many. Sometimes when you sit down and work on these things, you start to go, oh my gosh, how did we overlook this? And the one that just popped into my head, and I I admit I don't listen to it that often, but I remember working on it, was Chain Reaction.

SPEAKER_05 1:09:12

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:13

And just going, geez, this guy and Chain Reaction is fascinating. It's like it perfectly encapsulates Jerry Goldsmith's career because Jerry Goldsmith didn't score the fugitive. Fugitive, you know, four-star movie, nominated for best picture, right? And and obviously temp tracked with Jerry Goldsmith at times. You can hear Total Recall in the Fugitive at times. What? Yeah, yeah. Oh my god. So which is no slight against James Newton Howard because the score is fantastic.

SPEAKER_05 1:09:45

But Total Recall is amazing. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:47

And I love Total Recall too.

SPEAKER_05 1:09:49

And you did an incredible job on that, by the way. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:51

But anyway, but but then you get to Jerry Goldsmith's career. He doesn't score the fugitive. What does he score? He scores U.S. Marshals, the sequel to The Fugitive, and he scores chain reaction from the same director as the fugitive, but not quite as well received. And it was like, why couldn't Goldsmith have scored the fugitive? It's like he got to do all the adjacent fugitive scores, but not the fugitive. But you still listen to chain reaction, and Jerry Goldsmith brought his A game to it, and it's fantastic.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:26

Yeah. So, and and and I know some people, you know, the common thought at the time was, well, it's it's late 90s Goldsmith. He's like, you know what? I'll take late 90s Goldsmiths for the win, Alec.

SPEAKER_05 1:10:36

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. I mean, I I'm down with the Medicine Man soundtrack, the movie.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:42

Ugh.

SPEAKER_05 1:10:44

Oh, the both, yeah. I tried revisiting it recently and went, yeah, it's still it's not a good movie. It's not a good movie, but that score is fantastic, you know?

SPEAKER_02 1:10:53

Well, because because, and I think it was Jeff Bond who said this, Jerry Goldsmith scored the perfect version of the movie. He scored he scored the version of the movie the filmmakers wish they had made. And so, yeah, he he just delivers every time.

SPEAKER_05 1:11:07

Incredible. Chris, what about you as a man behind the mixing boards? What it what Jerry Goldsmith do you would you like to get your hands on?

SPEAKER_01 1:11:15

I don't know about getting my hands on per se. I anything is always good fun because he was such a great composer. So we we know that any of his work, whatever period it comes from, is always going to be great fun to work on and great fun to listen to. His period of sort of that late 70s to early 80s is a particular favourite of mine. But for things that I've worked on that did surprise me, I think Seconds, which is from 1966, certainly did. And it's very different to the goldsmiths of the 1990s, just as the other was from 1972, I think that one comes from. And that's as music is very beautiful but also very dark in some respects, kind of prefigures a little bit of what he was doing, maybe in the omen, but it's just again, what wherever you wherever you dig with Goldsmiths, you kind of you find something that's really fascinating and interesting. And it's to to some of the fans out there, I think that's that sixties, early seventies period that they think he was most invented because he took a lot of risks and pushed himself for things like Planet of the Apes, you know, a very avant-garde kind of score for his time. And as Neil says, by the time he gets to the 1990s, he's he's a bit more established in this particular groove, and we can kind of very much know what to expect, even though it's very engineable. So I think he's just a fascinating composer for the way that he evolved over time and he changed his style to kind of fit the requirements of films.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:00

Right on. Yeah, he's he's his face is definitely on the Mount Rushmore of composers. And my wall.

unknown 1:13:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:09

By Bob Peak, too. That's incredible. Well, we have one last question before we let you guys go, because we could keep you here all day, trust me. We hope we can do this again with you guys. And this one's from Chris and myself. What who why do you say, all right, we're gonna do put this out on vinyl? How does that who makes that call and can we plead to them for this diamonds are forever?

SPEAKER_02 1:13:39

How does that work? There's there's no magic formula for that. I don't I don't really know if there's a way to answer that question.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:50

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:50

Fair enough.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:51

Yeah, we don't want to put it right there.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:54

We'll keep we'll just we'll I'm not asking is diamonds coming out. I'm not asking that. I was just curious to know. Sometimes they get a vinyl release, sometimes they don't. I buy them all. The Scarface is in heavy rotation in my house. Cool. Love that. The the Godfather I got the cannoli one too.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:14

Um Mo Mo Green was my idea. Yeah, that was my idea.

SPEAKER_05 1:14:19

They were like, that it is that is a Sunday night beauty.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:24

They we were going back and forth with colors, yeah, and I was just like, well, what about Mo Green? And and and it sort of stuck. Um brilliant. So I will say this though, and I don't know if this has been Chris's experience or if Chris Chris has ever discussed it with anyone, because I've discussed it with Lala Land. And it I appreciate that your vinyl buyers, and perhaps a lot of your listeners are. Right.

unknown 1:14:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:53

Um and I don't know if it's because Lala Land has been doing CDs for so long that that's what their buyers expect. But cracking the vinyl market, now Goldfinger, Moonraker, they've sold out. I think Scarface sold out, Star Trek the Motion Picture sold out. You know, they they've they've put out Young E T. These things have have have come and gone, but they've they're very you know, the limited edition, you know, like a thousand units of vinyl. Yeah. Five thousand of each. Five hundred of each.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:21

Or something like that. Yeah. And it's like it's it's you know, you look at something like what Mondo used to do, or or what I forget what the label's called now, because they haven't called me. Um mutant. Mutants, um they set seem to sell out pretty quickly and have a pretty good supply, but for whatever reason, cracking the vinyl market has been difficult. Um now it's not to say that they're not going to do more, but it's sort of like the CDs are doing better. We need to focus on that.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:52

Wow. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:54

And so all you ever read about is how the vinyl renaissance, vinyl vinyl, vinyl. That's what I was gonna say. And CDs are CDs are passe, and yet that hasn't been our experience.

SPEAKER_05 1:16:05

That's amazing.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:06

And it's gotta you've got to look at it from a business point of view at the end of the day. We we're as vinyl lovers, we can look at the raw romantic side, but it is a business decision, isn't it? And it's gotta sell at the end of the day.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:16

Right. So so if you have, you know, some brilliant ideas of how to crack this. And like I said, you know, James Bond is a big deal and James Bond sells. Yeah. But even then, it's like, well, yeah, we're gonna, yeah, it's it's not like it blows out the door. It's sort of one of those, okay, yeah, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, that's gonna sell out. But it's like, well, how do we get the word out better? How do we, you know, what what can we do to to make this you know, there was an article in Variety about about the James Bond albums. Yeah. Um so it's like we're we're we feel like we're getting the word out. You know, the CDs you know are very popular, and the same people who get the CDs are getting the information about the vinyl releases, but it's always just that that last kick over the edge. It's like, what what do we have to do?

SPEAKER_04 1:17:02

It's crazy because we see it in a very isolated way, don't we, J Dubs, in that we get all of the emails in, we get all of the Instagram messages, and obviously as soon as there's a La Land release for vinyl or CD, we share it on our page. And we're inundated. I mean, it's unbelievable.

SPEAKER_05 1:17:17

It's unbelievable.

SPEAKER_04 1:17:18

Hundreds and hundreds of people I've ordered, I've ordered it, I have emails, and they're like long emails.

SPEAKER_05 1:17:23

Yeah, I like I'm I'm like, you know, we're gonna read this on the air on the next episode. I can't keep up with the emails we get based on a la la land release. They just want to talk about it. Like we have the answers to like what's gonna happen next. I'm like, I don't know. Let's just enjoy what we've got and you know, and I don't know. Be thankful.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:43

Yeah, no, it's gonna jump in with a thought that that's it's heartwarming to hear you guys saying that you're getting a a lot of good feedback about these things when they're announced, because there are over eight billion people on the earth, and yet when we think that maybe only a thousand or three thousand or five thousand are interested in a particular soundtrack, it does make me wonder why that is, why something is so so niche. And then the vinyl aspect of a soundtrack being perhaps a niche within a niche, I'm like it it it's to a degree on sort of as pure numbers, it doesn't really make sense to me. So I think there's something I I'm missing about it that somebody maybe need to explain to me.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:28

Honestly, Chris, we we do get inundated, and that's not just trying to you know make you guys feel great. We are we genuinely yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:36

That's funny because all the emails I get are hate.

SPEAKER_03 1:18:40

Oh god, no.

SPEAKER_05 1:18:41

No, they just they I mean, long, like I I don't write this long emails to my mother, and it's wonderful to see the passion, but we do, we we check it before every episode to see, you know, on your website on the 007 website to see if it's still available. If it's available, we'll ride our audience and go look. I see how many downloads our podcast gets. Like this should be sold out. Right. And and I love getting we love getting emails and DMs from people who don't have record players, but per our recommendation, just want to buy it to own it in case one day they get one because the artifact is cool, the limit edition, the color, the liner.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:22

We buy both colorways, don't we?

SPEAKER_05 1:19:24

I get them both. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:26

Day one. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:19:27

I prefer to get them through La La Land than 007 store, but um vice versa for me, because I've got to pay the shipping. Yeah, that's a whole nother thing we're dealing with right now. But um, you know, to your point, Chris, you're right. The numbers, you just kind of scratch your head and goes, well, this should be sold out in 24 hours, day one, when you think globally how many but they're Bond fans. And the only thing I can think of, and this is in no way any kind of criticism or critique, is do people know about them?

SPEAKER_02 1:19:58

Well, that's that's the thing. And it's like, well, what what can we do? No, you know, we we do, you know, we we do podcasts, you know, they do social media, and it's like, and you know, there's I see YouTube videos, I see, you know, I share this stuff myself and and and try to get the word out because you know I gotta pay rent. But but it's it's it's it's just one of those, you know, how I I don't know. And it's and and it's so funny with James Bond because everybody knows a Bond song.

SPEAKER_05 1:20:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:28

You know, so it's like it's it's it's like the most popular soundtrack franchise because you know, unlike Star Wars, it has a song. And you know, you can hear Live and Let Die on the radio. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:42

So I don't know. Can I just Can I just say, Neil, as well, something that I really appreciate from a marketing point of view is when you have those when when obviously when the soundtracks are are announced and you have those marketing shots of the whole package all all laid out, they are absolutely stunning.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:00

Oh, the environmentals, yeah. Dan Goldwasser. Dan Goldwasher does them for the CDs, Jim does them for the vinyl, and yeah, oh oh it that's that's one of the things you know I get to work with them on. They're like, well, what do you think of this product shot? What do you think of this? And it's like it's great, let's do this, let's do that. That's the same. I'll tell you a funny story about about Moonraker. It all comes back to Moonraker. Um, I had I had what I thought was a really genius idea, which was like, let's show the Earth on one side and Drafty space station on the other side. Yeah. And we sent it in for approval and it came back. This looks too much like Star Wars. And I was like, we so we couldn't do it. And I went, oh darn it.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:46

So yeah, so but no, they are absolutely impeccable. How you and I think that's that's how that makes you purchase because I we purchased them anyway, but when you see those those shots, you just think I need to order that immediately.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:59

You know, yeah, Dan and Dan and Jim.

SPEAKER_05 1:22:01

They're doing yeah, the art direction, all of it is just you know, it's presented so beautifully. And Neil, you you know what I'm talking about. You go into Amoeba and they've got the good stuff on the pillars on the walls. You throw a Scarface or a you know, a moon raker on that wall with a price tag that is probably not agreeable. Um, you know, they're it's gone immediately. So I know there's an appetite for this out there, and our pleasure to do everything we can do to, you know, help people find out about these gorgeous releases.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:38

As I always say, tell all your friends. Yeah. Yeah, we do, believe me.

SPEAKER_05 1:22:43

We've got quite a few listening right now. And so everyone, as of today, the Diamonds Are Forever 55th Anniversary Expanded Edition has dropped. Get over to La La Lands Records website and order this now because it will eventually sell out, and you don't want to have to pay that premium because you didn't get it at day one.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:07

Or as the press release says it won't be around forever. I love it.

SPEAKER_05 1:23:12

That is yeah, well played. None of us will, but yes, absolutely. Well, for Bond fans, these just aren't albums. They're they're truly new discoveries. And I will say that this one shines. It's an apex moment in your catalog. I absolutely adore this this soundtrack, and thank you guys for coming on today. This has been an absolute pleasure, and you know, we're gonna enjoy every sevete and dream of you know whatever may happen next. So uh, Neil, Chris, thanks guys so much. We really appreciate it.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:48

Thank you. Thank you very much for having me. Thank you both. It's been a delight to join the albums.