The Compliance Advantage

Beyond the Bottom Line: Cultivating Ethical Leadership in Healthcare with Larry Nabb

• Ross Ronan • Episode 6

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In episode 6 of Compliance Leadership Lounge, host Ross Ronan is joined by Larry Nabb, CEO of JET Health, to explore the critical aspects of leadership and compliance within the home health and hospice industry. Throughout the episode, listeners are treated to insightful discussions about the importance of cultivating a compliance culture, the impactful career transition of Larry Nabb from banking to healthcare, and the future trajectory of home health services. This episode sheds light on the indispensable role of trust and respect between CEOs and compliance officers, underscored by Nabb's motivations to improve patient care in memory of his grandparents. The conversation concludes with a forward-looking perspective on incorporating technology in healthcare to enhance patient outcomes.

00:00 Introduction to Compliance Leadership in Healthcare
01:02 Special Guest: Larry Nabb, CEO of JET Health
02:12 Larry Nabb's Journey into Healthcare
07:24 The Importance of Compliance in Healthcare Growth
07:55 Leadership Philosophy: Empowering Teams
11:35 Strategic Compliance: Beyond Task Management
24:18 Building a Culture of Compliance and Integrity
29:38 Advice for Aspiring Compliance Executives
33:04 Personal Wellness: Health as Wealth
34:21 Closing Remarks 

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Connect with Ross 

CCL Ep. 6 Larry Nabb

Ross: [00:00:00] In this episode, we dive deep into the realm of leadership, business growth, and the critical intersection with healthcare compliance in the home health and hospice industry. Today, we are honored to have with us a seasoned Chief Executive Officer of a predominant home health and hospice company.

Our focus will be on understanding the expectations of compliance officers in this field and how CEOs can foster respect and confidence within their compliance officers. Let's dive into it. Welcome to the Compliance Leadership Lounge. I'm Ross Ronan, your guide for insightful discussions in healthcare compliance. In our lounge, leaders and experts gather together to share their perspectives and wisdom. So grab a chair, make yourself comfortable, and join the conversation as we dive into the strategies and stories behind effective compliance leadership.

Whether you're a CEO, board member, or a compliance enthusiast, you're in the right place to learn, grow, and lead with integrity. 

Welcome and thank you for listening [00:01:00] to the Compliance Leadership Lounge. Today we have a very special guest, Larry Nabb, who is the Chief Executive Officer for JET Health, a home health and hospice company that's headquartered in Fort Worth, Texas. Larry, thanks for joining me today. I appreciate it.

Larry: Thanks, Ross. Thanks for having me on. 

Ross: Of course, Larry and I started working together. I want to say it's about two years ago, but let's not let the facts get in the way of a good story, right? And I think Larry was the CEO of the Home Health and Hospice Company. He brought in Ronan Healthcare Consultants to help emphasize the compliance structure that was already in place.

And I'll tell you from my perspective, Larry may have a different perspective on the matter. But we kicked it off and grew as colleagues and actually became quite good friends during that time period. And, really created a great relationship. I have a lot of respect for Larry and what he does as a CEO.

And I think the vast experience that he has in home health and hospice and in that arena in and of itself, which can always be somewhat of a [00:02:00] compliance frustration or nightmare or whatever you want to read from the OIGs perspective home health and hospice has always been a hot point for those areas.

I trust and respect those people who are in that industry. So Larry I, again, I appreciate it. Talk a little bit about your experience in healthcare, where you came from what you're doing now, and give us a little bit of background on you. 

Larry: Awesome. Thanks again for having me on today.

In your recant of our initial encounter is absolutely right, especially as we grow to become friends. And I think because we're so aligned. We're enthusiastic about what we do, but more importantly, I think there's a ton of accountability to to doing the right thing, which, I think we're going to talk a little bit about today.

 My story is a weird one, I started way back when it's my 2nd career. So I was a banker. If you can believe that, wealth manager. So my job is to make really rich people, even richer. So I was 16 and a half years as a wealth manager banker, and I had the good fortune to spend a lot of time around Medicare advantage, around post Q care.

Banking, high level executives of big health plans and big kind of risk [00:03:00] medical groups, if you will I would ultimately have my own series of experiences in 2008 and 2009 where I lost both my grandparents who are Vietnamese by origin, didn't speak a lick of English in America they both had varying cancers.

And what would happen over the course of this two years, as much younger guy back then in banking is, I got to experience, for 18 months, what healthcare was like in America for a frail senior who english necessarily wasn't the primary language who is disconnected from the theory of primary care or wellness.

And it was a horrific experience. To make a very long story short, what happened to me, I think unfortunately happens to many people in our country, but it led me to a decisional point in 2009 where I went back to my clients who were these big wig senior leaders in the healthcare space.

And I wanted to do something different with my life. I wanted to wake up feeling like I was making a difference to communities, not just individuals and their wealth. So I had to ask myself, if not [00:04:00] me, then who? Who's going to do it? And to come over the top of that story, I'm a big numbers guy.

I love stats and I would do a little research on my own. And no matter how much research I did, I couldn't understand the difference between Medicare and Medicaid. But what I did know is the U S census was about 30 million Americans were seniors at that time.

And we were predicting , more or less in 2010, when I decided to go live into home health was my first venture. We would have 65, 70 million Americans would be seniors by 2030. And I just thought to myself, Oh my God. If we can't handle what we have today, who's going to do it, and how are we going to deal with the onslaught of these critical seniors who need our help.

So that was a bit about how I got into health care. 

Ross: That's great. With the baby boomers and everybody coming of age and getting to that level. And we're getting up there too. Unfortunately, not quite there yet, but we're getting up there too. You really do wonder where healthcare is going, right?

Cause there's only so much capacity anybody can have. And [00:05:00] on the home health side of it, it's such a valuable. piece of health care that allows people to stay where they're at. They feel comfortable in their own situations. And I feel like they do have a lot more chance to progress and to get better.

And obviously hospice is what hospice is. But the compassionate care pieces of hospice is just, it's something that everybody needs. And I, we, Had the same kind of situation where we lost our parents and those two types of industries came in very very valuable for us in our lives. So I appreciate sharing that.

And thank you for all the work that you do in that space. So that's great. 

Larry: Yeah. Thanks. I'd add, just, the crisis is only growing, right? We have what we think would be that still 70 to 80 million people. Over the course of the next five, seven years that we're going to have to figure out how to solution, right?

50 something million Americans are seniors today. We're saying that another 15, 20 million Americans are coming our way. And there's just not enough providers, enough beds up there and people want to be at home to your point. So as far as where I'm at today, I'm at a great company called JET [00:06:00] Health.

And it aligns to my story. I like to say I'm too old to look for a job. I'm too young to not work. But certainly my time is important as there becomes apparently less of it as I age in myself. But JET Health is a culmination of businesses found to run businesses that were put together home health hospices and personal care businesses actually in four States.

So we're in this Western footprint from Idaho through Colorado. Texas and New Mexico. We service just over 2000 lives. Again, we're under the management company banner called JET Health, but downstream, we have different entity names in each of those communities. And what really attracted me to JET Health was this whole philosophy or this premise of why I do the work, which is I really want to transform communities that we live in, which means I really want to be part of a movement where we can identify a critical individual early in their disease trajectory and really help them with good care coordination, with strong provision of services, with high quality experience.[00:07:00] 

Kind of navigate those years of their life, right? With the acknowledgement that they're They could maybe stabilize slightly improved, but over time they're going to decline. So our services, the way I see it, it gives us the ability to care for people for the last three years, if not longer for life, which I really enjoy.

Ross: That's excellent. It's such a valuable service line and industry that you're championing here. And fortunately or unfortunately it does come with some compliance issues. Yeah, a lot of 

Larry: some, a lot of some. 

Ross: We'll dig into that. Everything that's valuable and everything that's out there, someone screwed up somewhere down the road and put a bunch of regulations in place.

So we have to follow them. That's 

Larry: right. You got it. 

Ross: We're all paying for bad deeds of others, but that's okay. That's the way it's always been. So since the Compliance Leadership Lounge, we do focus on leadership and relationships with leadership. I always ask my guests right off the bat, what is your favorite book [00:08:00] about leadership and then why what did it resonate with you and how do you apply it?

Larry: Sure. There's a book out there. Is a gentleman, ironically, that you would have met along the way to his name's Paul Gustafson. And he wrote a book called Team of Leaders. And Ross, there's so many great leadership books out there. But this one really resonates with me, especially at this time in my life because it really it keeps it simple in the philosophy that you really have to win hearts and minds in what we do.

We're in an industry where it's human beings, helping human beings. And you have to win hearts and minds to get people on board with doing the things you need them to do, like being compliant, like driving quality, following process, but what Paul does in this book is he really unpacks, a team of leaders this idea that, the best companies

are ones where every member of the team is deeply empowered and takes ownership of the business as if it was their own. So really what it does is it really shifts that leadership paradigm. And it takes somebody like yourself or myself who might be in a [00:09:00] senior executive position, and it really turns us

into, truly coaches at first , but then over time turns us into advisors where we get on board our team of leaders why is this, called team of leaders in different theories of how you drive culture, how you develop people, how you collaborate, but it really removes us from the middle of that structure.

Like most companies have this top down effect essentially, and it puts us on the outside end. Where we're almost like calling audibles from the side but the team in itself is a team of leaders and a team of coaches. And what I'm finding is that sort of philosophy really works well in our type of business.

A business where you have just layers and layers of clinical managers, of nurse supervisors of VPs, of directors. It's really just about trying to simplify everything around culture. But being very clear about process is that people have a tool to refer to, to follow process, but ultimately you empower these communities of people, [00:10:00] nurses, as an example, or CHHAs or finance team to really become their own team of leaders and drive their community of work, if you will to high levels.

So anyways, it really to simplify it, I think it just unpacks and. Redesigns organizations to really focus on process and focus on the group as a team to lead the business versus the CEO calling all the shots. 

Ross: It's really great because I listened to this other thing and I always forget who quotes things

so I don't take them on as myself. I just give a random air quotes to somebody who said this thing, right? So when you said. Leaders become advisors and mentors and coaches and really trying to bring people together. I heard this the other day and it was "Managers do, and leaders be." 

 

Ross: Thats 

Larry: right.. 

Ross: What does that mean?

So Managers and get stuff done. They're going to put their head down. They're going to work. And that's great. And leaders don't do that. Otherwise they become managers. But when you talk about being an advisor and a coach and a mentor, leaders lead with integrity. They are this [00:11:00] thing that people look at and respect and they want to learn from. That's right. And I think that's a great reference to that book. I have not read that, but I am going to pick it up and I'm going to read it 

Larry: That's great. And I think finally on that is, for all of our businesses and what we do, back to the crisis with how many seniors are coming our way, we've got to scale.

We've got to scale. If we don't, we're not going to meet the need of a lot of people who need us. But to scale, we have to be super organized and we have to have more coaches and advisors, teaching the larger companies how to get there. 

Ross: Yep. And leading with integrity. 

Larry: That's right.

That's right. Absolutely. 

Ross: Let's dive in here. So we have, obviously, when we look at health care and the ever changing regulatory landscape associated with it, specifically in home health and hospice, like I said before, hot topic, hot bed related to compliance matters and oversight by the OIG and DOJ.

When you think about, compliance executive, and I use that term very specifically because we [00:12:00] talk a lot about the difference between a compliance officer who is more like that manager and can do all those kind of things, to this compliance executive who is of the highest levels within the organization can have

a meaningful conversation with a CEO and a board and, just in itself be a leader, right? So when you think about a compliance executive in your position as the CEO, what do you look for primary responsibilities and expectations of that compliance executive? And then how do you see the difference between that and someone who's just a compliance officer that's just going to do tasks and task mastering?

Larry: I think the most important is a few things that come to mind. I think that the top, sounds broad, but the top and most important thing is the right compliance partner. So finding an executive that not only has the chops experience, the background integrity, the moral fiber, all the table stakes, But but behaves like a partner, [00:13:00] right?

So to the CEO, to the CFO, to the board really approaches it as a partner in the business. Versus a top down hammer approach of this is what " the law says". So just having someone with a strong partnership and business mindset I think too, then that person has to be accountable to help set the framework to the right type of program.

There, there are the elements of compliance. Which bode through and through true to every healthcare company, but each company dynamically is a bit different culturally. So ensuring that we build the right program, the right mechanisms, if you will to have a highly executable, highly efficient, and to the letter of the policy, right?

The reg, eccetera program. Having someone who is incredibly interested in education and creating awareness throughout the company. What I find is some of the best companies I've ever been a part of is where the compliance executive is looked at and revered in the company by all colleagues.

And maybe they don't always have [00:14:00] the greatest conversations with compliance executives depending on their actions, but they respect the person and the person is notable throughout the business. So they know that everything we do is around compliance. So we create a lot of awareness and, obviously a lot of education.

That's good as fun as it can be, education, it's just, compliance becomes part of what we do. So someone who has a mindset that says compliance necessarily isn't a program is as much as it's part of our culture and what we do. The other piece too, is having a compliance executive

that takes stock and, the overall culture of the company that participates in the orientation of new employees that cares about things like turnover and things like that. Differences to me pretty apparent, I think a compliance executive, somebody who can operate at a significantly higher level, very strategic, right?

Has the background experience. Can swoop like an eagle, right? And drop in the tactical planning and execution is needed, but really advises at a very high level, the board, [00:15:00] the chief executives executive leadership team as to how to not react to compliance issues, but how to on an ongoing basis continue to build onto the existing compliance program to be even better than what the minimum standard is, or is expected to be compliance officer or compliance manager.

Otherwise, I think is more of the doer, right? It's the person who does and executes. But at times, what I've seen may struggle to have strategic long shot vision. If I say to you as a compliance executive, Ross, we want to grow by a thousand patients over the next year and a half, and we're going to add 300 caregivers to make that happen.

Most compliance officers operate in the here and now versus that ability to look forward. 

Ross: Being proactive is a really hard thing to do for a compliance person, compliance officer, compliance executive. And I like the way that you put together the strategic partner is what you're looking for as the CEO and, really helping the company

grow, stay within their lanes [00:16:00] and figure out where they need to go from that standpoint is really huge. When you talk about like qualities and attributes of this compliance executive, one thing that we always look for. And this is sometimes not built into the relationship with the board and the CEO is this idea of respect and confidence from the CEO from the board.

Or even the broader leadership team across the board, whether it's human resources, quality, legal department doesn't really matter. What do you think from that compliance executive standpoint, what qualities and attributes should they be looking for to help gain respect and trust and confidence from you as opposed to you just going, look, you're just gonna, you're just gonna stand in my way.

Every time I turn around, you're throwing the penalty flag at me. And I, I just, I don't really respect what you do because you're not that strategic partner. So do you have any kind of thoughts on what qualities and attributes? 

Larry:  I think someone that steps forward with a [00:17:00] strong team approach.

Is an incredible listener and takes into advisory and deeply listens to other stakeholders in the business, right? So somebody who has a really strong team approach is open to feedback and open to listening to other leaders isn't really one track minded on what right is in their own sort of mind, someone who's got a strong growth mindset, back to, What we're dealing with in our space of health care. We've got a lot of people out there who need us and we've got to be able to scale our services.

So somebody who approaches with the presentation that we have to be proactive to grow our business. Our goal is to build a great great, amazing compliance program to meet that need to compliment the growth versus Oh my gosh, we can't grow. We just got to lock down what we have.

So I think for boards, investors, CEOs, it's really important to have a compliance officer or compliance leader executive that's very growth minded. The other thing too, is just showing up with the enthusiasm. The enthusiasm [00:18:00] for what we do. Healthcare, whether it's my space of healthcare or the hospital space doesn't matter.

We're caring for human beings. So somebody that really cares about our mission for caring for others, I think is significant. And last but not least, back to the compliance executive as a partner. What I look for is I look for somebody who can not only Be that high level compliance executive to the organization, to the board, but somebody who can help me drive to the broader company and to the community, to our referral sources.

 Sentiment of high morality, I'm looking for somebody in a compliance executive that can be my partner to help me because I can't be over at all times. Teach the company that we're do the right thing kind of place. Which means we have high accountability.

Those are to me some really important attributes. When I'm looking for a compliance executive as a partner, 

Ross: I love these two points. I want to hone in on and what you said in that last statement there we always say you got to lead with integrity, right?

And that's really important. If you look at [00:19:00] the definition of integrity, it's, doing things with truth and honesty and, leading with a moral compass. And I think you hit on both of those pieces because what thing it doesn't say with integrity as a compliance executive or even a CEO or a board member is do what you believe

is right. So belief. I think you talked a little bit about belief. And I think that's where some compliance executives or even some compliance officers, not compliance executives so much lose some respect and lose some confidence because they all of a sudden will say, I have this belief that this is what you should do.

And in fact, it's not the truth. And so we lead in compliance at least. And as you do too is, as an executive, We lead with facts. We lead with, does this regulation say X? Does this regulation say Y? Can we operate within these two things? And then outside of that, I don't care what your opinion is, [00:20:00] like your belief system may be over here and that's fine.

We don't have the same belief system, but we operate with facts and truth. That's 

Larry: right. 

Ross: And I do think that is the number one way, like you said, just to bring it back to your statement. I do think that's exactly right. That's how you gain the respect. That's how you gain the confidence of your leaderships to become that strategic partner.

You act with truth, you act with integrity, you act with honesty, 

Larry: Yeah 

Ross: you really go down that, and I think that it's not just your CEOs and your COOs and your CFOs and boards. It's also your counterparts within the organization. So I think that's just right on the money. 

Larry: Hundred percent.

 Facts are our friends, right? Ross. That's what I say a lot. Facts are our friends. If we strip back the subjectivity of the emotion, ultimately a great compliance executive doesn't just drive compliance in the organization, back to the partnership. 

In my experience, even just working alongside you, Ross, for a period of time, you, along with others out there who are at your level, [00:21:00] help elevate other departments and other areas of the business. Human capital, HR, finance. So just because of the approach of looking at facts and balancing, doing the right thing in high accountability and leading with integrity. 

Ross: And I do think, and I have this conversation a lot with my mentoring program making compliance executives in the world. And we've had this conversation a lot with some of your direct reports that I was working with. When the compliance officer or the compliance department starts taking over things that other people are supposed to be doing, whether it's human resources quality or whomever, you are essentially stripping them of their ability to

manage and be responsible for what they need to be responsible for. Essentially, you're dismantling their authority. And that's the worst thing that you could possibly do. We need to be building them up so that they can be better. Just as well as we can be better, and I think that really does go hand in hand with respect and [00:22:00] confidence for each one of the leaderships.

And I think you're exactly right. It handles working together very closely. 

Larry: 100%. My experiences. Compliance departments a lot of times live on an island and people are afraid to call in like a lead human resources person, maybe there's something about some regulation with labor and they're afraid to call a compliance officer, right?

A compliance leader, advisor, executive gets those calls all the time. It becomes a bit of a coach to these people, which is the optimal and what I continue to look for. ​

Ross: [00:23:00] When you talk about bringing them in as a strategic partner and you, let's say you have that right person and that's that right executive person, with this crazy regulations and what you can do and what you can't do in guidelines, how do you effectively

balance, between bringing them in to, to help foster some innovation and growth within the company, as well as, maintaining the guardrails on those regulations? And I think a lot of that is driven by the CEO because lot of the direction, a lot of the conversations that the compliance executive is having is direction from the CEO and you have the ability to bring somebody, anybody.

You want [00:24:00] to have your executive 

Larry: team 

Ross: into a strategic planning meeting or you have the power to go, no, you're out. I don't want you and the growth of the company. So when you talk about that, how do you effectively balance who you bring in and what's going to make a good leader?

Larry: First and foremost, if I've got the right partner, we'll assume that I think the level of engagement and time that I put into that relationship is so important. As a CEO, I think what's really, top priority is not just finding the right partner and walking away and infrequently having encounters.

I think it's really important to stay as actively engaged as possible with that compliance executive. One, because to the point you just made, That connection is just so key in everything we do in our business today and what we're planning to do tomorrow. Second, I think it's really important to, to prioritize the philosophy and the culture of compliance throughout the whole company so [00:25:00] that compliance partner is recognized as a key stakeholder in the business itself, not just in compliance.

In the business to all leadership and to everyone in the company, as an example, if it's Ross they know who Ross is, they know how to get ahold of Ross and they're not afraid of Ross. And they also understand that Ross is a key part of celebrating our wins as a family, as a business unit as well in our services, not just compliance. And last, not least.

 I think it's really important to not micromanage, right? In the sense that if you've got the right compliance executive, you've got the right modalities of communication to really allow them that freedom in that space to embed and become on their own true partners to the other executives.

The site leaders, the other leadership teams in the company so that they have their own rapport and relation, if you will. So that not everything has to go through the CEO. I will say very close with my compliance executive, having other stakeholders in the business, having a similar or their own [00:26:00] type of relationship with the compliance executive is really important.

But it all starts, I think, with the CEO, In any company prioritizing the significance of compliance and that . It's not just a program, it's just what we do. And that's not, it's easier said than done. You've gotta find the right partner to help establish that. 

Ross: It, it really does drive the culture of compliance.

When we talk about how you draw cultural of compliance from the top down. Yeah. It obviously starts with the board because if you don't have a engaged board that cares. Right? That's gonna make. You as the CEO, a little bit disconnected, I think maybe with the situation. But when we talk about the culture of compliance, leading from the top down, I think is where you're indicating that you got to have that right executive team to build that culture and lead through it.

So how do How do you implement that across the board? Even if , I know you personally, and I know you professionally, and I know that you're going to drive a culture of compliance, regardless of who's in your compliance position, you'll take it over yourself [00:27:00] if you have to, because that's who you are. But if you didn't even have, like, how are you going to drive that culture of compliance? 

Larry: It's interesting, because I think there's the formal approach to driving a culture of compliance, right? And there's the informal mechanisms.

And I think the formal ones are the obvious ones, right? I don't know that a lot of companies in our space invest enough in compliance. So I think investing in a, not just a program, but in the physical, FTE, if you will, and other potential vendor partners, you need. So things like an internal audit program, an external audit program, ensuring that you've got the right reporting mechanisms, tracking mechanisms, right?

So one, I think that the more formal ways that you ensure it's embedded in the culture is really A. Investing heavily into compliance. Don't overlook it. My advice to anybody in our space, we're so highly regulated. Two. Ensuring as the chief executive that you [00:28:00] really talk all the time about doing the right thing about compliance.

But there's this other part that I don't know that, that I hear people talk about a lot, which is even when people aren't looking. You always have to be doing the right thing. So how do you teach that? And I think so much of it isn't just myself. It starts with me. I would maybe guess, but I think it's broader,right.

The executive leadership team as a whole, the site leaders as a whole, the clinical leaders as a whole. We have to be so well educated and knowledgeable to regulations, to policy to what good and great looks like. What is right? What is wrong? But when we think no one is looking, somebody is always watching.

We're in a fishbowl. As a leadership team, We always, even in the small things, have to be recognized as doing the right thing when nobody's looking. I'm being a bit broad, I think but I think there's the formal approaches to how you build and embed compliance in culture, but there's a lot of [00:29:00] informal ways that you got to go about it, and it's in just your behaviors, your words,

your actions. 

Ross: I love that. And I don't think you're being brought at all. I think, act like no one's watching. So literally doing things when you don't have the spotlight on you and you have the town hall meetings and what you do is with integrity that's far often, that's far too often overlooked.

And it's not just. Compliance executives and CEOs and board members. It's everybody, right? We should actually in a life, I think we should always act like that. Typically you get me 100 percent no matter what I'm doing. So that should have good things and bad things. depending on what. day it is.

What would be some final advice that you have for aspiring compliance officers who want to be compliance executives who wanted to work with you and with home health and hospice. And you're like, Hey, by the way, this is what I'm looking for. Don't forget this and make sure you pay attention to that.

What are some good advice? 

Larry: Absolutely. There's an [00:30:00] old saying in the Navy from years ago, my dad was 30 something years in the Navy and he's bringing home these pencils and it said, it's not just a job. It's an adventure. So my first warning to all aspiring compliance executives in our space.

It's not just a job. It's an adventure. All kidding aside, I think if, the payout of the feeling of changing populations and helping communities is tenfold the most amazing feeling and I think a great compliance executive can have that feeling can definitely. execute help us execute on getting there.

Some of my top tips I think would be or words of encouragement. It's not just about the law. It's not just about regulations. It's about, about a service that we're providing, right? So as You look to maybe embed yourself or partner with a business like ours, come forward, not just as a compliance expert to regulations, to policy.

We need that. We want that. Sure. We have to have it come forward with a real partnership [00:31:00] mindset, with ego aside with a humility and desire to really want to help others. Now, I think that's really important. It's not just our patients. We talk about our patients all the time. That compliance executive to me is also here.

For us internally to help us as a culture, as a company to protect us. So come forward as a partner, come forward with a strong business mindset. And Hey, everyone's got their thing, right? Some people are better at certain things than other good Excel, not good Excel. Good on a income statement, not, but come forward with as much desire to want to learn about the business.

And stay focused on growth because that's the world we live in. We have to grow and scale really important. And, I think the last and really most important piece is recognize the value you bring. And sleep so good at night knowing that it's not just about compliance programs, right?

A great compliance executive isn't just that person to build a compliance program, to be a reporting mechanism, to work on active compliance matters. There's somebody that helps [00:32:00] protect what we have and really assist us in growing into the future. M and A, right? A great compliance executive can be a great partner for helping us in acquisitions and looking at internal audit, it's funny, we talk a lot about compliance

we don't talk about quality related to compliance, but a great compliance officer helps us improve quality because they help us from an internal or external audit perspective, identify how we can perform better which means we change, more and more lives of others. So again, I think my most important piece here

probably of all of that I just said is, come forward really as a strong partner with a business approach to wanting to help grow a business in care, not just for our patients, but for the people that you work alongside here internally as well. 

Ross: Great advice, Bravo. I appreciate that. I think, CEOs listening to this, should take some notes from what you expect from your business, board members should have that respect from their CEOs as well, figuring out what they're putting into place.

And, compliance enthusiasts [00:33:00] and officers should hear those words and live by them. So I really appreciate that. Last question asked with all my guests and, we call this health as wealth, right? Yeah. You need to take care of yourself because professionally, to be a to be a business athlete, you got to take care of yourself as well as take care of your business.

So what do you do to take care of yourself? 

 At my current age in life, Ross it's absolutely watching what I eat. I can't eat like I used to but I love being outside. I love getting outside and getting into the mountains. I love to go hiking and love to be outdoors.

Larry: A lot of outdoor adventures and certainly love to walk. So that's the kind of my big exercise thing. I'm at a point in life or maybe not so much in the gym, but I try to put on at least 50 to 60 miles a week walking, which is very helpful to de stress. I can take calls while I'm out there.

Plus get my steps in. And then just other things as well. I love to cook, love to travel, love to see new places and learn about new cultures. So I think to your point, health is wealth and [00:34:00] important to to not let it all bleed together at one time, right? To at times, feel like you have outlets. 

Ross: That's great. No, I love hearing the different ways that people take care of themselves. So Larry, thank you so much for joining us today. I really appreciate it. Again we'll get together very soon, but thank you for being here today.

Larry: Hey Ross, thanks for the time and really enjoyed being here. Look forward to seeing you soon man. 

Thanks 

Ross: for listening to the compliance leadership lounge. Please subscribe and follow us. If you found anything entertaining here and like to share with your friends, this is how we continue to provide useful information to you all related to leadership and compliance, please leave comments if you have any opinions on the matters and love to hear different advice or information you'd like to share with us.

And remember 

"Always lead with integrity." 

Thank you for spending your time with us in the compliance leadership lounge. I'm Ross Ronan, and it's been an honor to host today's insightful discussion. If you've enjoyed our conversation, please subscribe, leave a review, and share this podcast with your network. [00:35:00] Your engagement helps us continue to bring in depth and influential content in the world of healthcare compliance.

Stay tuned for our next episode where we further explore the leadership dynamics and compliance. Until then, remember effective compliance is about leading with integrity and leadership is about making a difference.