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The Steep Stuff Podcast
#152 - Coleman Cragun
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A young ultra runner with a mountain kid heart and a pro’s mindset—Coleman Cragun brings the heat. We dig into how he went from SUU walk-on to stacking top finishes at Canyons, Broken Arrow, Speedgoat, and Mammoth in his first year of ultras, and how mentorship from trail legend Hayden Hawks is shaping every decision. The honesty of their training partnership, from blunt fitness assessments to choosing the hardest race fields, has helped Coleman skip the usual trial-and-error and focus on the skills that actually win races.
Black Canyon 100K is the target, and Coleman breaks down the pillars of his prep: specificity on fast desert singletrack, back-to-back long runs, sweat testing to dial sodium and fluids, and the art of not leading when the opening miles go hot. He shares how he’ll choose between carbon and non-carbon shoes, why pacing by effort and heart rate matters when Bumble Bee changes the race, and how he structures 5,000-calorie days to stay durable in heavy blocks. The goal is simple and bold: keep the leaders in sight, stay patient, and make a real run at a golden ticket to Western States.
We also look ahead to a season that may pivot on one result. If he punches a ticket, Western States becomes the centerpiece—with OCC as the UTMB-week balance. If not, CCC offers a bigger Alpine canvas. Coleman’s excited by Sierre-Zinal for speed, by Cedar City’s high-low training ecosystem, and by the sport’s growing professionalism that could one day let him run full time. He’s coaching, refining, and choosing the hard line: race the best, learn fast, and build a name the right way.
If you’re into trail running, heat management, fueling strategy, Western States lore, or the mentor-mentee dynamic shaping the next generation, you’ll love this one. Subscribe, share it with a friend who lives for golden ticket drama, and leave a review to help more listeners find the show.
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Welcome back to the Steep Stuff Podcast. I'm your host, James L'Oriello. And today I'm so excited to welcome Coleman Craig into the show. I always love these conversations with athletes that are on their way in the sport and trying to build their name and just have all this excitement and enthusiasm. This gentleman, by the way, Coleman, is well on his way to becoming a household name in the sport over the next few years. Just in 2025 alone, he took a top five finish at the Canyons 50K, top 10 finish at the Broken Arrow 46K, which was arguably the most competitive 50K race that we've had in North America in the last decade. He also took a top 10 overall at the Speed Goat 50K and won the Mammoth Trailfest Dragon Ascent in 2025. And he's just getting started. We talked a lot about his plans for the 2026 season that included the Black Indian 100K and series and all. We talked about mentorship. Coleman is an interesting character in our sport. He is a training partner and is coached by first ballot hall of famer, Mr. Hayden Hawks, who has uh really ascended um to become one of the superstars in the sport over the last 10 years. So it was really cool getting to talk about that mentorship, that relationship, how Hayden has really guided Coleman and uh just what makes him, you know, so different and sets him aside for 2026 and beyond. Really fun conversation. I think you guys are gonna get a lot out of this one. Big big kick out of it. It's pretty freaking cool. Um, and I'm just a giant fan of Coleman's. So without further ado, Coleman Kragan, I'm gonna go. All right, Coleman Cragan, welcome to the Step's staff, to the Steep Stuff Podcast. How's it going, man?
SPEAKER_00:Going good, going good, happy to be here.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, excited to have you on, man. I feel like um, I mean, as far as like this crop of like young and upcoming, like really talented men in the sport, like you are one of them. And you you had such an amazing 2025 season. And I feel like uh um I'm really happy to have you on to talk about that and talk about plans for the future and just kind of where you're at in your running journey right now. So I really appreciate you coming on.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, for sure. Thank you very much. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, dude. Well, maybe for the audience, because this is kind of an origin story pod. Give me like the the five-minute elevator pitch on your background, like where you grew up, how you got into running, uh, your collegiate uh background in running, things like that.
SPEAKER_00:Cool, yeah. Um, I grew up in northern Utah in a small town called Perry. Um, played lots of soccer growing up. Um, most of my hobbies were just like in the mountains, skiing, mountain biking, rock climbing, doing that kind of stuff. That was like my passion for sure. But got into some running in high school, did that for a bit. And then after high school, I headed down to Southern Utah University. Um, I I didn't get a scholarship or anything like at first, just came down here for school and was out running one day and saw the the team there doing a workout, and I was behind them, could kind of hang with them. And I was like, oh, that's kind of cool. Like maybe I could be pretty good at this, you know. So start started doing some workouts, started training super hard. Um, and then I was just like, you know, like why why can't I be beyond the track team? You know, why can't I be on the cross country team? Why can't I be good enough? Um and just started training. And my mom, she actually saw like how passionate I was, and like she's always about supporting me and my goals, which is super cool. And she somehow found Hayden Hawks. And um, yeah, I had no clue who she was, or who he was, or my mom didn't either. Um, and I was like, okay, yeah, cool. He's probably a good coach, you know. Like he could help me get on the team because I knew he ran for SU. Um, so he he helped coach me um to the point where I hit all the the marks and standards I needed to hit to get on the team. Um, did that, made it to the tryout, qualified on the tryout, made it on the team and had a successful collegiate career. Super fun there. Um, and then I graduated last year, and I've always just loved the trails. Like every chance I could get in training, I'd be hitting the trails. And so, like immediately once I graduated last winter, um I just started training trails in the spring and hopped in a few races throughout the year to kind of still learn, figuring things out. Um, but yeah, I've really, really enjoyed it and gonna stick stick to it for a while.
SPEAKER_01:I mean, dude, and the success that you've had just in year one, just trying to figure it out. I mean, I mean, I can go down the line here. Uh, what do we got? We start with Desert Rats 21K. You got on the podium there, you were right behind Eli Heming. Um, Kodiak 50K, fourth, uh, Canyons 50k fourth, which is where I learned your name was at Canyons. Um, you beat some studs there. You were eighth at the Broken Arrow 46k, sixth at Speed Go. You won the Mammoth uh ascent or uh was the Dragon's Back Ascent race, and then you just had well, you're five seconds behind Hayden himself at UTMB Chiang Mai, just what, a month and a half ago. So dude, what a first year! Like that is I I mean, I I'm very surprised given that background. I mean, yeah, like yes, you didn't have any wins, but like just being how close you were, I'm very surprised there was no conversation around T-Roy or uh or even Uroy in a lot of ways, just because that was one of the best 50k runs, in my opinion. That uh probably the best beginner 50k run anyone's ever put up, in my opinion. So pretty wild.
SPEAKER_00:Thanks, thanks. Yeah. I I like definitely still still learning a lot. Um, but it's been good because Hayden's a super good mentor and he's he's had me sign up for the most competitive races. So I'm not going in racing like these super easy 50ks that like a win, no problem. Like every single race, like I'm lining up with like the best guys in the world. So like just uh be as many of them as I can has been cool, just kind of throwing right in the fire trying to trying to figure figure that out. I think that means a lot more than like winning some like local 50k type thing. So so it's been it's been good the the races uh I've been able to do this year so far.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, no, for sure. Let me ask you this what have you learned? Like what do you think uh that like because we'll talk about the race you're getting ready for uh in a little bit, but what have you learned so far that you think uh you can kind of take away from last year and start to apply in 2026?
SPEAKER_00:Um I think the big thing is taking care of yourself out on the trail, fueling and hydration and um all of that, because like in college we're in it's just so I don't know, you don't even like think about fueling or hydration or anything like that. So really taking the time to make sure you eat and you're taking in your electrolytes and you're cooling off in you know, rivers or whenever you get the opportunities just to keep your body temp down and and little things like that has made huge, huge difference. Um, because you kind of get carried away when you're in a race, not not focusing on those little things, but I've definitely learned a lot about how important that is. And especially as I bumped up the distance in the next year, I think that's gonna be very important. Um so still focusing on getting that as dialed as I can, but a little better every every race.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Interesting. All right, well, let's get into uh I think the big question I had for this entire conversation that I just find so interesting and why, like, I don't know, I just think your trajectory is going to be so like your ceiling, I think, is gonna be so high in this sport because you learn from a first pretty much first ballot Hall of Famer. I mean, Hayden Hawks is when it's all said and done, gonna go down as probably one of the best trailrunners to ever do it. And the guy has so much knowledge, he's so talented, and he's won on some of the biggest stages in the sport. What is it like just like having him as a basically a mentor? I mean, you guys also coach together, he's your coach. Um, you obviously get to train together, so he's kind of a training partner in a lot of ways. Talk about that relationship, how special that is, because it's really like it's not too many people have that ability when they come into the sport to learn from someone with so much wisdom.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, yeah, it's it's a great opportunity. It it works really, really good because we have a very, very similar background. We both ran at Southern Utah University, which means we did very similar training and and that that sort of thing. Um, and then it's super nice that we both live in Cedar City, so we can get tons and tons of runs in together. Um and we're pretty similar runners, honestly. Like we have pretty similar strengths and whatnot. So it's it's been good um because we can really push each other in in workouts. And um I'm super lucky because he's had years and years and years to you know figure things out, and I don't have to take as much time to do that. You can let me know, like, oh, I tried this, don't even do that. Like, let's focus on this, or let's let's work on this and this, and I don't know. It's just it's just been good because he just has a lot of knowledge and experience. Um and that's kind of what I need a lot, especially in ultras. Um, it's not as much just fitness. Like coming in, I thought it was just a lot of fitness, but like fitness only carries you so far. So having like a mentor like him to give me that other puzzle piece in there has been like a game changer, and probably one of the biggest reasons why I've had a good amount of success right off the gun is just because I have have him there. And then um I don't know anything really about the sport and like what the big races are and things like that. So he's really guided me and helped me get into the right big races, so I can kind of make a name for myself. Um so that that's been super, super good as well. Um, Andy's just super good, super good friend, um, very supportive. Um, always doing everything he can to help me out, which has been super awesome. I'm grateful for that.
SPEAKER_01:Um I love that. I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_00:No, it's it okay.
SPEAKER_01:Um it's interesting because like uh one of the things I I've just kind of like really admired about Hayden uh is that he's a little different from other ultra runners in the sport. Like I can remember a few years back, I can't remember, I think it was Western States, where he kind of called his shot. He's like, I have the ability to win this race and I want to win. Um and he's brutally honest about some stuff, like when it comes to that. Is he brutally honest in like training? Like, is he does he tell you like, oh dude, you're ready or dude, you're not ready? Like, how how does that relationship work? Like, I especially from a because he's also a coach, but he's also a competitor. Like he wasn't afraid to uh you know to to to do battle with you in Chiang Mai and and try to beat you, right? How did talk about that dynamic and uh kind of like the the real rawness of of that aspect of the of your relationship?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I think he's extremely extremely honest for sure. Like if I if he thinks I can win a race, he'll tell me I think you can actually win this race. If he's like, okay, these other guys, they're more fit than you right now, he'll tell me like they're more fit. Um, but he always like lets me know like it's an ultra, they may be fit, things can happen, you can still beat them. Um so it keeps my hopes up for sure, even when he knows like maybe they are more fit than me at the moment. Um, and then like competing with him. It's just, I don't know, we train so much together and push each other in workouts that it's just kind of it's just a good dynamic. Um, push each other in training, push each other in the race, you know, it just works, works good. Amazing.
SPEAKER_01:Dude, I I don't know. I find that really cool. I don't know. This is like kind of the first that we've kind of seen something like this in the sport where um I don't know, the the closest thing I I've seen is like in in tangential like other sports uh where there's really this like mentor mentee mentality and and it just works really well because you have so much talent and like there's a strong possibility like you are gonna be a big name in the sport in the next five years, and like there's a lot of opportunity there for you. So it's almost like that passing of the torch, which is kind of kind of dope. Not that Hayden's done, he's got plenty of work to do still, but uh it's very cool to kind of see that relationship. Um, so yeah, dude, let's let's shift gears a little bit. You're getting ready for the Black Canyon 100K. Um, you got to be so excited for that race. I feel like athletes generally from that from your area, like Hayden's had a lot of success there. I feel like the trails are very similar in a lot of ways. There's a lot of opportunities to get ready for a race like that. Um, maybe talk about like where you're at in your prep. I mean, I would imagine you're probably pretty far along in that block and getting ready to start. What do we got? We still got three weeks, four weeks, something like that. So you're probably still outside of your taper. But talk about where things are now and uh your excitement level for that race.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I'm I'm super stoked. It'll be my first 100K. Um but which is like kind of nerve-wracking for sure, like that's so far. But when you think about it, it's like only you know seven hours. So it's like that's not too bad when you think about it that way. Um, training's been going very, very well. It's nice because I live in southern Utah and I work down in St. George, so I can do a lot of training on the trails down there, which are very, very similar to the Black Canyon course, um, which is which is nice. You can get some specificity there with workouts and long runs and and whatnot. So that's that's nice. You can kind of escape the snow down there. Um and then we've been doing just like a whole lot of volume, lots of long runs, back-to-back long runs, that kind of thing. Um, really focusing on my strength and uh just staying healthy through this block. Um it's been pretty pretty big, which is nice. Um yeah, I feel feel pretty pretty fit. Gonna head out to the course next weekend, do a couple long runs, hopefully cover the whole course, um, get get familiar with it. And then uh yeah, I don't know. We'll we'll see, see what happens. Like, I'm pretty good at the faster stuff, so I think it's the the course is like pretty good, good for me. Um, so yeah, excited is always like just kind of bringing some big names, which is sweet. I I get super hyped about that, is lining up with like these like superstars. So that that'll be super fun. Just go out there and just crush some trails for a while.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. I mean, dude, it's an opportunity, such an opportunity for you to make, you know, to make your name. I mean, you crank one of these out of the park and that'll change your life forever, kind of thing. Like there's just such an opportunity there for you, especially with what you've done already. Um, I almost see this as well. Something uh seeing like your ability on the more runnable, faster stuff, like uh, like for instance, like Canyon's 50k. That's a relatively flat, uh, runnable, very fast 50k race, um, which you uh did amazing at. So it seems like that stuff translates very well for someone like you, and uh there's good opportunities there for success on race day. What um I know you you probably don't want to give away too much inside baseball, um, but like what are some things maybe Hayden has kind of taught you for the specific race, given the fact that he's only what a year or two years away from having won it himself?
SPEAKER_00:Um, I think the biggest thing he's kind of done with me in preparation for this one is just dialing in specificity. Um he knows exactly what the trails are like there. So he he tells me like exact trails in the area that are like very, very similar to the course and the sort of elevation gains and rocks and and things like that. So we've been able to kind of practice, I guess, um, in those scenarios, which is super helpful. Um, and and then like the the fueling and hydration. I've been doing lots of just like sweat tests and things, trying to get it exactly down, working um kind of with him, trying to get that that figured out. Um and then fitness-wise, just keeping things pretty pretty consistent, nothing nothing too too crazy with workouts and everything. Um fitness is there already. I think I just need to dial in the specificity a little bit going into it.
SPEAKER_01:What um what shoes will you wear for a course like that? Like what are you into these days? Like what are you rocking?
SPEAKER_00:I have no clue. That's why I'm going out next week. I'm gonna bring out like five or six, five or six pairs of shoes and see which one I like. It's hard. I work at a running shoe store, so I just have a ton of shoes, and I don't know, I'm trying to to decide what what I want. Because I I could go carbon, I could go like not, I don't know. It just depends. It's such a long race, so I want to make sure it's it's good.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah, it is that's the thing, man. Like, is there anything that intimidates you about a course that long? I mean, like, like you said, it's a what is it, seven-hour race, maybe a little less for the front guys? So it's not that I mean, it's still a long time. I mean, that's a slow, what is it? What is it? I think speed go uh is what a five or six hour race, something like that, maybe a little longer. So it's a long day, it's a relatively long day out. But is it are you intimidated by anything like that? Or are you uh are you ready to rock and roll? Like does that not even phase you?
SPEAKER_00:Um I'm not I'm not too nervous. Um, it's definitely scary because it's unknown. It's something I've never I don't know my body feels like running that far type thing. Um, but it also kind of excites me a little bit. Um that that's one of the reasons I love the ultra running, is just like going just a little past that, you know, and finding that line and pushing even more past that and seeing what your body can can do. That's always like super, super cool. So I'm I'm pretty excited to just go out and see what I can do over that distance. Um, but yeah, it is a little near, it's long. Like that's 60 over 60 miles that's far. But yeah, I think it'll be fun.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, no, no doubt. Are you um it's this is like a have you like conceptualized? I'm sure you've had this conversation, and we can cut this out or or move past it if it's too much inside baseball. But especially because I have a I imagine you're going to be in the lead pack with the front guys. Um, have you considered like the strategy involved? Because this is a particularly interesting race where the first 20 miles is blazing fast, dudes are running, what, sub somewhere in that six to low to high five minute pace, somewhere in that range. And then when things start to open up at Bumblebee, it gets it the race dynamic changes a little bit because it gets on like more of a single track. Um are you planning to kind of sit back and watch the race unfold in front of you? Or are you planning on like making sure you're in the mix? Like what are your thoughts as far as that goes on what you
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I think the race has a lot of extremely talented world-class athletes and they know what they're doing. Um, I don't think they're gonna do anything stupid, especially over 100k distance. Um, if they do, everyone's probably not gonna go with them because they're not all stupid, you know, they know what they're doing. Um, so I kind of trust that they'll go out at a decent pace. And if they go fast, that's one of my strengths. So I don't care. I think I think it's fine. It'll be it'll be fine with me. Um, I don't want to lead. Definitely not gonna lead just because I don't know, I'm the the newbie. Um, I'll let them kind of control the pace and and the effort. Uh but I'll I'll definitely pay attention to kind of my heart rate and see see how things are are playing out if I have to dial back a little. But I'd like to just keep the front guys in sight at all time. Um, I want the golden ticket super bad. So so we'll see see what we can do. Gotta keep that in in sight the whole time.
SPEAKER_01:So what would uh what would it mean to you win a golden ticket, dude? Like that's a that's a huge step forward in your career. Like what would that what would that mean to you to go to Western states and go go play that game?
SPEAKER_00:Oh, it would it would be so legit. It'll be sweet. Last last year I got the opportunity to pace Hiroki Kai, the Japanese guy who got 10th. Um I pace him, yeah, I paced him from the river crossing to the finish. And that was like my second time going out to watch Western States, and it was just like being in the race. I was like, okay, yeah, like I'm coming back next year. Like, I have to make it. Like, this is so sick. Um so yeah, it would be legit. If I don't get it, like that's okay. Like gustars somewhere for sure. Um, but I think I think I can.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I think you can too, dude. I'm I'm I'm excited for this. Um all right, so we already talked about strategy. We got into the race itself. Let's pivot a little bit. What else would be on your calendar for this year? I didn't see I checked ultra sign up, but I didn't really check around any other spots. Like, are you gonna do mostly ultras? Are you gonna maybe do some short stuff? Like, what are you are you gonna mix it up? What are the the plans for this year?
SPEAKER_00:Um yeah, so a lot of it's gonna depend off of Black Canyon. Um if I get the golden ticket and go to Western states, that'd be that'd be awesome. I'll do that. Um if I don't, if I do Western states, then I will do OCC. Um but if I do not do Western states, then I would do CCC. So I I'm signed up right now for CCC, um, but I'll just bump it down to OCC if if I make it into Western states just because that double would be a little better for me. Um and then I'll probably do Sierra Zenol um before that, which would be fun, yeah. And uh I don't know, I'd like to get another race in between that. Hopefully it's Western states. If not, maybe like go back to Broken Arrow or something.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. What did you think of Broken Arrow last year? Because that was a super competitive race. The 46k was probably the the probably the most competitive 50k that we've might have ever had on American soil. Like what would obviously you had a top 10 there. You're obviously capable of winning that race. What what is uh what was your takeaway of that?
SPEAKER_00:Oh, it was cool. It was a sweet race. Like it was just like everyone around you, you're like, yo, I'm running right next to this guy. Like, I don't know. It's just it felt super cool to be in that race. Um, and it definitely like was eye-opening to how insanely good people are at descending. Um, I'm really strong at climbing. So like I was hanging with everyone, no problem. Then we hit the descent, and I'm like, holy cow, like like this is crazy. Um, so that that was that's kind of where I lost it, honestly. Like, I I I was not very experienced with that sort of um course just because it's so steep, and then you just these big old bombers. Um, so that was that was crazy. Um, I kind of like the uh two lap aspect of it. It was nice to do a lap, you restock, reset, go again, you know what to expect. So that was cool. Um yeah, I'd go, I'd go back because a cool event for sure. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it's a good fit. I mean, I would definitely uh I'd like to see you go do that again. We gotta talk series and all though, dude. I'm so excited to hear you're gonna be potentially going out there to go race that this year. Um, what about that race excites you? Like, what is it about that one particularly that um I don't know, because that's my bucket list race. I gotta get over there to do it one of these years. Like, what has your uh stoke on it?
SPEAKER_00:Oh, I just say the the competition and just the hype in it. Like it's just like the the most competitive race. Like that's just that that aspect is pretty freaking sweet to just be in that. Um, and it's like kind of a cool, cool course, distance, it's just like fast, technical, steep, just everything all in one, um, which is which is pretty sweet. Um, and then Hayden says, like, it's nice because you can do that race and then go go to like any of the UTMB races, and it feels slow after. So it's kind of a good transition.
SPEAKER_01:So that's true, actually. Yeah. That's funny. Yeah, because he I mean he's had success there too. I forgot that he raced series in all a few years back. It's been a little bit, but yeah, he's done very well there. Um it's funny, you remind me of him in that way, like the versatility to be able to go up to the longer distances, but also have success in the shorter stuff. And so that's really exciting to hear that you'd like to do a golden trail series race because that I had that question prepared for you. Um, was there anything like a Zagama or series and all that kind of stuck out? So that'd be cool. Is there any I know you're going more of the ultra route and I totally understand that. Is there any potential in the future years to do maybe do more golden golden trail? Um, or maybe one a season to a season just to mix it up with uh in that type of uh environment that's a little more, I guess a lot faster. It's just a different different environment in general.
SPEAKER_00:Um yeah, I can see me hop in a couple. Like I I definitely am more passionate and stuff about like the super long distance stuff. Uh but I think it's it'd be just kind of fun. Just hop in something faster.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Yeah, yeah. No, it's uh I totally agree, man. What about the CCC courses or OCC intrigued you? Like that's uh have you been over to Shaman yet to kind of gonna see that world or what's going on over there? Because it's supposed to be amazing. It's it's insane.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I haven't been out there. Um so that that aspect is pretty sweet. Like I'm so stoked to to go out and race there. Um I think I'd I'd want to do uh CCC just because it's longer, I get experience more trail, like a longer route, get to see more things, which is cool. Um that'd be the race that I want to do the most. And then eventually UTMV, of course. Um, but I think OCC would still be pretty cool, and that would work better post-western states if I if I get in there. Um yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Yeah. Western states just make so much sense for you. Just because like the you can get down to Flagstaff to train, you've got St. George, you have just a such a big playground to play with as far as those trails to get ready for something that's just a very similar, it's a good race. Like, I think for someone that suits your strengths very well, um, and all kind of sorts, like I think that that's a really good fit for you, or would be a very good fit for you.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, for sure. People don't really think talk about Cedar City with training, but it's like one of the greatest training places ever. Like we're at 6,000 feet. Um, most of the time of the year, the trails are dry. We can get up 10,000 feet in like a single run. Like I was up at 9,500 this morning, and there wasn't even there was some snow, but not too much snow. And then I could do like a double today after work down in St. George at like 2,000 feet on like dry desert trails. Um, and then you can go out west, and like that snow melts a lot faster out there, and there's just like tons of very, very good western state sort of training type things. Um, dirt roads everywhere. And yeah, it's it's like perfect. So it's super nice living here.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, no, and I I think the two as well, the um I think the science behind it, it like really works out very well because you can sleep high and you can train high, but you can also go train low as well when you need a recovery run, and it's just less on your body because it's a lower elevation, the altitude, it's just easier, right? So you don't have to work as hard in a lot of ways, and then you can go sleep back high and uh you can get really just like totally hammer home the volume and uh kind of get best of both worlds, which is really hard to do in the mountain west. Like I live in Colorado and it's like I live at 6,000 feet, and the only opportunity for me is really go higher unless I want to drive to like Texas or like further, way further out to like eastern Colorado in the middle of nowhere. So for you to have that ability, that's really nice.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah, it's nice. Only 30 to 40 minute drive, and I'm in St. George, so that's pretty nice.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Pretty crazy, man. Um, all right, let's pivot a little bit. I want to uh talk about crewing. Like, what's the crewing strategy for this is actually a question I missed when I was talking about Black Cannon, but what's the crewing strategy for Black Cannon? You got a big crew coming out with you? Are you gonna have like Hayden with you? You're gonna have like family members out there kind of uh and get your pacers all set? Like what's the what's the plan for that?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I haven't really thought about it yet. I want to go out there next week, like I was saying, to kind of get a feel of where I want people and and things. Um, but crewing, it'll probably be probably my family, my dad mostly, um, my and my mom. Probably just them kind of see. I gotta see like what I'm gonna need. I gotta really like think about it for a minute. Um, I'm gonna get on a call with precision in the next few days to get my total nutrition and hydration bland dialed. So that'll help me a lot more to kind of get things how I want it. Um, but I should know after next week once I'm down there.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:They're dude, precision's amazing. Have you are you working with them now as far as uh like just all for your nutrition?
SPEAKER_00:Um, nothing official yet, but that's just what I've been using.
SPEAKER_01:Sweet. Yeah, I mean they're dude, they're amazing. I did their sweat tests over the summer. Um, and I used their gels and like their kind of all their stuff. It's it's that's that's my jam right there. I I do enjoy them. Um sorry. Oh yeah, yeah, they're they're great. Love it. Yeah, yeah, they're the best. Um all right, so dude, you're a free agent right now. Uh is there I mean, this is you're in an interesting part of your career where there's still a lot of opportunities and a lot of doors that are gonna potentially open for you over the next you know, year, several years. Um are you in the process of looking for a sponsor right now? Like, what does that look like for you, especially because we're kind of coming out of the free agency period and kind of into more formal where athletes are announcing their uh their sponsorship changes and stuff like that? Like, where are you at in that process?
SPEAKER_00:Uh yeah, yeah, that's that's definitely like my A goal for sure. And it has been for like the last year, is to like that's why I've been trying to get in the biggest as big of a race as I can. So that I can kind of make a name for myself and potentially sign something. Um, but yeah, just nothing, nothing yet. But that's that's okay. I think I just need to get over on the European races, you know, or CCC, LCC, do like Western states, like some bigger ones. I think that'll be the game changer there. Um, so I've had like some good results for sure, but I just don't think anything good enough yet, which is which is okay. It motivates me. I'm super hyped going into 2026. Um, just like with everything open. So see what happens for sure.
SPEAKER_01:It's an exciting time, dude. I mean, like the the world's at your fingertips. The reason I ask is because you were rocking the ACG sweater. So I was like, oh, maybe he has break breaking news here. We have something to report.
SPEAKER_00:No, I know. Just perk perked working out or running the store. Get all sorts of years. Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Oh man. So, dude, what do you like to do when you're not running or training? Like, are you uh are you still into snow sports or anything like that? Um, like what do you what do you like to do uh in your recovery time?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, um I just love love being in the mountains. I think my favorites are rock climbing, do a ton of rock climbing. Southern Utah is just loaded with good climbing. Um do a whole bunch of that with my friends and my brother. And then uh yeah, skiing. Skiing's probably one of my favorite things. Love skiing, do a whole bunch of backcountry stuff, and just get up in the mountains as much as I can. That's super fun. Um, and then yeah, just like backpacking, camping, um mountain biking's fun too. Um we got family as like a boat, love going boating, water skiing, surfing, that kind of stuff. Um, that's that's my favorite. Just any of that's good.
SPEAKER_01:So you're an outside guy then. You love that makes sense.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah. Hate being inside is terrible. Go crazy.
SPEAKER_01:No, that makes that makes sense. Do you uh like kind of uh integrate any of those like the snow sports, uh the skiing, or maybe even the mountain biking, like into your training, or is that just for fun, like fun stuff? Or have you like figured out how to uh kind of just like integrate that in as like um what's the word I'm looking for? Uh cross training.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, um a little bit. I I mainly just do it for fun. Um, but it it kind of depends. Like right now, it's just not specific to the races that I'm training for. So I like I would love to just go out and tour all day and just ski, but I need to be just like putting in time on feet and runnable runs and trails and stuff right now. And that's okay. So I'll still out go out and go skiing for sure, but it'll be more of like hitting like some cool route rather than like I'm getting the training effort in type thing. Um, so yeah, I'd say right now, just more for fun.
SPEAKER_01:I like that. I mean, dude, that I I I respect that because once you start to throw everything into the training bucket, it's like it just becomes another, unless you're like obsessed, obsessed, it just becomes like another chore. It's good to like hold uh other things that are like fun because the for the sake of them being fun, right? To get out and do something that's uh just outside of what you're normally doing. So yeah, I I respect that a lot. Um, dude, you're you're a coach in your own right. I know you're coaching now uh uh with uh Hawks Running as well. I I saw that in my research. Um talk about coaching, man. How much do you like that? And uh like that's a it's super fun to be able to coach people and to get to see them get their have their own successes. Like, how has that uh kind of worked out for you over the the last uh the time since you started doing it?
SPEAKER_00:Oh, yeah, I I enjoy it a lot. It's super satisfying. I got my degree in exercise science. Um, and then I just I'm super passionate about all that. I'm always listening to podcasts on my runs about different training methods and everything. I think it's just super cool. Um, and then the aspect of just like helping someone improve is just super, I don't know. It's just you feel so good, it's just so satisfying to see people like want to change their life, take the steps, and then just get better and better and faster or more fit or whatever goals they have set, see them accomplish those. That's that's super cool. Um, it's just reward re rewarding, definitely.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. That's super rewarding. I it's so like you said, it's so cool to see people just improve and get better and kind of reach their own individual goals. And it's a cool sport, man. What do you uh what do you think of the sport so far? Are you excited about the professionalization? Like it's now we're starting to see so many athletes uh like living full time off the sport and you know, like it's professionalized, like they can just focus on being a professional athlete. Whereas that wasn't the way uh in previous years. Um what's your take on the sport? Like, where do you want to see it go and and what has you excited about it?
SPEAKER_00:Oh yeah, that's that's super, super exciting. It's good timing for me coming into the sport because that would be like ideal. It just shows like the possibilities that like potentially I could just get to the point where I'm just running, which would be super cool because you can really focus just on that. Um, because like right now it's it's pretty hard just working like you know, a ton of hours you're just like so tired, and it's just hard to train as as hard as you know, you see Hayden and just like go on his run with me and then like you know, put his feet up, relax, recover, stretch, do his strength, all that. I'm just like, I gotta go work, you know. So it's cool. It's cool. Like seeing that like you can uh you can make it, you know. So I hope I hope it keeps keeps going going that way. Um, but at the same time, I do like just like the purity of just just trail running. Like, like some of my best runs, like are just you're just out there by yourself in the mountains and like you don't want to talk to anyone and you're just enjoying some amazing peak or or something. Um and that's where like it really comes down to why you love it. But it's cool that there's possibilities to you know be able to do do that full time, but we'll see.
SPEAKER_01:Do you um are are you like a big believer, uh, because you just kind of talked about like some of the little things that Hayden does, like with the stretching, like just all the extras that goes into being professional in the sport. Are you like one of those big people like with the the sauna, the cold plunge, the the you know, all the mobility, stretching, strength work? Like there's I don't think people realize like the amount of extra shit that goes into uh making sure you're able to bring your best self on on race day. Like, are you one of those people that are into that or are you more so just uh like you focus on other aspects of your training?
SPEAKER_00:Um I think it it just depends on um like where your needs are. Um so like Hayden, for example, where like he has all the time in the world, he can he can already focus on getting enough sleep and rest and all that. So you might as well with his extra time spend it on stretching and things like that. Or like I don't have as much time, so I just try to stick as much as I can to the basics, you know, like like eating enough food, like really make sure I'm getting enough calories in, good calories, um, staying like hydrated and then getting enough sleep. Um, so really focusing on like those things. Um and then if I do have time, then I throw in um the other stuff, you know, like I'll hit the sauna a lot or um, you know, roll out, stretch, those sort of things. Um, but if those things are gonna take away from getting enough sleep, for example, then sleep's more important. So it's it's okay to kind of skip skip out on those. Um, but you know, if you have the time, I think I think it's definitely helpful.
SPEAKER_01:For sure, for sure. Uh I just find that interesting. Like it's uh can you go in a little bit? And you this is as much as you want to go into. I'm just out of pure curiosity, like per your volume, like how much do you eat? Because I know like getting ready for a race like Black Cannon, I'm sure you're doing what, like 20 hours a week or something like that, if not more, maybe a little more, maybe a little less. So you're probably eating like gazillions of calories. Like, what does that look like for someone like you?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I I try to get 5,000 calories a day. That's kind of the goal. Um, most of it's like liquid calories. I drink like tons of milk, protein shakes, smoothies, that kind of thing. It's just easy to get. Down. Um and then just like simple things, just lots of rice, quinoa, um, just bread, stuff like that. Um just eat as much as I can. Like I'm just eating all the time. It's hard to eat enough. Um that's crazy, dude.
SPEAKER_01:I just I'd I'm just very curious. It's because like someone like the volume you're putting up for a race like that, I'm sure you gotta be eating uh eating the horse. That's crazy. Well listen, man, I I don't know. I feel like I feel like we're at like almost 40 minutes. Is there anything we didn't get to? Uh is there anything you wanna you wanna throw in there uh that I didn't cover? Anything you wanna like add extra?
SPEAKER_00:Uh no, not really, not nothing on my mind too much.
SPEAKER_01:Sweet man. Well listen, I I super appreciative, man, that you've been able to come on for a conversation. Big time rooting for you at Black Canon. Like, I cannot wait to see where your career is gonna take you. And uh definitely big things on the horizon. And uh again, I'm super appreciative of your time and wishing you the best of luck.
SPEAKER_00:Hey, thank you. Appreciate it. Thanks for having me on. Of course, man.
SPEAKER_01:Guys, what'd you think? Uh yo, if you're not a fan of Coleman's, you need to be uh putting a lot of stock in this guy, um, especially as he as he gets ready to take on Black Hannon. Do not be surprised if this gentleman comes away with a golden ticket. We are uh we're big time rooting for him and uh yeah, just super stoked that he was able to come on and and uh tell his story and have a good conversation there. Um guys, the best way to support him is to give him a follow on Instagram. You can find him at Coleman, that's C O L E M A N, underscore Kragan, that's underscore C R C R A G-U-N. Um it's gonna be linked in the show notes as well. Definitely give that a click, give him a follow. He's got all kinds of cool reels and uh exciting posts um from his um from his races and from his training. Um also good stuff there. One of the things I did miss, a result that I I forgot to say in the intro, um, was that he just actually came away in December. He raced Hayden really close. I mean, I want to say they were like five seconds or four seconds off from one another at the Chiang Mai 50K. So if there's any other reason to uh be a big supporter of this guy, it's it's how much he's uh progressing. So really cool stuff there. Um, hope you guys can all support him and give him a follow. And uh yeah, all cool stuff. Definitely someone who's gonna be a household name in the next few years. Always fun having these convos. So, guys, if you've been enjoying all the cool stuff we've been doing with the podcast, get ready because we we've got some big announcements and plans coming in the next few weeks that we're gonna be announcing, uh, including uh other podcasts, like other shows, subshows, and um yeah, like just big plans for 2026, some things I need to kind of elaborate on from the State of the Steep stuff show. If you've been enjoying what we've been doing and you haven't already, please give us a five-star rating and review on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you consume your podcast. I am uh trying to put more emphasis into growing that YouTube channel. So hit the subscribe button and give us a like over there. Um, it's still very nascent and growing, but if you want to access the podcast in 4K video, that's the way to do it. And if you want to watch my beautiful face, uh the only place you can is on YouTube. So give us a subscribe and uh listen there. If you prefer to uh just listen in the audio format, Apple and Spotify are gonna be your places. So, guys, thank you so much for the support. I love you all, and uh, we've got lots of cool stuff. Episode dropping next week with Grayson Murphy. I am so excited to have had that convo. Uh, as always, giant fan of Grayson, and um, we've got some other episodes dropping too. Mason Copi is back on the show, Camp Smith is coming on. We've got a lot of cool locked and loaded stuff for uh in the next few weeks. So uh thanks for supporting and following along with the same thing.
