Ep.129 From Rookie Casts To River Confidence In Fly Fishing

Something about a river at dark makes real life fade out fast, the bills, the noise, the racing thoughts, all of it. We sit down in Denver’s garage right after a quick fishing night and talk through why fly fishing has turned into our go-to reset. I’m still green as grass, so you’ll hear the rookie side of it too: learning how to cast in tight spots, why the roll cast matters, and the simple goal that changes everything, getting the fly to land flat with a clean presentation.

Denver Lewis breaks down the everyday realities that make you better fast, like going often, switching flies constantly, and not overthinking gear. We get into wet flies vs dry flies, how different patterns cast differently, why barbless hooks change how you fight a fish, and the kind of practical advice that saves you from losing trout. Denver also shares a great hack for carrying flies without overheating in summer: an old bino harness instead of a vest.

Then the conversation takes a turn into the stuff you don’t expect. We talk lamprey eels in New Brunswick, how big they can get, what they do to fish, and the myths people repeat about lightning strikes. Jared Lewis brings the guide perspective, from teaching brand-new anglers to building an experience that’s fun even on slow days. He also shares the work he does with Heroes Mending On The Fly, taking veterans, RCMP, and first responders on guided trips and tying nights, and how fly fishing can help people living with PTSD finally breathe and open up.

We finish with river culture and big-fish dreaming: “take a fly, leave a fly” boxes along the water, sturgeon that can outlive you, and why those river dinosaurs sometimes launch out of the water beside the boat. If you’ve ever wondered whether fly fishing is “for you,” this one will make it feel a lot more reachable. Subscribe, share this with a fishing buddy, and leave a review if you want more river stories and practical outdoors talk.

Check us out on Facebook  Hunts On Outfitting, or myself Ken Marr. Reach out and  Tell your hunting buddies about the podcast if you like it, Thanks!

Transcript

Stormy Tradition And Fishing Setup

SPEAKER_03 0:28

Hunts on this is Hunts on Outfitting Podcast. I'm your host and rookie guide, Ken Meyer. I love everything hunting, the outdoors, and all things associated with it. From stories to how-two, you'll find it here. Welcome to the podcast. Hey, yes. Alright, thanks for joining me for this week's podcast. I just got finished drawing off because here uh it's our first coon night of coon season. So my friend Denver and I and some others, uh Denver who will be on this podcast, just got done hunting uh basically in a hurricane. Very high winds, lots of rain, no coons, but a lot of fun was that. So uh yeah, it's tradition that every night on the first year we go out to this firm uh tis uh to his father-in-law's, and uh we didn't care how much it was raining or how hard the wind was blowing, we weren't breaking tradition. So that was a good time. Speaking of a good time. This week's podcast, we are talking about fishing. Yes, we've got another fishing one. I've got my good friend Denver Lewis on here, and new friend Jared Lewis on here as well, no relation to each other. Um we talk all kinds of stuff. We get talking about eels in the water and uh how big toads can get and how sketchy it can be fishing and having them bumping into you. But then we get talking about how fishing, how great it is for the soul, and just you know, no matter what's going on in life and and uh, you know, what's happening and how chaotic it can be when you're out on the river and you're throwing that line and you're casting and you're catching and you're just relaxing and you're around the trees and the water and all that, it's just uh it's good for you. It's a good reset. And, you know, I was never much into it before, just hunting, and this year I've realized, you know, if you're into hunting and you're into the outdoors, uh chances are you're gonna like doing some fishing. Uh so we talk about mainly fly fishing and just uh everything that comes with that and choosing flies and getting into it and the casting and and all that stuff. Um so that's been uh it's been uh quite a learning curve for myself, but it's been a lot of fun, and you guys are gonna hear about that. Uh if you're looking at the podcast profile picture, uh Jared is on the bottom with the uh or in the middle, I guess, with the big sturgeon, and then Denver is to the left, and then myself, I am on the right. If uh if you're looking at that and you want to know who's talking and who sounds like what, well, there you go. That's who it is. And also uh this uh episode here, you're gonna notice that the sound quality is not the normal sound quality that you have come to expect from this uh podcast channel, but uh uh you guys should still be able to hear just fine because we filmed it or we uh recorded it on location in Denver's garage after a quick fish uh uh fishing night. It was a shorter podcast just because uh we all had to work really early the next morning, but we wanted to uh after we got done fishing, we did want to record one while Jared was out and stuff like that, just to uh you know just to have a nice one that we recorded in the garage. But because of it, it's not a real long one. Um but I think you're gonna like it. There's gonna be some stories told, some facts and all that, and uh stay tuned. Oh, also if you're in the Moncton area, August fifteenth,

Learning Fly Casting In Tight Spots

SPEAKER_03 3:55

the Canadian Wild Turkey Federation, the Kodiak Longbeards, we are having our dinner August fifteenth. If you're in the area and want to get a ticket, let me know. Oh, and if you were looking to get a hold of us to maybe come on the podcast or suggest somebody for it, or just reach out to me, you can email me, hunts on outfitting at gmail.com, or you can find us on Facebook, Hunts on Outfitting, or find myself on there, Ken Meyer. Feel free to reach out. Some of you guys have been. It's been great talking with you from all over. Denver, Jared, we just had a uh a great time on the river. I'm uh that was a lot of fun. Denver, we've been doing a lot of fly fishing lately, and you got me into it, and I want to thank Eric Roach for giving me my first fly rod. In Denver, you've been giving me my first lessons. And Jared, tonight, you taught me uh the roll, the roll with the fly rod, because that's important and when we're fishing in uh I mean the river that we're on, sometimes it's real wide, sometimes it's tight. So I always wondered that when guys, you see guys whipping the fly rod back and forth and going like, how do they do that in tight areas? But there's technique to it and all that, right? And then Denver, you got into uh fly fishing here, you moved, uh, you bought a house that's literally touch basically touching the river. You could spit and hit it, and um you got into fly fishing, you go what, every night?

SPEAKER_02 5:16

Yeah, I I got into it probably around 12, 12 years old. Right, he was doing it. Crazy into it. Now that I'm 10 yards off the river, it's pretty easy to go every night, so get pretty good at it.

SPEAKER_03 5:29

And it's been fun. Well, it's been fun going out with you too, and like you've got your trails going to different holes and this and that, and then like all the neighbors know you because we were out what last week there, and uh and then the guy's like, is that Denver? They're like, Yep. Dark out. Yeah, it's dark out, but he just knew you know, because Denver's out fishing every night and stuff, right?

SPEAKER_02 5:47

So I got something for you.

SPEAKER_00 5:52

Oh man. Perfect. Well, even when we were walking uh down earlier, there's that old guy that came out on the porch and he's like, Oh, you I was wondering who you guys are talking to.

SPEAKER_03 6:02

Yeah, ourselves know this guy, yeah. This old guy's just talking away to us and stuff. But you know, that's what it like too, the fly fishing thing. I was thinking I said that tonight. I'm like, you know, that by yourself be you know, so so, but with a few people, it's it's a lot of fun, right? You know, I like that social part of it. When someone catches one, yeah, everyone's all excited for you, and then Denver, you get your picture taken with your face in it. Because Denver is talking about that. Well, you go fishing a lot and you go by yourself, and then one time you said there's a guy out there, yeah, and then you caught a big one. Like, can you take my picture? I've never gonna take my picture, and he did, and he cut your head completely out of it.

SPEAKER_02 6:38

That was a good fish. Everything but my head Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:45

Yeah. And you know, it's like when we talked earlier, it's it's almost as fun to see people catch fish than to catch fish yourself.

SPEAKER_03 6:54

Well, that's what I want to get into, you can show me the ropes and all that and everything. It's been great and uh really helpful because I'm still green as grass, don't know what I'm doing. And Jared, you do some guiding so you guys know about like getting new people into it and showing them how it is. And I was saying that tonight, I always thought, I mean, all of us sitting here a little bit a bit redneck, and I always thought fly fishing was more of a fancy pants thing, but you know, it doesn't it doesn't, it's it's for anybody, you know, and I I like that part too, because I always thought it was yeah, just I I fly fishing before I used to picture uh fancy guys at a big old lodge catching the salmon, you know, guys, businessmen and stuff, but I think it's bad too, but it's for everybody.

SPEAKER_00 7:34

And I think times are changing too. Yeah, times are changing, you know. Uh not many people have money, yeah. And you know, they wanna get into it. Yep. And you know, the easiest way is to just dive in without any of that.

SPEAKER_03 7:48

Well, it yeah, it seems like a lot to it, but I mean, really, you gotta get the casting down, and then as far as flies go, you see all these flies. People tie their own flies, they're buying their own flies, everything. What you just switch them in and out. But I learned you got your wet flies, which sink, and you get your top water flies, your dry flies that stay on top. But we learned tonight, I mean, Denver, you're having some good luck catching. Jared and I were getting some bites. I uh I did end up catching one later, but we were just switching them in. How many flies do you go through, Denver, in a night? Average.

SPEAKER_02 8:19

Ten, fifteen, that's in like a few hours. Maybe a couple hours.

SPEAKER_03 8:23

Yeah, exactly, right?

SPEAKER_02 8:24

Always switching. Always find the right one. You go into one hole and catch two or three good fish on one fly. Yep. Go to the next hole, they won't even touch it. Won't even acknowledge you through it. Exactly.

SPEAKER_03 8:35

Yeah, so that and then Denver, I want I said when we do a podcast, I want you to mention this. You've got an old bino harness on you, and that's what you're carrying, all your flies. And I was like, What a smart idea, because it's right there. Yeah, never really good idea.

SPEAKER_02 8:48

Never really had a vest, so I just improvise and it works good, everything's right there.

SPEAKER_03 8:53

Yeah, not in the way. Right where you need it. Yeah, and that's the thing too. I was like, why don't you have a vest on to get all this stuff? And you're like, it's too hot. And like, man, it is too hot in the summer. That's a good point. Yes. Yeah. Um, and then uh, but what when we were coming out, I want to talk about this just a little bit because I was like kind of blown

Flies, Presentation, And Simple Gear

SPEAKER_03 9:10

away by what you guys are telling me. Um, here we are in New Brunswick. Uh early season, you're dealing with eels, lamper eels. Yes. Tell tell me, tell me some stories about that. I didn't know they were uh they're vicious. Yeah, vicious. Oh yeah. Yeah. Like, and how big, how big?

SPEAKER_00 9:27

I've seen them as big as a baseball bat. Yeah. Really? You step on a nest, they wrap around your leg, they'll go at your waiters, like sharp teeth. It's it's not fun.

SPEAKER_02 9:38

Yeah, they'll latch right on the fish. Like I caught that one there two years ago. Big circle right on the side of it, you can see the individual teeth hold, like almost like a burn mark. The fish was well as trout, and then just a great big circle of pure white.

SPEAKER_00 9:53

Yeah. And if you look at uh there's some uh videos of the dam, like the passages down in the States, they actually keep it on a live feed so you can watch the salmon. What what is it? It's like a live feed of of a dam of all the fish going through the dam. Uh-huh. So they can count the salmon. Okay. You can see on the salmon they're full of lamp rays.

SPEAKER_03 10:13

Really? Yeah. What's the solution to that? I mean, do they have any? Like kill so is it the first lightning strike that hits the w how's that work? They die, right?

SPEAKER_00 10:23

I think that a lot of people, it's like a it's a myth. Um that they die on the first lightning strike. It just so happens that the timing that they're spawned out is when the lightning strike starts.

SPEAKER_02 10:36

They are still in the river, huh? Oh yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:39

But yeah. I've heard a lot of people have said that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 10:43

Someone probably just said that once and then one ran with it. Yeah, okay, yeah. But because but they do die off.

SPEAKER_00 10:49

They do die off. That's weird, and then they're they reappear every year. Yeah, well, I think the young, if you uh see a lot of the First Nations, they're uh collecting the glass eels. Okay. Which which would be babies. Yep. It's essentially babies from the lampreys. Okay. And they send them to Japan and and Real. It's delicacy.

SPEAKER_03 11:10

I know those Japanese, they'll just eat anything, right? Uh I've heard smoke deal's pretty good. Yes. I've heard that. Heard that's delicacy.

SPEAKER_00 11:19

The river eel. Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 11:21

Yeah, maybe not lampers. I don't never want to get bones and stuff in them, I'm guessing, right?

SPEAKER_00 11:25

If I get really rednecked enough, I might drop some more.

SPEAKER_03 11:29

So, Jared, um, you do a bit of guiding while you tell us a bit about yourself there and then how you get into that. And you've always been fly fishing, have you?

SPEAKER_00 11:36

Yeah, I've always fly fished. It was uh escape from the hardships in my life, and uh and now I'm I'm almost 30. I'm guiding. Uh I have my own guiding business. I guide with New Brunswish Guides, um, the great Marilyn Prince.

SPEAKER_01 11:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:54

He started that, and uh, we all work together and and it really works out good for us. Yeah. We do a lot of donation work, um, a lot of uh trip sharing with each other, so it works out really good for all of us. Yeah, for sure. Shout out to the boys.

SPEAKER_03 12:08

Yeah, no, it's uh you you hear that a lot, people it how much peace you find on the river. I said that, yeah. Yeah, well, I when you're casting, you're not thinking about work, you're not thinking about bills, you're just you're just out there casting. And that's what I really liked about fly fishing too. You know, having ADHD, I like to be moving and all that. And you're you're constantly casting, right? And it's awesome. I think all of us have a touch of that here. Yeah and um it's a lot of fun that way, and just getting the techniques down and all that. Denver, I mean you're you're going sideways and this and that. I'm still I'm learning, but just I was told, you know, the goal is when you're throwing it out, just try to have your fly land flat. It doesn't matter how you get there, there's more than one way to skin a catch, just have it land the flat.

SPEAKER_00 12:51

The presentation is is what it's all about. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 12:55

So when you're guiding, do you have a lot of people come out that have never done it before?

SPEAKER_00 12:59

Honestly, most of my most of the people that come out have never fly fished before. And at the end of the day, they're smiling. Yep, their technique is much better than when they started. And some people you get, which are like unicorns, are naturals.

SPEAKER_03 13:17

Right from the start.

SPEAKER_00 13:18

It's almost like they've done it for years, but they've never done it in their life. And it's crazy to see.

SPEAKER_03 13:23

And just teaching somebody that, I mean, it you you see the videos, people just I mean, you guys are pretty good yourselves, but just casting and going, it looks a lot too. But I mean, when you first start you're not letting out a bunch of line and you know, like that, right? But I mean, it's uh a bit of trial and error and stuff. But you're saying, like, even tonight with me, I was asking, is it more in the wrist? You're like, yeah, and like move your hips a little bit with it, and that helped and stuff, and you know, but and then different flies helps to have a fly on. Helps to have a fly on. Um, and then different flies, obviously, are I'd noticed that tonight when we were switching them in and out, wet ones and dry ones and big ones and small ones, it all cast differently and stuff. So that was a big learning curve too.

SPEAKER_00 14:04

It's a lot of information over the years. Right, yes. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:09

You just tinker with stuff every night I go out, it's like I haven't tried this. Well, let's try this. Let's do this.

SPEAKER_03 14:13

Let's yeah, well, it's like the thing, right, Denver. Like you go out every night and you're you're always trying something.

SPEAKER_02 14:18

I mean, you go through flies like yeah, crazy, just different ones and different casting and like big ones that like right at dark, throw the biggest one you got. Yeah, yeah. It doesn't matter. Like I've just using a striper fly tonight. Right at dark. Yeah. They'll hit it.

SPEAKER_03 14:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:35

They won't shy away from it. No, it's uh so that's the thing. So we're fishing brook trope, but Denver, you caught uh what tonight? A chub. Yeah, yeah, that was surprising. Yeah, caught two of them.

SPEAKER_00 14:46

And that was a big one. Yeah, yeah. You're right. Yeah, big one.

SPEAKER_03 14:49

That was surprising. It's a it's amazing though, the the brook trope. They're so much fun to fish, and like we saw that one that you caught there earlier, it's a good size one, but you'd swear the lower rod was bent over you caught a shark. But it's so much fun, and man, those things are strong. And then when you put them back in the water, they're

Lampreys, Myths, And River Weirdness

SPEAKER_03 15:05

they go, they're gone. Even with the stripers, right? You're shaking them like come on, come with, and they're little dopey, right? And then they they go, yeah, but it's like wow.

SPEAKER_00 15:14

Well, even I was looking at your rod before we started, and I said, geez, that's a nice sturdy fly rod, nice rod. Yep, and uh when you hook that burp trout, that thing was bent right over. Oh, yeah, it was a good fight.

SPEAKER_03 15:28

Yeah, no, it's so much fun. Man, it's fun, you know? But and they were using barbless hooks. So, what you were telling me, Denver, because I've lost a few, you're like, just hold it up, like control the fish, rod tip high stuff, because that's what I was going wrong before. I just had the rod tip down. I'm like, I want to just spit it out. Yeah, hold it up high, right? So, just stuff like that. It's been good. And then, so speaking about though, you know, we've talked about this is just how much fun it is to be on the river and just takes your mind off everything. You hear that a lot, the guys that that's how they got into it, just looking for that escape. Yeah, you're involved in something, Jared.

SPEAKER_00 16:05

Yes, I'm involved with uh heroes men on the fly. Yep. Um, it's veterans, RCMP, first responder um group, and we do fly tying, uh, we do guided trips, we take the the vets and and the responders out, and it's been great. It's um a lot of those guys come in with PTSD, and you know, um if you can get them out, because none of these guys have fly fished either since they started, and you get them out and you can see in their face that the difference that fly fishing has made. Yeah, an impact on them. It just takes their mind off of what they need to get their mind taken off of. And uh Joe and Chuck, um, they've done you know, they've they've gathered donated items and and given the vets uh you know fly tying tools, uh rods, reels, flies, and all that stuff, so you know it's no nothing out of their pocket, and and it just brings a new uh adventure to their life.

SPEAKER_03 17:13

Right. Yeah. And do you find too like the ask when you guys are out there, they open up a little bit and get talking about it's crazy how much they open up.

SPEAKER_00 17:22

Really? Yeah. It's almost like they never had anybody to talk to. And when you're give them the peace that they need, they open up to you. Yeah. And it's awesome.

SPEAKER_03 17:31

And the you know, the river or the brook's a great spot for that too, because you're out there and that's I mean, I like that's what I like about hunting too, small game and this and that, just this I like the social part of it, you know. And we're just out there like tonight, we're just out there, we're just shooting the shit, casting and going. You just it's just nice, right? It really is nice. And the water's rippling. Denver, when we were out last week there, we saw that mother duck and her ducklings going along and stuff, you know. It's just I mean, I was never into fishing much, but I I am now like if you're into nature, yeah, you you know, just being out hunting and stuff, you chances are you're gonna like fishing.

SPEAKER_00 18:04

Well, and I like tonight too, it was dead quiet, and we were all like the three of us were fishing away, and then all of a sudden you hear Denver say monster. And you and I go instantly excited. And we go running up to him, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 18:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 18:20

Get a picture of Denver with Denver with his uh face in it, yeah, with a fish. Yeah. That was big. And I like too, I mean, Jared, I've met you a couple times, haven't spent this much time with you, never met Denver before. Tonight the three of us were out there, you know, just it was great. It was great, you know.

SPEAKER_00 18:35

I had a great time. Yeah, you guys are awesome.

SPEAKER_03 18:37

So, what's another thing too with fly fishing? If someone's looking to get into it and they're a little hesitant on it, I'll ask each of you can answer. Like, what would you what would you say?

SPEAKER_02 18:46

I mean you don't need to spend a whole shitload of money. No, what I got half a dozen rods over there, some are really good,

Guiding, PTSD, And Peace On Water

SPEAKER_02 18:55

some are cheap.

SPEAKER_01 18:55

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 18:57

Tread will take pretty much anything you say about it. Yeah. Like you don't have to drop hundreds and hundreds of dollars to get into it, like a net.

SPEAKER_00 19:06

And that that ties into what you were saying with the fancy pants. Yeah, the fly fishing community. You don't need all that.

SPEAKER_03 19:13

Well, I was surprised to ask him, like, man, how much your rod and reel cost you? Like, I think it's like 150 bucks. I'm like, oh, that's not bad. Okay, yeah. And it it looked nice and I love mine.

SPEAKER_00 19:24

Yeah. The biggest advice I could give, leave the spin gear at home. Yeah. If you don't, even if you don't fly fish, leave it at home, bring the fly rod. Yeah. And because you got no other choice then. Right. You know?

SPEAKER_03 19:36

And you're gonna learn it. Yes. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:38

Exactly.

SPEAKER_03 19:38

Yeah. Yeah. And then as far as flies go, like someone's going out, like what where do you s where do you start, I guess. I mean, I was I was lucky Eric gave me some, Denver gave me some and stuff. I mean, where do you where do you just buy a bunch and start casting?

SPEAKER_02 19:55

Yeah, I probably got 600 flies around here. Yeah. Well, I know it's funny.

SPEAKER_03 20:04

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 20:05

I like using yellow in June-ish, July, red in August, early spring, mosquito-like stuff. Anything small, grayish, brown. And then yeah, anytime before dark, just biggest thing you can put on. Yeah. Like big mouse fly, like.

SPEAKER_03 20:25

Yeah. And it's funny, you just learned that trial and error though over the years, right? Just being out every night and and stuff.

SPEAKER_02 20:31

But you're trying it again the next year.

SPEAKER_03 20:33

I know, yeah. I mean, Jaren, anything to add to that?

SPEAKER_00 20:39

I would say uh I would say kind of randomize it, get some random ones, because when you're starting off, you don't know really the difference from a wet fly or a streamer or a fly. So just kind of get a mix of both if you can get some information where you're buying your stuff, and head out to a a well-known spot and talk to some of the other guys and see what they're using and and what works. Yeah, most guys will just tell you. Most guys will love to tell you what.

SPEAKER_02 21:09

I've had a handful of them. Oh, here, this one working for me. Hand the fly over. Yeah. Like we got boxes all down this river. It's like uh the take a fly, leave a fly. No, yeah. What is it? Tell me go. That sounds cool. Tell me. It's just a fly box, just like I got over there.

SPEAKER_01 21:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 21:26

And it's along the river? Yeah, there's a couple of down the side. Take a fly or need a fly, take a fly. Leave a fly. Have a fly, leave a fly. Yeah. Really? You open the box up and it's full of flies, so you want to try one, take it, leave one. Really? I believe that's that is cool. They have one down here by the bridge. They got one down by where we were tonight. Yeah. Across that bridge, and they got some down. Uh I think farther down processes.

SPEAKER_03 21:51

Yes, they do. I had not heard of that. That's really cool. Because I was just gonna say before you said that, I was thinking, I find that some uh hunter. Groups or fishing groups can be kind of um standoff. I don't know if you call it standoffish, kind of standoff, more private and stuff, but I find from what I've seen so far, the fly fishing community is very open and stuff. So you guys saying that, that really that is cool.

SPEAKER_00 22:15

I I find Sussex area, like Pinobacas River, has always been welcoming. But then you kind of go to the mare machine and it's a little different. It all changes where you can.

SPEAKER_03 22:25

That's where you get some of them fancy pants. Not all of them, but it's the salmon stuff is a little that's a whole other world.

SPEAKER_00 22:31

Um it was gatekeeped for a long time.

SPEAKER_03 22:34

Yeah. Yeah, it's I I've I've heard, I don't know much about it, but yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:39

But now it's changing times.

SPEAKER_03 22:41

Yes. The old guards kind of getting out. But that take a fly, leave a fly, that's cool. I didn't know that. That's the scene. That's that's the opening. How open, you know, the fishermen are around here and stuff.

SPEAKER_00 22:52

There's a lot of open yeah, a lot of open people here.

SPEAKER_03 22:54

That's very cool.

SPEAKER_00 22:55

That was the Kennabacasis watershed that set that up.

SPEAKER_03 22:59

Really? Yeah. That is cool. And people have been doing it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:02

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_03 23:03

No one's cleaned it out or anything. Good. Good. Oh, that's awesome to hear. Huh. That's that's neat. I did not know that. Yeah, yeah, no, I'm curious.

SPEAKER_02 23:13

Yeah, yeah. Is there any caddy flies in here? Just like Fast Pro in here. Um no, that's cool. I thought it would be cool, like, if they could somehow rig like a notebook or something up there. Yeah. A little note. What worked. What was working? Yep, yeah. Yellow tonight. That's a good idea. That is that's a super good idea. Yeah. I didn't know.

SPEAKER_03 23:35

Oh, maybe somebody could listen to this though. I didn't know.

SPEAKER_02 23:39

Maybe they already thought of it, maybe they didn't, but I think it's a great idea. You pass one, oh, take a fly, it's like, oh, let's write. Well, this one was working this day. On June 30th, you know. Oh, well, this guy said this was working this time of the year.

SPEAKER_00 23:54

If you hear this Ben if you hear this Ben Whelan, that's a good suggestion.

SPEAKER_03 23:57

Yeah, if anyone yeah, someone's listening to this that has some pull there. Yeah, that is a really good suggestion. Yeah. Um, and then along with fishing, not just fly fishing, Jared, you do some guiding for sturgeon and stuff. What what's that like? Those can be those are they're dinosaurs, right?

SPEAKER_00 24:11

It's fun. Yeah. They're dinosaurs. Um, they've been, you know, it's it's not very often you catch a fish that has probably outlived you. Yeah, well, how old how old are your average sturgeon and how big are they? So you get the Atlantics, they're uh when they're coming in the freshwater, they're not feeding at all. You won't be able to catch them on a hook. Um you'll catch small ones, juveniles on a hook. But as far as, you know, you hear stories of eleven foot sturgeon and stuff. They're in that river. Really? And uh a commercial fisherman had sent me a picture of one not long ago that was about ten feet long. Yeah. And when they looked in his belly, there was nothing in it. Because they harvest them for caviar for commercial.

SPEAKER_03 24:57

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 24:58

And there was nothing in it because when they get hit the fresh water, they're not eating. They're laying their eggs and they're getting out of there. So but you will run into a lot of the short nosed sturgeon, which are really f you know,

Fly Box Sharing And River Culture

SPEAKER_00 25:10

they're a lot smaller. Yeah. Um the max size, like I think the keeper size in New Brunswick is 52 inches. And that fish will probably be over 60 years old. Really?

SPEAKER_03 25:22

No way.

SPEAKER_00 25:23

Yeah. Wow. And uh the Atlantics will probably I'm gonna guess the Atlantics live a lot longer if they get 10, 11 feet. That's cool.

SPEAKER_01 25:32

Yeah, so yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:34

They're cool fish. That is cool.

SPEAKER_03 25:35

They're bottom feeders, right? But no, hear this. So somebody's telling me, buddy mom was telling me he's out at his uh girlfriend's parents, he's like, Yeah, they're jumping out of the water. I'm like, they weren't their bottom feeders, but they do, don't they?

SPEAKER_00 25:47

Now they the breaching, I don't know what causes that. Some people have different assumptions that it's communication or it's to uh burp the air out of their system, or or maybe to get lampreys off them. Yeah. No, I don't think anybody's really narrowed it down, but that is that is a fact. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 26:07

Yeah, we'll be out boating and you'll see them right in front of the boat. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:10

Really? But they're and bottom feeders doing that. Yeah, that's crazy. And you can almost count when they jump. You can almost count in your head to three before they go back. Really, they go back.

SPEAKER_02 26:19

Come out a little jump.

SPEAKER_00 26:20

Like it's it's like if you were leaning over the boat, you you get clipped.

SPEAKER_03 26:25

If they came out then, really. Yeah, that is cool. So they got some power. They got some big power, yeah. Because I mean they're large fish to be able to do that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:31

Basically shark. Yeah. Uh yeah. Shark without teeth.

SPEAKER_03 26:35

Really? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:36

Basically.

SPEAKER_03 26:37

That's cool. So, what's it like taking people out gauding for that and they hook onto one of them?

SPEAKER_00 26:41

It's pretty good. Yeah. Really fun. Yeah, yeah. Uh it's uh a lot of patience, I would say. A lot of people, you know, you're anchored up, you're you're sitting a long time, especially in the summertime. Uh spring is really good because there's not catfish or any of that stuff. Whereas in the summertime, you're always pulling other fish off, which can get kind of frustrating. So it's uh summertime's you had to be gotta be patient.

SPEAKER_03 27:08

Yeah. I don't know, I'm not very patient. But yeah, yeah. Wouldn't be for me at that time of year. Um, and then uh what's some other what's some other how'd you get into the guiding, I guess? I'm always curious about that is why people get into guiding. I like hearing that story.

SPEAKER_00 27:24

Uh for me, I always just had people tell me, like, oh, you know, you're fine. Guiding is not just taking people fishing. You have people skills. It's you gotta have people skills, you gotta give them an experience, even if like even if you don't catch any fish, you gotta give them that good experience and and have them coming back and stuff. I always thought I did a good job with that, and a lot of my friends always said that, so I jumped in it, and uh, yeah, everything's going good, and I love it. Yeah, so what is A and I guiding? A and I guiding, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 27:56

A and I guiding. So and then you're saying like you've been out, just random people come to New Brunswick from Ontario on vacation, they'll find out about you and be like, hey, uh, my wife's shopping, I brought my flyer, you know, that, yeah, that happens, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:10

When I get messages like that, that pumps me up. Because I know that's it. That they're they're they're fired up, ready to go, yeah. Yeah. And it it's just uh chemistry, you know, it fires you up automatically.

SPEAKER_03 28:21

Yeah. Well, I mean, if they came here not planning to go fishing, but brought it just in case, you know, they're gonna be fun. They got a few minutes, they got you know, the afternoon or something like that to sneak out, they're like, we're gonna have a good time.

SPEAKER_00 28:32

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, or you try to give them a tip and they're like, you know, you don't you don't have to babysit me, uh just handle the net and tell me where to go. I like that kind of a day too. Yeah. Yeah.

Sturgeon Dinosaurs And Guiding Stories

SPEAKER_00 28:45

Yeah. No, that's awesome. It's a lot of fun. It's actually crazy how many people from around not even just Canada, but around the world come to New Brunswick in the summertime. Well, tell me about you had a long distance traveler uh come out had tell me about that. I had Steven and his friend from Australia. They are uh Steven is is huge into the New Zealand. Like he he always go into New Zealand and fishing and hunting and stuff, and uh they were here on a conference for uh housing development. Really? And both houses around here? Uh I hope so. They booked a trip with me, man, and uh his friend had never fished before. Okay. And and Steven was pretty uh um he was pretty experienced. And both of those guys had a great time. And like it was just one of those days where they were, you know, we were out in Hearts Lake or something, and they were like, geez, is there any is there any crocs coming in here, mate? No, guys, there's no crocodiles here, you know. Crocking, never thought of that. Yeah. Fish and pickerel, you know, you're always.

SPEAKER_03 29:56

I like accents, so that would have been fun to interrupt.

SPEAKER_00 29:58

Oh man, I meeting people from around the world has been the best thing. Yeah, yeah. Like, I love it, because you get to hear everybody's accent and story.

SPEAKER_03 30:06

Yes, and you and what it's like there.

SPEAKER_00 30:08

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 30:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:09

You don't ever think about that when you're in your everyday life here. No. And then you have somebody else come and they're like, oh, this is how it is over here. Yeah, yeah, it's interesting.

SPEAKER_03 30:18

Well, it it's good to have different perspectives, you know. It keeps you uh well-rounded and cultured. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:23

Right?

SPEAKER_03 30:24

It's not a bad thing to be to be like that. That's uh yeah, that's really interesting, just having having people from that far away.

SPEAKER_00 30:30

And you get to ask them what kind of fish they're catching, yeah. What they're hunting, and their story. Because some of the hunt hunting trips that I've heard from some of these guys is insane. Oh, yeah. Like New Zealand stag. I would love to you hear those and you want to go do them yourself.

SPEAKER_03 30:45

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, the stag got that roar. Yeah. They got that roar. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it was New Zealand was designed as this ultimate sportsman's paradise, and from the sense of it, it really is. It would be cool to uh yeah, it'd be cool to go there someday. Maybe.

SPEAKER_00 30:59

Uh your guys' top three trips.

SPEAKER_03 31:02

Uh Alberta Elkhunt.

unknown 31:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 31:04

Alberta Elk Hunt.

SPEAKER_00 31:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 31:06

Yeah. Why Alberta? It's the Rockies.

SPEAKER_02 31:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 31:10

Uh Montana would be a cool Elk Hunt. Montana would be.

SPEAKER_02 31:12

Either or, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 31:13

I mean, they're similar. They're catching each other. I think either or. Yeah. Yeah. Um I want to go uh probably highest to my bucket list, and I think we'll be able to do that sometime here, is uh I want to hunt hogs with dogs where they get it bait up and then they got the catch dog catch it, right? And then you know you grab it. That like to go along on a mountain lion hunt with hounds too. And um I don't know if it's Saskatchewan white tail hunt. Oh man. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:40

We've got but you know that the Saskatchewan, but we've got just as big a deer here in New Brunswick. Yeah. I'd like to do a Saskatchewan mule deer hunt.

SPEAKER_02 31:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:48

That's what those are unique, yeah. Yeah. They're they're unique. Speaking around in the grass, hopping along.

SPEAKER_03 31:54

Yeah. Yeah. I mean New Brunswick though, we've got yeah, we've got just as big a deer as there, but just it just new areas, right?

SPEAKER_00 32:01

I think our population is a little less dense than theirs.

SPEAKER_03 32:05

Yes. Yeah, yeah. Oh yeah, we've got less deer, but we've got just as big.

SPEAKER_00 32:09

But that makes it more rewarding anyway.

SPEAKER_03 32:10

Yeah, yeah, that's right. Yeah.

unknown 32:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:15

Alaska moose hunt, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 32:16

That's a good one. Speaking of big stuff, we've got, I think we've got maybe not as big as Alaska, but we've got just as we've got Moose New Brunswick as big as anywhere else in the world, let's say, right?

SPEAKER_01 32:25

Yes. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 32:26

And um, yeah, it's uh And active.

SPEAKER_00 32:29

Very active moose. Yeah, yeah. You know. I find uh now in 2026, you think about 20 years ago, it was always a lot colder during moose season. Yeah. And now where it's it's hot, you really gotta work for them now.

SPEAKER_03 32:44

You gotta watch where you shoot them because you gotta get them out fast, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 32:49

Yeah, you can't take around too long.

SPEAKER_03 32:50

No, the flies are gonna set in and stuff, and you know, we did a podcast that'll be out shortly, Denver, about just putting pepper on there to keep the flies off and stuff.

SPEAKER_02 32:58

I was gonna say, yeah, that's six hours away from home. Like you got at least a six-hour drive if you shot it in the back of the truck. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:07

Yeah. Like exactly.

SPEAKER_02 33:09

You gotta have a kind of planned out. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 33:12

Yeah. Yeah, no, that's right. Um, but uh, well, boys, we're both at that time. This was a short but sweet podcast. Uh Denver and I both have work quite early. We went out fishing a little later, but we couldn't leave because you know they were biting

Bucket List Trips And Wrap Up

SPEAKER_03 33:25

and jumping. But just it it'd be cool. I'd like to spend the night on the river sometime, should just in a tent so you can hear the fish jumping and slapping all night. I mean, that gets you fired up and seeing them are like Denver when you and I were out fishing there last week and one jump like, oh, that was a big one up there. You know? Yeah. Yeah. Just and then they even the brook tow here, they come right out of the water too.

SPEAKER_02 33:47

It's like an ongoing thing. Oh, I'm going till seven o'clock, and then you say that every time I come out.

SPEAKER_03 33:54

Well, then I was like, oh, we go fishing tonight, and you're like, yeah, but I can't can't stay as late, and then 10 o'clock. We had 10 turns.

SPEAKER_00 34:02

I looked at the clock, I was like, is it really that time or is my phone?

SPEAKER_03 34:05

Yeah, no, it goes, but that's the fun thing with it. It goes by like that. It just you know, because you're having so much fun, you're so immersed into it and stuff. And uh I'm excited to get on the boat with you guys and sturge. Yeah, yeah, that'll be cool. Yeah. So on that note, boys, thanks.