Album Battle: Megadeth Vs. Metallica

In this episode, Michael and Sebastian return from their month-long break to discuss various topics, including their experiences at Burning Man and a detailed comparison of two iconic metal bands: Metallica and Megadeth. They engage in a battle of albums, analyzing songs from both bands, exploring their musical styles, and reflecting on the legacy of Dave Mustaine. The conversation highlights the technical mastery of both bands and culminates in a showdown of their most notable tracks. In this engaging conversation, the hosts delve into the musical intricacies and lyrical content of Metallica and Megadeth, comparing their styles, song structures, and emotional depth. They explore specific tracks, discussing their significance and the evolution of both bands over the years. The dialogue highlights the strengths and weaknesses of each band's approach to songwriting, ultimately leading to a spirited debate over which songs stand out in their respective discographies.

Takeaways

Burning Man is about cleansing and renewal.
Both bands have a significant impact on the metal genre.
Dave Mustaine's talent is often overshadowed by his ego.
Metallica's success is partly due to their consistent lineup.
The production quality of Injustice for All is notable.
Blackened is considered one of Metallica's best songs.
Hanger 18 showcases Megadeth's unique songwriting style.
The lyrical themes in both bands' songs are profound.
Musical evolution can be seen in both bands' discographies.
The rivalry between Metallica and Megadeth continues to intrigue fans. Metallica's 'Shortest Straw' is a rare gem, performed only 100 times.
Lyrical depth is a significant differentiator between Metallica and Megadeth.
James Hetfield's metaphorical lyricism gives Metallica an edge.
'Harvester of Sorrow' showcases Metallica's evolution in sound.
'Tornado of Souls' is a defining track for Megadeth.
'To Live Is To Die' features one of Metallica's best clean riffs.
Dyer's Eve is considered one of Metallica's fastest and most intense songs.
The emotional weight of lyrics in Metallica's songs resonates deeply with fans.
The chaotic nature of Megadeth's music can sometimes overshadow its brilliance.
Both bands have unique strengths that contribute to their legendary status in metal. 

Mandatory Music is proudly hosted and produced by Michael Heide and Sebastian Kwapich

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Thanks for listening and keep on rocking

Transcript

Michael (00:02.323)
Well, good evening. Is this on? Because we are back. Is this thing on? We are back. Our month long hiatus is over. Over. So all of our holidays, all of our excursions away from our homes. Now we are stuck back like regular work in the cave recording podcasts. So yeah, so it's been a busy August. All sorts of things have happened in August, but I don't.

Sebastian (00:05.922)
See you soon.

Sebastian (00:12.328)
Over.

Sebastian (00:20.778)
In the cave recording podcasts.

Sebastian (00:26.627)
Mm-hmm.

Michael (00:30.015)
think we really, they've probably been talked about on the internet to death. And I don't think, yeah. Yeah, you know. Yes.

Sebastian (00:34.114)
Vacation vacation vacation for us. Yeah, I do want to I do want to say one thing though. It's like Because this is just recent the Burning Man festival what came off to a really horrible start so on day one they were the basically most of the camps were ruined because they had a severe dust storm and Like it was muddy and people were just like this is terrible so they had to like build Burning Man and then rebuild it the next day but

Michael (01:00.553)
Why do people go to Burning Man? What is the point of Burning Man?

Sebastian (01:03.828)
It is a well there at this point, it attracts like 70 80,000 people right and it's just a big week long rave in the middle of the desert where it's all about cleansing and renewal and the significance of them burning the man is like burning all the old and moving into a new era. So it's like a rite of passage of like stuff that you want to release emotionally, psychologically or whatever. And it attracts like high

Michael (01:20.533)
Gotcha.

Sebastian (01:28.878)
you know, celebrities like there was a video of Channing Tatum dancing with some like random people just in the middle of the desert. So he was there. So yeah, it's like it's not about status at all. It's like everyone is equal and the whole mentality there's like you are giving to the festival. So, you know, everyone kind of contributes, I guess, to like make this thing work. But if you watch some of the videos from it and you see how epic the drone shots are, it's just a light circus. Like it's just a circular array of flashing lights and

Michael (01:34.581)
Okay. All right.

Michael (01:52.819)
Mm-hmm. wow.

Michael (01:59.133)
Interesting.

Sebastian (01:59.468)
You know, so yeah, but it's, but you have to come fully functional as yourself, right? So, you know, when you, when you, there's nothing provided for you there. So you have to take care of everything on your own, like tents, food, water, like all that kind of stuff. So yeah, there's just like, this is the space you bring your own stuff and we party. So.

Michael (02:11.945)
Wow. That's harsh.

Michael (02:18.463)
Sounds like something you would partake in.

Sebastian (02:21.75)
Yeah, I'm probably too old at this point. Maybe 20 years ago or 10 years ago, probably but now now

Michael (02:26.003)
Yeah. Right. Now, now that we're both 48 years old, because we both had birthdays also in August. it is nice to be the younger one of the two of us. I'll be up by 10 days, but I'm still the younger one. Doesn't matter forever, forever and ever. So we had the idea for our, our, not our comeback episode, but for our first one back. Yeah. Let's do something fun. And, and what do we mean?

Sebastian (02:30.326)
Yes, yeah, we both had birthdays in August, yes.

Sebastian (02:38.744)
Damn it. Forever and ever.

Sebastian (02:48.99)
reentry into this world space. Yeah.

Michael (02:55.477)
by something fun. Well, we talk, we're going to do a battle. We're going to do a battle of albums. We're going to pit each song against each other. I'm hoping we argue a bit too, because it make for, I think we're, I'm pretty sure we're going to argue. we're just one song against each other. What we like about the one song and what, why is it better than the other? We can have a nice conversation. So the idea was, well, we've got to pick two records that have the same amount of songs.

Sebastian (02:57.79)
A battle.

Sebastian (03:07.029)
I will definitely argue.

Sebastian (03:11.153)
Ha ha.

Sebastian (03:23.02)
Yes, that's the key.

Michael (03:25.071)
and two bands that have similar DNA.

Sebastian (03:28.269)
Yes.

Michael (03:29.033)
So what two bands have similar DNA? One is the other is Megadeth. So DNA is intertwined, they're inbred, they're all co-mingled together. So we thought we would do Rust in Peace by Megadeth and Injustice for All by Metallica.

Sebastian (03:33.346)
Metallica. Yes.

Sebastian (03:46.484)
Arguably both bands most, I want to say best album is not the right way of saying it, but like kind of almost the most accomplished in terms of technical musicianship, ability wise and music theory and all, and just rift-tastic, yeah. So it's funny how like both bands echo each other in their discography throughout their career, right? So.

Michael (03:57.459)
Yes, ability wise. my God. Rift, Rift extravaganza's. Riftastic, both sides.

Yes.

Michael (04:11.892)
Mm-hmm.

Sebastian (04:12.706)
You know, the Rust in peace is very similar to in the Justice for All, whereas their Countdown to Extinction is very similar to the Black Album, right? Like it's echoes of each other almost.

Michael (04:19.54)
Yes.

And then the script flipped where Euthanasia sort of came first and then load was kind of the same. Like they both, for whatever reason, they both just pulled it back. let's just not do this. Yeah, it's bananas. They both started tuning down and it's just all these things throughout the years. then, know, Megadeth has keeps putting out records every two to three years, four years or whatever. They do.

Sebastian (04:32.148)
Yeah.

Yeah, it's more commercially ready, right? Yeah.

Sebastian (04:42.764)
Yeah.

Sebastian (04:46.754)
Well, they only have one left, apparently.

Michael (04:51.093)
So this is what got me thinking about an idea like this, because I started thinking, okay, I saw this news, you know, back whenever it was that, you know, they've put out, it looks like the cover is out and that pre-order start in 24 days, apparently. me see 24 days and.

Michael (05:10.341)
Um, what's my life has been void of mega death for a long time. Like I've stopped, I stopped caring about them and I'm not, it's no slight to them, but I stopped caring after risk. that was 1990, I believe 1999. So that was 26 years ago. have not really given two shits, but what they've done. So I went on a Odyssey of.

Sebastian (05:14.734)
for so long.

Sebastian (05:25.537)
Yeah.

Michael (05:38.087)
Megadeth listening over the last week and a half. And I listened to, believe 13 of their 16 records. It's a lot. No, maybe 12. I listened to, I listened to a lot of them anyway. One's the ones I've never heard. The ones that people say are bad, blah, blah, blah. So I did. I made it through all of them. I only started to skip in songs on their latest record because it just, I was just like, whatever. But so yeah, so I've been on this Dave Mustaine.

Sebastian (05:45.866)
a lot. Yeah.

Sebastian (05:57.302)
Not as, yeah.

Michael (06:07.423)
thing for a little while. I, cause the thought was, okay, all of our favorite bands are going to go away eventually. Like, you know, Metallica is going to, well, Metallica is going to say, Hey, cause this is our last record. We're done. Every band does it right. Slayer has done it already. The who has been on their farewell tour for 40 years. It goes, it comes to an end. So yeah. So I'm like, well, my life has been void of Dave Mustaine except for hearing his

Sebastian (06:15.79)
Say it in its own,

Sebastian (06:26.114)
Yeah, that's funny. All good things must come to an end.

Michael (06:37.215)
Big Mouth on the interwebs.

Sebastian (06:38.83)
He still talks negatively about Metallica. man, it's been like 50 years, 40 years. Yes.

Michael (06:41.666)
Come on. So let me ask you this.

Dave is one of the greatest guitar players in the hard rock metal genre of all time, but he will never get the credit he deserves. Well, maybe not deserves that he should get because of his big mouth. Yeah. Like he just, he just holding on. Like, I don't know. He's so, he's so talented. And then I also thought too, I'm like, well, what if he could put his, his ego aside and he stayed in Metallica and how like all those riffs that he has.

Sebastian (07:02.604)
demeanor. Yeah.

Sebastian (07:10.635)
Yeah.

Michael (07:17.321)
Like just you listen to album after album, it's like, my God, all these songs. It's like, just, it's just, he's like this machine.

Sebastian (07:24.182)
Yeah, I mean, I've said this before on a previous podcast that we've done before. to me, Metallica needed to make the hard decision before they even recorded the first album because they just knew that it wouldn't work with Dave, right? we wouldn't get, Metallica wouldn't be where they're at if they still had Dave Mustaine in the band, right? Yes, they made some beautiful music, but the vision, you can tell by their careers how their visions altered. Like, I mean, yes, they are both thrash bands and they're the

Michael (07:35.347)
Yeah. No.

Michael (07:43.156)
now.

Sebastian (07:53.548)
A lot of their albums echo each other. But, you know, and I'll say this again, like I said, the last time we talked about this, there's a revolving door door of artists that worked it with Dave Mustaine. And so they don't last long because they leave the band to get kicked out for whatever reason. So he's not an easy person to work with. And the proof is just in again, how many different members band members he's had throughout the history of, you know, Megadeth, whereas Metallica has had the same drummer.

Michael (08:19.785)
Yes, sir.

Sebastian (08:22.08)
rhythm guitarists, lead guitarists from the creation of Kill'em All all the way through. They've only changed bassists, one died and the other left the band for, you you watch some kind of monster, you'll figure, you'll know why. So technically they've only replaced one member. They've only had issues with one member throughout the history of Metallica. So they understood, James and Lars understood from an early...

Michael (08:25.833)
Basically, yeah, yes.

Michael (08:31.849)
Yeah. He fucking left the band. Yeah. I'd leave too.

Sebastian (08:50.03)
wanted the band to go and Dave kind of was pushing it in a different way. Right. So there was a lot of substance issues early on in the creation of Metallica. Yes. And Dave substance abuse did not jive with the rest of the band substance abuse, right? They just like we can't have this guy in the band. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Yeah.

Michael (08:55.85)
Yes.

Michael (09:00.955)
No. Come on.

Michael (09:06.421)
No, he was probably a nasty drunk and we all know nasty drunks, right? Just like, God, so-and-so is drinking again, look out. It's bad news. And Dave didn't have Lars as the sort of song molder, because that's, right? And that's, I think that's the big key is that's why I Metallica is bigger is because Lars could, the song vision.

Sebastian (09:17.856)
Yeah, so, you know, you're right.

Sebastian (09:25.528)
He had to do it all himself too.

Sebastian (09:32.482)
But there was, mean, David Elfson got kicked out of the band for reasons that I'm not comfortable talking to those podcasts with, but valid reasons, also technically not, technically is legal, but barely legal. So she was like 18, I think, and he was like 60. So I mean, you know, there's that. But he also said, he also called out.

Michael (09:42.429)
Yeah, but he's also talking to a grown woman and he's a grown man. They can do whatever they want. Right? Whatever. Well, barely. Yes, there is the barely Lego. Yeah, you know, it's creepy.

Sebastian (09:59.502)
called out the hypocrisy of Dave Mustaine because Dave Mustaine has been quoted so many times where he's slagging Metallica for stealing his music. like, yeah, you contributed some riffs for sure. The only song that I know for a fact was written pretty much by him or like collaborated was the Four Horsemen. And you gotta tell me the Metallica version is a hundred times better than the Megadeth version of that similar song, right? But he wrote a bunch of songs for Metallica, but nobody ever talks about the fact

that Dave Ellison wrote a whole bunch of tracks on the newest album and they pulled his credits from that. So just like, well, that's the hypocrisy of calling a Metallica for stealing your material where you're now not giving credit to the bassist who wrote that material. Maybe they were re-recorded it with new bass parts, but I doubt it. I mean, but it's still probably the same bass parts. It's just a different, it's just not him playing on it. And so...

Michael (10:49.373)
I think they did. It's still. Sure. Yeah. Yep. yeah.

Sebastian (10:57.422)
And there's a pattern in the past of like him properly not accrediting other artists that he's worked with, know, like Chris Poland and Marty Friedman in the past, whereas the kind of like, you know, never get talked about. It's always Dave's band, Dave's band, Dave's band, Dave's band, right? So, yeah, so, you know, he's sour still, obviously, that's evident in all of the interviews he ever does because, you know, Metallica comes up.

Michael (11:15.455)
Yeah, man.

Sebastian (11:27.212)
weren't they, didn't they win a Grammy or are they were on some show where they won an award and as when they were coming up to get the award, they played Metallica as like the every year that's so. So yeah, I don't know. mean, Dave is a talented artist. Absolutely. For sure. No question about it. He's one of the greatest thrash lead guitarist of all time. He's a good songwriter, but he has baggage. He has baggage that he cannot.

Michael (11:35.015)
boy. boy.

Michael (11:56.081)
yeah.

Sebastian (11:56.21)
to peace with still at this age with Metallica. And maybe rightly so because he could have been part of the greatest metal band. That's okay. Is that Randy Costello or Lars O'Reilly?

Michael (12:05.343)
Well, my bad.

That was funny. I'm sorry. That was a new Lars. That was him on the scenario. If I could find hi-hats, it would be perfect. yeah.

Sebastian (12:16.62)
there. no, don't give me certain I had. So but yeah, I mean, so that's the outlier. So

Michael (12:20.597)
Okay, so they're assholes on both sides. Moral of the story. Yes, ego's the size of a stadium on both sides. And you cannot fit all those fat heads into one room. So there you go. Okay, too many cooks, too many hands in the cookie jar, right? Okay, so.

Sebastian (12:27.34)
Yeah, basically. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

No. Too many cooks in the kitchen. yeah.

Yes. Okay. Yes.

Michael (12:47.207)
And Justice for All was released in 1988. It was released, I got ahead of here, September 7th, I believe, of 1988.

Sebastian (12:48.846)
Mm-hmm.

And 88, yes.

Sebastian (13:01.294)
he's got the dance.

Michael (13:02.133)
I think so. I think it's September 7th, something like that. First single was Harvester of Sorrow, released August 28th, 1988, which is a good first single, but.

Sebastian (13:14.146)
Yeah, it's odd though. Like you don't think of that song as the single, as the first single, but you know.

Michael (13:16.405)
Now, no, especially the way it was recorded, it just was weird. Anyways, we'll get to that. Second single released was I Have the Beholder, which is even more weird, which that song doesn't need to be on the radio. And then third single in January of 89 was the landmark, Humongous One, which...

Sebastian (13:26.701)
Yeah.

Sebastian (13:39.992)
So that was my first experience with Metallica. Outside of a little snippet I saw in Much Music where they were playing Seek and Destroy, it was a 45 second clip. That was the only known video at the time of Metallica. Metallica up until Injustice Raw album did no radio play and no music videos. And so they created their first music video one and that was something that completely

Michael (13:42.312)
Yes.

Michael (13:52.147)
Yeah, absolutely.

Sebastian (14:08.674)
grabbed a hold of me when I saw it for the first time. But we can get into that when we get to the song.

Michael (14:09.471)
Yeah, absolutely. We will. But the first song we're doing, we're talking, I talk a little blackened for just a second. And then I guess I might as introduce the opponent for, for this battle. we have holy wars, the punishment do off of rust and peace, which it was released, I believe in September or October of 1990. So two years later, kind of, you know, the timelines were a little off with, with there's.

Sebastian (14:21.976)
Bing, bing, bing.

Sebastian (14:35.5)
They come up with their album. Yeah.

Michael (14:39.221)
their stuff, but this one came out in 1990, sort of the tail end of the thrash life in sort of being in the forefront. So two kind of very different songs.

Sebastian (14:50.519)
Yeah.

Sebastian (14:54.174)
Yes.

Michael (14:55.039)
Cause you know, black and like, talk had a formula at this point, right? have a thrasher to open the record. Same with battery. Same with fire, fire, hit the lights.

Sebastian (15:04.533)
Yeah, it's by going further on their opener, their thrash opener has a specific intro. And it was like, it's like that with the three songs, like Off Ride, Master and Off This One, it's a slow intro. It's like, we're gonna slowly in and then it's gonna, boom, punch you in the head. So.

Michael (15:10.964)
Yes.

Michael (15:16.498)
Mm-hmm. Yes.

Michael (15:22.075)
Yeah. Hence that's our intro for our podcast sometimes too.

Sebastian (15:26.582)
Yeah, we're just a slow intro and just go bam, here we go.

Michael (15:29.205)
So obviously you and I have heard Blackened 48 quadrillion times. So in my, I listened to Rust in Peace, I think like five or six times this week. Holy Wars is no joke, man. It's damn good. Like it just starts with that. Like it's just, I don't know. It's, I don't want to say like, obviously we're going to make our choices of what songs.

Sebastian (15:31.788)
Yes. Yes.

Sebastian (15:40.654)
It's a good song.

Sebastian (15:45.272)
Yeah.

Sebastian (15:53.526)
You won't influence any of my choices, I guarantee you. Yeah.

Michael (15:55.349)
I will know, no, I will not.

Sebastian (15:59.252)
I could do this without even listening to the songs. That's how familiar I am with these two albums, right?

Michael (16:01.513)
Wow, look at you.

Okay. Can I, can I do a one a and one B or no, I have to pick one or the other. that the way it works? There's no draws. So no, draws here. It's just, okay. If for an album opener, if holy wars is a nine blackened to 10. I'm sorry. it, I, I all week, I was like, I'm picking a holy wars, holy wars is better. And then I was at the gym today and then black and came on. my God, Jesus Christ. I'm like, it's.

Sebastian (16:09.43)
That's no, you have to pick one or the other. No, there's no draws.

Sebastian (16:25.229)
Yeah.

Sebastian (16:35.306)
It is one of the greatest intros of any song ever with that backwards guitar. what they've so yeah. So what they've done is they recorded the intro and then they reverse played it as the opener for the album. So you, get a, it's very haunting, I guess is the best way of saying it, right?

Michael (16:39.721)
The backwards electric guitar, yeah.

Michael (16:52.327)
It's, and even just to have the idea, Hey, why don't we have whoever's idea this was, I do not know. And this is one of the only songs that Jason Neustad's writing credits. was one of three. He did. And.

Sebastian (16:57.921)
Yeah.

Sebastian (17:02.55)
Yeah, he wrote the main riff for it.

Arguably one of the best Metallica has ever written to

Michael (17:08.635)
Absolutely. We've seen them play it numerous times live. They have played it a total... Where is it here? I had it. I had it, baby. Where'd go?

Sebastian (17:17.784)
So in my experience of watching Metallica people on podcasts, YouTube, all those algorithms that I get my Metallica content with, a lot of Metallica purists fans, Blackin is in their top five Metallica song of all time, if not number one. A lot of real thrashbangers saying Blackin is the best Metallica song they've ever written. I'm not gonna go that far.

Michael (17:35.839)
Yes. Absolutely. Yeah.

Michael (17:46.421)
That's up there.

Sebastian (17:47.384)
but it is so good. Yeah. And it's got elements of thrash and elements of, so, okay. The one thing that stands out to me of this song is that it does modulate through different pacing, right? It has that, but then, and then, and then, then it slows down and then it speeds back up again. Whereas like, holy wars, it's just the same speed the whole time. It's just on, on, on. Yeah. So, yeah.

Michael (17:49.299)
my favorite song off of this album.

Michael (18:03.252)
Yes.

Michael (18:08.252)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. It's just the train's going full force the whole time. Except there is a middle part where it kind of slows down a little bit. And then the solos, I will say, I'm gonna say this probably with every song. The solos on the rest of the piece are better than any of Kirk's.

Sebastian (18:23.821)
Okay.

Sebastian (18:27.425)
except for one.

song.

Michael (18:30.581)
Sure. One song, yeah.

Michael (18:36.969)
I will, I will. And so blackened isn't guilty of what I'm going to get into with the rest of the songs with the drumming, especially off of injustice for all. it's just.

Sebastian (18:37.804)
That's a spoiler.

Sebastian (18:46.048)
Okay, I will say this about the drumming real quick. I think this is Lars's best drumming on any albums on Unjustice for All. the chorus, well, that's by design though, but the chorus part in Black End where he does like the double bass rolls, like Black End is the end. Like that is so crisp and so, like it just works for me so well.

Michael (18:52.396)
sure it is. It's just too loud. It's just too there.

Michael (19:01.903)
Mm. Yeah.

Hmm. See, because there's two different styles, because, you know, all these songs, recipes are kind of loosey goosey in the production. And even in the playing, it's not as surgical because justice was, you know, like with a surgeon's knife, precise. Everything is, and which is crazy because James would just play the rhythms and he just do it again. He doubled them. just played, he'd have to play it. There's no cut and paste. He played them exactly the same way on a different track. It's like, holy crap, dude.

Sebastian (19:19.896)
Yeah.

Michael (19:35.989)
So, tacticians on both sides, right? So, round, okay, round one goes to Metallica, to Blackin. Blackin is the winner of round one. And then we'll, I guess we'll keep going with Metallica songs first because that's just easiest. Next up we have End Justice for All. The almost 10 minutes of pure bloat up against one of my favorite Megadeth songs of all time. 11 guitar solos, yes.

Sebastian (19:38.69)
There, yep.

To black ends, to black end, yes. Yeah.

Sebastian (19:53.27)
Yes, we do.

Michael (20:05.077)
Hanger 18, I believe it's 11, in like a four minute song. Like it doesn't get any better than that. Like it's just, it's absolute insanity.

Sebastian (20:11.254)
Yeah, I really do like Injustice for All, but you're right in the bloat. There's a lot of like, you don't need to do, you don't need to recycle the same patterns over and over again. And like the good, a good like six, seven minutes of it is kind of like the same riff. It's just different things put in, which can work sometimes.

Michael (20:18.459)
Ugh, it doesn't need to be 10 minutes, man. Like, just, ugh, come on.

Michael (20:29.769)
Yes. Yeah. Like the best parts when it kind of slows down and Lars is doing the double kick as it's slow, as they're slowing down together, that part is awesome. But that's like six minutes into the song. It's like, my God.

Sebastian (20:36.129)
Yeah.

Sebastian (20:39.618)
It is a, yeah.

Yeah, I think they just wanted to write a long song for the sake of writing a long song, right? So.

Michael (20:46.099)
Yeah, well, they could and they did and it's a great song. Don't get me wrong. And then we have hangar routine, which is all because rusted pieces, all sci-fi. It's all like apocalyptic. It's, it's amazing. I love this. Millions and all the.

Sebastian (20:56.087)
Yeah.

Sebastian (21:01.038)
It's funny though, when you look at the two songs right out of the gate, like Black and Injustice for All, and then Holy Wars and Hangar 18, the difference in writing style, because James likes to stay in that deep pocket of the guitar, where it's all like sixth string, fifth string, right? And then Hangar 18, the intro is all first, second, third string. It's all super high.

Michael (21:16.884)
Mm-hmm.

Yes, is the opposite. Yeah. Oh, it's what, but what it's the Cala Cthulhu. No way. That's so, so Dave Mustaine wrote the intro to the Cala Cthulhu, which is the intro to Hanger 18. Kind of same chords is played a whole lot faster. Yeah. Um, but not man, Hanger 18. It's just my vote's Hanger 18 just because.

Sebastian (21:28.702)
It is exactly the Kala Katulu chords.

Sebastian (21:35.628)
Well, kind of. It's the same chords, but he's just basically hammering the chords instead of, yeah. Yeah.

Sebastian (21:45.186)
Same. You know why? Harmony guitars. Harmony guitars. The entire rift is two guitars playing harmonies. Yeah.

Michael (21:47.497)
Well, like, it's just, everything in that song is just, and the drums play to the song. Like that's one thing Nick Mensah does so well. you did, it's okay. whatever. Rest in peace to both of them. but Nick's so good at as comparing it to what Lars does, it just follows the guitar. Like he's, he's like playing the guitar, but on drums.

Sebastian (21:56.334)
Yeah. Oh, I said Randy Castile earlier, I? I Mink Namsa, I'm sorry. Not the Aussie drummer. Yeah.

Sebastian (22:13.688)
Well, you can't follow the guitar in Megadeth because it's just two soloists that are all over the place, right? So, yeah, so you have to follow your own pattern, but yeah.

Michael (22:17.043)
You die. You just, your arms, your arms, the arms would fall off. That's just a way it wouldn't work. But yeah, Nick, the groove, like the, I think rest in peace sets up like sort of groovy, like the nineties groovy stuff, like the black album countdown, all that's cause he's just, he's him and Elvson are just, they're also on this like, and and you can hear the bass, which that joke's been, been, it's done to death. whatever it's okay. Well, you can hear the bass. well,

Sebastian (22:30.424)
Yeah.

Sebastian (22:40.36)
We may say it a few more times, but. When you get to Hanger 18 though, you definitely get a sense of the different writing styles as well. I just said this as well, like it's not like Metallica is very rhythm and lead guitars, whereas Hanger 18 is a perfect example of how Dave operates where it's just like lead lead. There's lean lead, right? There's no, like they both take turns playing lead stuff. They both go into rhythm and stuff, but there's not like

Michael (22:51.965)
Yeah. yeah.

Michael (22:56.618)
Yes.

Michael (23:02.131)
I was just say, lead and lead. that's just, yeah.

Sebastian (23:10.158)
It's not like an ACDC band where like is very evident there's a rhythm guitarist and a lead guitarist. Exactly, right? It's so they meld in the way they play off of each other's solos. They go back in and like through them. It's, I love the song too, man. This is arguably my favorite Megadeth song of all time, for sure. That or Peace Cells, because I love the harmony in Peace Cells, but we're not talking about that album. Yeah.

Michael (23:13.203)
Yeah, Malcolm is the rhythm. Angus is the lead. It's no.

Michael (23:25.265)
and have, I know I figured that was the way you're gonna go.

piece of all of that harmony is so good. and having the benefit of having two leads. Cause you got, especially with two distinct lead players, like Dave is pure speed. Marty is pure feel, but also playing with speed. So you have this sort of like give and take and they're playing off of each other and where Dave will come in and do something really raucous. And then the next one will be melodic. And I just, like, I'm not the biggest guitar solo guy, but just man, listen to this record over and over again.

Sebastian (23:45.784)
Yeah.

Sebastian (23:57.112)
Yeah.

Michael (24:01.555)
Man, solos are good.

Sebastian (24:03.682)
Well, the solos in Hanger 18 are very tasteful, right? Because they're not just blistering speed. Yeah, they have elements where they do these fast runs, but they definitely take, both Marty Freeman and Dave Bustain take the time to bend notes and sit in the certain areas of the solo where you don't need to just rush through it.

Michael (24:22.855)
And I don't think it's all an E minor pentatonic.

Sebastian (24:25.708)
No, it changes the keys halfway through the song.

Michael (24:27.677)
Yeah. I guess make solos great again. Could we say that makes all those great again. All right. So round two, went to Megadeth. Wow. Okay. So next up we have, what do we have next? We have eye of the beholder, which I've already kind of crapped on and we have take no prisoners, which I'm going to kind of start with take no prisoners. Cause I don't even want either beholder is whatever. It's just.

Sebastian (24:31.81)
make souls ready and we can say that yeah.

Anger 18.

Sebastian (24:42.709)
I have the beholder.

Sebastian (24:53.281)
Okay.

Michael (24:57.253)
it's not, it's not that good. It's just not like it's okay. Like it's okay. That's fine. take no prisoners. Kind of got a little punky feel to it and it's got, you know, it's got the gang vocals. It's just got lots of fun stuff going on in it. And it's just, it was it. Okay. Why was it? Why, why do you like either beholder so much? Okay.

Sebastian (25:02.144)
I kind of disagree with Mike, but that's fine. Yeah.

Sebastian (25:14.176)
Yeah, this was a hard one for me actually. Yeah.

because

Sebastian (25:23.566)
I love the intro to Eye of the Beholder. Like it's, it's, it, definitely loses me after the intro, but the intro to Eye the Beholder is so good because it, it, you know, it's, it's, um, it's a volume swell intro, right? But it's all groove. It's all rhythm and groove, right? There's, and what a perfect two songs to completely contradict styles, right? Because the intro to Eye of the Beholder is a muted six string.

Michael (25:27.359)
Dilly dilly dilly dilly. Yeah.

Michael (25:37.459)
Yep. It is very, it's groovy, baby. Yeah.

Michael (25:47.098)
my god.

Michael (25:51.402)
Yes.

Sebastian (25:52.556)
with no, just the open six string. It's just, right? And then you listen to the intro of Take No Prisoners and it's just like all over the place, right out of the gate. So it's super contrasting in styles.

Michael (25:59.743)
Take no.

Michael (26:04.073)
Yep. Yes, sir.

Sebastian (26:11.254)
Yeah, this is a tough one for me. I just like the groove of I The Beholder. Like I really like how it's groovy.

Michael (26:17.853)
Okay. Yeah. Yeah, baby. Groovy. I, just, I, the pace of take no prisoners is, it's not what I want to listen to.

Sebastian (26:23.552)
It's also like, go ahead.

Sebastian (26:33.367)
Yeah.

Michael (26:34.421)
It's just awesome. it's just, I don't know. It's just, it's another song. Same with Megadeth, like 90 % of their songs could be opening tracks on a record. Cause they're all like, like I understand like the pace of most of these songs on rest of the piece are the same. And it's kind of like, let's roll a dice. Okay. We got a 10 sided dice. We're playing some D and D. Okay. What's up first? Okay. Okay. Well, holy or is the number one done. Yeah. And just keep moving on. I just.

Sebastian (26:46.114)
Yeah, seriously.

Yeah.

Sebastian (26:56.376)
Yep.

Michael (27:02.771)
Then there's that sort of one part where the guitar kind of sounds like a tornado. Is that the song or is that tornado souls? It might, it might be tornado souls. There is a song called, no, think it's this one. Cause it's like, it just goes and it's just like, it's like, it's just crazy. It's just, it's completely ridiculous. Is it come on? Why don't you do it? no, it is. Song is fast. yeah. It is a song. It's just right before it gets real fast. There's like, this is.

Sebastian (27:08.398)
That's probably Tornado of Souls. I mean, it's a song called Tornado of Souls, right? So, yeah.

Sebastian (27:24.086)
I think this is like the this might be the fastest song on the album, isn't it? Take no prisoners. It's pretty fast.

Michael (27:33.777)
wicked, just complete, just like alternate picking this craziness. It's just awesome. But I don't know. Like either beholder is okay. Okay. We disagree. First one we disagree on. I should be writing this down. You do have a pencil in your head. So that I do not have. Um, so yeah, we agreed on the first two and the third one we finally.

Sebastian (27:41.94)
I have to go, I have to go, I beholder.

Sebastian (27:48.906)
I should write, I'll write it down. I have to.

Sebastian (28:00.778)
I just, I don't know, for me, Ivy Holder, like there's too much going on in the song, Take No Prisoners. There's so much going on. It's a lot. You just kind of get lost in like the chaotic shuffle of noise. Whereas like, you know, the polar opposite, Ivy Holder is a lot more, it's super, it's basically probably the most simple song on the album, I think, in terms of technical abilities. It's, Harvest is not that bad either, yeah. But yeah, I don't know. For me, I know you like this one probably better.

Michael (28:05.567)
There's a lot. There's a lot. Yeah. Yeah.

Michael (28:20.307)
Yeah, I think so that or harvester harvester is not hard either. No.

Michael (28:28.564)
Okay.

Sebastian (28:31.0)
take no prisoners. So that's where we differ. I think the fourth one we can pretty much immediately agree on, but we'll talk about it.

Michael (28:31.978)
Yes.

Michael (28:38.601)
Well, now, here, okay, so here's my case for five magics being better than one, which the sentence doesn't even work. So one, the intro to one, I don't even know how, I don't even think I can do this because it's not gonna work, but I'm going to.

Sebastian (28:45.767)
boy.

Sebastian (28:50.964)
No, there's bass in it. That's why.

Sebastian (28:59.17)
Well, that's the only narrative is just like, you can hear the bass in Five Magics because there's like a big bass part in it,

Michael (29:03.381)
Okay. Yeah, there there's lots of base and five magics. Okay. There's, there's, there's, that's a point two, five of a point. And then the intro to one has been recycled for the third time. If you want, if you want to go that route, if you want to go that route, it's the same as fade to black and same as sanitarium. If it is different. Oh, it totally is.

Sebastian (29:15.412)
It's the same chord structure from sanitarium fade to black. Yeah. But to me, it's different, though. It's a totally different mood, right? Because.

Michael (29:27.871)
Why do you think tone wise? It's not even like, like, it's just a.

Sebastian (29:29.706)
Yeah, but it starts the same, but Fade to Black goes in a different key. Whereas, so I think it goes in like B or something. I can't remember, but one stays in the key of E minor. like you have the same opening notes kind of, but it has a different feel entirely when you play the song and it's total, whatever that word is, in its entirety. Thank you. Entirely, yeah. So totality. That's it. That's just it.

Michael (29:34.25)
Yes.

It does go into B, yeah.

Michael (29:45.194)
Yes.

Michael (29:49.909)
Totality? Yes, entirety, that's better than totality. Totality sounds like the totality. I'm running out of reasons to make Five Magics better. I think we're just gonna put one, like, Five Magics is a great song, but you put 90 % of any band songs up against the song One, it's going to lose.

Sebastian (30:02.68)
So we're just gonna put one in.

Sebastian (30:17.865)
I mean, it's, yeah. Yeah.

Michael (30:18.549)
because even when you still, even now, when we saw them last year, when they played one live, it was on another level. And this is 35 years later. Like it's, it still resonates as much as it did in 88. Maybe you, don't listen to it anymore unless we.

Sebastian (30:26.754)
Yeah, it's a staples song for them.

Sebastian (30:35.04)
And it's the first video they've done. They knew what they had with the song. They knew that this song was a gold like this song would pave their way to stardom for sure. And they did the video their way to super dark, very

Michael (30:42.101)
Yes. But again, this, oh yeah. but five magics being a nine, one to 10 and a half. It's just, you know, five match. Oh God is such a good song. It's got such great groove. It's there's guitar solos all over after every verse, there's a solo. Like, it's just awesome. Like it's, it's, the, it is the Meganeth way. It's, and what's interesting is Dave wrote basically this whole record himself.

Sebastian (30:52.43)
All right, we'll do that, 11 out of 10. It's pretty good.

Sebastian (31:03.276)
That's the Megadeth way.

Michael (31:11.825)
Except for the last two songs. Yeah. And Marty and Nick didn't contribute anything. Like Marty wasn't even in the band yet. Like their album was written and he just put solos to stuff. Which, but what a team, Dave and Marty. Anyway, so, okay. That both goes to one. All right. So next up we have the shortest straw versus what's not a very good song title.

Sebastian (31:13.774)
It's quite impressive, hey?

Sebastian (31:23.629)
Yeah.

Sebastian (31:29.59)
Yes, absolutely.

Michael (31:41.609)
Poison was the cure. Like, come on.

Sebastian (31:46.474)
Yeah, did he mean the band poison was secure? Are you talking about the? He's quite the hotthrob when that album came out in the 90s. Let me tell you that much. Yeah. Yeah.

Michael (31:47.621)
yes, Brett Michaels is the cure to everything. That's exactly what this is. back in 1988, Brett Michaels, he man, every Rhodes has its own. again, this is a little punkier on Megadeth side and the shortest straw is like one of the strongest deep cuts Metallica has.

Sebastian (32:09.74)
I was just going to say that Shorter Straw is such a underrated song for how amazing it is. it's so good, like musically, right? No, the average Metallica fan probably doesn't even know that the song is a song called the Shorter Straw by Metallica, because it's never talked about usually, right? So

Michael (32:14.869)
It is. It is. It is.

They rarely play it live. Like I think last time I saw them do it.

Michael (32:32.021)
Oh, they played it on May 9th of 2025. It's been performed only 100 times in 35 years.

Sebastian (32:40.928)
considering Metallica has played many concerts. Yeah.

Michael (32:43.593)
Yes. shortest straw, one of the coolest riffs of all time. Like it's just, it's just awesome. The whole song is just awesome. Yeah. It's just, you just get your head. yeah. just, yep. Okay. That's, that's quick. Poisonous. Poisonous cures.

Sebastian (32:58.938)
It's so groovy, yeah.

Yeah, my my problem with Poisonous the Cure is like this is probably the worst that Dave is saying I sound vocally Like I hate his voice on this song. I hate his lyrics. There's lyrical choices on this song

Michael (33:10.942)
It's not good.

Wow. think that's, when you are, not really a vocalist and you're, you're forced to write lyrics, the lyrics, even the later records are, I don't want to say juvenile, but they're just, they're not like, they're like, I was trying to, they just,

Sebastian (33:19.894)
not a vocalist that has to sing, yeah.

Sebastian (33:35.746)
Well, that's a good point though. Like when you look at the lyrical content between the two songs, it's just like, for me, Dave Mustaine, it's an afterthought for him. It's just like, let's just throw some lyrics in it, because it's not about the lyrics. It's about the guitar solos in right? Whereas Metallica at this point was really exploring with like connecting the music to, you know, they did it with Master Puppets in the previous album, Ride and Lightning, obviously, you know, the light hearted.

Michael (33:47.253)
That's what it kind of feels like,

Michael (33:57.279)
Yep. Yep.

Sebastian (34:03.072)
Seek and Destroy type lyrics where like, we're coming to destroy you. Like that's so juvenile, right? Now they're talking about war and addiction to drugs, you know, all that kind of stuff, right? Like it's, it's, it's serious stuff that's connected to the type, like the music that they're writing for that particular song. So lyrically Metallica has a massive edge over Megadeth in terms of connecting their lyrical content to the music content of the particular song, I believe anyways. So.

Michael (34:29.469)
Yeah. Well, I think James is just a natural, he's a natural front man for one. And he, he's very smart with the words. Like he's like a lot of the songs are like in metaphor. It's not like I was trying to like make the point of like the megata songs, the lyrics, they just beat you over the head with, with what's going on. You don't, there's no, there's no thought process involved of, of any of this stuff. Right? Like this.

Sebastian (34:34.816)
And lyricists too, Yes, he's a poet, man.

Sebastian (34:47.299)
Yep.

Sebastian (34:52.832)
Yeah, to me it's like I guarantee you the lyrics are absolutely last and he's like I'll just throw some lyrics together and whatever comes to my mind first. I don't think Dave Mustaine spends a lot of time really mulling over the lyrical content of a particular song. He's just like, is Dave are you available tomorrow?

Michael (35:06.601)
Well, let's get him on the show and ask him that question. Excuse me, sir. Yeah. If you don't mind, we'd love to come on and we're not going to bash any. We have nothing but respect for you. We love you. We do. We love Megadeth. That's just the way it goes. We love your guitar playing and your musicianship because it's, you've been a huge influence on both of us. Really? Yeah. Okay. So that's another win for Metallica. This isn't going the way I thought it was going to when I was thinking about this earlier.

Sebastian (35:15.822)
might pass a little bit, but.

Sebastian (35:21.154)
He's an incredible guitarist, that's for sure.

Sebastian (35:32.844)
I think you're kind of realizing how good and justice for all actually is when you actually like take the time to like look at the songs. Yeah.

Michael (35:35.643)
I kind of am. Yes. Yes. Okay. So next up we have what could have been on the black album, Harvester of Sorrow. It's very true. And when we saw that last year, my God, that the way they play it now, it's kind of slower. It's heavier. The drums are, like, cause one issue with the recording of this song I have is Lars's drums. It's too much in the riff. Like he's just trying to mimic the riff. Like just play the groove, just groove it baby.

Sebastian (35:45.166)
That's true.

Sebastian (35:52.931)
Yeah.

Michael (36:04.799)
Cause even by 90 with the live shit box set, when they played a song in San Diego or whatever, Mexico city, it was pure groove. was like, there it is. Why was it? Where was this five years ago? Like they just weren't ready yet. And the, my God, what a good song. And what is a song about addiction? The whole deal. Like it's just as deep. It's awesome, but it kind of beats you over the head with the content, but it does it in such a, such a intelligent way.

Sebastian (36:05.154)
Yeah.

Sebastian (36:18.818)
Yeah.

Sebastian (36:33.805)
Yeah.

Michael (36:33.959)
or we're not talking about, you know, I think Lucretia is about a ghost and Dave's. I'm serious. I think it's literally about a ghost. sorry. This song was co-written by Alison as well. I'm sitting up at night. tiptoed through the darkness, cold as hell, black as spades, aware of my immediate surroundings in my place. I up into my hideout, hiding from everyone. My friends all say Dave, you're mental anyway. my God. that what the lyrics are? geez.

Sebastian (36:41.198)
He said, I didn't mean to laugh, but it's just like we're going through addiction and all of sudden, man, Lucre says about a ghost.

Michael (37:03.989)
putting your own, putting your own name in your lyrics. Drifting to a deeper state, I stalk the cobweb stairways. Yeah, that's about a ghost, huh? Whatever. Okay, that's another easy one.

Sebastian (37:04.129)
This is my point about the lyrical content.

Sebastian (37:15.34)
Yeah, Harvester. Has to be Harvester. Harvester is such a great song.

Michael (37:16.105)
harvester all day long.

Michael (37:20.669)
It is. Okay, now this one's gonna be tough.

Sebastian (37:23.65)
Man, the next one is incredibly tough for me.

Michael (37:28.841)
because we got Freight Ends of Sanity, which they played like twice in 300 years. And we have Tornado of Souls. So any Mega Death fan out there knows, like Tornado of Souls is like their master of puppets. I'm not even trying, like it's so good.

Sebastian (37:35.608)
Yeah.

Sebastian (37:45.388)
Well, yeah, it's the template for playing solos, because the solo work on Tornado of Souls is probably the best solo work they've done on any song in the history of Megadeth.

Michael (37:57.906)
without a doubt.

Michael (38:02.013)
And the songs couldn't be any more different because you know, Freight Ends has this like sludgy heavy groove to it.

Sebastian (38:11.278)
My, Oh man, is gonna be tough for me. There's that one part in Fratism of Sanities that I absolutely love where it's like, where it's in the middle of the song. I don't remember exactly the timestamp, but it's like when it goes, da da da da da da da da da da da da da da. Like that is the coolest part of the song. And it's like you, that payoff when you get to that part, you're just like, this is badass. Like I love it.

Michael (38:28.381)
Yeah, I was gonna, yeah.

Michael (38:37.555)
Now, can I just say Wizard of Oz? I think that's just that. That's it. think that's the deciding factor. Metallica used the OEO from the Wizard of Oz in the beginning of the song for, and it makes zero sense for dudes in their late twenties. Hey, let's put in some Wizard of Oz shit into our song. I think that'd be cool. Like, it's just weird. Like it makes no sense. But it's...

Sebastian (38:45.326)
Yeah, that's a bit odd, isn't it?

Sebastian (38:55.064)
Yeah.

Sebastian (38:59.006)
I have to say though, like when you get to like the three minute 40 mark of, and phrases of sanity, that is some of the best harmonized guitar work that they've done. And that leads into the dance to dance to just that whole buildup. And then they get into that is just masterful. I love it so much. man.

Michael (39:20.893)
I think we're at this, know, tornado souls is nine, but freight ends as 11.

Sebastian (39:25.39)
Yeah.

Sebastian (39:29.324)
I don't know man, this one has been mulled over for-

Michael (39:31.903)
Cause this, I know this was going to be the hardest one besides the next two are going to be real hard to distinguish themselves from. But,

Like I'm listening to...

Sebastian (39:44.013)
Like I want to give it to continuity of souls. I really do. But there's too many good parts in the phrase ends of sanity where all the instruments are connected. But like I can't deny the solo work in continuity of souls. for, okay, well I'll put a caveat on my, on my thing. So I'm going to say phrase ends of sanity. And I'm sure you're going to say phrase ends of sanity as well.

Michael (39:46.815)
But you can't, you can't.

Michael (39:55.901)
No, like it's out of this world.

Michael (40:01.309)
really?

Yes.

Michael (40:09.745)
I wasn't until we started doing this. Earlier today, was like, okay, I got holy wars. I got like the first three songs, it's all Megadeth, man. But then I had listened to Justice in quite a while and I put it on again. I'm like, man, this so good.

Sebastian (40:16.494)
I'm just listening to the solo now for Tornado Souls. It's just like, ah, that's so good.

Sebastian (40:27.864)
So the question is which song is better in our minds. But like my whole thing is like, well, if we're looking at riffs, then it's Frey doesn't sound it. If we're looking at lead work, it has to be Tornado Souls, but we have to make a decision either way. So.

Michael (40:38.911)
But I got Kirk's solo on right now for Freight Ends. Man, it's good. my God. Like this could be Kirk's best solo ever. That's so, my God, forget it. It's Freight Ends of Sandy all day long. Okay.

Sebastian (40:41.632)
It's still good.

Sebastian (40:49.536)
Okay, so hold on go to the go do three three forty four of tornado souls and listen from there or 340 and listen to there and then listen marty freeman solo It starts at about 350 but get the lead in

Michael (40:59.017)
Yep. okay. Hang on. 340 of tornado of souls. Okay.

Michael (41:08.853)
Okay. Okay, that's three.

Sebastian (41:13.708)
Yeah. That's some of Marty Freeman's... Yeah. know, the deal... Like that's some of Marty Freeman's best work ever.

Michael (41:14.734)
Ugh, even the rhythm behind this solo is so good.

Michael (41:24.775)
I think that's Dave.

Sebastian (41:26.712)
Could be Dave, but I know Marty's solo's on this too.

Michael (41:28.68)
Yeah, yeah.

Sebastian (41:31.574)
Yeah, I still have to go with Frayed still, but like, man, it's like, this will be the only thing we can do 1A, 1B. Okay, it's Frayed. It has to be Frayed, isn't it, Sanity? This is a song that, this is a deep cut song too that nobody talks about, which is incredible. Like, it's such a good song.

Michael (41:34.462)
Now you know what?

No, there is no draws.

Michael (41:43.285)
That's solo.

Michael (41:52.113)
I'm still, I'm really torn.

Sebastian (41:54.242)
You know, funny is like the solos are kind of similar. Like a little bit similar. They have they feel the same like in and it's kind of the same spot of the song too.

Michael (41:56.804)
wait, of course they are. Yeah, a little bit.

Michael (42:03.645)
And then that, God, and then there's this like harmony thing. Like after, like the song, actually the songs are kind of similar. They're just not as long.

Sebastian (42:08.408)
Yeah.

Sebastian (42:13.454)
They're very similar. Yeah. It's just tornadoes like about a minute and a half or two, maybe two minutes less than phrase. But yeah, the right. Yeah. Well, right out of the solo is that my favorite part of the song where everything cuts off and just dance to tan tan tan tan tan tan. So yeah.

Michael (42:18.973)
Yeah, I got to go freight. Is that solo being as good as it is freight and it's still a better song.

Michael (42:30.109)
Yeah, I know. And then tornado souls kind of did the same thing. Like it did. If you finished the solo, it's like, my God, seriously, Dave, come on.

Sebastian (42:39.446)
I think without the I think the okay, I will quantify it this way for you. And I think you might agree with me. The reason why it's phrase ends over tornado is because tornado starts like, there's no build intensity wise to it. Right? So there's no journey because it's just you're you're in the tornado right at the beginning for the most part, right? Whereas phrase ends has this like stairway to heaven build where it gets slowly faster and faster and faster and faster and builds and builds and builds.

Michael (42:54.452)
No.

Michael (42:58.666)
Yes.

Michael (43:05.555)
Yep.

Sebastian (43:07.244)
So the payoff feels better in that song when it resolutes near the end after the solos and stuff like that. So, boy.

Michael (43:13.769)
Now let me ask you this, if they would have put a, keep the intro that tornado souls has, but if you put some sort of acoustic piece before it to make like a, like a minute or so, like to, to sort of, you know, to start, start the escalator or the elevator going up instead of just going in, it's just like, it's like you say it's instant. it's just, that's a lot, that's a problem. lot of these songs have up until this point in their, in Megadeth's career.

Sebastian (43:23.682)
Maybe. Like battery or something like that, yeah.

Sebastian (43:32.29)
Yep.

Michael (43:41.577)
They just, start full force. go full force.

Sebastian (43:44.834)
But that was the design. That was the thrash design for Dave. It's just like, we're just going to slap you in the face with every single song, right? And so that's where Metallica kind of, yeah, they are known as a thrash metal band. One of the pioneers of thrash metal, but not every song was thrash metal. They definitely knew the assignment on how to layer pacing into songs to give you, because you can't like, when you watch a horror movie and the whole thing is attention, it kind of doesn't feel tense, right? You have to like take a reprieve from your attention for that.

Michael (43:46.357)
Of that's the design, that's thrash metal, right? Yeah, yes.

Michael (44:09.267)
Yeah. Yes.

Sebastian (44:12.396)
And then when you go back into the tension, it's just magnified. It just feels better, right? Yeah. Unless you're doing a George Miller movie and then it's just intense, right? From the beginning to the end. George Miller did the Mad Max movies, just so I'm saying. But yeah, Furiosa, yeah.

Michael (44:13.897)
Yeah, yeah, it can't be that from scene one of God.

Michael (44:24.095)
cars are going. Yeah. Fury road and the road warrior, man, the road warrior does not hold up. That was my favorite movies as a kid. does not hold up. fear. You know, what's really good is Furiosa. I it, it was a co it, you could totally tell it was a COVID movie and the special effects. Like you could tell when it goes, but there's some scenes when it goes CGI or like, but I like furious a lot. It was really, I was shocked. I was even enjoyed it. was Chris Hemsworth was awesome.

Sebastian (44:33.4)
Fury Road is one of my favorite movies of all time. It's, yeah, it costs a lot to make and a lot of people don't give it.

It's good though. It's good. Yeah.

Yeah.

Michael (44:54.015)
Anyways.

Sebastian (44:54.708)
I need to rewatch it because I got annoyed because I was waiting for Anya Taylor Joy to come in and she doesn't come in until halfway through the move. Yeah, I was just like, when is she gonna show up? Okay, moving on.

Michael (45:01.427)
No, it's like an hour. Yeah. It's like a, okay. We're moving on this. think this one, we don't even need to talk about these that much. we have Dawn Patrol track eight against to live is to die, which is arguably the saddest song in metal history. What the hell is Dawn Patrol anyway? It's two minutes of Dave talking with an English accent and it

Sebastian (45:23.65)
No idea.

Sebastian (45:29.132)
This is the easiest one of my life.

Michael (45:31.507)
And it's just, and it literally, it's just drums and bass. There's no guitar. It's just, it's just the same loop. And I'm like, you're like, what? think.

Sebastian (45:37.856)
Yeah, there's no substance in the song. mean, it's a minute, minute. Yeah, just under two minutes for sure.

Michael (45:43.379)
Yeah, like, do we need Mr. Mackie to come in and say drugs are bad, okay? Like, seriously. Like, I understand the lyrics are kind of like environmental and stuff, which I'm pretty sure if I, I,

Sebastian (45:55.736)
So the clean riff in To Live Is To Die, like in the middle part, not like the intro part, but like after all of this stuff happens, where it's just the guitar, is probably the best clean riff Metallica's ever written. The, da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. Like that is incredible. Like absolutely.

Michael (46:01.365)
Mm-hmm. I like the intro,

Michael (46:10.495)
Yes.

yeah. Yeah. yeah.

Yeah. So as, fans, we all know the song is haunting. They don't play cause it was full of cliff riffs and it's about cliff and it's a dedication to cliff. And, and there there's honestly a brilliant baseline behind all that in the middle of the song. You can hear it live on, um, I believe it's well, Seattle 89, they do it. I think San Diego San Diego, they do Orion, uh, but you can hear on the Seattle 89. So it's, it's some of Jason's greatest work. You just can't hear it.

Sebastian (46:27.938)
You're right. It is a sad song for sure.

Sebastian (46:37.292)
Yeah.

Michael (46:49.397)
So yeah, so it's a little bit easy, easy winner.

Sebastian (46:50.082)
You can't. The easiest decision of my life here.

Michael (46:54.373)
Pretty much and then last but not least tracks nine we have What's the Metallica one called again, my god, thank you. my god I can't believe I forgot that Dyer's Eve versus rust in peace dot dot dot Polaris

Sebastian (47:02.36)
Dire Z.

Sebastian (47:06.126)
It's okay.

Sebastian (47:11.608)
So I feel like Rest In Peace is a better song than most people realize, but the problem is you're, you're, you're beating up against Dire's Eve, which might be their best, fastest song they've ever wrote.

Michael (47:15.443)
Rest in peace, it's so good.

Michael (47:21.191)
Okay, well let me ask you this.

Michael (47:26.645)
Out of all the songs on Rest In Peace, why is this one last? Like, wouldn't you have put this like where, I would have put this in the four spot and moved Five Magics to five and put Poisonous Decure at nine, because Poisonous Decure sucks. Like it's a good, it's.

Sebastian (47:31.096)
Don't know.

Sebastian (47:40.876)
Yeah, I got a question his layering about like where he puts his songs right because it doesn't make sense to me.

Michael (47:45.407)
Doesn't this, cause this song doesn't make, it doesn't make any sense to end the album. get that you want to end the album with the title track, which is kind of weird.

Sebastian (47:51.882)
Also, yeah, also his voice is terrible in the song.

Michael (47:56.943)
I love this song. The vocals are, they're delightfully, they're delightfully ridiculous.

Sebastian (47:58.816)
It's a good song though, yeah. But I don't mean to, okay, I've been trashing his voice, but like it's, guess the way I'll say it is like it's Dave Mustaine. there's a certain, I think at this point he has to sing the way he sings because that's the Megadeth sound, but he's not a, like, you're, no one's going to go to bat for him and say he's an incredible vocalist. Like that's not, that's not even in the conversation. He just does the thing because he does the thing, but he's not.

Michael (48:21.575)
No. So.

So I just paused the song and I've never read the lyrics to any Megadeth song, cause I just don't want to, cause I just take what I think he says and I'm good with that. So the line that's highlighted right now, we are how many seconds into the song? 50 seconds into the song, immense in my girth, erect, I stand tall.

Sebastian (48:33.238)
Okay. Well.

Sebastian (48:38.962)
boy.

Sebastian (48:48.034)
This is great poetry there, Mike.

Michael (48:49.161)
That is, you know what, that's beautiful. I am a nuclear murderer. Yeah, well, immense is my girth, erect, I stand tall. Come on. I, fucking hell. And then, I'm sorry, Dave, but like I'm a nuclear murderer, I am Polaris, ready to pounce at the touch of a button. We get it, it's all about nuclear war, fine.

Sebastian (48:52.086)
And then we get when a man lies, he murders a part of the world. We get into this prophetic. boy.

Sebastian (49:11.438)
I will just say Dire's Eve is an incredible way to end an album. You give to that date and probably in their entire career, this is the fastest song they've ever recorded, Metallica. So they're like, we are, yeah. You're not wrong.

Michael (49:15.293)
It is.

Michael (49:21.321)
Yes. And Lars's drums fueled by cocaine. Cause there's no way, there's no way a dude not on cocaine could play that song at normal speed. my God, it's fast. Especially when you're wearing like headphones and you got like the, like the big, like over the ear headphones and man, that just, I was gonna say the bass kicks in, but it's the bass from the bass drums, but just, just the thunder from the drums being so loud. my God. It like shakes your head. Like it's.

Sebastian (49:32.696)
Do this fast.

Sebastian (49:44.032)
Yeah, it's thunderous. They were probably like, hey, Dave's playing some fast shit. All right, hold my beer. I'll show you what fast is. Yeah.

Michael (49:51.955)
Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Here, give me my plate with the, I'm to chop up my breakfast on a mirror and, master publish reference. yeah, I think.

Sebastian (49:59.864)
Yeah, I see that.

Michael (50:05.801)
This was the last song James was really yelling at his parents about. This was it. This was the final.

Sebastian (50:12.994)
Well, there's some more emotional songs later on that's slower, know, and what song, can't remember, God, failed. But I was trying to remember that song.

Michael (50:15.583)
Sure. Yeah. Mama said stuff like that.

Michael (50:22.133)
Oh yeah. Yeah, exactly. So, uh, I was going to say my bitch, but whatever who, who, who, who are we kidding? Probably. Um, okay. So this is another, I think this is another easy one. Cause just that one word, that one line alone, I'm out. I'm out on, on rest in peace. It's riftastic. Don't get me wrong. It is absolutely riftastic. If you like playing guitar fast, you like your fingers moving at the speed of light. Rusty piece is the album for you.

Sebastian (50:28.714)
That's more of a sister probably. No, just kidding. I don't even know if he has a sister, but yeah.

It's gotta be dire as Eve, man.

Sebastian (50:42.348)
Yeah.

Sebastian (50:49.714)
Yeah, you're right. Also in dire z for James is angry in that song. Like he's angry like you can tell like he is he is not holding back his tension in his voice. He's really screaming into that mic. So yeah. Yeah.

Michael (50:54.746)
Mmm, he's pissed, man.

Mm-hmm. No.

Yeah. Well, his upbringing sucked. His best friend died two years ago and you know, like he's good. He's got some, he's got, as they say, issues that he.

Sebastian (51:12.162)
Dyer's Eve, so what does that mean?

Michael (51:16.02)
I don't know.

Sebastian (51:17.324)
because it's, is it the Eve? So I mean, who's dying? Yeah. It's definitely Dyer's Eve for me, for sure. Do you want to recap? I mean, you have, we have.

Michael (51:19.285)
It's interesting. It's like the eve of death, but who's dying?

Michael (51:25.255)
Is it his?

I think we agreed on almost all of them except for one. This has been horribly disappointing. I thought we were going to argue.

Sebastian (51:32.43)
except for one, except for the third song. No, we think the same sometimes. The only song that, okay, so we had Black End, Hangar, and then the only song we differed on is the third one where I went Ivy Holder, you went Take No Prisoners, and then it was one, Shorter Straw, Sorrow, Phrase Ends of Sanity, sorry, I'm really tired, so I'm slurring my words. To Live Is to Die and Dire's Eve.

Michael (51:38.591)
We never.

Michael (51:46.581)
That's right. Yeah.

Michael (51:54.101)
That's okay.

Yeah. Cause I think like, like hanger 18, let's say pick a song to hang out 18. When, when Omega song is great, it's great, but they're deep cuts. If you listen to D listen to all of countdown or even euthanasia, like it really falls off a cliff halfway through the record. You know? Yeah. Yeah.

Sebastian (52:06.977)
It's really great. Yeah.

Sebastian (52:16.256)
Yeah, you're right. Like Metallica's deep cuts are so much better than Megadeth's deep cuts. you know, you're looking at an album like you can grab any. I mean, you can probably say that for some of the latest Metallica albums where there's a couple of songs that I'm not gonna listen to, like Chasing Light, for example. I don't think I put that on in two and a half years or whatever. Like, I'm just not gonna listen to that. But yeah, like the deeper cuts like Fades in the Sanity, Shorter Straw, like you put that on, it's playing on any turn it off.

Michael (52:31.955)
No, like, yeah, you can't. It's not that good.

Michael (52:42.783)
Well, I think there's something to be said about, how often you put a record out, like sure. Back when they were in their twenties, they're doing it every two to three years. And then that, and after that, it got longer. A family's life. No. Right. And then. Yeah. So, so the timeline for Metallica got longer, but Megadeth stayed the same. And I think that suffers. You, you, cause he could afford to take more time. Let's just say, okay. Right. No, you just.

Sebastian (52:53.282)
They had no commitments. All they did was music. Now it's like they have outside commitments and family and stuff. Yeah.

Sebastian (53:07.606)
You're tapping a dry well, you're not letting it organically fill that up. Yeah.

Michael (53:11.477)
It's like, God, it's album cycle time. Let's, let's throw together 12 songs. And it's like,

Sebastian (53:16.302)
I mean, I had this conversation with like a lot of people and I'm living proof of burnout from just a sports thing because I played so much soccer when I was 17, 18, 19, 20 that when I got to the age of 21, 22, 23, I was burnt out from playing soccer. So I just took a year off and that year lasted 12 years, unfortunately. So I missed out on the prime of my athletic career because I got burnt out too early on in my career, right, of soccer.

Michael (53:22.761)
Yep. Sure.

Michael (53:41.557)
Yeah, you played a lot, man.

Sebastian (53:44.576)
So you need rests to continue to stay in love with the things that you're in love with, right? You know, yeah, I guess athletes today don't have that luxury because if you're not training in the gym for your sport, you're already behind, but you still need to be able to rest from things, right? You can't just keep go, go, go, go, go, right? You can't just create, create, create, create, create, because the well is going to run dry. You got to recharge the creative juices from time to time. So.

Michael (53:50.707)
Yes.

Michael (54:01.149)
Yeah. No.

Michael (54:06.623)
does, in this genre too. There's only so many notes. Well, there's only so many minor riffs. You're absolutely right. There's only so many and all the bands, the Slayers, the Metallicas, Anthrax, Exodus, Testaments, you name it, any band that plays really fast, they've done them all.

Sebastian (54:13.332)
E minor riffs.

Sebastian (54:30.54)
Yeah, I will say this about Megadeth, which really impresses me is that Dave is not scared to play in many different keys. So like he's all over the board. He's not just, he's not the James, I need that sixth string muted and I need to be in the key of E. Yeah, so James plays all like, I would say more than three quarters of his riffs are all in the same key for the most part, or start or have elements of E minor.

Michael (54:40.212)
was

I need the low E baby. Yeah.

That's too much.

Yeah. He's like the Angus Young of metal. Yeah.

Sebastian (54:55.04)
Yeah, whereas like Dave plays like in D and F sharp and like all F like all sorts of keys, right? So.

Michael (55:00.565)
Well, I think it's musical knowledge. Like not to say James doesn't have any, it's just James plays by feel. But Dave, think Dave's musical brain is like, like crazy artists kind of guy. like Michelangelo, was that Michelangelo burned his ear on the thing? Was that him or was that, yeah, that's it. Yeah. Cut his ear off. Was that him? Van Gogh. Yeah. Yeah. I don't want to cut. Obviously I don't want to compare Mustang and Van Gogh, but, but Mustang's in that kind of like artisty artist.

Sebastian (55:03.531)
yeah.

Yeah.

Huge. Yeah.

So, that, Karazirov, that was Van Gogh. Yeah, Van Gogh, Vincent Van Gogh, Karazirov.

Michael (55:29.845)
sort of headspace.

Sebastian (55:30.616)
So that's a good question to have because I found that with the Tea Party as well with their music. It's like when you're such an accomplished music theory person, the average stuff is not good enough for you to satisfy your musical need as an artist, right? So you have bands like Polyphia, for example, that write this uber complicated riff structures that nobody even knows what the heck is going on in time signature wise.

Michael (55:45.011)
No, it's boring.

Michael (55:53.001)
Yeah.

Sebastian (56:00.79)
because the average stuff just doesn't satisfy them as musicians, I think. So they need to push the boundary of what music is to them. But then sometimes, like the perfect example is Dream Theater. It's not for everybody, right? I try to, but it's just like, it's just too complicated. It's just losing me because the pure, yeah. There is something to be said about bands like Tool, which...

Michael (56:08.788)
Yeah.

Michael (56:14.067)
No, I try, I try really hard. I want to like them a lot, but it hurts my brain sometimes.

Sebastian (56:27.262)
actually have such an aesthetically pleasing sound to a lot of their songs, but yet when you actually dissect how they're written, it's uber complicated, like with time signatures and stuff like that, so.

Michael (56:36.359)
absolutely. Yeah. And the cool thing with Tool is like the guitars aren't like Polyphia's guitar playing. It's, it's, it, well, there is that, but it's, more rhythmic. It's, it's more rhythmic and it's, yeah, it's more open and it's allowed to breathe. It's got, everything has space. Like Danny carries drums usually and the bass kind of just, yeah. They're working on a new record.

Sebastian (56:46.862)
It's all in D minor. A lot of openness. Yeah.

Sebastian (56:59.768)
It's very tribal too, right? so they're currently, yes, I was just gonna say that they're currently in the studio right now. So we'll see that in about four and a half years, but anyways, yeah.

Michael (57:05.469)
Yes, sir. So.

I don't think so. I want to, I want to hope they've been doing some writing since 2021.

Sebastian (57:15.318)
I am also holding out hope. Holding onto hope, holding onto hope, yeah. Well, they played the Black Sabbath Ozzie show, right? So, but I mean, that's not a tour, that's just a one stop, so.

Michael (57:16.723)
Right? Because they haven't been on tour this whole time. Like what? Come on, like this, let's do this. Come on, one more.

Michael (57:25.396)
They did.

Yeah, but they have basically been on tour for quite a while now. so yeah, so it looks like our favorite band has won again.

Sebastian (57:31.181)
Yeah.

Sebastian (57:35.694)
except for one or two songs, don't get me wrong though, like Rest In Peace is a great album. So you should give it a listen. It's just,

Michael (57:37.556)
Not not.

It, it's a metal masterpiece. It really is. It just, the sound difference is, is jarring and the messiness is the wrong word. when you see, we referenced a lot was a lot of the songs are kind of all over the place and a lot of the good guitar playing gets lost because two guitars are doing two crazy things and you're like, what is going on? And that's. Yeah.

Sebastian (57:59.086)
Chaotic

Sebastian (58:05.378)
Yeah. You got to let certain like thrash was thrash and I'm great. I'm grateful that it was born in the eighties and nineties and we experienced that. like it, I would appreciate slowdowns and pauses and breaks in music because it allows, you know, you have to build to certain things. You can't just be like, okay, we're at 170 BPM. So mean, you guess you can, but when you have an entire album, that's the same pace, you kind of like.

lose the magic of some of those moments, right? So.

Michael (58:37.609)
Yeah, you totally do. You totally do. Before we're done, before we leave, one of my favorite German bands is just put a record out, it's called Woukhan. They put a record out called Axioms. I bought the record, it's coming, I think it's still in the Netherlands. But they are...

Sebastian (58:48.568)
yeah.

Sebastian (58:53.26)
Nice. You'll get that in a while, but yeah, they're like, who did we get? Why are we sending this to Britain? Where's British Columbia?

Michael (59:00.511)
Tick, tick, yeah, where's Canada? but they are awesome. They're, they're younger band. They put it, this is their fourth record and. they're not, it's like seventies psychedelic than they are. They are amazing. They are fronted. They are pretty rad. And this new record is, is awesome. Like it's, it's, they've leveled up their writing game big time. and I, you should, the first song, Specters of Fear is so good. It's like, just got this.

Sebastian (59:08.418)
To be clear, they're not thrash metal.

Yeah, they're pretty rad. Yeah, they're pretty rad.

Sebastian (59:23.2)
I should take a look at that then.

Michael (59:30.995)
like immigrant song kind of vibe. And it's just, and there's flute in it. It's flute rock. So there's flutes. Yeah, there's flutes. There's theremin, there's wicked guitar playing, amazing drumming, great bass playing, great vocals. Like there's the band that nobody knows. My wife and kids do not like them at all.

Sebastian (59:37.718)
Now they're channeling their inner Jethro's hall.

Sebastian (59:50.35)
I had a Wukong song come up recently on one of my Spotify playlists, but I can't remember what it was.

Michael (59:55.924)
was probably, maybe it was KTN SAX. That's a great song.

Sebastian (01:00:01.782)
Yeah, I don't know. But yeah.

Michael (01:00:02.579)
Yeah. But anyways, WUKON, if anyone out there has needs, wants to find a band that not many people have heard of, they're a great band. They're based out of Germany and they're awesome. I hope they come to North America one day, which coming anywhere near me is probably going to be. But I totally like, I love to see these guys at a festival. If I ever go to like freak Valley or something like that in Germany one day. probably.

Sebastian (01:00:09.88)
Good band.

Sebastian (01:00:19.464)
I guess we're going.

Sebastian (01:00:28.876)
I mean, you probably play Wacken. Everybody, every metal European band tries to play Wacken. So, yeah, yeah.

Michael (01:00:33.779)
Yeah, everybody plays vodka in freak valley, all these blood stock, all the goods. do not want to go. I changed my mind on going to the one in France. what's it called? my God. hell fest.

Sebastian (01:00:43.894)
The Metal Festival.

Michael (01:00:48.615)
I wanted to go to hell, there's too many people, way too many people for me, man. I can't do it.

Sebastian (01:00:48.79)
Yeah, that's a bit extreme. Hellfest is like, it's a lot of people. Yeah. So you're not getting in the wall of death.

Michael (01:00:56.071)
No. are you kidding me? Like you see drone footage of that thing. It's like 500,000 people there. Like if you're up near the front, it'd be like four hours to get out. No, thank you.

Sebastian (01:01:01.152)
It's nuts. it's scary. Yeah. Yeah, but you could see Jason Momoa in there. Okay. All right.

Michael (01:01:08.725)
I'm good. I can watch them on TV too. It's just, it's fine. Anyways, that's our show. Metallica wins as usual. And we are happy to be back. We will be back with our weekly yammering on about whatever we feel like yammering on about. So next week, but I know in October there's going to be an album that we are going to review that we, that as an artist that we both don't listen to.

Sebastian (01:01:16.183)
Of course.

Sebastian (01:01:21.454)
stuff.

Next week.

Sebastian (01:01:34.41)
refresh my memory or we'll just. yes. Okay. October 3rd. Yes. I listened to their podcast. was very fascinating. Actually the new heights podcasts. It was, it's pretty fascinating. Actually I liked it, but, and, and I fell in love with Jason Kelsey because he's fricking amazing that that's a great human being. It's a giant bear.

Michael (01:01:35.423)
Taylor Swift. We're doing it. yeah, we're doing it. Yeah, we are... I can imagine it was.

Michael (01:01:48.405)
She

he's funny. but I got to say my gambling, but I don't listen to her music, Taylor Swift, but she's the biggest artist in the planet and she writes amazing songs. She wrote this album while on tour gigantic stadium tour and managed to do a record at the same time that takes.

Sebastian (01:02:07.426)
Yep.

Her and two other partners were 100 % the only people that wrote on this album. So her two writing partners, guess, or I can't remember who they were, but there's two people that she collaborates with or writes with or whatever. And the last song on the album has Sabrina Carpenter on it as well. I think it was Sabrina Carpenter, if I remember from the podcast. Taylor Swift, October 3rd, we're reviewing it.

Michael (01:02:15.423)
Crazy. Yeah.

Michael (01:02:21.744)
Absolutely.

Michael (01:02:25.737)
Okay.

Michael (01:02:29.097)
Yeah. So hats off to her October 3rd. And I'm sure if, my daughter will be all over it.

Sebastian (01:02:37.614)
Chastising you for any incorrect things that you have commented on

Michael (01:02:40.475)
yeah, I'm gonna see if I can maybe do an interview with her. Not Taylor, but my daughter. Yeah, my god, you imagine. I don't even know what I'd say. Be like, hi, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're awesome.

Sebastian (01:02:45.186)
Taylor Swift?

Sebastian (01:02:51.118)
Okay, I love you. All right. Okay. Where are you going? Oh, yeah. The interview is over. Okay.

Michael (01:02:55.999)
Okay, thanks. You guys suck and then see you later. Anyways, that's, that is, that's the show. Bye bye everyone.

Sebastian (01:02:58.99)
That's the show.

Bye.