We Got A Ferrari Name And A Kia Budget

Headlines don’t win medals. We dig into USA Taekwondo’s splashy six-year hire of a legendary former champion and ask whether a star résumé can fix a program that still can’t fund its juniors. We’re candid about what’s admirable—class, results, and global respect—while pressing on what truly matters for athlete outcomes: coach credentials, communication, culture fit, and a system that serves more than a handful of insiders.

Across the hour, we map the gap between PR and performance. Why commit long-term dollars when the pipeline is struggling? How do language barriers, conflicting training styles, and unclear authority lines play out in a two-minute round with video review? We compare proven high-performance models—clear plans, transparent budgets, domestic coach development, targeted specialist roles—with a “one room” approach that risks deepening divides and starving national depth. Being a great athlete is not the same as being a great coach; pedagogy, planning, and repeatable methods win across cycles, not just headlines.

We also call on governance to do its job. Boards should safeguard budgets, demand KPIs, and review plans when results stall. If the goal is sustained competitive excellence, publish the roadmap: funding for juniors through seniors, coach education that scales, and concrete benchmarks by weight class. If a special hire is strategic, define the lane—support a specific athlete profile, set medal targets, and require knowledge transfer to U.S. coaches. That’s how a bold move becomes more than a press release.

Join us for an uncut, informed take that blends insider experience with tough love. If you care about American Taekwondo’s future—athletes, parents, and coaches alike—this one’s for you. Subscribe, share with your team, and drop your view: smart investment or shiny distraction? Your feedback shapes what we tackle next.

Transcript

Cold Open And Merch Plug

SPEAKER_00 1:03

Sorry, not sorry, snowflake. Welcome to North Carolina. I'm so glad you could join us today. Sorry, not sorry.

Breaking News: Six-Year Coaching Deal

herb 1:16

It is time, and I can't believe it's been so soon, so soon. I feel like CNN combined with Fox, with Chuck E. Cheese, whatever, that we had to come back. I mean, I usually look forward to a week off where I can kind of think and grow and challenge, but we have some some news that was the prophet, the prophet, the grandmaster prophet himself called it and called it. So we had to come back out of where I usually go up to a cave in the mountains and I meditate for a while, eat some cheese and weeds. And uh, but we are back. This is the warehouse 15. And again, uncut and uh a special moment. Oh, nice shirt, guys. Don't make sure you hit our merch store. I just put up a bunch of new merch. We got notebooks, we got t-shirts, we got a wine cooler because I understand that TJ likes to get his wine on. So uh, but we we got some news that you know, Master Moreno, Coach Moreno, called and it made us have to come out. So I think it's time, but oh, I did not realize you were that tatted up there, Mr. TJ, or is that like a uh a nylon sleeve you're wearing? Oh, oh, 15. See, there's something I don't know. There's something I don't know. I'm gonna have to, but I'm old, I'd have to get like 17 instead. What's up, coaches?

Juan 2:39

Uh it's funny, just real fast. I mean, I I talked about this two podcasts ago, and then I talked about it, you know, again. So obviously it was the news broke today, but it wasn't news, it was old news. It was old news. I think they want to try to do it to kind of create a buzz around the U.S. Open or something like that. But it's funny because we talked about it, you know, a couple weeks ago, and then of course, just what? What's the day? Today's Wednesday. We we just had one of these uh on Monday. So I talked about it on Monday because there were some rumors, you know, flying around at Canada and different places. So not news, but news. And um yeah, I I I can't wait to get into this one. What do you think? TJ speechless, speechless. You know, I'll I'll start. I'm I'm gonna start with this. You know, it's funny because obviously I've had people from uh the Pan American region, you know, Spanish speaking, I've had uh Europe people, I've had uh a lot of domestic people, of course. And it's funny, the difference between the people that that have reached out to me and the people that I kind of see on social media, the one of the main differences, the people like that have reached out to me, um I I'm gonna say this try to say this in the most uh positive and respectful way. They're look they they they know the sport, they understand the sport, and they're trying to make sense of it all. It's easy to get you know locked into like a sexy pick or a name or something like that. But it's just you know, how does this make sense? How does this make sense in development? How does this make sense with you know, um why does this matter?

SPEAKER_04 4:21

Why does it matter? It's it's crazy. It's crazy. Was it a six-year contract?

Juan 4:27

Just um for clarification purposes. Listen, uh it was a six-year contract, apparently.

SPEAKER_04 4:32

That that's what's been reported, but it's just crazy because you know let me preface this by saying, and I it's not about the individual junior team is not funded, and we just guaranteed someone six years' worth of money. First, you know what I want to say first? I'm gonna say my congratulations, my boy got paid.

Juan 4:49

He got paid.

SPEAKER_04 4:51

I've gotten, I mean, paid. My god, congratulations, my boy. You did it.

Cost, Visas, And Funding Gaps

Juan 4:56

But that's like when you talk about like sports people, when a quarterback goes to another place and gets paid millions of dollars. I ain't hating on him. You're like, my man, you got paid. They wanted to pay you that money and they gave it to you. My man. And so, same thing, you know, Coach Lee. I'll call you because I have a little respect. I don't call him Daehoon, like the the chairman, uh the chairwoman of of the board said, I can't wait to see Day Hoon. I'm gonna say, Coach Lee, congratulations. You got that, you got that purse, you got that bucket, you got that bag, you got that guap. So, congratulations to him because he made the best deals. I'm not like hating on him, but you're right, TJ, man. Six years. You don't say, you know what, let's bring him over for two and see if there's an optional four. Ooh, ooh, ooh. You just throw six out there just like that. That's wild.

Athlete Greatness Vs Coaching Proof

herb 5:46

Oh, here's here's here's the short and the long of it, right? So they're talking about Daehoon Lee, who um was uh a competitor, but he's consistent with the leadership because he didn't win an Olympic gold medal, right? He's he he underperformed at the highest levels, just like Jay Warwick and some of the others. But and I'm not hate, I'm not, I'm not hating on the guy because um that's to win is to win. Korea has ceased to be a powerhouse in the sport, period. There was a time where if you could get a Korean, that was like getting a Ferrari. Now, no pun intended, when you get a Korean, nobody's got them, they're like Kias or they're like Hyundai's. You know, they're a dime a dozen. You can get a ton of Koreans. Um, and that's not to speak to his qualifications, of which I I don't know and don't really pay attention, but I am concerned about his coaching qualifications because those I don't see anywhere. And as we all know, there are great athletes who are terrible coaches. And until you produce as a coach, you're just a guy who did taekwondo well. And well at whatever. Well, and but here's the other thing. Two years off from the Olympic Games, unless you're bringing on a specialty coach for a specialty player, you're you're supposed to be well into your high performance plan. And if you're into your high performance plan, the last thing you're doing, especially when you can't fund your domestic program, which is sustain competitive excellence, you got to be able to fund your program as it exists and then yield that program with results throughout the time. Now you're spending money, six years worth of money, on a foreign coach who doesn't speak English, who can't speak English, who promised in his video to learn enough English to be able to communicate. He's probably the nicest guy in the world. I go to Korea, I don't speak Korean, but I'm not trying to be a coach of the Korean national team. If I was, I'd probably have to have some language skills. But um, with regards to the actual hiring of an individual, what you're saying again to the United States and you're saying to the players here, and I'm not a nationalist, I'm just a realist. Are you telling me that in a country of 330 or 370 million people, we don't have a single coach in this country that we've developed that can yield Olympic results? That's what we're saying. And now you're gonna go and bring in someone who's gonna, because when I listened to his interview, he spoke about finding a way to reconcile the Korean culture with the American individualism. And I'm like, uh, okay, I guess. Um, the second thing though is just the communication thing. I I've been coached, I have some amazing friends and amazing Korean friends and amazing Korean players. I was coached by a bunch of Koreans who could speak English, didn't know Taekwondo, and that's what I'm saying. Go ahead.

SPEAKER_04 8:36

Six years of our the of the memberships money on another coach for one room. Don't tell me if you have a 12 or 13 or 11-year-old kid that this makes a difference. 14, 15. What how many of you have seen the room inside of the academy? How many times do you think you're gonna interact with this guy? Like it makes this is the biggest distraction I've seen in a long time. Our junior team is still not funded. I just don't know how we're talking. Why are we putting up news about we're getting this big coach in the summertime? We got a tournament before then that's not funded that people are at home fundraising for. So am I correct?

herb 9:13

Selling cookies, selling cookies.

Juan 9:15

Listen, Pito, you're 100% correct. You know, where you know they're they're talking about this big slap splash of 2028 or down 2032, kick the can down to 2032. But you're right, you're not, it's the biggest, like you said, like well, nobody's nobody's talking about getting them here with the visa cost either, right?

herb 9:32

So let's let me put in perspective here.

Juan 9:33

I don't know what he's getting paid, but just to bring up or in the summer.

herb 9:39

If he gets a visa, but if you get a visa, let me explain to you how much it costs to get a visa because I've had I've sponsored Korean athletes. We got money that's another twenty-thirty thousand dollars just in legal fees to get him an O vis or an H1 visa or H3, whatever it is, depending upon the the level of it. And that's more money that we're spending to say that we don't have enough coach coaches domestically. Now, I would get it if back in the day, back way back, way back when Taekwondo's taekwondo, if I could have had Jung Cook Young come here, I would have funded him because he's a four-time world champion, he's an Olympic gold medalist, he had a successful method, he was a successful player. Yeah, maybe that would have been worth it. And and who knows, right?

Juan 10:25

But that's that's that's in that era. That's in that era. That's in that era when there wasn't there wasn't a lot of people around that at new stuff. I mean, listen, you know, at the end of the day, again, I I I I had so many different conversations, and I always preface it. This guy is the epitome of a gentleman. He's a three-time world champion, he's a 12-time Grand Prix gold medals. He's he's amazing. Like, literally, I I love them as an athlete. I mean, I can't say enough good things about him. The way he carries himself, so humble, so respectful, all that stuff, man. He is a mate, he's a peach of a person. But like, it's interesting because I had a conversation with somebody and I said, you know, there's there's not one Asian other than Iran and one in Europe that's coaching right now. There's not one in Africa, there's not one in in in actually there is one Asian. I'm sorry, there's one in France. Um, but that's the only one. And there's there's none in the Pan American region. Listen, that style is unique to that, to that culture, and it's been like that for a while. So when I see that kind of stuff, and then I say, wait a minute, you have this this era.

SPEAKER_04 11:34

We hired him to work with specific athletes at the academy. He wrote that. He's going there to work with specific athletes, so they spent money, membership money, once again, on giving those guys a better chance.

Juan 11:46

Maybe that 100k A you gave it is going towards that.

SPEAKER_04 11:50

And then calling it us.

Language, Culture, And Fit Risks

Juan 11:52

Yeah. No, it's not us. I I had another coach, a Korean American coach, called me and said, This is just gonna set our pipeline back another four years. They said it because it's not gonna help seven years. Well, that's what I was gonna say. I mean, listen, it's not gonna it's not gonna help the pipeline in the next two years, and so then we're starting all over and in in the next four years. You know, I talked to another coach and in and again, I'm not gonna use names, but he mentioned something that this is kind of like iconic and you know, it'll help, you know, with the international community and actually get some things done. I said, wait a minute, isn't that what does that even mean? But isn't that what the Great Britain boys were supposed to do? Weren't they supposed to come and expose us to the European style and and and and have the international connections? Weren't they supposed to come and get things done here seven years later? They were so good at their jobs that they had to go to Korea and and get it somebody. That's crazy. I mean, so you know, dude are they are they independent, are they non-partial, whatever? We we already have that model and it's and it hasn't worked. Hasn't worked in seven years. Let's be honest. Hasn't worked in seven years. Have we had pockets of success? Yes. We had a world champion and Olympic gold medals, you know. Look, because those people aren't in the in the sport anymore. You know, one just came back, we'll see what happens. But nothing like no success when it comes to overall development, depth of development, building a program. None, none so much so that we had to go get another foreign person.

SPEAKER_04 13:27

But it's but it's not that's I mean, uh it's not for development. It's not for development, it's not for development. They literally said he's gonna go work with specific people in that room. I'm not making this up. This uh um this is written on the internet. They put this on the internet. We are firing this guy for these people in our room. Oh, and he'll do online and seminars. They already set the platform for that. I'm sure, but my boy got a bag and then another bag at the end of the rainbow. Has to be unbelievable.

Juan 13:56

I mean, has to be, and he's married, he has kids, so he's gonna bring them over here and they get paid for housing. I mean, this is like how much you think of the game? Let's let's uh be that's public.

herb 14:08

You can find that out. That's you gotta wait till the end of the year.

SPEAKER_04 14:11

I'm sure we'll see at some point.

herb 14:13

No, you can make it, you can make, you can request it. You can send a note, they have 24 hours to they have to open their books at any time within 24 hours to a person who makes an inquiry. So that's part of being an NGB, it's part of being a non-profit.

SPEAKER_04 14:27

What happens if they don't?

herb 14:28

Um, you can compel them, you get a court order, and they pay the cost. So I'm not as concerned about I I just think philosophically, what was the, you know, like who's running the coaching program? So I mean, did they run out of bangers and mash crew? Was there nobody else, is there nobody else in England that couldn't uh Paul take care of one of his his other juniors? I mean, Gareth was a student, right? He came, he figured out a way to get paid in England, had Gareth his bag boy, the chokey boy, come over and do his carrying and his work. I I maybe they're getting rid of Gareth and him and his porn stash can go back to the movie business.

SPEAKER_04 15:05

No, he's talking about go ahead. No, no, go ahead, go ahead. I'm sorry. They're talking about consistency, and we are bringing someone in that like realistically changes the whole thing. If they let him run with the ball or if they don't, he like culturally, taekwondo-wise, infrastructure, like we are the question, are we starting over? This we're starting over, right? Because this can't be making it better. We've literally let's let's look on the bright side.

herb 15:33

Who who's he helping? Who do who do you see him helping? His his ability and his style, who's he helping that they're talking about?

SPEAKER_04 15:42

I have no idea. Me neither. I haven't even given any I haven't even given any thought. How about this?

One Room Focus And Pipeline Setbacks

Juan 15:47

How about how about this, TJ? You know this, I think Young, you've you've heard us talk about this, and it's been pretty well documented that you know that room, well, if we're gonna say it's gonna come to a room, TJ, which I happen to agree with you, he's in that room, he's in that room, and the style is you know, it's go, go, go, blah, blah, blah. It's totally opposite of his style. His style's technical, setting up, clean pace, moderate pace. Um, you go into a room where coaches, where athletes yell at coaches, curse at coaches. Coaches can actually, you know, physical, you know, hit people. Um, you have they they they call people by their first names. They're very informal, whether you like it or not. They there is no bowing. I mean, it's totally opposite where this gentleman is is respectful, coach, sir, master, young, whatever it is, you know, that's his thing. And you know, it seems like a culture clash. Like you're talking about continuity and trying to like blend. It seems like a culture clash. And so what happens when he says, I'm gonna work with these people, or it's my turn to run training? Man, it could be literally a divided house. We do it this way, they do it that way. Maybe that's the way they want it. You know, at GB, they had their their different coaches, they had different, you know, I guess, strategies. You know, they didn't train together, so maybe that's what they want.

SPEAKER_04 17:11

I mean, it's I I I just think it's it's like doesn't that mean if he's working with certain people and this is such a legendary move, doesn't that just mean whoever he works with are the eyes on for the Olympic Games, the divisions we're going towards? Like, you're investing a lot of money in a few people. I don't care who it is. I again I just water.

Juan 17:33

You're getting paid a bag just to coach two divisions, one division, I people? I mean, how many people they have out there? I mean, they have what do they have? How many guys they have out there?

SPEAKER_04 17:44

But isn't that but isn't that like putting a lot of resources once again in one place? So our decisions are already made. Four resources. Our decisions are already made, right?

Juan 17:53

You have you have I mean, if that's the case, you have Paul, you have Gareth, you have Lambdon, you have this guy now. You have four national paid people, and and pretty well paid. Uh I mean, I'm sure like you know, no one's doing it for a peanuts. And this guy didn't come over.

SPEAKER_04 18:08

That's a lot of staff. That's a lot of staff for what? How many athletes? How many athletes am I missing? Maybe there's some I don't know about. Maybe there's like this super secret black ops 18 and a half group that train after hours or something. Got it.

Juan 18:22

It's a lot, it's a lot, you know. Like I said, I know it's a sexy pick and it sounds good on paper and stuff like that. And you know, I see some people on Facebook going, wow, wow, wow. But again, those are the people that really don't know, they're not looking into it. They're just, you know, being you know, amazed by the by the by the name. And again, the name is the name is legit. Of course it's legit. But if he if he worked for a while and built up his resume, then you say, you know what? Yeah, we bring him up. I listen, I had my I had my reservations about Paul early on. I I couldn't deny he's a he he coached, you know, Jay Jones two worlds, I'm sorry, two Olympic gold medals. I mean, that's incredible. It's a it's a feat that's unbelievable. So I knew his pedigree with that, but I had questioned, could he do it for a program? Because he did it for individuals. Could he do it for a whole program? Could he build a whole system? I questioned that. Gareth wasn't even the other one wasn't even in the in the making of it because he was he was irrelevant. He was coming, you know, with with Paul because Paul was the name. You know, here we are again, seven years later. I I was pretty right, you know, pretty right. The program hasn't increased, it hasn't gotten better, it's just been wrong out over and over and over again. And here we are.

SPEAKER_04 19:35

And so no coach development, even in the Padam region in the Pad Am region. We went, we had to go all the way to Asia. In the Pad Am region, there's nobody good enough, there's no one interested. And they had to make a point to make sure everyone knew he he he was the first one to message us. This is a television show. This is a television show. In reality, Taekwondo.

Juan 19:56

They could have looked at someone like Oscar Salazar or something like that, who speaks English and Spanish and who's an Olympic medalist and you know, world medalist, and you know, took other countries to the Olympic podium. I mean, there's a lot of people you you could have looked at, but I don't know. And and it what these guys don't have enough, like they don't have enough help. You had two coaches that went to the Olympic Games last time.

SPEAKER_04 20:23

Grandmaster, break this down for me, please. I need an explanation. I mean I need it please give it to me.

Track Record And PR Spin

herb 20:29

Listen, I'm gonna be real about it. And then what I mean by this is it's really not that hard. This one's kind of easy. So when you're trying to save your job, when you're trying to keep your job, you have two things you do. You either create solutions, you create distractions. And so this is a little bit of both. When you have an organization that's underperforming, can't perform, is spending money, can't fund its teams. You gotta, you know, remember, McNally's a PR guy. He's not a sport guy. He has no history in the development of sport. And even when you read his press releases, it's all PR. There's nothing about sport development in it. It's not like we went out and did a search. We found the best coach humidly possible. His thing was like we we had a national, international, international world search, and he was the first one to apply. We were so excited because it's the star factor. Like it's like he said, it was like a soccer thing. And I was like, all right, so what does that speak to sport performance? Where does the conversation start with? Here's someone who went into Korea, into the middle school or the high schools, and developed a program that yielded 20 national champions. So I just did a quick search on this guy who I don't know. And I've just watched one of his fights. And for me, it's the same old, same old nonsense. I remember when he was fighting, I was underwhelmed back then. But um, and that's not to say he didn't win stuff. He won stuff in this in this style, without a doubt. What he had hasn't done is coached or produced anybody who's had a medal. So for the past three or four years, like the other heavy, the heavyweight from Korea, who's homeless and can't find a job, he's now trying to find a paycheck. And good to him, good for him. He found a paycheck. He has no history of coaching. He was an athlete and probably has some great insights for whatever weight division he was in. So if they brought him in, say we had a great hopeful in that weight division, and they brought him in specifically to make sure that this person was tuned up to win an Olympic gold medal. It would make more sense. It would make more sense to bring in somebody to help CJ. And I and I would say I'd start with a psychologist, right? You know, but and somebody to get him off the internet. It would make more sense to take that guy who actually is an athlete and has a lot of potential but can't seem to manifest it when it matters, and figure out him. I don't know who that is in the world. I don't I I think actually I do know who it is. Irene Ofargis. He ain't coming, but he's he's the guy that mentally could probably put him in the right place. I don't know who the guy is in the heavier weight divisions these days that would matter. But with all that said, you're bringing in an unknown quantity when your sport development program is out of whack. In other words, they don't have an athlete development program. They don't have a coach development program. This thing that they were going to do where they're going to develop coaches, you know how you know if you had a coach development program? You've had seven years to develop a coach. Now there are no shortage of coaches in development programs in other countries, but apparently in ours there is, because we don't have enough people. You know, the United States is a wasteland. We're the size of Rhode Island, you know, all all puns intended. With that said, this is another PR stunt by McNally and Warwick. And then he's talking about the this is the cover up from the Epstein Files. Maybe, maybe they're in the Epstein Files.

SPEAKER_04 23:59

I don't know. You don't think about De Huly, one of the greatest ever. What are you talking about? In our sport, he goes in our sport. You don't know the sport. You don't know the sport. Stop it. Stop it. Stop it.

herb 24:10

McNally McNally doesn't do the sport. He doesn't understand his sport. He's a PR guy. So when you're what I would here's what I would encourage our listeners to do listen and read what McNally wrote and his mouthpiece now, his paid mouthpiece, which is MAS TKD. And listen to it for what it says. Search for the words sustain competitive excellence. Search for the words past history of success in coaching programs. Search for the words of how it's going to work. Know what you're hearing now with promises for the future. This is going to be a great thing. And like they said before, when Gareth and Brown and Green and Blue and Orange came. Oh, it's going to take a minute, but we're going to we need a few years. Well, that was seven years ago. Now they put this guy into 32. Well, I'll tell you one thing that'll be good. Since he's moving to Carolina, North Carolina, hopefully, unless he's staying in Korea too. He's going to coach remotely. By 32, he may be able to communicate well enough with the athletes so they'll understand what they're doing. If he's in Carolina, he'll learn English.

Juan 25:19

He'll probably get a green card, he'll probably open up a dojong with uh his university people, and he'll do well off and he'll be fine. Yeah, well, I I don't I like the guy.

herb 25:29

I love any athlete that can get a paycheck, right? I mean, you gotta figure out how to market yourself and you gotta figure out how to make money. We all did, right? I I was fortunate post-my career. Go ahead.

Juan 25:40

Do you think do you think the CEO learns Korean? Like, how did he know all that stuff when he was talking about how he his vision and how he he studies how people learn and you know, like teaches them? I'm like, how where'd you get all that? Like, did you get that? I don't know where you got that from.

herb 25:54

I didn't I listen to, you know, I'm gonna say this in a nice way. I listen to it.

Juan 25:59

Maybe he's taking Lambdon's spot, like like Don Lewis said.

herb 26:01

I listen, I hope so. I listen to it.

Juan 26:04

Sven, my man Sven from California is going off. He's he's making a lot of sense, to be honest with you.

herb 26:09

I I I I uh he's watching it, paying attention.

SPEAKER_04 26:12

This is this is a hoax.

herb 26:14

I listened to Daehoon's uh well, let's play it for the listeners. We may as well. So let me let me do it. Let me let me you're gonna be hijacked for a minute. Shut your mouth. We've been shut your mouth.

SPEAKER_04 26:28

Shush. I'll go with you wherever you want to go.

herb 26:30

Oh, really?

SPEAKER_04 26:30

We've been hijacked.

herb 26:31

All right, there's a there's a bathhouse you can go. Well, anyway. We'll see. That was another day. All right, here we go, Champion. Oh, thank you. Okay, here comes. Let me know if you can see andor hear any of this. All right. No, I don't want to use my accountant. Here we go.

SPEAKER_00 27:04

Sans take on the Sarango, until you do, she do jarso, Sonsugan Lin, Sanganasila. It changed a olympical hanging kill, they would tick go, we might see.

SPEAKER_04 28:19

That was Stephen Lambden.

Governance, Board Oversight, And Accountability

herb 28:21

Yeah, that's not that's not this guy. But um, I I mean I could write, I could put on what McNally wrote, but it would just not, I don't want to alright it. I yeah, I don't really want to waste time with this guy. But uh anyway, with that said, let me kill the uh the sharing. So with that said, um nice guy. Um probably auditioned for a couple of K-pop bands, didn't make it, but good looking kid. And uh I I wish him the best. He found a paycheck, it's in North Carolina. Hope he's been there before. Um, but uh yeah, welcome, welcome to welcome to the United States. Um dude, you know, but uh I don't know if he's using Duolingo or whatever, but in three months, uh you know, you don't go from that level to this level of English. But uh anyway, it it simply goes back to this. TJ asked the question, so I'll answer it for you. If you're creating a high performance plan, and this is was part of your high performance plan, and you're executed, good on you. If you work, if you haven't created a high performance plan, of which I haven't seen one, you haven't developed coaches in seven years, and then you're bringing on washed up and retired guys, not talking about Daehoon, talking about Mr. Lambden, guys who didn't perform. Um, and then you bring them on to staff. So, you know, I don't know how many more bag carriers you need. I mean, you got Gareth and Lambdon now, and they're carrying the bags for Paul Green, who stays in England because the bangers and mash are better there and doesn't come here. His bag is good too. Oh, yeah, he's this guy. I want to I want to take a page from his book. I want to take I want to take a page from his his job book. Virtually chilling. Well, you know, the way the way he does his job, he could have like 20 of those jobs, right? He could be, he could get a few more countries if he can figure out. I mean, United States, it's amazing to me because I go back to that commercial where they had the Aussie guy for is there any other place in the world? These guys are the oxyclean salesmen of the world, but anyway. Is there any other place in the world that's you know what oxygen you know what oxyclean is?

Juan 30:37

You ever saw that commercial? Of course we have.

herb 30:40

Yeah, yeah. So they this these guys are the oxyclean Paul and uh Paul, who I like kind of until he started picking our pockets, you know.

SPEAKER_04 30:48

Me too, me too. Yeah, but he picked it any other place in the world that has three foreign coaches, outside coaches coming into a program leading a country. Three. No. Three, barely three. Barely one. This will be this this will be number three. I know that's crazy.

herb 31:09

Well, I I I gotta tell you guys are doing a horrible job then. I mean, I feel badly for the United States because hey man, we we can't develop any, you know, the Americans are just too stupid, too inept, or too unable to win. Um everybody though, not just the people on this podcast, everybody.

SPEAKER_04 31:27

Well, you all the coaches, all the coaches in the United States suck.

herb 31:31

We suck so bad that we can't coach for the national team. But uh terrible. Oh my gosh. Well, you got the huckster in charge with the huckster junior behind him in charge. So you're gonna get huckstered all day. So it it's unfortunate. And the the sad part of this is this is a political relations thing because if you're gonna do something like this, you do find somebody like, and this is what you both have said in a nice way. You can't say the guy's not qualified. You can say the guy is a great athlete. I can I'll say first and foremost, though, he's not qualified. He's a great athlete. That doesn't make you qualified to be a coach.

Juan 32:10

But I'm a dreamer, I'm a dreamer. I'm a dreamer, he's gonna save our world. Hey, I thought we had to take the coaching courses, online coaching courses.

herb 32:18

Uh, yeah. Well, maybe they've been translated into Korean, but yeah, I know.

Juan 32:22

Monthly coaching calls.

herb 32:24

Well, maybe he'll, you know, uh maybe he won't sit in a chair. Maybe he won't sit in a chair.

SPEAKER_04 32:29

He has to.

Juan 32:32

They're gonna for sure they're gonna give him a chair in in in 2028. For sure. They're gonna give him a chair, they'll give him somebody. They got four people. If they had to qualify, they'd be in trouble, but they got four people, right? And they're gonna put him in the chair. Obviously, we heard before Christina is is at odds with you know with with with her coach, and so maybe this is gonna fit the bill for her, you know. Uh I'm not sure.

herb 32:55

Who's her coach? Who's her coach?

Juan 32:58

It was Gareth. But she's not a slapper, yeah. But I mean, supposedly they're not getting along and you know, they're having you know drama and don't really want to work together or whatever for whatever that reason is.

SPEAKER_04 33:12

Again, this is public knowledge. They wrote this on the internet too, along with everything. You know what I mean? Like, this is public knowledge. Yeah, you know, this has been said publicly. Like, what are we doing? Yeah, what are we doing? What are we doing? Here, here's what I've been saying. You're in making large money announcements and sending a team to junior worlds unfunded. I just can't, I can't get past that point. I'm just being on I can't go any further than that. We are pushing this as big news, and people in America are getting hitting like and like and like and like. What a great addition! What a great addition! This is amazing, this is amazing, this is amazing. Well, this is our teams aren't funded. Yeah, we just paid for another coach to come and work in one room with a few athletes.

What Real High Performance Requires

herb 33:52

They're hood rich, they're hood rich, my friend. So they they they're I just they drive one. They drive the$5,000 car with the$10,000 worth of accessories, and then they go to Red Lobster and they try to use their credit card and they sit there and say, Are you sure? Can you run it through again? Because that time is coming for them, which at some point it's gonna it's gonna come true. But maybe soon as later. I I wish them the best, and I and I wish him the best, you know, and and uh in his tenure here as a coach. What I do hope happens though is that America wakes up and that the organization wakes up and the athletes and the coaches and the parents wake up and they undo these clowns because that's what's happening. This is what happens all the time in our sport. At some point, people get fed up enough, right? Before it was the referees who thought they knew better, and they're the ones that created this disaster. Um, and then before that it was us, and we got rid of uh the leadership before that was corrupt, and it's happened three or four times. And I gotta tell you, it's got to happen this time because you can't let the hucksters run the business and then you're not winning medals. Now, with all that said, I wish America the best and I hope that they win some medals, even though I don't like the sport in its current incarnation. And I hope that this Daehoon Lee is uh successful in connecting with an athlete or two that can meddle and make a medal performance, which is possible, right? Like if he can if he can find one or two that resonate with and he res, and and I'll be honest, if I had to choose between a Gareth Brown or a Daehoon Lee, I would take Daehoon Lee over a Gareth Brown. I I would rather have a guy who is empathetic, who's had some success, and and and isn't gonna slap me when I sit in the chair, right? So, you know, that's where I would be heading. So um the Steve Lambton thing, I have to agree with you guys, I have no idea um how he ended up there, other than being willing to carry the bags.

Juan 35:47

And so um that's another one like, but that's I mean, listen, that's that's this all this didn't start.

herb 35:53

Yeah, but didn't you guys want to offer to carry the bags? Wouldn't you aren't you willing to carry the bags you can't get a job?

Juan 35:58

You're crazy. No, no, no, you're not getting bag carriers. I listen, I would carry the bags if if that's if it was job for for for but not for them, obviously. No way, obviously them. If listen, if there was a coach that I believed in, I and I've done it. I've listened I uh I've told I've told the story many times. You know, I've gone to the Olympic Games when I when I scouted, when I held targets, when I ran for water, when I you know, when we didn't have all the you know the the internet and stuff like that. I did all that kind of stuff, and and I did it gladly. I mean, I went to the Olympic Games with Steven Lopez when Steven Lopez wasn't really even famous for him, he won his first medal, and I lost. I had a horrible Olympics, to be honest with you, and I was there on the next day, bright and early, I was hanging up uniforms, I was drying them off. I was I was like a little puppy boy. I'm way older than him, I'm way senior. I was done. But I listen, I could do that. I can I did that for Patrice Ramark. When Coach Ramark came in, I told this story before, I wasn't happy, especially where in my situation with you know being an Olympic coach and having two Olympic medalists, but okay, whatever. I I started working with them, it's his show. You know, it was it was rough at the beginning, but I worked with them. I I worked with them and I carried the water, so to speak. And when this thing first popped off, same thing. I I was like, let me know what I can do. They don't need us. No, they they don't need anybody, they need me, they need TJ, they don't need anybody. They they don't want to work with Paige, they don't want to work with other people, they don't want to work with James Howell, they don't want to work with you know David Kim, they don't want to work with Kaffani, they don't want to work with Michael, everybody, but just keeps going, keeps going, keeps going. Like I said, I went my own way. But when I look back and I look at this right now, and I look at who they've put in charge. You said it, you know, young many, many times. They put a bunch of underachieving people from this person that's on every single team to one of the chief opera or chief performance person. None of these guys were achievers.

SPEAKER_04 37:54

None of these guys so this guy, so this guy wasn't vetted. He wasn't vetted. They put out a global search and he sent in his application first, and now he's the best thing for our country, and he's the answer. It's not like this was an application. What do they know about anything of what he's done or can do? And this is what you're telling me we're just gonna do for six years just because and we're celebrating this in our country. They've come in for seven years and quote unquote developed. Nobody from a coaching standpoint, nobody can work with the national team and get paid to do it except for people from the outside the United States of America. That's what that is clear.

Juan 38:33

That's crazy.

SPEAKER_04 38:34

No, what is what give me another answer?

Final Rant, Community Invite, And Sign-Off

Juan 38:38

Nobody from America. The funny thing is like if you look at the track records, you look at the track record, you look at their most successful, you know, woman was Anastasia. She won right from the juniors. They had nothing to do with that. Dennis White had everything to do with that. We know that. Then you look at even right now, like the the the up and coming kid. You look at Michael. Michael was there for three months. They they had nothing to do with that. Michael comes from us and and he got a bronze medal. Well, he repeat that. Look, you know, we're gonna see because now it's gonna start to be on their on their shelf, you know. But it's they haven't been successful with people. I mean, it's it's tough, it's tough. And now now we're gonna see this show. And again, I feel so bad in the sense because I like the dude. But again, I'm just being objective and it's got some star power, but it's not gonna change the culture, it's not gonna change the you know, the people in the I want to know how they these guys feel about it. They got somebody more famous than them in the room. What if they become the nice guys? What if everybody says, you know what, I think I want to try that try style? Yeah, like what is what does that do to the coaching staff? I mean, a guy like Lambda can't hold a candle to that guy when he guy talks. He walks into the room. Come on. Those guys are gonna be like, what? Tell us how you did it. Show us how you did it. You know what I'm saying? Um, the other coaches, you know, staff, they're gonna be like, it's a it's a complete opposite of their styles. I don't know. It's it's it sounds nice on paper, but we'll see. Not even coming until the summer because of visa issues. So that means they're not gonna be around for the Grand Prix. I bet you he's in Muju. I bet you he's at the Muju Grand Prix in September. The first one. Like a TJ.

SPEAKER_04 40:34

For one room. All this hoopla for one room. All of this isn't fixed, you know.

herb 40:41

We've we've talked about this in the past, and it goes back to like we've talked about how do we fix the system, but you know that can't be the answer. No, no, it's not. But what I what I'm gonna say is this has to be cleaned up. This one all the way down. Yeah, it's gotta be cleaned up. It's gotta be the organization has to be redone.

Juan 40:58

Look at the chairperson right now, knows nothing about our smaller.

herb 41:00

Well, the chair, the board's asleep. The board, I don't know the board except for my my friend and longtime USA team captain back in the day. Um, but he's a solo voice in the room. Yep. And the rest of these people are just they just they're happy to get whatever they'll get. I mean, listen, they'll all get an Olympic guest credential to go watch a few minutes of the day, and that's what they're there for. They're there for the warmups. So the board is complicit and responsible because they're not overseeing the sport, and that's their sole function. Their sole function is to make sure the organization is spending and budgeting appropriately to develop high performance. So I don't understand, they just don't they probably don't know sport. They don't understand high performance either. Because if you understood high performance, there's no way you would make that decision. Now, just to be clear, I speak from a place of experience. I sat on the board executive committee, I was on the coaching development committee, I created along with you, created the coaching development programs. And so when you look at that development and we looked at it with a critical eye, we understood how it worked and where it needed to work, and we created high performance plans to deliver. By the way, if our plans didn't deliver, we wouldn't have stayed with those plans. So for seven years, if you're not delivering, it may be time, you know, year one, you can blame the athletes. Year two, you can blame somebody else, year three, four, and five. You gotta be the you gotta blame the guy who could created the plan. So I mean it's it's time to undo um it's time to undo the organization and the leadership, and I gotta be frank, probably the board too. Um, I and I I don't know. You gotta get people angry enough to want to care to change it enough. And I don't I'm not sure how you do that in today's climate.

Juan 42:48

Again, it's you know here's what I'm gonna say. Like, and I I think I don't know, was I talking to you, TJ, about this? It's um listen, the guy, the guy was a great athlete, whatever. Five, you know, five years ago he retired. Okay, or he stopped fighting. So if you take the average 12-year-old right now, that's in a cadet or 13-year-old, they were they were seven or eight years old, they don't even know who the guy is. You know what I'm saying? And so it's all about what you can do right now. It's all about what you you know, what have you done right now? If you said dragon, we're bringing dragon over because dragon, you know, has done this for you know, how many years you bring Tony from Croatia because he's done this for how many years? Okay, maybe they don't know the system, maybe they don't know the the the the pipeline. But these guys have a pedigree. You use you use Ireno Fargus. I know he's been out of the game for you know 20 years, but when he went from Spain to France to Mexico, there was a pet there was a lineage of what he did and and and how he did it. And you know, most of the people, when they do go somewhere, they work within the system. You look at there's one, you know, one coach Lee from uh you know from uh Australia right now. He he he coached for Korea national team for many, many years and he went. Australia and he works with the system within the system. You know, you look at uh you know any coach that goes somewhere, they they work with a group of people there, and these guys just keep bringing in extra people. It's wild.

herb 44:15

Anyway, all right. Well, we beat this horse up a little bit. I'm sure there'll be more to come. And uh, but as we say before, it's always been what it's been, and uh, we hope to make it better. But to those of you who may be offended, please be offended. And like we said before, it's sorry, not sorry, but get a t-shirt, get a mug, get whatever you want to get. Go to our website. We have a new podcast app that's gonna be released, and uh you can get your podcast on the app, it'll remind you when the new one's up. But more importantly, it's got a community board, a board where you and people like you can talk to each other about the things that you want to talk about, whether that's what we said or what you'd like us to talk about. But more importantly, if you'd like to be a guest, and I'm looking forward to I got lots of guest requests after that announcement.

SPEAKER_04 45:04

Oh, did you?

herb 45:07

Well, put them on, put them bring them on. We need people because I get tired of looking at YouTube. No, we gotta do it.

Juan 45:12

We gotta do the podcast of the Zoom call, but people gotta talk. Yeah, I mean, last time they were just listening to the case.

herb 45:16

Last time they got I think they just wanted to see if what we were doing is real. I think they were just they're looking those are guitars behind you, baby. Now twice. We may have to be three times a week. I feel like Jon Stewart.

SPEAKER_04 45:27

Special edition.

herb 45:28

All right, this has been the warehouse 15, and we are out. All right, I'll get.