"NINJA" NEIL HIGNIGHT 501 ARCHERY | Ep076 | Off The Clock with B Scott

Have you ever wondered why you can hit a bullseye one day and miss the target entirely the next? In this eye-opening conversation with Neil Hignight of 501 Archery in Hot Springs, we dive deep into the psychological aspects of archery that even experienced shooters struggle to master.

Neil's journey from barbershop owner to professional bow technician began after a neck injury forced him to reconsider his career path. What started as casual help at a local bow shop evolved into a full-time passion for helping others improve their archery skills. "I love to serve people," Neil explains. "I want to see somebody needing help because I want to help them—and it's not for my own gratification."

The conversation takes a fascinating turn when Neil reveals the concept of "target panic"—a psychological phenomenon affecting virtually all archers. With remarkable clarity, he explains how modern technology has paradoxically made some aspects of archery more challenging by disconnecting shooters from fundamental techniques. "We've forgotten the fundamentals," Neil says. "Technology's got so advanced... everybody's shooting their bow instead of letting their bow shoot."

Beyond equipment talk, Neil shares invaluable insights about the mental discipline required for archery success. His passion for teaching through the National Archery in the Schools Program (NASP) demonstrates how archery builds confidence and self-reliance in young people—qualities increasingly important in our technology-dominated world.

Whether you're a seasoned bow hunter or just curious about the sport, Neil's practical wisdom will transform how you think about archery. His memorable advice to "let your bow shoot instead of trying to shoot your bow" might just be the key to breaking through your performance plateau. Ready to overcome your target panic? Listen now and discover the mental game that separates good archers from great ones.

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Transcript

Introduction and Rattlesnake Scare

Speaker 1 0:00

It's 5 o'clock and you're off to Coggle Beast guys. Today we have as our guest Neil Hignight with 501 Archery there in Hot Springs. Now listen, we got in here and he's scared the living crap out of us with this fake rattlesnake. Y'all check this out.

Speaker 2 0:12

Oh shit.

Speaker 3 0:15

Mother God dang it.

Speaker 4 0:18

I don't doubt that shit, my man.

Speaker 2 0:21

Oh shit.

Speaker 1 0:27

Before we get into it, though's gonna tell us all about getting your bow set up, tweaking your mental game, because there's a lot to it all right, so like target, uh, problems where you get anxious and you just squeeze the trigger and you're not very accurate. He's gonna tell us how to get out of that. So we're gonna talk about arrows, talk about bows, talk about hunting, but before we get into it, leave a like, subscribe, hit the bell for notifications. Let's jump in.

Speaker 3 0:47

So you sell bows. Now, what are you doing here?

Speaker 2 0:51

Well, I'm a bow technician yeah, I work on bows. I started out helping out at Horns Outdoor. Anyway, place got sold. Those people weren't into it and I didn't realize there was that big a need. Yeah, because I've always done my own stuff Right In particular.

Speaker 1 1:10

But most people don't, though Most people don't do their own stuff.

Speaker 2 1:14

I totally get it. I don't want them to either.

Speaker 3 1:16

It's good money. Huh yeah, you still kill a lot of turkeys. Aren't you the one that killed a bunch of turkeys? I? Used to turkey hunt a lot yeah, but uh, back in the day.

Speaker 2 1:27

No, you don't turkey hunt, no more man, I I don't much these days just because it's gotten, so pop it's. It's dangerous really, in the national forest it can get that way population's coming back this is the longest drought of turkeys that I've seen in a long time, but they've really made a huge comeback yeah, yeah, yeah, they have.

Speaker 1 1:45

You know, one thing about turkey hunting, though, is I've kind of fallen out of turkey hunting a little bit and I've moved more into like saddle hunting. You know, deer hunting and turkey season fishing is like super good, like bed fishing for big bass, and that's kind of what we kind of fell into.

Speaker 3 1:58

Bass fishing. Yeah, Bass fishing. Do a lot of bass fishing fishing, a lot of bass fishing.

Speaker 1 2:05

We don't do a lot of turkey hunting either, but we did, though we just it's like you did one. It's like, okay, I killed a turkey, it's the same as the other turkey, you know so either you get hooked or you don't right everything's like that, though really yeah, I always eat up with it.

Speaker 2 2:15

Like I always said that I would die of a heart attack of a goblin turkey coming in, you know I would die you know, as an old man.

Speaker 3 2:21

I mean How'd you kill your turkeys? I remember you. I mean how'd you kill your turkeys? Shot them in the face? I know you shot them in the face, but what was your technique?

Speaker 2 2:31

Well, I'm a late morning afternoon guy. The last turkey I killed was at dark almost, and he come in gobbling.

Speaker 4 2:39

I don't like to deal with people.

Speaker 2 2:42

He flew up on that limb and he shot it down. No, I've never shot a turkey off a limb. I've had plenty of opportunities. It's just not me. That's the reason why I'm obsessed with shooting stuff with a stick Because it's harder?

Speaker 3 2:52

Did you shoot turkeys with a bow?

Speaker 2 2:53

I've killed a few turkeys with a bow. That started for me at a young age I started out, you know everybody started out rifle hunting.

Speaker 3 3:02

I think everybody knew you as a turkey hunter, though, if I remember this correctly. Am I remembering?

Speaker 2 3:09

this right. I don't know how far back you know, there was another barber in town, like before I was alive. That was the sneaky turkey hunter.

Speaker 1 3:18

Oh, oh, okay so you're talking about another guy.

Speaker 2 3:22

I didn't know, that guy got the drop-off everywhere.

Speaker 1 3:26

His wife would even drop him off. Johnny Long was always looking for him. That was the tactic you were talking about. I didn't know. I didn't know.

Speaker 2 3:30

That was the guy.

Speaker 1 3:31

You were talking about the drop-off tactic.

Speaker 2 3:33

There's something sneaky about you. No, no.

Speaker 3 3:35

Okay, nope.

Speaker 1 3:39

No, so you're legit.

Speaker 2 3:40

Everybody wants to try to associate me with jumping fences, but that's not me, it's just not me.

Speaker 3 3:47

I just remember going to get my haircut down there and he'd pull out a drawer and he had a bunch of turkey beards everywhere. I guess I was probably 22, 23, 24, a long time ago. So yeah, that was the other one. Yeah, did you buy his business?

Speaker 1 4:05

No, okay, no, he usually got a foggy memory, you know I mean two together I'm actually surprised you remember that though uh-huh, how old are you?

Speaker 2 4:13

47 yeah, we're the same age. Okay, no, you know what? He was still cutting hair. Years ago I opened a barbershop in malvern I'm talking about way back and uh, in the old Red Ball Down there by the.

Speaker 3 4:26

Yes, yes by the courthouse.

Speaker 2 4:28

Yes, no, that's I'm talking about further down behind the food center. But the one you're talking about is by the by.

Speaker 3 4:34

Wade's. That's the turkey killer.

Speaker 2 4:36

Yeah, I got you, I got, you, I got you.

Speaker 3 4:39

I just remember when I was younger. I just remember this guy who was like a legend and malvern and killed so much turkeys. I didn't know if that was you or not no, I'm the deer killer deer killer.

Speaker 1 4:49

So I guess, since he has a fog of mineral, kind of run us through your story, man, get us going from, like where you're cutting hair to where you decided. You know whatever happened then you transferred into doing what you do now. Kind of just give us the short of the of the long, of kind of like how you got to where you are now.

Speaker 2 5:04

Let's talk about how I got into archery Right so well I can't even remember not having a bow, it's just kind of in. And that's where I was going a second ago with this Started out gun hunting. I got to where I was using a side, I was using a muzzleloader during rifle season and my dad was like you're stupid. And my dad was like you're stupid Not really like that but it was a challenge for me. I didn't care if I got the shot or not, it was just it was hard. I always have, and that's how I got into shooting bows Just one challenge.

Speaker 2 5:31

Oh yeah, it's fun Like to think about getting a deer that close.

Speaker 2 5:44

When you don't always shoot In some of your best hunts you never even got to pull your bow back, you know Right. So anyway, I've always done my own work, you know Right. You know you got your little friend group that you shoot and hunt with and stuff, but anyway, I've always wanted to do it. But I could never imagine, you know, I was successful. I had a good business. I got rear-ended and smoked my neck, ruined it, you know and I was sitting at the house for too long and I decided I told my wife, I said I'm gonna go up and see, see what's shaking at the bow shop, because I know they don't have a bow technician. You know I'm friends with the owner and I see what's going on. He's like man. I wish you'd help me out a little bit here, you know gladly, because I can't sit at the house no more.

Speaker 2 6:27

Anyway, it turned into full time, you know, like overwhelming, and I was like maybe I'm supposed to be doing this for people, because I love to serve people. I love to help people Like I love it. It's not annoying to me. I want to see somebody needing help. Right to see somebody needing help, right because I want to, and it's not for my own gratification. I love to see somebody like, wow, this is fun.

Speaker 1 6:48

Yeah, yeah, you like seeing somebody enjoy something that you, yeah, get into something, get you know excited about it.

Speaker 2 6:53

I love it, but anyway, anyway. So that's where I am. That's how I got here, whether you know, it's funny, I had to break my neck to get here, but here I am, literally literally, and I, you know, I remember hearing that too, and that's why I asked you earlier, before we you know got on here.

Speaker 1 7:11

I'm lost, but I remember, like I know I remember that I was in there getting a haircut, which usually where you find out about stuff you know and you know I heard using an old truck or something. I can't hardly remember, but I remember when that happened. You know it's a pretty big deal. I mean a lot of people talking about it. They were just upset about the truck, that's what I got my kids it was like it was like a death in the family.

Speaker 2 7:31

They're like just totaled it out, huh your truck so you got rear-ended.

Neil's Journey into Professional Archery

Speaker 1 7:36

My neck, you got rear-ended yeah, man, I imagine you know the old trucks probably didn't have very good neck support either, you know so, dude, if I was in anything newer, like if you pulled up here and seen at my house right now, I got it and I kept it.

Speaker 2 7:47

You know you'd be like you didn't get hard hit hard. There's no way. Yeah, but it's the frame that's crazy.

Speaker 1 7:56

That's crazy. So let's talk about 501 archery. All right, what are you doing there? What, what are you specializing in? Like kind of what. What are you seeing this time of season?

Speaker 2 8:05

you know people starting to get ready for bow season so we opened in march and, uh, that's the off season. You talked about it a minute ago. That's when you go fishing. You're starting, you're getting ramped up to chase a turkey and then all of a sudden, right past that, boom mama wants you to take her to the lake and go to the beach, you know.

Speaker 2 8:20

But so that was a. That was a hard time to open. It was off season, but we usually shoot 3D all summer long, all spring, all summer. You know there's a lot of people that shoot bows year-round, Right, you know. But our focal point, you know, obviously is serving hunters and stuff. So that was a slow time to start. I can see that. But man, oh man, you know, was telling them I feel like a checker, the only checker at the Walmart that they run around right now and they ain't no barcodes on nothing.

Speaker 3 8:52

I can't get it caught up.

Speaker 2 8:53

No, I usually. You know, the big thing right now is a string. Put a string on Everybody's scared to death to put a new string on their bow, literally. They think, well, I can hit with it. Well, they're talking about 12 yards, but you know, it needs to fly straight oh yeah lately I've been keeping a one week turnaround time and that's a.

Speaker 2 9:11

That's a specific string order. You know, if you come in and said, hey, dude, I need string on my bow, but I'm worried about it, what do you think I'm like? Well, I can't see the future, but I've been getting them out in a week, and that's if I order the string today, whatever color you want. You know, right, I think they're scared that their peep's not gonna be the same, or whatever.

Speaker 2 9:28

But they've been, they've been fighting that peep for years anyways, like it's gonna be straight. That's funny. The last few days people come in. I'm like go in the lane and shoot it. I want to make sure that everything is exactly like I said it was going to and then I'll walk in there and see them and they'll that people be straight and they'll crank it. I'm like what'd you do that for? I'm like I don't know, I just always do it.

Speaker 1 9:46

I said please don't do that, it's great I'm like, yeah, sorry about that you know, that's a habit too. I get myself. I actually have that habit I every time I I don't have to. I know I'm used to it every time every time I do it, no matter what you know. I just realized I have that habit. I twist you twist yours.

Speaker 3 10:06

Yeah, I mean bow hunting and gun hunting is totally different when you actually practice your bow shooting oh, yeah, I think a lot of people don't understand that that's a true statement, you know? Uh, that's why most bow hunters are more accurate when they can kill better, because they pay attention to every detail, where a gun hunter takes everything for granted yeah, they rush more shots.

Speaker 3 10:26

They are in the scope, it's going to die. That's, that's reality. That's a really good point. So bow hunters are usually more of a unique uh individual. It's like they slow everything down their brains. They pay attention to detail.

Speaker 1 10:41

It's definitely a different person it is than most other people right, especially the detail you talked about, because everything's got to go right. You know, kill a deer with a bow. I mean you know we got to be in the right spot, the right wind. You know the deer comes out, you don't get busted drawing on them. You know how it goes.

Speaker 2 10:56

It's a heart attack all in one motion. That's why it's such a.

Speaker 3 11:01

It's a blur, for sure. I mean, it's not an sport, but it's such a dedicated sport. That's why I'll never die out, because it's just like.

Speaker 2 11:08

You don't have to have all the money in the world to do it either, though Literally I mean you don't?

Speaker 3 11:13

You know, to buy the new stuff nowadays? Yeah, it gets a little pricey, but you know you got recurves and all that stuff up there. I mean, that's a different person.

Speaker 1 11:21

Oh yeah.

Speaker 2 11:29

You a different person? Oh yeah, you start going to trash there's so many different levels of an archer, though, and a hunter. There are stone cold killers, there are killers that you're not going to know about. Then you got your guys that kind of do it, and you guys, you got guys that want to be a part of it. They just want to be known for the being in the crowd, you know what I'm saying it's like everything else, but your killers.

Speaker 2 11:41

They don't need your advice, they don't even want you to know where they are, what they're doing. Yeah that's right you don't even know that who does their work.

Speaker 1 11:48

It's because they do it right you know, it's because they do it yeah, I know you're right about that and I wonder how much social media has kind of changed that dynamic a little bit, because now everybody can look like a killer. You know, and I'm sure you see a lot of people come in to your shop and you're like man, y'all are so misleded here, like misleaded.

Speaker 2 12:07

Where do you see this at? You can't come at anybody like that. They didn't come in there asking advice like that and that I don't know. I've been blessed in the fact that I'm not trying to change nobody's mind. Matter of fact, if you come in and said you need a D-loop, and I look and I see your bow is a half inch out of time, more than likely I'm going to address that and show you how or why I'm going to do that.

Speaker 3 12:30

And that leads on.

Speaker 2 12:31

But I'm never going to tell somebody dude, you're hammering that trigger. I don't want people to shoot new paper because most of them don't realize that they can't do it like the way they're holding their bow or they're ripping their trigger. You know what I'm?

Speaker 1 12:44

saying Right.

Speaker 2 12:45

It's my job to make their bow shoot optimally, right. You know, but they didn't come in for shooting lessons. Right, they don't need me to tell them what they're doing wrong. Ignorance is bliss Right. I wish I remember back whenever I was man, my stone cold killer days. I wish I could go back and tune hit guys, bow like yeah it was good for me. Then I thought you know, but now I know what. Now you?

Speaker 1 13:08

picked up what I know now oh my gosh.

Speaker 2 13:10

But anyway, yeah I, I don't want to overload people with stuff.

Speaker 1 13:15

If they, if they ask, then I'll tell them like, what's funny is, like you know, as different as people are when they go in to buy stuff. When I go in and I'm talking, you know a guy like you, you know, I don't even pretend to know a lot, obviously I don't. So I'm like what do I need? This is what I'm trying to do and I always take that advice.

Speaker 2 13:33

I'm going to ask you what have you been shooting Right and what do you like? So the number one thing that I don't tell people is what broadhead I think they should shoot. I ain't doing that, yeah it'd be like you asking me what color to paint your room and I tell you what color I think it ought to be, and you'd be like I hate it, you know, and then it's my fault yeah I don't tell people what bow to buy either. I want them to shoot them and see what they like.

Speaker 3 13:54

Is bow hunters? Arrogant people. Are they arrogant when they come in the store? No I don't think so. I think a bow hunter is more of a? Um listen to they want to be better.

Speaker 1 14:04

That's how I see it.

Speaker 3 14:06

Because it's such a hard sport to master.

Speaker 2 14:08

Yeah, no, they're not, they're not arrogant.

Speaker 3 14:09

They know what they're coming for too, but they will listen, though I think they would listen If they don't know.

Speaker 2 14:15

They've already humbled themselves before they walk in the door Like look, I need some help.

Speaker 4 14:28

Yeah, yeah, you're like something's not right. I'm fish tailing bad. You just want to be better. I mean, you shot, you shot tournaments. Most of your bow hunters really deal with their own situations, their own problems with their bows.

Speaker 2 14:33

I used to fletch my own areas, sure so, and then that's more common these days than any, you know, with easy fletchers and stuff. But you know, what's funny is I didn't realize how many guys are really good shooters and they shoot a lot but they don't know how to tune really and they come like they come.

Speaker 2 14:49

I was like, and I understand that I would rather somebody not mess with it. You know, please don't you know? And the worst thing you said it earlier people get online and now everybody can afford to buy a press and they can work on it and it's not good, like it always leads to. They're gonna end up coming in. You know, yeah, I've done it all right, except for and I'm like, actually no there's a foundation you start from up again.

Speaker 2 15:14

I have to have a good foundation on a bow. You can't just start messing with your wrist.

Speaker 1 15:17

Yeah, I mean that makes perfect sense because like you start getting in over your head on something you know, watching youtube videos next thing, next thing, you know you've got a major problem.

Speaker 2 15:25

Yeah, yeah, especially on these new bows, you're far away from it.

Speaker 1 15:27

Yeah, yeah, I mean it's changed. The technology is so good now I wouldn't even try to tackle it. I mean speaking of technology right here you've got in front of us what is that? A Matthews Mission?

Speaker 2 15:35

Man, they finally revamped the Mission. And my daughter is begging for one, my son's got one. So this one goes from 17 to 28 inches and it goes up to 50 pounds. But the let off is so different on this one. You remember the old Menace. You had a craze.

Speaker 1 15:53

Yeah, his is the old Menace.

Speaker 2 15:55

It didn't have this on it.

Speaker 1 15:56

See, this makes it have a good stop, yeah, I see that it was more of a round egg, smooth spongy at the back? I don't see this thing, but it is that dude locks out solid wall, yeah, yeah, that is sweet man.

The Value of Pro Shops vs Big Retailers

Speaker 2 16:12

So see, my first bow kill was with a mission they're awesome I mean, yeah, it was. It's a matthews bow guys, it was cameron's first bow kill too with a mission. What do you shoot? Whatever's in my hand, yeah I I believe it I have a pse do you? Yep, uh, I have a lot of those, so this is kind of not fair right in my household it's everybody shoots something different.

Speaker 1 16:32

We have matthews oh, we got that going on, everybody shoots something different.

Speaker 3 16:36

It's what you like like we don't have that role. In our house we shoot what we, we support well, it depends on if they're. I don't know. We're all Matthews. My wife is not going to shoot a PSC.

Speaker 2 16:49

Mine's always been a Matthews. Actually, more women are starting to shoot a PSC because of EC2 cam.

Speaker 4 16:56

My wife shoots one. Yeah we all shoot Matthews. I got a neighbor. He's a firm believer in PSC. We always talk in business.

Speaker 2 17:04

They all Listen. Everybody's had a year or two that they struggled per company.

Speaker 3 17:09

You know what I'm saying. Everybody's put one out there, that's like I don't know about that. That's questionable.

Speaker 2 17:13

Yeah, but I don't know. We shoot whatever you know. You're just a nice guy, that's not what. Yeah.

Speaker 4 17:26

I always tell my neighbor if he misses a deer with his psc the shrat, and he'll kill it.

Speaker 2 17:29

Yeah, shooting around trees and stuff that's so funny, dude.

Speaker 1 17:33

Yeah, so daryl, he's usually on here with us. He shoots a hoy. He's the only one out of the whole group that shoots a hoy and we give him so much such a hard time about it, which I mean he's rough on it, though I mean he's dropped his hoy out of the tree like twice.

Speaker 4 17:44

Yeah last season, it was in the floorboard of his truck the other day and I don't there's so, honestly, anything.

Speaker 1 17:49

Honestly, I don't even know if I can even blame the hoid at this point. You know what I mean. I think it would just blame daryl. But we all shoot matthews and we've always shot matthews. It's kind of one of those things I'm sure a lot of people like that. I've always shot Matthews, yep.

Speaker 2 18:02

I always have. So what made you switch? They handed me one and I shot it.

Speaker 1 18:08

And you decided to try it.

Speaker 2 18:09

That's pretty sweet yeah.

Speaker 3 18:11

Well, I mean, it's hard not to shoot free stuff, whatever you know. Some companies support you. I mean you got to help them too.

Speaker 2 18:17

Oh yeah.

Speaker 3 18:18

You know, I'm sure it's a good bow too, you know, too, you know.

Speaker 2 18:24

So that's a good good thing like you're right about that, I mean they all.

Speaker 1 18:26

They are, these primes man. They're slick, so I've seen that the other day.

Speaker 2 18:28

I brought the newest one. I brought the 30 and it is so balanced. You know we run back bars on our setups and stuff trying to get a balance in your hand. Right, that bow sits like it has one on it and it's naked. Really. Yeah, I brought it, you want to see it.

Speaker 1 18:42

Yeah, yeah, pull that thing out.

Speaker 2 18:43

Yeah, pull that thing out there we go, pull that thing out.

Speaker 1 18:45

I've seen a video of it. As a matter of fact, I sent it to somebody, I think Daryl, I was like you've seen this.

Speaker 4 18:50

He's like yeah, I have seen it. Hey, basically I brought it, you want to see it?

Speaker 2 18:55

Yeah, I guess we got it. There's his hole. I brought your favorite color too, so this is a.

Speaker 1 19:11

So that's aluminum right.

Speaker 2 19:13

I brought that for Darryl.

Speaker 1 19:14

Is that not made of aluminum, though? That hoit right there. And that's aluminum hoit.

Speaker 3 19:22

There ain't nothing wrong with that.

Speaker 2 19:24

It feels good.

Speaker 1 19:25

They're some clothes, man yeah, they are a lift.

Speaker 2 19:29

Mom has lift let me just throw these in the floor when you're done. But yeah, that's the problem, hold this.

Speaker 1 19:34

That's the problem. That's what I seen.

Speaker 2 19:36

The video up, god you're gonna notice, as soon as you hold it, it's just gonna sit there. Oh yeah, it's cool, it just sits in your hand. They're really cool, man. They're small. So I brought I brought the short bows today because we're talking to hunters.

Speaker 4 19:52

You know, most hunters around here like short bows easy to get out the back window of a truck? How much is the?

Speaker 1 19:59

how much is the prime way? Isn't it supposed to be lighter? Because it's. When I watched the video, what they said was it took the best parts of aluminum and the best parts of carbon fiber and put them together.

Speaker 2 20:10

They claim this is the stiffest riser on the market.

Speaker 1 20:13

That's pretty convincing technology, theoretically, obviously. I don't know nobody that shot one. Can I hold it please? Would you like to?

Speaker 2 20:21

touch it.

Speaker 1 20:21

Yes, it's pretty light. I'll tell you what's crazy. Hold it please. Would you like to touch it? Yeah, it's pretty light.

Speaker 2 20:24

Yeah, they're light, but I'll tell you what's crazy is how smooth that thing draws. It is pretty balanced. Huh, this is a big seller.

Speaker 4 20:32

I'm talking about a big seller.

Speaker 3 20:38

Which one's a big seller? The Mach 30. Which one's a Mach 30? Mm-hmm Dang. We're just on Mach 1, one that does feel pretty good.

Speaker 2 20:47

I don't like, yeah, I know what notice how it feels when you open your hand.

Speaker 3 20:52

It sits there what happens when you put a stabilizer on it. Sir, what happens when you put a stabilizer on it?

Speaker 2 20:58

well, that's kind of the point. That's kind of the point. It doesn't like you're there to shoot one shot, not, not a score. You know what I'm saying? That's kind of the point I was making. Like it doesn't like you're there to shoot one shot, not, not a score.

Speaker 1 21:06

You know what I'm saying that's nice, so you can. I mean I imagine you probably keep the bow lighter so you stop adding stuff to it to balance it, and you're actually adding, you know, a little bit of uh, kind of a give me there on weight.

Speaker 3 21:17

Yeah, so so you think that's a marketing strategy.

Speaker 2 21:19

Was uh get rid of the stabilizer because in a way, not necessarily, I think necessarily, I don't know, but I like the way it feels.

Speaker 3 21:25

I mean, that's a good strategy Like hey, you don't need a stabilizer, shed some weight, so why did they start with Mach?

Speaker 2 21:32

30?.

Speaker 3 21:32

What happened to the other 29? Why?

Speaker 1 21:35

is it Mach 30? What is a 34? Is it like a?

Speaker 3 21:39

So they've had carbon bows before you know, yeah, but why did they name it Mach 30? What does the 30 stand for?

Speaker 1 21:45

30-inch axle-to-axle, that's kind of what I was thinking, Gotcha okay.

Speaker 2 21:48

So they had the Mach Stealth and they had a few bows. But when they come out with the Mach 34, like you were talking about, it changed the game. It woke people up. People didn't like the way it looked, but when they shot it, they and then they come out with that.

Speaker 3 22:01

I have no idea. Is it still pretty noisy, though? Out of all these bows, which one's the most?

Speaker 2 22:06

quiet. Oh, obviously you know which one that is.

Speaker 1 22:08

Yeah, Dude that was a quarter question for the geek.

Speaker 2 22:12

You know which one that is. See, that's my favorite part, though People can't deny that.

Speaker 3 22:15

That's my favorite part, though I'll just check and see how honest you'd be.

Speaker 4 22:19

How do you these cams will hold up compared to the rest of them? Which one?

Speaker 2 22:22

These composite ones, not the I haven't seen one of those dry-fired, but I haven't seen an issue with none of that.

Speaker 4 22:30

Like one piece, like the ear right here.

Speaker 1 22:32

You want to dry-fire it? No, I don't, no, I don't. We could test all of that right now.

Speaker 4 22:38

I know that guy. You see what I'm talking about, though, sir. You see what I'm talking about, though, sir. You see what I'm talking about, though. How the? So you got to think, basically, it's not 3D printed, actually, but that's what it's like. It's all one piece, it ain't yeah they're machined.

Speaker 2 22:52

They're not machined. Yeah.

Speaker 4 22:54

Yeah, hmm, it's like plastic.

Speaker 1 22:57

So let me ask you this, though when you're not going on crazy walking like you're not hiking out hunting mule, deer or something you would just say just climbing up in a tree and hunting, you know whitetail or something other than you know speed and you know how quiet it is. I would say those are the two most important things when it comes to a bow speed and quiet, speed and quiet it is if it's fast and it's quiet as far as deer hunting goes through the hunter yeah so yeah.

Speaker 3 23:27

So I mean you got, you know, you got a good point going coming on here, so what?

Speaker 1 23:31

why would you not just go with the quietest and fastest?

Speaker 3 23:34

I think a lot of people you know, confused, are like what bow to buy because obviously they're so nice, all of them and you got to go with forgiven if you have make right kind of slight adjustment so if you're a shitty, shot, you gotta get both that's more forgiving.

Different Bow Types and Personal Preferences

Speaker 2 23:46

You gotta get one forgiven well, most people come in and they already think they know what they want and I'm gonna let them shoot one of everything.

Speaker 3 23:54

How do they make that decision, though?

Speaker 1 23:56

based off of their buddies, yeah yeah, it's like a four-door dodge, you know it's.

Speaker 2 24:00

It's like I've always had this it's so funny because I'm not just, like I said, about painting your room. I don't want you to think I talked you into anything, but it's kind of funny. People come in with their mind made up and then they change their mind.

Speaker 1 24:13

Yeah.

Speaker 2 24:14

And I can't tell you which way it's going to go. It just blows my mind.

Speaker 1 24:19

A lot of people. They'll go in. They'll see something like that's what I want in.

Speaker 3 24:25

They'll see something like that's what I want. What is I?

Speaker 2 24:26

want that. What is the best bow? The one that fits you, I mean, I promise, like your opinion, raven the best bow ever made.

Speaker 3 24:33

I mean, he had one bow to buy. What bow would it be? Somebody has to be better, somebody has to be better, right man? I don't know. It's not an equal opportunity, we're not.

Speaker 1 24:42

We're not comparing prices, we're not comparing.

Speaker 2 24:45

Well, there's so many dude you like. If, you, if, if you was at the shop and we just shot everything and you, you did, you weren't even shopping, you just wanted to know. You would have to admit to me that are nice, all of them to me if you ask me what's the best truck, well, I mean I like horse pirates.

Speaker 3 25:02

Right now it's ford. You know we'll've got the high output.

Speaker 1 25:05

That's what that's based off of, which is like all right, so take that speed right, power speed. So I would say speed.

Speaker 3 25:12

If the bow has speed and it's quiet, it's effective To me if I'm picking a bow out, I want the most quietest bow on the market, because that gives me the second shot if I need it.

Speaker 2 25:24

You mean when you need it. You know what I'm saying. Yeah, I can hear you.

Speaker 3 25:29

I mean, that's the most important part.

Speaker 2 25:30

I've been a stickler my whole life about the news. I mean, it's not like this. I don't want them loud.

Speaker 1 25:33

Yeah, I don't want them jumping my street. I don't need you, that's right.

Speaker 3 25:36

That's right, you don't need you, I Would you say, the quietest bow in the market would be the one you'd pick too, I feel like we're in court here.

Speaker 1 25:46

I mean kind of Me too. I kind of feel like I would pick it based off quiet and speed.

Speaker 4 25:51

What is the flattest shooting one right now? Man, it's not always the fastest.

Speaker 2 25:56

That's why I'm asking You're opening another subject I wanted to cover. Okay.

Speaker 4 26:01

With arrows.

Speaker 2 26:01

Yeah, well, this is cool too.

Speaker 1 26:04

I like that arrow case for one, for one, I like the arrow case.

Speaker 3 26:07

It depends on what you're doing. It depends on what you're doing.

Speaker 1 26:09

I know you're digging that too.

Speaker 3 26:10

I know I was thinking okay, the arrow case is slick. What will it take for that thing to stay here?

Speaker 1 26:16

I was already bidding on it, so you're too late.

Speaker 2 26:20

This obviously is made by your brand. Oh yeah, Matthews.

Speaker 1 26:24

Have you seen these yet? Designed well, have you played with them?

Speaker 2 26:27

So whatever diamond or arrows that you shoot, you'll buy the insert that holds them. Oh wow, separated, that way your fletchings aren't warpled up. You know, is that a word?

Speaker 4 26:38

I don't know, I don't know, but we can use it.

Speaker 2 26:40

Well, you got a knock missing, so no, I don't, so I wanted to go with that, you said. You said what's the flattest shooting? Well that depends on if you're a 26 inch draw shooting 50 pounds, yeah. So if y'all remember how y'all been shooting z7 days back then, what did we shoot? As far as arrows you either shot, I shot gold, tip you shot a gold tip, a beaman, ics hunter 6.5.

Speaker 2 27:04

We're down in the 8.4 grains per inch days. Now we've gone to the whole other end of the spectrum with the heavy arrows, right, right. Well, all of a sudden, look at the industry. This year it's all white. Look what they did. This year we're going back to the a little bit lighter setup because we've gone one way too far. This is the new FMJ Max. You've still got your FMJ, but it's lighter than the originals. Who makes those? Easton Easton.

Speaker 2 27:31

So these are the two biggest arrows of the year, and you've probably already seen it it's the Easton 5.0.

Speaker 1 27:36

Hey, pass that down.

Speaker 2 27:39

And the Victory HLR.

Speaker 1 27:42

You know I went to a lighter setup this past season. What did you go to? Easton's? I don't remember exactly which Easton's what were they called Easton's? I see, but now I shot these Fletchins right there, same Fletchins. But now I shot these Fletchings right there, same Fletchings.

Speaker 2 27:58

Those are coming from the factory. Everybody's ventured off into the 2.6's and the 2.4's but you know this is what we've always seen. You can't leave out the old altar here, buddy. I think Levi Morgan killed a whole lot of deer With one arrow last year, and those have been. My youngest son shoots them and, trust me, he's proven them tough now I went super light what's that?

Speaker 3 28:23

five, or what was it?

Speaker 2 28:24

I don't have any skinny ones here.

Speaker 1 28:25

Four mils, the smallest, yeah so I seen a four millimeter last year at some point. They were awesome, dude. Just the fact that how small they were is like whoa, you know yeah, they all penetrate.

Speaker 2 28:37

I mean I can't deny that. Is it harder to stick a stick through a balloon or a pencil, I mean a needle, you know a needle, definitely easier makes sense, don't it? Yeah, makes sense, those make sense so it's the flattest shooting one is it depends on if you're shooting targets or shooting deer. Yeah, that's how you rig it up the lighter you get, the more you can be all right.

Speaker 3 28:55

So if you had one bow, pick one arrow, one arrow what would it be?

Speaker 2 28:59

it'd be a switchback xt baby. Oh, what do you? Mean and eastern axis five mil, really yeah, if they said hey dude they're gonna shut the power off of the country. What bow are you gonna carry the?

Speaker 4 29:09

zombie apocalypse.

Speaker 2 29:10

I'm that's. Yeah, I'm a switch her name's lorraine.

Speaker 4 29:15

She's tune them.

Speaker 1 29:15

She's drawn some blood. She's drawn some blood, I promise.

Speaker 2 29:19

My middle son's shooting it this year. He said, Dad, I'm going to shoot Lorraine all year. I'm like we'll see, but he's Be easy with it he is he's shooting it.

Speaker 4 29:27

You don't have to be easy, yeah.

Speaker 2 29:28

XT or a regular switch.

Speaker 4 29:28

XT.

Speaker 1 29:29

Yeah.

Speaker 3 29:38

You got new strings on it. I think I put a few new strings on it. I don't know what's left.

Speaker 1 29:43

You don't shoot it anymore. No, she's hanging on the wall. It's a phase four. Now I have a phase four too. Oh, whatever.

Speaker 3 29:55

Green ambush yeah, and then Mama has a tan and black.

Speaker 1 30:01

Lift, lift.

Speaker 3 30:02

Lift Really. Yeah, it's like a two-tone.

Speaker 4 30:05

Yeah, she had to get a newer one, oh she got the faded black. Mm-hmm.

Speaker 3 30:07

Yeah, she shot her first buck last year with it.

Speaker 4 30:10

Found the saddle, found your saddle, the other Check that out.

Speaker 1 30:15

Let's get back on this thing.

Speaker 2 30:16

I was going to show you all this keeps your arrows from getting on, that's an awesome kit, dude. And it fits in your case. So what is this? It's called the vault. It'll hold all your arrows. You put opposite ends that way, you're not jamming them in your case. Everybody has a soft case. They throw them in their case and they come in. My arrows are kicking.

Speaker 3 30:39

I'm like have you looked at your fletchings.

Speaker 1 30:39

They look like you slept on them. That's pretty neat. Man, that's awesome. That case right there, I'm going to have to give me one of those for sure.

Speaker 2 30:43

I got to give McPherson that he comes up with the coolest stuff.

Speaker 1 30:46

I mean that is nice.

Speaker 2 30:47

Lead by an example at his finest, right there for yeah, show me, show me tattoos.

Speaker 3 30:55

See, look at that, look at. He knew about it. He already said that.

Speaker 1 30:59

So we have a banner at our old house. We have a banner like a big banner maybe was it a four by eight banner. It's like a matthews logo in the center and it's got me with my matthews mission like on the side. I'm like cut off sleeve shirt and, uh, he's got his. I forgot what you had, and my uncle, he had his matthews and we're all like posed up in it. Probably switch back.

Speaker 4 31:19

Yeah, I think it was switched back actually dude, that's funny because I got a picture in my phone let's go get that banner and bring it back my son's first bow tournament was at a tournament and he won it. He was a shooting little joker and he had a little cutoff shirt on, you see how fun bow hunting is for people.

Speaker 3 31:36

You you know, just for us talking about it. I mean, we got several guns, but we don't get shit about guns. You know, guns aren't near as cool man it's the bows, but that's special kind of people though.

Speaker 4 31:46

It's not everyday people. I heard you say something about y'all shoot 3D up there.

Speaker 2 31:50

There's still 3D tournaments going on up there in your area there's still one of hot springs county and yeah, oh yeah, you can get on. You know, uh, arkansas bowhunter association and, and people post up when they're gonna have them.

Speaker 4 32:01

We just be everywhere.

Speaker 2 32:03

I know every weekend yeah, and it's a lot of fun.

Speaker 3 32:05

It's just the people don't it's kind of like going fishing. Do you see it dying, or or is it growing?

Speaker 2 32:10

I don't think it's gonna die yeah, I really don't, I don't think it's gonna die but is crazy. It's just like motorcycles and the popularity of a street bike.

Speaker 3 32:17

You know, they go.

Speaker 2 32:18

It's like the turkeys they go and they come back, they go and they come back. But it's so fun and right now, at the stage of my boys and their life, you know where we are and we just started shooting NASP. You know at school, and that's another thing, man, I had no idea. I would love it so much. You know helping kids and teaching them, because I think everybody needs the opportunity.

Speaker 3 32:41

Well, you have to.

Speaker 1 32:42

So what is the you got to teach our man?

Speaker 3 32:43

how to hunt.

Speaker 1 32:44

So go ahead and explain that for people that don't know, because a lot of people hear that and don't know what that is. Explain that, the program where you go, and you Archery in the Schools program? Yeah, Go explain that.

Speaker 2 32:53

Yeah Well, matthews has a Genesis bow and they started this gosh on the spot here. I don't know what year, but anyway, it's just like shooting trap at school or anything else, but people aren't taking the time to do it. Right, but I didn't. It's such a diverse group. Anybody can shoot, right? You don't have to be the coolest, you know. You don't have to, you know I'm saying the smartest. It doesn't matter, but it's so neat to watch kids grow and be a part of something and they gain so much self-confidence literally you I mean you they'll, they'll be start out withdrawing.

Speaker 2 33:28

You know, yeah, and then in a few weeks they're. I've got reports back from principals and teachers like I don't know what's going on down there. But they're really independent now. They really want to take charge. I'm like, yeah, we got to let them do something. We can't do everything for the kids. We got to let them fall down and scrape their knee and figure out hey, let's keep going.

Speaker 1 33:46

Right. But anyway it's just awesome For sure it's definitely a good thing to have in the schools too. Like you know, with the way technology is now, it's kind of misdirecting kids from necessarily going outside and doing this, doing like we grew up doing, to where now you can stay inside and just do endless things with the way technology is, you know. So it's like getting them in the schools doing that at a young age, getting them exposed to it like possibilities that are actually out there, is always good.

Speaker 2 34:16

That's a good point. It doesn't even have anything to do with anything. If you take your phone away from your kid, you give them three days. They're gonna be out the yard playing on their age level because they're gonna do a beautiful thing they're gonna do something.

Speaker 3 34:26

It is like yeah, you know mama and briggs is out in the woods right now, yeah, feeding the feeders up and checking cameras and stuff. But you know it's really important to keep the kids out in the woods because, like you said, technology is like running.

Speaker 1 34:40

Yeah, I mean, it just takes attention, spans away, you know because technology just changes.

Speaker 4 34:46

Like y'all still have technology.

Speaker 2 34:47

No, it ruins it.

Speaker 4 34:48

Y'all have cameras on every tree. Y'all got technology. What I'm saying is though that's more technology what I'm saying is though that's more technology.

Speaker 3 34:57

I'm saying with a kid like, would he rather sit on the couch and play a game? A tablet baby, let's talk about tablet babies, or go outside and shoot a bow. That's so important.

Speaker 1 35:05

What would be more beneficial physically, mentally for the kid to develop how to play a new game on his tablet, or go learn how to shoot a bow?

Speaker 3 35:15

Yeah, I agree with that. I I mean it's out of control, pound for pound, if you go to a restaurant and you look at all the families and restaurants. Everybody's looking at their telephone yeah, it's out of control.

Speaker 2 35:24

Here's the problem. None of us ever meant to get here. It just takes one bite at a time until we're totally and and we're all. I'm guilty. You know what I? We all are, we're all guilty of not stopping what we're doing and taking time.

Speaker 3 35:40

Yeah it is, and bow hunting. That's what's so special about bow hunting. If somebody just got into bow hunting, they're chasing the animal. They got to get close to the animal. It's more than just sitting in a box stand with a gun Teaching you patience.

Speaker 2 35:53

I've taken people that did.

Speaker 3 35:57

They were successful, successful and they didn't continue to do it, and that's okay.

Speaker 2 36:00

I don't know how you can't get addicted, but for the most part it's so personable it's so personal, you know you take you take guys who hunt with hog dogs, you know, and you then you got the guys who stick them, you know, that was the big thing like. Oh, it's more personal, you know that's the way it is.

Speaker 3 36:16

You think that you think it's because it's more deer now it's easier. It is easier to bow hunt now, and it was 15, 20, 30 years ago. I remember when I was a kid. Well, I remember when I was a kid, you know, grandpa sent me on a deer stand a whole lot less people out there 15 years ago.

Speaker 4 36:32

Yeah, I know, but we were shooting spikes back there.

Speaker 3 36:35

Remember Remember they had. I miss shooting spikes.

Speaker 4 36:38

I do too. I miss it bad, not caring what it was. Look how far we've taken everything.

Speaker 3 36:42

I know, and it's never enough, it's never enough, grandpa took me out there, set me on a deer stand. It was cold as shit. Okay, I had no walls.

Speaker 4 36:53

I had nobody here.

Speaker 3 36:54

No window. I had no cell phone service. I didn't have a cell phone. I think back then we had bag phones. Grandpa didn't have a cell phone, for sure.

Speaker 4 37:05

He had the big mud grip tires on the back and street tires on the front. My grandpa did too, square body Chevrolet, old square body Chevrolet, you know that's how we learned to deer hunt back then.

Speaker 3 37:12

It's not like that, no more. You take your kid out there and if they don't kill a deer that day, they're disappointed.

Speaker 2 37:19

It's because this instant gratification world we live in.

Speaker 3 37:22

I know it's crazy.

Speaker 1 37:24

And then you get on social media and you see all these people killing, all their photos of all the deer and stuff they're killing. You're like lost.

Speaker 2 37:30

You're like I'm not seeing any deer. If we could compare our success and our daily anythings to everybody else, we'd be a lot happier.

Speaker 4 37:35

I was going to say anything, not just hunting anything, Everything yeah.

Speaker 3 37:39

I think if they just take away social media for a little bit, everybody would be happier.

Speaker 2 37:41

Have a little reboot, yes, like what would happen I?

Speaker 4 37:46

thought Trump was going to hook us up In the short term.

Speaker 1 37:48

I mean what would happen? Say you went three months and no social media. Be like the instant effect to it.

The Mental Game of Archery

Speaker 3 37:54

You would grow so close with your family closer than I know like you know, you're a nice guy and everything, but I don't care what you eat for dinner.

Speaker 4 38:00

Don't post that shit, you ain't gotta worry about me, you know what I'm saying like nobody really cares.

Speaker 3 38:07

You know what I'm saying. Like if you go out on the beach and you everybody's dressing in white t-shirts and everything, I don't care to see that picture, because I'm working, I'm glad you're having fun, don't post a picture. I don't give a shit, you know.

Speaker 3 38:20

So I think I think a lot of the society it's just gotten used to facebook and it's just ruining everything it's absolutely, it's definitely had an impact yeah, yeah, because it's hard to convince a kid to pick a bow up over his tablet until you take the time and show them, and then they don't care.

Speaker 2 38:39

It takes that right.

Speaker 3 38:40

It takes the right father to drag us out in the woods that's why I love my job. Yeah, I love my job, you can make a difference like that, and that's that's. That's awesome. You can make a difference and I can inspire other people.

Speaker 2 38:52

That's right to help. To help kids, not just kids. Yeah, grown men man they need to stick a deer too. They need to know what it's like oh, I know it.

Speaker 1 39:01

I mean, and the more people in the sport you know you're going to secure, the longer it'll be there. You know, I mean because it seems like nowadays everybody wants to share their gold mine with everybody else.

Speaker 3 39:11

No, I don't want to share nothing. I want you, somebody else, to earn it, right know.

Speaker 2 39:16

I do want to talk about why people should come to a pro shop. Yeah, I mean, what's the reasons.

Speaker 3 39:21

I know why I would go to a pro shop.

Speaker 1 39:23

I mean what's the most like. The main reason of that Like why are you saying that?

Speaker 2 39:29

Well, I see people I think people who don't know anything about it, who are interested in it, have like, well, I'm a grown-up and I don't know anything about it, so they're going to go and try and research and do their own thing and they're going to go buy a box store bow. It probably doesn't fit them, or they're going to buy one from somebody that doesn't fit them. What is a box store bow? I mean a big chain store or the Bass Pro Shop.

Speaker 2 39:52

Not that they don't sell good stuff, I'm just saying they think well, I could just buy this whole thing right here for whatever I got you.

Speaker 3 39:59

And then it doesn't fit them, or in two weeks of shooting.

Speaker 2 40:01

They want to come buy a better quality.

Speaker 3 40:03

So you want to talk about a corporate style big store versus the family owned small store.

Speaker 2 40:09

Well, a pro shop is small, it is, but the thing is.

Speaker 4 40:13

He's talking about more of a custom Make the bow fit the person. So why is a small shop important.

Speaker 2 40:19

It's very important, it is very important.

Speaker 3 40:21

I see it too.

Speaker 4 40:22

I think those guys are going to be. They can dial it in exactly to fit you?

Speaker 3 40:25

Yeah, and they're willing to work with the customer. You know a little more hands-on 100%. We have the same issue with dealers too. We same issue with dealers too. We have our dealers are small dealers. They're more hands-on than we got these mega dealers. Then you get, you get these special mega dealers are special, but they're very, very.

Speaker 3 40:47

they're hard to find, you know, but I can see where in our, in our world, our small dealers is going to give you the best customer service. They're going to take care of the customer at all costs and they're going to have your back the most because they depend on the manufacturer so much.

Speaker 2 41:00

Right right, right, yeah, to a fault. I care, I care too much. I mean, I really do like, literally I do too. That's Tim. I can't let something go If I see even the smallest thing, and you didn't ask me for that.

Speaker 4 41:14

I have to do it. My name is on it.

Speaker 2 41:20

It's not about my pride either. I want you to know that this is wrong with your bow.

Speaker 3 41:22

Please let me fix it. Do you know why you're stuck in this little vicious little deal you deal with your whole life. You know why you're stuck in that? Because your age group is mixed up with the technology. That's why you struggle with it. People that are born after you or whatever that's more adapted to the technology, can just let it go, but you don't. You still have handshake morals, you still have the one-on-one business sense and you're mixing it with people that are just on the Internet. I struggle with it every day. Some people don't care about certain things, but we do. We care about everything because we do. We worry about what the people think.

Speaker 2 42:02

Right I mean, if you come in, I want to sell you. If you want to buy something, that's fine, but if you came in, you had a uh, even earlier than a switchback. If you had an old bow and you were ashamed, don't be ashamed, come in there, let me. Let's put a new string on it. I can make it feel brand new. Yeah, I'm not here just to sell you something, right? I'm here to serve you. I got you and your needs. That's why you need to come to a pro shop. That's your age.

Speaker 3 42:25

That's your age, it's not. I'm the same way. I want to make sure you're happy. Not necessarily I mean what I need to do to help you, but most like you talk about going to bow shops and going to big bows. They just try to sell you something they don't give shit.

Speaker 2 42:40

Well, now we're all jaded, yeah, you know, in society today because we feel like not everybody's a chick-fil-a. Yeah, it'd be my pleasure to serve you. You know, I want to be the chick-fil-a bow shops. That's right. I want you to understand I'm not just doing this to be somebody or you know what I'm saying. I want you to really understand that I want to help you.

Speaker 3 42:57

I don't know how you would market yourself. Just I can't tell people how you actually want to serve people. It's, it's. I can show you. I can't tell you it's impossible. I don't know how you do it. I deal with it all the time, too.

Speaker 3 43:09

One person at a time yeah, you just do your repeat, uh, your your repeat buyers is what is what keeps you going and that's what makes you who you are is repeats. That's your one-offs Right. Same way with us. We have customers that buy five or six Havoc boats and they're all repeat customers. That's when you know you're doing something right. And another thing I wrote on here you got a little notes over there, a few, not me.

Speaker 2 43:36

Notes None of of the, you know. But you need to come to a shop because we're going to address you specifically and set you up and even if, even if you bought one somewhere else, you're going to end up bringing it to me and I'm gonna have to set it up for you, right, for you. You know, I'm saying yeah, I would say 90 of the population that shoots a wrist release is shooting too long a release. There's no point in having a bow set at your draw length.

Speaker 1 44:01

It's funny you say that because I always look at mine and I have a scotch release that I've shot from the beginning.

Speaker 2 44:06

The scotch. Yeah, from the beginning. It needs to hit you about right here in the opening, and it does.

Speaker 1 44:10

It does. It's real short and I got mine out of the case the other day and I was flicking around. I've had this thing for years I'm talking about since I was 12. I love my release. Since I was 12, you know, and I started flicking and I'm like, oh man, just don't flick like you used to and I don't want to go buy a new release because I'm like this one's special to me. You know, every deer I've ever killed been with this release. Squirt it with some rib oil. I've tried.

Speaker 1 44:32

It's just so wore down, dude, it's so it's so wore down well, look at this old turd, I'm telling you and I'm see I don't really want to go to something like this.

Speaker 4 44:41

You know right there, if you ain't never shot one, we'll bust your nose I've tried it.

Speaker 1 44:45

I've tried it, I've shot it before we got them.

Speaker 3 44:47

Actually we got them. You got a hinge, I mean. I mean we have several I've shot tournaments with them.

Speaker 4 44:52

I mean, I could shoot them. It's just we try to use them.

Speaker 3 44:55

But it's just like man, I just gotta be careful that scares me.

Speaker 4 45:00

I flinch wrong, it goes off first click yeah this one's got some wear and tear on it.

Speaker 1 45:05

Use it, use it much huh, you use it much it's the floor about 10 times a day yeah, it's got some wear and tear on it. See, I just my thing is like I don't want to drop it out of the tree, I don't want to leave it on the loop because it'll fall off. And the next thing I know I'm like how do they make them with the strap?

Speaker 2 45:21

I don't know, it goes right here. Yeah, brandon, I just don't want to get rid of my, they got technology.

Speaker 1 45:24

Quit making excuses.

Speaker 4 45:31

No, I still use a wrist it ain't like the clampers, the old clamps that clamps down on them, or nothing like that.

Speaker 2 45:36

Oh yeah.

Speaker 4 45:37

Here you want the true balls.

Speaker 2 45:38

short, and sweet, and that's another thing I run into in the shop. People come in and their buddies told them they need to do something. And they come in and they feel like maybe I'm a few years behind, maybe I need to go learn this, and then they don't want to change.

Speaker 3 45:52

They don't want to change anything.

Speaker 2 45:53

That's me, the peer pressure around them has forced them to try. So I'm like don't change. They're like really I shouldn't.

Speaker 1 45:59

I'm like, no, I mean if you have a hard time killing the deer you become no, then what? What's the problem? What they're doing, yeah I don't understand this I mean in your, in your opinion, that release versus, uh, like a pressure release versus, you know, the trigger release. I mean, is it worth trying to learn a new release style if you're successful with the trigger release?

Speaker 2 46:21

No, because every release you shoot should be shot the same way.

Speaker 4 46:25

Listen to me, they're all back tensions technically.

Speaker 1 46:28

Technically yeah.

Speaker 2 46:30

Everybody needs to go back to the KISS method. Keep it simple. Stupid right Everything. Think about it. Kiss method. Keep it simple stupid.

Speaker 3 46:36

Think about it. Kiss method, kiss the flesh, keep it simple, stupid.

Speaker 2 46:38

You know the kiss method so nobody is letting their bow shoot anymore. Everybody's shooting their bow. They're all punching and that's okay. It's okay to be a command shooter it really is. But you've got to understand. You know Well, I talked about it with you earlier.

Speaker 4 46:55

It's not accurate though. It is accurate. Not like it can be. Not like with a back tension. It's different.

Speaker 2 47:01

This gets you back. My daughter, all my kids, have shot a hen since they were three. They can lot of hands. Since they were three they can shoot any release. And it's because I've pounded the fundamentals and fun, the physicals and this joel term and say, or whoever it was, let the bow shoot.

Speaker 2 47:15

You know, if we're shooting rifles on a caldwell let's lid, are you gonna look at it and go bam, no, no, you're not. You're gonna reach around there and you're just gonna squeeze it because the caldwell let's let's got it right, right and you want it to go off while you're looking. You want your bow to go off while you're aiming, not because you aimed once. So the let off is so high on these and the efficiency is so awesome on these bows now that we don't even realize. You take an old switchback that has a spongy back wall, it has high let off, but it's nothing like these bows. Now you go outside, outside, and you realize, wow, I've got to hold this thing back and you you finish your shot, didn't even think about it, because you had to hold it. You had to hold it till it broke, even if you punched it.

Speaker 2 47:58

You get a new bow and it has high, let off rock solid back walls. You know you have you pulled one back. That was like so solid and rigid it felt like if you moved back here it was moving the front too. That's what people do. They get home with that new bow and it's like I can't shoot a group with this. I'm like, well, come up here and let's talk about it. And usually they'll have a wrist release. What do we do with the wrist release? When we draw our bow back? We hang on with these fingers at full draw. What do you do? You're still hanging on these fingers.

Speaker 2 48:23

You got a kink between your elbow and your arrow if we we open that up, look it levels out, gets straight with your arrow, then we're going back to the correct way to shoot. If you put all that tension on this, finger instead of these guess what happens and we squeeze it. Quit looking at the pin moving. Quit looking at the pin moving. Look at your spot. Cover your target with the trash bag. Dude, please Go home and cover it. Quit aiming at dots. The middle is the middle. Your eyes can see it A deer. Don't have dots. The dot will give you target panic so bad.

Speaker 4 48:57

Yeah, ain't never lying If you're already struggling it.

Speaker 2 48:59

cover it up with a black trash bag and back up and shoot it. Start at 10 yards. I want you to think about it. Okay, tim, today I'm not going to hammer it, I'm just going to look at it and I'm going to squeeze it like a rifle and it's going to go off and you're like whew, that was fun, I did it. Start working your way back. The target doesn't change its size. It's the same size at 10 feet as it is at 100 yards. It's our doubt. Our doubt is what makes us screw up? If you think you're gonna screw up on a big buck, guess what you're gonna do.

Speaker 3 49:29

screw up you're not gonna take enough time I've been thinking about that shit as soon as he walks in, oh, shit.

Speaker 1 49:36

What can I do to ruin this?

Speaker 4 49:37

you're probably thinking he's probably never gonna come over here and he starts coming over here like, oh my gosh, I better, here he comes don't screw up.

Speaker 1 49:46

I'm gonna have to, actually, I'm gonna have to actually draw back on them.

Speaker 2 49:48

Oh well, no, but the fundamentals of the shooting is we've forgotten, technology's got so advanced it has, and it's funny because I'm not gonna cram that down somebody's throat, but I'm gonna show them accidentally how they're anticipating it and that's what's making them miss the mark did you know that that's what's making them miss the mark. You know what? You know that that's a. That sin is sin is an archery term sin is archery term yeah, it means to miss the mark, yeah but anyway look at there, let your bow shoot.

Speaker 2 50:20

Quit trying to shoot your bow, that's right. It can out shoot us.

Speaker 1 50:23

It makes 100 sense the way you're putting it, though, because I could see how especially somebody getting into bow hunting now gets a new bow. New technology how they might would be way off of the fundamentals they need to have, you know, because the technology does so much for you, versus like old technology actually a beginner.

Speaker 2 50:40

A beginner and I say this. I tell people all the time if somebody come in and they look like a newborn giraffe, you know they have, know if they can pull the bow back, but they have horrible form and everything else if I tell them, no matter what, just squeeze the trigger, they can shoot a group at 16 yards. That will blow your mind. You're like how are they doing that? Because they look like they're like this. You know it's because they're actually squeezing it until it goes off and not worrying about the movement. They're just looking at what they want to hit. We've gotten so far away from that. We we want to hit that and trying to hit that. We're missing this big yeah I can see that it's not well, you know.

Speaker 2 51:17

They say aim small, miss small.

Speaker 1 51:18

You know, aim small, miss small. Aim small, miss small. That's what everybody's heard their whole lives. Aim small, miss small.

Speaker 2 51:23

You've probably seen this before, but if this is your pin, you'll see everybody. If you're sitting on your deer stand and you draw back on a squirrel, and I don't care if it's 50 yards, you can sit there. You know what I'm talking about.

Speaker 3 51:33

Y'all have all done it.

Speaker 4 51:34

You can sit there and be like dude I could hit him in the eyeball.

Speaker 2 51:37

And now, if I was in your ear and I said, put your finger on the trigger, you'd go come right down below him every time and then the trigger you'd be like trying to get it back up. But if I said, take your finger off the trigger and just aim at him, you go right back to it. That's made to a T.

Speaker 3 51:52

Why is?

Speaker 2 51:52

that it's doubt. Why can you walk across a two by four on a floor, but if I put it up in the air you're like whoa same two by four.

Speaker 4 51:59

Yeah.

Speaker 2 51:59

You can run across that thing.

Speaker 3 52:01

That makes sense.

Speaker 2 52:09

It's the doubt. I think you're a doubter, dude, I think I'm a doubter, debbie, debbie, doubter, that's just it. Cover your target up and quit putting dots on it.

Speaker 4 52:13

That makes sense. Aim at the middle. I do have target panic. That's why I quit shooting.

Speaker 2 52:16

We all have it. Really. Did it scare you? No, just target panic, no, it literally scared him. I started aiming for the 12 ring, 12 ring, oh, it'll make you want to quit. I remember having my five-year-old son pull my trigger for me to make sure my pin got right.

Speaker 3 52:33

I don't understand how that made you quit. It's just, I got target pain. You didn't realize you just need to practice, or something.

Speaker 1 52:38

Did you wake up with night?

Speaker 4 52:38

terrors. You couldn't practice no more. We shot every day, 200 errors a day, and you, just, you just could not do it. It I think it was the dot.

Speaker 2 52:46

Did you wake up with night terrors?

Speaker 3 52:48

Here's how it happens. Here's how it happens. How does it happen.

Speaker 2 52:52

You start out, okay, without panic, right, you can just aim at it and let it happen. Well, the further back we go and the better we get, the more that pressure builds and you're like you know, you start timing it.

Speaker 1 53:08

It's just what we do you start timing?

Speaker 2 53:10

start timing when you start timing it boom, boom. Well, guess what? When you start timing it, you start going faster and faster and faster, to the point where you can't even aim at the target anymore. You're literally aiming below a deer target like oh my gosh and you start going, oh my gosh, and you'll just probably just run through it and you, you don't even care anymore. And then you get mad.

Speaker 1 53:30

You gotta do that with a deer. It sounds like a mental. A deer does not do it An animal does not do it.

Speaker 2 53:35

Everybody does it. Listen to me. It's so hard to coach NASP archery. There's no sights, but the target panic is just as big. It doesn't matter. That's what's wrong with trad shooters too. You know what I'm saying. It's trusting the process and letting it happen.

Speaker 1 53:50

It happens. So how do you get out of that? So do you? Yeah, I mean.

Speaker 2 53:53

First off, you've got to dig deep.

Speaker 3 53:55

Oh my God, it's like going to the gym, if you ever get in this hole. Are we talking?

Speaker 1 53:59

about going to the gym.

Speaker 4 54:04

Scoot up, I mean y' deer all day long.

Understanding and Overcoming Target Panic

Speaker 2 54:05

I don't have it, but I don't want it. So did you hear what I said a minute ago? I remember my oldest son was like five or six and right before season opened I had target panic so bad I even had a bag with a dot on it that I would make him squeeze my trigger for me at every yard to check my pins. I wouldn't do that on a deer I was killing like, but a target.

Speaker 1 54:29

I had target panic so bad, and I know I know guys that can shoot targets good, can't hit a deer. You know you're like the fourth person that brought up target panic to me now. I must not shoot enough, oh no, I don't think I shoot enough to have to. Even y'all are making me so we just shoot a lot like every I imagine target panic comes whenever you're really beating it in there like boom, boom, boom boom, like shooting a bunch. Do you want?

Speaker 2 54:45

to know if you have it or not. Y'all get home and pull your bow back and say, hey, dad, pull my trigger. And you tell him say, tell me when you're ready. And he's going to say okay, and you'll see him tense up. He'll be like, wait a minute, okay, I'm ready. Whoop, whoop.

Speaker 4 55:14

I mean, I really don't feel like I have it, and you're probably gonna tell me this was where I messed up at, because it's real smooth and I breathe good, I mean. But when we shoot a lot we'd get dark, we'd blow up balloons, get them about this big around, put them on the target, put a flashlight on it, back up 100 yards, and that's when I started noticing we'd hit, we're shooting them. We'd put five out of six in a pie plant at 100.

Speaker 2 55:24

Yeah, that's a good. That's a good thing because you'll have you'll have some coaches say that you shouldn't be practicing far. And then you'll have some say well, actually, before I go to the shot 3d, we do that once a year. You know, it's kind of like a tag. It's really cool. It's really cool, y'all should go do it. Anyway. They have it at mulberry every year mulberry mountain fun.

Speaker 2 55:47

Anyway, the week before i'm'm like I never get to shoot because I'm still busy. I'm busy that time of year. I'm like oh my gosh, this year I just cut it all out. I walk back to 100 and I start at 100. Your groups will be like add a black bag with no dots. That's what I aim at. They'll start out pretty big and then it's like being under a microscope man. It's like being on slow-mo. You're like whoa, you don't think you do something to have somebody video you in slow-mo. You're like oh man, I did do that, you know, but by myself I can't video myself. But shooting at 100 yards, I know what I did. I didn't, I didn't wait on it, I didn't let it happen, I forced it. And every time you force it you're forcing it off. You don't know it happen.

Speaker 1 56:30

I forced it, and every time you force it you're forcing it off. You don't know it. Hmm, it's really fun. Man Dad, do you think you got target?

Speaker 3 56:34

panic, what are you thinking about Shockley?

Speaker 4 56:35

you're thinking shit, he's thinking about his target panic.

Speaker 1 56:37

I'm thinking about going and painting my target black. Just get a target.

Speaker 4 56:43

I haven't seen Shockley's head a lot Haunted me for so long I have it bad.

Speaker 1 56:47

But I don't. How do you know you still have it, though you haven't shot in a while, you haven't shot in a long time. So I mean, how do you know you still have it? I mean, don't go away.

Speaker 2 56:53

You can tell when somebody's fixing to shoot.

Speaker 3 56:55

Dude, you can tell he has it. You're terrified, God. I hope I don't get this target friction.

Speaker 1 57:07

Y'all are making this sound scary. Damn it.

Speaker 4 57:09

We used to want to put 12 in. That beer can right there.

Speaker 3 57:12

Yeah, but I can tell you still have it.

Speaker 2 57:16

Yeah it's like PTSD with you dude. So everybody has it People just don't know it. Seriously, I probably have it, I just don't know it, I know you have it, I know he has it, I have it, can you?

Speaker 4 57:26

pull your bow back, hold it on something. Just sit there and hold it for two minutes in one spot with your finger on the trigger.

Speaker 1 57:32

I do believe. So, yes, well then, you ain't got it. I mean, I feel like I'm not rushed by no means you ain't got it severe.

Speaker 4 57:37

You probably got it I probably.

Speaker 1 57:38

yeah, we all have it.

Speaker 2 57:49

So me there are people out there that are struggling with it. People will quit shooting their bows because of it. I don't know.

Speaker 3 57:51

Single person shopping. There's so much self-help out there. But you're right, you've got to reach out. But you're right, I mean you're both.

Speaker 2 57:54

Don't be ashamed to come to the shop and say, hey, dude, I need help. That's what I was going to earlier. Is've got too much pride to walk in and say I don't know what I'm doing.

Speaker 3 58:09

I did that with B Scott when he used to get in a slump and play baseball. I'd buy him a new bat and he'd hit the ball. Was that, is that something? You just changed his, his mindset, you know Like. So you think people buy stuff because they shoot bad?

Speaker 2 58:24

You can't buy your game, okay.

Speaker 3 58:26

All right, 100%. It worked on B Scott a little bit.

Speaker 2 58:29

It's just a Band-Aid on a bullet hole.

Speaker 3 58:30

Yeah, you're right, always is Do you see people doing that, though People.

Speaker 2 58:35

Oh yeah, how many guys you know that play golf? They're going to have the best club. They still can't hit a driver.

Speaker 4 58:44

But they're going to have the best driver.

Speaker 2 58:45

I know what you're talking about Like they never hit the driver down the middle.

Speaker 4 58:48

anyway, he just got all the cool stuff.

Speaker 2 58:53

Pretty good set of gloves?

Speaker 1 58:55

I know a guy. I know a guy. It would be so much better off if it was just in iron. Well, what's funny is I'm the guy with the good driver.

Speaker 3 59:02

Yeah, but you can drive the ball good, you just can't drive it straight. You can't, you cannot buy your game your anchor point's way off, dude.

Speaker 1 59:12

I got fairway panic.

Speaker 2 59:13

No, you got T panic, t panic. Now you have an excuse it's called target panic. It's a mental thing I'm going through. Hold your head still, look at the ball. Hey, look at the ball, just like shooting your bow.

Speaker 3 59:30

You can't hit the ball off a tee if you're moving your head. I need your bow to go off, so you don't look at your pins.

Speaker 2 59:34

You see them.

Speaker 3 59:35

You just see the target, then you see the pins.

Speaker 2 59:37

Your pin is just going to float.

Speaker 3 59:40

It's just going to float. So don't focus on your pin. Focus on the target.

Speaker 2 59:43

If you focus on that pin movement, you're just going to screw it up. You're trying to time it. I think I do get target back. Are you looking to pen? He's the actor. Yeah, everybody does. I think I think we start holding our breath, we start tension our muscles trying to get it more still and like oh well, that's as good as it's gonna get. And bam, you know close enough, he's breaking.

Speaker 4 1:00:00

I got blood I don't know, I think I might hit him high I feel like I've been talking to a shrink all morning.

Speaker 2 1:00:08

Because here's what happens. We go like this, that's good enough, and then you think, just hammer it, and if you saw slow motion, you'll see this finger go, whew bam. It has to go all the way around and then, smack it.

Speaker 1 1:00:21

You're right, I see what you're saying. Yeah, I see what you're saying. I think that I think I'm screwed.

Speaker 3 1:00:28

No, you don't.

Speaker 4 1:00:29

You don't just punch those. You can make them go off. You can make a thumb trigger go off, if I rip this release.

Speaker 2 1:00:35

I'm going to shoot to the left this much, and if that's at 100 yards it's this much.

Speaker 4 1:00:39

You can do it at any release. You can punch them.

Speaker 1 1:00:41

It's always going to be left, though, so what would you recommend for say somebody's listening and they got target panic as bad as Shockley does? First thing you do is put a garbage bag on top of Target. Garbage bag on top of Target.

Speaker 2 1:00:52

Yeah see ya and how close they need to go to it. Take your side off your bow. What the fuck.

Speaker 1 1:00:57

Okay, we're going to wait. That's way too far, way too far, and then scoot up. Yeah.

Speaker 2 1:01:02

And learn to shoot, just feeling it yeah.

Speaker 4 1:01:06

You got to feel it. You got to feel it.

Speaker 2 1:01:08

You don't feel it. If you're not feeling this, you're right. If you don't feel it, then you're not. You're refusing to try and make yourself better. You're right. Close your eyes, look at your release, hold it so close to the target you can't miss and watch it go off. Watch it go off. Let somebody pull your trigger Once, once your brain relearns what it's supposed to feel like. You have trust issues with yourself. You don't trust yourself. Golly, you're breaking this way down.

Speaker 3 1:01:33

I mean, it's the truth. You don't trust yourself, shockline. I've had people pull the trigger.

Speaker 2 1:01:37

It's weird, it's not, you can do it. You can do it right now at point blank range. You can do it at 10 steps. But when we back up to 20 yards, you're going to be like oh, you're going to go right back to hammering. You're like dang it. Then you've got to move back up and start over, because every time you move back.

Speaker 1 1:01:51

How long does it take to get out of that?

Speaker 4 1:01:54

You don't. You get better.

Speaker 3 1:01:58

You get better.

Speaker 2 1:01:59

Once you have it you cope with it You're always going to be a sinner brother.

Speaker 1 1:02:02

That's what I'm not understanding here is like is this such a mental hurdle that you figure out about yourself that you just never get over it? Cause that's what y'all are making it seem like you just cope with it.

Speaker 2 1:02:13

No, you get better you wax and wane man, you get good, I mean you always.

Speaker 1 1:02:19

So let me get this straight there's no, not ever having it, you always have it, you have it there's guys who don't have it, but they can get it.

Speaker 2 1:02:26

So once you get it, you never lose it. Dude, it's just like this, you get three strikes. I'm telling you right now, I've seen somebody talk about this.

Speaker 3 1:02:33

You get three strikes just like baseball.

Speaker 2 1:02:37

You can be fine and rip it one time If you don't let those next ones break. If you command it the next three times, you're done. I'll tell you if you get online and watch them guys shooting indoors.

Speaker 1 1:02:50

It's such a big deal.

Speaker 2 1:02:52

You can see them. If you see them start blinking fast. They're trying to put a Band-Aid on a bullet hole because they're anxious about it.

Speaker 4 1:02:59

It's dot shooters.

Speaker 2 1:03:00

If you see them start blinking real fast, it's not because they can't see. Your brain has to rethink every time it has to refocus and refocus and refocus.

Speaker 1 1:03:11

This is such a big phenomenon that's going on that I never knew about. You know what I'm saying? Such a big deal. I feel like so you're saying there's people that don't have it and they're good, but then, once you have it, you're stained with this.

Speaker 3 1:03:25

What makes somebody good shooting a bow?

Speaker 2 1:03:37

Is it consistency? Yes, cons 100 discipline, not caring what you think if I was gonna shoot dude, like when you go to qualify for the village hunt. Are these urban hunts right? Good hunters, man? Some of them don't make it in because they got 250 guys watching them shoot three arrows at 20 yards in the zone of a target. Like what I can heart. Shoot a deer every time, but man, I can't stand on a stage. All these people watching me, what? How come people can't be good speakers?

Speaker 3 1:04:02

the fear, the fear of sucking you know mental game of sucking fear of missing the deer.

Speaker 1 1:04:10

The doubt I thought you could write a book over the mental game of bow hunting.

Speaker 2 1:04:14

I can't, but there was already a bunch of them out there, he struggled with it.

Speaker 3 1:04:17

He's trying to figure it out because he's an overthinker. That's how he's gotten to where he is now with it as deep of an understanding as you have you're like one with the target panic.

Speaker 2 1:04:28

It applies to everything we do, though he's a bow whisperer, if you were shooting a slingshot, it applies to.

Speaker 1 1:04:32

that Makes perfect sense. I'm getting it now.

Speaker 3 1:04:37

You make a valid point.

Speaker 1 1:04:38

I understand. So there's one thing that you can do.

Speaker 2 1:04:41

There's one thing that you can do Think about your elbow. If you want to clean your shot up, open these back fingers up and open these back fingers up, and that way it transfers Any weight. That's going to go is going to go on your trigger, not here. Open it up, hook your finger around it and if you're thinking about shooting your back elbow is going to go right before you hammer it. But if you pick your finger or hook around your release and back elbow goes up and back and you just keep aiming and you everybody forgets to push. These things have 90% let off. We don't have to do this anymore, but that's why we got target panic so bad. You know if you'll build the pressure between the front of your bow and the back. Just do it from point blank, man, like when you feel it. You'd be like whoa, I'm a pro. Every time you're like dang, this is awesome, right. But then you're like I'm going to do this all the time.

Speaker 1 1:05:37

In a tree. That's where the discipline comes.

Speaker 2 1:05:40

I love school archery dude. This NASP I used to. I got to admit I used to make fun of it because we were 3D shooters. I'm like man, it's corny Archery. In schools they shoot at 10 meters or 15 meters. No, get 60 kids to understand it. You got to come up with 60 different ways to get these kids to understand to trust the spot. Do they ever trust the spot?

Speaker 3 1:06:01

Do they ever trust many kids? Yeah.

Speaker 2 1:06:03

My son. It was his first year to shoot man. He won two state titles. He finished Eastern Nationals at Louisville. He shot a .298 out of .300 but there were a four-way tie For a first that shot .299. I was like dude, it's right there. Like last year At Eastern Nationals, .297 won the whole thing. He ended up fourth or fifth At Myrtle Beach At World. It was cool, yeah, but so I? You ended up fourth or fifth at Myrtle Beach at World. It was cool, yeah, but so I focused this year my focus. I can't be talking about this on here, can't weigh my secrets. Well, I mean I focus on the mental aspects of it with the kids.

Speaker 3 1:06:41

You're an educator.

Speaker 2 1:06:43

I have to? Does that mean I have to tell all yes?

Speaker 3 1:06:45

Pretty much Tough shit.

Speaker 2 1:06:47

So Okay, tell all, yes, pretty much tough shit. So okay, and then ask there's a. There's a 11 steps to archery success. And people ask me like, how are you getting these kids to do that? I'm like, the 11 steps to archery success. It's right in front of you, it's like the bible dude. It told us how to live and now we're struggling because we're not following the way. You know, I don't know just look at the read, the directions.

Speaker 3 1:07:06

Right, it's right there, dude, right, just read the directions. Right, it's right there, dude, you're right about that.

Speaker 2 1:07:09

Read the directions 100% true. We all want to do it our own way, and that is what I tell. And even at the bow shop, people come in. I'm like, listen to me, I'm going to teach you the simplest things right, and if you stick to it, it's not mine, it's the people who've gone before us the way like do it this way. This is the way the male pride goes. You know what I like to do this right, we add something to it.

Speaker 1 1:07:36

Well, guess where that leads way off.

Speaker 2 1:07:36

Yeah, yeah, we're gonna start blaming everybody. That guy that told me I target panic? No, it ain't the guy. It's my bow, it's my arrows. No, it's not. It's remember back when you decided to do your own thing. That's right. That's where the problem lies, just lack's just a lack of discipline. Go back take your stuff off and start over. Follow the guidebook.

Speaker 3 1:07:54

It really doesn't matter what bow you buy.

Speaker 4 1:07:57

No, the technology's there. You don't have target panic with any of them.

Speaker 3 1:08:03

I didn't know you had target panic. Everybody has it To that degree, to that degree.

Speaker 1 1:08:07

No, we've obviously, you know, just learned about Shockley's severe case of target panic. You think target panic?

Speaker 3 1:08:14

But it's only dots drives the industry for revenue, like I believe. It's like people get so caught up in this they just buy, buy, buy, buy, buy.

Speaker 1 1:08:27

I don't know though, because, listen as a guy, that hasn't been so into. I guess the industry as detailed as like now I'm starting to figure out about all this stuff. I didn't necessarily know it was such a big deal.

Speaker 2 1:08:40

Archery's not about being better than somebody else. You've got to remember what it's about. It's about being better than you were last time.

Speaker 4 1:08:47

I don't know. I've shot in many tournaments and I wanted to be better than everybody else.

Speaker 3 1:08:50

Well, it's a tournament that's because you put in the work. Yeah, let them target practice at the podcast talking about target painting. That's because you didn't work hard enough.

Speaker 2 1:09:00

You ever done something 19,000 times and you walk in and say, mom, get out here and watch this, and you can't ever do it again. Yes, seriously, hey, man, watch this. You never get it to do it again. You broke that concentration. I'm telling you, man, you watch somebody, you watch somebody. They'll climb up and they'll have their best tournament of their life and then they have to start all over. I don't know why it is Every time.

Speaker 1 1:09:32

That's with everything, though I'm the best.

Speaker 4 1:09:34

We ought to go shoot a tournament for deer shooting.

Speaker 1 1:09:36

That's with everything, though. I'm scared too. You know what I mean. You can be on a real hot streak batting and then all of a sudden just go through a slump out of the blue.

Speaker 2 1:09:43

Yeah.

Speaker 3 1:09:43

It's the pride, though and it's like a pride it's like what is going on tell you, love the bow, hunt, shoot your bow. It's, it's.

Speaker 2 1:09:49

It's definitely touched your soul so I'm really proud, like I, I, you, you can't just decide to be good, you're into controlling something you can't control you ever hear somebody say well, I want to build a boat, why don't you teach me how to build a boat?

Speaker 3 1:10:00

no, you it's, it's all in what you want to control. It's like you're controlling this whole thing, like the, the method of shooting making somebody better. It's like it's you, it's the person shooting the bow.

Speaker 2 1:10:13

There's so many life lessons, though. There's so many discipline life lessons in shooting a bow that you can apply to your everyday decision making. Literally.

Speaker 3 1:10:21

Because? Why? Because it's based off of discipline, and that's what we all lack is discipline, yeah, into today's age, whether it's working, it's all the same thing.

Speaker 1 1:10:33

Well, discipline in almost any aspect is good. I mean name, something that you can do better without discipline than with discipline.

Speaker 3 1:10:41

I wish I had a lot more discipline to go to the gym. You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 1:10:47

Yeah.

Speaker 3 1:10:48

So I get it so.

Speaker 2 1:10:49

I get it. I get it, you know it's bow, you know.

Teaching Archery to Kids and NASP

Speaker 1 1:10:53

That's why bow hunters are different because it takes discipline that, and I feel like bow hunters enjoy the journey more than they actually enjoy the prize at the end we gotta talk about archers, just archers in general, like it's not just hunters, like there's, there's more.

Speaker 2 1:11:10

Uh, people are more eat up with it. They shoot 3d and nothing else.

Speaker 3 1:11:13

You know I'm saying they're more ate up with it. Oh man, I believe that you're around like we.

Speaker 2 1:11:19

Yeah, we got a lot of bows I believe that you can't, and everything's different yeah how about this?

Speaker 2 1:11:25

how about this? I've been noticing lately that people their bows, they'll bring them in. I don't know these people, but they'll have their sight. They'll have a pick mount sight run way out here and they're a deer hunter and they don't realize that the further your sight is away from your bow, the more you're going to twerk it. You know, right, the more I'm sorry, at distance you're going to miss way where they're out. Right, the closer your side is to your riser, the less it's going to matter. But they see it on TV, so that's what they do.

Speaker 3 1:11:55

Why do they do that? They try to get the site closer to the target, maybe.

Speaker 2 1:12:00

But they cause they see it on TV. That's, that's the. But they don't realize. They're like man, I'm back up to 40, and I'm shooting like a whole deer to the left. I'm like, well, yeah, that's how bad you're torquing your bow.

Speaker 3 1:12:12

I got you that makes sense. Jinx, I don't want you to tell a bitch.

Speaker 1 1:12:17

Yeah, no, it makes a lot of sense what I can see hunter, you know, the dead bullseye kills the deer. But also, you know, being a little low to the right kills the deer too.

Speaker 2 1:12:35

There's a huge difference between shooting animals and shooting targets.

Speaker 1 1:12:40

Right.

Speaker 2 1:12:41

There's a it doesn't matter, Like there's a huge difference. There's a huge difference.

Speaker 3 1:12:45

All right, let me ask you this I got something for you. So when you shoot a target let's say you put one arrow in it why can't I hit my knock on that next arrow? But I can't.

Speaker 4 1:12:55

Are you aiming for the arrow or aiming where you aimed? I don't know. It's just the thrill he's aiming for the arrow.

Speaker 3 1:13:03

It's a thrill of hitting the knock. You said why can't?

Speaker 1 1:13:05

you I mean Chances are it's easier to follow the arrow than it is.

Speaker 3 1:13:08

If he shoots an arrow in that target, no matter where he shoots it, I'm going to get really close to his knock.

Speaker 2 1:13:12

Why is that? It's easier to follow the arrow.

Speaker 3 1:13:14

You didn't finish the question, though, what I mean. Why is it easier to hit his knock than it is a target on the bag, if I'm the first one to shoot?

Speaker 2 1:13:24

Because there's no dot. Why is it easier for you to aim at his arrow? I don't know. It's your determination to hit, to ruin his arrow? Yeah, that's what it is. That's what it is you're. That doesn't matter if you miss the dot. How come? If people ruin their arrows? They could shoot a group this big on a target, but the moment you put a piece of steel around it with a hole in it that big, they're gonna ruin every arrow.

Speaker 3 1:13:47

It it's that doubt, I know, I know, cause I can screw this shit up every time.

Speaker 2 1:13:51

That's what yeah but.

Speaker 3 1:13:52

I can't group it. You know what I'm saying?

Speaker 4 1:13:54

It's like I get it.

Speaker 3 1:13:56

I don't know. It's something. There's a thrill about screwing this to miss. You're going to miss, but if he shoots, Because I put pressure on you. But if he shoots that deer in the eyeball accidentally, I can hit his knock or come close. You got nothing to lose.

Speaker 2 1:14:20

I guess not. You've got nothing to lose then, but if I put pressure on you, yeah.

Speaker 3 1:14:24

You're right, though You're 100% right.

Speaker 2 1:14:28

You're right, though you're right. I mean, it's just, it's the nature of it's our sin nature, man, like literally we want to be in control. Yeah, you're not in control. We got we should. If we would let our bow shoot instead of trying to shoot our bows, we would never miss. I get it it'd be awesome.

Speaker 3 1:14:40

I get it, it's all making sense.

Speaker 2 1:14:42

It's all making sense, it's a little different.

Speaker 3 1:14:44

You know like you get somebody come in here trying to sell bows, whatever, whatever, but you're trying to break this down. I mean obviously. No, I don't try that's what I was trying to say earlier.

Speaker 2 1:14:52

I don't try and tell everybody this. If it goes there, we get there right. Yeah, I hear you, if it doesn't go there, I don't give a newbie all this stuff.

Speaker 3 1:15:02

Right.

Speaker 2 1:15:10

And I can't do all that they. They don't even know how to, they can't even pull it back.

Speaker 3 1:15:13

The same, yet every time, yeah, so in order to be great at something, you have to understand why you're failing right. And there's, that's what, that's the part you're trying to describe that's the growth.

Speaker 2 1:15:24

That's the growth to it, yeah I'm not trying to tell everybody in the world what's wrong with them at all.

Speaker 3 1:15:28

Well, you don't convince us. We got target panic.

Speaker 2 1:15:30

No, I'm just saying.

Speaker 3 1:15:32

I'm pretty sure we do now.

Speaker 2 1:15:33

I'm just saying it's okay. If you do have an issue with it, Go ask somebody. Leave the pride at the house and walk in there and say I need help. It's more fun, isn't it? Do you remember when you shot? It was fun, yeah it was.

Speaker 3 1:15:46

Well, I'll tell you, what you've done for us is, when we go home, we're going to shoot and we're going to definitely have it on our mind, but we will. We're going to be panicking, but we will probably be a better shot because we can control it better.

Speaker 1 1:16:02

We're not going to let it absolutely live in our minds, like Shockley, Shockley's terrified.

Speaker 2 1:16:09

No, no, you're going to go home and pull each other's trigger. Remember, yes.

Speaker 3 1:16:12

Whatever. Well, we're going to pull triggers, put bags on targets, we're going to do everything.

Speaker 4 1:16:17

Yeah, I get it. What are we doing? Meeting at your house in the morning and shooting.

Speaker 3 1:16:20

No, I've got to go to Mississippi tomorrow.

Speaker 1 1:16:23

This won't be a tomorrow thing, but we'all have to have a target up here, man. Yeah, I think we did, don't we do we?

Speaker 3 1:16:29

have to die somewhere. There's snakes. We've been working.

Speaker 1 1:16:32

We've been working like non-stop for the last three months the bow season's coming, so we gotta get our stuff ready. I'm gonna get locked in my uncle's awesome he always talked about.

Speaker 2 1:16:41

He would go to his shop in the morning. He would shoot one arrow on the way to his shop and he would shoot one arrow going in that's cool because you gotta. You only get one shot on a deer, that's right. That's right. What are you gonna do with it?

Speaker 3 1:16:52

it's like cold bore, you know yeah you gotta know what it's gonna do yeah, core board shots, that's that's what we do. Shoot once a day, you know, and that's how you cite your stuff in it is well, neil.

Speaker 1 1:17:05

I think we learned a lot.

Speaker 2 1:17:06

Man, no shit, thanks for coming I don't know if it was worth it, but I think we learned a lot. Man, no shit, thanks for coming. I don't know if it was worth it, but we got a lot more to go.

Speaker 3 1:17:10

I really think we did learn something.

Speaker 1 1:17:12

No, we did and you can definitely come back. And as we grow in our experience here with Target, panic and everything, hopefully we can come back. We can regroup and we can have some more to bring to the table from our end.

Speaker 3 1:17:24

what we're experiencing, are in, you know what we're experiencing, but I definitely learned a lot. Definitely for sure that you're going to shoot somebody straight, and that's the first step of buying something you need that says something yeah, and remember, I'm not here to sell you stuff.

Speaker 2 1:17:37

If you want to buy something, that's good, I'm here to help you. Yeah, I'm in the shop to help you. I'm not going to judge you. What you bring me, I don't care. I'm going to help you make it better. That's the way I am too.

Speaker 3 1:17:45

I mean, if a guy comes, here, if a guy comes anyway 350 pounds, he doesn't need a 15, 50, you know, 15 foot boat small boat right he's a bigger boat. I tell people the truth all the time. They hate it, but it just that's. That's how you, uh, that's how you make repeat customers as being honest with people.

Speaker 1 1:18:02

So man that was a great podcast absolutely, man. I'm glad you came, for sure me too.

Speaker 2 1:18:06

I, too, I had a ball. This is really cool. Y'all got to get set up, thank you. Absolutely I'm coming back, dude, I'm going to bring somebody.

Wrapping Up and Final Thoughts

Speaker 1 1:18:12

Oh, absolutely Do it, man, do it, it's going to be a big surprise. Oh yeah, awesome. Well, that wraps this up. Guys Leave.