The Vertical MRO Podcast
Welcome to the Vertical MRO Podcast, where we explore the fascinating world of helicopter maintenance, repair, and overhaul. Our episodes feature MRO experts who share invaluable tribal knowledge and stories that are sure to inspire current and aspiring industry maintainers.
The Vertical MRO Podcast
Episode 104: Moving Aircraft Is Harder Than You Think | Don Lockie & Peter Van Dael
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Welcome to the Vertical MRO Podcast, brought to you by HeliCASTS and in partnership with Vertical Plus.
For this episode, Jon Gray sits down with Don Lockie of Aviation Resources Group and Peter Van Dael, product manager at Navi-Gate, for a live conversation recorded on the show floor at Verticon 2025.
While logistics often happens behind the scenes, it plays a critical role in keeping aircraft, components, and maintenance operations moving. Don and Peter share insights from years of experience coordinating aircraft transportation, navigating international regulations, and solving the unexpected challenges that can arise when moving high-value aviation assets around the world.
The conversation explores how supply chains have evolved since COVID, the importance of planning logistics early in a project, and why waiting too long to make transportation decisions can lead to unnecessary costs and delays. From regulatory requirements to practical decision-making, the discussion highlights the often-overlooked work that helps keep maintenance and operational schedules on track.
Whether you're moving a component across a border or relocating an entire aircraft, this episode offers practical lessons on planning, communication, and the partnerships required to make aviation logistics successful.
Special thanks to this episode's sponsors, Rotorcraft Support Inc and Metro Aviation.
Also, be sure to check out Vertical MRO's Instagram channel for even more awesome content highlighting the awesome work being done to keep the rotorcraft community flying!
Welcome to the Vertical MRO podcast, where we dive into the world of helicopter maintenance, repair, and overhaul. In each episode, we talk with the technicians, engineers, and experts who keep helicopters flying. Because at the end of the day, no maintenance, no mission.
SPEAKER_00Everybody always says logistics, why, as you said, why do we need it? But logistics is in our everyday life, not only for the helicopters or for the MRO community, but in our everyday life. To get your foods, to get your car, so everything has involved with uh with logistics.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, anything to add in there? I think it's a nice way of describing it. It is essentially, you know, in a day, if you sit back and look at all the things you've done today, how many things have been delivered to your, you know, have arrived either from a courier or back of a truck that eventually you know work their way back through to being on an aircraft or in a chipping container. It all orientates and that links back to our industry. Our aircraft don't fly, as as per the uh byline, correct me if I got it wrong, but you had it to Kelowna. No maintenance, no mission. That's the one, no, it's no mission. And I guess that's it. You add logistics to that. No logistics, no maintenance, no mission.
SPEAKER_03Thank you to this episode's sponsors, Metro Aviation and Rotocraft Support Inc. Hey, welcome to the Vertical MRO podcast. I'm today's host, John Gray, coming to you from Verticon 2026 in Atlanta, Georgia. It's been an amazing week so far. Uh, this is recording number two for the MRO, and we've got a returning guest, Don Lockheed. How are you doing, sir? I'm doing very well, sir. Very well. Traveled across the world to get here.
SPEAKER_02Well, half of it anyway, a lot of water between here and where I live.
SPEAKER_03So I guess it's fitting we're going to talk about logistics and the logistics surrounding how you got here might be a part of that conversation. But um, Don, you you've introduced me to somebody who uh played a part in the success that of Kelowna and the VMRO conference and in getting you there. Uh do us a favor and introduce our guest and and then we'll we'll learn a little bit about his background. Sure.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, so introducing uh Peter Van Vale, who is the CEO of Navigate uh Logistics and their aerospace side. And Peter was good enough to support us to come to Kelowna, as you as you said before, John. Um and what uh Navigate is doing is becoming effectively, I guess, uh one of the better providers of services to our industry. Uh they're specializing in moving uh all this all the aircraft right through to the large S92s through and currently have multi aircraft on the on the water. Um based in Belgium, uh primarily connected very well with Airbus Leonardo, and that's a little background. I think Peter, if you want to step in and uh you know tell a bit a little bit about how Navigate evolved and where you've come from.
SPEAKER_00Yep. So yeah, uh thanks for inviting me, John. Yeah, thanks for coming on, Peter.
SPEAKER_03And Nate, thank thank you again for the support in Colorado. It was great to have him with us.
SPEAKER_00It's uh it was important to get our name out there. Yeah. Um, Navigate is my my own company, as uh as Don said. I'm the managing director. Uh we're a small team of seven people, uh, based out of Antwerp with an office also in Zibruges. So centrally located into the shipping world, in the logistics world. Um I've been working in logistics for all my life already. Wow. Um doing any everything actually in the entire logistics chain, which has a lot of different uh connections. I've been a shipping line agent, I've been a shipping broker, I've been a terminal operator, uh doing containers, brake bulk, everything. So just a mix of everything. Uh but yeah, running an own company is even more exciting.
SPEAKER_03How did you find your way into the logistics business to begin with?
SPEAKER_00Um actually uh a friend of mine uh was working in logistics and he was talking about the international side of things. Uh the um challenging and unexpected uh side of uh of his world. He said, I can start my day with a whole list of things that I need to do. By the end of the day, I only did one of the ten. So he said, your day is constantly changing, you have to adapt, you have to be flexible. But in the meantime, you get also acquainted with a lot of people around the world, you get a lot of personal connections, uh, not only from on the phone or the email, um, but especially also seeing people uh face to face, shaking hands, having a beer, uh going out for a bite to eat, and that's yeah, that's where the business is. It's still a very personal business.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I think what you're speaking to is what we're dealing with here at the conference and at the VM Row conference as well, that networking, that face-to-face communication, there's nothing that can replace that. Absolutely not. It's the the training that takes place at the conferences that that's great, but it's the environment where you're having a beer with somebody afterwards, and an idea is drawn up on a napkin, and all of a sudden there's some either business or ideas that are exchanged, and and and things change.
SPEAKER_00You're talking to somebody, and oh, do you know this guy? Oh, yeah. Talk, connect, change, exchange cards, and the day after you're uh talking something totally different, and when it works out, that's that's always fun.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, absolutely. So when you talk about logistics in the company that that you own and run now, what percentage of the logistics um operation involves aviation?
SPEAKER_00So actually there are two companies, Navigate and Navigate Aviation Logistics. And if you look at the turnover, both of them are quite similar, actually.
SPEAKER_03Okay.
SPEAKER_00But um yeah, uh Navigate Aviation Logistics is actually only about helicopters.
SPEAKER_03Okay. I'm sure some of the listeners, whether it was in the conversation with you or the panel or now, might be like, what does logistics have to do with me? You know, there's uh obviously there's the exchange of of parts that we talk about that part the part supply issue is something that globally we're we're dealing with as an industry, right? So it's the understanding how to how to package, repair, ship, deliver those parts that are critically needed across the world, but beyond that, it's it's the larger aircraft itself. Uh but I'll open that question up to you. You know, how does how how does this impact the the maintenance community, this idea of logistics and the importance behind it?
SPEAKER_00No, everybody always says um that logistics, why as you said, why do we need it? But logistics is in our everyday life, not only for the helicopters or for the MRO community, but in our everyday life to get your food, to to get your uh your car, so everything has involved with uh with logistics.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, anything to add in there?
SPEAKER_02No, I think that I think it's a nice way of describing it. It is essentially, you know, in a day, if you sit back and look at all the things you've done today, how many things have been delivered to your, you know, have arrived either from a courier or back of a truck that eventually you know work their way back through to being on an aircraft or in a shipping container. It all orientates and that links back to our industry. Our aircraft don't fly, as as per the uh byline, correct me if I got it wrong, but you had it to Kelowna, mission uh critical or whatever that line you had was very critical, you know, everyone. No maintenance, no mission. That's the one, no maintenance, no mission. And I guess that's it. You add logistics to that. No logistics, no maintenance, no mission.
SPEAKER_03Yep. Well, I'll kind of prelude what we're gonna get to in a minute, but military battles aren't aren't one and lost necessarily on the battlefield, they're won and lost based on the logistics available to support you know what's happening there, at least in today's modern warfare.
SPEAKER_00Every every business nowadays depends on logistics. And I think uh if we go back a couple of years, uh we're not talking about everything that's going on in the world now, but go back a couple of years to COVID, Corona, yeah, all the supply chains suddenly fell still, and yeah, things change, and everybody before was like, oh, we work just in time, we are outsourcing to other sides of the world. People are coming back from that.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Yeah, I think before COVID, I'm guilty of this. I I didn't really take into account what what the supply chain and what the the logistics operations look like and what it meant. I just took for granted the fact that I ordered something and it and it showed up. And for me as a consumer, it's on a much lower scale than than what we're talking about here with what you guys are doing with you know aircraft parts, aircrafts as as a whole. Um, but I think COVID really highlighted the need for that logistics expertise, and I think people started realizing that it nope, you can't just take it for granted. This is this is vitally important.
SPEAKER_00No, indeed, indeed. And it was not only the supplies to the shops, but for a lot of people, what became very apparent and very clear is like they ordered a new car, oh yeah, you have to wait for three years. Why? People didn't understand it.
SPEAKER_03So when you look back over the course of your career and business, is there one or two bits that you've learned that would be interesting for for our listeners to hear as it pertains to logistics surrounding aircraft operations?
SPEAKER_00Oh, ho. That's a good one. That's a good one. Um, how much time do we have? Uh no. Um help me out here, Dom.
SPEAKER_02Well, I think um a project that you and I did together late last year with moving a large retired fleet of uh Black Hawk helicopters, and we have to be a little bit careful about depth because there was certain um requirements. But that involved an interesting set of circumstances. We were dealing with a a foreign uh foreign entity, uh a foreign government, there was uh legislational paperwork that had to be correct because it involved what is known as ITARS, which is a uh harms limitation type process. Um, and then combining that, then working with a storage facility, transportation uh domestically within the country, and then uh shipping to the United States and then onwards transport. It was a lot of various combinations that involved a lot of people, a lot of issues, and even um then coordinating with ports and those authorities. And at the end of the day, we moved in this process. There was uh we'll say 25 aircraft. I can't exactly remember now off the top of my head, but they were all what we call default, delivered in full and on time. Now these aircraft were tired and they were were retired, but they didn't there was no value if they'd been more damaged. So it was a very key part of the relationship. So there was a multiple team. I think that was probably a pretty key thing for your company in the early days when we were, you know, when we first started working together. And getting the success out of that, John, was really cool. Was the staff at the receiver here in the United States, you know, they were got a real kick out of it because suddenly they had these very awesome aircraft in their fleet that their management had purchased, and if the physics of getting them to be to cross was great. Yeah, and I think that's something that we can't overstress how good that feeling is in logistics. Um, you know.
SPEAKER_03Thank you to our sponsor, Metro Aviation. Metro Aviation, the world's largest family-owned aeromedical operator, offers comprehensive aircraft services with 140-plus aircraft in over 25 states. The completion center installs medical and law enforcement kits in avionics, serving diverse aviation needs including offshore, utility, VIP, and corporate sectors.
SPEAKER_00No, and what what before um I was always like, okay, uh you move, let's say let's make it simple, you move a container. It's standardized, every every time it works the same way. But if you look at helicopters, it's totally different because every single type has their own little quirks, if I can call it like that. You have to see okay, what's the weight distribution, things like that. So you go actually beyond the point when you're dealing with containers, it's like okay, just repeat business, check, check, check, check, check, and you just actually focus a little bit more on the paperwork. But moving the helicopters, it's like yeah, you have to be there, you have to see it with your own eyes, and physically, sometimes also climbing up, uh, attaching the the slings, uh, making sure, okay, looking at the balance, all these things. It's yeah, that was indeed a real eye-opener.
SPEAKER_03For the MRO operator who maybe they're they're they've freshly opened their doors or or they just haven't gotten experience with shipping an aircraft internationally. What advice would you have off the top of your head for for that MRO shop who's looking to do that for the first time?
SPEAKER_00Don't wait until it is too late. Um Logistics forwarding business has always looked like um we're a necessary evil. You have to pay us to do something. It can be that difficult. Not always, but when you don't pay enough attention on it, then you will get delays. Delays means money, money means uh yeah, um, especially when you're starting, uh it plays a very big part. So don't wait till too late. Preferably start earlier than you wanted it to. Don't leave it as okay, it's it's something in the back. No, it has to be in front of your mind, in front of your uh little sheet of things to do. It has to be on there.
SPEAKER_02I think too, if I can step in on that to add to that, John. Just literally before we came to this conversation with you, we were with with one of the OEMs here on the floor, where the they've just releasing a new type, and it's still in the mock-up mode of feasibility. And now's not the place to know to name that aircraft. But the logic is that we're able to have a meeting with their people, with their logistics people today, and look at reinforce the parameters of what a shipping container is if they want to try and design it to ship. So it's allowing them to think about the logistics and blending that into the avi into the uh flight characteristics of the aircraft and working out, well, if we have a pedotube, for example, that sticks out this far, it's gonna make it too wide to fit in the container. Let's put a shorter pedo tube in and then we can and reduce shipping costs and transit costs. And I think that's a real kick that we get out um by being experts in the field, is being able to push the paradigm a little bit and go, well, is this could this be done differently? And when once the aircraft has been finished and built, and if it's only that much out, it's gonna be a very expensive adjustment every time you ship an aircraft.
SPEAKER_00Right. It is not standard to begin with, and but not standard and not standard are two different totally different things in the in the spectrum of things.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, it's important, I guess, as a consideration for these OEMs to think about that, I guess, when when they're you know the RDs phase of of this aircraft, it's honestly something I hadn't thought of, you know, but really interesting point of consideration.
SPEAKER_00But also people see, okay, we have airspace, and the bigger the better, you can say it like that. But if you put something on a truck or on a on a vessel, you still have quite enough lot of space. But if, for instance, if you wait too long with taking your decision, might be that the only option is to send it by air freight. But air freight, planes are not getting bigger just because of your cargo. But your paycheck, or not your paycheck, your final bill, your final invoice will become a lot, lot higher if you wait until the end.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, it's that that's uh I guess something we talked about a little bit at the finances surrounding this, right? People are wanting to um spend as little as is possible uh for the shipment of whatever it is they're moving. But in the case of aircraft, that's not a good practice. You want to touch on that briefly before we kind of move on?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, just briefly though, I guess the key thing is that cheap is not necessarily right. Um look at you know, look at the knowledge of the people you're working with, ask the questions. You know, if you're moving an item, uh we take a rotor blade, isn't it? Well, no, that's about a tower rotor. It's and it's not properly packed, and it's gonna go thro through six airports and then be trucked for another three hours before it gets to destination, all to save what might be a total of 120 US dollars for something that's worth 13 and a half thousand. You've got to look at the logic the economic decision and how you make that call. Um, and if you're if your logistics supplier is driving you to the cheap and not challenging you, why are you doing this? Then they're probably the wrong supplier.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02And that's that's what it, you know, it's gotta be a two-sided street, right?
SPEAKER_03Well, uh the what I wanted to get into kind of prefaced a few minutes ago, talking about logistics in a time of conflict and some of the challenges that obviously exist there, but there's I'm sure there's a million things that I hadn't even thought of. But before we talk about that, give us a thumbnail preview of uh both the companies and some of the services you offer.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um, so start off with uh with the first one, navigate aviation logistics. Um we do transport worldwide of parts and uh complete machinery, uh complete helicopter airframes, uh used ones, but new ones as well, and for all kinds of services. So search and rescue, EMS, uh firefighting, personnel transport. We we cover the whole deal. Um, and as I said, we're based in Antwerp, but um yeah, we cover the entire world. Okay. Um fun thing about we're from Belgium is we talk, we have three original languages, official languages in our country, but on top of that, we try to speak a little bit more. So try to say that I'm fluent in four or four and a half languages. Which makes, if you work internationally, yeah, makes makes uh life a little bit more uh flexible.
SPEAKER_03It's actually actually a really interesting point. You know, you you talk about the ability to communicate people and how important that is in your business. That skill set you've got there, we'll call it that, is very unique and very valuable. Thinking to our sponsor, Rotocraft Support. Rotocraft Support from the hangar floor to the flight line. We've spent 40 years caring for the aircraft that communities rely on every day. Rotocraft support, where dedication meets decades of experience.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. And the fun thing, as sometimes people don't think about that, is you go into a meeting and everybody speaking English, and then you suddenly hear the customer, for instance, for me in German, speaking in German, and it's like, okay, but I can hear them, but they don't know that I speak German. So sometimes they share a little bit more information than they should.
SPEAKER_03They start start picking their counterparts in Germany, like, I know what you're saying.
SPEAKER_00So um, yeah, that's uh navigate aviation logistics. We do actually everything we do road transport, sea transport, uh air freight, uh, we do the customs, we do the other uh paperwork uh together with the customer, of course. Um we do uh fly-ins, fly outs, uh fueling, uh dismantling, uh preparing crates, uh boxes for the blades or other uh other parts. So we try to give a full-in service. Okay.
SPEAKER_03Uh where could people find information on your company?
SPEAKER_00It's uh www.navi-gate.be. Okay.
SPEAKER_03Don, anything to add in there on what he talked about as far as the business preview goes?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, look, I just think the thing is there's a there's a a care to want to do this right. That's that's what I've seen. And as you well know, John, you know, I had a previous company in my past life which was successful, was sold many years ago. Um, and I guess that's one of the reasons I've sort of aligned myself with Peter because I've looked at many companies that have been around who are in the helicopter logistics space, but I've always felt there's been something about what they're trying to do, and they've and they are well respected on the ports that I've worked with them on, uh, and that's a very key part of this relationship. And and I think the other thing is really important is, and I know this from personal experience, you know, the cash flow is positive, they are moving well as a business, and so there's an assurity. They they haven't they didn't come around last last year, they've got history, they've got and they've got a destination, and most importantly, Peter's got a strong goal.
SPEAKER_03We did talk about that a little bit, some of the risks with some of these companies. There's there's a lot of kind of we'll call them startup companies. And if you're a startup company, in my mind that tells me you probably don't have the experience or expertise to transport things like a helicopter, like some of these really expensive and valuable parts, um, in a in a way that's uh responsible, I'll say. Whereas you, you've got the experience, the passion, and the ability to do this in that you have to have a hands-on approach as well.
SPEAKER_00Thinking that you can range everything from behind your desk, because nowadays everybody has a computer, has a phone, but thinking that you can range everything from behind your desk, that's not gonna work. You have to be on site, you have to be next to, and that's one of the key things that we always say to our customers said if you hand over the business to us, said we will be there at the crucial points. When a helicopter leaves the ground, not on its own power lifted by a crane or something like that, we will be there. If it's only one palette, that's something different. But for the for the major things, we are there. We are sometimes we've been on top of a helicopter, cleaning, taping, uh, protecting the windows, everything. Those are the things that are important, and those are the little things that make us different from our competitors.
SPEAKER_03It's funny. I when you talk about success, whether it's in leadership or business, I I think it's the small things that matter the most, just uh what you're talking about, you know, and it's a very interesting concept.
SPEAKER_00So I think you have to have the flexibility as well because they say, Yeah, okay, we're gonna load at 12. Oh no. We all know it, planes delayed, trains delayed, whatever. Okay, yeah. We wait, we do other things, we talk to the people. And the people that are handling the cargo for them it's another piece of equipment that they're moving. Like they're moving twenty four seven they're moving. But if you come in with a helicopter or a blade, the uh prices the price tag that comes to that crate or that unit is a lot different from what they're used to. And you just start chatting with them, like Don said, you need to talk to not only the people on the ground, but you also need be able to talk to the people making the decisions, uh spending the millions of dollars uh to purchase the helicopter. Um but you just say, okay, but how what do you think it's worth? And and what do you think by handling it this way or this way? Not saying like it has to be this way, but just let them think about it and that that that makes things better, yeah, from my point of view. Personal approach in all levels, best thing to do.
SPEAKER_03Well, uh thanks for the for the preview, and again, thank you for for sending Don over and and for what you're doing for our community because we all know we need to get this aircraft from point A to point B to do what we need to do. Let's talk about where we sit today, and it doesn't have to be today, it could be any point in history. At any point in history, there's some conflict globally somewhere. Talk about some of the challenges that exist and pop up for you guys that is unique to conflict. And in this case, as we sit today, we've got conflict literally all over the world. So I'd imagine shipping anything anywhere internationally is challenging right now. If you're passionate about rotorcraft maintenance, then be sure to check out vertical's new Instagram channel at vertical.mro. Sure in all things related to helicopter maintenance, repair, and overhaul. Vertical MRO is dedicated to supporting and advancing rotorcraft maintenance. The backbone of our industry.
SPEAKER_00And now it's like, oh, the the vessel is coming from that country, sorry, not allowed in. Very plain and simple. Yeah, but no, but it has been here before, yes, but now it's not allowed anymore. That's point one. Uh secondly, all vessels, airplanes, they follow the same route every time. And if suddenly it's like you go on a bike, you go on a ride, and suddenly there's a tree in front of you, yeah. Even though you ride that path every day, it's it's not possible anymore. But turning your bike around is a little bit easier than turning a plane around in the middle of the sky, or uh a vessel having make a U-turn when it's like, for instance, uh in the Suez uh canal, uh, and it has to go completely around. It's not only sometimes practical things, but especially financial things, and also timing. Because people say, Okay, we're gonna move cargo, doesn't matter which cargo, they say, okay, we're leaving day A, the transit time is gonna be 45 days. They promise their customer day 50, you will have it in your hands. And if you then have to explain at day 50, um, I think it's gonna be day 150 because of this and this and this and this reason, nobody's happy for that. Right. So the timing is an issue. Then it comes like, ah, um we had it on another shipment as well. The idea was to go directly from point A to point B. Shipping line said, sorry, things are moving around in the world, we have to readjust our entire plan. So A to B is no longer possible. You now have to go from A to B, from B to C, from C to D, and then you're there. I said, but yeah, that's not possible because there are costs in between. Sorry, this is the only solution that we have for you. That as well. And then what everybody now knows, of course, is shipping lines, airlines, if they go to a place that is considered a little bit more dangerous, say, okay, you have to pay more money. And what we see now uh is that uh the fuel prices are going up. Yeah, planes don't fly on nothing, right? Vessels don't sail without uh a little bit of uh oil, so you have to pay for that as well. And that's something most people they say, okay, we have this budget, this is our sale price, and the logistics cost is included in that. And then if we go back to COVID as well, uh let's say you had a container between Antwerp and uh Shanghai, or Shanghai to Antwerp was $2,000 during COVID, it was $20,000.
SPEAKER_02Wow.
SPEAKER_00So it's totally different, and now we're seeing the same thing happening on top of the fact that yeah, a lot of the ports in the Middle East, if I can name it now, are not served by shipping lines to just say nope at the moment we're not doing anything there. So your entire logistics flow is completely disrupted.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, the the Middle East will I think that's a good example. They purchase a lot of a lot of helicopters. If you're an OEM or an MRO that has uh a new aircraft that's finished to be shipped off to whoever purchased that aircraft, gosh, today how do you how do you do that? You know?
SPEAKER_02To a certain extent you can't, but you're actually you're here now. There's actually there's a there is a move back to road transport some of those distances, which is bizarre, but you consider it's now being deemed the safest way to move a product from A to B. Flying in it is not possible because of the risk of drone attack. Oceans can't get in, as Peter's just indicated, the ships aren't being allowed. So road transport is now being brought back as a as a possible scenario. But your cost per kilo of moving something in a truck is significantly higher than obviously my ship, maybe not as high as an aircraft, but then your time factor kicks in.
SPEAKER_03Sure.
SPEAKER_02And um plus, of course, now you've got your cargo sitting on the ground exposed 24-7 for 15-16 days. So it's a very much a it's a challenging situation. Underneath that, of course, the insurance industry is now starting to go, we're not interested in covering that. The risk is too great. So you're in the because you know, like our travel insurances, we're not covered for war risk. Most of these uh insurance policies don't cover that unless it's specifically uh identified.
SPEAKER_00Or they say, yes, we will cover it, but before you saw one or two underwriters taking the risk for uh for the shipment, now they say, no, we're not gonna do it alone, maybe with the three of us, four of us. But that means that you have to have more people on the same line, which then takes longer. So you have a lot of issues that come along.
SPEAKER_02It comes back again to very much as Peter said, planning ahead. If you've got a scenario where you are likely to need to move a sp a part, uh whatever, to a new destination, think about it now. Don't think about it in three or four weeks' time when it's maybe required, because now will give you time to make choice. Four weeks you won't have that.
SPEAKER_03Well, what's interesting when I think of the the timing of what's happening in Iran, you may have ordered a helicopter two years ago, obviously without knowing there's going to be global conflict taking place in that that point of delivery in two years, or across or near that that that that delivery point. So all of a sudden you find yourself in a situation where okay, this thing's supposed to be there. This is this is what we're confronted with. Having a professional company who understands the different modes of transportation and logistics involved in doing that, I think is critical.
SPEAKER_00So uh we always like to say we have seen everything, that's not true, of course, but we have seen a lot of things happening. And one of the key things in our profession is that you have to be flexible no matter what. Something happens, you take action. You don't sit back, lean back, look at it, and say, it will solve itself. No, it will not solve itself. You have to take action, you have to be on top of it.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, absolutely. Well, time is is is challenging at this conference. Uh trying to get recordings in and our allotted time is really hard. I'm used to having as much time as I want to have these conversations. This one in particular, I feel like, is one we could we could talk at length about uh with specific geographic regions and all this stuff. But uh we've this is the time we've got for today. Um so before I close out, I just want to thank you guys for for taking the time to be here with me and talk about some of these situations that you know, like I said, before COVID, a lot of people took for granted. And and even now with global conflict, I think that's uh it's almost another glow uh COVID type scenario where people are like, okay, now what? You know? Indeed. Um so I'll start with we'll start with you. Uh ask about any closing thoughts, any any any parting thoughts uh before we walk out, and then we'll we'll we'll go to you and I'll walk us out.
SPEAKER_02John, I think the simple thing is it's just planning. Planning, don't panic. There will be a solution. Uh it may not be the solution it's as wished for, but it will come through. And just being systematic in your approach and then relying on your logistics supplier to make sure they've got the right people with the right experience. It's pretty simple from that respect. And thank you for the opportunity to be part of this. Yeah, it's good.
SPEAKER_03Good to see you in person again. Yeah, indeed. Indeed. Sir?
SPEAKER_00You took my closing statement. Planning, planning is is is is key, uh, that absolutely, but also, and I want to tell this to everybody keep in mind that slow and or fast, good, and cheap doesn't go together. Slow and and expensive and shitty service, those things sometimes do go together. But to get confirmation of quick, qualified, and a good price, it's difficult to find. So think about that. Don't always go for the cheapest one because there's a knowledge that you have to pay for as well. Yeah, I think a lot of times you get what you pay for, right?
SPEAKER_03Oh, yeah. It's the lowest price, you're getting probably the lowest quality service.
SPEAKER_00How do you say it? Uh when you want peanuts or you get monkeys, or when when you when you pay peanuts, you get monkeys. That's the one. That's the one.
SPEAKER_03Okay. Well, um, again, thank you guys for joining us. Uh, Verticon 2026 has been amazing. Uh, we're gonna go finish out the day, day two, and uh we'll catch you guys later. We'll catch you next time on the Vertical Emerald Podcast. Perfect. Thank you. Stand by for a message after a word from our sponsors. Thank you to our sponsor, Metro Aviation. Metro Aviation, the world's largest family-owned air medical operator, offers comprehensive aircraft services with 140-plus aircraft in over 25 states. The completion center installs medical and law enforcement kits in avionics, serving diverse aviation needs including offshore, utility, VIP, and corporate sectors. Thank you to our sponsor, Rotocraft Support. Rotocraft Support, from the hangar floor to the flight line, we've spent 40 years caring for the aircraft that communities rely on every day. Rotocraft Support, where dedication meets decades of experience. If you're passionate about rotorcraft maintenance, then be sure to check out Vertical's new Instagram channel at vertical.mro. Sharing all things related to helicopter maintenance, repair and overhaul. The latest podcast episodes to conference updates, and even epic photography. Vertical MRO is dedicated to supporting and advancing rotorcraft maintenance. The backbone of our industry.