The Mission of Mercy: Rescuing Children and Finding Grace

In this episode, Austin Gardner sits down with Stephen Underwood and Haley Thomas to discuss the vital work of Black Flag International and the Black Flag Innocence Foundation. Haley shares her journey from 7.5 years in the Navy as a K9 handler in Bahrain and San Diego to her transition into the civilian sector through the SkillBridge program.

The Mission:
The conversation dives deep into the mission of the Black Flag Innocence Foundation: combating child trafficking. We explore how professional expertise in high-end security is being used to bring light into the darkest corners of the world.

The Spiritual Takeaway:
Beyond the tactics and the missions, this episode is a testimony to the fact that we are "followed by mercy." Whether in the heat of a deployment or the transition to a new career, God’s goodness and grace pursue us. It’s a reminder that we don’t have to perform to be loved; we are held by a Father who calls us to be His children first.

Links & Resources:

• Learn more about the mission: waustingardner.com
• Support the Black Flag Innocence Foundation: https://bfi-foundation.org/about
• Follow Austin for more stories of grace: @waustingardner

Thanks for listening. Find us on YouTube, Substack, Twitter, LinkedIn, Facebook, and Instagram.

Transcript

Welcome And Guest Setup

Austin Gardner 0:27

I'm excited to invite you to listen to everything today. I really believe it is going to be a blessing to you. I've had comments made about our other podcasts that I've done with Stephen. So, Stephen, you're here to introduce Haley to us and to tell us what we're what what are we talking about?

Stephen Underwood 0:46

So we're here with Haley Thomas, and she was my very first connection to Black Flag International, which is the private security company that I work for. And uh she introduced me to the nonprofit that they have called Black Flag Innocence Foundation. And uh when she started explaining to us the mission and the purpose uh why we exist, it's it's one of those missions that if you if if you care anything about innocent children, you have to be able to get involved. And so I was very fortunate to have that opportunity to not only meet her and be involved with the private security company, but then found a new purpose and passion for Black Flag Innocence Foundation. Haley is the backbone of our organization, uh, both on the private security sector and in the nonprofit. She's one of those multi-tools, if you will. She handles about everything. And so Haley, uh, I'm gonna let her tell her story, but she served in the Navy, did a really cool job in the Navy. She wasn't stuck on on a boat or anything like that. She got to play with dogs.

Austin Gardner 1:47

I think my brother would uh beg to differ. They are not boats.

Stephen Underwood 1:52

Okay, ships.

Haley Thomas 1:54

There you go.

Stephen Underwood 1:55

Sorry, John, if you're listening, sorry. But uh, she got to play with dogs and get paid to do it. And so uh she was a canine handler, and I'm gonna uh let her take over and talk a little bit about herself.

Austin Gardner 2:06

Hayden, why don't you just tell us who you are? And before we really dig into a lot of who you are, I want to ask you a question about that. Okay. So what is Black Flag period?

Haley Thomas 2:17

Black Flag period. So we have Black Flag International, an executive protection agency. We focus all of our security services around high net worth clientele. We can do anything that you can think of quite literally, there's nothing we can't do, but we do provide an extensive amount of services as far as like residential security, close protection, transportation of high-value goods, even as far as events as well. So those can get dove into at a deeper topic if you'd like to. We can pick those apart, as well as our Black Flag Innocence Foundation, which is our nonprofit. Counter trafficking of children is our mission as far as like protection and rescuing and getting those children out of such dire situations. So as a whole, it's made up of better known and operated. Each one of my guys comes with such a diverse background and their military background or law enforcement background to the table. And because of that, we're able to be so successful in every area that I just uh kind of highlighted on.

Austin Gardner 3:17

Okay, so why don't you just tell us about Haley? Introduce us to her.

Haley Thomas 3:21

Okay. Hi guys, I'm Haley. And I just actually got out of the Navy myself. I detached in December and actually just participated in the Skillbridge program. For those of you who don't know, Skillbridge is an internship program designed for service members to transition out of the military very smoothly. It gives the service member a six-month window to uh exit out of the military early on. And uh Skillbridge is a blessing, if you ask me. It's uniquely designed so that way service member can retransition into the civilian world, into any sector of the civilian world. So I started my Skillbridge back in August. And during that time, I was interning at an equine therapeutic center where they specialize in equine therapy for veteran, uh, veterans who struggle with PTSD, anxiety, and trauma. During that time frame is when I started scouting out where what's my next step, right? Um, where am I heading? Am I gonna be working for in the nonprofit industry or like security world still being my background with dog handling and MA, which is Master at Arms in the Navy. And how I found Black Flag is its own story and a God story, if you ask me. But truly, I didn't see this for myself prior to getting out, and I'm so thankful for the opportunity. But that's how I kind of unfolded into this this opportunity that I have now.

Austin Gardner 4:50

Well, uh Steven is a very personal and good friend of mine. I've known him basically. He wasn't in diapers, but it wasn't that far off. And so I was 14. Okay, well, so he wore his diapers a lot longer than most people.

Haley Thomas 5:05

Say, maybe late development there.

Getting Selected For Canine School

Austin Gardner 5:07

But Steven speaks very highly of you. And so uh I I there's a lot of interesting questions here. Yeah. How did you become a canine handler in the Navy? And how long were you in the Navy?

Haley Thomas 5:20

Seven and a half years. I actually started off as a reservist my first year, and then um there was a moment impressed upon my heart uh where I went to the Lord and asked him, What is it that you have the calling, like what's your calling on my life? And um, I fell on my face. I spent a a significant amount of time praying and and fasting over this, and it was brought to my mind that canine was the only option for me.

Austin Gardner 5:47

Wow.

Haley Thomas 5:47

And so I went to my career counselor. I told him what it is I'm gonna do. And they told me, Thomas, you're crazy. Uh you can't be job blocked, but we'll give it a go. I put in for my transfer from reserve to active. They had a window blocked out of what year groups were to be selected. They called me Thomas. You didn't get selected. Sorry, try again next time. 30 minutes later, he's like, Thomas, I don't know how you do this, but you got selected. So uh I went and got the orders to go R C D E C. And then I then waited for my actual orders of placement. And uh originally stage selected for Poland. I was defeated because I there's no kennels in Poland. But then again, I got a call and they were like, you're going to Bahrain, and you need to be there in 30 days. And so, which normally reservists get like six months before they go and PCS off into their first command as active duty. And um, so I went to Bahrain and I asked every question necessary to figure out how to get into the kennels. And they have a strict protocol in how people are authorized to even be in the kennels working, you know, OJT essentially. And I hit every check mark that I needed to to get myself in the kennels and start training and learning the life of a handler. And so then through that process, is I got selected for dog school, went to dog school, and from there I went and worked as a handler out of San Diego, which was my most recent and last active duty command.

Austin Gardner 7:25

For those of you listening or watching, you know, this is podcast, I call it followed by mercy, because the Bible says, Surely goodness and mercy shall follow us all the days of our life. And that that word in the Hebrew is pursue us, chase us. And you just listened to Haley tell you how God has just been chasing her with mercy. And she sought the Lord and the Lord answered. And so I just want you to know that it's really not theory, it's practical. It works in our lives. We can mess up and and we can I don't know where you are, I don't know what's going on in your life, but I don't care where you are. Mercy and grace, surely goodness and mercy are following you, and I want you to know that. Stephen, I want you to jump in and make a comment right there about that. What I just said, we'll get back to Haley.

Stephen Underwood 8:21

Yeah, I mean, that's exactly what I believe God is doing in my life currently with being able to partner with Black Flag, both on the the private security sector, but also with the Black Flag Innocence Foundation. You know, coming off of the mission field, uh serving 10 years and in two different fields, that was my dream since the time that I got to visit Honduras as a teenager. I knew then that I wanted to be a missionary. And even from the time that I was in Peru with you during that internship and we went to Tucumán and Argentina was on my heart even then as a young teenager.

Austin Gardner 8:57

Yes, man, you got the best steaks in the world.

Stephen Underwood 8:59

Exactly. Yeah. Uh you can eat very clean in Argentina and for very true.

Haley Thomas 9:05

I need to go.

Stephen Underwood 9:06

But um when when we came off the field, it literally was the death of a dream for me. And uh, of course that has its own story, but over the past several months, God has given me a new dream, and it's just his mercy that continues to pursue me and uh open up these new opportunities. And for the first time in in uh in a in a couple of years, it's like there's a a new door that God has opened for me just to be involved. And uh and he's not done writing my story.

Stop Camping In The Past

Haley Thomas 9:34

No, he's not. And and to comment on that, Stephen, I will say there was a period in my time while stationed out in Bahrain that because I was I was beating my drums for the Lord. Like I had witnessed God's hand so many times, like there's no way to deny who he is in my life and in my heart. Um this was just after I had truly learned how to exercise the authority in Jesus Christ's name and put go before him in the courts of heaven and pray and ask for certain things and command for certain things to be done. And then I had hit a wall in my own life because I had experienced a traumatic death and loss while stationed overseas. I'm sure any service member can relate to that and being detached from family and loved ones and then someone passing away. And then I had an accident, a major accident, occur where I was concussed and I hurt my back severely. And then I, in that transitioning of coming back from the emergency leave that by the grace of God, I got authorized to go on for the funeral. I had contracted COVID and they put me up in a hotel for 17 days. And so I was limb due, partnered with um COVID. And, you know, at that time they'd separate us off. I share all of that to say, like, I had come back from that and I had almost given up on canine. There was this long period of like I had I had come back from that and felt defeated and felt like I was not hitting the target with picking up orders and for dog school. And I think the Lord saw that as well in my heart. And um, he sent someone out that sought me out and said, Thomas, we saw the work you did. Your name's all throughout the books. We know you were in the kennels, like we want to give you dog school. And so that to me was like it was just another reassurance of who he is as my father, and like that prayer that I had prayed two years prior in going canine. It was a long haul. It wasn't an overnight absolute answering, but even still, it was like that period that you had probably felt prior to meeting me and Black Flag Innocence Foundation coming to light, but where you're like, I thought this was the mission, I thought this was the purpose on my life, and so um he's like faithful. I was just reading how faithful he is and delivering um the promises he has for us, and so this morning. So it's just funny how it's all coming full circle.

Austin Gardner 12:08

I want to say this to all of you listening. Now we're gonna talk about rescuing the children, but I need to help you because that are listening because you can get stuck on what happened. And and the devil wants nothing more than for you to get stuck in the past. It's way behind you already. Yes, you messed up. Yes, things didn't work out your way, yes, something happened, an accident happened. But he is I am, God is I am, Yahweh, I am. And so he's not I was, and he's not stuck in the past, he's not stuck in the past, and you shouldn't be stuck in the past. And I'm enjoying hearing Hailey's story and Stephen's story because they're not stuck in the past. And so if you're listening and you're kind of stuck in the past, I really want to ask you to think about that. Don't put down a tent and camp and what happened to you. Or what or or what or or not only what happened to you, maybe where you messed up. Because we love to beat ourselves up. Go ahead, Steven.

Stephen Underwood 13:18

I want to add to that, you know, uh over the past two years, when we got back from the mission field, I tried to open my own doors as well. I tried to start my own nonprofit. Uh, we did some good things, and but it seemed like uh every time we had uh a new opportunity to expand and grow that that door was shut. And uh so that time period of self-defeated and just kind of wanting to throw in the towel, those those came multiple times. And I look back now and I I understand what God was doing in in my life on a personal level. I had some lessons that I had to learn. I had the I had I had some wilderness time to go through some refining before he right, and uh and so you know now our family is is uh thriving, my marriage is thriving. We're doing everything that we can to to please the Lord and what we do on a daily basis. Excuse me. And so I believe it does take some of those wilderness days. We try to make things happen in our own power and it never works out. When when we when we eventually put ourselves to the side and just say, Lord, you know, I don't know what you want from me, but I'm your vessel, that's when he starts opening the doors for us to be able to walk through and they stay open, they remain open.

Austin Gardner 14:33

I can tell Helly's wanting to say something, then I got some questions.

Haley Thomas 14:37

No, I just I I I appreciate that you allowed yourself to self-reflect like that and see how like when you give him the absolute um permission to operate as your leader, as your father, as your parent, and refine those areas and s and completely surrender yourself. Um, that's when he's able to be God in your life, to be the big, powerful God that can open doors, that can speak your name before your you've ever ever entered a room and he creates opportunity, but we just have to release that and surrender that to him to do so.

A Real Day As A Handler

Austin Gardner 15:13

Amen. Okay. We're we'll ask a few more questions in today's podcast and then we'll we'll break for another one. But Haley, how did you go from a name? Maybe I want to know this. What's it like on a day-to-day basis being a dog handler?

Haley Thomas 15:29

It's fun. Honestly, I'm I'm gonna tell you it is the best job in the Navy. Uh, we get to play with all kinds of dogs all day long, and the community is close-knit, and everyone there is their own special breed of person. Um, I was blessed to have worked alongside some phenomenal handlers and trainers during my time. From day to day, like that dog is your partner. And so you establish a routine with you and the dog, and you have your primary objectives to hit as as far as like checking in with the command and you know, chain of command and you know, arming up, going to guard mount, those essentials, right? But you establish a routine for the dog and for you. You're also hitting primary objectives established by the Navy, like as far as like where the dog team should be at to be certified and fully operational. So you have certain certain training requirements to meet, and you build out your day-to-day plan based around those training requirements. And um, if you're super good about managing your time and and working with the the other handlers, like you can have some fun and get some cool training. And often it just felt like, and a lot of people gave us, you know, talk back as like canine just have fun, like they're not, you know, but we're actually like hitting several objectives. We're out there training, we're at, we're responding to multiple commands at any point in time. We could be dispatched to any call within nine different installations in the local area of San Diego. So we were busy all the time. Operations was number one. So it definitely was fun. High drive. I love the adrenaline rush and just the journey of partnering with a a new dog and becoming one with that dog is there's nothing like it. I still miss my dog.

How To Pursue The Canine Path

Austin Gardner 17:15

I think, I think some young person listening right now is thinking, boy, I like that. And so how about uh turning Navy dog recruiter right quick? What would I do? What would I do if I was 17 or 18? I guess that's the age, and I wanted to do something like that. I'm hearing your story and I'm like, wow, I want that. Yeah. What do I do?

Haley Thomas 17:38

Um, so you're gonna find your local Navy recruiter. Um, I think you got to start shaping up now as far as physical readiness. Uh being canine, you are cream of the crop. And every little statistic and stat about you is gonna come into play as far as like your competitiveness. Um, they are cracking down as far as like having a service member join enlist, be rated as an MA, again, uh short for Master at Arms, Navy Lingo, and you go through your academy, you get stationed. You want to try to aim for if you have any pool to get into a your first command that has a kennel, so that way you can go and do the kennel support program. And you have to understand, like you're holding down the job requirements of an MA that though they have certain requirements that you're expected to meet. And then your any time you spend with the kennel is all volunteer. And so that's like you got to give your heart, blood, sweat, and tears to that to demonstrate how much it means to you to be a part of that program. And then um, once you make it through that and get the dog school orders, then you're shipped off to dog school and route to your next command. And it it's certainly the best job in the Navy.

Austin Gardner 18:50

Okay.

Haley Thomas 18:51

I just have to add that back up.

Austin Gardner 18:52

All right, Steven, since you didn't handle dogs, I don't know. We won't even we won't even go there. All right, all right, Haley, how about this? How did you go from a Navy canine handler to working with black flag?

Haley Thomas 19:05

So in in my venture out of Skillbridge and learning how veterans transition from active duty to civilian, I was learning how to rebrand myself, how to connect. Um, I built out my LinkedIn, got headshots done. I started anytime I met a veteran at any networking event, let's connect. And I had been hitting the keyboard every day, every week, and pushing out resumes and such. I was getting nowhere. Indeed, LinkedIn, I was having a hard time finding um solidified job offers. And I just, I told the Lord I had just gotten an apartment, you know, with the active duty pay coming to an end soon, knowing like that guaranteed pay was coming to an end. I was building up. I was getting frustrated. Lord, where do you want me to go? I'm not seeing the path, I'm not seeing the calling. And I was also during a six-month fast of no social media and no drinking, not that I'm a heavy drinker by any means, but I just wanted my mind clean and clear and less busy. Um, so you know, I was trying to give him room to be God in my life during this period of transition. Um, one day I was at the gym and I was doing my standard protocol of lifting and working on what's in the head and and processing, meditating. And I had my, I was doing some hangs, had my eyes closed. I opened my eyes, and there's this young, beautiful woman standing in front of me, bright eye and bushy tail. And she's just like, now she has a southern accent. And you commented on my accent, this woman's southern accent. And uh she was like, I just have to tell you, like, you are killing it. Like, keep doing what you're doing, like your physique is in shape and da-da-da-da. And I was just so taken back by this encounter that she came across the gym. I don't know you, and uh, I hear her accent. I'm like, thank you for one. If you knew how hard it was for me to get in here today mentally, I was struggling, being postpartum, you know, trying to get back into the physical shape I was pre-baby. So it was just really great to have that female validation. And then I asked her, I was like, Where are you from? Because you're not from here. And she starts telling me her story. Her husband's a retired Green Beret, uh, owns a security company. And all of a sudden, all these bells and whistles are going off in my head. I'm like, ding, ding, ding, can we connect? And I was like, absolutely. Uh, I need to connect with you and your husband. I want to send you my LinkedIn profile. I'd love to send him my resume. And where I was heading with that in my mind, he's got a security company. I have a security clearance and a security background. I can translate for you. Let me do the administrative role. You go do the boy the man's job, and you know, I'll I'll hold down the the front, you know. And um, I did that. I connected with him, I pitched it to him, and he was like, We we need, we have a role. We need space, we have a need for that kind of role within our company. Let's come in and do an interview. And we did, and it turned into like what should have been like maybe 30 minutes to four hours of just talking um and finding out how much we all share in common. I was, I was just like quickly, I realized God had removed some key key individuals in my life. That were in alignment with my belief system andor just were good for where I was heading. And then all of a sudden, my whole network of personnel are aligned with believers and like-minded individuals who are have their a mission and their mission-oriented. And so truly, it felt like God was, I mean, He did all of that. I was the one sitting there trying to do all these resumes and scouring the internet and making calls. And I didn't have to work for that. God preordained that. Like he allowed it to come to pass. And it was just an amazing way to see God unfold and execute everything. So fell into the role as an executive assistant and operations manager here at Black Flag and utilizing the skills I've developed in the military as far as like supervising as a patrol supervisor and you know, seeing how we conduct operations over there systematically, and then as well as my bachelor's in business administration, that helps kind of bring it all together as far as being able to support in an administrative capacity.

Shame Ends When You Surrender

Austin Gardner 23:27

Well, I will let both of y'all help me with this because I want to stop talking about black flag and I want to help people listening. You see, God is the one doing the work without a doubt. But if you stay camped in your past and you keep letting garbage beat you up, then it's not gonna work. Real faith is gonna say for you to step out and say, I'm trusting you, Lord, and I love you. But it it's not a matter of not working, it's a matter of trusting. And so you are gonna work and you are gonna you gotta get your head right. Uh Stephen, you want to say something about that and then let Hayley?

Stephen Underwood 24:09

Yeah, you know, when when we do try to make things happen in our own power, you know, every veteran I know, every service member I know, we're used to, in the absence of orders, we create our own. But that's not how God works. We follow the orders, we know what the Bible tells us, we know what we should be doing, and as we're obeying, as we're living in obedience, that's when he presents us with these new opportunities. It's not it's not that we're having to work for for his approval or anything like that. We're working already approved by him. And when we start to live that way and we believe that, then we're simply following what he wants on a day-to-day basis anyway. That's when he opens up greater doors for us. And I know that that's been true in my life. There's been many times where I tried to force something to happen that wasn't his will, and that's why that's when you fall flat on your face, that's when you feel defeated, is that you're trying to live in your own power. And uh when we when we finally let go, we're yes, we're doing the work, yes, we're living in obedience, but when we trust God to bring us to the point and place that he wants us and not where we want to be, he provides for us more than what we could ever have wanted for ourselves. You know, I I I I know it's your life first, but Romans 8 28, all these things that work together for what? For good. All the the good, the bad, the ugly, all these things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose. And so when we live with that in mind, that whether it whether we experience good or bad, those things God was using in our life to mold us into an instrument that he could put to good use. And so, yes, I live with regrets. Yes, I have a past that I'm ashamed of, but at the same time, I'm thankful for going through those experiences for God to mold me into who I am today to where I can be ready and prepared for the next venture.

Austin Gardner 26:04

Before Haley speaks, let me just say this our regrets are under the blood and forgiven.

Haley Thomas 26:11

Yes.

Austin Gardner 26:11

And the the one who likes to put out your regrets and beat you upside the head with them is not your father. It is not your father. Everybody listen, we we live in a land of regret. Instead of and what you gotta do is rewrite the story. You might have messed up, but God turned the garbage to good. And you don't even he takes even your message, turns it to good. Haley, uh, you're looking like you want to just preach. Go ahead.

Haley Thomas 26:41

I just I can sympathize with the feeling of shame, honestly, uh, because there are decisions that the Lord has brought back to to light for me where I grieved over those decisions and I I felt the weight of how that impacted him when I was in those motions of sin. But then once I surrendered it, once I grieved it, once I, you know, put it all at his feet, I can tell you I carry no shame anymore and how freeing it is. And I can see how he does get the glory out of it because there are moments I've had encounters with people that were heading down that exact path. But because I could see from the perspective with the spiritual mindset, spiritual eyes, spiritual ear, spiritual tongue to hear, to hear, to speak, to receive, uh, I was able to move in on that moment and speak to them from a place of like understanding, no judgment. But let me tell you about my my testimony, you know, and let me help you, you know, like, and or just be there present with you in this moment and offer that support. And I just I can tell you, Stephen, personally, I love you. You know, we've got our friendship that I don't want that for you, like to carry any more regret or shame. In fact, that's where he gets the glory is when you surrender all of that to him. He's already handled it at the cross, it's done, it's finished, right? And we can come into agreement over that. And so there's no reason to be ashamed or regret. There's gonna be a he's gonna get the victory out of those choices that you made.

Why Child Protection Became Personal

Austin Gardner 28:15

He or or better said, he's already getting the victory. How about that? Yeah, but I want to talk to the listener right now because we're talking to people that I'm not saying everything's always gone right, but we don't live in the past anymore. But I want to tell you what you need to do today. See, you have to pull up the tent stakes and move out of your past and get a hold of the I am the God of today. He is not he'll never bring up your past, he'll never bring up your sin. He's taken all of that away, it's all cleaned up, and you're letting the past beat you up. But you are followed by mercy. You do not have to live in the past, you don't have to live there. You find purpose and it uh you you gotta live till you die. So live trusting God. And then moving on. Well, I want to change one one more question, and we're gonna take a break from today's podcast. But I I want to ask you, Haley, how you go from dogs to protecting children and then and your change careers. I I'm glad the Lord opened the door for you to get a new career, but you're into protecting children, and Stephen, you and I have been talking about that. So both of you kind of help us see how you got there. So the listener might go from, I don't even know what you're talking about, to I want to help the children.

Phones Open Doors For Predators

Haley Thomas 29:39

Yeah. So first and foremost, I'm I'm a single mama. I have a force, my firstborn son, um, he's two years old now, and it is was the driving reason as to why I chose to separate from the military. I could not reasonably argue with myself to remain a deployable asset as a single mother. My son does have chronic health issues, um, being that asthma, and he's already been hospitalized in the ICU over five times now, fighting for his little life, early as six months. Um I will say my journey in motherhood has been every layer of it has been even like a slow awakening to the realities of the world. And I will also add to that that I am a single mother. I've gone against the design of God's plans for how families are constructed, right? Uh becoming a mother was my a very humbling moment between the Lord and I. And I developed a very thorough respect for his design for the family. I am now in a place and period in my life where I am waiting on the Lord for a husband, if that is his will for me. With that said, as well, a man's role is to be a protector, right? And provider for the family. That is an honorable role. And I know Stephen can attest to that when his wife has been pregnant, how vulnerable she is, and how much a man plays such a pivotal role in that pregnancy. And then when the child comes, how much, how innocent this little bundle of joy, blessing from the Lord is, and how the provider and the protector come home to uphold that roof and ensure the evils of the world remain outside, right? So you have that full picture. It's just me. It's just me at home doing the providing, the protecting, and all of the provision over my child and I. And so I do live on the day-to-day, especially working for Black Flag Innocence, very aware of how vulnerable I am and how vulnerable my child is. I was listening to the Vets for Child Rescue podcast done by Craig Sawyer, and they were going over statistics. And while every child is vulnerable, it's important to know that specifically children, baby boys, are more vulnerable coming from a single parent home because predators see them as an easy target to groom. And I know we're talking heavy terms and heavy topics now, but that hit me harder than you can imagine. I get angry over these discussions. I have a hard time going out in the public without being protective over myself and my child and being aware of my surroundings at all times. From how I position myself at the gas station at the pump to knowing my surroundings and exits and ingress and egress routes to every restaurant and um gas station. Um, I very rarely go into a Target or Walmart anymore. I'm picking up my orders because you have to be aware in the parking lot. You are followed, you are tracked out of a store, you are aware. They watch how you move to see how unaware you are. And so um seeing what's happening to these innocent blessings from God and how vulnerable they are, and knowing my child is even more vulnerable because I am a single parent, it fuels me, it angers me, but it like it's a righteous angle. Like, I want other single mothers to know. I want single parents to know, but especially single mothers to know, like it's not okay to shove your head in the sand and not pay attention to what's going on and how these predators move and how they're executing, especially with social media, online platforms such as um or games, Roblox, Minecraft, all of these different avenues to your child. When you're and it was said on the Sean Ryan podcast, but you know, you think you're giving your child a phone to have access to the world when in actuality you're giving your child a phone for the world to have access to your child. You know, and there's just so many avenues to our child children being, I mean, we're talking about AI being utilized now for FaceTiming and setting themselves up as uh a parent calling the child and instructing the child to open the door now. Um we're they're under attack. Our children are under attack, is what I'm trying to get to here. And so that that's my mission. That's my fuel for the drive as to why I have a voice in this this fight. And um, I think what's been my biggest um change in everything is just educating myself, you know, surrounding myself with like-minded individuals who are educating me and how to be uh protective over my house and home and and what what to carry as a sidearm, um, you know, what to um how to carry yourself and conduct your business in public. Like it's not okay to be walking through the parking lot with your face in the phone. You know, when you're in the store, you must be aware of your surroundings at all times. Your child could be yanked out of that car, that uh buggy at any point in time. You know, you gotta pay attention, you gotta wake up. And I don't think uh children need social media, access to social media, point blank.

Austin Gardner 35:05

So I don't I don't like one thing you said at all. I think it's I think it's gotta be said. You said you uh you can I want you to just hit it again and Stephen can jump in. I think Steven has cheapdog syndrome, and so uh which is great. Uh but you said you think you're giving your child access to the world. But the world is getting I want that, I want anybody to listen, I want them to hear that. So I'm gonna ask you to say that again.

Haley Thomas 35:35

Yeah, when you hand your child a phone, you think you're giving your child access to the world when in actuality you're giving the world access to your child, right?

Austin Gardner 35:45

That's terrible.

Haley Thomas 35:46

Yeah, it is terrible.

Austin Gardner 35:47

I don't like that, I don't like that a bit.

Haley Thomas 35:50

And that's the truth of it. You don't know what that child's doing on the phone. And what makes you think as a parent, and this is like I am not a tech hacker, anything of any sort, I am not smarter than these predators that are able to hack in on these apps and create profiles and find ways to, you know, emulate themselves as an another young child and start begin grooming these children. They are smart. So why would you make yourself more vulnerable to these avenues to your child? Like point like I I just don't um well I can't come into agreement with giving the children a phone and or social media access.

Austin Gardner 36:32

I don't like I don't like it one bit, but I think it is well, it's like when you're told you got cancer, you don't like it, but you need to hear it. Yeah, and so we needed to hear that. Uh, but for Stephen, you can jump in anytime on this, but let's give uh listeners two or three things. If if their children have phones and uh they're not gonna take them away. You just gotta live in the real world.

Haley Thomas 36:53

Yeah.

Parental Controls And Hard Conversations

Austin Gardner 36:54

We need to say, listen, mama, I realize you're not gonna take that phone away, but here's two or three things you should do.

Haley Thomas 37:01

Yeah. Um, I would number one and foremost, be involved in every area of the phone, right? Like understand what apps they have. If they do have social media, go through that, comb through it. Who's their followers? Who are they following? What's their algorithm looking like? I would insert as many blockers and parental blockers that you can, but also educate yourself on other uh resources out there to help, you know, uh filter out any or any blockers that could be implemented onto the phone if need be, as well as educating your child, right? Talk to your child at their level, right? Give them signs and symptoms and behaviors to be aware of, right? I had this tough conversation with my nine-year-old niece uh recently because I jumped on her social media and I I told her, I was like, I could tell where you go to school, I can tell you who your friends are, I can tell you when pickup and drop-off time is, I can tell all these things, and guess who else can tell? And I was like, and then the type of content she's posting in her little beautiful innocent mind may seem innocent to her, but to a predator's perspective, your daughter's dancing for them.

Stephen Underwood 38:12

What's that Navy term? That Navy term that y'all said uh many times. I've even heard it, uh, loose lips sink ships. And that's exactly what we're doing when we post our entire life on social media.

Haley Thomas 38:25

And they think it's innocent, you know. Exactly. Yeah.

Stephen Underwood 38:28

Yeah, I'll tell you this. Uh statistically, the majority of ambushes that were successful overseas were done because of situational awareness uh or a lack of it. Uh when you see when you see soldiers with, you know, laying their heads on their weapons, not paying attention to their surroundings, not alert to what's going on, uh, they become soft targets. And uh in the world that we live in today, when we bury our faces and our phones out in public, when we are not paying attention to our children, that's when we become soft targets for these predators to take advantage of it. And um, and then that includes the social media platforms and the video games and all of that. Today is Neiland, our youngest son's 10th birthday. And um, I can tell you there's times where just overhearing, I don't know, I don't get it. I never I watch cartoons at that age, but they like to watch those uh YouTube shorts where they're opening presents or they they get these gifts, and it's like, okay, that's that's nice and and innocent and whatnot. But then the next video that pops up that they didn't search for could be full of innuendos, it could have bad language, it could have all sorts of different topics that a 10-year-old should never have to worry about. Yeah, and um, and so it's not it it's not that they're searching out uh these opportunities via take exactly they're not searching these these videos for uh to be targeted, they are being targeted, they're being hunted. And um, and that's that's done by design. And so being able to uh being able to to be involved, to to follow up, to to look at and and be accountable, have your children be accountable to what they're doing on social media and on the video games and things like that, that's that's part of having that situational awareness. Another term, another military term that that we use is operational security. So what that means is you keep your mouth shut about the sensitive information. There's no sense in in posting your daily schedule, where you're going, where your kids are, what they're doing all the time. You want to snap some pictures at their ball practice, fine. But leave out where they're having ball practice. You don't have to tag the location.

Haley Thomas 40:44

Not even that. I would just say altogether, don't post your children anymore. Stop posting your children. Just I was the mother who did it, okay? Full transparency. Uh first year of his life, I was posting that he's three months, he's four months, and it was fun. Then I got here into this point of like supporting Black Flag Innocence, and I s I I wiped my Instagram clear and clean. I'm still having a I'll get memories on Facebook that I need to delete my child's face. Don't post your children. Why, why are we doing that? Giving them clear, easy targets. And it's that complacency as parents where the day-to-day, the running down, the exhaustion, the I just gotta, you know, pacify my child and get them to stop bugging me. I get it. I'm I get it 24-7 from my child. Um, but at the end of the day, like you have to have a standard, and these are gotta be very clear. We're not posting our children online, we're not posting where we're going, and we're not allowing them access. And if we are gonna allow them access, it's gonna be monitored thoroughly.

Austin Gardner 41:48

And maybe it ought not be a babysitter for us.

Haley Thomas 41:51

Right. Right.

Austin Gardner 41:53

I'm gonna ask one other question, and I I did not warn you of this, so I don't know if you I don't know if you know the answer. But are there not apps that appear innocent to mom and dad because they're kind of ignorant and a kid knows that when they click on this, or I don't know how it works. I I am ignorant, but are there apps like that that the people are using to get it to our children if parents don't watch it?

Haley Thomas 42:18

Roadblocks and Minecraft, I know, are wildly being talking about, um, especially uh with the gang 764. They are doing wildly horrific things to children and grooming them to do satanic things to uh children. I do know and I've heard of other apps where predators can create profiles that, you know, portray them as at that age if they want to target a child, a boy or girl at the age of 13, um, that they can then create the profile in that sense and and then zero in on the child group that way. Um, but it doesn't um I think every parent should just research uh every app that your child is is is desiring to partake in and do your background checks on it um because every there's room for these hackers are finding every which way. They're finding every which way. And I will be the first one to tell you I'm not smarker smarter than these hackers. So, like, why am I gonna, you know, partake in something I know they can outbeat me on? So um it's a it's overwhelming as a parent because there's so many avenues to monitor. So I uh it's a bit long-winded answer for you there, but um yeah, those are just I know definitely roadblocks and Minecraft, Snapchat is another another one that they love to utilize.

Stephen Underwood 43:43

We think that they're just taking pictures with f funny filters and and everything, but they get on there and and they can find out just about anything that they want just through Snapchat. And then not only that, but Snapchat deletes messages, it deletes things so that there's no history after a certain period of time. So you have no idea what sort of conversations your children are having with these people that they've never met in real life.

Austin Gardner 44:08

Well, I really believe y'all have helped us a lot. Uh I don't like everything I've heard. Fact is, I don't like a lot of what y'all have said. Uh, because you know, I have 20 grandchildren and I now have uh four great-grandchildren, and I don't want them hurt. I do not I went to visit my grandson yesterday who's twenty-five and he is um he's had a he's got an infection. He's been out out of work now like three weeks. He was in the hospital over a week. He's on the C an infectious disease doctor, he's taking three injections a day for weeks to get over this. And I hurt just watching him. And so don't ignore these people. Stephen and Haley are working in an area. We're gonna talk more about it in another podcast, but but they're working in an area that's it's not nice. It's not pretty. And it here's the horrible thing, it could be our kids. And I don't like that. I'll let both of you take a minute or so and let's close this one down and we'll and we'll start up another one.

Haley Thomas 45:21

Thank you.

Austin Gardner 45:22

Go ahead, Haley. Go ahead.

Haley Thomas 45:24

I just want to say thank you guys. And um, you know, this has been a blessing to have the opportunity to speak out on this. I do have the unique perspective as a single parent to be driven by this like mission, to be so self-aware. It's okay to accept, like, I didn't know, but now it doesn't matter when you wake up to it, like just start educating yourself. And if I can do it and I get it done day in and day out, you can too.

Stephen Underwood 45:48

Well, while ignorance can be a temporary excuse at this point, it's no longer an excuse.

Haley Thomas 45:53

No longer an excuse.

Prevention Now And Closing Prayerful Note

Stephen Underwood 45:54

Now now now you'll make the conscious decision on how you're gonna conduct yourself and allow your children to conduct themselves with access to social media and video games. I will say this concerning Black Flag Innocence. We exist to fight this battle for you, but that doesn't negate your personal responsibility. We exist to where we want to do the investigation. We want to kick in the doors, we want to help these children get access to the help that they need in the aftermath, but it doesn't negate your personal responsibility for prevention. You know, just like um, you know, your grandson going through that and and with his illness right now, he's having to take, I'm sure, antibiotics to fight this disease and take those injections and everything. You can start your children on a quote unquote antibiotics, antibiotic series right now against these things just by simply being involved and helping to monitor. Yeah, we're gonna exist to we're gonna exist to be the scalpel uh for surgery. And, you know, in in your darkest days, we can be there to to help um help you come out of that. However, there's some preventative things that you can do as a parent right now to make sure that they never wind up under the knife. Amen.

Austin Gardner 47:03

And that is what we want. Okay, we'll be back tomorrow. You'll hear the follow-up to this. I thank you so much for listening. Remember this surely, goodness and mercy to follow me all the days of my life. That's what David said. After he'd really messed up his life, after his son Epsilon's trying to kill him, but he knew this no matter how much I mess up, my father still loves me, and surely, goodness and mercy to follow me all the days of my life. Thank you for listening.