68: National Jubilee Pilgrimage of Hope. A special episode

Episode 68: Following pilgrims walking from four corners of England & Wales, converging in Nottingham. Their pilgrim ways, named for the four evangelists, traced the sign of the cross on the land. The pilgrims speak of Catholic heritage, hospitality, the presence of God in nature, community, hope and love. One said, 'It's really good for the soul.' 

Find out more

Nottingham Cathedral Livestream

Hearts in Search of God Pilgrim Website

Padley Martyrs' Chapel

Brother, Sister, Let me serve you. Words and music by Richard Gillard 

A new episode, a different conversation, every Wednesday!
Email me: theresa@KindsofCatholic.co.uk
Facebook, Instagram, Bluesky and X/Twitter Give me a follow @KindsofCatholic
Find the transcript: https://kindsofcatholic.buzzsprout.com

The podcast is kindly supported by the Passionists of St Patrick's Province, Ireland & Britain and by CAFOD.

Music: Greenleaves from Audionautix.com

Transcript

You're listening to All Kinds of Catholic with me, Therese Alessandro. My conversations with different Catholics will give you glimpses into some of the ways we're living our faith today.  Pope Francis used the image of a caravan for our travelling together on a sometimes chaotic journey.  And Pope Leo, quoting St Augustine, reminds us, Let us live well and the times will be good. We are the times. I hope you'll feel encouraged and affirmed and maybe challenged now and then.  I am too in these conversations. And if you're enjoying them, it helps if you rate and review on the platform where you're listening. Thank you.

Listeners, welcome to this special episode about the National Jubilee Pilgrimage of Hope.  You will hear lots of voices from pilgrims who were walking. But first I met with Phil a few weeks before the pilgrimage began and he'll explain what it's all about. Good to see you, Phil. We're meeting a few weeks before now the National Jubilee Pilgrimage of Hope begins.  And I remember that we met last year in Shrewsbury when I walked a little bit of the Shrewsbury pilgrimage route with you. I remember you talking about this national pilgrimage that was in the planning stages then. So how's it going now? Where are you at with these few weeks to go? 

Yeah, I think we're in a pretty good place. All the routes are planned. They've been trailblazed. We've got four groups of perpetual pilgrims walking each route, which is what we're hoped for. We've all had a formation weekend together and now we're opening the day pilgrim registrations and they're coming in slowly and steadily. Just tell us a bit about then for listeners who haven't been following closely, I know that the routes have been chosen to make this cross shape across the nations, which I think is really beautiful. Tell us a bit about how that came about.

 Well, I've always been supported by the Sisters of the Holy Cross in this project. When I was starting to think about doing something for the Jubilee year, I thought it would be a beautiful thing to do. Bless our countries with the sign of the cross and also with the Gospels. And I was inspired by the Eucharistic pilgrimage that happened in the United States last year which also made a sign at the cross. But I thought it would be good to add in the names of the evangelists too. So it's the names of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John for the four routes, all arriving in the same place. So the idea is they make a sign of the cross, bless our nations with the gospels and with prayer as we go along. And we try to embody the values of the Sisters of the Holy Cross which are compassion, faith, prayer and community. So those are the four things we'll be attempting to achieve while we're en route.

That sounds very rich. You know, it's a rich experience for people as well as just making the journey together and achieving that. It's quite a long journey that Perpetual Pilgrims will be making, isn't it? 

It is. It's quite long, quite challenging. So from Cardiff to Nottingham is about 210 miles. So it’s fairly tough walking up the Wye Valley and over the Malvern Hills. It will be a physical challenge as well as a psychological and spiritual challenge. 

I'm due to meet your group as you're walking now in Lichfield. So listeners there'll be a moment now later in the episode where I'm meeting up with you again and you'll be, well, I hope you won't have blisters, but you'll be a bit more tired perhaps at that point. 

Possibly. 

I'll talk with some of the other people walking with you and I'm going to be checking in with all of the routes, en route as it were. Then I'm going to meet the pilgrims as they're arriving in Nottingham for the vigil of the Feast of the Exaltation of the Cross. So that's on the Saturday evening, isn't it? 

That's right. So we'll be arriving between three and five on that afternoon and the cathedral parish are very kindly putting on tea, coffee and cakes. And then we'll have a welcoming liturgy. Later on in the evening we'll be having a meal together and a ceili. So I'm looking forward to that. And then next morning the pilgrimage will finally conclude at the Solemn Mass at 11.15 in the Cathedral. It should be an exciting time. 

And I think I'm right in saying when we talked before that Bishop Patrick, the Bishop of Nottingham, you know, has been a great support to this. 

He has. He'll be around that weekend, I hope. But yes, he was one of the inspirations for this when we walked together on the Nottingham Way. He talked to me about, What are we going to do about the Jubilee and maybe you could come to Nottingham. And then he suggested the Feast of the Exaltation of the Holy Cross. 

Fantastic. So I'll see you then in Lichfield Phil in due course. 

See you in Lichfield. Foot sore and tired and hopefully not too grumpy. 

So I headed over to Norwich on the day the St Luke's leg was setting out from there to make their way to Nottingham via Walsingham. The pilgrimage officially began with Mass in the Cathedral, celebrated by Bishop Peter Collins, the Bishop of the Diocese of East Anglia. And Bishop Peter prayed with us all and sent us out together to begin our pilgrimage. 

Heavenly Father, in communion with your beloved Son, we set forth on our pilgrim way this day. Bless all those from North, South, East and West who are undertaking this great pilgrimage walk. May our hearts be filled with hope in this year of Jubilee. May our sacrifices and our offerings help bring renewal to all God's people. And bless us all in our task of sanctifying the world that you have entrusted to us under the guidance of the Holy Spirit and in your beloved Son Jesus Christ. May Almighty God bless and keep you, the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. 

We had a great photo on the Cathedral steps too and then off we went into quite a showery morning and here I am chatting with some of the people who were in that group… So Daniel, tell us a little bit about why you're here today. 

Well, I actually, although I'm 56 years old, I very recently became a Catholic. I was baptised this Easter, so that's just a few months ago. But on the other hand, I've been interested in pilgrimage for a very long time. In fact, when I was in my twenties, I lived in Spain and I did the Camino de Santiago. Perhaps that's partly where my interest in becoming a Catholic actually began in many ways. Pilgrimage is one of the things I like most about the many things you can do as a Catholic. So I'm delighted to be here.

Okay and you're joining as a day pilgrim although you're doing a day tomorrow as well all the way to Walsingham is that right? 

That's right yeah.  

Have you been to Walsingham before?  I have yes, as a tourist I've been to Walsingham very lovely very pretty village it is too, but this is the first time I'll be visiting it as a Catholic. Much more meaningful.  I look very forward to paying my respect to Our Lady in two days’ time.

So Dane, thanks so much for joining the podcast. Perhaps you’d tell us a little bit about why you've joined the pilgrimage today. 

Doing pilgrimage or walking helps me relax and strengthen my faith.  Time to think about what's happening in my life, something like that.  

Reflect a little bit, okay. And do you find it helpful to just walk and reflect quietly yourself? Do you like talking to people as you walk? Bit of both? 

A bit of both. I like talking to other people as well. I've met a few people from my previous pilgrimage last Holy Week and I enjoyed it. We are still friends. 

So you did a pilgrimage in Holy Week? And you enjoyed it so much you've found, you've made time to come and do this again.  And just for listeners, this is a weekday. So have you cleared some space in your diary to be here? 

Yeah, I swapped shifts. I work as a nurse and our schedule is three months ahead. So... 

Well, that's real commitment. Terence, thanks for taking a minute to talk as we're walking along here on the Marriott Way just outside Norwich and I understand you're a perpetual pilgrim on the St Luke's Way so what does that entail? 

Perpetual pilgrim means basically you've made a commitment to walk the whole route so I've chosen St Luke's Way so that's going to be 10 days or 10 nights, approximately 17 miles a day.  

That is a massive commitment and a great service for the groups. Different people will be joining on different days of that route won't they?  

That's right Theresa. The sort of responsibility of perpetual pilgrim crept up on me a little bit. When I signed up, in a selfish way, I just gave myself two weeks to go on a pilgrimage. I thought that would be it.  But we had a formation meeting in London in June. All the four groups came together. It showed the depth of the responsibility, really, because we've got day pilgrims signing up and we are responsible for them. So we've got first aid and marshalling, etc. So yeah, it's come up as a bit of a surprise, but it's fine. I'm happy.

It certainly is a service, isn't it?

Yeah, it is a service. Just looking ahead, if I may, this is fast forwarding to Nottingham. The pilgrims, as we all group together in Nottingham at St Barnabas in the afternoon, we're going to have a pilgrims’ liturgy. One of the things in the formation weekend in London that I put forward was a hymn, one of my favourite hymns, Brother, Sister, Let Me Serve You, which has been chosen and is going to be sung. So I'm very privileged and grateful for that. 

I'll be there too, Terence, so I'll think of you when that hymn comes up, I'll know where that came from…So I'm walking with Mary and now the sun's come out. 

Yes, glorious.  

It was raining for a bit but we're okay. I'm actually feeling a bit warm now. 

Yes, me too.  

Mary, thanks for taking a moment to talk. Just tell us, for listeners then, what’s brought you to the pilgrimage today? 

Yes, so I happened to sit next to a friend in church one Sunday morning and she said, I just feel I need to tell you about this walk that's going to be taking place in a few weeks’ time. And we're walking for peace. And reclaiming England back for God and for Mary and forming a cross across the whole of England. 

That's right. 

Oh, what a fantastic idea. And I thought, you know, we all are aware of the dire need our country is in, and the world and the things that are going on. We all want peace. We're all longing for that. 

Yes. 

So if I could play a very little part in that, I'll go for it. 

And then, listeners, we said the Angelus together standing under the trees led by Father Peter, who was also one of the perpetual pilgrims on this route.  And I left the group there, looking forward to seeing some of them again in Nottingham… The St Mark's Way group were walking from Leeds to Nottingham.  I had the great privilege to meet them at Padley Martyrs' Chapel, which is outside Sheffield. This is a place from where two young priests were taken in 1588 and executed for the practice of their faith.  We'll hear a little bit more about that from one of the pilgrims that I spoke to in a moment… Gerard, Gerard's eating cake, Listeners. So you've just arrived now at Padley Chapel. 

And we've just come through an SSI area in Burbage Brook, Burbage Gorge, which has got so much amazing natural history, prehistory. It's a very special place spiritually and you cannot but walk down that brook with the dappled light, the running water, and thinking, We are in some special place. 

Queenie is the group's first-aider and a nurse and she also was talking about this spiritual element of the pilgrimage for her. 

This pilgrimage has taught us the simplicity of life and that it's a real time for reflection. And from the spiritual point of view, it's a very good time to re-engage with your faith and to share it along the way. 

Queenie's husband, Frank, captured some of the day-to-day experience of walking as part of a group.

I started from Leeds, so that was on Saturday, was it? So what day is it today? I've lost track. 

It's Tuesday today. And how are you finding it? Are you getting increasingly tired?

No, I'm getting increasingly encouraged.  We've had such wonderful hospitality from all of our hosts along the way in various churches.

Seems like you're getting to know a little bit about each other's lives. 

It doesn't just happen.  You may fall into step with somebody, you may spend some time by yourself. Other people walk at different paces. Somebody needs to tie shoelace. So you end up being strung out and you find your own rhythm. 

Alongside the perpetual pilgrims who are walking the whole route, there are day pilgrims joining just for the day, like these three women did. 

Hi, my name's Janice. I'm Carmel. I'm Yvonne.

So the three of you seem to be walking together.  Tell me about that, are you friends? 

Yes, we're all friends.  We all thought we'd come together and it's been fantastic. It's been wonderful. Absolutely. Wonderful.

So you've really enjoyed it at some level and can you put into words what it is that you've really enjoyed? 

I think from meeting this morning we went to Mass and during the Mass, the pilgrims, brought us together like a community there and you got a warmth. I had a really strong feeling of hope. Yes, really strong. I felt as though like something, a warmth, like something had lifted. And then we went over to the Anglicans. They met us and we did a prayer.  For me personally I think it's just an uplifting day all round for the friendship, the actual weather that we've been blessed with today and just the beauty of nature and I think just walking the peace and serenity is really, really good for the soul. And I think the thing that came to me is like, life is a pilgrimage. It's a journey all along, you know, the people that you meet, the history, the different backgrounds coming together. It just adds to it really.  

Listeners, these are three ladies who weren't sure they wanted to speak to me but my goodness you’ve captured so well there what the pilgrimage is about. I'm very moved speaking to you… Here I am joined by James. We're sitting outside Padley Chapel now with a bit of sun on us.  James how has the day been for you?  

Day's been marvellous.  I started off feeling rather tired, just as a result of things that have been going on in my life recently but now even having done this distance, I feel invigorated. 

Wonderful. 

And we've had a lovely reception here, tea, cake and just a sense of accomplishment. 

I think that's one of the lovely things about this National Pilgrimage that it's covering so much of England and Wales, people have got a really good opportunity to be here. 

You're right. I’ve walked in Spain. I've walked to Rome. I've walked across Germany, but I've never really felt the same sense that there's pilgrimage in this country. I know there is, but I've never felt as though I could tap into it.  And this national pilgrimage, this Jubilee of Hope.  It's a gift.  

Before I left Padley Martyrs’ Chapel and this group of pilgrims, I spoke to Rowan. Being in the chapel had brought up some strong feelings for Rowan, as you'll hear. What kind of day have you had, Rowan?  

It's been a hard day, but the sacrificial nature of a pilgrimage, especially when you're walking toward where the martyrs were caught, were harassed, were victimised. Walking in the footsteps as it were, almost, those painful footsteps of Christ walking to Calvary. You know, he had more than a rucksack on his back. And I think that aspect, that penitential aspect of a pilgrimage is something that's very important to me.  And what's also extremely important to me about a pilgrimage walk is the fact that it's a public act of witness to our Catholic faith that was suppressed for many centuries.  It's a way for me, as somebody with recusant Catholic heritage, to say to Henry VIII, and also to Thomas Cromwell and to those generations of Puritans who tried to erase us from the face of the earth: We're here, we're loud, we're proud, we're Catholic. And we love everybody and I even forgive them.  

And what a beautiful, fitting place to have this conversation, standing at Padley Chapel. 

It certainly is. I've never been here before. It's extremely moving to think that these men gave their lives for the faith. 

It absolutely is moving. I'm with you on that.  In fact, when I first arrived and had a look around the chapel, I've arranged to come and do a whole episode about the history here. It's deeply moving somehow for people who have faith still all these centuries later…  In the next part of this episode listeners, I went out to Lichfield and it was a rest day for the St Matthew's Way group who were walking in from Cardiff to Nottingham. I had a really good conversation with some of the perpetual pilgrims on that route, Jim, Dave, Phil and Catherine. You'll remember hearing from Phil at the beginning of this episode and that this national pilgrimage has grown out of his work. Here's how that conversation went. So Phil, how’s it been going so far? Have there been any hiccups? Are you feeling tired? 

I think we do get tired at the end of days, the longer days, but I think we've borne up remarkably well.  We've been in good spirits and cheerful together and we've been blessed by some wonderful day pilgrims.  

Now that we're on Wednesday and we're working towards Nottingham on Saturday, do you have a sense of the routes converging now and can you feel something of people getting nearer to Nottingham or do they feel very separate from you at the moment? 

Well, I'm in touch with Alison, Ian and Pat who are leading the other routes so  we do exchange odd messages and we do know things are getting closer. So yes, we'll all be in the Diocese of Nottingham fairly soon. 

Yes, so it's certainly getting a sense of the pilgrimages converging because the whole idea is to create the sign of the cross over England and Wales. And here we are, in a way, putting in the pieces of the jigsaw as we take every step nearer. Yeah, there'll be a great celebration when we join up.  We're not totally sure if we'll be up for the ceili dancing in the evening, on Saturday evening.  It does feel really right. And the welcome we've been given from the parishioners at every stage has been remarkable and a way of weaving in our walking with the local churches. And they've talked about their journeys as well with us. It's been very, very special.

Thank you, Jim. Catherine, how are you finding this experience? Is it everything you hoped for? 

Yes, it's just wonderful. The group that we've had has come together really well and we enjoy being together on rest days but we also enjoy inviting day pilgrims to come in and share our experience.  Every day we come closer, and we feel hope and that's growing. Definitely this sense of hope as we go through the parishes, as we experience the joy and the love that we've experienced along the way.  This feeling of a fire coming along and just burning hotter and hotter as we come through. And it's burning in our hearts and in the people around us. And I don't know any of the people coming from the other directions.  I'm really looking forward to meeting them all. It's going to be a really great celebration.  

A number of people along the way that I've been speaking to are talking about this sense of hope.  And that's great because this is the Jubilee Year of Hope.

I don't have much of a sense of Nottingham actually.  Still seems a very long way away, although I know it's three days of walking. I'm still very much in the present moment. I think one of the things that we have achieved on the way is to create a kind of bubble and this space that people come into it and they slot in really easily. We've been able to be deeply present to one another and to the people who join us and to our Lord on the way.  And I'm still very much in that space. I'm just trying to remain in that space for as long as I can because at some point I have to go home. 

Thank you, Dave. I was going to ask about what it's like having people joining just for a day.  

Fantastic. They've all bought different stories, some of great hope, some of joy.  Some people have bought quite painful stories with them.  Quite a lot of people, I think we’ve found, have been in a place where they have a decision to make or in a place of uncertainty and they've started to talk about that. That's perhaps surprised them. It's been really good to be completely present to that.

I'm just very struck by the thing that your blog is called All Kinds of Catholics and we are meeting all kinds of Catholics in this room. It's really remarkable that we've met people who are into the Latin Mass, people who are Charismatic renewal. And everybody, and it's not divisive in any way at all. Everybody's coming together in friendship and proximity, just real love and togetherness. The idea of pilgrimage and the actual process of walking the pilgrimage, I think, just brings people together. You can talk and you can say whatever's on your mind and what you believe in and what you don't believe in and  it doesn't tread on other people's dreams because we're all walking in the same direction.  Synodal. It is very much going together rather than having a discussion around a table, then you sort of start defending your position.  

So listeners, one of the things I've found on meeting the different routes along the way is that prayer is very much part of the pilgrimage and you'll hear some glimpses of prayer in this episode, but Jim suggested that we spend a moment in prayer together now, so we're going to do that before I leave today's group of pilgrims.  Well we thank you Father  for enabling us to live this Jubilee Pilgrimage of Hope, in the name of and with all the churches in our country. We thank you and we pray that the spirit of pilgrimage  may enthuse our churches way beyond when we arrive in Nottingham. This is all to the glory of God, Father, Son and Holy Spirit.  

We stood outside Lichfield Cathedral and sang some of the jubilee hymn while Jim accompanied us on the tin whistle. The group told me that they have been singing the hymn every day…The St John's Way group were walking from London to Nottingham and I met them at the Church of St Michael and All Angels in Hallaton, which is a village in Leicestershire. I was met there by two parishioners who understood a great deal about the history of that church in Hallaton, today an Anglican church. And they explained to me that although it's a quiet village now, actually that church was a major stopping point on the pilgrimage route to Walsingham hundreds of years ago and they have archaeological evidence that people travelled from the South West and from South Wales across England, stopping at Hallaton on their way to Walsingham on pilgrimage. And it was really interesting to have the group stop there on their way through. But this was a big day of walking for the group and they were running late for their lunch when I met them. And of all the pilgrims that I met on their way to Nottingham, this group were the most tired and hungry at that particular moment… Firstly, I interrupted Ian eating his sandwiches. We talked about what a long way it is on foot from London to Nottingham and I asked him if being out in nature was helping him feel a sense of being in the presence of God. I enjoy walking as a pilgrim within towns and cities because you’re a witness in that context. But when you're walking as a small group in the countryside, you're able to be a lot more contemplative about what you're doing and why you're doing it.  Nature just lends itself to being that place where you gradually fit in and your feet are just being placed gently across the countryside while you're thinking about other things and seeing beautiful things. 

Then Eddie shared a few words about his experience. I'm guessing you're the person bringing music and singing to this group? 

Yeah, not the only person. We've been very lucky that there's been a few very talented musicians. In a couple of the churches we've sang Taize chants in parts.  People have been really touched. So we've had great music at the Masses that we've had. We've been singing on the way, all kinds of random stuff, Undertones songs from the late 70s, early 80s.  We've been putting in different words. 

It's good that there's humour as well along the way

Oh, very necessary in life generally. It's tough, know, walking is tough, walking long distances. In a group of people that didn't know each other at all, humour is very important, music is very important and through the ages pilgrims have sung to keep going when you're flagging, when you get lost. 

Another perpetual pilgrim on this route is Angela and she is an experienced pilgrimage walker although she often walks on her own. So I was asking her a bit about what motivates her to do pilgrimage at all. 

Well a priest in my parish many years ago asked me, Angela, why are you always away in Holy Week?  And without thinking I just said, For me it's time out, to go within. A really good way of getting out of everyday life.  It really does do me such a lot of good. It's being out there in the countryside. It's the walking. 

And for this group I was wondering where prayer fits into their walking. 

We leave at lunchtime usually with a reflection. And the reflection can be on the Gospel of the day or on pilgrimage itself, on sayings of the saints. And we go out with that, having taken something from that in our hearts to just spend time with God and to listen to Him. 

And then listeners, it was the last day of walking, and I joined the St John's Way group again and walked with them on that last day from Keyworth to the Cathedral of St Barnabas in Nottingham. Bishop Patrick also joined the Pilgrim group for the day. And listeners, on that day we had sunshine, we had rain, we had thunder and lightning and we had a little hail as well. So I waited until we arrived in Nottingham, meeting all the other groups coming in from all corners, and then I talked to some of the pilgrims... Alison, you made it to the very end. How does it feel to be here at the Cathedral? 

It feels absolutely fantastic. I mean, there was never a moment when I thought that we wouldn't make it but it just feels really good to have got everybody here safely. 

Because you must have felt some responsibility leading a group all the way from London to here, day by day, more day pilgrims. 

Totally, totally. It's a big responsibility. And also I felt responsible for the people that we arranged to offer hospitality for us, Oh, we're going to be so late and we need to contact them and say we're running an hour late.  But they've all been amazingly accommodating. 

So you maybe can't process it all quite yet, but you feel some sense of accomplishment. 

Oh definitely. I mean, the sense that with our feet we've been walking a cross on the country - and the welcome that we've had. And the hospitality and being part of the parishes along the way, just feels like we've laid the foundations for something that can only grow bigger and better. 

So Bishop Patrick, thank you for spending a moment or two. We captured earlier in the episode that some of the pilgrimage that's happened now, that we've just got to the end of, you were part of the planning process. At least, in terms of the feast day I believe.

In terms of the feast day, in a meeting with Phil, probably on a walk with him when he was scoping out something of the walk here in Nottingham Diocese. Talking about the cross, I said, We have the Feast of the Exaltation of the Cross. That's the only bit I'm claiming, other than support from the very beginning. I thought brilliant idea, absolutely brilliant, and particularly in this year of hope. The notion of pilgrims of hope just comes alive in a very  visible way as we see people from the north and the south, the west and the east of the dioceses of England and Wales all coming together, converging on the eve of this beautiful Feast of the Exaltation. How good is that? Why would we not support that?

Exactly, yeah, I think it's a wonderful thing. You, like me, just walked today.

I did. 

We're surrounded by people who have walked a lot further, but it doesn't matter, does it? It's all part of the efforts that we can make. 

Part of the planning was that people might join even for a couple of miles along the various pilgrim routes, and that has happened. And I suppose I was part of that on the last leg today. All of those are pilgrims, whether they've walked the whole caboodle or even just a tiny little bit of it - it's our motivation that's the important thing. 

So Anita, you walked all the way from London in the St John's Way group.  Tell me how has it been to arrive finally at Nottingham? 

Oh amazing, ecstatic, exhilarating to be treated with all this lovely hospitality and meeting up with all these lovely people who've walked for miles and miles and miles for the last two weeks. Very exciting, absolute honour to be here.

I know that care for creation is really important to you and have you felt that while you've been walking? 

Absolutely, absolutely. Because when you're walking you slow down, you notice everything, notice creation, you notice the sun, you notice the wind.  Because you are part of nature, we are part of nature, and we are all connected to nature. So it's really nice to take the time to slow down and to notice those details. 

And how are the legs feeling at the end of that? 

Oh, legs aren't too bad. It's the feet. Actually, the feet are hurting. Yeah, I do have a few injuries, but I'm sure nothing that a good bath and a good relax won't sort out. maybe a little prayer. Maybe a little prayer to Saint Servatius, who's the patron saint of feet. 

Good tip for pilgrims.

I'll be praying to him tonight.

So listeners, you might remember Eoin from a previous episode. You cycled from home to Rome last year and here you are, you've cycled a lot of this pilgrimage route and how's that been?  

It's been epic. It's been very fulfilling, very rewarding. 

And you've joined the pilgrims, perpetual pilgrims on the St John's Way at one or two points.  How have you found it fitting in with that group? 

I only actually finally encountered them last evening. We had a Livingstone and Stanley moment at Keyworth. I previously had word from them at Northampton where I'd met somebody that they'd already encountered. So it was great to finally catch up with them and they made me welcome. It's been good to exchange stories about our shared but different experience on the St John's Way. 

So for you cycling, it's been more of a kind of solo experience, I suppose, this pilgrimage compared with groups who've been walking together.

I think it's definitely more chance to be in a kind of contemplative state. On the other hand, on a couple of times when you get to a place in the evening, it's just you - and then there's maybe a bit of a lack of a structure that might help kind of round out the day. But  I wouldn't change what I've done. I think cycle pilgrimage is valid and a good thing to do  as an adjunct with the walking pilgrimage. And it's even better when the two come together like yesterday evening. 

And maybe your experience might encourage a couple of other people to give it a go. 

With a little bit of organisation up front and with cooperation from the overall organisers like we had here, I think it's very feasible to have a mixed mode pilgrimage all uniting for the same common purpose. 

So Terence, I met you on your first day setting out from Norwich and here we are. You made it. How does it feel? 

Mixed emotions. So you've got four pilgrimages all converting at the same time in the same place. You've got a sort of sense of achievement, camaraderie, fellowship, admiration for each other, what we've actually done. And I'm feeling all those things, but I'm also feeling slightly apprehensive because it’s going to be a real privilege in about an hour or so that we're going to have a service for the pilgrims in the cathedral.  And from each of the four pilgrim routes, one person has sort of been self-selected to do some reflections. I'm in a state of flux. 

You can't relax yet. 

I can't quite relax yet, no. So my emotions are in a way under wraps a little bit. 

Listeners, we gathered in the cathedral for a beautiful pilgrim liturgy led by Bishop Patrick. It was live streamed and there's a link to the recording in the episode notes. So you can see the reflection Terence and pilgrims from each of the ways gave. Remember the hymn, Brother, Sister, Let Me Serve You which Terence mentioned in our first encounter? We sang it at the service, accompanied by some of the musicians who had made the pilgrimage. There was a fantastic ceili to round off the evening.  And in the morning, at last, Mass for the Feast of the Exaltation of the Cross, celebrated by Bishop Patrick. This was live streamed too and the link to the recording is in the episode notes for you. Bishop Patrick presented Phil with an apostolic blessing from Pope Leo for the National Jubilee Pilgrimage of Hope, bringing the good news of Jesus Christ to every corner of the nation. And I caught up with Phil once more before people began to disperse. Because as Dave said earlier, At some point we will have to go home. OK Phil, here we are at the very end. This must be the very end finally. 

I think so, yes.

Are you able to put together a few words about how it feels now to be here? 

I think the few words I would put together are I'm feeling a bit  overwhelmed but it has been a wonderful experience and I'm just thrilled that everyone got here safely and everyone seems to, as far as I can tell, to have really found it sometimes a profound but also always enjoyable and joyful experience. So that's, I think it's all that I could possibly hope it would turn out to be. Getting a message from the Pope of course is lovely as well. And the welcome that we've had here in St Barnabas's Cathedral has just been wonderful. The social event last night and then also the welcoming liturgy and the Mass today. All lovely.

Phil mentioned at the beginning the values of the Sisters of the Holy Cross, compassion, faith, prayer and community. I certainly saw those values in action when I interacted with people making this pilgrimage. And I hope you can feel that too in this episode. 

Thanks so much for joining me on All Kinds of Catholic this time.  I hope today's conversation has resonated with you.  A new episode is released each Wednesday.  Follow All Kinds of Catholic on the usual podcast platforms. Rate and review to help others find  it. And follow our X/Twitter and Facebook accounts  @kindsofCatholic. You can comment on episodes and be part of the dialogue there. You can also text me if you're listening to the podcast on your phone, although I won't be able to reply to those texts. Until the next time.