#105 - Matt Johnson - Running Across Texas & Turning Trauma Into Purpose

Matt Johnson grew up in a double-wide trailer, joined the military searching for direction, and later discovered endurance running as a way to transform pain, trauma, and complacency into purpose. He shares how a fractured leg, a near-suicide moment, and running across Texas forced him to confront identity, faith, and what “home” really means. This conversation explores resilience, suffering, and the realization that the real race isn’t miles. It’s proving to yourself who you truly are. 

Timestamps:
00:00 Relationship With Home
03:33 The Man Who Thought Matt Should Leave Home
06:56 Dealing With Chronic Back Issues
10:47 The Event That Sparked A Change
20:56 Running Sub-3-Hour In 1st Marathon 
24:56 Introduction & Deconstruction Of Self
30:21 An Evolving Relationship With Faith
31:59 Running Away Energy & Finding Stillness
41:10 Running Across The Entire State Of Texas
46:21 Holding Yourself Accountable
51:52 Memorable Moments From The Texas Run
54:47 Slowing Down In Life
57:57 Recovery From Texas Run
1:00:23 What I Think Matt's Next Event Should Be
1:01:03 Connect With Matt Johnson

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Transcript

Matt Johnson grew up in a double-wide trailer, joined the military searching for direction, and later discovered endurance running as a way to transform pain, trauma, and complacency into purpose. He shares how a fractured leg, a near-suicide moment, and running across Texas forced him to confront identity, faith, and what “home” really means. This conversation explores resilience, suffering, and the realization that the real race isn’t miles. It’s proving to yourself who you truly are. 

speaker-0 (00:00.418)

Matt Johnson, welcome to the show. What is your relationship with home look like? Yeah.

speaker-1 (00:01.815)

Here we are.

speaker-1 (00:05.826)

Relationship with home? Ooh, home in what aspect? Whatever home is? Home is where my people are. That is definitely something that I've actually came across very recently. That home to me is, home is where my community is and home is where my friends are, my people are. You know, just kind of like how we talked, right?

speaker-0 (00:11.886)

whatever I think is

speaker-1 (00:34.764)

Over the last nine months, I've lived about an hour outside of Austin. And in that process, I think I really did find out what home meant to me. And it's not where you live, how you live, how big your house is, it's where your people are. I was so isolated from everybody for eight to nine months. That home kind of just recently took on a new meaning to me.

speaker-0 (01:01.078)

If that's something that's pretty new to you, what did it originally look like?

speaker-1 (01:04.578)

Yeah, you know, I think that, you know, the biggest thing for me, you know, that I've battled is, you know, growing up so poor. You know, I was born and taken back to a double wide trailer and, you know, had a single mom and, you know, joined the military. It was in the military, lived in a one bedroom apartment, you know, bought a small house, you know, I made three, four grand a month.

while I was in the military and then, with my success that I've seen since, you know, 2023, you know, I had a lot of, I had a lot of money coming in and, you know, to me it was like, it was really cool because I had money for the first time. And it was like, man, like I want the nice things, right? Like I want the nice cars and I want the nice house and I want the big house. And, and so I chased that for a little bit kind of in, you know, 24, 25. And

As I started chasing that, really felt like when we did move out to Georgetown, the suburbs of Austin, we moved into a $1.4 million house up there and sitting on an acre of land and massive pool and fenced in yard and all the fun things. The happiness wasn't there because we didn't see our friends. Obviously, the funny thing is if you know anybody in Austin, everyone hates to travel anywhere.

We didn't see our friends a lot and I felt like that was God. I'm huge in my faith and I felt like that was God kind of moving me out there to really kind of realize what home was and that it was the people, it wasn't the materialistic items that you have.

speaker-0 (02:48.814)

Going back to that original home, that first life of yours where, you know, growing up in that trailer, you weren't the first one who wanted to leave that life or had the idea to leave that life. What do you think Austin Clark saw in you?

speaker-1 (03:07.424)

You did your research, huh? That's a good one. You know, I don't know, just a kid that was motivated, you know? And yeah, I mean, I lived at that time when I was working at Weiler in small town Knoxville, Iowa. And I lived in, actually it was now as an adult, it was a double-wide trailer. So my mom had rented out this property for like four years.

By the way, rented out this property, this was a double Y trailer, it $400 a month. Like that was how much it costs. And I mean, we're small, rural, rural Iowa. And when I left for the military, when I came back, my mom had bought a house and she's like, hey, like I'm to move out. We've rented this property for years now. She's like, you know, the owner said that you could, you know, take it over if you want it. I'm like, cool. So I had three of my buddies move in. We're all paying a hundred bucks a month. And.

I joined the military to get skills because I didn't go to college. My idea was I'm to go to the military, I'm going to get some skills I can use in real life and I'm going to come back and I'm going to use those skills. But I came back and I just settled for a complacency and I went into a factory and started working in the factory. yeah, Austin Clark was one of my very first ever bosses, right? Like in the workforce.

He came up to me one day and he's just like, you don't belong here. He goes, I've been here for almost 20 years. He's like, you don't belong here. He you need to get out of here. Like I was sandblasting metal parts. That was my job, literally all day long. Like metal parts would come in, I'd put them in the sandblaster. We'd sandblast them, they'd go get painted. And I was making like 12 bucks an hour. So I think, you what he saw in me was...

you know, someone who was motivated and that was just in the wrong place because of complacency. And, you know, early on in my younger life, like even when I got in the military, like I always just settled for the easy road, you know, and I always just settled for like, what, what, what's easy? Like, okay, I can go work at the factory and make 12 bucks an hour. mean, that was what, 2015, you know what mean? I mean, I'm like, cool. Like I can go buy, I went and bought a car, I bought like a Chevy Cruze, like a 2008 Chevy Cruze. And I thought I was.

speaker-1 (05:28.706)

ballin', you know, and yeah, you know, but what I think that he saw in me was just, you know, someone who was motivated and I think he saw someone who was capable of more things.

speaker-0 (05:41.942)

It's interesting that you didn't have the reality or the evidence to back that up, but he saw something obviously intangibly.

speaker-1 (05:50.146)

Yeah, it's a great question that I should ask him now. Well, yeah, think, I mean, I don't ever get on Facebook, but we're definitely like, we're friends on Facebook for sure. And we've chatted here and there a couple times over the last, you know, 12 years. But yeah, I mean, from what I think, I think he still works there. Wow. yeah, I would love to ask him that question. And that kind of just reminded me of that.

speaker-0 (05:52.822)

You're still connected with them?

speaker-0 (06:19.694)

Well, his advice paid off. He's like, I was right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's cool. Something interesting about your military experience that really hit home for me. Um, mean, you have a really interesting relationship with pain and it comes within the endurance and the physical sports space, but it goes back to the military. You had a chronic back pain injury and dealt with a lot of chronic back pain. That was something that I dealt with for a while and it ended up being.

speaker-1 (06:23.95)

100 %

speaker-0 (06:49.524)

one of the best things that ever happened to me. Curious to know what it was like navigating that.

speaker-1 (06:54.35)

Yeah, I mean, I'm gonna be completely honest. Like I don't talk about this a lot, but I have severe scoliosis and I have something that they call military neck, which is from wearing your helmet so much that it adds the weight and your neck is kind of at a slight degree more. But like, it's funny, because right when you asked that question, I was doing this and I was like massaging, like I'm still, I still, I have chronic pain every day. Like still today from.

But I think that what I don't classify it as chronic pain because I think it's just what I live with every day. But sometimes if you ever see me running, you'll see me like, you know, I'll manipulate my neck a lot. I'll stretch it out. Cause like everything gets really, really tight because my scoliosis is so bad. Even to the point, like I remember when I ran across Texas the first time, my crew was laughing because I mean, they are tailing me for 17 days, right?

And they said that just over the entire trip, you could just slowly see myself leaning farther and farther left. And there's pictures where like, you can see me just, you know, off to the left because I, I do, I have, I have horrific scoliosis. A lot of people don't know as well, something that, yeah, some of the most people don't know is I used to professionally, well, I wouldn't say professionally, but I used to race cars. And one of my very first nights ever racing,

I crashed my car at like 120 miles an hour. Just rolled it through the entire corner. You can find it on YouTube. And I also had it on my TikTok, my OG TikTok. I have like an in-car of that happening. And I fractured my back in two spots. I fractured it like right below my neck and then right down at my tailbone. And I only found that out through a CAT scan years later. So yeah, you know, just dealing with

Yeah, I mean, it's just an it's a sob story like that doesn't, you know, need to be told to people, right? Like there's so much more I have to tell than, my fucking back hurts when I wake up. But yeah, you know, people that are around me a lot, you'll see me a lot like I, you know, like I'll crack like my body's just kind of fucked up and I'll like crack my elbows and I'll crack, you know, I'll do this with my neck and, you know, pop my back, stretch my back because everything's just a little fucked up.

speaker-0 (09:18.328)

So does running loosen you up basically?

speaker-1 (09:21.086)

yeah, I mean, you know, I, I, I've been quoted before saying that, I remember because of my back injuries in the military that I had never thought I would run a marathon. Like, and I remember telling, I remember telling my mother when I ran my first half marathon, I was like, yeah, like that sucked. Like I'll never be able to run a marathon because of the back, because like my back hurt. but yeah, I mean, you know, I think that, I think that running does, you know, I mean, here's the thing.

with the terrible scoliosis, like if you just sit there and you're sediment and you do nothing, it's probably just gonna get worse. So I don't know, I think that the running makes it better, but it's also just my daily life that I live. So, I mean, we'll see, I don't know, 10, 20 years from now when medicine's advanced and I'm 50 years old and 20 years, then maybe I can get some type of surgery, get it done and I'll be all right. But for now we just keep marching on.

speaker-0 (10:16.184)

tying things back into that complacency mindset. What I find really interesting about your story is that it took your brother to create that spark for you. And what I'm talking about is he went through something tragic with two of his close friends being murdered and you see him kind of go through a physical demise. What was it like seeing somebody else externally struggling that sparked that

sort of like action within you that you really didn't have before just on your own.

speaker-1 (10:50.604)

Yeah, I mean, you know, something for me, especially with my family is, you know, we like growing up, like, you know, everyone knows, like I grew up with a single mom and my grand, my mom would take me, my mom would work two jobs. She would take me to my grandparents. My grandparents would watch me. My mom would then pick me up after the other job, take me to my, aunt and uncle's house. They would watch me. She would go to the other job. And then, you know, my eight years later, when I was eight years old, my little brother came along.

And then it was like, my mom was working a different job and I was watching my brother. And then we, you know, we went through a period, like my brother and I went through a period of, you know, abuse through my mom's ex-husband and, you know, kind of bonded through that where like I had to take care of him, you know, cause my mom was gone and she didn't know what was going on. And then, you know, all that came to light and that's a whole nother segment. But for me, family is everything. And...

and relationships and loyalty to those people that are there for you is everything. you know, seeing him completely broken was going to break me. And, you know, we, like at that time, like I was married, I was full-time in the military, I lived about an hour north of where they lived, you know, and...

I just sat there one day and I was like, have to do something. And I think it was like to help my mom because I saw my mom struggling because he was locking himself in his bedroom, trying to deal with this depression, playing video games all day, gained a hundred pounds, know, like just was going through it. And I'm like, man, like how can I help him virtually, right? Like before virtually was a thing, you because this is like pre-COVID, you know? And...

I'm like, what can I do? And it was the idea of like, okay, like self-help books. It's like, all right, like, like, like let's read a book together and then we'll talk about it. And I've never read a book in my life. I don't know. I don't. Maybe because at that point I had just started training. Like I just started running for the first time and I was listening to YouTube videos. I was dabbling in audible because my mom had an audible account and she's like,

speaker-0 (12:51.534)

Why do you think that's where your mind went?

speaker-1 (13:09.206)

I still don't understand how audible works, but she's like, she had credits or something that she would get monthly. And so she's like, like you can use my credits on the audible account. So I was just listening to things. And like I said, like, I'm, I'm not, I'm not a good reader or a writer. Like I can speak, I can talk, but when it comes to, you know, I, I grew up medicated for ADHD and ADD from the time that I was in second grade until I left for the military.

When I left for the military, I should probably still be medicated today. When I left for the military, because back then, they didn't really check you for stuff, it was just like, my recruiters were like, hey, you just need to dump it out before you leave. Literally the day before I left for the military, I dumped my pills in the garbage and never took them again. But with that being said, I don't read. I have to listen. I have to hear it. And I have to be doing something in order for it to lock in. so I think it was a little bit of that. I think it was like the ADHD and being able to run and being able to have an

outlet where I was able to pack in that information. And for me it was like, okay, if I can do this, then maybe like somebody else can do it as well. Let alone my brother. I think that was kind of how that came about, but I'm really not sure. God send? I don't know. Because then I would do it. I still remember the time where my brother texted me when he read the first chapter, cause I was like, holy fuck. Like I can't believe that he actually did that. I was out raking leaves in the yard.

speaker-0 (14:23.31)

That's interesting. That's really interesting.

speaker-1 (14:35.406)

It was like fall time in the Midwest and leaves are falling. And I was raking leaves in the yard. I was listening to the book to Can't Hurt Me by David Goggins was the book. And I've probably listened to that book. I mean, I'm not even joking, probably over 50 times, start to finish. And he texts me and I remember right where I was and I'm like, holy shit, like he's reading the book. And, you know, I don't know, he probably made it three chapters and then gave up, but.

speaker-0 (15:04.11)

That's such a fascinating symbiotic relationship where running helped you to read and reading helped you to run, especially in those very early days of your running journey. What did those beginning running days look like?

speaker-1 (15:19.222)

Yeah, so it all kind of started, it would have been fall of 2020. I got into listening to this book because Devante and Malachi, the two boys that were killed, I have both their names tattooed on my legs right here. And they were murdered in January of 2020.

And Marcus went through that entire depression in the summer. And then I found out that he didn't go back to school in August. And I found that out in November. And I was like fucking heated. I couldn't believe that my mom let that happen. Like I was mad at her. And so that's when that's the timeline for when the book came about. But at that time, I just started dabbling into fitness. Like what I would do is I would go to the gym and I would watch people work out.

do, let's just say, a tricep curl. And I would watch them from across the gym, and then when they were done, I would go do it. And then I would watch someone bench press. And then when they were done, I would go over there and I would do it. Like that was, I didn't have anyone to teach me. I didn't watch any videos. I just would go to the gym and I'd just watch people and I would copy them. So then it was like music, hype up. And then I was like, okay.

came across the David Goggins. I wasn't really running at that point. mean, the military has a two mile physical fitness test. We had to run two miles and I was doing that in, I don't know, 17 minutes, I think was like the minimum standard. So like I was able to run, but then I started like getting on a treadmill and then that's when I really started like listening to it. But yeah, November, it started like that. And then what I would do is I would listen to David Goggins book and on Monday, Wednesday and Friday.

I would go to work at Camp Dodge in Johnston, Iowa, North suburb of Des Moines, where I worked full time. And there was a two mile track, like a loop-de-loop around a pond. And I would run four laps. I would run eight miles. And on Monday, Wednesday, and Friday, and I would listen to that audio book and it would take me like an hour and 40 minutes. Like I'd run, know, what, probably eight? No, it would take me about an hour and a half. I'd run about 11 minute miles. And I'd just like, in like sweats.

speaker-1 (17:42.382)

$30 Nike shoes at and you know, and I would just I'd rip it and I'd shower and I'd put my uniform on I go to work and That's what it looked like for you know, most of the month of November And then I I signed up for my first race November I think late very late November of 2020

speaker-0 (18:05.336)

And what's ever race was that?

speaker-1 (18:06.702)

So that was called the equalizer endurance run. Yeah. But so like the way that this worked is it was a, it was a different, it wasn't on, on Camp Dodge, but it was another two mile loop. Actually recently Zach Bitter from Austin just went there and ran a hundred miles and under 12 hours on that same course, which is really cool. Cause he's my coach. Isn't that crazy that like, he's my coach now and one of my friends and

speaker-0 (18:09.612)

Like the movie, but then so much.

speaker-1 (18:34.764)

which he told me he found out about the equalizer from listening. I think I talked to him about it on his podcast one time. And that's why he went and ran it. Anyways, I went out there, no fricking idea what the hell I was doing. And it was a six hour endurance run. And I ran 23 miles and I literally couldn't walk. And I quit, I was done. It was like, I probably made like four and a half hours of just

running and I made it 23 miles. That was my, that was the longest I ever did. Did a half marathon. Cause then I was like a week later, then I was like that whole week I couldn't even walk and I was fucked. And I was listening to Goggins and I'm like, holy shit, like I'm that guy. like, I'm like, I'm like, I'm like, ran 23 miles. Like I'm the best. I'm the greatest. And, I went and I ran a half marathon and I finished it, but I ended up like hurting my foot. And I took like that. By that point I was like,

this is so cool. I like, ran 23 and then I ran a half marathon. then I, that was, I think I took like December, January, February off and I don't think I ran again until March. But coming back March of 21, I won the Des Moines half marathon. That was my first race back. And I ran a 120 just off of no coaching, no training, which I think it was like a six oh five pace. And then we moved to Virginia.

And that was when it really all started like really picking up where I just started hammering 70, 80 miles a week for months.

speaker-0 (20:09.55)

So that's great. mean, it's great seeing that. I think that's important to be able to see that progression. Like you weren't just a beast.

speaker-1 (20:09.934)

That's all right. I gave you a lot there

speaker-1 (20:19.758)

No, no, no. I did not start running like late 2020s when I started running. And my first like race was January of 2022 in Austin, Texas, the BPN.

speaker-0 (20:30.958)

Yeah, that's one that I want to talk about because first marathon, you still really don't have that much of an idea of how to train and run. How does somebody run sub three hours in their first marathon?

speaker-1 (20:44.494)

I ran sub three and I walked by the way. I don't know, but that was a very pivotal moment for me. Went down to, I got in, like it was like a golden ticket, right? Like, don't know how familiar you are with it, but like BPN launched. And so Nick ran the marathon, dropped the YouTube video. And then like November of 2021, he's like, hey, we're gonna run it in January. We have 250 tickets.

we're launching at 5 PM central time, get in, buy your ticket and go. So I had my wife, my brother, Marcus, who lived out there in Virginia with us at that time, who was doing much better, went and got his high school diploma and he was out like working at Domino's. wanted to move, because I got stationed in Virginia. So he wanted to move out there and kind of get away from Iowa for a little bit. And I had all three of us were on there trying to buy a ticket. And sure enough, I got the ticket and

yeah, I flew down to Austin in January of 22 showed up at the BPN marathon. Had no idea what I was doing. I don't even know if I took in any nutrition that entire race. and, but I called my shot during the first BPN marathon. called my shot. stood in line for two hours to meet Nick Bear in his gym and I shook his hand and he said, what are you running tomorrow? And I said, sub three.

And he chuckled and he goes, by how much? And I said, 259.59. The next day I ran 259.52. And at the finish line, Natasha Vandermeer comes up to me who was, she owns NVDM coaching, Nick Baer's triathlon coach at the time. And she goes, how'd you train for this? I'm like, I didn't. I don't, I don't know.

And she hands me her card and she's like, you could be an incredible athlete. She's like, call me. And I went home and went back to the military. But that conversation with Natasha lit a fire inside of me because that was one of the first times in my entire life that someone saw my athletic ability like I did. I knew, I knew what I was capable of, but I didn't have anybody to also tell me that.

speaker-1 (23:08.366)

I had 200 people that followed me. My Instagram right now is the Instagram I had in high school. I've never changed my Instagram. Matt Johnson two underscores was my 2020, 2012, 2012 Instagram. And I didn't have nobody that believed that knew anything and Natasha's like, you could be an athlete. And I remember going home and I just sat at my desk at Camp Dodge and just thought about that for weeks. And then I made a move on it.

speaker-0 (23:37.294)

It's interesting. that year 2022, it's the introduction to who you know you can become. But it also seems like it was the deconstruction of your present self.

speaker-1 (23:48.91)

Yeah, yeah, it was a deconstruction of, of everything. Everything in my life was broken down in 2022 in order for me to rebuild in 23. And, you know, a quick rundown of that was, you know, my marriage was falling apart. I was a piece of shit human being. All I cared about was fitness and training because I just knew, I knew I had something in me and I knew I had to do it right now. And.

You know, even to the point where I tell this story all the time, I told my mom, was like, I was like, I like, I'm going to do this full time. And I had, like I said, I made three grand a month in the military. Like I had no money. Natasha at that time, the coaching was $350 a month. I was maybe netting in my account, $300 after I paid all my bills. I didn't have any money to do that. And I went to my mom and I said,

My mom, who by the way, has no money, who has never had any money, who has never once, she worked as a medical aide at a hospital, had never once made over $20 an hour. So I just want to throw it like, my mom has nothing and never had a new car, has never had anything nice. And she had just sold her house, that house that she had bought. Remember like when I said, And she was staying at our house and I was like, I'm going to do this full time.

And I was like, but I need like your, need help trying to figure out how I'm gonna pay for it. Like, like I needed her advice. And she goes, you what are you gonna do? was like, I'm gonna do an Ironman. I'm like, but I need to pay for coaching. I need to get a bike. I need to do all this. And she goes, I made $10,000 off of my house. She goes, I'm gonna give it to you and you are going to go do this. And then you're gonna give it back to me.

And I said, done deal. And actually today right now, the way that I'm giving that back to her, we're in a deal right now, I'm gonna buy her car today. And it's been how many years? That was 22, four years later, I'm gonna finally be able to pay her back. she took that, it takes one fucking person to believe in you.

speaker-1 (26:09.484)

Right. And it takes three to, to really turn it around. Right. Like Natasha believing in me and you know, my mom believing in me and everyone, most of the people around me saw it. And yeah, I took that money. bought a bike. I, I put the coaching on credit cards and I was like, let's, let's rip. And that entire year I trained and trained and trained and everything in my life fell apart.

You know, but everything that was supposed to fall apart to lead me to where I am today. You know, like, like my wife and I at the time we got married so young and we were, you know, she wanted one thing and I wanted another. even told her, I was like, I want to move to Austin. She's like, I don't want to move to Austin. And, you know, like we just, it was just constant fighting. And, you know, I went through 2022. did, I did Ironman Des Moines and then I did a 50 K trail race.

down in Arkansas that I won. Like I was traveling to race cause I was like, dude, like I'm going to do it. was trying to, I was doing the same thing I did in the gym, but on Instagram, I was watching how these influencers moved and how they showed themselves and what they did. And I just would, would emulate that. And I would, you know, I would do what they did. And the, and the following slowly started to grow, you know, it's like 2000, 4,000, 8,000, 10,000, 12,000. And yeah, did Ironman Texas.

You know, ran 40 miles with the Ironman, did Ironman Des Moines, ran 40 miles with the American flag, ran the 50K race that I won and set the course record at. Got into Leadville, had no business going to Leadville, DNF to that Leadville race. Everybody knows that story. And then, yeah, and then going into 2023 is when, you January, New Year's Eve of 2023 is where, like, I knew that my marriage was done. And was really where

You know, like I was, I think I told this story for the first time on Gary Brekos podcast where I was like, I was going to kill myself. And.

speaker-1 (28:18.966)

I had a choice to make. remember sitting in my bedroom February of 23. I was out of the military. My wife left me and it was, I was going to kill myself or I was going to move to Austin. And I just got back from Austin. I just got home from Austin and I had a buddy down here and he was standing in Airbnb and he literally texted me and said something and it stopped me from committing suicide in that very moment.

And I picked up my phone and I said, are you still in Austin? And he's like, yeah, I'll be here all week. And I said, I'm coming down. I'll tell you why soon. And he said, all right, we'll see you when you get here.

speaker-0 (29:02.707)

moment again. Yeah.

speaker-1 (29:04.106)

over and over and over, God is present in my life, for sure. And at this point, I didn't even know who he was. You know, like, like I've grown up with faith, but like at this point, I wasn't going to church. I wasn't praying to God. I didn't even see God as a thing.

speaker-0 (29:21.494)

You've said that you feel like you are blessed by God and obviously you're saying you didn't have that relationship with faith earlier in your life. Did you feel like you had an opposite relationship? Did you feel like was it God wasn't in your life or was it even going further of like God has?

speaker-1 (29:41.73)

Yeah, you know, no, I don't ever like there was no resentment towards towards, you know, my faith. My faith was always there. Like I have I have so many Christian tattoos that I got when I was 18. I, know, I. Yeah, 100 percent.

speaker-0 (29:54.382)

Let go, let go. And I literally blacked out the arm and I would...

speaker-1 (29:59.178)

Not, I couldn't go over it. Like I couldn't let that one go. That was one of my OG tattoos. yeah, the lady's like, want it. And she's like, it doesn't look good. And I was like, I don't care what you like. I'm not blacking over that. And, but no, was never, there was never anything against God at all. It was just, I never spoke to him and we didn't have a relationship until, you know, late, late 2023.

And when I met my fiance now and she's like, we go to church with me and I'm like, hell yeah, I'll go wherever you want me to go. And that just changed my entire life.

speaker-0 (30:40.27)

So 2023, you have a lot of physical success when it comes to running. But I've heard you say you described that year as having running away energy. How did fracturing your leg force you to find stuff?

speaker-1 (30:58.05)

Yeah. Yeah. I actually, I just had this conversation with Matt Choi, like three nights ago because, yeah, I spent the entire month or the entire year of 2023 running. I fractured, I fractured the leg in, Ironman, Texas, April of 23. And I ran on it until it broke in September. Like I ran Leadville with, with three fractures in my leg. I.

ran another 100 mile or the one that I DNF'd when the leg was just fucking wrecked. And I went back and the doctor's like, yeah, like, when was your race? And I was like, Saturday. This was a Monday. She's like, no, honey. She's like, this thing's been broken for a while. And I was like, fuck. And they put me in a boot and they said non-weight bearing for three months.

And I went home and I just sat there and I cried and cried and cried and cried because my entire identity was in Instagram running. You know, like that's all I posted about was running, running, running. now, now my idol, like I idolized running. My idol was ripped away from me. And in that moment I had to, you know, I had this conversation with Matt Choi. I met with him and I'm like, you know, cause I've always looked up to him as a creator and I'm like, yo, what do I do?

like all of my contents about running. He's like, you just need to tell stories, bro. You need to learn how to tell stories. need to like, you know, the greatest advice he ever gave me for anyone listening to this is he's like, you need to have an ABC and D story. A can be motivation. B can be education. C can be funny and D can be military. And he's like, and what you do is when you post, you go ABCD, ABCD, ABCD.

And at that time, like I said, like I look up to him so much and I went home and I did that. And I met Amanda at that same time. I went back to church at that same time and the following went from 60,000 to 200,000 in three months. And then I came up with the Texas idea and that just fucking catapulted me into outer space. That event, you know, Texas one in 2024 and.

speaker-1 (33:18.857)

Here I am now.

speaker-0 (33:21.922)

You want to know what a term though, think though, that encapsulates all of that, those buckets, because what I love a lot about you is that you don't see yourself as an endurance athlete and you preach a lot of like, Hey, like I'm just some guy.

speaker-1 (33:33.774)

Yeah, yeah, I had well, yeah you tell me and then all I just had this conversation with this person on Instagram that was like shitting on me the other day and I was like I'll you I'll tell you we tell an hour after this

speaker-0 (33:46.146)

Let me say what I think that you're an alchemist. Do you know what that is? An alchemist is basically like there's the book, the alchemist, but basically you're taking something and then you transform it into something else.

speaker-1 (33:52.172)

What is that?

speaker-1 (34:00.888)

Yes, yes, 100%. That's when I learned how to do, how to take my trauma and turn it, like, everything changed when I took my trauma and turned it into a purpose. Yeah. I literally erased trauma and turned it into purpose.

speaker-0 (34:16.706)

Yeah. And I mean, you're not a runner. You're not an athlete. Running is the tool to alchemize that trauma and that unwilling pain into purpose. And I think that goes into those four buckets.

speaker-1 (34:29.826)

I'll take it. I like that a lot. really do. You know, I think that, yeah, I don't, I don't identify as a elite runner. I don't identify as, mean, sure, I might say I'm an elite runner, but like I don't identify as.

speaker-0 (34:44.33)

I mean, you've backed it up.

speaker-1 (34:46.862)

But I don't identify as that, right? And when people identify themselves in their sport, like I had this, I announced the Ironman. I'm going back to Ironman, Texas, and it's time for me to close that chapter. Yes, I completed the race, but I fractured that leg in the process, right? It's time for me to, I need to check that fucking race off of my book and let it go.

And I announced that and someone commented on there and was like, I think it's so funny when these influencers try to come into our sport to prove that they're elite.

And I was offended because I'm like, I'm not an influencer. Like, do I have influence on social media? Yeah. But like, I don't see myself as an influencer. I don't see myself as an elite athlete. I see myself as just a person who, thank God, has been given a platform where I can make an income just doing what I want to do every day. And we got into this long argument and he ended up deleting the entire thread.

He deleted it, where I was like, I'm like, I am not trying to come into Iron Man to do anything, but do something for myself, right? Like, I need to wrap this thing up. And he's like, yeah, you know, people are like, they're gonna crush you. you know, cause I have a fucking target on my back now because I've done so many cool things. And I'm like, bro, like it's not that serious. Like this is an Iron Man race. Like, we are...

currently bombing Iran and people are dying. Right? Like we are at war right now. Like that is real life. You know, like, like countries are being bombed. People don't have fresh water. Who gives a mother fuck about an Iron Man? And that's my mentality. Like on anything. Like I'm just me. I'm just living life. Like, like there are so many real life problems out there for

speaker-1 (36:43.256)

that it blows my mind when people identify themselves with their fitness accomplishments. Like, yeah, cool, I ran across Texas, dope. But like, guess what? Just, did you watch the Gary Brekker podcast? Yeah. Yeah, where I, yeah, and guess what? When I was done, nobody gave a fuck. Nobody cared. Nobody cares when you're done. Like you are another person. You and I both right now are replaceable because guess what? This is a rented studio and when we come out,

speaker-0 (37:01.675)

Yeah.

speaker-1 (37:12.93)

Two other goofballs are gonna come in here and do the same thing we're doing. We're all replaceable. It's not like, it's not that serious.

speaker-0 (37:22.712)

Yeah, I you can't take yourself too seriously. No.

speaker-1 (37:24.814)

No, and I feel like that's why, maybe I think that's why I blew up because that's the message I preach to everyone. I'm not serious at all. You guys see me smoking cigarettes and hammering monsters and drinking a few beers. It's not that big of a deal. And that's a whole nother conversation we had too. People come to me all the time and they're like, how often do you smoke?

I'm like, buddy, I don't even remember the last time that I took more than two drags off of a cigarette. I'm like, the cigarette's a metaphor for like, it's not that serious. The monster is a metaphor for it's not that big of a deal. The beers are a metaphor for like, it's okay to live your life 80-20. And it's like, that's the biggest thing I try to tell people with that is I'm like, you're worried about me smoking a cigarette, but you're microwaving your food in plastic. You're worried about...

about me not icing my balls in the sauna, but you're lighting a candle at home that's putting toxins into your air, right? Like everyone is, you know, always just trying to like, I wish I'm just trying to bring the peace to the world of like, yo, guess what? I don't give a fuck about anything. you can't hurt me with your words.

speaker-0 (38:45.134)

I think it goes to those four buckets as well where it's like, I'm trying to motivate people to do stuff. And if I'm all just in one bucket, like you're, you bring the common people into it. Yeah, yeah.

speaker-1 (38:58.734)

Nobody cares about your fucking abs, bro. People care about, are you a good person? Nobody cares about what you eat in a day. People care about, are you doing good in the world? You know what I mean? The nice cars and the houses and the influencer things and the tapping on, this is my fucking Chick-fil-A, all of that is cool, but what are you doing in real life?

You know, and I feel like people now it's 2026, people are going see through the bullshit. People are see through your shit. Are you a good person or not? Are you doing good? Are you raising money for charity? Are you using your platform for good things? I am. Whether or not you like my cigarette monster drinking beer chugging ass anyways, I don't care. I've raised almost $400,000 for charity since I've had this platform. What have you done?

speaker-0 (39:51.054)

Let's dive deeper into that, especially with the big event. Most recently, talk to me about this most recent run across Texas.

speaker-1 (39:59.994)

it was horrific. It was the worst experience of my life. yeah. You know, ran across Texas the first time and I just felt like, like, cause everyone's always like, why did you do it again? Like, they're like, they're like, not only did you like go and do this crazy thing once literally three months after you were done, you're like, Hey, guess what? We're running it back.

And the answer of that is because I felt like we were like the most unprepared, bad news bears, fucking mangled team of people that like the only point of that run was yes, to raise money for valor fit, but it was to just run across Texas. There was no story. There was no, there was no thing attached to it. It was like, okay, like I have to do this to prove it because I'm going to be honest, like I knew who I was at that moment and I had to prove to everybody else who I was.

I needed to run across Texas the first time to prove to everybody like, yo, I am who I say I am. And I'll be the first person to admit that. Everything after that, I don't need to prove shit no more at all to anybody. But when we had to run it back, I didn't raise enough money for charity. And there was a clip in the... Like when we were going through the documentary, there was a clip and what I did is I hit mile 50 for the day.

And I'm like, 50, and I stopped my watch and I literally stopped right there. And as a listener, you're probably like, okay. But like to me in that moment, I'm like, I had my mindset on the bare minimum, right? Like, like I didn't take another step from that point. 50, mark, draw, I'm going to bed. And that, that ate at me. I don't know why, but it did. It just ate at me that I was like,

I never pushed harder. I never did a little bit more. I always just kind of did the minimum, right? And it's so crazy for me to say, and it's probably hard for people to even relate to that because they're like, dude, you ran across Texas. You know what I mean? But like I did the minimum I had to do to get it done. And I raised, I only raised $30,000 for ValorFate. And I didn't walk away from it happy. I walked away fulfilled, but I didn't walk away from it happy with the way that I did it.

speaker-1 (42:22.125)

And I was like.

speaker-0 (42:24.942)

I'ma run a-

speaker-1 (42:25.408)

And I'm gonna do it better in every way and We did you know we raised? $175,000 for charity I went through the worst pain of my entire life, and I had to push through that for almost 16 days I ruptured my Achilles like I have like I had like a like a like a micro tear in my Achilles on day three and

I had to battle through that for over two weeks and every day was misery. And that's exactly what I asked for was to not do the minimum. And God gave me exactly what I asked for. And I'm so grateful because as soon as that event was done,

I just, I don't know, I feel so free. Like I can do whatever I want. like I, Matt Johnson is who Matt Johnson says he is and everybody knows it.

speaker-0 (43:28.512)

And you had never felt that freedom before in your life?

speaker-1 (43:30.956)

No, I always felt like I had something. I felt like I hit all aspects. I don't have to prove to myself who I am anymore because I've already done that. I don't have to prove who I am to everybody else because they already know my name. I mean this humbly, but like, if you are within the fitness space, you know my name. You know what I've done. And no one can ever take that from me.

But I know my name and I know who I am as well. And that's all that matters. And now that I know that for the first time in my life, I have proved to myself who the fuck I am. I have nothing else to give. Everything's fun now. Like right now I'm having a blast. I'm training, I'm running fast. I'm going to GoodPain and working out with my friends. GoodPain's just like a little track workout down in Austin. There's like 85 people there.

And I show up and they're like, holy shit, Matt Johnson, how are you so fast? And I'm like, I don't know, but it's so much fun. Like I'm having so much fun training. I just announced the Ironman, Ironman Texas, and you know, I'm to go back and do Ironman and I don't care what my time is. I'm going to have a fricking blast. Like I'm so excited to do that. And then we got the White House event coming up and then I'm done for the year. And I'm done for the year in July. Brother, I have not had a summer in two years. Like, you know what I mean? Like I am ex-

Life is so good. And it's just, it's a blessing.

speaker-0 (45:02.008)

Something you've shared about yourself is that when you were a kid, you would make stuff up a lot about, you know, stuff that you would do to make yourself look better and cooler. And that accountability is a trait that you really wanted to embody. When it comes to events like these, where...

speaker-1 (45:14.734)

wire.

speaker-0 (45:27.83)

You're out there. There's no like officials or like a rule book. What are like the rules or the guidelines that you have to follow to document everything so that people know you did do this?

speaker-1 (45:41.868)

Yeah, well the cool thing is now is that traditionally you can't manipulate data. It is becoming easier to do and there are people within the space that are doing it. But the greatest thing about Strava is that it has cadence data and you can see cadence data. So the cool thing for me is that if my watch is going, you're going to know where I'm moving and is the cadence going to match up to the heart rate, right? Like if you're into the runner nerd stuff, you can look at data and be like, you know.

So yeah, it's a test, right? It's a test of free will because guess what? I'm out there. No one's seeing me. We can turn the cameras off and I could sit on the van. There's always jokes about, you know, about shit like that with these long distance events. Like people are saying Paul Johnson did that and William Gooch did that and it's fucking funny shit. But like, yeah, you're right, you know? But it's almost a test of like,

Am I who I said I was, right? Like I grew up a pathological liar. would, you know, and we moved around a lot and I would just fib and make up stories about myself when I was a kid and like, you know, my dad is rich and I didn't even have a dad, you know, like I would, because I felt like I needed people to like me. And you know, now it's like a fraud check. You know, you go out there and you have those moments in your head where you're like, nobody would know. It's like, but I would know. And I'm, and I am not that person.

Right? that's most, yeah, yeah. And that's the most, you know, when you get out there in a multi-day event and you're eight days deep and you're 400 miles in and you are suffering from heat exhaustion and you can barely even take a step forward, your brain wants every way out of it. But every single day that I woke up was another day for me to prove who the fuck I am to myself.

speaker-0 (47:13.038)

It's a different type of It is.

speaker-1 (47:40.182)

And how could I ever live with myself if I fraughted myself? I wouldn't be able to because my entire foundation right now is built off of like, am who I say I am. And that's it.

speaker-0 (47:57.986)

watched the entire docu-series of the most recent run across Texas, and it's something very, very subtle, but I picked up on. when you would spray paint at the end of the day, you know, your initials and the day that you had just completed. I honestly think more times than not, you had to ask what day is it?

What's the balance there between being focused on the goal and knowing where you're trying to get versus just so in the moment that you are just focused on the next step.

speaker-1 (48:32.738)

Yeah, you know, I think that the big thing for me is that, you know, I couldn't look at it as days. You know, I had to look at it as. And this might sound cliche, but like today is, is day zero. Tomorrow is day zero. The next day is day zero. Right? Like now granted day one, two, three, and four are one, two, three, and four. But once you get to like five through 15.

nothing really makes sense anymore because you're in that routine. Once you get about a weekend, you're in that routine of like, you know, wake up, do it, go to sleep, wake up, do it, go to sleep. And if you focus on, you know, on the miles and the, and how many days deep are we right now, you're so far away and it will destroy you. And that was kind of what I found out, you know, when I, when I did the first Texas is that it was like, I was like counting down the miles in my head.

I'm like, I know it's 840 miles. And if I do 40 miles today, now it's 800. And if I do 50 miles today, now it's 750. And I did that for like seven days. And I was like, holy fuck, 600 miles is so far. You know, so for me, like this time it was like, I really did, I lived every day like it was the same day. And it makes it hard because sometimes you forget to like stop and just take it all in.

because you're so focused on just, you know, the more miles I run today or the less that I have to run on the very last day. And it's a, it's hard to put into words or even explain any of that, I guess. But I, I know I can see myself in my head, like a movie from what you're talking, right? But in that moment, I can't, I can't put myself in that moment. If that makes sense. Like, I think there was just so much going on that that must've just been.

a thing that I did, you know?

speaker-0 (50:33.61)

Do you replay any scenes a lot in your head from that?

speaker-1 (50:38.67)

From the Texas run? Yeah. Yeah. You know, there's a couple of key scenes in my head. Like, you know, day one when we started, we were on this long highway and we were coming out of like these wheat fields in Oklahoma and the wind, was like 25, 30 mile an hour winds. And there was, you know, like when you blow a dandelion, the air was just dandelions everywhere. And these trucks kept going by.

that had grain in the back of them. And it was so windy that the grain was blowing everywhere. So I felt like I was running through like a sandstorm. Like, and I had a, had a buff like covering my mouth and it was crazy. Then there's another one. You probably saw the shot of me like running next to the train. We saw the train. We literally stopped to get that shot because it was so cool. Like running next to a train. Then we stopped at Waterburger when we got down into San Antonio.

or not Whataburger, P. Terry's, shout out P. Terry, Patrick Terry, the homie, Patrick Terry. He was like, yo, stop at my restaurant. I was supposed to meet him and I didn't get to meet him, but they were so supportive and they gave the whole team burgers and fries and all of that. We all absolutely felt like dog shit after we ate them because we were not used to that type of food. Yeah, like P. Terry's. then when I saw the horse, that was incredible. The horse.

The horse became a, to me became like a sign from God of like, which is crazy because now I find out it's the year of the horse. And, you I always say the horse, you know, guys can go find this. This is such a long story. Go find it on Red Rocks podcast. I believe that like I saw this horse and I touched it and it healed my Achilles. If you're interested in that Red Rocks podcast, the horse and then another, very key, like the most key moment was the last sunset.

speaker-0 (52:14.371)

Yeah.

speaker-1 (52:37.452)

And I was able to, it kind of actually just gave me goosebumps. I was just able to, for the first time in my life, like I just slowed down and I remember looking and I was like, this is the last time that I'll ever do this. You know, like I'm never gonna run across Texas again. I will not. I don't want to. It destroyed my body. And I just remember looking at this sunset and I'm like, this is it.

Because tomorrow I wake up and the only thing we're going to be thinking about is that finish line that's 30 miles away. I took a picture and I moved on. But I just remember that moment I was like, I did it again. It was just a very clarity moment for me.

speaker-0 (53:28.094)

And I think it was the second to last day in the video. It was the video where you were like, you know, no film crew today. I just want to talk straight to you. And you said, God is calling me to learn how to slow life down a little bit. What's that mean to you?

speaker-1 (53:46.648)

to not have to do things, to not feel like I need, I get caught in this cycle and I've talked to friends about this too, maybe you'll even understand. I see people on Instagram that aren't doing things, right? That aren't training for events and destroying their bodies. And I'm like, man, like I'm jealous. Like I wish I could just go kick back by the pool and do those cool things. And then,

I get to that point where I'm kicked back by the pool and I'm like, and then I see my friends training for 50s and hundreds and I'm like, damn, like, I wish I could, you know, be training for that right now. And it's just, it's this circle of emotions that, you know, but yeah, the, the, the saying was, and I talked to Amanda about this is I'm like, I feel like God's calling me to enjoy the mundane, to enjoy the peace, to enjoy the fruits of my labor that I have, you know, that I have.

I have been going nonstop since 2023, 2020, guess. And here's the thing, I'm going to be completely honest right now. If with the White House run and we're announcing that publicly on social media next week, with the White House run, if it was not the White House, I would not have done it. But I told Amanda, I'm like, how would I ever be able to tell my kids?

yeah, your dad was going to run to the White House, but then he said no. Like no way, you know, but I was set and like, wasn't going to do it. I wasn't going to do another big run. I was, I was done. And honestly, truly this White House one might be my last on the road multi-day event. You know, I might, I might do a 200, but like, I just, I need some time to just be me and learn who I am outside of, of training and fitness and.

You know, of that, like the Ironman's fun, right? Because I don't really have to, like, what it took for me to train to run across Texas was six hours a day of full commitment to training. Seven days a week, 42 hours a week of putting my body through shit. And that's something that I don't ever want to do because I, the way that I feel now,

speaker-1 (56:11.276)

like feel physically is incredible. And I'm just running, you know, 50 to 70 miles a week. And I say just running, but like that is so normal to my body. I was running 150 miles a week training for Texas and 350 miles a week during the 36 days of the total Texas traverse. And yeah, you know, it's just, it's, I don't need to do anything.

speaker-0 (56:38.734)

Do you know who James Lawrence is? So I him on the show a while back for people who don't know him, 100 Ironmans in 100 straight days. Yeah, 101. Yeah, 101, exactly. 101, 101. The fascinating about him is that he said that the recovery was the thing that was harder than actually doing it. I think he said it like, to feel like he fully recovered took like two years. He said he just like, couldn't get back to parasympathetic. Yeah.

After running that, especially doing like these big events.

What's it like getting back to equilibrium?

speaker-1 (57:16.002)

Yeah. For me, to be completely transparent, I have all the data to back it up with Whoop as well. Like my recovery is a superpower. Like I had during the entire Texas event, I had two red recoveries and I had like 15 greens and three yellows. know, green is like the best, like green is great. Red is terrible. Yellow is medium. And that's, that's my superpowers being able to recover. Texas one.

fucked me up when I was done. Like I was having, you know, blood sugar issues, re-regulating my blood sugar because I was eating 2,000 carbs a day and then I came home and I, anytime I would eat a carb, my insulin would dump and I would crash, I would get dizzy. But post Texas this time, I finished Texas on Friday night and I ran on Monday morning. I went for a little 5K, I watched the sunrise and it was the most beautiful thing in the world.

And I remember telling Amanda, like, I'm not going to run for months after this. And I drove to church on Sunday morning after I finished and I was watching the sunrise and I was like, I am born to run. Like running is who I am. And I craved that there's something about watching the sunrise when you're out on the side of a highway, not out your window when you're driving to work, not out your bedroom window when you're waking up, but being out in the world and watching the sunrise from the middle of a field.

is incredible and I craved that and I went for, I woke up early and I went for a run and I watched the sunrise. yeah, I mean, I think I ran 30 miles the week after Texas and then ran 50 and I've been running 50 to 70 ever since. It's just who I am. It's what I love to do. My body craves it.

speaker-0 (59:04.386)

Dude, I think I know what your next event should be.

speaker-1 (59:06.798)

What's that?

speaker-0 (59:09.08)

I think you should write a book. Yeah. I think that's the thing that'll...

continue to give you that stimulation, but do it in a intellectual way.

speaker-1 (59:22.759)

Yeah, I've actually, I have a friend that has wrote five or six of his own books and I've talked to him about helping me do that.

speaker-0 (59:30.606)

I mean, that'll be full circle. Yeah. Yeah.

speaker-1 (59:33.048)

Yeah, I agree. I agree, 100%. I think it'd be an incredible thing. It'd be very hard for me to do. Yeah, but I like that.

speaker-0 (59:39.96)

well. That's exactly why.

Matt, it's been great talking with you today.

speaker-1 (59:46.126)

Thank you

speaker-0 (59:48.398)

fun. Where can people who don't know you, where can they learn more about you, anything else you'd like to share? Yeah.

speaker-1 (59:53.966)

Instagram obviously is the big one and Hammer and YouTube this year. We're doing a video every single week.

Find me on YouTube, find me on Instagram, Google my name, I guess. You can find all the articles there. Yeah, I'm just a dude that does some things.

speaker-0 (01:00:15.726)

Thanks. The Alchemist. Yeah. Awesome. Great talking with you.

speaker-1 (01:00:19.438)

Thank you.