Episode 60 With Toni Serofin

This week's guest is Toni Serofin, a book designer from Canada, who specialises in working with self-publishing authors.

Toni to the drastic step of a very short haircut, to speed her journey to all grey, and still likes to keep her hair short. after the grow out, her hair was whiter than she would like, so now she adds some lowlights, to give more depth to her colour.

Transcript

Helen: Hello, and thanks for joining me, Helen Johnson for the Happier Grey Podcast. I'm pro-ageing and love my grey hair, but I know it can be quite intimidating to take the plunge. So, each week I'll be chatting to other women who've chosen to embrace the grey in the hope of inspiring and supporting you, whether you already have silver hair in the process of going grey or just considering ditching the dye.

Today I'm joined by Toni Serofin, a book designer with over 15 years of experience helping self-publishing authors bring their books to life. She specializes in books with niche topics such as personal finance, spirituality, history, and memoirs, and loves connecting with each author client and seeing the pride they take in sharing their book with the world. 

Good morning for you, Toni.

Toni: Hello. Good morning from Canada.

Helen: I'm gonna start by asking you, can you remember when you found your first grey hair?

Toni: No, and I'll tell you why. I've been colouring my hair since I was in my early twenties. So, I never noticed any grey coming in.

Helen: Did you start colouring it just for fun?

Toni: Yes, I did. Yeah.

Helen: And did you experiment with lots of different colours? 

Toni: Yeah. Originally it was bleached out, and punked out because it was the Eighties. And then I moved on to, allowing my natural colour to come through in doing blonde highlights. Along the way I ended up red, for a while. And then, when it got too difficult to cover the grey, and I never really knew how much I had, we switched to colouring me in ash blonde with blonde highlights.

So, yeah.

Helen: And did you colour it yourself or did you get your salon?

Toni: Mostly the salon. A few times I did it myself, but I was never satisfied with the result. And also, I'm very specific about the way my hair looks. I went to a salon.

Helen: And you've got short hair now. Has it always been short?

Toni: Always, I haven't had long hair since I was 19. I moved away from my home-town to the bigger city of Vancouver. Just before I left, I cut my hair, you know, new start and when I was 23 years old. So, I've been short ever since.

Helen: And would you say your hair's fairly central to your image for you?

Toni: Yeah, that's the way I feel. I don't know how others feel, but my hair is so important to me.

Helen: I think a lot of people feel that way,

Toni: Yeah.

Helen: and I think that's one of the reasons why it's so traumatic if people suffer hair loss.

Toni: Absolutely. Yes.

Helen: When did you decide to stop dyeing your hair?

Toni: 2019, I had my hair highlighted and ready for a trip to Italy and, you know, by that point it was costing a fair bit to have the tech, and the haircut, and everything. When we got back, I just decided. I had been talking to my hair stylist about it prior, and I decided to let it grow out.

So, I let it go to a point, and then I got super, super shortcut. Kind of unattractive really in a way. It was very, masculine looking. But I just wanted it all off, and I was really interested to see what I had. 

And then, the pandemic arrived in 2020, and like so many people, I wasn't able to go to the hairdresser. So, I just let it keep growing until she could open her salon again in, I guess, April or May of 2020.

Helen: Okay, so was it even shorter than a pixie cut?

Toni: Yes, it was. It was buzzed on the sides, a couple of inches on top. So, yes, it was very short. The advantage of that is I didn't have to have a haircut. As it turned out, I wasn't able to get a haircut for several months. So the pandemic, as far as my hair goes, it worked out really well for me that way.

Helen: Because you had your hair cut so short, I'm guessing the whole grow process was pretty quick?

Toni: Yeah. My hair grows fairly quickly. And even when I had what I call Pandemic hair, I did not look unkempt. I love hair products. Can't do short hair without hair products, Helen.

Helen: And regular haircuts.

Toni: Yes, that's true. That's true. Regular haircuts.

Helen: Those of us with long hair, I get mine cut about every three months. 

Toni: I've tried to grow my hair longer. I flirted with that last year. So longer for me would've been like chin length instead of the really shortcut I have now. And I have naturally wavy hair. So, I thought it would work out okay, and I could scrunch dry it.

It looked beautiful. The curls were gorgeous. And I felt more like I looked like a grandma, rather than my youthful image of myself. I know we all have this image in our heads of how we wanna be. And yeah, I just didn't like it. I am not really officially a grandma. Anyway, I got a cut. Long story short, I got a cut again. 

And now I have a really big bottle of mousse for curly hair. I need to find someone to give that to.

Helen: So, do you use any special shampoos and conditioners for grey hair, or are you just focusing on the curly?

Toni: My stylist introduced me to Silver Shampoo, by Clairol. It's a nice product. I do a wash with that every week and then just use regular shampoo in between. 

I actually still colour my hair, I've got lowlights instead of highlights. Now I've got the dark bits added. 

Helen: Okay.

Toni: Yes. Yeah, this streak in the front, and on the sides. I started doing that a couple of years ago, because my hair is mostly white, and then I've got like a little black or darker hair in the back. And I wanted more depth. So, I'm not done colouring my hair. I'm just doing it in the reverse.

Helen: And why do you do that?

Toni: I want the visual depth, and because for me it gives a youthful lift. Because my hair kind of frames my face. 

Helen: Yeah.

Toni: I just, prefer the way it looks. Yeah, it's fun.

Helen: So, did you have it without that for a while?

Toni: Yeah, I did.

Helen: But you felt washed out?

Toni: Yeah, agreed. And I said, I'm not digging this. First of all, it started with my hair was kind of frizzy, because, you know, the follicle's different texture. So, she was adding a toner to smooth it out, and it added a bit of a sheen. 

And then I said. What else can we do? Let's play around with some colour. So, I went from a really basic cut, to adding a little bit of technical work by her. The price it went really low, comparatively speaking. And then I started to increase my services with her. 

And now my prices, you know, what I pay to a hairdresser, that cost has risen again. So, for a while I was saving money. But I feel like, looking the way I wanna look, and feeling confident is. I've got the budget for it, so why not?

Helen: Do you have to have the colour that you have now as frequently as you had the overall colour?

Toni: Not at all. Probably every, let me see, every other time, and I go in every six weeks to have my hair cut. So, every other time she'll do the foils, do the lowlights for me, maybe every 12 weeks I'm having colour added. Yeah.

Helen: But it's just a little patch at the front?

Toni: There's a little bit on the front. She does some on the sides. She just uses a paintbrush. It's lots of fun.

Helen: And is it, permanent or semi-permanent?

Toni: it's permanent. It grows out or gets cut out.

Helen: Ah, interesting. I have spoken to someone before who has, some pink streaks from time to time.

Toni: Many women with white hair do that. Blue is also popular where I am. I never was attracted to the colour. My hair's important to me, but I'm also kind of a mix of conservative, and adventurous. I don't know. I'm a Libra. I'm just, I guess I'm trying to strike a balance.

Helen: When you were talking about the colours, you coloured your hair, they all sound fairly natural? 

Toni: The red wasn't so natural. But it's funny 'cause when I met my spouse, I was a redhead, and he loves redheads. I said, hey buddy, this is not natural. Just so as you know, so you could run away right now. He said, no, no, no., I like you for you not just your hair colour.

Helen: Okay, so a different question now then. Has your style and the colours that you wear changed since you went grey?

Toni: Yes. As an ash, I was a blondie like many people are as a kid. And as I got older, I had blonde streaks, and then I became more like an ash, ash blonde, ash brown, and I could never wear black. 

I actually talked to a clothing stylist who recommended that most people really shouldn't be wearing black. It's just too harsh. You want grey as your neutral, or a type of brown if it works for you. But I would wear, if people are familiar with colour theory, more of a Summer Palette.

Helen: Mm-hmm.

Toni: When I changed my hair colour, black looks not bad on me, although I still don't like to wear a lot of it. 

I can wear patterns. More intense geometrics. I feel like they work better with my hair colour. And I am wearing brighter, deeper colours, like, you know, a deep purple or berry reds. 

My favourite colour is orange and I can't wear orange. It doesn't quite work with my hair, which is interesting. My skin tone hasn't changed.

So long answer to your question, yes.

Helen: it sounds like maybe you're wearing some slightly brighter colours or more dramatic colours now.

Toni: Yes, yes. More dramatic, and maybe my personality's become more dramatic. As I've aged, I am becoming more of myself. And I feel like the personality is front and centre. I mean, yeah.

Helen: So, no plans to fade into the background then?

Toni: No. Although I'm an introvert in that I need my space, and I need to rest. I have like, bursts of energy in public. I'm not like doing public outbursts. That's not what I mean. It's just, I am a little bit, more comfortable with being outspoken. That's the answer I was searching for.

Helen: I can absolutely understand the introvert thing. If I go to a networking event, or God forbid two in one day, then I just have to go outside, or lie down.

Toni: If I did back-to-back networking, I would also have to lie down. It's a lot. That's a lot of expended energy. Absolutely.

Helen: Yeah. If you were an extrovert, you'd be energized by it. But an introvert, you're drained by it.

Toni: Exactly. Yep.

Helen: okay. I'm gonna ask you just slightly different question then. You are wearing quite long earrings today.

Toni: Mm-hmm.

Helen: Is that again part of your image?

Toni: No. I like them with this shirt, because it's got a pattern. I typically wear tiny earrings. My styles evolved where my earrings are simpler, and generally silver colour. 

I used to make earrings for fun, like a side hustle when I, was working as a designer. When I had a job. I would make earrings and they were dangly, and flouncy, and multi-tiered, but my style now is more simple. I want you to focus on my hair.

Helen: It's the centrepiece.

Toni: Exactly.

Helen: Coming back to your hair, what was the reaction from your friends and family when you decided to go grey?

Toni: They loved it. I didn't get one criticism. I remember saying years ago, I am going to go to the grave colouring my hair. You're never gonna see me with white hair. And, never say, never. Everybody supported my decision. Yeah.

Helen: And have any of your friends grown those out subsequently?

Toni: I had a friend, who passed in 2021, she went grey in her late forties. And she had longer like, shoulder length hair and it looked fantastic on her, and she had a beautiful dark streak in the front. And then she started to add colour. Pink and the blue coordinated with a lovely cut. It looked great. She was kind of a role model for me. I just didn't take up the mantle until much later. 

And I still know women in their fifties who colour. You gotta do what works for you. I have a friend with an amazing mane of Auburn natural curly hair, and she's not ready to go there yet. She's just continues to colour her hair. It looks fantastic on her. It doesn't look like she's trying too hard. It still looks natural.

Helen: You've gotta do what's right for your mental health. And if continuing to dye your hair makes you feel more confident and happier, then that is the right path for you. Whereas if you think you wanna go grey. Then that's maybe the right path for you.

In terms of aging well, are you doing anything to look after your health, in terms of exercise and diet?

Toni: Oh yeah. Oh yes, definitely. I exercise three to four times a week, whether I'm going to the gym or walking on off days, alternate days. But you know, I didn't start a regular exercise routine until I was in my early forties. But exercise is definitely important. You gotta keep moving.

I even exercise when I'm having a little back pain or whatever. It's just gotta keep moving. I just take care to not overdo it. And I garden, it's Spring, lots of work to do in the yard. That's a lot of heavy lifting. 

The diet, not so much. Recently I experimented with, what's called a metabolic diet. As many women do, I gained a lot of weight in my middle, and I felt very uncomfortable in my body. So, I did a little 10 day eating routine, or food routine where I cut out many things, and upped the amount of vegetables and leafy greens that I was eating. 

As a result, I lost like eight pounds simply from not eating bread. Not eating after 7:00 PM. I like my wine, so I didn't stop drinking. That's my experiment. You know, because again, as a Libra it's like, well, I wanna feel better, but I also like drinking white wine. So, you know, I don't really wanna give it up.

That's not much of an answer for you. Yes. To the exercise. Not so much to the diet. I think I eat reasonably, and I don't eat junk food. I don't eat prepared foods. We cook at home. Okay. I indulge in chips every now and then.

Helen: Doesn't everyone?

Toni: Yeah.

Helen: So, coming back to your hair, can you remember why you decided to go grey?

Toni: I was fed up with having it coloured. I was getting it coloured and highlighted, having the roots and the highlights every five weeks. By going grey, I was able to stretch out the times between appointments. 

I used to live in the city. I live in a rural area and the only way I can get into the city to get to my hairdresser because I am not giving her up, she's fantastic, is I need to take a ferry. So, it's a day long kind of excursion. The ferry ride's very short, but I'm in the city doing other things. I'm not gonna just do a trip for that one thing. So, I was able to stretch that out. 

It was a choice of, it was about budget, it was about convenience, it was about time saving. Yeah, I mean, my spouse laughs at me. Many of my choices are made. Based on financial reasons. And so ultimately that's what this ended up being. 

But as I mentioned earlier, since I've gone grey, I've started to add services. So now the price that I'm paying for her is backup to what I was paying prior.

Helen: And how do you feel about your grey hair?

Toni: I love it. I like it a lot because of the colour that's added frankly. But overall, I love it. People complimented me even when I didn't have the extra bits, the extra colour added. 

It's nice to not have the pressure, like I used to worry about my regrowth and the white hair showing. I'm taller than average, so I would joke that, well, it's a good thing nobody can really see my regrowth, because I need to go to the hairdresser.

So, it's just that the layer of concern about my appearance has been removed. Yeah.

Helen: Okay. I call it root stress. 

Toni: Root stress!

Helen: It's kind of that low level stress that you have. From about a week of having it coloured to the point that you get it coloured again all the time. 

Toni: Yes.

Helen: I can see white.

Toni: Yes. Wear a hat, wear a hoodie. I know it doesn't always work, especially when it's really hot outside.

Helen: I'm gonna ask you one last question then. So, if somebody came to you and said, I'm thinking about going grey, what advice and tips would you have for them?

Toni: I would say enthusiastically, do it. I would love to see what you look like with grey hair. You could have something amazing under that colour. 

And the tips I would give them are to, just rip off the bandage. It's difficult with people, who have longer hair though. I mean, I really understand the attachment to having long hair.

That's a hard question. First of all, I would enthusiastically say, do it, and then I would ask them more questions. I mean it was easier for me because I've had short hair and I want to keep my hair short. Easy thing to do. 

But when you're growing out, shoulder length hair. Wow. Talk to your hairdresser. That's some good advice. Talk to your hairdresser.

Helen: I mean, I was growing at shoulder length hair, because mine was bleach blonde before. And I had the line for, probably about 12 to 18 months. And then I went to a layered jaw length Bob, 'cause that was as short as I felt comfortable going.

Toni: Yeah.

Helen: And then grew it from there. But yeah, I think definitely don't get it cut shorter than you feel comfortable with.

Toni: Absolutely that would be a disaster. And I'm wondering if for longer hair, if different layering techniques would help to mitigate the appearance of the line, like the regrowth. So, you cut it a little shorter than you normally would get it cut, and then get some layering done. 

I mean, my hairdresser's an amazing resource. She's a creative, she's got ideas, and she's also, you know, highly, technically skilled. So, she's my go-to.

Helen: I think grey blending is a lot more of a thing now than it was as well.

Toni: Yes, yes. She joked with me, she said, you know, there are women in their thirties who are having their hair bleached white. Like it was a look in Canada, a style in Canada., It may have already left, England or the UK. Where it was a look, white, silver white hair for younger women. And I love the look.

And I was looking around at them going, what the heck? I've got this stuff naturally. I need to do something about this.

Helen: Anyway, I'm gonna say. It's been fascinating chatting to you, and enjoy the rest of your day.

Toni: You're so welcome. Thank you.

Helen: Thanks so much for joining me for this week's show. I hope you've enjoyed it as much as I have. I'll be back again next week, but in the meantime, you can follow me on Instagram at happier.grey. Have a great week.