Change of Heart

In the debut episode of Earshifter, hosts Rene and Sean dive into Toronto's Change of Heart, reflecting on their significant but overlooked influence. Amid tales of teenage button collections and record exchanges, they discuss the band's history, evolution, and why they're deserving of more recognition. Earshifter playlist: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/4xT3qcagxiU1wsHNNaVOwR?si=a51c033d6a0c4f56 UPDATE: In 2025, Change of Heart released their new album, In the Wreckage – giving you more Change of Heart to explore.

Transcript

Speaker 00: 0:00

o Welcome to EarShifter. He's Rene Rouleau. And he's Sean Kapstick. And Rene, tell us why we're here.

Speaker 00: 0:21

We are here because this is a brand new music podcast and it is about bands or artists that didn't that we feel didn't get the recognition they deserved. Mm hmm. And I hope we can share a little bit of our recollection of the bands, a little bit of history with them, put them in context. And yes, give these bands the exposure that they deserve, that we think we should share with people.

Speaker 01: 0:45

Yeah. And I think the other thing I'd say, Sean, is that it's really it's about two things. So it's about discovery. So meaning new bands you've never heard of. But it's also for those fans that know the band, but want to explore that band more. And this podcast, guys, this is all about, hey, you like that band? Excellent. Okay, so. Why are you so passionate about music? Oh, man. So I think for me, like, OK, so first of all, this podcast, guys, this started because selfishly, I'm just going to say this. I'm in the 96th percentile of Spotify heavy listeners in Canada. And that's where we're coming from. We're coming from Toronto, Canada. So 96th percentile says a lot in 33 million people. And that just says that we are into music. And Sean and I have always been into music since were teenagers, and that's actually how we met. Yep. You were

Speaker 00: 1:45

wearing buttons like you did back in the day. And I'm questioned whether you really should be wearing those buttons. Do you remember what button? I

Speaker 01: 1:52

know I had a Clash button. I had a Who button. And I think I had a Sinceros button. I

Speaker 00: 1:58

can't remember the third, but you definitely had the Who and the Clash. Yeah. And I wanted to know whether you were legit on the Clash.

Speaker 01: 2:04

Yeah. And that was before, guys, just so you know. If any of you know, the Who toured with the Clash opening, that was before that. So my buttons were actually before the time when they... actually toured together. You've always been a trendsetter. Thank you. Yes. And your buttons... I don't remember

Speaker 00: 2:21

what your buttons were, Sean. I had the spoons. Oh man, that's right. But I also was trying to rebel within that rebellious thing by not having so many buttons. Yeah, whereas I was just a whore. I was a buttons whore.

Speaker 01: 2:34

Those were good days. Those were good days. And just one more thing on that before we get into this. Sean and I have been friends for a long time, but our friendship is truly based on music and I'll tell you why. For about 12 months, we exchanged to records every month and that's all we did we actually didn't sit together drink together nothing we just said this is a good album i like this band and that's all we do 10 minutes of exchange of albums once a month for about 12 months and then we

Speaker 00: 3:05

became friends and then we started critiquing the records and i kept asking you why does this one not have any songs on it why is it just music is that true yes you gave me a brian eno ambient album and i was like I guess it's okay if I was going to sleep, but the songs aren't very good. He wrote a lot of good songs. Why didn't you give me Taking Tiger Mountain by Strategy way back then? That would have saved me a lot of time before I found that.

Speaker 01: 3:31

Well, Sean, you know how I feel about ambient music. This is not a podcast about ambient music, guys. Don't drop off yet. But Sean is heavy duty in the lyrics. And what he's getting at is Sean loves lyrics. I love music that makes me feel good. And that's kind of what you're going to get in this podcast as well, is kind of an objective... Look at these bands from a lyric standpoint and from a feel standpoint.

Speaker 00: 3:53

Yeah. And mostly we agree on music. Sometimes we don't agree on the music. Mostly when I'm like... watching the band going, why are there no microphones? Did you bring me to another band that doesn't sing? But most of the time we agree on the music, but we do come from a very different perspective in terms of why we like the music. And even when we talk about bands that we like, we have very different reasons about the songs and approach the songs differently. So yeah, it is kind of interesting how the same music can evoke different... emotions and different ideas of why the band did it so

Speaker 01: 4:25

yeah but let's get to i mean we're having fun but is everyone else having fun i don't know so let's let's why don't we are you ready to rip into this sure but before we

Speaker 00: 4:36

start in terms of of the band we want to talk to today let's set a little bit of ground rules in terms of when you said they need exposure so where are bands in terms of popularity so we don't want to have a band that nobody's ever listened to even if that was important to us but at the same time we don't feel that we need to talk about bands that most people know or maybe most people don't. know in our minds don't need to know more about so where is what is an ear shifter band for you yeah okay so this gets weird

Speaker 01: 5:05

so i think it's really based on people i talk to if they don't know the band then that tells me that the band is not radio friendly or tiktok friendly if it's my daughter and in that case i feel like they deserve more but there are bands and we're not going to get into a rabbit hole too much yet but there are bands like car seat headrests that we both love and one could argue he's got at 1.2 million listeners on Spotify monthly. But is that enough? And when I talk to anyone that's into music, a lot of them don't know who Car Seat Headrest is. So really, what is an ear shifter band? An ear shifter band is a band that we feel deserves more. Whatever that is, that more, it depends.

Speaker 00: 5:48

Fair. So we go to shows and sometimes we can't believe how popular the band is when we think nobody likes them and there's a whole bunch more people liking them. So, you know, we mentioned The Clash. The Clash need more exposure. Everybody should know The Clash. I'm glad The Clash are on to the third generation, but maybe we won't deal with those types of bands that do have more base of popularity and exposure. So, yeah, I think it's going to be interesting to explore whether these bands we talk about But our ear shifter bands are not. And you know what that means. And maybe they will think it's good too. Hopefully. If they get our seal of approval. So we'll start about our first. What are we going to talk about in terms of our first ear shifter band? Well, I'd like to talk about Change of Heart from Toronto, Ontario, Canada. I'd like to thank them very much for being part of my growing up. I can't remember when... change of heart. And the main guy, who I'll talk about, Ian Blurton, has been there for a long time. So I think he's as an artist and he's done many other things. But the first meaningful project was Change of Heart. So he and Rob Taylor started the band probably in the early 80s. They came out with their first album, which I know I had. I can't find it right now. So it was 50 feet up and they've evolved. The sound has evolved. The band has evolved over the time. And listening to the songs there, they were pretty simple. They released an anthem that I have seen him play in the last decade, Reasons for Living, that still holds up, even though he was a very young person and they were both young at the time. And then they evolved to Slow Dance, which was a and I guess even before we go in if we leave before we leave 50 feet up you know I think one of the reasons why Change of Heart has been so lasting is because they punched above their weight so that album cover was worn by i think it was sloan on their big breakout i don't know if it was i think it was underwhelmed when you know they were able to to really make it out of the canadian music scene and the drummer was wearing a change of heart t-shirt and that's been a number of other influential canadian bands who are like kind of pointing back to change of heart

Speaker 01: 8:27

that's kind of awesome so listeners just in case you don't know who sloan is sloan was a popular band a kind of a grunge band back in the time in canada

Speaker 00: 8:35

the canadian they're the

Speaker 01: 8:37

canadian nirvana there you go and they're still kicking around and they are still kicking around and and you know i i've seen them live i'm i don't know have you seen them live yeah i'm not together though but yeah anyway they were they were a pretty iconic band for canada a little small country just north of the u.s but the thing i want to ask you sean and i don't i don't think you said this but how did you first hear about change of heart was it on the radio was it in the mag what where did you hear about them That I don't remember.

Speaker 00: 9:04

They would have been part of, I'm sure it was... I might have saw them in concert. They might have been opening for a band on Queen Street. They may have been, you know, played on the Ryerson radio station. Something. You just don't know. I just don't know. And then when I look back, you know, Ian Blurton was around all the time. Like there was a novelty act, the Jolly Tambourine Band, and he was on another potential ear shifter band, Neon Rome, that we'll talk about. He was a drummer on that. So he was all around the music scene. He didn't grow up in Toronto. or Canada he grew up in the States but he was all around that Toronto scene in the 80s and so it was kind of ubiquitous so like I'd see him play in different bands he'd tour with other bands so it was kind of he was always there and then Change of Heart was very distinctive in terms of those other acts and you know and the way that he that they, he and Rob evolved, right? Slow dance was much less simple, more complicated, more, still had some nice, easy, you know, like, They never were ballads, but quieter music. And then Stress Monkey, one of the songs, had a locked track. If you played it on the record, the needle wouldn't come out. It was just in a circle right before the record would release. So it was just this drowning, that if you didn't take your record off, would go on forever.

Speaker 01: 10:33

Whoa, that's kind of cool.

Speaker 00: 10:34

That's really innovative. And that was back in like 84 or something, right? And so they then moved on. and expanded musical leap changed people and then they released an album called Soapbox that had I don't know like from a conventional you know four songs per side Soapbox probably had i don't know 20 songs on it i had you know at this point cds had come out so i don't longer have that well actually my son has it because he took all my cds i hope he still has them he thought they were more valuable than i did but you know that's that became quite a different more involved sound so maybe let's let's hear a pat's decline

Speaker 02: 11:19

it's

Speaker 00: 11:21

just

Speaker 02: 11:22

a day that is making and breaking suddenly i I could tell you it would be a different sort of hell without me. Could you make your hell without me? Was that thunder or backfire? They

Speaker 00: 12:10

started to get pretty complex at this point, bringing in different instrumentation. You know, they were moving away from being a simple rock band or a punk band, but they still had that ethos of do-it-yourself touring. They could be Quite abrasive in concert, but looking back, you know, I've got a single here that I was going through my record collection because I still have my records on my CDs and they look so young. I mean, there's the double A side with the asexuals with another cut from that song. And yeah, he looks so young.

Speaker 01: 12:42

guys it's it's just a testament to sean as to like he actually brought these 45 singles with him and he's kept them for all this time ian if you're listening he's got them man if you want them we could sell them to you

Speaker 00: 12:56

i checked his songs they're not that worth that much all right to me they are so at this point they'd had you know radio college success and they really started to okay say what can we do next and at this time the band had kind of switched Like the members, you mean? Whoa,

Speaker 01: 13:36

I didn't know

Speaker 00: 13:36

that was the origin. That's so cool. Smile is one of the Beach Boys. Of course. Albums. Brian Wilson specifically. Yeah. And so that was the album and it was released. It was recorded like in three days live to tape with, you know, a band of, you know, there were 20 people in the studio at some point. And it's quite, again, a departure from the soapbox, lyrically similar. But now it went forward. And are we going to we're going to hear Smile? and their hit that actually crossed over to commercial alternative radio there you go Okay, so that was Smile, the title cut. There's very little space between the tracks before they just go from one song to another and deals with environmentalism, loneliness, laziness. And then, ironically, they had a college radio-friendly hit called with There You Go, which did have a little bit of play and all of a sudden, you know, maybe they were going to get popular and maybe they were going to break out of a little smaller venue touring. So let's hear There You Go. But before we do, I

Speaker 01: 15:33

just want to say that, you know, Sean, we take turns. Sean brought Change of Heart to me and I'm like, Change of Heart? Okay. Yeah, sure. Sure. Sean, that sounds good. I mean, I'm down. I like them. We saw them together, but I didn't like them as much as I remembered. I liked them. So what I'm getting at here is I hadn't listened to them in like a long, long time until we're doing this podcast, which is by the way, why we're doing this podcast. So we can do this too. And I was fucking, I was loving like listening to them. I had them in my head for days when I was like away from it. And I just, I just remember how influential they were to me too. And I just forgot. And so this is, this is an awesome moment for me in terms of like, Just bringing them back and feeling all those feelings again. And yeah, let's listen to There You Go.

Speaker 02: 16:16

There you go, standing alone. Do you find there's no one home? And if I could tell you, if I could find, I would know all through you. okay

Speaker 01: 17:08

i gotta say something right off the top i'm sorry but that song gives me fucking goosebumps every time like when he says the blue perfume line i just i get goosebumps every single time i he hits that note it's just amazing so why weren't they more popular why didn't they hit the big time i don't know i think about your son and i remember him saying are they seminal And I remember I had to look up seminal because I didn't know what the fuck it meant. And then I realized, okay, it just means influential on other bands. So my question to you, I'm sorry if I'm jumping the gun, man. I'm just getting excited. But were they seminal? What kind of influences did they have on other bands? Do we know? I think they were totally seminal.

Speaker 00: 17:51

I think that not just me, but I think if you were... Growing up and looking up to, you know, the band scene in Toronto was super vibrant. You could see them often. They were playing in different bands. There was a real scene. So, yeah. So, they matter. Now, off the top of my head, who could do that? I think Ian has gone on to be quite seminal because he's a very well-known producer, has had different bands since then. Does solo stuff too. His solo stuff. And so, yeah, I think that the influence has been lasting and maybe a little bit more than output as a band during the time. But, you know, the next record coming up, Tummy Suckle, they won the CFNY, which was an alternative commercial radio station intro it's still going but it's very different than it was as everything is it's called the edge now the edge and what was there the spirit of radio yeah back then so they gave it they gave they gave a hundred thousand dollar prize to an upcoming band so you know a bigger band won it the bare naked ladies they went on to fame and fortune sorry

Speaker 01: 19:02

i'm just gonna say this i hate the bare naked ladies so much it's a strong it's a very strong word i use it very sparingly and this is our first episode but you'll learn i really can't stand them what is the

Speaker 00: 19:15

other band that never made it i think it was the kill joys uh or treble charger they were also i think and then after that they'd the cfny had run out of hundred thousand dollars to give away so change your heart got it they had tummy suckle in the bag they spent the money i hope they did well in terms of what they did and then they came out with tummy suckle it's amazing they had flames on the album they had a baby wait a baby like In flames? Or... The baby and the belly, because the unofficial version, because they were waiting to remaster it because they had all this money that they wanted to waste in the studio, had a picture of a belly. I think it was one of the cello player we heard on Smile. Okay. And then the baby was on the cover because it took so long to come out. So there was a real tangible time between the bootleg copy I got at Vortex and the record label that came out. And then the band completely blew apart. So before Tummy Suckle the band had disbarred the longtime bassist John Taylor had left John Bora came in from a Neon Rome Bernard Meza came in from a Neon Rome who's then I mentioned them you know incestuous band Ian was a drummer we can talk about maybe a Neon Rome on a later show they were again great Glenn Mitchum left because he was too busy making money with Blue Rodeo but they were still a good band and then John Bora left you know I don't know what Ian does to bassists and I don't want to know John Taylor seems like a very nice man it Every time we saw him, Deanne would always go, he looks so dirty. And I'm sorry, John Taylor, if you're listening. But then we met you at the reunion show and you look like a fine upstanding guy. Anyway, the band then, Ian completely changed the band, all new players and came out with Steel Teeth, completely different sound, and then had another little hit. So why don't we hear their second almost hit, Little Kingdoms.

Unknown: 21:05

Little Kingdoms

Speaker 00: 21:34

So there, and then they broke up and that was it. And since then, Ian has gone on, as we said, to produce many different albums. He's had different incarnations of bands. Jicky Woo, Come On, The Kingdom of Blurtonia. Can I ask you a question,

Speaker 01: 21:51

Sean? So when we were talking off mic, you said that the writer of the songs lyrically is not Ian or Rob. Is that correct?

Speaker 00: 22:00

No, Rob wrote all of the lyrics. So when they started, Rob Taylor wrote all of the lyrics. Ian sang them. Rob sang backup. But it was Ian who was emoting the lyrics and definitely had a stage presence, has always had a presence. I remember, yeah. And he

Speaker 01: 22:18

didn't write the lyrics. Okay, so we probably don't know this. I know we should have asked you, but maybe we will. Who knows? Did the music come first or did the lyrics come first? So I think about Elton John. Yeah, I'm going to say Elton John. who's a very good musician absolutely and famous obviously never on this podcast but elton john and bernie topin was the writer and bernie always wrote the lyrics and then elton would take the lyrics and write the song to those lyrics so my question would be which came first and we don't know

Speaker 00: 22:50

we don't know perhaps the lyrics for another great canadian band maybe an air shifter band this would be a good debate for a later date max webster oh max webster they didn't write the lyrics they was a guy who wasn't even the band who wrote the lyrics. Pidey Boab wrote all of the lyrics. He wrote the lyrics first and then they put that to music and some pretty good 70s rock.

Speaker 01: 23:12

Damn right. Now, again, Canadian band, I think Toronto band, actually lead singer Kim Mitchell. Kim Mitchell had a couple of like local hits here, but Max Webster were iconic in the 70s. Absolutely. A million vacations. Very, very cool.

Speaker 00: 23:27

So the the other thing that I think is kind of, you know, like why they were why they're lasting, why do people like them so much. So a long time after they broke up, they re-released Smile as a 20th anniversary and they toured that, which is the last time I believe they toured. But before that, they got in their head that they would have a reunion tour and they played their albums in chronological order backwards in time with every single band member from the band members that he had gone through who would play. So they would play a couple songs off Steel teeth the steel teeth band would not be on then they'd go back to tummy suckle and the tummy suckle era band would come on and they'd go back right to the first album and the guys that were in the first album came out and played this

Speaker 01: 24:14

is all in the one

Speaker 00: 24:15

concert this is one concert where was it do you know the horseshoe it was amazing people cried it was wonderful were you there yeah oh man it was amazing yeah at the end ian's hands were bloody from strumming the guitar so hard and so cool yeah but at that i think at that point he became a curmudgeon

Speaker 01: 24:33

Ian if you're listening I mean you've been super nice to us so far in terms of your texts and stuff so maybe it was just a bad night curmudgeon wise I don't know

Speaker 00: 24:42

man I don't know it comes to all of us and you don't know how curmudgeon you are except to external maybe we are curmudgeon's daughters my wife has told me I'm curmudgeon my daughter too but he looked at the band at the audience and we're like you're a rock god and he's like I don't want to be a rock god but I would say he is a rock god, at least in Toronto. He's a deity of amongst a certain people. And yeah, so that's why I think he's an ear shifter band or Change of Heart is an ear shifter band.

Speaker 01: 25:15

Yeah. Yeah. And at first, I'm going to be just totally honest. At first, I was like, well, this is surprising. But when I kind of rediscovered them as I did, I was like, yeah, OK, they do deserve this. Absolutely. So give a listen to them when you have a chance. And I might have to edit this out. I don't. don't know but when i was texting with ian he said that change of heart will be coming out with a new album

Speaker 00: 25:38

the rumor all over the internet or instagram which is the only social media presence that i see him on he has announced that we can look forward to it and yeah he's got old band members coming back supposedly or playing it and then he said it's the last but who knows and hopefully maybe people are going to be more excited about it after listening to the show

Speaker 01: 26:00

yeah so it's official there will be a new Change of Heart album. So you can dig into the old tracks. We're going to put kind of our faves on Ear Shifter on Spotify so you can like that or listen to that. And you can also reach out to us via Instagram, Twitter, Facebook, even Facebook. Yep. Sometimes Facebook. Guys, that's our very first episode. I'm Rene Rouleau and my co-host Sean Kapsik. Special thanks go to our logo designer Stuart Thursby and our intro outro music. You can find Joe at Bye bye, Batman. All one word on SoundCloud. And yeah, a little hint. Next episode, we are going to be doing a band that's from Wales, which I believe makes them Welsh. OK, until next time.