In this episode, Avia Aiken-Brown and Zhara discuss the challenges and joys of marriage. They explore the idea of marriage as a mirror, reflecting both the beauty and weaknesses of individuals. Avia shares her personal love story and the importance of choosing love every day. They also discuss the challenges of transitioning from friends to a romantic relationship. Avia and Zhara highlight the importance of resolving issues quickly and creating a peaceful atmosphere in the home. They also discuss the impact of hormonal changes on emotions and relationships. This conversation explores various aspects of marriage, including the importance of alone time, understanding introvert and extrovert tendencies, the purpose of marriage for holiness rather than happiness, the refining process in marriage, the joy of long-suffering, the work required in marriage, supporting a spouse with chronic illness, and managing triggers and expectations in marriage. The conversation emphasizes the need for communication, self-awareness, and seeking counseling to navigate challenges and strengthen the marital bond.
Takeaways
Connect with Avia here:
Instagram : https://www.instagram.com/aviaiken/?hl=en
Connect the Host
Follow Zhara on Instagram @ zhara.marie - https://www.instagram.com/zhara.marie?igsh=cDdiaGtrODRpcmtr&utm_source=qr
Follow our podcast page @beyondthebouquetpod - https://www.instagram.com/zhara.marie?igsh=cDdiaGtrODRpcmtr&utm_source=qr
In this episode, Avia Aiken-Brown and Zhara discuss the challenges and joys of marriage. They explore the idea of marriage as a mirror, reflecting both the beauty and weaknesses of individuals. Avia shares her personal love story and the importance of choosing love every day. They also discuss the challenges of transitioning from friends to a romantic relationship. Avia and Zhara highlight the importance of resolving issues quickly and creating a peaceful atmosphere in the home. They also discuss the impact of hormonal changes on emotions and relationships. This conversation explores various aspects of marriage, including the importance of alone time, understanding introvert and extrovert tendencies, the purpose of marriage for holiness rather than happiness, the refining process in marriage, the joy of long-suffering, the work required in marriage, supporting a spouse with chronic illness, and managing triggers and expectations in marriage. The conversation emphasizes the need for communication, self-awareness, and seeking counseling to navigate challenges and strengthen the marital bond.
Takeaways
Connect with Avia here:
Instagram : https://www.instagram.com/aviaiken/?hl=en
Connect the Host
Follow Zhara on Instagram @ zhara.marie - https://www.instagram.com/zhara.marie?igsh=cDdiaGtrODRpcmtr&utm_source=qr
Follow our podcast page @beyondthebouquetpod - https://www.instagram.com/zhara.marie?igsh=cDdiaGtrODRpcmtr&utm_source=qr
Marriage the Great Refiner with Avia Aiken Brown
Zhara- Marie: Welcome to another episode of Beyond the Bouquet Podcast. Yay. And we are at episode, I don't even know what number this is. I think It's episode seven, and today we have the topic, the Great Refiner, and sitting on the big white virtual couch today is Avia Akin Brown. She is a woman of God. A beautiful singer, big singer, guys.
Sierra, different places. She's a worship leader and wife to Jelani for how many years?
Avia Aiken Brown: this year August is
five years.
Zhara- Marie: five year a big married and a little married. I understand. So
Avia Aiken Brown: I'm still a teenager,
Zhara- Marie: So I'll come to the couch.
Avia Aiken Brown: Zara, it's a pleasure.
Zhara- Marie: I Know guys we talk like every day in the DM's
Avia Aiken Brown: every single day. I love it. The best Insta friendship.
Zhara- Marie: Man I get that from time to time. Sometimes I see people in real life and they're likeI am so on. So I was like, Oh, you are so my underscore. yes.
Avia Aiken Brown: Yeah.
Zhara- Marie: but I mean, you know, when it comes to like, especially wifehood and this topic of marriage being the great refiner, I think we connect a lot on that.
Cause we're always draping up each other about the fact that, marriage is like a mirror. It's something that reflects us. And it's also. Like shows like our weak spots. It shows our insecurities, but it also radiates the beauty. And that's what's the powerful thing about it. So I know that you're into music and stuff.
I know it's very close to your heart. Is there any song that's Like any song that's your song this season, in this moment.
Avia Aiken Brown: there was a song that I actually sang for my Vogue. It's called I choose you.
And, that will always be my song because in marriage, it's not just about love. And if you're married for any period of time, you will know that
love is great, but ultimately marriage is a choice.
keeping that love is a choice every single day. And so me vowing to choose him and knowing that he chooses me too and us living that every single day is just so special and makes me feel good inside,
Zhara- Marie: Oh, all mushy. I love that. We also had that song. We had that song, me can't sing. I actually like singing, with a group of people, like in a choir.
Avia Aiken Brown: in you. You
Zhara- Marie: I like a choir or even two or three other people. I can't hold a little alto. You get me? But no, not out of that. But
Avia Aiken Brown: a good man,
Zhara- Marie: we can drop a little harmony here and there.
But I choose you with it for the bridesmaids entrance at our wedding and I just think it's such a a spiritual song as Well, and I like that it meshed both of it. Yeah
Avia Aiken Brown: If you
hear me, I
sing in between, man. I'm like, breathe. I
give you my whole heart for my whole life.like when you're in between, you're singing, you normally have some.
Girl, I couldn't do no oohs. I was fighting for my life.
Zhara- Marie: That's
Avia Aiken Brown: it was a very sweet song. And I knew that I could sing. I know we will get on a tangent, but I was trying to write him a song
and too much was happening. The wedding
planning and other things. And I said, let's reel it back a little. We don't
gotta, do all the things, us girlies, we like to do
all the things. So
Zhara- Marie: And then the guys will show up.
Avia Aiken Brown: Oh, Jelani just asked me for two things. He let me do everything else. He's
Zhara- Marie: what were the two things?
Avia Aiken Brown: let me choose what I'm wearing and let me take care of the music. That was it. Oh, and he asked
me for purple cause he went to Casey. So he asked me for
Zhara- Marie: Oh, he's a KC guy. like when I think about weddings, sometimes the bride waking up 5 a. m. because your hair have to get done. All the girls have to get ready. Everything like the timeline, 10 minutes for this, five minutes for that, one hour for that. And then the guys are just like chilling, just sipping pina colada.
And it's, it never gets old. Never, ever gets old. I like men say, all in a half a day I show up and I'm over there
Avia Aiken Brown: groomsmen afterwards told me that they went to KFC on the morning of the wedding. I'm like, you had time for that?
Zhara- Marie: guess they had time. All right. Anyways.
So what's the tea on the love story? How did you Angela? I wasn't going to ask you this, but no, I'm going to ask it because you said it. So condense the tea. how did you
Avia Aiken Brown: How much time do we have? It's a very simple story. We met in a singing group, of course.
I sang in the group. He played keyboard. And, we had a mutual group of friends as a result of that group. that group of friends started playing music at my church and the pastor's daughter. So hospitality wise, they ended up at
my house after church, eat dinner.
We all became actual friends in real life and in the groups that Falta, Peter out and Angela and I were left. So
Zhara- Marie: Look at that.
Avia Aiken Brown: I don't know if it was intentional on my end that we were both left, but,
yeah. He stuck around and we
Zhara- Marie: No, we thank
Avia Aiken Brown: a good while
Zhara- Marie: Yeah
Avia Aiken Brown: and then we were friends for a little while.
I just thought we were great friends, best buds. He was deeply in the friend zone. Now that I understand what I was doing, he
Zhara- Marie: Really no little nothing you did not see him nothing.
Avia Aiken Brown: not even a little bit,
Zhara- Marie: Oh, no
Avia Aiken Brown: close. he was stuck. I remember his best friend asking me one time. You and Jelani together? I'm like, oh, that's funny. What do you mean we're together? Absolutely. I would never date him. I would
never
Zhara- Marie: well look at you now Look at you now
Avia Aiken Brown: for 10 years, but,
basically what happened is that we were very close. We would go a lot of places together. We like music. So we went to all the little gospel concerts. We did all the things. We went to Regency, saw the jazz live and all of that. And, we were just really good friends. Or so I thought. Then one day, good friends, we always spoke on the phone after work or after school. And, one day I wasn't feeling the best and, I was a little down
and I was telling him how I felt and my man just, lyrics me. It's like a click in my brain. this not sound friendly anymore. Like this sound
Zhara- Marie: Yeah.
A little more.
Avia Aiken Brown: It sounds like feelings are involved, but I didn't say anything. And then out of nowhere, in my mind, he, out of nowhere, he just said. I love you and I'm like you do what?
Zhara- Marie: Wow. is it like a love you friend or
Avia Aiken Brown: No, he saidI love you. You're such a beautiful person. It will be difficult not to love you and the
man just start professing feelings and I was just like I
come from? yeah, all this time I just thought we were really good friends and he said all this time It wouldn't have been the entire time. We were besties You That he felt that way. But, he did feel that way for a while and did not tell me he was just patiently waiting. 'cause we have a friend there.
We have I, good friend.
So I wasn't thinking that he had any romantic interests, girl, but feelings for me also nothing.
Zhara- Marie: I guess also sometimes we struggle with the fact that what if we say it and then when we say it, it break up this beautiful friendship that we have and it affect the friend group and so the mutual
friends and stuff.
Avia Aiken Brown: I definitely think, that was a part of his thought process because he knew that I had. Some little unfinished relationships with some other local people.
Zhara- Marie: YouI go church
Avia Aiken Brown: he was, he was afraid that would have interpreted how I felt and it wasn't the case because one thing with me, I'm an emotional person.
So if you're not treating me Right
emotionally, I'm not paying no mind. And
so even though I wasn't. Completely like unattached. I was getting to a place where I was like, Yeah,
I'm not gonna talk to them people. They no more. like when
man takes you out one week and then next week they pop up and then they disappear and then
Zhara- Marie: yeah, man. Yeah, man. I
Avia Aiken Brown: me to say
Zhara- Marie: and the church guys love to string people along. I feel like it's a thing I don't know if there's a training for that, but they do do
you get that after you get
Avia Aiken Brown: They, are very good like at just keeping staying in your life, like just staying
Zhara- Marie: Yes
Avia Aiken Brown: enough in your space
to be there. If anything go wrong
Zhara- Marie: and then they act oblivious because of that Zondre do I'm just like No, he'll say stuff like oh I stayed willfully oblivious to things and I'm like not really anyways So as we talk about like
marriage being
that was it.
Okay. Boy. Mm
Avia Aiken Brown: Yeah. Oh, I wanted to finish the thought because he told
me he loved me. We're very good friends. And then I immediately like, think about. How did, how did I feel? Like, do I have
feelings too? And I never had to think about before. and then I thought about some, like, well, I do have feelings for this person.
I probably can say that I love him too, but I just never thought about it. Like never did. I've never did in other mental spaces. So we spoke and we talked, talking stage for
another month. And then I'm like, you can ask me to be your girlfriend now. Like we're talking every single day. Like, what are we doing? and then he made it official. and we've been together ever since. That was November
Zhara- Marie: Wow. So you didn't even realize that you were actually liking him too throughout this entire thing?
Avia Aiken Brown: Now, I was just
enjoying conversations
Zhara- Marie: when a marriage is built on a friendship like that, how, like, how, nothing. whatever trials or tribulations come, it will come and it will rock, but it's built on solid foundations
Avia Aiken Brown: Yeah. It has saved us many times.
Zhara- Marie: So as we talk about marriage being the great refiner, right? Have you guys, well, I know that you faced challenges, but. Could you give us an example of a challenge that kind of forced you to grow or change in a unexpected way, or something that kind of mirrored a part of you that you're not even realized was there.
Avia Aiken Brown: All right. So when we got married, I was 23. I want to put that in context, right? I had never lived with anybody before outside of my mom and my dad. I'm an only child, so I'm not used to sharing things. He is also an only
Zhara- Marie: Wow. What a combination.
Avia Aiken Brown: I want to give you a background, you know? he was what, 27 when he got married. So we were kind of setting our ways a little bit, right? I made it always big for me, so I made it always Mature and like unfiltered. I know what I want, right? So I thought going into marriage, I was ready. Absolutely. I was ready and I was wrong. I was so wrong. I honestly thought that because we had dated for five years, we were almost six years together when we got married, that we would have been prepared to handle living together. I don't even want to say this on your podcast, but it's one of the
drawbacks of being Christian and following God's plan, right?
We don't
Zhara- Marie: Yeah, you don't get to live with somebody
before the time
Avia Aiken Brown: well, me never did go live with somebody
past the picnic
otherwise. Right? Personally, I wouldn't want to, because I want to do it the right way, right? And so, getting married, I really thought I was prepared to handle some of the things. for example, when I got married, I didn't that Jelani have a tad bit, he's a little less clean than I am. that's with how him, put down him things, right? In the background, you can see his bag, not for the day. yeah, it's just out of place. Right. And I didn't deal with that. Well, when we just got married, I used to be a lot less calm handling things out of place
because how I want things, everything to go where it's supposed to there. and so I would get really frustrated with how I responded to him when I realized that things weren't in, put back in the right
place, or if him leave something on the table simple stuff like, you know, man, don't really put
Zhara- Marie: on the
Avia Aiken Brown: the hamper, then put it at the foot, at
the hamper, the side, at the table, places that are simple for them to put things. and I thought I was a great person
Zhara- Marie: you thought you had the emotions under control?
Avia Aiken Brown: did. I really, really thought I did the inner work before I got married enough to where I would be able to answer my husband with a pleasant smile. And I was
really wrong.
you said share a personal experience where it challenged me to grow.
That particular thing,
not answering my husband out of turn, that challenged me. I really had to look into myself and say, you can't answer him like that. You can't pounce on him. And it's not like I was cussing him out or, you know, like cussing bothered or nothing like that. Right.
I was just not nice. I was just not
nice. In those moments and that, and I would get an attitude, I would really let it sit on my spirits, but are the truth, whoever Tell the truth. Thankfully, I've grown now, but at first I really let that sit on my spirit and I let it bother me. Thankfully, I have a husband who is open to correction and is willing to hear me out when I do hear my grievances Because there are many in marriage and he was willing to say all right next time you see me put it down Just tell me if you take it up Just remind me if you take it up because he's not used to it And what
I learned in marriage is that when two people come together We'll come with the owner ways.
We'll come with the owner thoughts. We'll come with the owner You background and own a life and how we grew up or how we were really
informs what we do in marriage. So when the Bible
said the two become one, it's actually two people now figuring out our new way to be.
And once I looked at it that way. I'm like, Oh, I'm also going to have to learn how to be in this marriage.
It's not necessarily going to be that every day I'm going to come up with socks that go in the right place.
Some days I might have to take it up and that might have to just be the way. Not saying that
I'm not gonna learn to, how to be better, but I can't let it be that Zara, my husband, come home and the first thing I say to him is, why you put your shoes there?
That all right?
had to challenge myself, like, your husband come to the door, the first thing you say, Is why you putting issues there that can't make
sense of you. So I had to like really talk myself through those little things. And then this is a personal experience.
He had an accident at the end of 2020 2021. He had an accident. He came home because we share a car. He came
home for the car keys. Cause I had the car that day came home for the car keys. He was at the rehearsal, but he was going to drop somebody home. So he and the person came home. He said hi to me, and he said, babe, I'm going to take the car keys drop the person home, right? Zara, less than five minutes from him leaving the house, he called me and said, I'm meeting an accident. Police want to take me to the hospital.
And I was shocked. Of course, I was just like, okay, are you okay? And he was like, I'm not sure, but I know that I have to go to the hospital.
I went up there, look at the car. his side had the worst impact. So I immediately knew that he was hurt. Everything that I was bothered about in the house before
it became nothing. It really became nothing and in that experience alone, and there's a lot more I could say about that, but that experience alone shifted my perspective back to what's important.
It does not matter now. Where's the line to put your shoes? Okay, put your shoes somewhere. I don't care.
Are you coming home to me? Get home safely. that's what I care about. Like, that accident let
me know that I was focused on the wrong things. And I can say that now.
focused on the wrong things. So, that really shifted my perspective. Like, now, if you put them in some, somewhere where we don't
want
Zhara- Marie: take it, up. You're the one who is bothering him. you are stuck
peaceful in my sleep, but him side and all a snore and you, so one of the things that also I wanted to chime in, you were talking about the fact that the first thing that you would say when him come in is just start finding issue with what he's doing and, We do still believe in some of, especially the biblical role of a wife and also wives being responsible in whatever way, whether it means that she's actually doing the work, but wives being responsible for the atmosphere of the home and a lot of times when we talk about homemaking and talk about, wives being in charge of the home, a lot of people start thinking chores.
And I think it's so far from the truth because chores can be split. Chores can be outsourced. They can always get somebody, they can hire somebody to do all those things. But I think a lot of conversation is not surrounding the fact that as the woman with that, Feminine flair. It is our responsibility.
That is literally how God built us and made us to be in charge of the atmosphere of the home. The way we greet our spouse, the most times it is our attitude that's going to throw off the mood.
our Lord mode that's going to switch things around. It's our PM. Let it, yeah, it's really. So
When we recognize that this is something that's in our hands and this role is a role that's up to us for us to cultivate and we lead in that aspect. That's one of the areas that I think we can lead in. Nowwe have that edge, when guys can lead in other ways logically, because that's just how they were built because of the things that we were built with a little bit more compassion, a little bit more femininity, that softness, We are in charge of that atmosphere and it helps with the type of submission.
It helps with even the reflection of the worst parts of us. So one of the things that you also mentioned was like stacking. I think we spoke about this at USA. Being able to let go of things as they happen is one of the biggest things you can do for yourself in a marriage.
Something happens and you don't feel good about it, it's like you can't sit together and say, you didn't say something to me last night, don't wait till next week. You say no, because stacking just going to make you bloat and then something like the accident going to happen and you're going to say, so all of this, and you don't even realize when you're stacking, it don't
Avia Aiken Brown: That never made no sense.
Zhara- Marie: When you're stacking, a lot of times you don't realize.
Avia Aiken Brown: One thing I love about, us is that we've always, prided ourselves on being able to resolve issues pretty quickly. and that's why it's important not to have multiple people in your relationship, except you. Because when you're not done dealing with it, you'll move on and forgive and make up and make love and do the things. Your family is still a whole now and your friend is still a whole now and you're
like, oh no, we moved on already man. Him love me, but yeah, it's important for me that we resolve our issues very quickly. And I'm not The one that usually pushes for that
Zhara- Marie: the talking through
Avia Aiken Brown: You
Zhara- Marie:
Avia Aiken Brown: yeah.
he'll be
Zhara- Marie: That's not
Avia Aiken Brown: you talk. And I'll be like, oh, you know, he's like, your mood, just talk, man. what me do now? And he'll be like, what me do now? sometimes we also have to recognize, I found this on a podcast the other day. Sometimes we're supposed to not do nothing. We have to recognize when we're mood just off, and we are trying things where them do wrong. When them just a try live in a peace and harmony, we just wake up in a mood Now, everybody mad. Like, why everybody have to mad? You are mad. You stay mad to yourself and leave the man to himself. But we know we
have to drag everybody in our bad
Zhara- Marie: I don't know
because
Avia Aiken Brown: So, I've had to recognize when I'm in a not so great mood that has nothing to do with him and just deal with resolve it on my own and still be able to say, you know, babe, I'm not feeling the greatest.
Zhara- Marie: yes,
Avia Aiken Brown: I'm a Christian lady, so. I
always bring it back to babe. I'm not feeling the best mentally. I don't know what's going on. Just pray for
me. When you pull out the pray for me, it knows I'm not doing it.
Zhara- Marie: No, I find this so hilarious because about three hours or days ago. I wake up in the middle know what wrong with me. Me don't know.
And my youth has seen,
Avia Aiken Brown: It's hormones. It's
literally
Zhara- Marie: Zandra has sing one song. I don't know which song, I don't know if it's Jesus is my deliverer, but it was nothing wrong with this song, but he kept on singing it over and over, it was so annoying and I said to him, babe, change the track now
and he goes. But I can't
think of another song that I want to sing. Like, and I was so annoyed and I literally had to take a step back at me and say, Sarah, what is wrong with you? Nothing. The guy not did nothing. and then he was like, yeah, all right. And let Me say, yeah man, me alright.
He say he not seem alright. And then me say, me really not feel alright. But nothing is wrong, like he didn't do anything. nor did anybody do anything to me. But, and I
guess, as females,
Avia Aiken Brown: It's just extra
honor in the day.
Zhara- Marie: Cause it, easily for the first couple hours of the day is the one song. And me say, what is wrong with you?
Just sing a next song. But, being
aware, pick another one, but I guess also being aware of like our cycle and the different weeks and stuff and, How that affects how we feel, because I guess after that, I realized that it was PMS and I was like, okay, cool, it is what it is.
That's why I felt
like
Avia Aiken Brown: Yeah. There's times when
Zhara- Marie: there's times when we need support and space. And then for us, as only children,you might not have this because Jelani was also only child, but Zondre is the opposite of an only child. And there are moments when I just need to be by myself and it's good.
it balances out because he's a doctor and he works a lot, like not a lot, well, a lot, but he will work overnights because that's when I get the time to just. And I didn't even realize how important it is. It was for me to just be until we went on
a three month trip in Asia. when
we
couldn't
Avia Aiken Brown: Wow. And you were in each other's face all the
time.
Zhara- Marie: no break.
He never went to work and
Zondre is a very sociable person.
Avia Aiken Brown: Well, Zara.
Zhara- Marie: and then he would also do the thing where he won't talk to other people all the time. and I don't want to talk to other people all the time. And I did even this whole refining thing. Zondre has shown me that I'm not as sociable as I thought I was.
Because I thought I was a very sociable person, but then there are levels to being very social and him surpassed that level.
And then I'm like, yeah,
Avia Aiken Brown: You're probably what they call an introvert
Zhara- Marie: yeah. like an ambivert, which is
like a mixture of both of them. Where I have a limit, but he doesn't and he pulls his energy from being with more people.
But I pull my energy from being alone, so I need that time to recharge. So all these things happen and you're like, that's what marriage was made for. But I think I'll go a little bit more in detail with the topic, but what do you think about the phrase, marriage was not meant for your happiness. It was meant for your holiness.
Avia Aiken Brown: Ooh. that's a good one. Some people, they feed into the world's view of marriage. That's number one. Yeah. Mm hmm. we church kids, we understand that marriage is, well, we hope that we
understand that marriage is much more a fairy tale, day. It is not a wedding.
Zhara- Marie: the bouquet.
Avia Aiken Brown: It is a life. It's a ministry. and so I knew that yes, I should want to be happy as a person, but my marriage should not be the thing that causes me happiness. If I'm a child of God, I should have the joy of the Lord, huh? Inside.
and if two people come together with the joy of the Lord, then y'all go happy. Y'all go
happy. But the holiness part, there are parts of in your striving to holiness. You have to go through that refinance file and refining file is hot and marriage Your partner is your direct mirror and God
uses them to refine you and that is exactly what happened
Zhara- Marie: hmm.
Avia Aiken Brown: I as I was saying, I thought I was a great person when I got married I found out that maybe I wasn't a great person.
Maybe I was just a good person Maybe I wasn't great. Maybe I was good, right? and it showed me that even though I was a passage child, I didn't, I wasn't sexting a hundred
Zhara- Marie: out.
Avia Aiken Brown: that at all. ButI wasn't outside like people always say pastors kids are the worst.
I genuinely wanted to please the Lord and I wasn't even afraid of my father. I was afraid of God himself. And I
still am. I'm like, Lord Jesus, you shouldn't do this Lord. Y'all gonna strike me. Not strike me down, but like you're going to be disappointed because I wasn't afraid of like striking me down. I didn't want God to be disappointed in me. that's how my fear did stem from, you know, like, you go out on the road and you disappoint your father, or you talk to
somebody and
your parents tell you not to talk to them, and yeah, I didn't want the
Zhara- Marie: it's that level of reverence. It's not fair oh, you are this big tyrant and you're going to strike me down, but I love you and I respect you, and I want you to believe in me, and I want you
to think the best of me.
Avia Aiken Brown: Yeah, well, I want to please you, and I do believe that Marriage should, because it's not just personal, marriage in general should cause you to come into even a greater alignment with the Lord and with the things of the
Lord. Especially if you are two Christian people, if your marriage is not making you better spiritually than anything. You need to fix it. You need to really reevaluate where you're
at and how this marriage is helping you as a person. it has definitely caused me to look at my fruits of the spirit. Like, can I
be more gentle? Can I be more kind? Can I be more loving? Can I suffer a little longer for the cause of this marriage to work?
like to look past Long suffering but we don't like that We don't like that and that's why I have an issue with soft life,
If something is impactful, if anything you're building, you want it to be good, you have to put it in the work.
And so marriage is no different than that. We have, where me and Jelani are at.
Zhara- Marie: Togetherness.
Avia Aiken Brown: Five years of marriage now we've yet 10 years of Togetherness.
five years of dating and five years of marriage. And we, over the years we have put so much work into getting where we are now. and there is so much work left to be done because we haven't yet become parents.
We haven't yet, all our parents are aging. So we haven't gone through the season of you know taking care of sick parents because I know that's coming up We're both owning children. So
those Parental challenges will now become burdens that even just thinking about our future Like it's gonna get more rough and they're gonna be more seasons that we have to navigate But
I know that we can do it Together it only works
if it's
together and I will say too on this same holiness thing Marriage cannot always make you happy because your partner is your accountability partner. Jelani will look me in the face and say Babes You fix up that straight like that. It will look for me because he's also my friend. He'll be like none of that
Zhara- Marie: yeah.
I know that.
Avia Aiken Brown: And I have been like, oh, I don't have six up because if I can't trust my husband to tell me where I'm going wrong then
stop it there, and it's the same thing like when he trusts my word for him in the same way that I trust his word for me because I
know that God is using him to refine me
and I think I know he knows that God is
Zhara- Marie: refining.
It's
to refine him. Yeah, so if you're in that marriage just for oh, we're gonna travel or we're gonna you know Take all the social media pictures. We're gonna do this. We're gonna do that and you know expect to go through the refinance file Maybe there's maybe it's too complicated. Maybe there's things that you're ignoring I don't think the refinery is
fire It's a choice though. I feel like everybody is, cause as I always tell people that I don't think marriage itself is hard. I think life is hard and marriage is an aspect of life that helps you to navigate that. But no matter what happens, there is some sort of refinance for it, just that you have somebody else to go through it with.
And as we talk about accountability part of it, it's one of those things where I don't know if you see it in your marriage, but I find that whenever I'm on a spiritual law. Zondre is on a high or he's in a place where he can pull me up. And then when he goes down, I'm at a place where I can pull him up.
And then sometimes we balance out, but we're always there to help each other spiritually. And sometimes the other person is so low that you have to pull all of that weight. And even as women, when we talk about the fact that all we want. a man who's going to be the spiritual leader of the household and one that's going to, be the priest of the household and stuff like that.
I find that if we leave it up, if we allow itto be the determining factor of our relationship with God, it can cause issues because even as a spiritual leader, sometimes you need help. And yes, he's the head and we're the shoulders. So at no point should we always just rely and say, Oh, he's a spiritual leader.
So if you now worship me now worship, or if he's not praying, because sometimes he just can't pray and that's okay. Like it's okay if you don't have the strength to talk to God, sometimes there's nothing wrong with that because God sees us, he knows us. And sometimes I just cry, I go cry. Sometimes
Just tears are the only language, but you are going to be the one who will have to pray. So it will help you to get closer to God. And as you know, that little analogy that says if God is in the middle or God is at the center, as each of you get closer to God, you get closer together because this is now your partner and you're doing this thing together.
You're doing this life thing together. You're doing this worshiping God together in spirit and in truth. And it's not something that we should take for granted because Accountability partner is not easy to find, this world is ghetto,
like the amount of people want true community and true friendship and if you have that in your marriage, it's just such a blessing and I know not every wife will have it because some people you got, you became a Christian after you got married or.
You got married to somebody who is not a Christian, so you don't have that experience. And, that's also a different struggle and a different conversation that I'm sure we'll talk about in later episodes as well. But for you specifically, Avia, I know that you are a sickle cell advocate warrior. Ambassador, all of the above,
all the things.
So I'm interested to hear about what, where, whatever you feel comfortable sharing about how, struggling with that chronic illness how has it impacted your marriage and your role as a wife and how have you been navigating that?
Avia Aiken Brown: Well, as I said before, me and Jelani were really good friends before we became married or before we started dating. And so that?
really helped us, in
navigating the challenges that come with chronic illness because he knew every single thing about my illness. I have never been one to be. Coy or shy about that kind of that aspect of my life.
it's on my ig bio It is literally on my resume. I'm a sickle cell. I'm a member of the sickle cell support foundation of jamaica. That's on my resume so like You are gonna know i'm not afraid because I do think that it's one of the diseases in jamaica that Could be talked about a lot more and could be understood a little more.
So If you are going to be my
friend, you have to know, right?
So he always knew and he was close to me enough, to understand what I did to help myself. So for a sick love, for example, hydration is really important. Taking your medication on time is very important. You know, staying away from your triggers is very important. And so he, even as a friend, was very protective of me in that way. and so as a husband, oh my, he's like top of the things, girl, I had a crisis early this year, I think. I ended up going to Andrews. But it was a good experience at Andrews still. They took care of me. But after that, he was like, you weren't drinking enough water and he didn't stay away from you. Of course, it ended up in that situation and of course, as I said, it's hard to hear. Of course, he supported me in the moment,
but those are the kinds of things.
He's a very
practical solution
oriented kind of guy.
and he's the same way as my husband. Yeah, he supported me. I woke up 2 o'clock that morning I couldn't go to sleep. and the pain just wasn't getting better and I woke him up and I said, babe, I can't manage this, tonight. I don't think it's gonna get no better. I just feel like it's getting worse. And he just jumped up, putting on some sweats and just, me that, just drive me to the hospital and
he's always been so supportive in everything. Every kind of way. After that crisis, my man buy me a huge water bottle and he said, You see it have the time stamp them put You see when we
come home, better there. the time stamp where I was like, okay, all right and he said, we'll have to avoid your triggers a little better. And he kind of, took ownership, to be honest, like that's, I've never experienced.
Well, other than my parents, I haven't experienced friends or family who have taken ownership of my illness in the way that my husband has,
he takes responsibility for it as well. And I could
not have asked for a better partner in that way. So when I'm sick, he will take the load He will. I'm not really like clean so I'm gonna call somebody or he will ask me what's priority like what will bother me
and make sure that those things are done he'll make sure that I have food he will make sure that you know everything that I normally would be doing that are
important
to me are done and he'll
just hug me support me comfort me give me my heat pad give me my water things like that and I really appreciate him for that when I was at UTEP
and I did a year and a half at UTEC for a program that thought I would have liked but I didn't like and stress is one of my triggers and I wasn't managing mentally.
I wasn't doing well mentally in that situation. And we're together at a time, we were young together to like two years
and it started to affect my health to the point where I had to be on a morphine, for pain management. And if you're no
morphine are cancer drugs. Soit's very strong.
And I had to get the morphine from UI. Pharmacy, like I had to go to a pharmacy to get them working. and during that time, he was just so supportive. He would come to my house, make sure that I'm eating, make sure that I'm well. He was in college himself, in my mother vehicle, and call me on, make sure I take care of myself and that kind of thing.
And so from the very beginning, he was just super supportive and making sure,
and protective and
making sure that I'm okay. So
now just on a
different level, you
Zhara- Marie: And I think that also adds to whatever kind of weight or insecurities you would have about even you like your role as the wife, because, with him not making you feel bad, cause some people at a certain stage they'll say it slightly, but at the end of the day.
Avia Aiken Brown: Yeah,
Zhara- Marie: of you were friends first and that you are more than just his wife You're his friend and he sees and he understands and he cares. So as it relates to Sickle cell, right? I know that there's some, I don't know what the word, but there's something that you have to do when you're going to have children.
So is it that like when you have, cause you have, do you have the traits or do you have a full blown thing
or you're full blown? So is it that, is there anything that, for education wise, is there anything that can prevent children that will come into this mix? From getting it or is it just chance?
Avia Aiken Brown: No, it's hereditary. So my children will get a sickle cell gene from me so they will have a trait Even though so when jelani and I got together One of the first things that we did was to get him tested for sickle cell kamina
Zhara- Marie: Yeah. Yeah.
Avia Aiken Brown: sickle cell. No, please.Not gonna do that. So, fun fact, there was a guy that liked me in grade nine
Zhara- Marie: and
you were
Avia Aiken Brown: out he had sickle cell
and I just stopped talking to him. I was like,
Sorry, only reason I kind of didn't get Jelani tested when we were like early was because he was giving blood. He had done all of that. So I was like, pretty sure he didn't have it. But
by two year mark, I was like, sir,
Zhara- Marie: Yeah.
Avia Aiken Brown: now. Like, you have to give me the black and
white, show me. And thankfully he doesn't. I had to be sure. So thankfully he doesn't have it. He has two
normal genes and sicklers who have full blown sickle cell have two abnormal genes. So the two abnormal sickle genes full blown sickle cells.
So, the way reproduction works is the child will get two genes, one from either parent. So they will have a trait. I will have to educate them. However, it doesn't affect reproduction from me, but When I've spoken to gynecologists and stuff, they have said that they would prefer for me not to deliver naturally vaginally because they have more control, for blood loss and stress on my body So that's the thing that I know going into childbearing more than likely my children will come
via c section andI will have to be at, yeah, no, no, wrong, still
baby. I will have to be at a public, a hospital that has an ICU so that in case anything happen, they can rush
Zhara- Marie: by the grace of god.
Avia Aiken Brown:
Zhara- Marie: Nothing will happen and you'll be fine
Hallelujah,
Avia Aiken Brown: Girl, that has been a whole other thought journey.
but we're getting there.
there. Slowly
but surely. I'm getting there. Mr. Brown has been there for a while, but I'm, getting there. I'm
getting there. I'm getting
Zhara- Marie: Alright, so let's see. We're looking into 2024 and 2025. Let's see what will happen.
Avia Aiken Brown: I'm not rushing it. I am definitely, Oh and sickle cell does affect your birth
control methods as well. So I cannot do anything high progesterone. I only can do low progesterone and I cannot do oestrogen either. So my birth control options were very limited. I could only do IUD or the Depo shot or condoms.
Zhara- Marie: actually having a Gynecologist come in. One of my friends, Millie coming in soon to talk about that. Because as Christians we don't like talk contraceptives, is we don't. it's
so taboo. I guessit's even more taboo in the holistic space because everybody have their little opinions and stuff.
So
Avia Aiken Brown: Be fruitful and multiply.
Zhara- Marie: We
mustn't limit God, right? So yeah, anyways, so this week's listener letter comes from Tracy from Ghana. And Tracy says, marriage has exposed me to triggers I didn't know I had. What's the best way to deal with these triggers?
Avia Aiken Brown: so good. I was mentioning earlier that I had a little depression stint at UTEC and thankfully I was able to utilize their counseling services. And during that counseling session or those counseling sessions, I learned a lot about how sickle cell affected my mental health. And through that, I also learned other triggers about myself. So I was doing some inner work to kind of figure out what triggered me. Now in marriage, them say, see me and come live with me at two different things. You don't even know that you have these, you don't even remember, you don't even aware that these triggers exist until you kind of put in a situation, but I would say it's important to understand yourself as a person, as an individual, before you get married. So that even when these things come up in marriage, you're able to identify it a, as a negative aspect of your personality and not necessarily attributing that to the person that you're married to. Because sometimes we want to blame
people and not know what to do with them baby. yeah, It's you. So like before marriage, I was mentioning to you that I thought I was great, but one of the things I learned was I was expecting Jelani to
Zhara- Marie: ha ha.
Avia Aiken Brown: because I'm like, you're supposed to know
Zhara- Marie: for this long.
Avia Aiken Brown: you're supposed to know because Yeah, you're supposed to
know. So I don't even know if it's an example of a trigger, but my father was very homely, very domestic in cooking, cleaning, washing,
everything, and in garden. But see my father do all of the things that a man wouldn't necessarily do.
And I thought Jelani would have the same kind of, you know, mentality. Pre destination. But that wasn't the case and that really bothered me
Zhara- Marie: Wow,
Avia Aiken Brown: that I expected him to
Zhara- Marie: like it out.
Avia Aiken Brown: my God,
that's, that was a, yeah, that was a fair, he's his own person. And while he does share similarities to my dad in terms of characteristics, he
is not my father. He is Jelani,
Zhara- Marie: hmm.
Avia Aiken Brown: who is a different human with a different background. And so I was putting some expectations on him that were very unreasonable and very unfair. And once I realized that about myself I removed it from the equation and said you have to make it as bad as it will be Yes, he will learn certain things over time, but let him be who he is right now And you'll live a much more peaceful life and that has been the case I have let him be his own person and not
put these expectations and we're not expecting him to read my mind either so You know, we just communicate What is there but I don't know if that's a trigger but that's definitely an expectation
unrealistic expectation
Zhara- Marie: and disappointments come when expectations aren't met. So it would trigger disappointment in some way. When it comes to triggers though, as you said, I think it's okay to go and get individual counseling to learn how to deal with the triggers and then also couples counseling, because especially if those triggers are some deep ones.
Maybe you'll have to know, learn how to navigate that within the relationship because one of the things for me is that my dad died early, died when I was 12 and when he died in a pretty unfortunate way and one of my biggest issues or triggers, is that if I call your phone, you need to answer me.
And if you don't need to answer me, I have already created 20
scenarios in my head.
Avia Aiken Brown: You get you're kidnapped and
Zhara- Marie: Yes.
Avia Aiken Brown: to
Zhara- Marie: and I'm going to call the police and I'm going to call my father in law because my father in law is who I call if, anything serious
happened, AKA. So what happens? so Zondre had to learn very early because I knew that about myself because I would have identified that before marriage, he knew that he needed to keep his phone charged at all times.
And if it was going to die, he should know to send me a quick message and it has even showed up. No, because sometimes I'm at the hospital and I don't realize I'm phone a dead, I'm phone dead. And two times in particular, I have, I call all operator at the hospital to
ask for him. Everybody knows, says his wife is looking for him.
I call everybody's number. I know. So having to work through that,
how,
Avia Aiken Brown: Not the
Zhara- Marie: entire, the entire search party. But, instead of him thinking, Oh, my wife is crazy. What is wrong with her? Is she insecure? She think, he knows exactly where that is coming from. And he knows instead of getting he doesn't get upset when I do stuff like that, he actually just apologizes because he knows that he had a part to play by allowing his phone to die or whatever.
And sometimes it's most times it's not on purpose. When you can identify those triggers, then both of you can work around it to see how, how best you're going to navigate those triggers together. What part can you play in communicating maybe how you're feeling and what part can your partner play?
So that's our listener letter. Remember to send your listener letters to beyondthebouquetpod at gmail. com. All right, Althea,
thank you so
much.
yeah, it was
a good
one.
So that's
it.
Avia Aiken Brown: There's so much more to
talk about.
Zhara- Marie: it's been a pleasure to have you on this big virtual white couch. I'm sure you'll be back .
and we'll see you on the next episode of The Beyond the Bouquet Podcast. Bye guys.
Avia Aiken Brown: It was so much fun. Bye guys.