Embark on a captivating journey with Brian Whitfield, Colorado Springs' trail running marvel and dedicated science teacher, as he shares his tale of balance, endurance, and the passion for both environmental science and trail running. From a top ten finish at the Pikes Peak Ascent to the demanding Black Canyon 100K, Brian's narrative bridges the gap between an ardent teaching career and the thrill of competitive running. Discover the man who ties his running shoes with purpose and teaches with the same fervor, a true testament to the power of dedication in multifaceted lives.
This episode transcends the mere recounting of races and training regimes as we traverse the thought-provoking trails of competitive strategy, environmental stewardship, and the profound meaning that running injects into our existence. Listen to Brian's tactics, like meticulously knowing each twist of a trail and how such preparation can result in improved performance. As we navigate the environmental concerns that come hand-in-hand with the sport's popularity, the episode paints a holistic picture of the future of trail running within the delicate dance of conservation and community engagement.
Wrap up your laces for an inspirational sprint through the ethos and aspirations of the trail running community. We celebrate the diversity of stories within our ranks, from the legends who've paved the way to the everyday runners finding their 'why.' Brian and I engage in a vibrant dialogue that transcends the race course, touching on the significance of sharing narratives from across the spectrum of experience, fostering an inspiring, collective energy that fuels our own personal quests in the great outdoors.
Brian Whitfield IG - bwhitfield_
Embark on a captivating journey with Brian Whitfield, Colorado Springs' trail running marvel and dedicated science teacher, as he shares his tale of balance, endurance, and the passion for both environmental science and trail running. From a top ten finish at the Pikes Peak Ascent to the demanding Black Canyon 100K, Brian's narrative bridges the gap between an ardent teaching career and the thrill of competitive running. Discover the man who ties his running shoes with purpose and teaches with the same fervor, a true testament to the power of dedication in multifaceted lives.
This episode transcends the mere recounting of races and training regimes as we traverse the thought-provoking trails of competitive strategy, environmental stewardship, and the profound meaning that running injects into our existence. Listen to Brian's tactics, like meticulously knowing each twist of a trail and how such preparation can result in improved performance. As we navigate the environmental concerns that come hand-in-hand with the sport's popularity, the episode paints a holistic picture of the future of trail running within the delicate dance of conservation and community engagement.
Wrap up your laces for an inspirational sprint through the ethos and aspirations of the trail running community. We celebrate the diversity of stories within our ranks, from the legends who've paved the way to the everyday runners finding their 'why.' Brian and I engage in a vibrant dialogue that transcends the race course, touching on the significance of sharing narratives from across the spectrum of experience, fostering an inspiring, collective energy that fuels our own personal quests in the great outdoors.
Brian Whitfield IG - bwhitfield_
Hey guys, welcome back to the steep stuff podcast. I'm your host, james Lauriello, and today we have a special one. Trail running phenom and Colorado Springs trail runner, brian Whitfield, is on the pod, and I am couldn't be more excited to have this guy on. We dive into all kinds of fun stuff from Brian's 2022 and 2023 seasons and we really get into the nitty gritty with his 2023 breakout performance his eighth place at the Pikes Peak Ascent, the Golden Trail World Series. We also dive into his 2021 and 2022 Black Canyon 100K races and, last but not least, we talk about who Brian is as a human. We get into his past as an environmental science major and his passion for the environment and, very last, we dive into his career as a sixth grade science teacher.
Speaker 1:I am so excited for this one. I think you guys are going to absolutely love it. This is one of my favorite episodes yet. Brian is a good dude and I am so excited to see where his future goes in this sport Upward trajectory, to say the absolute least. So tune in. Here we go. The Steep Stuff Podcast, episode five. It's time, Ladies and gentlemen, we are live. Oh man, so did you run it all today?
Speaker 2:I did. I ran this morning. I got 10 miles. I started at Cheyenne Mountain High School and did like a hilly route. It was like hour and 45.
Speaker 1:Solid, man Solid.
Speaker 2:Just cruising around the mountains enjoying our snowy day here.
Speaker 1:That's right. Snowy day in the spring. It's this weird spring crazy spring weather. So you're on spring break, right?
Speaker 2:I'm on spring break. I got a week off. It's well-deserved, I think Well-earned Deserved. I think Well earned.
Speaker 1:Heck yeah. Hey guys, we are live. I'm live here with Brian Whitfield. Welcome, Brian.
Speaker 2:Thanks for having me, James.
Speaker 1:Dude, I'm so excited to have you man. We've been meaning to have this conversation for a while so I figured we had Ace got to have you. I mean, brian needs no introduction, he's one of the legends of Colorado Springs, so I'm very excited to have you on. You really fit the bill perfectly for this pod anyway so it's fun to get this rolling.
Speaker 2:So let's introduce yourself and tell me a little bit about who Brian Woodfield is. Yeah, my name is Brian Woodfield. I'm 27. I'm in denial about my age Every time someone asks me how old are you? I'm like I have to remember. But yeah, I'm 27. I'm a Colorado native, I was born and raised here and I just I love to run. I. But yeah, I'm 27. I'm a Colorado native, born and raised here, and I just I love to run, I love to be outside and I love to hang out with my family, my wife, our two cats.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, what's your cat's names?
Speaker 2:Albert and Sneffles.
Speaker 1:Dude, those names are amazing, they're right here.
Speaker 2:Oh, they're on the phone, yeah so cool they're beautiful boys. How old are they? Uh, they're like three or four. Okay, yeah, we adopted them and they're like 18 pounds each, so they're that's cool little beasts oh my god, 18 pounds is pretty solid.
Speaker 1:It's a big cat. It's a small bobcat right there, exactly. That's awesome. So all right, so we'll dive into a couple different things. One of the things I I what it's funny, I had ace, all right, so we'll dive into a couple of different things. One of the things I I it's funny. I had Ace on last week and we were chatting about that a little bit. He brought you up, of course, and one of the things that we were talking about was just like how amazed we both were uh, just, uh, just. We just admired who you were as a person, your hard work ethic you know you had so many amazing performances over the past few years but the fact that you're a teacher and how you balance both. So do me a favor if you wouldn't mind getting a little bit into what you do for a living as a teacher and what grade you teach and all that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's definitely like you said. It's trying to balance it all. It's a lot to balance, you know. It's eight hours of work on your feet all day and it's high energy, high demand with the kids and, um, I teach sixth grade, so they're 11 and 12. So they are the epitome of little nerdy middle schoolers. Um, they're super fun. They're super fun kids. Uh yeah, I've been a teacher for about four years now and I love it.
Speaker 1:I mean, some days are others, but it's a good job it's really cool and you're in, you're, you teach in the springs right I teach on the south side of the springs cool, um yeah, it's a great, great little district down there, awesome man. All right, so let's dive a little bit more into your origin story. We'll back it up um you're from colorado. What area of colorado usually originally?
Speaker 2:from.
Speaker 1:I was Wheat Ridge, Wheat Ridge okay, very cool, and you went to Western.
Speaker 2:I went to Western, and that's what birthed this beast of a runner. Yeah, I guess, so I would attribute it way back. I mean, first of all, it's my dad's right, my dad's genes. He was a phenomenal athlete in his day, a big cyclist and big runner out in the East coast. All the prep schools out there, Um but, yeah, definitely that's where I get it. And then you know nature versus nurture, lots of nurture in there.
Speaker 1:Very cool. So tell me about your time. Let's get into your time at Western a little bit. Um, I know, did you have, was Josh Eberle your coach when you were there.
Speaker 2:He was. Yeah, josh was there the whole time. I was there, um, he's a good dude. He was a fantastic coach. Um, while I was under his program, I think he he did a great job communicating with his athletes and making sure you were heard. Um, and that's my personal experience, I think, um, you know there's probably a varying degree of success with every coach, but for me it was. It was a great relationship, great partnership and definitely gleaned a lot of information from him.
Speaker 1:I knew you ran in high school. So what turned you on to Western? Was it because of that, of the trail running team? Is that what you knew you kind of wanted to do, or how did you find that?
Speaker 2:I completely stumbled into Western. I graduated high school kind of with no vision, no real direction for what I was doing or where I was going. I didn't even run my senior spring of track. I did ultimate Frisbee, oh sweet. And yeah, I got you. You know, I was just chilling, I just didn't really I wasn't a runner, I wasn't this or that, I was just like you know, some dude who was graduating high school and didn't really have a plan, um. But yeah, I went to western because they accepted me and had some pretty poor grades in high school, so getting accepted was pretty cool high school, so getting accepted was pretty cool, uh, and then I just, I didn't even run for the first two years actually, really, oh no, I was a ski bum.
Speaker 2:I was a ski bum at western and skied, crested butte every day. I got like 50 days two years straight and damn it was. It was a pretty fun part of my life.
Speaker 1:And then, how did you like? Did you? Was it someone that invited you to check out the trail team?
Speaker 2:or like, yeah, my, my wife, okay. So, um, I met her in geology class and she encouraged me to get out and run, so I attribute the whole trail running thing that's, that's her credit.
Speaker 1:So geology, dude, that's. That's my undergrad, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Nice, I took it twice.
Speaker 1:Did you really?
Speaker 2:Well, I failed the first time because I was out skiing my freshman year, but then, the second time I took it, I had a much better experience. It could be hard, man those rocks will sneak up on you, especially when you don't go. Yeah.
Speaker 1:If you don't show up, you're not going to know what kind of rock it is. It's a steep learning curve, you know Wow, so okay. So your now wife invited you to check out the team. What'd you think? Like what I mean? Obviously something clicked, because you are who you are now.
Speaker 2:So I I loved it initially. Um, if you ask Josh Eberle this question, um, when he first met me, he thought I was a bum and I think his assumptions of me were probably pretty accurate because you know, I was coming off of two years of no running. I was, you know, I was a ski bum. That's all I did. You know, I just skied and lived that mountain lifestyle and it's pretty chill. But the more I started running again, the more I kind of felt like myself and connected back with those high school roots that I had. And, yeah, things just started to click.
Speaker 1:Very cool. So you do that your junior and senior year right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the second half of my sophomore year and then junior senior year, wow, but I was there for three and a half years because it took me five years to graduate.
Speaker 1:Gotcha Me too. It took me five years to get a geology degree, because it took me five years to graduate. Gotcha me too, took me five years to get a geology degree it's no rush, forever, dude my parents were joking. They were like you're on the five-year plan, we're gonna finish, dude, I got, I got. I got the pressure from that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so you're on the team with jess right yeah, jess, you're in small um, him and I were like best friends for a good minute there and um, yeah, everything, yeah, we were best friends for a good minute there and um, yeah, everything, yeah, we were really close for a long time up until COVID, really, um, and then once COVID hit, I think he moved out to um like Provo, utah, to do chemistry and Salt Lake and um, my wife and I moved in with her parents and just started working, you know.
Speaker 2:COVID was a weird split for that team.
Speaker 1:It was a crazy time, dude, oh yeah.
Speaker 2:That's when I graduated, May 2020.
Speaker 1:Wow. So did you have like the last of your classes? Was it online or was it just?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I presented like my senior thesis digitally. Okay, we had this huge like install planned with the parks and rec team over in the gutterson county field office and like we didn't even get to install our senior project which was like monofilament recycling stations. Um, because of covid, because of the restrictions of like building permits and masks, mandates and group sizes and all that. But yeah, we did submit our work and got the degree and that was it.
Speaker 1:Sent you off dude. What did you? I know you're a science teacher. What did you study in undergrad?
Speaker 2:I studied environmental science okay. So it was a it was kind of a liberal arts exposure to a lot of the things in the environmental world as well as just general sciences. Yeah, I joke because I stopped at like all the 200 level classes Okay. So I have like a broad exposure to all the sciences up to that.
Speaker 1:But you got off easy. They didn't make you take Calc 2 or any shit like that.
Speaker 2:No, I kind of maxed out at like the. Uh yeah, calculus was difficult, but like the chemistry stuff, um, did a little bit of that I failed chemistry twice a lot of wildlife biology, a lot of um spreadsheets. You know working, working with field surveys and stuff like that.
Speaker 1:So very cool. Did you at any point like think you wanted to be an environmental scientist? Or did you know you wanted to be a teacher?
Speaker 2:oh, major, yeah, I definitely wanted to be an environmental scientist. Um, my goal kind of graduating college was to get into environmental consulting. Yeah, where I would, you know, come into a company and make advisements of how to improve their environmental? Um, you know ethos, um, so, dude, that was my first job.
Speaker 1:Oh I, I fucking hated it Really. I got laid off in like six months. I was terrible at it.
Speaker 2:I imagine it's got to be pretty hard though, because how do you tell a company to change what they're doing for a reason that's mostly public relations?
Speaker 1:Well, that's the interesting thing too is it's complicated. I think that's the best way I would explain it, because I worked in South florida. I uh went to undergrad, got my undergraduate degree um in south florida and there it's very more hydrological um, water sciences, things like that. So you're doing a lot of like phase one, phase two site assessments and they're basically trying to look for contamination. So you're looking like old um, you're looking at like you know old dry cleaners and places where they had like buried storage tanks from, like stuff like that and a lot of it's business man, you know, and it's just it kind of sucks the fun out of it and it's very deliverable based um. One of the projects I have to actually worked on was quite fun. Like we were counting trees, like shooting them with the gps and like like creating these like little gps tabs for like different types of trees and like, dude, like we walked like miles and miles and miles every day shooting these trees with the gps. It was actually kind of fun. That part was kind of fun.
Speaker 2:The rest of it was not fun no, but I was kind of the vision. I mean, if I could work in that field again, I'd love to go back, but education is a natural transition. Couldn't get a job in environmental consulting, so I just sort of got my teaching credential and jumped in.
Speaker 1:That's dope. I think teaching, too, lends itself. It's almost like a good handshake with running, because I feel like you get your summers off. You get a lot more time off at a certain time too. You know, it's a little more they.
Speaker 2:they do coincide with each other pretty well. Um, training during the winter months and, uh like, we just got daylight saving time back recently and getting the sun after work was a huge win for the good guys. I spend a lot of time on the treadmill, a lot of time running in the dark. I have a. I have a really nice headlamp that keeps me alive out there.
Speaker 1:So so do you? Are you usually running after work or before?
Speaker 2:Typically after work.
Speaker 1:Oh, your afternoon guy.
Speaker 2:If I get up in the morning, I just I'm exhausted throughout the day and I find, like you know, I just I'm exhausted throughout the day and I find, like you know, it's just my schedule is a little more open-ended if I like, can go to bed late rather than getting up early.
Speaker 1:Gotcha, yeah, cool, all right. So we finished college. You finished in a crazy time in the world and at that point, I know in 2019, I did some research on you. So in 2019, you ran Infinite Trails. Yes, we can get into that, but I'm just kind of curious to where you kind of bridge this gap. Post, if you will, like post-college to deciding like, okay, this is something I want to pursue, if you will.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think one of the major draws to doing a podcast was I, you know, I do feel like I have a story to tell. It's been an interesting. It's been an interesting ride in this like trail journey that I've been on In college. You know, no one ever really talked about being professional or like what it would look like, what that next step was like. Our coach, josh Eberle, at that time, was a professional athlete, um, and he kind of he didn't, he didn't show us much of what that looked like, other than leading by example and, just you know, running like he was a runner. That was it Right, um.
Speaker 2:But when we went to infinite trails, uh, robert Mewkin, the athlete manager of the Adidas team, basically introduced our team, um, three guys, three gals, um, my wife included, and we, um, you know, we kind of learned more about what this, this professional side of the sport, looked like. And it was. It was pretty, pretty cool, pretty captivating, um, you know, I mean, there was masseuses and hotels in Austria and I mean it was pretty attractive to see that and to get that exposure. At like 22, I think I was 22. Yeah, it was super cool.
Speaker 1:That's crazy. Man Like I look back and think and think if I could have. I'm old, I'm 33.
Speaker 2:Grandpa.
Speaker 1:I might as well should have brought the cane in with me, but if I had that exposure at a young age. I just think about the unique it's such a unique opportunity.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was a game changer. So basically we went into that and it was like a relay team. So there was someone doing like a 25 K, someone doing a 40 K and someone doing a like a 65, 70 K, Um, jesher, and did the 65, 70 K distance, whatever that uh long part was. I did the 40 K marathon, um, and then our buddy uh did the 40k marathon, um, and then our buddy uh did the 25k. Okay, my buddy ben, super cool dude, um, yeah, but the the marathon was interesting because, uh, timothy olsen was in the race. I believe he won, maybe I don't know. Uh, I just remember getting fifth and they like showered us in beer and gave us like a five liter beer Stein at the finish line and there was like a DJ and like it was like it was so epic. I mean it really was pretty cool, um. But yeah, you know, we're just running through the Alps and what an intro to European racing.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh, Absolutely yeah absolutely A banger, you know.
Speaker 2:and then you go back to the Adidas team house and everyone was um, you know, it was just good vibes.
Speaker 1:Cause at that time the Adidas team was, I would imagine, pretty small, like it was, like Tim and just a few others it was.
Speaker 2:It was really starting out. I mean, I think they started um having a trail presence in 2016. Okay, um having a trail presence in 2016. Okay, so we were three years after that kind of inception. Um, I could be wrong on those dates, but it was very young, you know, you had, like Cordis and Abby Hall, josh Eberle, um, I think, corinne Malcolm at the time.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:It was. There wasn't a huge American, North American presence, but then you had like a larger European, spanish. There were some Russian athletes, um, I think they had a Chinese athlete, it was. It was really cool.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I dude, I love what they're doing. I mean they just got my coaches, eli and Tabor and wow, like it just seems, did you see? I mean the coverage that they just had of their athlete uh summit just looked so much fun.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think the biggest thing about a team like that and an opportunity like that is it's a huge time commitment and it's a huge lifestyle commitment, because you're not just signing up for this team, you're signing up for the total package of team trips and so many like time obligations throughout the year. Um, and if you have that like the ability to commit to that it's you know, I think they're they're leading the charge on that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but um, I don't know. I I kind of after the after an infinite trails um about six months after I interviewed for a professional spot with Adidas and it just didn't feel right.
Speaker 1:I did not know that, yeah.
Speaker 2:So I had the chance to interview with their athlete North American recruiter and the conversation felt pretty natural. And then they just started asking about shoes and I I was like you know, there's there's a lot of different shoes out there and, like, the ones that are working for me right now are definitely more thick, stack height. Um, specifically hoka, at the time I was, uh, you know, I was definitely a a believer in the hoka stuff. I love the speed goat and the clifton and um, yeah, I just I kind of mentioned that in a in a sense of like, look, yeah, I'd love to be able to, to participate in this team and have that opportunity, but, um, if you know, if I can't train in the shoes, that's going to be an issue, right? Um, and I, I stuck to my guns and ultimately, like it, you know, it didn't come to fruition, it didn't pan out.
Speaker 2:Um, then fast forward. Uh, same thing happened with solomon. There was a solomon camp that came up in I think it was May of 21. And went out to Solomon Camp in 21, out in Moab with Courtney DeWalter and Jamil Curry and Max King and a bunch of cool guys. Kieran Nay was out there yeah.
Speaker 2:Jacob Dewey, both Colorado Springs dudes. Both of those will be on, they should be. If you ask me who I'd recommend, those are my two. Hell yeah, but yeah, we went out to Moab and had an incredible time. Be on, they should be. That's if you ask me who I'd recommend.
Speaker 1:Those are my two.
Speaker 2:Hell yeah, but um, yeah, we went out to moab and had an incredible time. Um, and then the same thing happened again. They offered a you know that professional level afterwards and I, you know, I was like same thing. I was like I just don't know if I can believe in your shoes, man.
Speaker 2:I just don't know if it's yeah like the right fit for me and, and hindsight on both of those choices, I still feel confident in those decisions. I still feel like you know I'm proud, I was true to myself and stayed honest with that. I think it'd be really easy to be like yes, let me have any opportunity that comes to me and let me you know I want that. Yeah, I think it. Yeah, I think it. It took some.
Speaker 1:I mean they weren't, they weren't easy decisions to make.
Speaker 2:I have to say like definitely a lot of deliberation with my wife and my family and just talking about it.
Speaker 1:but yeah, stuck to my guns and I really admire that and I think it's, in the long run, wise. I think if you're training in the shoes that work for you, I think you're going to be healthier, I think you're going to have more longevity, and there's nothing wrong with knowing what you want, dude, and I think that's that's a beautiful thing.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I kind of see what you run in, so I have an idea of what you want.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I think I think if you look at my Instagram page and you, uh, you know, you know who I am. You there's, there's some obvious choices for me that I would be most interested in, but, um, there's some, there's some really cool shoes coming out right now. Um, I've had the chance to uh see a couple of new things coming down on some brands I'm excited for and um, yeah, I don't know, I'm just excited for the future. We'll see what happens.
Speaker 1:I'm excited for your future. Um yeah, man, that's an interesting story. Wow, I did not know that. I mean, I knew I remember seeing pictures on Kieran's Instagram. Oh, I knew you were there at the Solomon camp. Oh, it's so fun yeah.
Speaker 2:Like. There's the the only reason I I were so sick, like, like uh the athlete manager was amazing, courtney was amazing, jamil like we had such a blast out there. And I knew that that was like this is hard to walk away from that community and hard to walk away from those relationships I'd made. But it wasn't like walking away, it was just like uh let me ask you a question.
Speaker 1:I don't know, I know some of this you might be able to get into, some of you might not, but like I just know from people that I know that have run for Solomon, have had and this is nothing against Solomon I think that, like I said, I love the golden trail series. I plan on racing a lot of their stuff. Like their. Their races are amazing. I'm just curious to see like different brands have different requirements for different races, like, like. Would that have siloed you and I don't know if silo is even the right word but would that have forced you into that golden trail series path, if you will?
Speaker 2:Um, yeah, I, you know, I think we I don't specifically know the details of a contract with Salman or what that would look like, but I think it's. You know, in any um, in any athlete brand partnership, you have an incentive to do their events right to to be there and um, that'd be.
Speaker 2:You know, it would make the most sense for solomon to encourage their athletes to go to those. Yeah, um, and obviously we see that right, like we see a lot of solomon athletes going there and, um, it's, it's pretty sick to. They call it the traveling circus, I think Something like that. Yeah, it's like their whole Golden Trail series posse and it's a pretty cool team. Oh, yeah.
Speaker 2:You're right. If you sign for one of those companies that is a major player in the event scene, like Hoka or Solomon, I do think there's contractually going to be obligations that would put you in their events, which isn't a bad thing. I just think I love like. One of the biggest reasons I like to run and like I love to be, you know, like a competitor, is because I get to go explore new places. And if you're running the same same course every year, you know that's super fun for a competitive aspect. But when it comes down to like, why are we running, why am I continuing to pursue training and all this, it's? It's to be able to enjoy the mountains and go to new places.
Speaker 1:And is that what inspires you mostly about this?
Speaker 2:uh, the, what mostly inspires me about running and like training? Yeah, I would say the thing that inspires me the most about about running and training is just being able to set a goal, work towards it, and it's very grounding to me to have this like hobby, outside of my work, outside of my relationships. It's like something that is like, um, it's completely, it's completely mine, and it allows me to to just devote myself to something that is a little bit bigger than myself, and I don't think it's uh, um, I know it's selfish, but it's just like having a goal, working towards that goal is really just gets me motivated. It's something to chase.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I love that. I would say I'm a lot of the same way it's. You have your day job, you have what you do, you have your relationships, but there's something a little bit bigger that pulls you towards. I mean, there's gotta be, I think. For me it's. It's something cause, like I go to sleep at night and I'm thinking about running when I wake up in the morning. A lot of times I'm thinking about what I'm going to be doing that day from training, Like I'm genuinely excited about it and I think you have to be genuinely excited about it to be able to do that and repetition day in and day out to achieve those results for sure yeah you know I love that now.
Speaker 1:Obviously you're pretty good at the repetitions because your 2023 season was off off the chain. I was. I appreciate it.
Speaker 1:You're welcome I was really blown away and I kind of told you, going into this, like one of the things I really wanted to dive into was your 2023 uh pikes, peak ascent. I mean, you ran the ascent in 2022, you got 12th place correct and you had what I would call, and what many would call, a gigantic breakthrough in 2023, cracking into the top 10 with eighth place, uh, and I mean I would argue that that was probably the most competitive race ever assembled on American soil. So you, obviously you got to be pretty, pretty damn proud of that. Do you want to? We'll keep this pretty open ended. So do you want to dive?
Speaker 2:into that one a little bit. Yeah, I think first, like I love, I appreciate it. First of all, thank you so much. It's hard for me to take a compliment, but thank you when you say like the most competitive race assembled on American soil for like sub ultra stuff. Sub ultra, yeah, I mean, I don't know, I guess I'm not as much of a student of the sport as some other people, but like I know, the Golden Trail series has been big Like I just remember like in 2016 or 18, 19, something like that. They did the Pikes Peak Marathon for Golden Trail and was like sage candidate dakota jones, killian jornet, like there was a lot of like high caliber athletes on that race and I know like the 2023 pikes peak ascent was, it was a big one, like it was I'd put it up there, dude I think people say that the term stacked field a lot, but I think that that was a that was genuinely a stacked field.
Speaker 2:That's gotta that that was a that was genuinely a stacked field. That's gotta be at least for me, that was the most competitive race.
Speaker 2:I've participated in Um so, yeah, but yeah, 2022,. Um, I went into the race and I I've never really considered myself like an amazing climber. I've always been like a good um, you know I'm good at the long haul stuff. You know, three hour kind of marathon distance, I can just kind of get in a good rhythm and focus, um. But the climbs have sort of alluded me up until maybe 2022. And I was like I'm going to jump in something that scares the shit out of me. And running 8,000 feet up to a 14,000 foot peak scares the shit out of me, um, still does even, you know. But yeah, doing Pike's peak in 22, um was kind of like a, a commitment to trying new things and it went okay.
Speaker 2:I think I learned a lot about that first year of how to train for these events and how to focus at altitude and get get good at like running up a Hill and um, yeah, moving forward into the next year, I spent more time at altitude. I did a bunch of Matt Carpenter's like three, two, one workouts, where you go to the summit, you drive up there, you park at the top. Um, I would do like a couple of miles warmup, just running loops in the parking lot there, um, do some strides to get the heart rate going, and then you do, you know, one mile down, one mile up tempo, two miles down, two mile up tempo, three miles down, three miles up tempo, and those fucking hurt I. I puked a couple times after those. Uh, just working that hard at altitude, yeah, it was. Uh, those are challenging. Those are probably some of the hardest workouts I've done. But, um, do you have his book? No, I didn't know he had a book he wrote a book.
Speaker 1:It's like a. I've had his ice cream, it's custard bro, oh custard, sorry, matt yeah, he's got like a little little like um, uh, just a multi, like a few page book that he wrote. I mean, this guy was so dialed like he. The book even talks about like what rocks to step on on the w's and stuff like that, like what to avoid and what. Yeah, he was pretty damn dialed, I, I believe it. Yeah.
Speaker 2:I think, and that's that's part of the beauty of like running these same races every year, like just running in your local trails. Like I know, matt grew up in Colorado or not grew up, but spent a lot of time here in Colorado Springs and when you get that familiar with a trail or a course, you, you really learn the ins and outs of it. Um, I don't know if I'll ever be as dialed as him on something, but, um, I, I, that's what it, that's what it takes, though. It's just like having that familiarity with the area, your body, how your body responds, and like all those little pieces.
Speaker 1:Dude, I love the preparation that you put in. So that's see like I've never been an extremely talented athlete. I think if I've gotten anywhere doing anything it's been from a lot of hard work, um with you. I just really admire the fact that, like you were up there doing three, two ones, like hammering yourself into the ground every Saturday, really.
Speaker 1:Cause I've seen you. I think I saw you last year, might've been before the race. You were going up up bar and I was coming down. I was. I always do that loop around longs ranch road up bar and I was coming down. I was.
Speaker 2:I always do that loop around Longs Ranch road and I always I'll spot, usually spot a few people and yeah you saw you a couple of times coming down and I was like, yeah, I would do, I would do like one. So I had two days every weekend, right Saturday, sunday. One of those days was always dedicated to just going purely uphill, doing the whole thing kind of easy, um, and then the next day or the day before I'd swap, um, I would do the three, two ones.
Speaker 2:So, just trying to maximize that time and altitude and being intentional with where I'm training for the goals I had.
Speaker 1:It's impressive. So, race day, did you have nerves going into this one?
Speaker 2:I did. I really did Um. I was a lot less Okay. I was more nervous in 2022. The first time I did it um, because I think I had only run Pike's peak, like the full bar trail segment. I'd only done that one, like twice before the race, so that one was really scary, intimidating.
Speaker 2:Um, it's my first time stepping on the line with all those big names and um, you know people I look up to in the sport and men and women that just like just kick ass all around the world and I'm, and I'm there, you know, just like oh, but uh, in 2023, I think I had a better sense of uh, you know where I wanted to be and like where in that lineup I felt like I um had worked to get to. So, um, not as nervous on the starting line, I think I was nervous. Uh, a couple of miles in, probably like five miles in, I was running with, like, joseph Demore, who's really cool guy I think he's on Lost Bar TV with you.
Speaker 2:Um, colorado native as well. But I was running with him and I was like, oh, I feel pretty good, and then I just I dropped him and I was like, oh crap, like am I really about to drop? Like you know, a US national team member.
Speaker 2:It's a legend, someone who's an absolute beast on the uphills, like, and it you know, that intimidated me. I like I kind of was like wait a minute, like, am I really? Am I doing this right? Am I pushing too hard, is it? Um, so I kind of second guess little moments in there. But once I got up above tree line and I kind of hit that familiar three, two, one zone, I was like, oh, I've been here before, I can.
Speaker 1:I can still hammer Um.
Speaker 2:I think I had a really nice uphill section. Uh, once I got above tree line, everything else, I feel like I can improve any low points. Um, low points are, it's probably like those first three miles, like when you're just like. I mean you're just getting dropped it was like Remy Eli, like um Patrick Kipniego and mean just really incredible athletes, just like leaving you in the dust and you're working hard, right, if you're getting dropped and you're working and they're just floating away from you.
Speaker 1:These guys are running seven, eight minute pace up the w's. It's a little little discouraging.
Speaker 2:But um, yeah, that's probably the lowest point. Once you get in the rhythm and you kind of you know, find your own feet. It's, it's not. Yeah, once you get in the rhythm and you kind of you know, find your own feet.
Speaker 1:It's not yeah, yeah, once you, I feel like yeah, once you make the turn off from Experimental Forest onto like Bar, I feel like you can just kind of settle in and you get some separation and stuff like that. Did you other than, like Joe DeMore, were you like with anybody, or or did you actually? I'll let you answer that and then we'll get into it. I.
Speaker 2:I was with, uh, joe Damore for the first four, five miles, maybe, um, and then I don't know his name. He was on that, on team. They're like yellow and white singlets, um, one of the Kenyan, one of the one of the Kenyan runners who had, like he had just like gotten second or third at series and now previously and I was like, oh, I knew you were talking about.
Speaker 1:they just did like a whole thing on him.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, I was like, how am I running with this guy? He obviously had a tough day and I think, um, the altitude might've got him or I don't know. But yeah, I spent the last uh with him until, uh, the circ, and then I dropped him. Okay, um, yeah one of the most impressive things of that day was uh, is it not joe demore? Who's joe demore?
Speaker 1:seth demore so he's a freak dude.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh. He had a fantastic race that day. He came up, uh, flying from behind us all and passed like 10 people in the last couple of miles.
Speaker 1:Really.
Speaker 2:He had a really nice second half on that day Wow.
Speaker 1:It's just altitude, just super fit. Oh, he's a beast. Wow, were you picking guys off going up the switchbacks as well, above tree line?
Speaker 2:I think. So I talked to someone about this and I don't even remember. You know, you probably kind of you get a little bit of tunnel vision, yeah, and I don't even remember. You know you probably kind of you get a little bit of tunnel vision. Yeah, yeah, I don't remember getting passed by anyone, except for Seth D'Amore. Okay, it's not eight, it's a good company, whatever, yeah, which is you know? Yeah, but I remember I don't know.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:You definitely black out a bit. Yeah, who cares?
Speaker 1:Just lack of oxygen, lack of oxygen. What a day, oh my God. And to get to that point and do it, how did you feel at the finish line? Were you just elated once you found out you were? Did you know like I did this?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was in shock. I came up and I saw 2.14 high on the clock and I like, raised my hands and I was like, oh my, like you know, my mind was blown. And then I just crossed the finish line and I was like like holy cow I was so grateful for you know a lot of things, you know mostly my wife being able to take that much time away from her and spend time with her as I was out training.
Speaker 2:But yeah, yeah I'm super grateful for that. And yeah, then one of the usada people grabbed me and they're like all right, you're being tested and and I was like oh, what an honor.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what an honor. I was like, really Me.
Speaker 2:Are you sure? No, it was my first drug test and I kept the little. They give you a little like certificate of like slip.
Speaker 1:I don't know at the end of it.
Speaker 2:I kept it. It's in my little training dojo at my house training dojo at my house that's awesome. Next to my bike. Yeah, it's my proudest moment in trail running.
Speaker 1:I mean dude. That's a day I feel like I would remember for the rest of my life.
Speaker 2:Yeah, amazing it did take me a long time to uh to get a sample, but uh it was, it was a good time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's so funny, oh dude. Well, congratulations again. I mean I, I'm like I said breakthrough, absolute. I'm like I said breakthrough, absolute, amazing race. And I like I don't know it, just I, we were all I said. I remember sending you a DM. Everybody was just so excited, so it's freaking dope that felt good, all right.
Speaker 1:So what a day. We move on from that. After that you take some, some downtime and you kind of get back into your 50k, 50k. It seems like for me, I don't know, like knowing you now it seems like you really like these 50Ks and just really excel at these distances. I love them After.
Speaker 2:Pikes Peak. I was actually trying to run the Moab Trail half marathon in November and I went out there and I got sick. It didn't do well, there's a bummer way to end the season of 2023, um, but yeah, getting back into 50ks, I have. I have like a two-year plan right now of like where I'm wanting to go and like what, what things I should be focusing on. So, uh, working on the 50k kind of marathon distance is uh, it's intentional for the future, do you want?
Speaker 2:to maybe dive into that. Yeah, the 2025 uh world trail championships are in canfrank, spain, in the pyrenees, um, and every year, the or not every year, but every time the world trail championships happen there's a long team that's like 80k, and then there's like a medium team I guess you'd call it yeah, um, kind of at that marathon distance, um, and then there's short and classic vertical vk, all those um, but I kind of see myself shooting for that um, that 40k team.
Speaker 1:I love to hear it, dude. Yeah, world was really really fun to watch last year like wow and it was really made me really bummed.
Speaker 2:We didn't have one in 2024 yeah, I think having a like a bi-annual is that what you call that? Having a bi-annual schedule is really cool because it um, if it was every year, it would lose its clout. But yeah, I think it's cool enough to wait two years, right? Yeah?
Speaker 1:Wow. So there's no speculation as to yet. Like we don't know what they're going to do. Like, this year for the VK it's at Loon Yep. This year for the Classic it's going to be at Snowbird. For the Cirque series, which Kieran's going to be at I was just looking at the start list today. Andy Wacker's going to be a lot of dudes there. I'm excited. I'm going to do a preview episode for that. Any, any consideration that you might, might end up there in the summer. Um.
Speaker 2:I, I did, uh, I did the U S mountain champs. Uh, for the classic which is like that, seven mile distance up and down.
Speaker 2:I did that in 2019 at Waterville valley. Um was joe gray, andy wacker, seth demore, joe demore stack, josh everly uh, who else is there? David fuentes, kick my butt? Um, yeah, a lot of cool guys, but, um, no, I, I love that, that short distance. I just think my um, my specific skillset and my talents, um, and where I enjoy, you know, performing the most is that that 40 K ish marathon distance. Um, so I don't think I'll be out there this this summer shooting for the short stuff, but, um, it's, those races are hard.
Speaker 2:Those races are so. I've never been more sore Like I was more sore after the seven mile mountain champs race than I was after the hundred kilometer black Canyon I did really uh, you just throw yourself up on the mountain.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what Just savage I mean, you're just yeah. I mean, I know like I I I mean, I haven't done. I've done a lot of mountain running, seven to 12 mile races, nothing like I haven't done a U S championships yet or U S champs yet. But black Canyon, dude, that's, that's painful. The I just had a Jacob scabber on. He just got top 25 at um at black Canyon this past year.
Speaker 1:And that was another fricking stacked race. Oh yeah, one of the things I actually had noted was to talk to you a little bit about your kind of rewind and go back into your black canyons a little bit, because I know you, you did it once, had a really tough day out and then one of the things I really admire about you is that you came back and you finished the damn race the second time around, which is kind of like reminiscent to me as like you're almost like your Pike's peak. You did it once you started figuring it out and then you came back and you nailed it.
Speaker 2:So black Canyon maybe for a third time to go nail that Like yeah, I, I, that one was, uh, the first time I did black Canyon. I was like, uh, I think that was the first race. Uh, that was like a high competitive event after covid had hit at least on my schedule. Um, I was slotted to do the lake sonoma 50 mile but covid canceled it. So I kind of was like put off of racing for a while.
Speaker 2:And then black canyon came around in 2020 I think that's it was 2020 first time I did it and we had masks. You had to have a mask at the start line. All the aid stations have some really interesting, some funny photos of me and my dad, like you know, me racing in a mask and coming through aid stations. It's, it's wild that first time. Uh, yeah, but I definitely, like you know, I came out to Black Canyon the first time and like race to 50 K really hard. I think I did like a. You know, I came out to Black Canyon the first time and like raced a 50K really hard. I think I did like a 330, 50k in the first half of Black Canyon. And then I got to Black Canyon city aid station at like mile 40 or whatever and I was like, oh there's more.
Speaker 2:So I I really didn't plan well. I don't think I fueled nearly enough um mentally going in. I don't think I knew what it was going to take and what it was going to feel like for my first one.
Speaker 2:Um, especially being a cocky young kid, I was like oh yeah, I could just run seven minute pace all day and you know, hopefully one day I can. But that first shot it was a bit of a stretch for me. And then coming back the second time I really was more motivated to finish, purely because I just remember the feeling of dropping out last year, like the year prior, and I felt like just such a you know, such a burden of like like I just never wanted to feel that again.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so that sucks. You have, you know, family and friends come out to support and you got to. I've, I've had that happen, man.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you feel guilty, almost it's like. But yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 1:So it's tough, hey, but you came back, you overcame redemption. Yeah, you got it what.
Speaker 2:And then Preston Cates, right at the end. Uh he, he came up behind me at like mile 59 and sprinted past me and it was like, oh, I have nothing bastard. Yeah, it was it was perfect, we hugged after oh, I'm sure, I'm sure.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what a cool race man. It was fun following it this year too. It was I mean to see Hayden come back and like, totally like it's so cool to watch those live streams. Yeah, yeah, I big fan of those, big fan, big fan dude speaking of those live streams, like the sport, man has just like it's, evolved in the last five years, so much you know, like.
Speaker 1:what are your thoughts on that, especially as, like you, come from this young gun and now you're maturing and growing within the sport as it's evolving? Like what do you think about that?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think, um, there's, there's a, there's a lot of mixed emotions around it. I think number one I'm excited for the future and the development of the sport Um, just getting more accessible to a lot of people and, uh, seeing all these major brands like put an interest towards it and put money towards it, um is, you know, that's, that's the lifeblood of the sports economy. Really, I mean, like, once they do that it's, it's only going to grow and more, uh, you know, expand for better. But there's a lot of things in the trail running world right now that are, I think, unsolved or unfinished and there's, you know, there's some growing pains.
Speaker 2:Um, I think there's a lot of tourism and maybe, impact on the natural ecosystems of landscapes that are, you know, maybe pretty fragile areas and you're hosting, like you know, major events on these fragile areas and I think, uh, you know, these areas are meant to be enjoyed and they're meant to be, you know, cherished and loved and positive experiences are supposed to be made on those lands, whatever. But when you, you know, if you're not contributing back to the public land, like the dollars and the trail work and the conservation efforts, then I think that's an issue, and I think UTMB just posted, or not posted recently, but they came out with some of their financial awards that they had given back, which is really refreshing to hear.
Speaker 1:I wasn't yeah um.
Speaker 2:I think that was a single track podcast.
Speaker 1:I heard um but then I know what you're talking about. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:But then other, uh, other companies like mad moose um, they're, like they're the largest uh trail donators or trail fund donators for, like, keeping trail maintenance up in moab.
Speaker 1:Uh, they're the largest contributors towards that really yeah, I mean they have a good half dozen plus races. I mean they've got quite a few in that area. So yeah, that's amazing dude they're, yeah, the ricks families.
Speaker 2:Uh, they're fantastic for a lot of reasons, but that's are they based in the springs definitely one of them. Um, I think it's not my story to tell, but they, I think they split their time between moab and colorado gotcha, there's ties there.
Speaker 1:I I was assumed wow. So to piggyback on that environmental impact, I mean that's something I think in colorado we have to deal with. Uh, I mean just from a population booming perspective. It's like pretty, pretty serious. I mean we have more deal with, uh, I mean just from a population booming perspective.
Speaker 2:It's like pretty pretty serious.
Speaker 1:I mean, we have more and more people moving here as the days go by and there's a lot of impact, especially on the high country. It makes me wonder, like, what the future of our races really are in a lot of ways in the state, because, like, are we just going to be confined to? I mean? That's why I feel like pikes is such an anomaly. You don't have a lot of, I mean, other than, uh, the blue sky race or former Evans race. There's nothing up a 14 or or hard rock that goes over handies, but that's so unique and minute. Um, yeah, I just feel like the future of trail running in Colorado, who knows? I mean this could be just pushed to ski resorts at some point.
Speaker 2:You know it's interesting to see where these impacts are going. I just think it's um's, um, you know, with any development and any growth in a sport or area that involves like landscapes and sensitive areas like we're talking about, uh, it takes careful consideration and I know some people are like really good about it and making sure that they're doing all the right things that they can to keep these lands uh pristine as possible. Um, but you know, just that's my, that's my uh soapbox no, I agree, I do agree with you we're gonna be out there.
Speaker 2:We gotta be fighting for the land gotta be stewards of it.
Speaker 1:I totally agree. So yeah, I was talking. One of the things ace had talked about on on the previous podcast was doing a. We're talking about logistics of a pike's peak. If this is a fictional possible race in the future, uh, like a descent, not an ascent, a descent that would be for ace, wouldn't it just for ace?
Speaker 1:yeah, it's an absolute machine downhill but like the uh, the logistics of busing every, every I mean we already do the logistics of going to the top in a bus and then busing everyone down. This would just be the logistical inverse of it, which seems like such a crazy impact on what's already fragile up there, you know, or already gets beat up.
Speaker 2:But the infrastructure is there right. Like the road was built for better or worse. It's there and I think it can handle those people and it can like accommodate that type of event. If you go somewhere, you know, like in the San Juans, it's a fragile ecosystem and like you see trailheads that are just way over packed and big time. Um, that's just part of the sport. We just I don't know- I don't. I don't have all the answers.
Speaker 1:Are you a big incline guy?
Speaker 2:Uh, not a big incline guy. I love it, though Like.
Speaker 1:I just started getting on it a lot more.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, no, it's, it's cool I'm. I live kind of on the south side of the spring, so the incline's not uh, it's a little further north than me, it's more towards manitou, but, um, every time I get up there I love it, it's.
Speaker 1:It's such a good challenge and it always humbles you and it's tough I was just curious to see, like and we can edit this out if, depending on what answer you want to give or not, I was just curious to see, like, what your take was now that there's like such a big reservation system and it's, I mean, they let everybody on, basically Like, if you ask, they'll basically let you on. But it's just interesting to me that now we've moved to a permanent reservation system.
Speaker 2:So I, yeah, I have, I have thoughts on it and I think you know because, because I studied environmental science in college and we had a lot of these like uh, land use discussions Um, I don't know if I'm the most qualified person to talk about it, but I do have some opinions and I think, um, anytime you have a very popular uh asset or amenity, um, controlling its use and putting some sort of um of safeguards in place are typically a good thing for the future and a good thing for long-term use. But obviously that upsets. You know different communities in different ways and you know the people that have been living in Manitou for 40 years and never had to worry one time about a permit. Now they have to do a permit Like they're probably going to be disgruntled about it. But I just think about generations ahead of us and if we want these things to stay beautiful, then there needs to be some sort of policies and plans in place.
Speaker 1:The reason I was just so curious was this past Sunday I ran up there and it's spring break, obviously in Colorado. Do the amount of trash I picked up on the trail at a bar on like lower bars. It's like man like yeah, so sad.
Speaker 2:Every time I run gold camp. So that's, that's like my area. I run over in North shine Canyon. Uh, every time I run gold camp I try to run with a pack or something with pockets, because there's so many like beer cans and cigarette cartridges, whatever.
Speaker 1:Like little, just crap I love the environmental discussion and and that's something that like really is very deep and like really means a lot to me as a as a someone I grew up in south florida and you know land use, mostly ocean access and ocean use is like a really big thing.
Speaker 1:Um, you know, like we have a lot of pollution is a very big problem there, specifically water usage. What happens is we get um tons and tons, millions of gallons basically of this polluted water from lake okachobee comes out and they'll basically pump it out to either coast and it just creates these harmful algae blooms and and it just kills the secret. It's, it's a whole mess. Yeah, but I'm going to pivot off that. I don't want to depress anybody here. But let's talk about your bright future.
Speaker 2:That's right.
Speaker 1:Let's talk about your 2024 season. Yeah, dude, so you just had amazing race last week. What?
Speaker 2:did you run in Moab? I ran a 50 K out in Moab. Mad Moose event put on the Behind the Rocks 50K. That was their final installation of the Triple Crown Championship of Moab. I guess you would call it Okay, something Mad Moose has been doing for a while. They've had this Triple Crown in place, but this year they really put up a bunch of funds for athletes to win. Um. They had, you know, I think it was like twenty thousand dollars split between the male and female winners that's amazing, that's serious prize money, ton of money, holy shit so you know, just being close with the ricks family and just, uh, knowing mad moose, I was like I'd love to participate.
Speaker 2:I didn't get to do all three out of four events so I wasn't in to do all three out of four events, so I wasn't in contention for that final championship. Um, but it was some good early season racing and to, uh, you know, to line up with some some awesome guys and gals out there to tell yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I was on your ultra sign up. I was looking at some stuff I saw I was peeking around.
Speaker 2:Peeking around, if you know where to look.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so really excited. Obviously, I see you're signed up for Ram party. It's a cool little grassroots air Viper race they put on. I ran it last year, dude people showed up, it was. I mean, I made some friends there. It was a nice little race.
Speaker 2:That's the goal.
Speaker 1:Are you doing Saturday or Sunday? What?
Speaker 2:are you doing? I have. So I'm finishing up like work for my master's program for education and I have a. I have a class that Saturday it's like sometime in May but I'm doing the Sunday race 30, 33 K. It'll be a fun little distance.
Speaker 1:I like how they change it. Like the Saturday races are different than the Sunday races in the sense where it's like a completely different course.
Speaker 2:like near Rampart. It's like the festival.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's dope. The other one I was really excited about, just because I just know that it's part of the golden trail series for the summer, is going to be the Y East trail fast and you're doing, are you doing the 28 K which, yeah, the 28 K.
Speaker 2:I think that's part of the golden trail series, north America. So I don't know if it's World Series quality, you know like that next World Series level whatever, but it's so sick out there, like the course is just beautiful and if you've ever been to Oregon you know that's where you want to be running, so that's going to be really special.
Speaker 1:I know you've done a few races in Oregon Like what's your. Is it your wife's family that's from there?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so they're out there and uh, yeah, we spend a lot of time out there and visit them and, um, I love to run out there, it's, just it's very different than colorado yeah, yeah, I went out.
Speaker 1:I did, uh, the lewitt trail a few years ago. I was gonna do the volcanic 50k, decided against it because I wound up getting covet and instead I already had flights booked and everything. So I was like, all right, I'm just going to go do a different day and run around the run around the volcano. And it was it was cool, it was uh, it is so different, it's so pretty.
Speaker 2:Yeah, um, my first time going out there. You know, I'm used to Colorado. You can just kind of like go up the 14 years and, like you, all you need is like a pair of shoes and maybe a raincoat, um, and I tried to do that on like mount hood and, uh, you know, I didn't realize there's a whole glacier on top, and then you need like ice axes and pickaxes. You know all this crazy gear and I was, uh, I was very humbled by, like you know, it's a, it's lower altitude, like it's only 10 000 feet, but, um, it's way more technical and way more like, uh, of an alpinist, uh, you know specialty I'm excited for that race.
Speaker 1:I actually had that on my list for last year and didn't wind up, didn't come to fruition.
Speaker 2:Are you going this year?
Speaker 1:no, this year I've got. This year I'm sticking to like one thing I'm gonna just do all the cirque series races, except for snowbird, unfortunately. Um, but yeah, I'm just gonna do all those races, stick with it. Maybe next year that's cool.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'll try to get some stuff in there. Uh, was it? Who's the guy that puts on cirque scuri? Julian, julian car yeah, have you seen his videos of him like hawking himself off 150 foot cliffs? He's a psycho dude.
Speaker 1:I don't even understand it. It's like a free fall dude I, I don't know, and then like what that can, what that does to your back and your muscles.
Speaker 2:I'm just like why he's a guru. Whatever he's doing for his like stretch routine, it's gotta be for real, patented I really, you know, I really like.
Speaker 1:I mean, I don't really like what he's doing with the ski.
Speaker 2:I mean, listen, I mean that's, that's I'm just like terrified with what he's doing with the skis. You don't want to go jump off cliffs like I'm all for.
Speaker 1:You're like doing crazy technical shit, but like that's on another level. But what he did, I don't know. I really admire I was just talking, I, I have this conversation literally everybody that comes on the pod just because I'm just so excited for those races and just so psyched about what they do, and it's it like sub-ultra mountain running. It is sub-ultra mountain running but it's like its own little removed thing. It's very different. It's like it's almost got like a ski culture attached to it. You're really attracting athletes from Nordic skiing, from back countries. You're really attracting athletes from all over the world and all different types of modalities if you will.
Speaker 2:I think it draws a really cool crowd. Yeah, Uh, one of the one of the best parts about those races is they're only like seven miles.
Speaker 2:So when you look, it's like, oh, it's only seven miles, but there's 3000 feet of gain and loss, you know there's a lot of people that signed up for those that I think, um, they're in over their heads and that's such a fun experience to be in a place where you're like I don't know if I can finish this thing. Um, you know, most people come out on the other side and they're like that was awesome. When can I go again?
Speaker 1:And it provides. It's like an interesting inflection point Cause it's an entry point for the rate for for the sport, cause I feel like we get a lot of people in with those like low uh mileage level races, right, but, like you said, then you're on top of a damn mountain and you're like, oh my god, there's a lot of exposure here and what's this technical? How am I going to perform in this technical downhill like the alaska race just has me my mind blown uh, mount marathon one.
Speaker 1:Uh, it's it's like mount marathon it's it's called aliaska is like their area. Dude, mount marathon's on my list too.
Speaker 2:I want to do that race before I didn't realize, series had one in alieska oh yeah, check it out, it's dude that one's.
Speaker 1:That's like 4 000 feet of vert it's like no joke. That's a lot for six and a half miles that's so much.
Speaker 2:What the hell?
Speaker 1:um, yeah, it's definitely those races. That race in particular is a hiker, a hiker's game. You know, if you're a good hiker, I feel like you could well there, if you're just good at turnover and running, it's going to be a long day, I think, in a lot of ways.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that would be hard for me. I was going to say you're a great runner.
Speaker 1:The only thing I'm good at is hiking Dude, so I can't believe we've been talking for almost over an hour now. I really want to dive into a few more specific questions. One of the things I loved is like you had brought some things to me to talk about which people don't normally do. Um, and if you want to dive into those, I know one of them was like you know what's your, why, what drives you, and we can get into more um of what the stuff you had brought to me, but let's let's get into that the meat and bones.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think, uh, that is something like when I first started running, like I was like 12, right, and I started running because I was good at it. Like when I was 12 years old, I was like fast and it felt good to be fast and, you know, be good at something, because I, like wasn't a good football player. I wasn't a good, you know, I wasn't good at math, I was kind of mediocre at a lot of things. But once I found running, I was like, oh, wow, I'm like naturally pretty good at this. Um, I'd never really had a why, though. Like, if you asked me, why do you run? Um, I don't think I would have known like a solid answer until I was at least like 23,. Even even like during college, I was just like, I don't know, I just like to run fast. Like, um, I'm pretty sure I said that in my Adidas interview I was just like, why, why you and I was, I don't know, I'm fat, like you know. Just like, I just don't think I contemplated it much. But now I think like the reason why I run is because it's like I have I.
Speaker 2:For me, it's like a celebration of life, like I have a healthy body. I have, you know this, this passion for the outdoors, and they meet in the perfect place of like being able to, you know, enjoy life and be happy, of like fulfilling, you know, the desires I have to to work towards goals, and then I also have, you know it's, I'm lucky to be able to do these things and if, I guess, if you're not, um, as lucky to be able to do these things like you're, you know you find other ways to make meaning for yourself. But for me, this is where I find a lot of meaning and find a lot of joy. So my why? Is just because you know it fulfills me, it just it just fills me up, dude, I love it Every time. Every time I go out for a run, I feel better after.
Speaker 1:It's so good for your mental health and it's and you run it too like you don't realize what you have until you you lose it in a lot of ways. This year I went through like a really strange injury and like I've talked about it in prior podcasts, but like it was balance related fucking wild dude. And every day I was left like, oh my god, is this gonna stick with me for the rest of my life, like am I gonna have this for a long time, and like it made me just genuinely realize how lucky I was and how much I missed I, how much I would miss not having this every day. And it's like being fast and like running hard and like doing those things is awesome and training really hard is awesome and I think the thing, just the best part about it, is just being able to move your body in the outdoors and being healthy while doing it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. There's been some people around me that uh, lose that ability or they lose that like freedom of you know their health, and when you don't have that opportunity and it's taken from you, it's uh, it's a lot harder. But you know, if you're just choosing, like in college, I just chose to be lazy, you know if you're, if you're not, if it's not a choice and it's taken from you, then it's like it's way more difficult. So it's fair.
Speaker 1:Gotta be grateful while it's here have you had any like crazy injuries? One of the things I noticed about you is you're like really good at like noticing if you're overtraining a little bit and like taking time off, um, and like pulling back the reins. I, I, I don't see a lot of people that mature.
Speaker 2:I take it took a long time. So in college I had one major injury I got a stress fracture in my third metatarsal on my left foot just from wearing. I basically wore a pair of Adidas Bostons, like eights, for like 80 miles a week on concrete during the winter and we were just like hammering workouts every day Not every day, but, like you know, we were running out there me, josh, like the whole Western team and all I wore were these, like you know, old Adidas shoes and nothing to fault their you know their products. It was just that was not what they were intended for and my body couldn't keep up with that. So, yeah, I got one stress fracture in college and then, um, this past June I kind of had like a bit of an Achilles thing. Um, never fully tore, never fully had a major issue or anything like that. Just, uh, you know it's just overworked, I was just doing too much, um, so I backed off training and I basically spent a month mountain biking, okay, and uh, I fell in love with mountain biking.
Speaker 1:It's fun I love it. Oh my gosh, do you do it anymore?
Speaker 2:I still do it. Yeah, very free. Yeah, often I'm trying to convince my wife to get a new bike.
Speaker 1:Actually, I feel like it's a perfect compliment for trail running so fun. It's just you, just yeah, it's very enjoyable yeah, I, um, I've got one in the basement, but down I should say the basement, I got it in the garage and I just you know this should go ride sometimes we should, we should. You're gonna whoop my ass because I haven't.
Speaker 2:I haven't stepped on a bike and I haven't got a bike behind you and I and that's the other thing is like I'm not great at it, like you know what I mean like there's a lot of people that are like doing jumps and stuff and it's something I'm not good at, and I think that's part of the reason I love it.
Speaker 1:It's like you know what scared me.
Speaker 1:You know david norris's uh sounds familiar, he's uh, he runs for on, but like he had like a really he like crashed on a mountain bike and a couple years ago it was like last year, I think it was a couple years ago but like had like nerve damage. He had like a bunch of issues and like missed a huge chunk of the season. Um, I think he missed mount marathon because of it. So ever since I saw that like being like kind of public, I was like you know I'm I'm a wimp dude, like I anything that I even like running downhill on certain things, like blodgett, for example.
Speaker 2:I'm not gonna send it off blodgett because I don't want to break my ankle yet you know, yeah, every time I run with ace I all right bud see you at the bottom.
Speaker 1:Oh, dude, dude, same, he just drops me. Yeah, dude, his downhill skill, what the fuck?
Speaker 2:He's got no fear. I don't know what it is, yeah, I think it is just the risk factor. I'll put this out there right now. If Ace wants to do his downhill Pikes Peak, I will personally drive him up there.
Speaker 1:Oh, dude, I would do full live commentary bro, let's make it happen.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, absolutely All right, so let's dive into some more questions. Do you like who? Who inspires you? Um, that's, that's a great question. I think I have a lot of different answers for that and I could say a lot of different people. Um it, you know, I I'll keep it focused on running right now. I think, uh, someone who I met personally and kind of really just felt like was a an excellent ambassador for our sport is, uh, courtney de walter. I think she is, um, she just is humble and down to earth in a way that, uh, you know, makes it feel like you're just like hanging out with your neighbor. Like, you know, she's just cool, like she just doesn't. I don't think she's trying to be anything, she's just herself, but herself is awesome.
Speaker 1:So, like.
Speaker 2:That's, that's my inspiration of like, try, try to you know, be yourself, try to just like.
Speaker 1:Don't try to be somebody you're not.
Speaker 2:Don't try and change yourself for anything else? Yeah, I don't know. She reminds me of Dory from Finding Nemo.
Speaker 1:I see that a lot, just keep swimming.
Speaker 2:I don't know. Courtney DeWalter is definitely a big inspiration.
Speaker 1:I've never met her. I haven't. I've seen her from far but never said hi. That's her from far, but never, never said hi. Um, that's interesting and I feel like that's a lot of answer a lot of people have, like she really is just such an amazing ambassador for the sport and what she's done and like where I mean dude, she's taking things to new levels like she hasn't lost a race and I don't even know when I well and like maintaining like a a semblance of herself right, I feel like it'd be really easy for someone to like see that sort of like success and change absolutely because of it.
Speaker 1:Well, dude, and the money, I'm sure, and like I don't even know if I don't even want to go to money, but like the notoriety and the fame there's a lot that comes with it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I think you know that's a big burden to carry.
Speaker 1:No, matter who you're hanging out in leadville, colorado, like she's just keep swimming on now she is a goat, I'm gonna put her. Obviously she is, you know, the female or if not, the overall goat of vulture running in a lot of ways. Who is your sub-ultra goat?
Speaker 2:very curious to you, you sent me that question beforehand and I looked at it and I I I don't think I know enough to to to honor past generations and you know like give an answer that respects older generations, because I really know mostly like the past five or 10 years. I respect that, um, but there's no right answer. Yeah, no, I don't know. Uh, hometown hero for sure is Joe gray, like right here in Colorado Springs, just like I've trained with him a couple of times and every single time he just just puts me in the dirt. You know like it's so fun to work out with Joe gray and get your ass kicked. He's so fast.
Speaker 1:He's a good dude. Yeah, he's, and that's.
Speaker 2:that's the other thing, it's like just hanging out running with Joe.
Speaker 1:It's kind of like weird. Before I met him, obviously I knew of him and you like, we all know the aura of who Joe gray is. Then you meet him and I'm like the first time I met him was at the ultimate direction.
Speaker 2:Uh, uh, athlete summit and I was like starstruck dude and he wouldn't even I was like oh my God, like what's up dude. That's how I felt First time I met him in.
Speaker 1:Waterville Valley. My dad was like who is that? I was like that's Joe Gray, dude. The first question Rose had we're gonna get him on, he's gonna come on soon. But the first question Rose had was like are you gonna get Joe on the podcast?
Speaker 2:I was like absolutely he'd be a great guest, oh he would?
Speaker 1:he would absolutely. Yeah, dude, so I he's my goat, you know, and there's guys in the past, you know. There's plenty of people you could point to Mark. One of the people I always bring up is like Marco di Gasparri. I don't know if they had nobody.
Speaker 1:I gotta see this, all right, so one of the things this is actually partially a plug. I'm gonna be doing episodes. So you've ever heard of, you know, julian? Julian Edelman is right, uh, the football player, football player. He does these podcasts that I love, called games with names, where they talk he brings on someone who played in this game right from the past. One of the things I want to do and I'm going to start doing is more podcast episodes where we bring, where we talk about races of the past with some of those goats or some of those people that have raced that race, or no people that have raced that race, and we just talk about it like, like Joe, for instance, is he's a student of the game, he knows everybody in a lot of ways from that, so he's got stories he does. So there's a definitely. It's kind of a plug for something that we're going to be doing in the future. I'm stoked about.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Plus like.
Speaker 1:I don't know. I think from a community and a, it's important to know your history. You know it's important for for the people, especially with so many new entrants coming in every year you know, for people to know, like who these people were Cause dude. You know, 10 years down the line after Killian's retired, he's just going to be the guy who runs normal, and you know, and it's a weird thing to think about, you know.
Speaker 2:No, I to learn from people before you and make sure that those stories are shared.
Speaker 1:Big time.
Speaker 2:Big time.
Speaker 1:And like Matt Carpenter, now he's just. You know the aura of Matt Carpenter, you know, and it's weird because you walk past him in Manitou or you buy custard from the guy you would never know.
Speaker 2:So unassuming. So, unassuming, and I think that's, yeah, that's you know, a lot of people in the trail world. It's like a lot of average people you know and they're just like doing incredible, crushing, like alex nichols also here in carla springs um. Just an absolute legend.
Speaker 1:But he's, you know, you would never really know it, just by meeting the guy there's so much depth here, dude, and so many uh it's interesting so many people that got their starts here too.
Speaker 2:Uh, like anton came up from the springs, you know that's a lot of people spent some time in the springs uh, jared hazen and I forgot about jared hazen. Yeah, yeah, yeah he zach miller well, he's yeah, I think he's still here.
Speaker 1:Sometimes he's around, yeah, he's hiding behind a tree, that's right. The last time I saw him uh, it was the ascent day coming down longs ranch road I was like running behind him Like we chatted for a little bit. This is the most embarrassing thing that's ever happened to me, dude. You know, longs Ranch Road I face planted, dude, face planted behind Zach Beller.
Speaker 2:Yes, what did Zach say he?
Speaker 1:just kind of turned around and looked at me he's like you, all right, dude. And then I kept running.
Speaker 2:That's the last I saw him. What a nice guy. Oh, super nice dude.
Speaker 2:Super nice dude so what else do you want to get into man? Yeah, I think that was something that you kind of brought it up about, just storytelling, and I think that's something that's super cool that you're doing a podcast devoted to the sub ultra kind of disciplines, because I think in we were talking I was talking to someone about this recently about barclays. Barclays goes off every year and there's like a netflix documentary, there's a big youtube thing like there. Like barclays is out there in the mainstream, like people know about barclays, like if you say, oh, I'm an ultra runner, and they're like, oh, did you do barclays? Like, um, like it's it's probably the most, uh, widely discussed ultra trail event. I don't know and I could be wrong, but no, I, I would agree what I think the reason for that is, like, the reason it's so popular is because of all the storytelling that's happened around that event and there's been so many good, uh, you know, writers, uh, videographers, creators that have gone there and shared that story, um, and really gotten that like you know why?
Speaker 2:Why is this place special? Why is this event special? Uh, they've, they've told that story enough times to where it's gotten out in the community. I don't think that's happened enough in the sub-ultra distance to really, you know, to get its like. There's so many cool stories happening in the sub-ultra world but, like, if these stories aren't being told, who's going to care? Agreed?
Speaker 1:Agreed and I think a lot of the ones that have been told are ones more performance, less about the people.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know the people behind it. You know you could take so many people, for example, like um I just listened to. Uh, tabor was on free trail, yeah, and one of the questions that um Dylan had asked Tabor was like someone like Sophia Lockley, like, can you just like personify that, like what she is doing as a skier and as a as a runner at the same time and then being so dominant in both, and it's like such a rarity. But you know, you just see the person for their generally, you know what's what's looked at is the person for their performance, not the person. Just that's actually like who is that person? You know?
Speaker 2:what I'm saying I completely understand. I think it's really easy to have those like a conversation starter is like oh, you won UTMB, or oh, you did this or that. Like, your finishes are the conversation starter, which is great. I think it opens the door for a lot of new interests and people to want to listen, because it's like, oh, if you're the winner, like you must have some interesting insights. But there's a lot of people in the entire field that have such good stories and, like you know, like I met, when I met, when I I think I did pike's peak, uh, I met probably like a dozen people that are like, oh, this is my 10th time doing it, this is my 20th time doing it. They're, you know, it's just like it's generational, it's just such a big community out there and I think, like, the more that those types of stories are told, uh, the better. Like it's great to talk to the winners, but let's talk to some of the people that are just like I don't know like staples of the community.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I agree, and that's so, to piggyback on that, like like with the pod, yes, we do interviews with, like professional athletes. We do interviews with those Like I think the biggest thing that had me the most excited wasn't even necessarily a conversation with the pros and peers, it's more so the conversation with those that are like making it and in the process of making it. And yeah, and the community voices the community as well. But the thing that like really stoked my enthusiasm was like seeing these killers like yourself, like ace, like nick tusa, who I had before, jacob scrabba and all these more people than I'm going to have on, and just getting to talk to you guys about where you came from and where you're going and where you plan to go, and to see you guys in the process of like making it and and you're all going to get there. It's going to click, you know.
Speaker 1:It's just a matter of watching that happen and to kind of capture that lightning in a bottle in conversation form before it does. To me is is, you know, and getting to meet all you all and and like your energy excites me. Like I told you, dude, I'm an old man 33, you know, like that that gets me excited to go to go train harder and push myself and and perform at races. You know, um, yeah, I love that. And then, yes, the the voices of the community, I think, are what grounds it in a lot of ways. You know, not everybody's going to be running up front, not everybody's going to be running in the middle pack. You know we have to tell the stories of the people that are like making a difference in other ways. You know.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And, and that's.
Speaker 2:I yeah, and I think we can cater to your audiences.
Speaker 1:a hundred percent, but I think you're doing a great job. Oh dude, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 2:Thank you for coming questions that I ask everybody. The first one is what is your take on bigfoot? Oh my gosh, bigfoot is so real. Uh, there are. I think it's a. There's a genre of like things out in the world called cryptics. Is that cryptic? Cryptids cryptids yeah, I, I love that rabbit hole. I, I think it's so interesting. Uh, yeah, I'm a man of science, right, I teach science, uh, to middle schoolers, but I still believe in, like aliens. I believe in bigfoot, oh shit ness monster.
Speaker 1:Oh, dude, no loch ness is out there I love that stuff okay, I love it. I'm so happy that you're a science. You're like a science guy all right.
Speaker 2:So I have a serious, serious question, okay okay, grizzly bears in colorado.
Speaker 1:still, what's your take, dude? What do you think? You think Is this like a? This is like a serious thing. This is like an underground thing going on right now.
Speaker 2:Is it like sightings?
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, oh, wow so there's been notable sightings on Independence Pass. There's notable sightings every year in the San Juans. One of Rogan's friends, adam Greentree, got a really damn good photo of like a very large cinnamon phased bear. Wow, um, you couldn't tell that like a hump on it, but like, or you couldn't obviously see the head. But to me like that makes the woods a little more wild.
Speaker 2:Yeah I mean, you know, I, I love, I love the idea of it, because it's like if they're there, it only adds value to the ecosystem and it like it's like oh hell, yeah, there's grizzly bears in colorado. You know, like I love that, like there should be grizzly bears in Colorado, okay, but I don't know, if there's not, then those are some really big black bears.
Speaker 1:I agree, I agree, yeah, I just I don't know. I read this like amazing book called ghost grizzly. Ghost grizzlies Check it out.
Speaker 2:It was written by some like random guy in the 90s very um, but yeah, it's like a common common I oh my gosh dude I listened to a podcast and I watched this documentary about. There was someone in the 90s that was like big on the grizzly bears in alaska okay I don't know his name and I can't remember it, but he went up to alaska and like filmed all his own stuff. It was very like steve irwin kind of thing, okay, but with bears and uh it's like grizzly man.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, that's it. Oh shit, dude, grizzly man.
Speaker 2:Spoiler alert uh, he dies, but I'm not gonna tell you how. But it's pretty brutal yeah but yeah, no, I, I love the bears okay yeah, grizzly man dude, that's a good, that's a good documentary.
Speaker 1:I remember finding that as like a kid I was hooked.
Speaker 2:I watched it twice in like one day. I was like no way.
Speaker 1:Well, and the guy I think the guys was dealing with some issues.
Speaker 2:Yeah, for sure, yeah a little bit, yeah, um but yeah, on that note.
Speaker 1:Uh, oh, one last thing I wanted to talk to you about was trail team. Are you still, are you still involved with the trail team?
Speaker 2:um, I, you know, I don't know how like involved you want to say I am, but I definitely, like I talked, like I talk to Andy once a month at least. There's a trail team club. That's like people that are like associates, I guess, of the team and yeah, I'm definitely still involved in that and I talk to them monthly and we just bounce ideas off each other and plan races, plan our schedule out.
Speaker 1:Love that community. Very cool yeah.
Speaker 2:I think what Andy's doing is fantastic and uh, can't say enough good things about the trail team and uh, you know, like last year's roster of trail team athletes, Killers, dude, All of them are just killers. I can't wait to see what this year, uh, what they do.
Speaker 1:I mean, like I thought I was a talent scout because like I like look for you know, different people on the on the bubble that are like coming up, you know, like yourself and dude, I like I got to hand it to Andy like Christian Allen.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And Malik, I think is Malachi. I can't. I don't know his full name. I can never pronounce it, but God damn, he's good man, yeah, yeah, shout out to all the guys and gals that were on that team and are on that team. I'm going to have Andy on at some point.
Speaker 2:I just know how much time he spends on that and he is putting in so much work and I just want him to know that it's working out.
Speaker 1:Oh dude, it's paying off.
Speaker 2:You're seeing the fruits of your labor, because it's sick.
Speaker 1:I mean, I just listened to a podcast with Christian Allen today. Actually, I think it was a shout out to the it was Eighth Lane podcast. It's in like Salt Lake, but he was talking about yeah, he's chatting with brands and I can't wait to have him on as well. Jesus, he's a cool dude. Yeah, Dude. Is there anything you want to get into to end or you want to plug anything?
Speaker 2:to end. Or you want to plug anything. Plug your instagram, plug your social. Yeah, my instagram's just my name, b whitfield. Yeah, underscore. Uh, I actually I'm private on strava. I. I did that about a year ago. It felt like the right thing to do and I've never looked back same actually I have all my training private, it feels it's uh takes a load off, doesn't it?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I do a lot of chill stuff. I don't want anybody liking that or looking at it.
Speaker 2:It's for me, I think. If you're posting your training, that's great, but in my perspective it's my own thing. I don't feel a need to share it.
Speaker 1:I appreciate that. I appreciate that perspective, brian. I appreciate you, man, thank you for coming on. Yeah, thank you, james. You, man, thank you for coming on. Yeah, thank you, james, thank you. Yeah, man, what'd you guys think I told you brian was a cool guy and, holy shit, what a story to tell. What a cool past in the sport and what an exciting future. Before we get going, I just want to go ahead and do some plugs. You guys can go ahead and find Brian on Instagram. That's going to be at B Whitfield underscore. So B, w, h, I, t, f, I, e, l, d underscore. Go ahead and look him up, give him a follow um and reach out to him, send him a message, let him know what you thought about the episode and, uh, let him know if you're a fan. Well, guys, thanks so much for tuning in until the next one. Uh, I'm your host, james Lariello, and this is the Steep Stuff Podcast. Thank you.