The Mezzanine Floor
The Mezzanine Floor is a podcast that creates a space for conversations concerning the christian life as we walk out living in the tension between heaven and earth.
Join our host, Pastor Malachi Maillot and his guests as they wrestle with how we ought to live with a heavenly mindset in an earthly body.
The Mezzanine Floor
Season 3 Ep 3 - Redeemed
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This week on the Mezzanine Floor, Jeff Turner-Hayes joins the crew to unpack KCC’s sermon series, Redeemed. Together, they explore what authentic faith really looks like, how to engage others with honesty and intention, and why true authenticity begins with our relationship with God.
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Well, welcome back to the Mezzanine Floor Podcast, where we talk about living in the tension between heaven and earth. Uh, thank you for tuning in to episode, I believe this is episode three. Episode three of our new revamp of our new style of doing our podcast. Uh, so thank you for tuning in to this episode. Follow us on uh Spotify, and I forgot what we're called. The Mezzanine Floor. We're gonna have to edit that. Uh follow us on YouTube, follow us on Spotify, uh, like the video, and also if you like the video, leave a comment. We would love to hear from you, even just feedback on what you think and what you learned. Um, each month we're gonna be taking time during these episodes to uh basically just go over the sermon series that we've been doing, um, and in a way to just dive a little bit deeper into those uh sermons, getting different perspectives, uh talking about different tensions, talking about different takeaways as just a way to get deeper into what we actually talked about. I think, I think I said this on the last podcast. It's really easy to sit on a Sunday uh in church and listen to the sermon and literally walk out the door and forget what was said. So this is just our way of helping you kind of just like dive a little bit deeper into that. Um, also, we understand too, some of the viewers might not be a part of our church, KCC. Um, so we invite you to uh as we listen to these clips, we invite you to even go to the YouTube, you can watch the sermons, or you can come to our church on a Sunday, which we would love to see you. And uh, we would love to meet you as well. And so, yeah, again, with me is some friends of the podcast. We have back again Pastor Brian, and we have someone for the very first time on our podcast. We have Jeffrey Turner Hayes, and I love saying his full name because it just everybody always does. It just sounds like this strong, I don't even know. Sounds official. Like a strong Texan Albertin. Albertin. He's Albertin. Basically, the Alberta same thing. Alberta is the Texas of Canada. So uh we also have our producer Logan York, and Logan is uh gonna be doing the switches of the cameras, making everything look all beautiful and fancy and nice. Uh, but he's also gonna be playing clips through the sermon series uh that we uh are gonna be just talking about and diving deep into. And so I just want to talk quickly about uh our sermon series last month, which was called Redeemed. And we had we had Easter uh this month, we had a busy month, we had Easter, we had baptisms, we had child dedications, yeah. Um, and we just kind of talked about the finished work on the cross and that idea of Jesus is first our savior, and then as Christians, we have to eventually move him to a place where he's our Lord and our King. Um, and the reason why we have to do that is that that's actually where our life begins to change and we actually start to have a formation in our life. And so um we're gonna get right into it. So, Logan, take it away.
SPEAKER_01We've all been at that point where we've opened up to someone, shared with someone who we really are, and experienced that anxiety and that fear, experience the rejection and the pain. And what's natural in those situations is that we pull back and we adjust and we protect ourselves and we build walls and put on a mask, and we don't ever show that part of ourselves again. To be fully known is too risky. It's just performance. You love me, but you don't know me. It's exhausting. People love you because of your title, your position, you're strong, and you're successful, you're in control, but deep down you know if they really knew what I struggle with, they wouldn't love me. So, what do we do? We filter ourselves, we post our highlight reel, we hide our true struggles, and we show people the version that we think that they'll love will hide the parts that we're afraid that they won't. Here's the truth: if you're not fully known, you can never feel fully loved. If you're fully known without love, you'll never feel safe. So deep down there's the question is there anyone who could see all of me and still choose to fully love me? The message of Jesus is not just that he loves you, it's that he knows you completely and loves you fully anyway.
SPEAKER_00And so I think one of the biggest struggles that we have, and it was highlighted by Pastor Brody in our culture, is uh authenticity. Um, I think, like as he was saying, there's so much of a front that we either put on or feel like we have to put on in order to be our best selves. It's like we always it's not even just like we have to put our best foot forward, but we have to cut our bad foot off, like completely. Like, like you can't show any weakness, can't show any flaws, anything like that. And I was thinking about this idea of authentic authenticity and like where where does that actually begin? And I I think, and this is where I kind of want to launch off from. I think in order to truly start being authentic with other people and having authentic relationships, um, we have to be authentic with ourselves, wherein like we have to know who we are, and specifically we have to know like who God is and who we are in relationship to Him. And from there, once we're authentic with God, we can actually start to be authentic with other people.
SPEAKER_06That's so good. I think that's a question I've wrestled with my whole life. And I think one thing that's such a solid foundation for me in that authenticity is knowing whose I am and who I am. Like in the beginning of my faith walk, and and as I mature, figuring that out, like okay, God, like who do I belong to? Like that's such a big purpose question and meaning and all these things. And and without that, we're so lost.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, right.
SPEAKER_06So like I I belong to someone, right? Who's I am, and then who I am, who does that person who I belong to or cast my value, who do they say I am? Yeah, and I have to live out of that place to even live authentically, yeah, to then bring authenticity to other people.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yeah, exactly. I remember when I was watching this clip, it reminded me of I mean, a very personal story, but I remember when me and Rebecca were um we were first dating, or it was like at the end of kind of like when I was um I was gonna be moving back to Kelowna and she was gonna be in Chilliwac. And it was kind of like the moment of our relationship was like either gonna be like we're either gonna continue this or and and have this kind of like long distance commitment, and we're gonna like date for marriage, and we're kind of making this decision at this point. And I remember my mentor uh during Bible school, he had talked me through um even just like but myself and I had a lot of a like a kind of a grubby past, um, that obviously I wasn't gonna like you know just dump on her the day I met her and be like, all right, you know, here's everything to know about me. Uh, do you want to date me? Right? Like it would have been a bad idea. So I was like, okay, there's a there's a point in your relationship that you're going to have to essentially give her your full story, and it's almost as if you're giving her a chance to walk away.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And I remember it was like a terrifying moment that I had to do this, but I remember sitting her down. It was like the day before she left to go back to Chilliwack, and I was gonna start work here, which was nine years ago, which is crazy. Um, yeah, just about 10 years now. And I remember just like I just gave her pretty much my entire background of my life, and I said, All right, that's me. Take care. Like, this is basically your opportunity to basically say, I don't want to date you anymore, and I don't want to move forward with this relationship. Or like, I'm gonna like this is this is we're going for it. Like, we're gonna go uh for like I want to continue on with this. And I remember that was like the foundation of our relationship. Um, and obviously, like you're still gonna go through stuff and it's not gonna be perfect, but um, it just reminded me of like the mirror image of what marriage should be, and and obviously, like our marriage to God is like that same thing, but it's the the nice thing is like he already knows everything about us. Like we don't need to sit down and be like, all right, God, like you know, back in high school, you know, May 19th, like we don't have to we don't have to go through and recount, but but it's but it is a simplicity of like God fully knows us, and he he it's like that verse, the famous verse in the Bible where while we were still sinners, Christ died for us, um, like knowing all the garbage, knowing all the stupid things we've done, knowing all the the times we've rejected him, knowing all the times that we've um like hurt him and grieved him, right? Uh he still would be willing to commit to us, which is just a it's exactly the picture of what marriage should be. And I think, again, you know, quick marriage tip. I think a lot of marriages fail because they don't start with that or they don't have that in their foundation because you have two people that think they know each other, then all of a sudden, you know, 15 years down the road, it's like this explosion, like a time bomb happens because you know, there's betrayal or there's any number of things that can happen. But I think it's just to the the ideal part of what marriage should be is like you've I I completely know Rebecca and she completely knows me, and we still are willing to work through the crap. And I think that's the same uh picture with God, and that's really the the the crux of how it should be for our relationship with God.
SPEAKER_02There's an understanding that comes from even what you had said is said, I know whose I am. If you can land in that spot with your spouse, but also with God, that scripture that says he knew he died for us while we were still sinners, while we were like we all of that, like we we were far from him, and he called us like he called us his own. But if you can reconcile that, that he died for me while I was still sinner, and I know now whose I am, there is such a different level of peace and understanding that comes in your relationship with God, and it's very similar to the relationship you have with my wife or that I have with my wife. Is that I know her and she knows me. She knows me at my worst. She's seen me at my worst at my ugliest every day, every day. Yeah, she's gonna wake up next to her and it's just that face like the chipmunk, like whatever's going on. But she knows the inner parts of me, the parts where I struggled, the and even in in being married for we've been almost for almost 25 years, is that in that 25 years, there's been times that 20 years where she learned something new about me. Yeah, or yeah, I got squeezed in a way that I hadn't been squeezed, like pressure-wise, stress comes on, and out of me came something different than she's used to, or a response. And she's like, Well, I know him and all of these other things, but because there's history and I know who I am in Christ and she knows who she is in Christ and how our relationship with God is separately, that when we come together, there's this understanding of, oh, we'll be able to work through these things. There's so much more pressure when you don't have a good relationship with God. Yeah, it it's it's like I can look back to the difference, even as a Christian for so long. I could look back to when my relationship with God was unhealthy, when it wasn't close. And it's not like it's perfect now, but even then you're still having to work through stuff. Yeah, but I can say, man, that what that was before is so different than it is now because I know whose I am. I'm a conqueror, I'm a co-heir with Christ. I'm like all you can go through the list of things that I can say to myself about who God says that I am.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, and it's funny because it's us that needs that understanding. Yeah, it's not God. No, right? Like God is faithful and perfect on the other side, and like He doesn't treat us any different, knowing our vulnerabilities, knowing our mess-ups, knowing we're gonna mess up again. Yeah, yeah, right? It's that vulnerability of us coming to Him and us changing our mindset. Yeah, like I think of even the first time that like we screwed up in the world with Adam and Eve, and and when sin entered, and when we became those enemies of God, God didn't change his action in that moment. Right? It said that he came walking through the garden in the cool of the day, looking for them, looking for them, like he had always done. But it was man who hid in that moment. It wasn't God that hid and withdrew himself. Yeah, so it's always our own understanding that needs to change on that relationship basis and that vulnerability basis.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's an interesting thing too, because I leave in what you said, if God knows everything and we screw up, we try and hide, but he already saw it. Yeah, right. And it's funny how our own shame and our own guilt and our own issues will actually prevent us from getting on our knees before the God that already saw everything that forgave us the last time, it's gonna forgive us this time, but our shame just puts us in a spot where we're like, I don't want him to know, even though mentally I'm like, nah, he knows already.
SPEAKER_06Like it's no different than being parents right now. Like I have a six-year-old and a four-year-old, and they'll both run and hide when they know they've done something. Yeah, right. When I've already called them out on it. Yeah, it's like, no, don't run and hide, like, run to me. Yeah, come to them. Even like as a parent, like I'm trying to teach them when I make mistakes, I come to them.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_06And I'm like, hey, forgive dad for for speaking to you this way, or that I got frustrated with you and didn't have patience, hoping to teach them not to run, but to run to me in a mistake. And that's a lesson that I'm trying to learn my whole life is to run to God when I make a mistake, not not hide, not hide.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Well, it's even interesting too, like you're talking about how man hid, but like God's approach was like a question, not like how like how dare you mean it. Yeah, you like, why did you do what I said? The one thing, like the one tree in the garden I told you not to eat from. Like, why did you idiot? Like, he didn't come in, he just said, like, where are you? And and it's God, he knows where they are. It's really and I but like he he approaches man on a level of like humility in that sense. It's just insane to me to to look at that scripture. I remember preaching on it one time, but like that that approach that God comes with is such it's like mercy and grace right away. Yeah, it's like, hey, where are you guys? Like, and it and it could have been uh you know, like, hey, like I I know what's going on. Like you, I want you to to just be front with me, like be up front with me, be open with me. I'm not here to like well and obviously there's there's punishment for sin, but there was it was like he was still there was still mercy in that approach, which is so interesting.
SPEAKER_06Even the punishment itself was mercy, yeah. Like when we look at it, he removed them from the garden so that they wouldn't eat from the tree of life and then live for forever. And like God removed them from the garden, and then the punishment was mercy so that he could restore us back to it.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, that's right.
SPEAKER_06Right. So even in that punishment, it was for our own good.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Everything is always driven towards God wanting to restore relationship with us. And just even as you're saying, like that I the I've gone to my parents or my kids come to me. Well, these my kids will come to me. I know they've done something stupid. I know that I have to have a really tough conversation with with my son. He's like 14 or 15. I know it's gonna be a rough one. I'm not even gonna like this, but I have to lay some discipline down. But I know what he's done, and then he comes to me and he finally says, Okay, dad, I did this. And I just have this picture of of God saying to me, I know. And but the I know is filled with like when I when I have to say I know to my own son, I'm like, I I know, I love you, I care for you, but this is what we have to do next. I just feel that, and I'm wanting to restore health in him so that what he did he knows is wrong and he wouldn't do that again, but also that this relationship between me and him isn't severed because of my own bad behavior or how I responded to the frustration. But when you have that understanding of who God is, I can respond to my son differently. But that I I know is filled with so much love, so much compassion, so much mercy, and he's drawing me in to restore me to a better relationship with him. Yeah, yeah. That's a beautiful picture. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I think one of the questions that I had that um from what you said, Malachi earlier, um you were talking about that that point where you were open and authentic with Rebecca about the life you had before you guys met. Um and I guess I want to open this question up to all of you guys because I mean you guys are all married and so you've experienced this. But um what how do I say this? Um like where does that moment where where did that moment of authenticity come in for you and your relationships? Because as you said, Malachi, it's like you don't want to just like you meet someone, you're like, this was my life, and I'm blah blah blah. Yeah, I did all these things. Yeah, that's how you scare people. You scare people with stuff, yeah, yeah. But uh there's a point where you do have to have that conversation, yeah. And uh not even like you're telling on yourself, but it's just like you know what, this is where I was, this is who I was, but this is who I am now, who this is who I'm trying to be. Um, what is that what did that look like for you guys? Or what where do you think that that comes in when you're trying to engage or have a relationship with someone to that level? Because when we engage with God, it's different in the sense of like as we were saying, he already knows everything we're doing. So we're really repenting and admitting to ourselves who we are. But when we're putting ourselves out there for another person, we're admitting, but we're also saying, like, is this too much? Do you want do you want to?
SPEAKER_04But I think even in that too, you can be dishonest with God too. Like, you can be like, you can like, even though God knows everything about you, you can still be dishonest with him in the way that you give your heart. Because I think it's the same way as like I I I'm gonna give up this part of me, but I'm not gonna deal with this other part that's like, I know that this is hindering my life and hindering my walk with God, but I I'm not willing to give it up. And I think that's the same situation with a relationship with somebody, and obviously you don't just do this with anybody, I don't think. And I think again, like there is a point in in relationship context, I think there's a point of like are we like it's it's commitment, right? Like it's are we taking that next step of of committing? Like we're we're talking about wedding, we're talking about engagement, we're talking about forever, or you know, you know, we've kind of like guarded this relationship up to this point so that it doesn't go into these other areas, right? Like, and and that's another guardrail as like not just like boundaries with physical, but like emotional boundaries, right? And emotional boundaries will come down, I think, way before physical boundaries should, um, for just like practical reasons. I think again, like you're not just gonna meet somebody and just tell them everything about yourself because you have no idea how they're gonna handle it. And I think it just you have to, it's a discerning moment to some degree, but it's also just having wisdom and knowing where that relationship is at. Yeah. Like I think people overshare all the time. I think in the digital age that we live in, you have people oversharing over text, you have people oversharing their life with people that they shouldn't be, um, and they get burned for it. And I think that's again coming back to Pastor Brody's message. Like we we get scared, or we get burnt once, or we get like have that bad relationship or whatever that is. And I think we we are really careful then we almost we almost like hide those areas of our lives, but we have to be we have to be discerning about where that relationship is, and you're not just telling everybody everything about your life. No, there has to be a huge trust, like a huge bridge of trust that you've built with that person.
SPEAKER_02But I don't know if that answers that question, but and also now I've been married for a long time. Even coming back to the thing that I said earlier, there is um times in your life that especially if you're especially if you figure out who you are and you're submitted to Christ, there's been traumas in my life that I I have had to heal from as a grown man. Like, say regarding my dad. My dad left a wound in my life when I was young that literally persisted into my mid-40s, like I'm 40 something now, 47. And I had a a moment three years ago where like it was a something that just happened with my dad years ago that somehow affected my communication with my kids and my wife. And I was like, what is happening? And so in those moments, it's another layer that God peeled back. Yeah, my wife and I had to walk through it. I and I healed from that moment, but that was something that 25 years ago, when I first dated her, I wouldn't have ever thought that as a 45-year-old or 44-year-old man, I'm gonna have to deal with this issue. Yeah, but then yeah, it's another layer where I have to share more of my heart that I didn't actually even really realize I was having to struggle with.
SPEAKER_04It's not like a one and done.
SPEAKER_02No, it's never a one and done. It's a constant, yeah.
SPEAKER_06And I think like looking at that, that vulnerability piece to even realize that hey, I responded this way, why? Yeah, right. And then like having the the gumption or the courage to to look back and why is this happening?
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_06And I think like very similar. I come from a very broken home. Like my wife and I both super, super broken. One of the things that attracted me to her. originally was we were both so I'll say hell bent or heaven bent, however you want to word it, that we weren't gonna let our kids live out the trauma that we live. Yeah, us too. That's good. And so I always think back to the quote like if you don't heal what hurts you, you'll bleed on people who never cut you. Yeah. That's really good. Right. So then as a parent, as a father, if I'm not healing what's going on in my life, man, I'm just passing that down onto my kids and probably exponentially.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_06Right. So it's it's my responsibility to be vulnerable, to deal with those things, to go to God, to go to my wife, to go to my kids and ask for forgiveness and and walk that out and actually heal that out so that I don't pass it on.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And the reality is is that no matter what, as a dad, I'm gonna leave wounds in my kids that I didn't know were there, but I'm not gonna do the same ones that my parents did. I'm gonna make my own. Yeah.
SPEAKER_06Right. And then hopefully have the the wisdom to ask for forgiveness for 100% kids for those wounds. Yeah man I've I think that's been like the biggest thing too that God has spoken to me about a parent is that like if I want my kids to run to me and their mistakes I need to be open with my mistakes. And I'm not saying like I I sit down with my six and four year old and I'm like here's my laundry list of all these things but like hey when I get frustrated with you and I yell at you I need to come and make that right and I need to say hey my actions like dad's actions there were wrong and I'm I'm sorry and I need your forgiveness.
SPEAKER_02And that gets harder the older they get and they start thinking clearly wait yeah actually Jeff it's the easiest thing in the whole world we'll never struggle again.
SPEAKER_04And all I have to deal with right now is my kid not eating crayons so I feel like uh I have the easiest stage right now.
SPEAKER_00Yeah Logan too I'm sure oh yeah yeah just make sure they don't climb on stuff or eat sharpies. Um yeah I really love that that's a beautiful conversation and like encapsulate it all it's like being authentic is being willing to engage in relationship and willing to grow. It's not just a savior moment with Jesus where it's just like okay you saved me and now we're cool. It's god God is wanting to grow in relationship with you. He's wanting to heal you um these people relationships that we pursue here on earth was with a significant other is it's growth. It's continual it's it's seasonal it's not it's not just a one and done thing there's work that needs to be put into it that's beautiful in your lifetime to pull yourself up from your bootstraps you physically can't do it.
SPEAKER_02You can't grab your boots and then pull yourself up you don't have the power to clean yourself up. You don't have the ability to climb yourself up towards God not just because you're spiritually tired or you're having an off season or having a bad day you're just not able to do it. You can't pull yourself up to Jesus. You can hustle how many of you in the room are hustlers just love to hustle gonna work hard I'm gonna put in more we're gonna work hard we're gonna do this and that's me. I'm a grinder. I'm able to grind it out even if it's going poorly I'll grind it out. But the thing with being powerless Paul wrote to another church and said this he said you're dead in your trespasses and sin. So not only can you not pull yourself up, you're dead in your trespasses and sin. And I don't mean like you're you're dead you're not sick you're not just limping with a limp across the thing you're dead in your trespasses and sins. Some people talk about salvation like Jesus came to help them finish what they started that they're halfway up the mountain Jesus is going to come alongside them hand them a granola bar give them a good encouragement and then we're gonna go Jesus didn't come to coach the dead he came to raise us from the dead while we're still powerless Christ died for the ungodly mic drop on that line Ebrian which one didn't come to coach the dead but come to raise the dead yeah that was a that was a good one that was my once per year get a quotable line so I was watching this clip yesterday and uh I had this verse come to my head and this is kind of where I want to launch our question from but um I was thinking about that verse in James I was talking about m to Malachi about this earlier but um it's that that quote that faith without works is dead and I think when we come into a context of a clip like this I think there's two different groups of people that there tends to be where it's like there are people who lean more on the side of faith where it's like it is that savior moment where it's like okay God save me this is awesome.
SPEAKER_00Now I can live my life how I want to and that's where we see a lot of our modern Western world culture. And then there's I feel like the other side of it where people are like overly legalistic and fire and brimstone and it's like you gotta you gotta pull yourself up by your rootstraps. You gotta do all this stuff in order blah blah blah blah when it's really like um as James is saying like it's a both and kind of thing where we're in tandem we have faith and we believe in grace and we hold on to that but there's also responsibility that we have and so um do you guys want to just talk about that for a moment that tension and how to live in that tension here's here's here's a the it's interesting because the the clip does not give full context to the rest of the message obviously give us some context the the really the where we were going with the context or was wanted to go with the context was what happens before we were saved like who we were what God did for us even what we were talking about before the podcast is that we were dead in our sin.
SPEAKER_02We were sinners God died on the cross for us while we were still sinners the whole idea of not being able to pull yourself out by your bootstraps is that you give your life to Jesus and you immediately submit to him when you give you confess with your mouth that Jesus Christ is Lord you repent you be baptized all you've done in those moments is submit to Christ that's nothing and all of that comes back from Christ to us is something that he offers repentance when we offer it to him he just he forgives us and so the context is is that no we can't actually God we're saved through faith what we do is I can't change my sin Christ can I can't change my behavior but Christ can give me the strength to change the behavior and my submission to him is where he gives me the Holy Spirit he shows me what to do. My effort is I'm submitting to him is the context where I even where I go on my own heart I'm like Lord I've tried so many things on my own strength strength where I'm going this way and the Holy Spirit is directly beside me instead of with me. Instead I'm just doing it in parallel with God. He's beside me I'm I'm Jesus adjacent I am not I'm not I'm not he's not in the center of my life and me pulling myself up I've noticed in my own life that the more I submit the more successful I am in the things that he's called me to do. The more strength I have the more wisdom the more direction but I still have to be taking up my cross and following him every single day. And that's where the the act of of faith comes in and I actually have to pursue him and that in itself sometimes is a real grind to just take up my cross every day and you have that place between faith and action. It's not just faith it's not just action it's both of them combined that lead me to this healthy whole restored relationship with God if that makes sense.
SPEAKER_06Yeah I think our role isn't to fix the mess. Nope our role is to be obedient our role is to submit our role is to come into alignment. Yeah right and just take that next step. What is it God that you're you're calling me to do because I in and of myself I can't fix any problem let alone all of my problems at once right and God I find at least in my life highlights the one thing in this season that we're gonna work on that's gonna have the greatest amount of fruit moving forward and and when we get through that there'll be another one thing of course but our response is always that submission and alignment piece. And it's that juxtaposition juxtaposition between like faith and works. Yep. Right. And the whole purpose of like hey God can I keep all the rules no and it was designed that way so that I would be dependent on Jesus absolutely right like the Ten Commandments were written so that we would never be able to fulfill them to bring us to the end of ourselves to make us realize our dependence and reliance on Jesus that if I'm even going to fulfill a portion of this I need you God. Yeah right like I I can't do this on my own.
SPEAKER_04Yeah I think it's like it's tough because like discipline like discipline in our life it requires us to like do something about it right we can't just be like yeah I'm disciplined and just sit and not do anything and just be like oh yeah grace is here to like fix me so fix me God like we have to it's like you're working in tandem and it's this weird tension that I think people just don't like because I think people like just like clear cut kind of like I'm on this side like oh grace through faith like are saved by grace through faith and like I you know I don't do anything to to receive this which is true but also like you have the other camp of like you know you have to like you have to put in effort you have to put in work you have to you actually have to like get out of bed you have to make your bed you have to make the food you have to eat the food like there's things that we have to do and I think there people I don't know why there's such a hard place of coming into the middle of that where it's like the tension between the two it's like and that's where we I think we were talking about like can you like lose your salvation and we had a conversation about this a while on the podcast it was like um like you you can't necessarily like lose your salvation but you can in a sense like do the opposite where you're walking away from God like it's almost like a like a you are directly in like a full knowing that you're you're a deliberate opposition. Like you're you're against God. You're you're physically going and mentally spiritually going and rejecting Christ um and you're it's a very like forceful position to be in like you have to actually like there's action steps to to be to be had there and I think the same thing with you know uh I think in 2 Peter it was talking about um all these like things like these virtue like uh like uh stay in virtue with faith and knowledge and and love and stay in brotherly affection and and um like keep unity between each other and he was talking about if you actually practice these things you're not gonna stumble like he was talking about these like these these these traits of a Christian if you you practice these things if you actually do these things and it's not that Jesus is gonna come and you know you're like a puppet like he's gonna like the Holy Spirit's gonna come and start moving your arms for you like that doesn't happen. That doesn't work that way like we actually have to to walk with God and and follow him and that's where I think it's important where we started with you were talking about like Jesus is first my savior but then it actually needs to be a place where I'm submitting to him to become my Lord my Lord and my king and my life will actually begin to change because I'm actually doing things right out of out of faith. And it and it works in tandem it's not one or the other and it can't be one or the other because we get either we get sloppy grace or we get religious religious like there's not emptiness.
SPEAKER_02Yeah right so could could a way if I ask the question I'm gonna ask it like this if uh to exactly what you're saying the way that we bridge faith and works kind of in the middle is the why we're doing what we're doing. 100% could it be that like you've actually nailed it on the head and we get to the why we discipline ourselves to read our word why we serve him the way we do why if we understand the why of what I'm doing is to give glory to God could that be and I'm asking the question I want to it could that be the differentiation between I'm doing this for religiosity's sake or I'm doing this for only faith's sake but the why is what separates me from someone who is just acting or just doing it by faith. Does that make sense?
SPEAKER_06Yeah yeah totally I think couldn't be the why then like bring it back we've used this example a few times marriage right like what is the intent what is the why behind the action that I'm doing yeah right like am I doing this to gain approval to hopefully gain love right or am I doing this out of love to serve right yeah right and like it can be the exact same action but a different heart intent and like I know from this I go into the other a woman will see right through it. And we we might be a little bit dull and we're like oh that was a really nice thing you did. But like women will see right through the intention right no matter what it is and it's like hey are you doing this because you truly love me and you're servering me or is there an end game to get some sort of approval or something out of me. Yeah right right and it's that heart intent and I think like intent is the perfect word. I think intent is what marries those two of faith and works.
SPEAKER_02And that's why it's such a knife's edge that we're where you can lean so far in hey I'm gonna work really hard this way and end up just being religious like you said. Or you go so far the other and you're working really hard or you go so far the other way and you're not doing anything and just expecting it to be handed to you. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. And I don't think you'll ever be perfect in that too like I think you're going to and I I think that's why repentance exists because we'll constantly be saying God I'm sorry. It's like that song I'm sorry for the way I've made it like I'm coming back to the heart of worship of why I'm actually like asking myself like why am I worshiping not just like oh I'm worshiping because I was always brought up in church or like I'm worshiping because the song is awesome and I love it or I'm worshiping because you know the electric guitar player is like is a sick electric guitar player and I'm vibing with the music. Like no I'm I'm worshiping because I'm actually like in love with Jesus. Like I my affection is towards him and that's my why the over right and it's like obedience obedience for obedience sake isn't enough. It's like do I like I'm gonna love God and I'm and and through my love I'm gonna obey him like the way I'm gonna show my love towards God is my obedience. So it says in Matthew if you love me you'll follow my commands. Exactly right like you you show your love and it's not an obedience of like I'm just avoiding hell like and I think a lot of people can get into that camp where it's just like I'm just trying to be a good person. I'm just trying to be you know morally okay and I'm and I just so that I don't you know get to the end of my life and I get judged this way or or you know my d my destination isn't what I wanted like I'm just gonna avoid hell. So I'm gonna do these good you know quote unquote things or I'm gonna have this good life but it's like it's so much more than that. And I think that a motivation of love like same thing in marriage like if I'm just doing the dishes because you know I don't want my wife to be ticked at me or you know she's she's mad at me so I'm gonna do the dishes and then she'll be happy with me. No like I'm gonna I'm going to do the dishes without her even talking to me or asking me and I'm gonna go above and beyond that. I'm gonna wipe the counters because I know her and I know that she likes it this way and she doesn't have to ask me because you know I actually want to do this for her and I want to take the load off of her and I and the motivation is so much more pure and it's so much different. And and exactly women will see right through that and they'll and they'll see that and they'll actually like draw close to you. Yeah like your wife will draw closer to you if it's the motivation is not you know I'm just gonna get her off my back you know because she's ticked or you know I didn't do this properly last time and I'm gonna make sure that you know she never asks me again. But it's like it's like okay I know I know my wife enough that she likes this and so I'm gonna I'm gonna make this space beautiful and I'm not gonna say anything about it. I'm not gonna I'm not gonna demand anything for this. My gold star please and be like well tomorrow you know you're doing the dishes no no like I'm gonna I'm gonna continue to just I I want to serve my wife I want to serve her in a way that that actually shows like I actually do care. Like I truly care about you and I'm not trying to get anything from you. And I think that's that's a beautiful picture like marriage is that reflection of our relationship with God is like I'm going to like I know what God wants. It's it it you know you know the Bible tells me what God wants and his preference and and how he wants things done and how I should worship him and how I should live my life. Like he's he's told me this and I and I want to follow as closely as I can to that absolutely because not because I'm scared of hell not because I'm scared of you know judgment I I think I think that's a part of our life but that's not the focus. Like the focus of our life is not just avoiding hell but it's glorifying God. Amen yeah I agree that's well said so good.
SPEAKER_00Yeah I love the way you're describing that because even in those um even in those acts where you're doing things for your wife um or whether it's your wife or whether it's God or whether it's other people uh sometimes a lot of times it's an act of choice that you have to make even if it's like your your body your flesh doesn't want to you don't want to you'd rather do the thing that makes you comfortable and so it's interesting because even in those acts it really starts to weed out your own selfish intent and your own selfish desires or your bad habits and it's forcing you uh to choose something that's greater than yourself. I really like that. That's good.
SPEAKER_02And I'll say just to and to end with that too is that the your heart of service for God for people carries you into places where um struggle will happen but that love that you have for each other and the heart of service that you have towards someone else will bring you into a place that when there is struggle you remember back to oh I remember like Rebecca will say to Malachi I remember Malachi's heart here. Right. Or even in like in relationships like I appreciate it when Malachi says hey great job on this. And I also appreciate it because we've spent 10 years working together that he's like hey I got some feedback for your sermon like hey this is something that maybe you missed or you didn't think about it or this was too much. But I remember the fact that I'm we're serving each other in this or I'm serving my wife or and they give me something and that service holds you when what you're getting isn't what you want. The feedback you're getting is different or the response is different but that service you have for God so when he disciplines you you remember oh he blessed me over here and I remember the blessing because I serve him because I love him but he had to correct me and I remember the good as well as the bad.
SPEAKER_01Yeah how does the kingdom advance in your life the world sees the kingdom advancing through power position politics but Jesus's lens was different. He saw a different shift he says I'm gonna change lives and those lives are going to change individually personally people are going to change and it's gonna be the church that's gonna bring the kingdom of God to the world.
SPEAKER_02You know what's interesting is um we had baptisms in Family Sunday this last week and we've been running in uh church for the last like 18 months this foundations course foundations 101 201 and we have when you go to 201 you have to do homilies and so we had people just doing a five minute testimony and we heard this exact thing from people that they came to church they gave life to Jesus they went to foundations on one of the nights went home gave their life to Jesus but the moment they started committing their life to they committed their life to Christ the world around them began to shift that they were inviting people into church they were shifting the atmosphere of their own lives they were like they've invited people those people are getting saved now family members that were against God are starting to like come to church are like I'm just starting to see this and he's not wrong that the individual gives their life to Christ and the kingdom of God shifts because it's the church that goes out makes the difference and the kingdom of God shining from them actually starts to change the orbit all around where where we can't actually make we can't we can't affect all of those areas but those people make that of those areas and just show them who Christ is and that's where the kingdom of God begins to advance.
SPEAKER_06Yeah sorry just jumped in there people can't deny change. No like if you're one way and something happens and you come back and your life starts to change people notice. And they're like what's going on and then kind of the emptiness or the curiosity whatever it is within them needs to know how.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_06Because we all struggle with how do I change this there's all there's things we all want to change about ourselves and we fail at it miserably going through life. So then when we see somebody change like how did that happen? Yeah right I think of like Luke 17 it talks about like the kingdom of God is within you. Yeah right so when you find Jesus like you carry it with you wherever you you go like you have your own sphere you have your own metron and that's I think what Pastor Brody was talking about like the kingdom of God isn't just this thing that shows up and we build it and people like brick on brick. Yeah brick on brick it's like hey the kingdom of God is established in an individual yeah and that individual goes out and they bring the kingdom with them whether they realize it or not and they change people. Like personal story I remember like broken family as I alluded to earlier I had a cousin that drank himself to death at like 35 through alcoholism. All of this stuff and he wasn't my cousin he was my brother right like that's literally how we describe each other he lived with us for a long time all of this kind of stuff but when we were at the hospital the morning he died I was the one most put together but him and I were the closest and one of my cousins And like I won't name names or or anything like that. But they watched that happen. And they watched that, hey, there was a piece in you when we were all breaking and figured you would be the most broken in this moment, but you weren't. Why is that? And I was just like, hey, it it it's one or two things. I I know where he is now. Yeah, he struggled with these things, but he loved Jesus. Yeah. And number two, so do I. Right. And that's where that strength and that peace comes from. But that's advancing the kingdom. Yeah. Right. Like we think it's this big complicated thing, but really it's just living life. And it's going back to that authenticity piece that Logan mentioned earlier is if I'm authentically living out my faith and walking with God, people notice that difference. And that's how the kingdom's advanced. Right.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, that's good. That's like one of the when I was watching this clip, the one thing I thought about was I think so often, like even just in his sermon, which is probably one of the best sermons I've heard from Pastor Bruno. So encourage you to go watch that if you're listening now. Um but he was talking about how oft like often the world's the world's kingdom advances by like platform, power, politics, um, power specifically. Um and I think I think so often like in our faith and in especially in church, I think a lot of people who you know you sit in church and you see the pastor on stage and you I remember thinking about this when I was younger, as like, oh, I just gotta get to that place to be able to like influence. I remember those two. Like I I I just need to be on stage in order to like, okay, that's where real Christianity, you know, is and that's where like where influence lives. Yeah, that's where the kingdom of God advances, and like we need to grow the church, and we need to um, you know, we have to have the biggest youth group, we have to have the best, whatever, and that's where the like the kingdom advances, and sure like parts of those things are still true and great, and like having a a good youth group and a healthy church, or it those are very, very much important things, but it's like it doesn't it doesn't stop you as like someone who's not on stage uh from advancing the kingdom, just as like you're saying that happens personally, and that's really what Jesus' mo was. Like obviously, obviously, he taught and he taught to the crowds, and those were impactful moments, and they were they were recorded for a reason. Those sermons were recorded for a reason, and and he believed in public ministry, and he would go and he would heal people, and he would go and he would perform miracles, and there would be this like through 5,000 people, he feeds them with a little little kid's lunch. Like we see those big, huge, ambitious moments, but then you see moments um after you know Peter denies Jesus three times, and um he sees his best friend crucified on a cross. And afterwards, in it's in John 21, you know, Peter he's depressed and he goes back fishing, like he goes back to what he was doing, and and Jesus shows up and just makes these guys breakfast. And he comes to Peter specifically and he like personally restores him. Like, and I think that I think it's there there's there's there's merit in both, and I think yeah, and I'm not discrediting uh like the the pulpit, the pulpit is is important, and pastors and preachers are important, but they're not more important than the people in the congregation. Yeah, like that's good. It's it's not this like hierarchy, right? There's there's different callings in people's lives, and and and I think there's also multiple callings on someone's life. And just because you're not called to like vocational ministry, like you're still called to be a friend. You're still called to be, you know, if you have kids, you're called to be a father. If you're if you have a wife, you're called to be a husband, if you're single, you're called to be a good friend. Um, and we're all called in these different ways, and God uses us where we're at, right? Like he doesn't like if you're a plumber, like you can advance the kingdom of God. And and if you're a teacher, uh, you could probably do it more effectively than I can. Yeah, right, like because you're with the kids every single day, you're with that same class every single day, and they're watching you every single day for like hours upon hours every single day. And you have so much opportunity to advance the kingdom um strategically through the way that you teach. If you're like you name it, whatever, whatever your occupation is, you have so much influence in whatever that circle is that God's given you, whether it's five people or it's hundreds of people. And I think I think the most effective circles are small because you have the ability to be super personal with those circles. For sure.
SPEAKER_02Well, and it's even what we say at church all the time, too, is that we're big church, little church. And I always say this are the 167 hours from one service to the next is where one Sunday to the next is where relationships, the kingdom of God is advanced. It's from Sunday after church till Sunday the next, all that's time in between. Yeah, because the what really matters is the fact that we as the body of Christ, which is the individuals, are the ones that are actually doing exactly what you're saying, is we're going out and we're making a difference in our little sphere of influence. That's where the kingdom of God grows. Our job on Sundays when we preach is literally probably three percent of our actual job as pastors. Maybe yes, it's it may be even less than that.
SPEAKER_04And that and but that should be it should be less. I think it's been made to be this, yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, we think it's the pinnacle of influence on stage, and like I'm sure all four of us you alluded to it earlier, thought that that was the pinnacle. Like, hey, once I get the microphone, once I can speak all these things, that's when my real influence will happen. Well, and it's so far the opposite because the reality is you're probably in a room full of people, and 99% of them agree with what you're saying. Yeah, like yeah, you're influenced them for sure, but like the majority of people sitting in those seats know Jesus. Yeah, right. And the greatest influence is when we go out into the world, yeah, and we bring Jesus, we bring that kingdom. I think of the quote, like to a lot of people, you're the only Jesus they'll ever see. Yeah, right. Like you're their first introduction to Jesus. That doesn't happen on a Sunday morning. Like, I know there's people in our church that we would all say, This was the last person that I ever would have thought would have stepped in the foot of a church. Yeah, right. But they're here. And they're not here because of an amazing fancy mesh message, they're not here because of influence from the pulpit or a great worship set or any of those things. They're here because there was an individual that brought them Jesus. All of you church people. Whether they call them Jesus or not, but they brought love, yeah, they brought grace, they brought mercy, they brought stability, they brought all these things that sits in us that the kingdom is, yeah, right. Like the kingdom of God is love, joy, peace, like these things. Right. Absolutely. And we're we're called to bring that out there. And that's when people first encounter Jesus. I even think of it from like a team perspective at church, right? Like um amazing mentor and pastor that I had uh before we moved into Calgary, he said, Man, if I didn't speak, I want to be on the parking lot team. And I was like, that's the weirdest thing for a pastor to ever say. And we were driving, like we had, I think like a 12-hour drive back home from a conference. And I was like, unpack that for a little bit for me. He's just like, I get to be the first representation to that person. He's like, if there's a new person and I'm on the parking lot team, I get to set the stage for how that person's going to experience Jesus that morning. Wow. Right? It's it's not it's not the message, it's the guy holding the mini lightsaber, smiling. That's like, hey, come here, we're so glad you're here this morning. We've got a spot for you over there. I hope you have an amazing morning.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. What a perspective to have too, because I feel like a lot of people you'd hear something like that, and their answer would probably be something else, like, oh, I thought it. I just point and people go, I don't actually have to talk to anyone, but like, wow, what a what a but like we walk through life not seeing friendly faces.
SPEAKER_06Yeah. Right? Like we could all go walk down the street, yeah, and probably not get a smile.
SPEAKER_02Even look at you because they're in their phone.
SPEAKER_06Whatever, right? Everybody's looking down. Yeah, that like one moment of engagement, whether the window is rolled down or not, that's a smile that's welcoming that says, Hey, you're here and you belong, and we're we're happy to have you. Man, I've heard stories that people get saved because of that guy, yeah, and the message was crap that Sunday, kind of thing, right?
SPEAKER_02Like well, and if you think if you think of it like this, we uh like even for Baptism Sunday, we had a like someone in our church, um, a father and a daughter give their life to Jesus and they just got baptized. Amazing story. All they did was uh back to even that the like the responsibility of the church, people in the church is to share the gospel and be Jesus to people. What we're saying. They came and happened to be on that Sunday that me or Pastor Malikare, Pastor Brody, gave a salvation call that gave your life to Jesus. What we don't see is all the work that another family that we know in the church spent time with this family, shared the gospel, loved on them, cared for them, and had known them for a long time. So the seed. And so would the seed and invited them to church. And in that 90 minutes on a Sunday, the last four minutes where we say, Hey, do you want to be give your life to Jesus because you just feel the Holy Spirit doing something? That's where they give their life to Jesus. We can't discount all the work that other people did for that one little moment. It's the church, the people in the church that will have all that will have more influence than us pastors. Yeah. They have more influence, they have more area that they're gonna reach out to people. Our job is to share the gospel, to equip people to go out and do exactly what we're saying. You're gonna go out and you're gonna share the gospel. That's our responsibility. It's just to make sure they're equipped to go share the gospel with people. And then the best, but one of the best things about being a pastor is we get to celebrate with people that give their life to Jesus on a Sunday, they get baptized, that do baby dedications. That is like so much fun for us pastors to be able to do that. And the best job on Sundays, in my opinion, isn't the one isn't preaching. I love preaching, I love standing out front and just shaking hands and learning people's names so I can forget them by the next week. Right? I love doing that. That's my favorite thing.
SPEAKER_04I also think too, like not discounting one person. Absolutely. I think a lot of people it's like an overwhelming thought when you like you hear a message like Pastor Brody's message on a Sunday. Sometimes you can get overwhelmed of like, well, I'm not doing anything right now. How am I gonna like how am I gonna get you know, out and do this? Like, how am I gonna share the god? Like, you want me to share the god? Like, how am I supposed to share the or share my testimony? How am I supposed to share my testimony? But it's like literally just pick one person. Use words if necessary. Like, yeah, exactly. That's right. Start just meeting with one person or start like if it's a person at work or if it's a person that you know maybe is like a friend that doesn't know God, um, like just start inviting them over to your house or like just start eating meals with them, start asking questions, start showing up in their life. Um, it doesn't have to be like, you know, you have to go and get a theology degree and just start to just like to help them know what the Trinity is. Like that's yeah, that's important. Like we're supposed to, like it, it it the Bible and and it calls us to be equipped. Like we're we're supposed to study and show ourselves approved. And I heard I heard one pastor say, like, we should all be little theologians, like we should all be striving towards like understanding why we believe certain things and why we believe what we believe. We should know uh why, like why I believe and why I'm saved. I should know my testimony. Um, but you don't have to start there. Like it doesn't start there. It literally just starts like, hey, like I got saved last Sunday and now I'm gonna like, I'm gonna go share this joy with somebody. Yeah. And it doesn't even need to like, you don't even need to use the name Jesus in that conversation, yeah, unless they ask, right? And that's the that's the beauty of it, is like you can just get really good at like asking them questions until they want to get intrigued enough and like, hey, like it's like you're saying, like, uh, like they notice some change in you, or someone's gonna notice change in you, and they might ask questions, and then you get to actually share, oh yeah, well, like this is what happened to me. I was like this, and now my life is like that. That's literally a testimony. Yeah. Um, we were teaching our student leadership how to write their testimonies, and uh that's okay. And how your daughter came up to me and she's like, she's like, I'm not sure about this. I'm like, really? You don't you don't even need to focus so much on like the darkness because the biggest part of your testimony is like what life's like after now. Like what is life like with Jesus? Like it's great to show people, hey, this is what it was like before, and it's a contrast, and you don't know something's good until you know something was bad. But I think it also doesn't need to be like, well, I was on meth, you know, like for it to be a powerful testimony. Yeah, it's like I had darkness in my life, I was depressed, I wasn't happy, and now I I can't stop smiling. Yeah, yeah, because I have this community around this uh around me, and I I I there's a joy inside my heart that I didn't have before. And people people aren't gonna, it's not something weird, right? I think I think it's it's always this really intimidating thing where people just think Christians in church is just weird, but it doesn't have to be. Like it's just like it doesn't have to be some weird thing, and I think don't discount like one interaction, don't discount that like you're saying, like one smile down the street, or like your your waitress, you know, tipper. You know, like like like say something, like say how's your like resting close to church. Yeah, like how how is your day today? Like ask, ask them how their day was, or you know, like hey, like thank you, like say thank you, right? Like hold the door open for somebody, like these little micro decisions we have throughout our day they matter to make exactly to make those small differences, and then you're gonna have those moments where you actually get to like pour into somebody and don't discount that one person because it could end up being someone that their life is completely changed, yeah, because of I think like coming full full circle and going back to the authenticity piece is people are way more willing to hear what you say if they know you're real.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, yeah, true. Right?
SPEAKER_06Like if you're showing that you that you're faithful, like you're showing up, you're you're there no matter what, that like somebody does something to you, you forgive them, you're still there. Yeah, like these people aren't used to that kind of thing. Yeah, right. Like, and we can share the gospel in so many ways. Like your testimony is amazing, words are amazing, but like I'm a I'm a subscriber to like see a need, fill a need.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, right.
SPEAKER_06Like you see, like it talks about in the Bible, like that that's what true religion is, right? Like taking care of the widows, the orphans, the downtrodden, these things. See you, need, fill and need. And often when you do that, people just open up, right? Or you do that and say, hey, tell me your story, right? And just be actually like authentic with people as with where they're at. Yeah. Like I used to work in the construction field, and I jokingly got called the reverend on like almost every job site we were ever at. And I never told people I was Christian, none of this kind of stuff, but people would literally just dump their problems onto me on job sites, and I would just sit there and listen. And like through those moments, they're like, man, like you see me like you have it all together. I'm like, no, I don't. Like I'm a messenger like you, just a mess with a little bit of hope. Right. And this is where it is, and just living that authenticity and just meeting people where they're at. Yeah, yeah. I think where we've made mistakes as Christians is we're calling people who are messed up in sin to a standard that we hold ourselves to, and they can't meet that standard, they don't know Jesus yet. Yeah, I can't expect something of you that you know nothing of. Yeah, it's good. I need to come meet you where you're at, yeah. And and bring you up out of that.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. I heard something along the lines of what you said. I like that see and need fill a need. It was it's actually I don't even think it was a Christian podcast. I think it was like some random clip of this dude who is like basically telling people to stop asking. Um, you know, if there's anything you need, I can like tell them, like, let me know. If there's anything you need, let me know. And he's like, instead of doing that, just go do do it. Whatever you're thinking, go do it. Yeah, like yeah, and I was thinking about that. I'm like, well, what if like you assume the wrong thing? I mean, like, no one's gonna get mad at you for filling their tank with gas, right? Like, no one's gonna no one's gonna get mad at no one's gonna. I have some Costco tacos, like he's not gonna be upset. Big fan. Like, uh, like no one's gonna be upset unless they're like, I don't know, maybe maybe there's certain people that will be, but you know, they had a bad day. God bless those people.
SPEAKER_06But that's part of cracking that wall, too. Exact person's that guarded that that offends them. Yeah, man, they need people like that to crack through that hard exterior, yeah. That that prove to them that because that also usually comes from a a place of deep hurt, yeah. Or like hurt people hurt people. So if you're offended by somebody loving on you or giving you, it comes from that place, but they need somebody to chip at that wall.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, this this is an odd comparison. Have you ever um done carols, like sung carols at someone's house? I used to do that in Smithers. So our church, yeah, we did this in Prince George, small town things. Yeah, but yeah, you smell Smithers and smeller in Prince George, we're in the same part of the world. It's just a smelly town thing. Yeah, it's a smelly town, that's for sure. Eventually, you just end up your nose hairs gets burned and you can't smell anything anymore. Um, but I remember one year, we did it for like four or five years in a row. We would take like 20, 30 of us and just go knock on doors. And I remember um this woman that we she had apparently she we didn't know this, but we she'd only been there for a year. She couldn't make any friends. She was in her 70s. We knocked on the door, and one of our uh the kids in the church walked up over and said, Merry Christmas, handed her cookies, and we just sang to her. Pastor Leroy goes to her and says, Hey, bless you, love you, have a great Sunday, and she just burst into tears. And she ended up in our church that next Sunday and then stayed for a long time before she moved out of town. But she said, I couldn't find friends, I didn't know what was going on, and just like you said, she we cracked the wall just by saying, Hey, we just wanted to go and just bless people down this thing. If you do the even what you're saying, though, just go do it.
SPEAKER_04It doesn't even have to be like you could just not a big deal, do it anomalously. Like, yeah, I'd I had youth leaders when I was sick. I've been sick way too much this year, but I I had a bunch of youth leaders that just like I would just open my door and there's like a care package on the on the front doorstep. I'm like, where did you guys learn this? Like, where did you learn to be such saints? Like, I don't even know who sent this, but it's just like it's just it's it's the idea of exactly like that. You see a need and feel the need instead of like seeing the need and be like, hey, you know, if there's anything you need, like I think at there's there's there's good intention in that, but I'd also think just like skip that step, yeah. And you know, put the money in the envelope and stick it in their mailbox and don't let them don't let them see you do it. Fill the need. Yeah, just fill it. See the need feel.
SPEAKER_06I think I remember like as a youth group when I was in youth, we did this event a couple of times a year and we called it random acts of kindness. Yes, yeah. And we just like I lived in Calgary and we just bombarded the city around where our church was with just random acts of kindness. So some people went out with rakes and and shut and like raked up leaves and some went to the mall and paid for like random people's purchases or like dropped money in an envelope on somebody and just did that, and there was no other follow-up. It was just this random act of kindness to just love on people, right? Yeah, which is so crazy. And who knows? That's that sowing the seed moment, exactly, right? And who knows what that was for somebody. Maybe we dropped a hundred dollars on a single mom, yeah, that had no idea how that week was gonna look for her, and that was a moment that caused the question.
SPEAKER_02And even then you're bringing it back to the why. Yeah, why are we doing what we're doing? Are we doing it so we can have a really cool social moment on Instagram and everyone sees how great I am as a person because I filmed this whole thing? Are you doing it because God actually asked us to serve and to share the gospel with people? And we're doing it because we love souls, not so we're trying to fill up our church. Exactly. My my our goal is yeah, we want people to come to KCC for sure, but we also our bigger goal is we want you to know Jesus. Just know Jesus. We want you to, if we're gonna introduce you to Jesus and you go somewhere else, cool. We don't care, we just want you to know Christ because your soul is important. Yeah, and follow Jesus, man. Like that's what we want.
SPEAKER_00The when I was watching this clip uh the first time, the question that came to my head is like, Why church? Like, why should I go to church? Why should I invite people to church? Why? Um, and it's it's not like just we don't go to church just to hear like the Tony Robbins motivational speech or to go for worship or the great coffee or whatever, but it really is a culmination of everything we've been talking about today, where we go so that we can learn to be authentic, so that we can grow ourselves, so we can grow in our relationship with God, but then it's also goes beyond just what happens in this building, and it's everything outside of that where we're authentic with other people and we're inviting people in. So yeah, that's just that's beautiful. Yeah, I love that.
SPEAKER_04That's awesome. Thank you so much for uh tuning in and listening to our podcast on Mezzanine Floor. Thank you, Jeff, for being with us. Always appreciate new faces. I'm sure you'll be back again. Um, but yeah, we just encourage you to again uh you know, follow us on social media, follow us on Spotify, uh, like this podcast, like the videos, help us out, uh, comment on them. We want to, you know, maybe eventually do like a QA type thing. Um, but we just pray that this conversation would bless you, and uh, we'll see you next time on the Mezzanine floor.
