The Steep Stuff Podcast
Welcome to the Steep Stuff Podcast, your source for all things Sub-Ultra Mountain Running
The Steep Stuff Podcast
#106 - Steve White
Steve White brings a refreshing perspective to mountain sports as both the West Coast Race Director for the Cirque Series and an accomplished athlete in his own right. Through our conversation, Steve offers a glimpse behind the curtain of what it takes to create memorable race experiences while maintaining his personal connection to mountains and movement.
What sets Steve apart is his approach to adventure – less concerned with structure or external validation and more focused on inspiration and meaningful experiences. He describes finding running in his twenties not as a competitive pursuit but as a way to move his body and connect with nature. This philosophy has carried through to his current approach of pursuing what excites him rather than adhering to rigid training plans.
The highlight of our conversation revolves around an extraordinary human-powered adventure Steve undertook last summer. Linking three significant peaks – Gannet Peak, Granite Peak, and the Grand Teton – entirely by bike and foot, this journey exemplified the self-sufficient spirit he admires in mountain runners like Anton Krupicka and Kyle Richardson. Along the way, Steve experienced a rare face-to-face encounter with a wolverine, one of only three documented in the Wind River Range at that time – a moment of pure wilderness connection that transcended athletic achievement.
Throughout our discussion, Steve champions what he calls the "quiet crushers" – those who accomplish incredible feats without broadcasting them. In a social media age where adventures are often performed for an audience, his celebration of personal experience over external validation offers a compelling counterbalance to outdoor culture's sometimes relentless self-promotion.
Whether you're looking to understand the inner workings of mountain race directing, seeking inspiration for your next human-powered adventure, or simply wanting to reconnect with the pure joy of moving through mountains, Steve's story reminds us why we venture into wild places – not for recognition, but for the depth of experience and connection they provide.
Follow James on IG - @jameslauriello
Follow the Steep Stuff Podcast on IG - @steepstuff_pod
Use code steepstuffpod for 25% off your cart at UltimateDirection.com!
What is up, fam? Welcome back to the Steep Stuff Podcast. I'm your host, james Lauriello, and I'm so excited to bring you guys an episode today with none other than Mr Steve White Steve and I. I first got to meet Steve doing the Killington course preview ahead of the Cirque Series race and Steve left a lasting impression on me and he's someone I was definitely excited to have a conversation with on the podcast. He just brings a lot to the sport.
Speaker 1:For those of you who have ever raced a Cirque series race over the last few years, it's Steve has played varying roles in bringing these races to life. This year he has a new job of being the West Coast race director. So if you race Snowbird the Snowbird Cirque series last week, you would have interacted with Steve as he was the race director of that race. On top of that, steve has played a pivotal role in these races for the last few years and he's an amazing athlete in his own right. He's had some great finishes, both at Cirque Series Killinton and Cirque Series Canon just a few weeks prior, and he's also an avid bike packer and just does what inspires him in the mountains. He's a very inspiring person. Like I said, definitely someone I was really excited to have a conversation with, as he brings a unique and refreshing perspective to the, to the sport in its own right. One of the things we do get into that I really enjoyed was this amazing bike packing adventure that he did linking up Gannett Granite and the Grand Teton last year, which was a fun conversation to talk about. So, yeah, I hope you guys enjoy this one. It is a personal favorite of mine. Like I said, steve is an important person in our sport and someone behind the scenes that makes a lot of things happen, so it's amazing to get his perspective and hear his story.
Speaker 1:So, without further ado, mr Steve White, it's time. Ladies and gentlemen, we are live. Steve White. Welcome to the Steep Stuff Podcast. How's it going, buddy?
Speaker 2:Good, super good. Thanks for having me, james oh dude, it's my pleasure.
Speaker 1:I had a great conversation with you running around the Killington course the day before Cirque Series. Killington and after that, you know, kind of left a lasting impression on me and I was like man, we got to get Steve on the pod, so happy to have a pod and happy to have a chat with you, dude.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely Happy to be here. How's your day going so far? How's your? How's your day going so far? Pretty good, yeah. So woke up, got a nice little, uh, did an actual time trial and uh, some on a on a local mountain over here, which was a blast. And then, uh, just off to the office for a solid day of work.
Speaker 1:So very nice, very nice. Um, all right, let's get into it. Let's maybe, maybe for the audience that might not be familiar with Steve White like, maybe give a background, we can talk. You have a cool role right, so, like you, you obviously work with the Cirque series, but you're also an athlete, and a respectable athlete in your own right. Maybe we could talk about both those things, talk about your involvement with the Cirque series, and then we can get into your background as an athlete as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah for sure. So I grew up here in Salt Lake. That's where I currently reside. I've moved around a little bit since growing up here. I spent my college years in Logan, which is just a stone's throw away from here in northern Utah. But yeah, I actually don't have a super storied or historic background with running. I kind of found it in my early 20s after growing up playing traditional team sports soccer, uh but was craving something to do, uh, to push my body, uh, maybe not necessarily in a hard way, but just to get out and move. So, anyways, I came to running through that way.
Speaker 2:But currently I'm working as the race director for Cirque Series. I've been working with Cirque Series for just a little over a year now. Last year was my first full season with them. My role has changed a little bit since last year a little more involved this year, a little more involved this year, currently working as the uh race director for our West coast series. Um, so we have another race director. Tom Hooper, who I'm sure most people are familiar with, is, uh, our race director for the East coast and, uh, lame.
Speaker 2:I'm just kidding, yeah, lame guy and uh lame, I'm just kidding, yeah, lame guy, yeah, he, he's, uh, he's well known uh for better, for worse, I guess.
Speaker 1:Right, usually for worse.
Speaker 2:Shout out tom, we love you, tom yeah, but anyways, yeah, that's a little bit about me. Um, I'm stoked to be involved with Cirque Series. It's been a blast ever since I started working with them and I feel like I've kind of stumbled my way into the position that I am in now. Try to be involved in community, whether that's trail running, mountain running, whatever. Um, but, yeah, super grateful to be here at this point.
Speaker 1:So no, I love it, man, I love it. Let's, we can get into it now. So, like I said, like running some of the races obviously we're West coast race director. If you will Can, maybe let's talk about it. I think I need to understand this just better. You know, I don't think a lot of the audience or people understand like outside, like what it's like to put on a race and be able to organize some of these races across the country. Especially now a Cirque series is one of the fastest growing and is, in my opinion, the best series in the country, if not the world. Like, what does it like to put on some of these races? Like, how has that kind of changed for you as you start to understand, like, how these things work?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, first of all, thank you. Uh, we're, we're proud of the product that we have. Um, cirque series is is pretty incredible. Uh, what is it like? Uh hectic, uh busy.
Speaker 2:Um, it requires a lot of organization, a lot of forethought, a lot of planning. I mean, yeah, at this stage we have a lot of races that are established and we've been doing them for more than 10 years. This is our 10-year anniversary for several of our events Snowbird, alta but that doesn't mean that there's not a lot of planning still. But, uh, that doesn't mean that there's not a lot of planning still. Um, planning begins as soon as the race ends, uh, conducting a thorough debrief to make sure we have notes for next season. How does that improve? Um, but, uh, I mean, it's a blast, like I.
Speaker 2:So we just did snowbird this past weekend and, uh, to be honest, I got emotional. I mean, this is like this was my first race and in this role as race director, um, and uh, yeah, I got emotional, like being there, seeing my friends uh across the finish line, um having like the experience, being able to experience, um with them, the joy of the event and knowing that, like all of the hard work that I put in. That's it's not necessarily visible, and not that I care that it's visible and I don't care at all but like it's nice, it's so nice just to see people happy and enjoying themselves and uh, and feeling fulfilled as they cross the finish line. Uh, whether that's people in the front of the pack, mid pack or or back of the pack, it's, it's pretty special.
Speaker 1:It's do I mean? I honestly couldn't think of a cooler job, in my opinion, Like I don't know like.
Speaker 1:I don't know. Obviously, we both love the mountains and just like the ability to put on an event like that, and that's the thing. Like I got a chance to race Killington a few weeks back with you and dude I there's just something so special about the racing series Like it's not, it's just different from the sport, like we've all raced other other races outside of the sport or outside of like Cirque, but it's. It's something special about just the atmosphere. The pressure is not really there, it's fun, it's. It's a relaxed atmosphere, everybody has a good time and you're left fulfilled, having just challenged yourself on a very difficult course. Like there's no easy courses, they're all, they're all, they're all kick your ass, um. So yeah, I just got to give you guys your your kudos for that, um that's the cool thing, I feel like.
Speaker 2:I mean, it doesn't really matter what type of athlete athlete you, it's going to be challenging, whether your goal is to run wicked fast or just to finish the damn thing, it's going to be hard. So I think that's pretty cool, in my opinion, and that's I mean, that's not necessarily unique to Cirque series. I think you can get that in a lot of other races, but I think it's awesome. I think it's really cool.
Speaker 1:Let me ask you this what do you think the secret? I mean, obviously, like I've had Julian on the pod before and he's an amazing person to chat with, he's an amazing human. But what would you, what do you think? Like now, working for the organization and being on the inside, like there's a secret sauce there, like something's working really well and I think it really resonates, because you guys obviously always have, you know, people sign up, people are having a great time, there's a lot of engagement on social media. Like what do you think the secret sauce is for?
Speaker 2:like the series I think that's it. I think it's well, I don't know. I guess there's multiple things, but one, yeah, the engagement. So julian has always been very engaged with the people that come to his races. Um, and I think people appreciate that having a race director that's involved, that gets to know people by name, wants to know their backstory, wants to know where they're coming from, why they're participating in his event, and then just talking to them about things that he can do to improve the event, um, I think he's done a really good job of that.
Speaker 2:Um, I also think our courses are pretty spectacular. Uh, granted, they're all at ski resorts, but every ski resort is pretty magnificent. Um, I mean, it's pretty rad. Our courses are really cool. Um, yeah, the races that we had on the east coast at cannon pretty, pretty badass. Uh, kinsman ridge that trail is just incredibly technical, really cool. It almost feels like you're running on a ridge but you're in in trees. Um, that's how I describe it at least. It's really cool. And then everything we have here on the west coast, which is so drastically different than everything on the east coast not to say that one's better or worse, but just spectacular views Uh, and it's straightforward Just go up and then go down.
Speaker 1:It's pretty rad, unless it's Killington and it's go up and go down and go back up again In my case die on the grassy Hill and then come back to life. You know it's, it's, uh, it's good times, good times all around, times all around. Yeah, what did you think of that? Oh, dude, it was awesome it was awesome.
Speaker 1:I you know I was like it was like a blessing and a curse, like I was so stoked to have known, like, obviously, coming back from an injury, I was like I'm gonna be very smart about this race. I'm not gonna blow up right and sure as shit at the 10k mark, I absolutely imploded and I was like at one point, dude, I went to the second aid station trying to quit. I was, and they like wouldn't let me, they're like dude no just finish and I was like okay okay, I'll finish and I'm on, you know, the last climb, the last grassy 40.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, evergreen needles uh, yeah, I'm like laying on it, like trying to like straighten my legs from cramping and like these kind humans are like handing me gels, like as they pass by dead corpse, like it was. It was funny, dude, it was a good time. And then obviously, once it's over, then you know it's exciting and we all have beers and enjoy it and chat about the experience and, yeah, it's just a great time. Man, everybody, nobody's there having a bad day, everybody's there having having the blast. And yeah, how about that bear? That bear was pretty sweet hanging out pretty cool.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I know it's wild. Both at canon and killington we had multiple bear bear encounters. At killington I think we saw three bears, a bunch of cubs. Same thing in canon pretty wild, that's pretty sweet. Yeah, it's like no, sorry what are you saying? Oh, I was just gonna say we don't come across bears very often here in the wasatch. Uh, I've actually only seen one bear and it was this year and I was on my bike, um, so I guess it's not very often.
Speaker 1:Yeah it's funny, dude, you would think like the east coast, like I don't know. You would like people synonymize it with um, you know, not being as wild or not being, or just being different, right, and you know west coast mountain runners go out there and it's a completely different ball game.
Speaker 1:Like sure, like we don't have altitude out there, but the humidity, the bugs, it's a whole different, like the temperature zones, like, I think, our race like when we raised Killington, it was like in the sixties but like 100% humidity within the first two miles.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, gotten pretty good, so I was like all right, like it's.
Speaker 1:It's a different game, like just a completely different uh situation, so I'm glad, I'm glad you guys expanded out there, which is pretty, pretty sweet I guess you sorry.
Speaker 2:Oh, I was gonna ask you, had you run out there much beforehand?
Speaker 1:like no no, just uh well, other than like came out a couple weeks before obviously to uh just hang out in the northeast with family, um, and I got to play a little bit in the cat skills, so I was like, all right, I'll use that as a stimulus to.
Speaker 1:I mean before that I hadn't really ran, like I only ran like two weeks leading up to the race but like, just got to explore the cat skills, do a couple of their I forget like 4,000 foot peaks, something like that, maybe 3000. I can't remember. But like they have, um, some like lower, lesser peaks down there that were kind of fun, like Hunter mountain, which is a good ski resort, and stuff like that. And I was kind of using that as a stimulus to like figure out Killington and just start to get the legs ready. And they were ready for like 10 K.
Speaker 2:And then I thought dude, I gotta say I think the East coast is uh underappreciated. I I was blown away and I I mean I was fortunate enough to stay a couple of days after our our races and do a little bit of running in the whites Um, but truly incredible. I mean like having thoughts of what do I do so that I can spend a month or two every year out here type of incredible it's. It's really cool. I thought the same thing.
Speaker 1:Man, I've been Googling races and stuff, like how do I figure out, like how to spend Cause, like that's the thing.
Speaker 1:Like I I'd love to just go and do Canon and then hang out until Killington and yeah, kind of play that game for a little bit and just see what it's all about, because the whites blew me away, like we went up going to the whites after um, because it's not that far, it's only a few hours away, and yeah I kicked myself for not going to franconia or like that area and running the canon course, because I was like, ah, that I would love to see that before next year because that looks pretty dope, so might go out early and go play on that one and see what that's all about ahead of uh, ahead of time, but yeah, different, but yeah different kind of technical, just very difficult. You know, I, I, I kind of questioned my choice in the shoes, like I was like man, maybe I should have brought my mutants with me instead of like running with the Pregeo pros. I was like I should have taken your advice on that.
Speaker 1:I was like damn.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm a big fan of that shoe. Both shoes, though, they're great.
Speaker 1:They're both great, so very capable let me ask you this I want to get into just like pre-race planning and stuff like that. So after the race is over, like do you guys automatically like start the permitting process for the following year? Like I'm just wondering, like because ski resorts are their own kind of beast. Right it's a national forest and then there's usually wilderness areas outside of that. You guys do such a good job of like figuring out the most, like the, the best and prettiest areas, if you will, for the ski roads and for just kind of creating the course. And then there's always this like amazing I don't want to say traverse, but you're always able to get off the ski road, get onto the peak and then get back on and like the way you guys are playing, these courses are just so well done. Is that difficult to do with the permitting process? Like, how does that work?
Speaker 2:Yeah it it is. Um, I actually haven't been super involved in the permitting process, um, until recently. It is complicated, but, with that being said, for a lot of these resorts we're able to obtain more than a single year permit. For some of the events that we have, we have a five-year permit, which means, kind of like, you get it done and then you don't have to really think about it for another five years and then revisit it with the forest service. I mean, you're still operating with the forest service, uh, despite it being within a ski resort. I mean, most of these ski resorts are are actually on public land. Um, so, yeah, you, there is communication, but Julian is the one who who does a lot of that work. I haven't been terribly involved, he's he's included me on some of the discussion more, just so I'm aware, um, but I, that's something that I'm hoping to get involved with, though, in the future, um, just because I think it's an important component of the job.
Speaker 1:So yeah, no super interesting. Sorry, I just I'm so curious, how does this work, how does that work? And then, like on a race day, right, like snowbird just happened, like what do you, what do you do? Like, what are you doing? Are you, like you know, checking in with personnel and volunteers? Like, obviously, like wait, what does the race directors role? Like on race day.
Speaker 2:So I have a team who works with me and an incredible team, I'll say and most of the day I'm just checking in with them and making sure that some of the assignments that they have are are being completed, checking in to see if they need help, additional help, making sure that we have volunteers where we need them to be, and then also just making sure the vendor village is is all put together, uh, but I mean like, yeah, we get there super early on race morning. Um, we have our vendors show up pretty early so that by the time racers are there, we were kind of rocking and rolling, um, but yeah, just checking runners in, uh, but as the race is rolling, it's kind of like just being on call, in a way, uh, putting out fires as they as they happen whether those are safety things that happen, on course, um, just having the ability to communicate to the right people. My, we have our safety coordinator who who does most of that communication, but in the event of an accident, it's possible that I would have some level of involvement in something like that, but I don't know. Yeah, it's just a lot of like little things.
Speaker 2:Talk about what my job is. It's like when I describe it, I feel like it sounds silly, just because there's not like, there's not like any any big thing that I do. It's just like. I mean, my to-do list is like 50, 60, 70 items long, so it's just a ton of little things that I need to make sure happen, and if any of them don't happen, then it's noticeable. Okay, it makes sense. So I just try to make sure that all those things get done, but regardless, like I said, sorry no, go ahead.
Speaker 1:I was just gonna say it was make a joke. It just sounds like you're doing more than top hooper, so you're good there.
Speaker 2:It doesn't matter yeah, no, tom is he. He does it such a good job. I I really respect tom. Um, it was awesome to be able to go and uh to, to have work with him for those east coast races and just see. You know kind of what his mentality is as a race director and um, he's incredibly efficient. He's able to do a lot with very little uh, something that I really admire. Um, I mean, yeah, it's crazy of all my jokes now.
Speaker 2:So well, yeah, well deserved. I'd say he's gonna listen to this and be like man. They're just throwing shade the whole time oh, 100, 100, dude.
Speaker 1:You know what I get shit from him. So I have to dish it back at some point in time. So it's all, it's all good. Uh, I can't, I can't sing his praises enough that I love tom. Uh, well, dude, thanks for opening up about that. I know it's difficult to try and sometimes get those things out so, out of pure curiosity, just for love of the series and love of the sport, it's just always interesting to me to learn how these roles work and what goes into making the day such a memorable one for all these athletes that are participating. So I appreciate that.
Speaker 1:I want to talk about you as an athlete man. I was really impressed. Like you know, you've had some great finishes, obviously, both at Killington and at Canon. Like you're, you're a pretty accomplished athlete in your own right. I knew you um, you know, explore the Wasatch on bike as well. I was trying to figure out some stuff about you because there's not a lot out there. So you're, you're a man of mystery. So maybe talk about, like your pursuits and like what you're into, like what you like to do as far as in the mountains.
Speaker 2:Yeah for sure. Well, thank you. I I appreciate that. I feel like I have a pretty fair bit of imposter syndrome. I don't feel like I'm anything special and as I talk to my friends like I, I don't feel like I'm at an elite level in my running. I just feel like I'm an amateur if that, and maybe I compare myself to others too much, but I just see, like, what people at the top end of the sport are capable of doing and I feel like I'm nowhere near. But, with that being said, like that's not really what. What matters to me, I guess. I mean, I do want to be fast and I want to like develop as an athlete and and be able to do things that are inspiring to me, but that's not really the reason why I came into this sport to begin with. Um, I just I just like to have fun. I don't really do any structured training.
Speaker 2:Um, it's all just kind of like you know, just from, just from messing around dude, I mean like I, I just like wake up and like if there's a certain thing that I feel inspired to go run, then I'm going to go hit it. Or I don't know, I mean, maybe at the end of the week there's something that I'm inspired to do, so I'll structure my week around being able to like actually have energy for that come the end of the week. But I don't know, I mean, at this point in time I feel like I'm inspired by, um, by technical mountains. Uh, I don't feel like I'm I'm not an alpinist, I'm not a mountaineer, um, but I do really enjoy scrambling um and uh, combining like that discipline with with running and just moving efficiently in the mountains, um, also like incredibly stoked on these human-powered efforts and uh, trying to do stuff from the door, um, as much as possible. I don't feel like I've had the bandwidth this summer to to be able to get out and do that as much, but last summer my gosh was like probably the coolest summer I I've ever had. Uh, this is like the first summer that I I feel like I've been totally healthy as well and I think, introducing the bike into training or just the things that I was doing maybe not necessarily training, but the things I was doing maybe facilitated that experience a little bit more to be able to stay healthy. I've looked up to people like Anton and Kyle, richardson and Boulder and the things that they do, and and I'm I'm very inspired by those kinds of things and want to pursue things that are similar, but with maybe my own little twist.
Speaker 2:I love that. Yeah, I love mountains, I love playing in mountains, I love being in the mountains with friends, and I love the way that mountains lead to vulnerability. I feel like they force you to be humble, but in a very good way, and when you're with other people, that humility leads to like the development of relationships that I just don't feel like I've been able to do anywhere else, um. So I mean, really that's why I like it. It's, it's fun for me to move. I love moving in mountains, I love moving, being able to move somewhat efficiently, um, and I love spending time with people that I care about.
Speaker 1:So talk about how, like the Wasatch has helped your development. Like it's obviously such an amazing training grounds, like maybe talk about that, like the wasatch has helped your development, like it's obviously such an amazing training ground.
Speaker 2:Like maybe talk about that a little bit. Yeah, for sure, um, this conversation is kind of interesting actually because I, like I mentioned at the beginning, I I actually lived in logan, uh, through my early 20s to, yeah, just a little over a year and a half ago, um, and the terrain is incredibly different and most of the time that I was living in logan, I was actually injured.
Speaker 2:I had some weird um nerve tension injury that uh would manifest itself as as uh achilles pain, and for the longest time it was almost three years. I'd like start ramping up volume again and my symptoms would come back and I'd you know, I'd get so frustrated uh and uh. Anyways, I, towards the end of my time in logan I I was able to connect with some pretty incredible people, um people that I really look up to to this day. Uh, like Cody Draper, the race director of the Bear 100. He's somebody who, like really opened his arms to me, um, because at the time I was doing all my running solo, uh, for various reasons, but uh, I wanted to find community and I found community, um, in Cody and and some of the other people in that area, but I feel like he was one of the first people to really open his arms and uh take me under his wing, which was incredible.
Speaker 2:But when I moved back to Salt Lake I I didn't have anybody here, uh, even though I grew up here, it was like a lot of my friends from high school were doing other things and uh I I mean I like I said I'm not, like I'm not an elite athlete and I think, uh, I'll be honest, I think Salt Lake can be kind of clicky, so I had a really hard time like connecting with people when I first moved here. Um, but, uh, my buddy Sam, his story is crazy, it's really crazy. He was pacing a friend at Bear and I'm involved with the Bear 100. And he recognized me. And he recognized me from the Bear, but in the Home Depot parking lot, like six months later, he recognized me from the bear, but in the home Depot parking lot, like six months later, he's like yo, dude, you're that guy from the bear. And I was like yeah, what, yeah, but what? Anyways, like him recognizing me, we started to run together and as a result of that relationship, I've been able to connect with a lot of other people here. Um, but it took a minute, it took a really long time. I was doing like all my running alone. So I guess I'm like more speaking to the community component rather than the Wasatch itself component. But like, once, once I've been able to like have people around me, I feel like running here has been a lot more enjoyable. I am somebody who runs a lot by myself, but I also really appreciate this community component.
Speaker 2:But the Wasatch dude. This place is cool. This place is really cool. There's so much to do. I feel like I really admire the people here in the Los Angeles who are creative in the ways that they train in the in like the routes that they pursue, trying to do it differently, always looking for a new way to do something that it's like somewhat established, but having their own little twist. I think it's awesome. I think it's really cool it's so interesting man.
Speaker 1:So one of the things I found very interesting as well is, like I know finn has been very vocal on on the wasatch and and you know, just the salt lake scene as well, as it's developed and grown over the last few years. Like I feel like it's one of those things like if you build it, they will come and like now there's just so many athletes in that area. Just it's kind of crazy Like it rivals Boulder rivals, the Springs rivals a lot of places in the, in the, in the country. Now, like, what do you think of that whole scene? Like, have you kind of embedded yourself with those? Do you run with those guys, or are you more kind of do your own thing?
Speaker 2:Like what's your approach on it? Like no, I mean, if people come, they come I. I don't really understand the mentality of like being gatekeepy, like no, keep it quiet. Like it's a great place and there's a reason why a lot of people are drawn to it, um, but I also don't feel the need to be outspoken about it Fair enough. So, yeah, I don't know. It is cool, though, to have so many crushers.
Speaker 1:I mean, I feel like it's raised the level.
Speaker 2:You don't have to look far to be inspired by the things that people are doing around here. But, with that being said, I feel like there's a lot of people here I I still don't know, still haven't run into. I mean, I run with a couple people that are definitely they like fall into that category of being crusher, but they're also people that I don't think many people would know about I like that dude I'm starting.
Speaker 1:The more I've been in the sport, the longer I'm starting to. I really admire and look up to the quiet crushers, the people that are just not saying anything but they're getting out and doing this crazy link-ups or these crazy things. They don't talk about it. It's just some of the things that they do. I don't know. I admire that more now. I think I appreciate that more now than I ever have in the sport, where I in the sport, I feel like a lot of people have a lot of voices and a lot of things to say and you know, sometimes it's just good to get away from all that and just just focus on the craft Right.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, for sure. No, I, I, I, I agree. I really admire the people that don't feel the need to be outspoken, to share everything that they're doing. I love when people share because I like looking at that kind of content, I like seeing what these people are doing to get after it, but at the same time, it's really cool that there's a lot of people who just don't feel the need to share For sure. I got to ask you this.
Speaker 1:This is an intriguing question but at the same time, it's really cool that there's a lot of people who just don't feel the need to share. For sure, I got to ask you this. This is an intriguing question. So Anton is someone I'm trying to get on the podcast now it's being worked on. I've had Kyle Richardson on the podcast before. He's become a friend over the time, and both guys I immensely look up to. One of the things that you kind of said something similar like I, I you know influenced by those guys, but with my own little twist. Can you, can you go into that a little bit more? I find that really interesting yeah for sure.
Speaker 2:So I mean, like, from the perspective of route development, uh, there's things that anton has done that I've tried to I don't I don't know what the right word is here, but like it's inspiring enough for me to want to do something similar. Maybe I don't have enough time, as he does, uh, to be able to do exactly what he did, or or to do it maybe in a slightly different style. I don't know. But for example, like I think it was three, four years ago now, he did his sage russian sagebrush and summits project. It was rad. Four years ago now he did his Sagebrush and Summits project. It was rad Linking up several peaks, human powered.
Speaker 2:Last summer I did something similar. I linked up Gannet, granite and the Grand by bike. There were several other summits that I was hoping to add, but it just didn't work out time-wise. I had like a little week and a half window that I could make it work to try and link together as many as I could, and that was a really cool project. And it's really cool that, like he has documented those things as well as he has, because, like it gives you a lot to think about as somebody who's doing the exact or something similar to him, I guess.
Speaker 2:Um, I remember being on my bike and just thinking about some of the things in his write-up, but also thinking about, like, how my experience and what I'm experiencing right now is is different than what he was experiencing and I can have like an original experience for myself, I guess. And, and what is my? What are my thoughts as as I'm moving through this kind of terrain, and how does that differ from somebody else has been in this position before? No, I mean like, maybe it's not all that different, maybe it is different, I, I don't know but like just the whole human powered concept, I think is it's really cool? Um and uh, I know Kyle and Anton do several of those types of things. Uh, during the year I know Kyle has spent a number of times or a bit of time in the East coast, even doing some uh like gravel summit link ups, which I think would be really cool to do um for sure I don't know.
Speaker 2:I, yeah, I, I really look up to those people, but I also, like I, I want to be my own individual and and do things that like I want to do and have my own thoughts about those experiences and um. Um, I think that also manifests itself in the things that I pursue to do here in the Wasatch. Like I, I'm very inspired by people who pursue, I mean, the world or or whatever, but I also like kind of want to try and do things in in my own little way or whatever.
Speaker 1:So I don't know oh, dude, that's a beautiful answer. I'm glad I got that out of you. The uh, the this, this granite, granite and teton link up like. Like did you I gotta ask you so much about this? Like, did you leave from salt lake and bike your ass up there? Like, where did you start? And like what, how did you do this?
Speaker 2:like talk about this yeah, so I actually didn't, just because of time, um, I, I decided to start in alpine wyoming, uh, and I I worked my way to gannett, uh, those first couple of days bike through the wyoming range, which was awesome, um, some pretty incredible gravel riding through there, and then rode to pinedale and to green river lakes area and was able to uh, to do the, uh, to do gannett, which was awesome. I, I had probably one of the coolest wildlife encounters I think I've ever had and apologies to any of my friends if they listen to this because they've probably heard this before but uh, yeah, I, I came face to face with the wolverine, like 15, 20 meters away, and we just like sat there and stared at each other, um, for a good like 10 seconds. I was like dude, what is this creature? It took me a really long time to understand what was actually happening, but it was super cool. It was directly below the glacier that you have to cross to reach the scrambling portion to gain the ridge on Gannet, but that was incredible. And to be back there all alone. Up until that point I hadn't seen anybody. I didn't see anybody until I got back onto the CDT later in that afternoon, a couple hours later, but it's pretty incredible.
Speaker 2:But anyways, yeah, from there I biked to Dubois and Thermopolis and to Red Lodge and then did Granite Peak, which was freaking cool, super cool, biked my way through yellowstone and tried not to get charged by buffaloes I was going through there. Wow, I had a buffalo bluff charge me in yellowstone on my bike, dude, I think I went through there during mating season, so they're like especially reactive. It's pretty scary. It must have liked your mustache or something. They like wanted you there. I think I went through there during mating season, so they're like especially reactive, it's pretty scary.
Speaker 1:It must've liked your mustache or something.
Speaker 2:It like wanted you there? No, I really don't know. It was funny though. So there was. There was a pickup truck that was by me and I was like yo, can I just like throw my bike in your bed for this Like short little section, because I'm not trying to get charged right or I'm not trying to get trampled right now. I just hopped on this guy's truck. He had like a cover. I just it's like the the nicest section of bike riding that I did that whole trip oh, my god, dude, I gotta go back real quick on the wolverine conversation.
Speaker 1:Like wolverines are, like you know, first team. All violence of the animal kingdom, like what. Like what was going through your head when you ran into this wolverine? Did you just, and you had to stare down with it. It looked at you, you looked at it. Who blinked first and who ran off first?
Speaker 2:dude. When I saw it I thought it was like a black lab. I was like dude, why is somebody's dog up here, like how? Where's the person? Why is their dog just roaming like it's in the middle of nowhere? Gannett is like I don't know. In my opinion, it's one of the more remote summits in uh yeah, and in the contiguous United States.
Speaker 2:It's, yeah, no matter how you get there, it's gonna take a while, but it was really cool. Uh, I feel like, well, that whole trip. So I I feel like I was really in tune with my emotions, going into that trip, um, in a way that maybe I haven't ever before and so like, and that was as a result of some life circumstances. I I had been through a divorce about a year before then. Um, and this trip was kind of like a like a celebration of of that relationship and everything that it meant to me, but also like where I am now and how grateful I am to be in the position that I am.
Speaker 2:I'm, I was in uh, to be able to pursue these things that were kind of complicated to do in the relationship that I was in. Um, so, yeah, I mean like, pursue these things that were kind of complicated to do in the relationship that I was in. So, yeah, I mean like all these things leading up to this trip led to like this sense of like emotional awareness or mindfulness, and, and that moment it was just like dude, this is this, is it? This is what this is all about. It wasn't like I don't know, it wasn't like I had a ton of thoughts, it was just like a moment of clarity, a moment of of peacefulness and and this incredible creature. I feel like I've never connected with an animal like that before and I've I've spent a lot of time hunting, uh, and not necessarily like to kill, but just like to be in in the presence of animals. Like that is is pretty incredible.
Speaker 1:That's so cool and it's very rare, like I don't think they're super, like there's not too many of those things running around which is pretty neat like they're, you have a higher probability of probably running into a grizzly than you do a wolverine, which is crazy yeah, it is crazy.
Speaker 2:I I've gone back and looked at, uh, just some stats of like some biological studies that have been performed in the wind rivers, and I think the most recent study that was done was like 2021 and at the time there was only three known wolverines in the wind rivers. Wow, I think it was two female and one male. And so, not only to like, just see, but to see it where I saw it, with these massive summits residing in this massive glaciated valley directly below this glacier Dude, it was spectacular, it really was.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's a memory you'll have for the rest of your life. That is so cool. Oh man, I've got to say I think that might beat David Hedges. I think he said he ran into a mountain lion and it's. He had to stare down with a mountain lion and it ran off, or something like that. He said it on the podcast a while ago. I think this one might be a better story man. This is. This is pretty cool.
Speaker 2:Well, thanks, no, I I felt incredibly lucky to have an encounter like that. I recognize that that's not something that a lot of people would ever have in any lifetime, so it was really cool yeah.
Speaker 1:Can you maybe talk a little bit about like some of the like I know the approach, I can't remember and forgive me for this, but like if it's Gannett or Granite, but like they're like 50k days, aren't they Like? They're pretty, like it's not easy to get to those peaks. It's not like a Colorado 14er where it's usually a 12, 13 mile day.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think Gannett is close to 40 miles. I think it's a little over 8,000 feet of climbing over the course of that. The first it's almost a half marathon, if I remember right that you're just running on the cdt and it's it's flat, it's really flat, uh. So it's gorgeous, but like there's almost no climbing in that, I want to say it's a little under a thousand feet over a half mile or a half marathon um might be closer to 12 miles, maybe 10 miles, I don know. I haven't looked at it for a while. But anyways, as soon as you step off the trail you're basically uh, I mean there's a couple of stream crossings that you have to get, that you have to take, and there's multiple ways to get there.
Speaker 2:I took tourist Creek um to get up there. It's just the name of the drainage up there, um, but yeah, you're basically in a boulder field a lot of the time and then you reach some lakes up higher and it kind of turns a little bit more like high meadow-y um a lot of people complain about like all the boulder hopping that's in that area and and there's definitely a fair bit of boulder hopping, but there's also a lot of like pretty lush meadows that you get to run through, which is pretty spectacular, um, but yeah, it's. I mean that 8 000 or whatever how much feet of climbing comes in the second half. And then there's like, uh, in I went, the goalie that you typically go up was there's still a lot of snow and I I didn't bring an ice axe or or any, like I didn't have crampons or anything like that, I was just wearing my mutants, um, but uh, um, the the snow was like ice dude it was, it was rock hard. So I ended up just like going I climbed, lookers, lookers, left of that ascent goalie and got into like some low fifth class climbing, which something that I really enjoy.
Speaker 2:Uh, in hindsight, I'm kind of glad that it was a little icy, just because it facilitated, like me thinking, oh, I should probably move over to this area and anyways, it was really enjoyable, um, and then there's a little bit more like third and fourth stuff on the on the summit ridge, but yeah, it is a ways back there. Uh, summoning ganad I I don't feel like I've ever felt more remote anywhere in the united states, in the lower 48 at least. It was pretty special and, like I said, I had like that entire day to myself. Not that I'm always looking for those days. I think there's value in seeing other people out there. I think it's cool that people are getting after stuff and I'm not like looking to have an experience where I don't see anybody. But it was really cool that day to just like have that for myself.
Speaker 1:So it's very special, yeah, like I said, like in the same thing with the Wolverine, like it's. Those are memories you'll have for the rest of your life, like it's just so, I don't know, those are, those are the days like, those are the ones that were living is like you did a lot of living that day, pretty, pretty freaking cool dude. Yeah no, it's definitely really cool so biking to the grand, running up the grand and playing that game like was that your first time up the grand and what was your takeaway on that?
Speaker 2:yeah, it was. Um, yeah, first time on the grand I was. I was actually more nervous for the Grand than I was any of those other summits, just because I was under the impression that it was way more technical than anything I would encounter. On the other two, I actually found Granite Peak to be the most technical. I did get off route and so that contributed to that, but the Grand was really cool. But the grand was. The grand was really cool, man, I it was kind of a funky morning actually, so I wasn't sure I was going to be able to summit and I was bummed because that was the last day of my trip. Was the grand?
Speaker 2:And uh, I was looking at the forecast like leading up to that day as I was biking. It's like, okay, two days before, what am I looking at? Like, am I gonna get a window? The weather looked uh, but anyways, I I just pressed on hoping that maybe a window would open up. But the night before the weather was saying that there was supposed to be snow by like 9 am on the summit and uh, what ended up happening is that storm rolled in a little early. So I got to the saddle and it was like totally socked in. I was like, damn this, this might not work today. I don't think the weather's gonna cooperate, um, but I just like kept going. I was like, if I'm just gonna like go until it doesn't make sense to go anymore, um ran into several other parties on my way up there, which was really I don't know just like chatting.
Speaker 2:You know what are you guys thinking? I ran into some people that were coming down, asked them why they decided to come down and and for me it just like it just made sense to keep going. And, um, one of the people who I ran up to up the, who I ran into up there, um, it was also his first time and he was just soloing and we ended up doing the belly crawl together, working our way. I, I think we did most of the most of OS together, actually, if I remember right, which was really cool to share that with somebody else, but also feel like I'm having my own experience at the same time, like I'm I don't know, it was really cool. But yeah, the ground was the window. Like, as soon as I got to the belly crawl, everything went away. The clouds went away, the skies cleared. I don't know what happened. But I got to the summit and it was incredible, like I, you couldn't ask for better conditions is awesome.
Speaker 2:But yeah, that was I don't know dude like the way that trip ended being able to do that, do the grand on the final day, and that was kind of planned. I wanted that to be like the culmination of of this whole thing, not that I was like trying to have a certain kind of experience or whatever, but it was like the grand. This is something I've, a summit that I've wanted to do ever since I first laid eyes on it as a kid and just have never made, made it happen and uh, finally decided this is, we're gonna go for it. And uh, yeah, it worked out. None of those summits I had done before the trip and and they were I mean, that's like part of it for me was there's three summits that I I've been inspired by for a really long time and might as well go for it. And if it works out, it works out I. If it doesn't, it doesn't, I guess, I don't know, but it was a really cool trip, definitely. Uh, one of the core things I think I've ever done in my life.
Speaker 1:So cool man. I think everybody needs to have like some sort of like soul adventure like that, where it's your, your, your completely on your own, You're figuring it out yourself, You're, you're pat, you're completely on your own, You're figuring it out yourself, You're, you're pat, you're literally. It's all human power from from place to place, and I don't know like it's. Kyle and Anton have inspired my like me as well. Like I, this year, it took me an injury to finally get on the bike and start messing around with a gravel bike and it just opened up so many doors. I was like, wow, this is like such an like. I'll never just put a bike to everything now. I'll never. I just want to bike to everything now. This is amazing and yeah, it really changes your perspective.
Speaker 1:Um, just on everything, like how you can completely transform your fitness. Um, just doing, you know bike link ups and things like that. Or biking to peaks and running up the peak and then biking. You know running down and then you know biking. I got to ask you this in between, so, like, would you give yourself time, like half a day to recover from, like, whatever long biking you were doing, or were you just like, you know like uh, or like get to one point, sleep and then wake up, do the peak and then bike to the next location. Like how were you like linking that so you're able to like kind of recover and just have some legs to be able to run these things?
Speaker 2:yeah, I, I consider bike time recovery time. Maybe that's not fair to say because like 100 miles is 100 miles, but like I just don't. I feel like my body is able to recover, even if it is a long day on the bike. Plus, like I'm just not moving that fast on the bike. I'm loaded. I got like my bike weighs I don't know, probably 70 pounds with everything that I have on there, and so it's like I'm not really pushing it. I'm trying to enjoy that experience. I, of course, I want to cover the terrain as fast as I can, but, yeah, those days in between are definitely rest days.
Speaker 2:There were a couple nights where, yeah, I went into that trip with a pad that had a hole in it sleeping pad. So, like the first five days of that trip were really miserable. I didn't sleep. I probably was sleeping like I don't know two, three hours a night and I actually called a friend who's a coach three hours a night and I actually called a friend who's a coach and it was like I didn't, like I feel fine during the day, but I feel like this is going to catch up to me at some point. I'm just not. I'm I'm not getting the sleep that I need. Unfortunately, when I went through, cody was able to buy a new pad. I had tried patching this thing and just nothing was working.
Speaker 2:Um, but, and then, like, throughout the trip, I would get a couple motels I think I stayed in two motels uh, just to like expedite that recovery a little bit. But I don't know, I mean, on the bike, you can eat a ton of food, which is great, also helping with recovery. I'd probably consume, I don don't know, four or 5,000 calories a day when I was on the bike. Um, but yeah, I I think the smallest day, the smallest day I did, was just biking from Red Lodge to East Rosebud, or sorry, west Rosebud. I did West Rosebud, but that, uh, no, east anyways, yeah, east Rosebud, uh, that that's all. That was only like a 30 mile day. Um, I had biked like 140 miles the day before, though, and I was just like, ah, might as well enjoy my day before I go up to gannett, or sorry, granite, um, but yeah, I mean there there wasn't a whole lot of, uh, of actual like days off or anything, and part of that, too, is the time I mean we had.
Speaker 2:So the way my trip started, I had just finished our Cirque Series race in Alaska. I landed like Monday morning. I had a red eye flight. I landed at 5 am, got to my house at 6 am, picked up my bike and drove to alpine and pushed off at like noon and then I finished my trip on tuesday, or was it like monday? It was on monday a week and a half later, or no? What was? What was the timeline? Anyways, I had another race that was the following, like that weekend that I had to be back for and and working.
Speaker 1:So it was a targhee, right there for targhee or no, I think our next.
Speaker 2:What was our next race? I think it was, maybe. Yeah, I think it was alta.
Speaker 2:Yeah nice so it was like the window that I had and it ended up being that I finished. So I had like planned a couple of rest days going into the trip just as a like you know, maybe I, maybe I'll want to rest or whatever, maybe I'll just want to chill somewhere. But in hindsight I kind of wish I would have tacked on a couple other summits, just because it would have been doable. Uh, I and then I. There's a couple of days that I was on the bike longer than I thought I would want to be.
Speaker 1:So so cool, so interesting man, were you eating like in insane amounts, like were you just stopping at gas stations and just grabbing like pop tarts and shit. Like where were you like where you'd eaten on that?
Speaker 2:you do a lot of chocolate milk yeah that's the stuff, man it's so good.
Speaker 2:Oh man, nothing hits like chocolate milk on a bike. Um, no, I, yeah, it was a lot of gas station food, um, and then, uh, yeah, I mean it's kind of grab and go and finger foods that I can eat while I am on the bike. I i's several Mavericks that I ran into on the way and I'm a big fan of those Maverick burritos. Pick those up. They last a long time. I don't know what they have in those things, but they're good for a while. They don't need to be refrigerated or anything. So just, yeah, I can whip one of those out after a couple hours of riding or something. Yeah, I'll whip one of those out after a couple hours of riding or something. And yeah, it's not that down, but that's the other nice thing about a bike is you're never really that far away from a gas station, which means free supply means food, that's true.
Speaker 1:That's true, that's true. Well, dude, thank you so much for breaking it down Like I really appreciate it. What a special trip. Um, I gotta ask you this this like what's obviously you have, you know, big boy job with what you do with circ series, but like what's what's next on the athlete front, like is there any races you want to try to get to this year that you'll be racing after the seat? Like after the circ series concludes, or like any bike link ups? Like what's what's kind of next for you on the athlete front?
Speaker 2:I have a blog, a couple ideas of things that I might want to do. It's just a matter of like, what the schedule will permit. Um, I think I mean I have an interesting schedule where, like, most of my winter is free but my summer is just kind of full on. Um, I mean, like looking to next year, I I'd really like to get over to Europe and do some sky racing, just to experience what that's like. I don't know if that's going to happen or not. I mean I would love to go do like Trophy Okima or Monte Rosa or some of those more storied sky races, again just to experience it. I don't expect to be competitive or anything like that, but I just I think it'd be really fun.
Speaker 2:Um, sky race things around here go, I just like, yeah, I, I just I just want to like mess around with some friends. I don't know. I have a friend who he ran like killington and uh it's kind of funny. So I missed a turn on the course that I marked, which I I don't know what happened there, but my friend also missed a turn. But we don't. We mark our courses really well at cirque series. Anybody that's around one of our races knows that um is. I don't know what happened, but where did both of us miss a turn? Dude, I don't want to talk about oh shit all right, there was people there.
Speaker 1:There was like a person standing.
Speaker 2:I do like each one well, I actually turned where I shouldn't have turned. It was just kind of like it was really foggy on the descent and I I got you.
Speaker 1:I actually looked at my watch. I know what you're talking about.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I looked at my watch, and I never look at my watch. But next thing I knew when I looked up again it was like oh, oh, I'm not seeing flags anymore.
Speaker 2:Uh, anyways, him and I, we both, we both got off course a little bit and I was like really stoked to race him and at that point we were like pretty close to each other. He, he maybe had like 60 meters on me, so what, like uh, I don't know, a 20 second gap or something like that. But um, we were, uh, we, he came back and he's like dude, we got a race. And uh, so he, he drove a route he actually just sent it to me this morning or last night and uh, the total bullshit route here in the woods. Okay, the uh, the Luke, steve and Jake showdown, I think is what's going on or something.
Speaker 2:But I don't know, man, I, I don't do a lot of racing and that's. I mean, that's kind of the fun part about my job is like it doesn't really feel like work, because that's not or like like it doesn't feel like like it it interferes with my hobby as as a trail runner or mountain runner, whatever you want to call it, because I don't race very much on my own. Um, so it's like really fun, but I don't know, racing is fun though I, I, these two races I did earlier this year were a blast, and and then I did a local race, fins race, twisted fork and got absolutely smacked. So that was a good one, which one.
Speaker 1:Did you run 15k or 30k would you raise?
Speaker 2:I did the 30k. It was bad. I had a really, I think my buddy shout out to nick tusa.
Speaker 1:Nick tusa was in that race too. Dude. Jacob grant fucking did really well. Obviously, garrett corcoran and caleb all crushed it, but like, yeah, it's interesting you watch that? Boys or can handle heat dude. I think that was the big thing. It's like it's supposed it was hot there, right it was pretty hot that day.
Speaker 2:I think it was like 90 degrees. Um, we started a little earlier, though it's probably like 75 by the time we started, but it was super hot. I felt bad for the people who did the. What was it? The 68 K or whatever? Yeah.
Speaker 1:That's a long day out, that's terrible.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh man.
Speaker 1:Well, listen, steve. I want to say dude, thank you so much for coming on for a conversation. This hour flew by. I really appreciate it. Obviously, I'll probably I'll see you, we I'll probably I'll see you, we'll be, we'll hang out at uh you're in. Alaska, right, no, I'm not going to be in Alaska.
Speaker 1:We changed the trip around I am going to be hopefully at Alta. I'm like starting a whole new training block and kind of building back up, so hopefully we'll be at a basin and then targeting crystal as well. I think crystal is going to be hopefully peak for crystal. That'd be nice and kind of figure things out along the way with alta and a basin.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, yeah, yeah, new race. Anybody listening? Come check out our crystal course. I think it's going to be pretty spectacular. I haven't actually been up there, only seen pictures, but it looks, it looks pretty special. Um, yeah, I'm, I'm really excited, should be fun. I was talking to tom yesterday, actually, because I thought that you were going to be in Alaska. Tom's going to come out to Alaska too, is he?
Speaker 2:I was joking with him I was like yo, we just got to get James to do an interview with the whole Cirque gang me, you and me, tom, julian, just get all three of us together. I got it. You know what dude? We together?
Speaker 1:I gotta you know what dude I got? We gotta figure something out for next year, maybe like doing like a round table thing, like pre-race or post-race or something like that, to talk about it and like, yeah, I think that would be a lot of fun. I've been thinking about it too, because I'm like man, like there's opportunities here. The problem is I like to race, so it's like it can't be. Obviously we can't do something like commentating during the race, but maybe something before, after, something like that. I, I don't know. We're going to figure it out for next year. Something like that would be fun. Yeah, it would be really fun. Hooper's always funny. He's got jokes for days, at least he thinks he does. Yeah, he'd be.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he's a funny guy, Funny guy Tom.
Speaker 1:Listen, man, I really appreciate the conversation. Yeah, man, I'm looking forward to seeing you again later this summer and we'll be in touch.
Speaker 2:Well, yeah, thanks, james. Really appreciate you having me on, of course, man.
Speaker 1:What did you guys think? Oh man, what a great episode. For those of you who have ever interacted with Steve, you know the kind of person he is, and just a good guy and someone that I think really represents the sport in the most positive of ways, um, and just someone just who brings a per, in my opinion, a very refreshing perspective. He does the things that gets him excited, um, and that's how he gets out and plays in the mountains, and also, on top of that, what he does in his role with the Cirque series, um, you know, these races, um, a lot of these things wouldn't be possible like this great, amazing series If it wasn't for people like Steve. Julian, um, no-transcript Guys, before we get going, I think the best way to support Steve probably would be to sign up for a Cirque series race and if you see him at the race, say hey, um, he's a little more, um, I guess you could say private on social media, so I'm sure he probably wouldn't want all that social media attention. If you are looking to follow him, you could Google his name and follow him yourself, um, but I'm not going to blow up. Blow up the man's spot on social. Um, blow up the man's spot on social. Um, but, yeah, if you are interested in interacting with them, I think the best way is say hey at a Cirque series race and support, support the group. That way. That's the best way to do it. Um, yeah, guys, hope you enjoy this one. Um, if you enjoyed this episode or any episodes prior, um, wherever you consume your podcasts, uh, please don't hesitate to give us a five-star rating and review. Um, if this brought some joy to you or you learned anything new from it, hopefully we can bring you, guys some value. Uh, going forward, um, and yeah, I hope you guys have a great rest of your week. We've got some fun things coming down the pipeline Um, some cool interactions. Um, uh, some cool race previews. Got some stuff coming out for series and all some stuff in the pipeline for speed goat. Um, you know, maybe some cool stuff in the pipeline for Speedgoat. You know, maybe some cool stuff in the future with the sub hub we're going to be working together with on some cool stuff and, yeah, all kinds of good stuff there. Have a great rest of your week, guys, and I really appreciate it. Thanks so much. Listen up, guys.
Speaker 1:The Steep Stuff podcast is brought to you by Ultimate Direction USA. Guys, I am so excited UD just dropped their new race vest six liter, and ultra vest, 12 liter into beautiful aesthetic colors. You guys got to check these new vests out. They're dynamic in ways like that you just have never seen from an ultimate direction vest Very stretchy, lots of storage, beautiful aesthetic colorways coming into, coming to you in a new, like a white and blue and an onyx and green just absolutely beautiful vests. I think these ones are just like some of the best products we've ever dropped and I'm so excited for you guys to try them out. Hop on ultimate directioncom and use code steep stuff pod Again, that's steep stuff pod for 25% off your new vest. I mean, they're already affordably priced, but 25% off is just going to make it so much more affordable for folks in an already increasingly expensive trail running environment. So hop on ultimate directioncom, get yourself a new vest, a pack or any hydration solution and let me know what you guys think. Thank you you.
