ABA 2024: Supportive Stud - Diana Stevens

What separates a stud dog owner from a true breeding partner?

In this episode, Sara sits down with Diana Stevens of Wylanbriar Labradors, winner of the Supportive Stud Award, to reveal what it really takes to build a stud service that breeders trust, respect and return to—litter after litter.

With over 1,000 litters sired through her boys and a thriving community built on mentorship, marketing and high standards, Di shares why ethical stud work is about so much more than just showing up for a mating. For breeders ready to raise the bar, whether you're using or offering stud dogs. 

Join the Brew Crew for support tailored to your breed, background and breeding mindset.

📌 Show Notes: breedersbrew.com/notes/s3e26
👉 Learn more about Di: www.wylanbriar.com
👉 Join her Facebook groups: Wylanbriar Labradors, Wylanbriar Gundog Training, and her exclusive breeding group (invite only)

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Transcript

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (00:00)
Owning a stud dog is one thing, providing a true stud service is another. That's why today's guest, Diana Stevens of Wylanbriar Labradors, is the perfect person to talk to. Winner of the Supportive Stud Award, Di goes beyond just offering a stud, she provides mentorship, marketing support and ongoing guidance to bitch owners. In this episode, we discuss why connection and rapport matter in breeding.

the difference between simply having a stud and running a stud service and how marketing plays a key role.

This conversation is truly packed with insight. Let's get into it. Here's my chat with Diana Stevens.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (01:00)
I'm super excited to introduce to today Diana Stevens, who is the winner of the supportive stud award. And I'm massively grateful that we've managed to tie down a time that we can catch up together because she's a very busy lady.

to really talk about the amazing work that she's doing in regards to our stud team that she has. So firstly, welcome Di to the podcast. I need a little round of applause sort of sound clip that I could play at this point. But right, I don't want to give too much away. So it'd be great for you just to introduce yourself, and basically what you do in regards to your stud team.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (01:24)
Thank you. Thank you, Sara Thank you.

Hahaha!

Okay, good afternoon, good afternoon, Sara, good afternoon, everyone. I'm Diana Stevens. I am down in the Costa del Sussex down in the south and my kennel is called Wylanbriar Wylanbriar Labradors.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (01:42)
Never.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (01:53)
Wylanbriar has been established now over 30 years. The first litter I had under that kennel name was in 1994. So as a brief kind of intro, yes, I started off as a breeder and or breeding litters myself and a boy here and there and then because of what I was achieving with those boys,

Gradually they started to be asked to be used for I come from a marketing background in terms of I have a marketing degree and had a marketing job for years and years and years for 15 years. I worked in Malaysia and Indonesia and all sorts of places, So I looked at the market and thought what can I give people that's just a little bit more? And so that became quite popular.

just giving people just that little bit more. Then of course everybody has to get miles on their clock. I also mentored under probably the two best people in the breed for ethics, for all sorts of things, for service. And that was Carol Coode and Joy Venturi Rose, two of my heroes. And it went from there basically. So I was genuinely knowledgeable, she says, like blushing, but

genuinely knowledgeable and I knew how to mark it. So that was something quite unique to the dog world at that time.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (03:19)
Well, I think it's still unique now because even from my background, took me, I thought that just breeding dogs and good dogs was good enough and it isn't. You have to tell people how good your dogs are and you kind of think if you compete, whatever that might be, whatever form of competition you're involved with and how you participate with your dog, you kind of think, if I do that, then I'm demonstrating to people how good the dog is. But some people still don't understand that.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (03:33)
You do.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (03:47)
So I always think dog breeders are probably, I think, one of the laziest group of people to communicate how good their product is and putting product in brackets in regards to their dogs. And I think they really do rely on the cuteness of a puppy to sell themselves.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (03:49)
Absolutely.

Thank

And I think yeah, and I also think because I started in the show world It's very non PC to brag It's very non PC to push yourself if you had a any any other company you would be saying look at my products They're great. They're really good. They're better than somebody else's by X amount and blah blah blah We've sold this much and this is how much we've won and these are the awards we've got but in the dog world

You almost seem to have to, it seems to be PC in the way it's bolshy and up yourself to push yourself. You know, you're thought of at the start, you're thought of as an upstart that doesn't know what they're talking about. And then your reputation is meant to sell you rather than any kind of actual physical marketing, I think, you know.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (04:44)
Yeah.

Yeah, no,

I agree with you 1000%. I don't know if it's sort of the act to add to it the British stiff upper lip of don't talk about money. Don't don't put your head above the parapet. I think the Americans and this is where my eyes were opened to it all really, is seeing the Americans have a very different attitude in regards to dog breeding. And I think commercially, it's accepted more widely. And I'm sure I'm sure

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (05:06)
Definitely. Definitely.

completely.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (05:26)
people to have their opinions and are anti it and all the rest of it. But what I realised with all the eye opening experience of the American bully breed, particularly the XLs, as much as that was crazy, I have to respect and it's sad how it all ended up with the ban and all the rest of it. But you could not recognise that those breeders as marketers

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (05:38)
Yeah, I'm sure.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (05:53)
were out of this world compared to anything that existed. So for me, that's what I took away from it was actually, the, you like the breed, if you like the type of breed as they are, they actually have a really good skillset of communicating to a buyer why these dogs are so amazing. And that's why they blew up so quickly. And unfortunately it was kind of the detriment of them at the same time. But I think there's good lessons to be taken from everything.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (05:55)
Absolutely.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (06:19)
And that was a big lesson that I took from them is that breeders tend to do this crazy thing of they don't want to sell their puppies until the puppies are born. Sometimes, and we'll come on to how you assist people in how the people that use your stud dogs. But the Joe average basically wants to kind of ignore any people until the puppies are about well born or maybe up to four weeks old. And then they start going,

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (06:36)
Mm.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (06:47)
I need to find some homes. And then they compress the selling opportunity into the most ridiculous of a four week window. So then to then try

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (06:56)
Very valid, yeah. That's right.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (06:58)
and find five star homes. Why would you put yourself under that pressure? It's crazy that you know, you I think the whole breeding windows like a is it 17 week? Was it longer than that? No, it'd be longer that wouldn't it from the season from all the time she's pregnant to the pups being born.

the perhaps leaving, you've got a big window to work in yet for some reason, the majority of people just want to find some owners in the tiny little four week window that they've got, which I think is just crazy, because it just means you could take the stress out of it and really find some five star homes and it not just be some emotional turmoil, or trying to find all these homes, which brings me on to you because that's the whole point of

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (07:15)
Yep.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (07:39)
If you use a stud dog owner that has a significant reputation and you like your marketing background, then just elevates a whole relationship I feel to have with a stud owner to another level. So I don't know if you just want to talk through what you offer people that use your stud dogs.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (07:57)
Okay, yeah, so I am purely in Labradors, or Labrador retrievers as they're called, I cover the spectrum. So my kennel, my stud kennel, and obviously my own kennel has all three colors, black, yellow and chocolate. So for a start, that's quite rare. That's quite unusual. Most kennels seem to either be kind of black chocolate kennels

or they seem to be black-yellow kennels and often that falls between the working lines, the show lines, whatever. And then my kennel also crosses that boundary that we don't just have show lines, we don't just have working lines, we have show lines, we have working lines, and we have dogs that are a mix of the two lines plus the range of colours. That is a commercial decision. It's a decision made with my heart because I love all three colours equally.

which is unusual also, as they've all got their bonuses. And so that is one of the other sort of unique things in the Labrador world that we can offer across the range through show lines, working lines, and all three colors. So that's fairly unusual. I'm unashamedly commercial.

in the sense that it is my living, is my taxpaying living, it is a company, my stud fees, and I bring in as many other elements of the dog world as possible. So just very briefly potted, I started showing dogs, very, very quickly went on to working them out shooting at a very low level. They weren't particularly well trained, but they were really good looking working dogs. And then...

started to get interested in training them a bit better and trained with all sorts of different trainers and things like that and went to club trainings and things and got these show dogs that went to shows every weekend and went to Crufts and got stud book numbers and you know the real show side of things had reserved tickets I had tickets on my show dogs but they all went out shooting then I decided I wanted to train a little bit more

So I trained them a little bit more and a bit more and a bit more until we could run in what we call working tests, which is the lower level of competing. And we started winning against the working bred dogs. Then we hit a little bit of a ceiling because there are certain character traits in the show dogs and physical traits that do give them a little bit of a drawback, the more robust frame.

the sort of more butterly way of going as opposed to more flowing and fox-like and speedy. so I decided I was going to start in my own breeding program mixing the show and working. So obviously all the things that I was doing in my own breeding program I had quite a large kennel at the time, anything up to about 18 dogs. I would have bitches that I was breeding from and creating my own breeding program, but I was keeping boys that I could stand at studs and they,

started to become literally half and halfies. And there's all sorts of kennels around the country that think they invented the half and halfie, but we're talking 25, 30 years ago, you know. So that was kind of how we developed that side of things. In terms of my service, pulling in, so I started a training company and that sounds very brash and very bold, but...

Nobody starts a training company. What happens is you're breeding some nice dogs and then the puppy buyers ask you, how do I get it to do that? How do I get it to do that? And you start having little classes for that litter and then they get a bit bigger and more interested in it. And then a few of their friends come and then a few golden retrievers join them. And then you've got a couple of pointers and a spaniel. And suddenly you're starting to put proper classes on. Then in my world,

that started to bash into my office job, my, and certainly my traveling around the world office job. And I had to make a decision about 15 years ago, was I going to be an office person that had a hobby that was pretty all encompassing, but, or was I going to break off and go dog company all the way? And I decided to take the chance and go dog company all the way. And that's where

Wylanbriar Gundog training was started and Wylanbriar Labradors wasn't started then but the true marketing came when I decided I was never going to join social media. Social media was not for me. I didn't like it. I thought it was a kind of bitchy hotbed of something I didn't know very much about and was used in a negative way. And then

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (12:21)
haha

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (12:31)
I decided to go for it and explore it and in true Di Stevens style I decided, I like this, this is useful, oh gosh, I've got a new market there, I've got a new market here, I've got this, that and the other, I can reach people far more easily than having to text them and call them and things like that. And then gradually as social media became more and more open there were so many more avenues.

I stuck at one, I stayed at Facebook, which maybe is limiting, but hasn't proven to be. And basically it ended up with me having to say to people, if you want to be part of us, you have to join Facebook and you have to come in my two groups, Wylanbriar Gundog Training and Wylanbriar Labradors, which pulled everybody in. And my point being...

is that then what that created was the opportunity to be able to direct market everything. So my stud dogs then leading onto their puppies. So every litter that was coming up would get strongly highlighted, pretty pictures. And then when those puppies were born and a waiting list was full of people on the Wylanbriar Labradors group, then...

those puppy buyers would be marketed, training company, which is a pet gundog training company, and they would go on to become part of that. Not all of them, of course, but a huge amount of them. So I'm not saying that everybody within Wylanbriar gundog training, it comes with a Wylanbriar stud labrador, they don't. But I would say, of my classes in a week, at least 40 % are.

and that's the snowball on from marketing. that's kind of what we've done.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (14:20)
Thank

I think it's brilliant. And you talking about forcing people into Facebook, I was listening to an audio book or podcast, but it was really good. It was a marketer. And he basically said, you when you're passionate about something, and this is what people need to be clear about. Yes, you have a commercial element to what you do, but you do it because you're passionate. It's no different to me. Like

our lives would be very different without dogs. So it's the passion that drives it. And then you have to profit from it because then that enables you to carry on being passionate. It's like it's a cycle. But this basically this guy said when you're passionate about something, you have to have rules and boundaries. And that's and that's what you've done. You've gone if you want to be involved with Wylanbriar, you need to come in this way. And it's no different to

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (14:49)
Yeah, absolutely. They're my life, absolutely my life.

Absolutely.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (15:15)
people that would have listened to other podcast episodes, we've talked about vetting forms, where you go, if you want a puppy from me, you have to fill in this form. If you don't want to fill in the form, then go, go elsewhere. That's fine. But this is, this is how I'm doing things. Because this is the level of expectation, whatever you want to call it standard surface. Yeah, that's what it is. So I feel, yeah, there's nothing wrong with doing it. If that's doing it your way, it's doing it the Wylanbriar way, and it works.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (15:26)
Okay.

Connection, yeah.

No.

I think one of the reasons it works well, no, two reasons which are linked together. One is it all started as a family. So the very first name of Wylanbriar, what is now Wylanbriar Labradors, used to be Wylanbriar Family Group. And basically, used to, you know, I'm very un-fur baby I'm very against...

anthropomorphising dogs. I do not want them called your furry kids and you know, and I don't like hats and boots but What I do want to do is a sense of connection so consequently I was quite happy to be called Granny Di and Only in the sense of you don't want to piss off Granny Di as opposed granny dies gonna buy a Christmas present and sort of have a slightly draconian kind of

grandmother Barbara Woodhouse type air about it, almost a character. And off we go with it. So the way this was linked was because to begin with, in that group, you know, when there was 100 people and then there was 300 people, when there was 1000 people, I wouldn't say everybody knew each other, but there was always a chance you might rub up against someone at training or a

if the bitches had a reunion, get together of the puppies at a year old or whatever. So people were polite to each other. People didn't act like they acted on normal social media. They weren't keyboard warriors because we were a family. You were talking to someone that you might actually meet. And that's exactly where the problem is with social media, that we don't talk to people like we might down the pub.

We talk to them because we know we'll never see them again. We can just point score. And that never happened in that group. And obviously now, between the two groups, we're up to over 10,000 people. However, it stayed like that because I have never allowed keyboard warrioring. We have talked about every topic under the sun you can ever imagine that could be a flare point.

Raw feeding whatever anything, you know dogs running up to dogs on leads off leads, you know aggression anything and I just don't allow it the second you're sarcastic you're gone So people say is the point there but maybe two people a year just don't suit the group don't understand the rules and

you know, they can have really strong opinions. I love people countering me. I love people asking searching questions and things like that. But you don't mess around with it. And that has been a big strong marketing point because people feel safe. People feel looked after. So within the brand, it is a safe place on social media to come, act, be completely clueless about HIP Scores or eye tests or types of Labradors.

but there's no one going to go, you stupid or something? Because bang, they'd be gone and they know it. So that's another part of the service.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (18:34)
Yeah.

Well,

you've basically built a community. Yeah, and, and it's a really, I must admit, I've never seen any beef on there at all. And so, you know, compared to some groups, I mean, but

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (18:43)
I defend them,

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (18:53)
But equally, as you say, you're happy for someone to disagree with you. And that's the problem with the internet, isn't it? Whoever's typing feels like they're right. And you're like, no, we can just agree to disagree. There's no medals to be won here. It's just an opinion.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (18:57)
Yeah.

Yeah.

No, absolutely. Yeah,

the only person that's always absolutely right, of course, is me. There's nothing I don't know about. Why am I a jumped up witch that looks like she knows everything? Because I do!

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (19:14)
you...

Yeah, well, I mean, that's

the thing, but you do have to respect, like you said, you respected the people that mentored you and people should respect you because you've been in it so much longer. And sometimes it's not even a time element. It's the number of dogs that you've seen within that time frame. your 10, 20, 50 in exit compared to somebody that's been in the same amount of time, but they've only had one dog concurrently.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (19:28)
100 %

That's the thing.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (19:48)
And you know, that could be.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (19:49)
So of course

they're going to have an opinion about something that is unshakable because that one dog did or that one bitch whelped in a certain way or whatever. But I'm now at the point where this we will definitely knock into a thousand stud litters. So a thousand stud litters is a lot of litters and that I can...

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (20:04)
Wow.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (20:11)
I can categorically, when we're talking about the service as well, I don't think we have ever had a puppy hang on beyond homing age. If I think that somebody's struggling, there was a tiny time a couple of years after COVID.

where everybody decided breeding was a terrific idea and the market was absolutely flooded, not particularly from our end. We kept the same rules, we kept the same prices, not low prices, but I mean, just to give you an idea, people were charging 3000 pounds for a Labrador puppy over COVID. I could never force my clients because they're clients. However, I very, very strongly lent on them to say, you do not put your prices up because it's COVID.

I'm not putting my price up. If you want to charge three grand, I'm going to charge you a double stud fee because that puppy should be 1500 quid or 1200 quid back then. So, you know, we're going to pull together and we're going to get through this thing that's going to go away. And we're not going to have prostituted our reputation while this bad time is happening for

the next 30 years to go, well, they just did the same thing as everyone else did. No, we didn't. We stayed reasonable. And so again, just another little kind of thing I'm quite passionate about.

protecting the clients, you know.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (21:34)
Yep.

i think it's just because your vision is quite visionary to be honest because most people they have a

you know, I fell into it this way. You have a good dog and then you think, well, people start asking you to use it as stud and then you think, okay, then and you I fell into the stud role without kind of ever thinking that was the route I was going to go down. And so I never really thought about it from, how do I protect the people that use my dogs or that my dogs are then siring, which obviously now I have a different perspective of it, because back then, as you say, I had a different day job and the dog.

showing was a hobby and it all sort of but equally, it just goes to show there's very little people having those kind of thoughts where they've I mean, nowadays, you'll see any any dog could basically

be a stud dog. They buy a dog. It gets to 18 months old and then they start going, Billy's looking for a girlfriend on Facebook. Does anyone want to breed my dog? And then

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (22:22)
Yeah, absolutely.

I think exactly

on that, think what has changed enormously is people don't do apprenticeships anymore and I don't mean that in the YTS type way. I mean they don't do an apprenticeship within the breed. They don't look for mentors, they don't go and ask for help, they don't ask. I have fairly regularly people asking, can I come and watch matings?

I want to learn the trade and I think very carefully about it and some I will some I won't it depends where they fit within the brand and so on but I That just never happens now people because the social media and we get this a lot in the working dog world There's so many training opportunities out there now. There's so many Opportunities to just stick a load of classes up on social media

and a time and a postcode and the what three words and go, right, I'm a trainer, come and bring your 40 quid to me and your dog. And it's there, it's set up social media makes you a trainer. And so if you get a nice little stud card printed and you can scan it and put it onto your Facebook wall, suddenly you are a stud dog owner. But that forgets the idea that there's a big difference between

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (23:43)
Yeah.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (23:50)
offering a dog at stud and providing a stud service.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (23:53)
And so talk us through what do you feel that you do different compared to those type of people.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (23:58)
first of all, we give them value added. So we have a third Facebook group, which is only for people that use my stud dogs and a few people that help within that, like yourself, and a couple of vets, reprovets and things like that as a bonus. And we look after them from the very first day they call saying, I don't know anything even about hip scoring, but I'm thinking of maybe mating Mabel when she's

two and a half years old, you help me to walk through this? And I say, yes, and into that group they go. and they're mentored right the way through. They watch everybody else's litter. They watch every other first timer. They get good links to take their dog for progesterone testing, for hip scoring, for eye testing, for DNA testing. They ask opinion on everything, you know. Then...

we have our website, [http://wylanbriar.com](http://wylanbriar.com "smartCard-inline")  And that was where everything started before Facebook. And that has grown. It might not be the most glitzy of websites, but it is absolutely rammed full. There is a whole breeding section in there with articles written over probably 25 years on every element that these people are going to want. And those articles are available to anybody to read.

my information in the Facebook group, the breeding Facebook group isn't. So first of all, I believe that then secondly, I select my dogs really carefully, really carefully. I'm always thinking about five years time. I'm always thinking about when you get a dog, what is going to follow him when he starts to become middle aged, because then you got a

two year prep into the dog really actively and knowledgeably standing at studs. So certainly in our breed you have because of the health testing, you can't do it till a year old. So consequently, everything gets thought through really carefully. Then there's lots of dogs, well, too many dogs have failed along the way and I will never compromise on that. So small, umbilical hernias.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (25:51)
Yeah.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (26:10)
Unfortunately, I find them superb homes, pet homes through Wylanbriar Labradors. Any kind of temperament issues that they cannot deal with. Anything in the peak season, we could have anything up to 10 bitches a week coming here. Ovulation stage, I've got seven entire males here. Occasionally I've got another one that I'm standing at stud for someone else. They have to be okay with that.

They get ruled with an iron rod in the sense that you allow seven entire males to be drifting around on grass and gravel and weed on by umpteen bitches. You're gonna have an unruly bunch of rude bastards. So consequently,

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (26:52)
you

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (26:55)
That is part of it as well. They get policed, they all mix together. I want to be able to put every single one of them in the truck straight away after a mating and shut the kennel door again and put them all back in with each other. I don't want to grumble. I don't mind a little bit of jumping on each other and going, you smell nice, mate, let's have a quick hump. But I don't want an overreaction from the dog that's being humped.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (27:02)
you

Mm.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (27:19)
So that part of things, I get a very, very stable temperament. A very stable temperament. And that's partly from mixing show and working lines occasionally. Sometimes the working lines can be a little bit on the sharp side and you have to police them a bit heavier. The show lines sometimes you have to give them a bit of a kick up the ass if a bitch is...

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (27:37)
You

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (27:38)
If a bitch is a bit growly and a bit I don't want it, I don't want it.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (27:42)
But I think

all what you've just talked through, for most female owners, none of that has ever entered their head. Because none of them have thought about, the dogs that I aren't using, what are their temperaments like? How is their pack dynamics? And the fact that you've just covered that, like as a stud owner, that's super important. And

It's not until you as a bitch owner that you walked into a situation where two dogs suddenly started kicking off, would you then go, oh, that's not what I was expecting.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (28:09)
Yeah,

and it has happened and I had a really lovely stud dog here who was a smashing boy, and he sired about five or six really nice litters for me, but I was always suspecting he was slightly on the edge. And once he had a little bit of a busy week one week, one dog went, I think I'll jump on you, walloppy Adam.

and he was on somebody else's sofa in 48 hours. So it can't happen because I've got hundreds of puppies a year to put into the pet market. And the primary thing, yes, okay, I would love a zero zero hip score or I'd love a full band of clear DNAs or the most perfect, you know, field trial champion that won a show award at Crufts. However, it needs to not bite the postman and that's...

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (28:34)
Yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (28:59)
That is the most important thing, you know, that without a doubt.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (29:01)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

When you, as you say, if the majority going into family homes, it just, can't be, it's just not acceptable. I think people really need to appreciate your honesty, because there can be a lot of stud owners that will hide those issues and they will carefully manage your breeding. Yes.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (29:10)
got the

Absolutely. And carry on mating their dogs.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (29:23)
And so the bitch owner would never know that that was lurking in the background until their pups go off to a new home. And then they start getting new owners come back to them saying, I've got this issue with the dog. they...

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (29:28)
Absolutely not.

Yeah, and it's not

because I'm Teresa or anything like that, the other thing, the Wylanbriar Labrador's group, we are absolutely warts and all. So if somebody's dog comes back with double elbow dysplasia at a year old, or if somebody's dog has a temperament issue and has started turning on dogs on walks or something like that, they will put that up there and we will answer and there's no...

Well, you've caused that. It is, yeah, absolutely, these things happen. Let's try and work this out. let's try and find the way through this. And I will take all that feedback. And if honestly, I saw that three or four pups in one year were starting to come back, dah, dah, dah, dah, dah, it would affect my choice of where I went with my stud dogs. Because people are gonna read that and go,

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (30:17)
Yeah.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (30:20)
don't want to stud puppy from flossy. I've seen three now that bite dogs on walks, you know and Because I allow that through I don't go. Oh, here's the negative right? We won't let that post through you know, the negatives come out what's no say that's fed

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (30:35)
Yeah,

I never thought about that. You could just not accept the posts and no one would see, but yeah, I'd have.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (30:39)
Absolutely, and I do monitor all the posts because I like

occasionally to get him first to answer for all sorts of reasons, know, usually a marketing reason on a I would like a chocolate puppy in June, you know, and I'd like to get straight in with my bit as opposed to but also I police obviously, but I do kind of like jealously police it as well. So there are quite a lot of people on my groups that do breed themselves. Now, I don't know what they're doing to my people.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (30:47)
Yeah.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (31:08)
by private message but I'm fully aware that there is, but everybody knows and if they don't their message is soon gone, their post is soon gone that you do not push anything on my group without asking me first. So whether that's another trainer, whether that is, you know, if it was a cocker spaniel, someone's looking for a cocker spaniel, fine I don't do cocker spaniels, you know, they don't do paint at Tesco's so

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (31:10)
Yeah, yeah.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (31:36)
Mr. Tesco is quite happy to advise where to go for paint, you know, but yeah. Absolutely.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (31:36)
Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, but I think that's just general courtesy and manners, or it should be. But as you

say, you don't know, I've known people, as you say, go through and DM, you know, yeah, you just see.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (31:49)
You don't know, absolutely. And I'm

sure they do, but luckily, whilst all my litters are selling absolutely fine, if they are, they are. I'm not going to turf them off. If I see them screw up once, if it came back to me even once that somebody had then sat in my group to direct market their litter, I wouldn't fall out with them, but I would just remove them. Bang, they're gone.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (32:11)
Yeah, yeah, no,

too right. Well, too right, because it's your community. So it's what you've built. you have very high health standards for your females, and you expect a certain level of health testing from people that want to your studs. So don't know if you just want to talk through that. I just want to caveat this with is that, again, you're a person

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (32:15)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (32:32)
I think like in economics, they call it like the sunken cost fallacy or something rather. But I know for a fact where you've had a lot of money into a potential future stud dog that hasn't made the grade. Now, some people will go, he's only a little bit short, we're still offering a stud because I know I've already spent X amount of money on that dog. But again, because of your reputation.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (32:38)
Yeah.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (32:57)
effectively you put yourself on the pedestal and now you have to stay on that pedestal that you've had to make some hard decisions where you've gone,

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (33:03)
Yeah. Really hard.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (33:06)
yeah, this dog isn't good enough, he's cost me a lot of money and you know what, he's gonna have to go and find a sofa because as you say, it's your reputation, you can't have that for the people that sit under you. So just talk about all your health testing and what you expect somebody to have if they wanted to use one of your dogs.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (33:16)
Yeah.

Okay, so as a straight answer to that first, yes, I expect the bitch to be hip scored and eye tested and elbow scored. The elbow score has to be zero. Unfortunately, I won't accept anything higher than that. And the hip score in an ideal world is under about a total of 15. And we play with different averages on that. If it was 14-1, I would think that was far dodgier than 7-7, for example.

DNA testing and the current yearly eye certificates, so it's like a car MOT, they have to renew them every year. Well, they only have to renew them if they're actually mating their bitch. So that's all fine. The DNA tests that are out now, I'm actually bit long in the tooth with it all. I've been there from the very first day of the very first DNA test in our breed and I was running clinics for it, which was called Optigen PRA. And now that is GPRA.

I don't require that the bitches have any DNA testing at all, because everything that I've got, with one exception which I will come to, everything that I've got is clear for every test that I value. There are tests I don't value. However, the top five that I value, my dogs are clear for them, so therefore...

It doesn't matter what we're trying to produce is we're trying to produce dogs that are not affected. We're not trying to produce clear. So consequently, if that bitch is a carrier or, you know, or worse still affected and they didn't know and it was going to come on later, my boys are clear. So the worst that you can ever produce is a carrier. And therefore that's okay. As far as I'm concerned, a pet dog being a carrier for something, a carrier is never going to display symptoms.

However, these days, most of the bitches that come have been DNA tested for this and that and the other. So the little exception I was going to say is if, unluckily, one of my boys comes back as a carrier for something or other, sometimes, unfortunately, that's a good enough reason for them to go because unfortunately, in our breed, there's such a diverse choice of stud dogs that just being a carrier for something can cause a dog to just not be used, you know, but...

I have had carriers for things stood at active stud and obviously then it changes the rule a bit and the bitch coming to them must be clear for the thing that the stud dog is a carrier for but it's actually just a hell of a lot easier sadly, sadly to only carry clear DNA dogs in your kennel so you don't require bitch owners to have to do that.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (35:53)
Yeah, yeah, I totally

agree. I was the same when I had one my last major stud dog. I was all an advocate. I was like, yeah, we must DNA test. We must DNA test. Then for bulldogs, we done them HUU, which is urate stones. Obviously, my dog come back as a bleeding carrier, didn't they? I was like, no. as a stud dog owner.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (36:07)
Okay.

Yeah cool.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (36:13)
it instantly impacts how much work your stud dog's going to get because half the people will no longer be interested. They're just because they're obsessed with this clear line. And I agree with you. If it's a pet dog, it doesn't matter that they're carrier. So don't get obsessed with clear only lines from a bitch owner's point of view. But so half the people will be put off because they're just clear obsessed. Then the half that would want to use your dog, half of those couldn't. So you've lost a quarter because their dog is also a carrier.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (36:28)
Yep.

because they're carriers as well.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (36:41)
So effectively

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (36:41)
Absolutely.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (36:42)
you're now only getting a quarter, of your stud work that that dog should have been entitled to. So I totally agree with you. When you've got a stud dog, ideally you want everything clear because it means that they will run at their optimal in regards to the bitches they can serve. But yeah, from a bitch owner's point of view, you know, it is one of those. If you don't test, then yeah, pick a clear dog.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (36:44)
absolutely.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (37:05)
but it is a hard one.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (37:05)
And yeah,

again, I'm not trying to make myself sound like the Holy Grail, but I think it's really important to say when we're pushing how much we, we or I care here at Wylanbriar, I had two dogs, went off, absolutely no reason to believe they went, two youngsters went off for scoring two weeks ago,

The vet rang me last week and said, Di, I'm really sorry, but you know, it's not good news. I said, God, which one? And he said, both of them. And I said, Jesus Christ. So one came back with, for me, two higher hip score, and one came back for me with two higher elbow score. Now, both of those, should I have wished to make myself 10 grand, I could have sold them to the States. I could have sold them to Europe.

I could have sold them to the top of Scotland and sold them as stud dogs. But I instead put them on our group as pet dogs at just over puppy price I'm not trying to go, gosh, whoop, whoop, aren't I fabulous? What I'm trying to say is that is the sort of level that we, I'm not a rich woman, you know, I'm single, I live on my own.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (38:11)
No.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (38:13)
So if it's to be, it's up to me. And so consequently, 10 grand would be very lovely. Thank you very much for my smashing working chocolate that's got every DNA test and clear elbows and a clear eye certificate and a slightly over average hip score. But do it anyway, because that's how much we care, if that makes sense.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (38:29)
Yeah.

Yeah, no, totally. And this is two males from different bloodlines, it's not even like you rocked up to the same kennel and  bought two litter brothers or you don't, know, whatever. Yeah. So, I mean, what are the chances that like, really, what are the chances?

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (38:36)
Completely different.

No, there was a year between them even. Yeah, and unbelievably

one of them had been health tested through the Australian health test schemes. So again, you know, we go over and above because when I bought him, I was pretty confident in his Australian schemes, but they weren't really enough for me. I wanted BVA. We all used Australian health testing during COVID.

But there was no need after COVID to me. We use our own scheme. and unfortunately, the UK scheme did not reflect the Australian scheme. and that's not knocking the Aussie scheme, you know, it's spot on. But when I looked at the x-rays for this, I could see that our scheme was right. there wasn't, there was no fallacy on this.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (39:30)
the insight is massive and I'm probably going to do a really nice summary bit of spiel to go after this pod because I'm not sure we've got across the magnitude of the things that you do for a female bitch owner.

from we've said the mentoring advice, we've said about the Facebook group, but also, mean, I know you deal with WhatsApp, you make sure breedings happen regardless of whether you're in the country or not. I don't think people can underestimate that type of reliability. You advise them, you guide them, ovulation testing, you point them in the right direction, the people that are top tier for, you your hips, elbows, all that kind of stuff. And as I say, pregnancy support or the delivery support.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (39:43)
Great.

Yeah, I know.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (40:11)
Like the

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (40:11)
Yeah.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (40:12)
puppy place in the fact that you run wait lists, you manage puppy owners, you have a whole community. Like there is nobody else and you know, I will blow smoke up your arse and I will give you your flowers because I see the level of breeding and there is literally nobody functioning on your level. anyone that's listening to this that doesn't have a Labrador.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (40:17)
Yeah.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (40:36)
You should go and copy what Di's doing in your field. You're crazy not to because you build up such a good rapport with your bitch owners. Why would you want to go anywhere else? mean, anyone that's listened to these pods, they know Adam Mayle has been on. He's one of your clients. Sue's used your stud dogs, Sam Chamberlain, So you are raising the benchmark because those people are award winners as well. So you're...

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (40:44)
That's right.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (41:01)
as you say, rising tides lifts all boats, doesn't it? And I think you're no, but it is true. Like these people wouldn't be functioning at that level without you having such a high caliber and functioning in such a way that's so welcoming to anybody, whether it's their first litter, whether it's their 10th litter, you have a really good ability to be able to talk to that person on that level. And you're not dismissive, you're not

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (41:05)
Thank you. Yeah.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (41:28)
patronising, you know, you don't know if it's simplified stuff. So I really can't emphasise to people enough. I wish more stud owners, future stud owners functioned at your level, because it really would help their breed and help the people within their breed. And yeah, just breed better puppies. And ultimately, that's what we're all here to do. And that's all what we want to do. So

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (41:29)
No.

It would.

Yeah and sleep

well at night.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (41:53)
Yeah, and I

just want you to be recognised for that. So I hope that this podcast done that but just before we disconnect tell everybody where they can find you whether that be Facebook website, whatever give them some details

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (42:06)
Certainly. So thank you very much. have a very heavy presence on Facebook and you can look up Wylanbriar and Wylanbriar is W-Y-L-A-N for November, B-R-I-A-R. So Wylanbriar Labradors, Wylanbriar Gundog Training, which is pet dog training as well as Gundog training. And our breeding group, I will put you in if you contact me. My website is [http://wylanbriar.com](http://wylanbriar.com "smartCard-inline")

Simple as that and you know it you only have to put W Y L, I don't think there's anybody else in the in the whole in the whole world and it comes straight up so yeah, please do and you know, obviously [WylanbriarLabs@iCloud.com](mailto:WylanbriarLabs@iCloud.com "‌") is the email and I'm always willing to talk to people always and just because last thing I'd like to say

Just because we offer this level of service, our stud fee is the same as anybody else's. So don't think that you're even having to pay a premium for it. I've been offering champions, I've been offering field trial winners, I've been offering dogs that have won all sorts of classes a Crufts the whole working ring. And we offer them for exactly the same cost as anybody else offers a stud dog. So I just wanted to emphasise that too.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (43:18)
Yeah,

big surprise audience when I bred my Labrador, where did I go to? And everybody said, and everybody said to me when I when I got Spice, I'm like, Oh, you're not getting a Wylanbriar? And I was No, because obviously I'm going. Yeah, exactly. So was like, I'm going to travel a bit and so I can go and

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (43:25)
And you are most welcome.

Cause I'm gonna breathe it too, yeah.

So relieved your bitch was in putt

both times. That would have been awful, wouldn't it, if she'd missed? She's a super moth.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (43:42)
Yeah, no, she's a good one and all sexy morph bless her but yeah, I

as a clientele myself can not speak highly enough But I just wanted to spread the word to people that there are some fabulous stud dog owners out there not taking the mick doing an amazing job for an amazing price And yeah, I just felt that people need to know that there are people out there offering outstanding service So when you find a stud in your breeding

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (43:53)
Thanks.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (44:08)
You basically thought that all you bought is some sperm and that's it. There are amazing people out there offering a massive package of support and you need to go and find those stud dog owners where you can have that kind of relationship. So I just wanted to lift the curtain to say they are, they exist and you are one of them. And if they don't exist in your breed, you need to be that person and they need to go and get a stud dog and build that team. But right, I should take no more of your time, but thank you ever so much, Di.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (44:22)
Here, Here.

Yes, quite.

Thank

you.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (44:37)
You've

already got your awards because I've seen you in person, haven't you? So enjoy them. I hope people have enjoyed listening to this podcast. And yeah, it's a goodbye from me, I suppose.

Diana Stevens (Wylanbriar) (44:40)
Yes, yes, I have.

Thank you, goodbye everybody.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (44:50)
Thank you, bye.

Sara (Canine Family Planner) (44:51)
What a brilliant conversation. It's a shame that we've run out of time to work through the quick fire round questions. However, Di did truly set the bar of what a stud owner should be, offering support, guidance, and a full service experience. So if you're into Labradors, make sure you look up Wylanbriar Facebook or visit the website,

And if you're into another breed, take notes, this is exactly how stud owners should be operating. If you found this episode helpful, please share it with a fellow breeder and remember, if you can't find an owner like Di, maybe it's time to become one. Until next time, take care.